McCain will be the next U.S. President (IMO)

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 29, 2008, 8:43 pm

Here's a comparison of Palin in 1984 to now:

I think she'd push the button if she had to!

Fash · Post by **Fash** » August 29, 2008, 10:00 pm

I'd hit it!

Very surprised by this selection and haven't had any time to look into her yet... won't make a snap judgment.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 29, 2008, 10:15 pm

Tyek wrote:I chose to be the Republican because I believe in the ideals of the Party. Less government intervention and a conservative fiscal outline. I am not sure where that party went, and I absolutely abhor this new "shared wealth" crap he and Hillary are touting. I believe in the Rights of the People and unfortunately neither party agrees with me there. "Shared Prosperity" sounds like I am going to pay moe taxes for people who have not done as well, and fuck that. I worked hard to get to where I am.

So I will vote Obama, hope that Palin represents a change in the Republicans, and hope even more that common sense can rule the world and the U.S. again. If Palin is just another Religious Wackjob...sigh

I think the US needs to adapt its individualism a bit, at least when it comes to education. You can not afford to be losing so much brain power. You could handle it before because you were always competing with smaller populations, so even if you were having high drop out rates you were still producing more educated kids than anyone else. This is no longer the case. You can not afford to be working at 50% while India and China firing on all cylinders with their advantage of much larger populations.

You should also think longer term. If you invest now and bring down poverty rates it is a win x 2. You add to your taxpayer base and you bring down your your social program costs, which should lower everyone's taxes if the money grubbing politicions down't use it to build giant moon lasers. Education is the answer here IMHO tho it will take 10-20 years to see the return on investment.

/rant off

Anyway, this was JM's decision so I doubt he is setting her up as a future candidate when he loses. I see three motivations for the pick. Far right on abortion (no abortion period) to motivate the base, kind of a 'maverick' to add to his narrative and she is a woman. I believe he is trying to recreate the Obama vs Clinton 'historic' drama. The GOP are also trying to use the experience arguments against her and boomerang them on Obama but I don't know how successful that will be. Obama's education and career are much more impressive and he is longer in the tooth politically. Doesn't really pass the smell test unless you want it to.

I think he may have gotten a bit panicked and careless and I don't know why, he is still close or tied. He met this woman only once before and I don't think she was seriously vetted. The media is going to tear her life apart like they have Obama's but in a much shorter timeframe. She is taking a huge career risk herself.

The republicans are pushing this sell hard. I would write it off as silly (and I find it hilarious) but you guys did re-elect Bush

Some info here from a AK reporter interview. He doesn't seem to be a fan but he does come across as professional.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 02052.html

She was in Texas this spring when her water broke. Rather than staying there to have the baby, she jumped on a plan for an 11-hour flight back to Alaska, so her baby would be a "Alaskan-born."

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 29, 2008, 10:30 pm

An anti-abortion pro-creationism Vice President candidate?

Really? Wow....so can we call this thing now? This is, on first impressions, the absolute worst thing McCain could have done. He must have dementia.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » August 29, 2008, 10:59 pm

I would think he and his team put some serious consideration into this and tried to think it all through... I have absolutely no fucking clue how they came to this conclusion, but I'm pretty sure they think they can make this work. I was just as surprised about Biden being Obamas pick and comparable in experience to McCain.

It's kind of funny, each chose a VP that compares well with the opposing candidate and reduces some arguments, at least as far as experience goes. Obama argued against the long-term Washington crowd and then picked a 35 year senate member, and McCain with 21 years in the Senate argues against Obamas inexperience and chooses a complete Washington outsider, a 44 year old woman, the governor of Alaska. Obama served 6 years in the Illinois Senate and by the election will have served 4 years in Washington, while Palin has been governor of Alaska for less than 2 years and before that she was the mayor of a town of < 6,000 people. On the face of it all, I'd say she is obviously more in touch with the average American than is Obama. As I said about great power I would rather grant it to someone who isn't asking for it and who I believe is pure, than the guy offering me money for it who exudes a power-hungry zeal. I would really like to take Obama at face value and give him credit for being more generous or compassionate than McCain, but there's something about him that I don't trust... and it has nothing to do with the color of his skin. I think McCain is far more out of touch than is Obama, but Palin might be just the right weight to balance the scale.

Oh, and I still can't believe any of you freaks put credibility into whether the candidate is pro-choice or anti-abortion. It is a fucking non-issue and not in the hands of the president or especially the vice-president. The people will not allow that issue to be overturned. I am pro-abortion (that's right) and quite confident that ruling is not in any danger. It's a terrible tactic used by the right. The left have theirs...

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 29, 2008, 11:20 pm

Fash wrote:I would think he and his team put some serious consideration into this and tried to think it all through... I have absolutely no fucking clue how they came to this conclusion, but I'm pretty sure they think they can make this work. I was just as surprised about Biden being Obamas pick and comparable in experience to McCain.

It's kind of funny, each chose a VP that compares well with the opposing candidate and reduces some arguments, at least as far as experience goes. Obama argued against the long-term Washington crowd and then picked a 35 year senate member, and McCain with 21 years in the Senate argues against Obamas inexperience and chooses a complete Washington outsider, a 44 year old woman, the governor of Alaska. Obama served 6 years in the Illinois Senate and by the election will have served 4 years in Washington, while Palin has been governor of Alaska for less than 2 years and before that she was the mayor of a town of < 6,000 people. On the face of it all, I'd say she is obviously more in touch with the average American than is Obama. As I said about great power I would rather grant it to someone who isn't asking for it and who I believe is pure, than the guy offering me money for it who exudes a power-hungry zeal. I would really like to take Obama at face value and give him credit for being more generous or compassionate than McCain, but there's something about him that I don't trust... and it has nothing to do with the color of his skin. I think McCain is far more out of touch than is Obama, but Palin might be just the right weight to balance the scale.

Oh, and I still can't believe any of you freaks put credibility into whether the candidate is pro-choice or anti-abortion. It is a fucking non-issue and not in the hands of the president or especially the vice-president. The people will not allow that issue to be overturned. I am pro-abortion (that's right) and quite confident that ruling is not in any danger. It's a terrible tactic used by the right. The left have theirs...

Dude just say you are voting republican, way too much effort in self justification with all this great power - those who want it crap. If someone is running for office they want it. You don't need to explain your vote.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 29, 2008, 11:29 pm

Edit: Actually, on second thoughts, replying to Fash is pointless, I'm sure "Sarah Barracudah" will do juuuuuuuuuuuuuuust fine.

This turn of events is fucking hilarious.

Xatrei · Post by **Xatrei** » August 29, 2008, 11:42 pm

Fash wrote:Oh, and I still can't believe any of you freaks put credibility into whether the candidate is pro-choice or anti-abortion. It is a fucking non-issue and not in the hands of the president or especially the vice-president. The people will not allow that issue to be overturned. I am pro-abortion (that's right) and quite confident that ruling is not in any danger. It's a terrible tactic used by the right. The left have theirs...

You're a bigger idiot than I previously thought (not sure if that's even possible) if you don't think that the right to choose is in jeopardy now that Bush has mucked up the Supreme Court with a couple more right-wing, fundamentalist ideologues in the mold of Scalia and Thomas. McCain says he'll appoint more just like Roberts and Alito if he gets the opportunity, and it's likely that 3 justices would need to be replaced during the next presidential term. There are several challenges to abortion rights ready to filter up to the supremes for consideration. If the court becomes stacked with more of these bastards, the right to choose as it exists now is history, along with plenty of other things most people who give a shit about their liberty should care about.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 29, 2008, 11:46 pm

Absolutely hilarious.

Also: Her voice, lol. awesome. This could not be better.

Edit: and what's this about her baby and the pregnant daughter? Maybe too early to tell so who knows? Still, hahahaha. Sarah Palin, hahahahaha. God can you imagine her dealing with Putin, Ahmedinejaad etc once that cancerous old McCain tops it? what a fucking awesome day.

Xatrei · Post by **Xatrei** » August 30, 2008, 1:22 am

The more I see about Palin's background and so-called experience, the more (baffling|frightening|shocking|outrageous) her selection becomes. Someday her name will be used much like Bork to describe failure or bad decision. That will be a shame for lumberjacks everywhere.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 30, 2008, 1:25 am

As amazing as they are, I doubt even Monty Python could ever have come up with such a silly joke as this.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 1:50 am

Xatrei wrote:The more I see about Palin's background and so-called experience, the more (baffling|frightening|shocking|outrageous) her selection becomes. Someday her name will be used much like Bork to describe failure or bad decision. That will be a shame for lumberjacks everywhere.

Stop dismissing her Xatrei you sexist pig!!!1111!!1 She is the most popular governor in the USA!!!!!1 Governor of the largest state!!!!!!!!

*talking points brought to you by the GOP

Metanis · Post by **Metanis** » August 30, 2008, 1:54 am

I've been reading commentary about Sarah Palin for almost 12 hours straight. Both the left and the right are discounting the very important fact that this woman will control her own destiny. It's not going to be all about what she did (the past), but the potential for her to take the country by fire. She could fall flat on her face but it's in her hands. Her history indicates she can easily turn the conventional wisdom on its head. I certainly wouldn't bet against her.

I also have a much higher regard for John McCain today for his willingness to bet the farm on this decision. It's thrilling to see a man risk it all. It's tempting to contrast McCain's much bigger pair than poor Barry's. However based on what I've read today, Ms. Sarah has bigger balls the entire team of Obama Be Biden.

The wailing and gnashing of teeth on the left is proof enough to me that this was an awesome decision by John McCain.

Don't you boys go choking on your own bile now!

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 2:23 am

I think the "gnashing of teeth" is due to McCain being 72 and the very real possibility this unknown could become president and people know shit all about her. Even McCain had only met her once before. You call it balls, many see it as reckless.

Aslanna · Post by **Aslanna** » August 30, 2008, 2:35 am

Thanks for the entertaining post Metanis. It was worth the wait!

If anything the wailing is being done over on the right. The left is simply pointing and laughing.

Spang · Post by **Spang** » August 30, 2008, 3:14 am

I'll vote for McCain if Sarah Palin milks my prostate.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » August 30, 2008, 3:52 am

Lol Metanis. The left is not wailing and gnashing their teeth, they are laughing hysterically at the McCain campaign, the gift that keeps on giving. Let's not forget that McCain is older than the state she governs! This woman is qualified to be commander in chief? Is this the judgment McCain lauds so often? lol. I'm so happy. So very happy. As I predicted many times, this election will be a landslide.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 4:31 am

Xyun wrote:Lol Metanis. The left is not wailing and gnashing their teeth, they are laughing hysterically at the McCain campaign, the gift that keeps on giving. Let's not forget that McCain is older than the state she governs! This woman is qualified to be commander in chief? Is this the judgment McCain lauds so often? lol. I'm so happy. So very happy. As I predicted many times, this election will be a landslide.

It should be but remember 2004? The left was laughing hysterically at first, now they seem to be getting frightened by the possibility of President Palin.

Sirton · Post by **Sirton** » August 30, 2008, 4:52 am

Its great how much everyone is under estimating her. Even if she has different views than many of you she is smart as a whip and a great debater. She also does not need a teleprompter to speak. Shes a reformer and brings change to Maccains ticket aswell. Her vs Biden(a great bloody nose debater) hell be the washington insider and when Id normally say hed kick ass in a debate he may actually go over board on her and backfire.

And I have to say.....The conservative base has been TOTALLY energized about her, which will help equal out the energy around Obama. Every talk show besides Mike savage has been in total glee about this choice. Why is that important???? because, Mccain was in a neck to neck race vs Oboma with all the talk shows inspiring 30-40million listeners...and they were down and out and didnt like Mccain. Today it completely change....Obama's bubble has peaked and deflated some and Mccains will soon be inflating!!

Small town America will fall in love with her around Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Minnesotta, Colorado every small town in America......she is there sister there neighbor someone they love. She is a frontiersman a classical American.

Is she able to be commander in chief? No, but she has more governmental executive experience than all 3 of the others combined and is governor of a state about the same size as Bidens in population. And them putting the argumentnt on her experience......BRING IT ON it just pushes more in LIGHT Obamas lack of experince which is even less than hers...WELL whos running for President Obama vs. Mccain not her....Mccains age is the only big ?????

She was also discovered by rassmussen reports for Mccain..and so her polling is many test polls must be great. 50% of Hillarys supporters are willing to maybe vote for Mccain...This choice even makes it more to Mccains side...

Now you say shes too inexperienced women aren't that stupid....Hell more than half the idiot voters probally don't know who the secretary of state or The Speaker of the House is atm.....Hell maybe even the VP.....and many of these stupid people are voting for a man Barrak hussein Obama cause hes inspirational and different....BUT he has NOOOO experience....Well She is too but its for Women now!!

Hey I have to say this could be a great move or a disaster for Mccain....but to call it atm is way to early.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 30, 2008, 8:03 am

Many of the same people on this thread thinking McCain has no chance are the people that thought Bush had no chance his second term.

VP's are eye candy for those that get distracted easily by actually considering the VP as part of the decision. Biden isn't going to inspire any votes but a spunky female will grab a few.

Quayle: Useless, had celebrity looks for the women voters (not all women, just the clueless ones, same as there are clueless men that will pick a candidate for one dumb reason or another, ignoring the important issues), Bush Sr still gets elected with Quayle as VP.

As funny (in a sick way) as it is to see Sarah Palin nominated, she's going to be more beneficial to McCain than Biden is to Obama.

Crazed NRA peeps: Lock for McCain
Nutjob Fundies: Lock for McCain (he's still a better option than Obama for those freaks)
Scared Old People that want to kick hostile foreign threat ass: Lock for McCain
Lesbians: Has to favor McCain with a female VP. Lesbos can't fantasize about Biden but at least Palin is the right gender.
Racists: Lock for McCain

That adds up. Unfortunately for Obama, being black doesn't mean he gets all the minority vote as if evident by the hispanic vote.

Hispanics are still a question mark. Biden doesn't help Obama's cause and Palin wouldn't seem to help McCain. It's going to come down to who can get the endorsement from the actor that played Pedro in Napoleon Dynamite.

Lynks · Post by **Lynks** » August 30, 2008, 9:34 am

If Obama is too inexperienced for the job, what does that make her? Perfectly acceptable so far. I love the hypocrisy here.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 10:17 am

Winnow wrote:Many of the same people on this thread thinking McCain has no chance are the people that thought Bush had no chance his second term.

I agree. Also the GOP media team are better than DNC team.

Winnow wrote:VP's are eye candy for those that get distracted easily by actually considering the VP as part of the decision. Biden isn't going to inspire any votes but a spunky female will grab a few.

Biden will help with Clinton voters in the midwest but his main plus is as reasurrance for Obama's short political experience.

Winnow wrote:Quayle: Useless, had celebrity looks for the women voters (not all women, just the clueless ones, same as there are clueless men that will pick a candidate for one dumb reason or another, ignoring the important issues), Bush Sr still gets elected with Quayle as VP.

Bush Sr had a tailwind from Reagan, McCain has a headwind from Bush. If Palin implodes I doubt McCain survives.

Winnow wrote:As funny (in a sick way) as it is to see Sarah Palin nominated, she's going to be more beneficial to McCain than Biden is to Obama.

If she survives I agree.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 30, 2008, 12:11 pm

Yes, those of us who have an ounce of faith in America do indeed hope for a democratic win, like we did in 2004.

It will of course be no surprise if the christian right and idiot voters prevail again.

I want to hear you all say "I think it's a good choice that a woman who believes the Earth is 7000 years old, is against abortion even in cases of rape and incest and speaks in tongues at her local church, is an EXCITING AND VALID candidate for the Presidency were McCain to die in office".

Really?

Really?

Nevermind the fact she has batshit insane eyes and sounds like a banshee.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » August 30, 2008, 1:35 pm

Winnow wrote: As funny (in a sick way) as it is to see Sarah Palin nominated, she's going to be more beneficial to McCain than Biden is to Obama.

Thank you Mr. Obvious. The reason for that is because McCain desperately needs someone to make him a better candidate than he is, Obama is not in that predicament.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 2:17 pm

Sirton · Post by **Sirton** » August 30, 2008, 4:07 pm

Haha good one....

Sarah Palin is not experienced enough.....Im not all happy about the selection, but I know most Americans have no clue about politics and will find her appealing(Annie Oakley figure).

Her selection will bring up many experience questions...Which in turn bring up experience questions to the top of the ticket Obama vs. Mac.

She has more experience in elected office than Obama. He was running for President with only about 40 days of elected office as a Senator and his whole term so far hes missed a ton of votes. He has no Record??? What has he EVER accomplished???

He didnt vote against the war in iraq....HE wasn't a Senator then. Hes lie's constantly for political gain and to hide the fact he has no record. Ohh he worked on ethics with John Mcain...Thats why he backed out at the last minute for partisan reasons and Mcain wrote a letter about it in disgust.

Ohh hes a community organizer and as a state lvl senator he mainly known for blocking a bann on abortion after birth that even Barbra Boxer(The queen of Abortion rights) voted for the federal lvl version, and 70+% of Americans will find disgusting..since about 70% are against a lesser version of partial birth abortion.

Obama's only real accomplishment has been that he defeated Hillary Clinton in the Primaries., and He speaks so well. (which he is great at)

Sarah Palin....She was mayor, sat on energy board of our most important energy state. She fought corruption in Alaska and took down people of her own party. She said thanks but no thanks to the bridge to know were. Ohh and she was a Governor of a state that is the basically the same size in population as delaware and much more important due to energy reasons to the nation. Shes been to visit our troops over seas aswell. She has more political executive experience than all 3 of the senators.

Do I think shes inexperienced..Hell yes I do, but thats not the point.. Its about the demographical movement to the STANDARD voter nationwide just because shes a articulate women. Weve just got done seeing this with Obama. 50% of Hillary voters are tempted to vote for Mac and 25% saying they are leaning to voting for him....If 25% or more decide togo over to Mac...then Obama at the end of the day numerically will have no chance.

Its going to be all about negative adds and the Debates...after these conventions. And negative adds on Sarah will backfire after many women have reservations about Obama already.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 30, 2008, 4:16 pm

I think McCain supporters should maybe stop with the "inexperience" angle, it's so hilariously suicidal.

Actually, no, keep it up! go go go!

laneela · Post by **laneela** » August 30, 2008, 4:17 pm

I think Obama should hire Sirton and send him to everyone's house to have a one-on-one with them. I know that if I wasn't already an Obama supporter, my vote would've been swayed to Obama in a heartbeat after reading .02% of his posts.

Sirton · Post by **Sirton** » August 30, 2008, 4:22 pm

Nick I personally think both are way too inexperienced, and Im uneasy with this selection, because its too risky.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 4:44 pm

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 4:47 pm

I'll ignore the points on Obama, there is plenty of info out there about all of them.

Sirton wrote:She has more experience in elected office than Obama.

I grew up in a town of 20,000 people, 3-4 times the size of this town in Alaska she was a council member and then mayor of. This is part time fairly trivial work. I would rank this "experience" with that of a PTA member. She also left the small town with higher taxes and $20 million in debt.

She has been the gov of AK for 20 months. Relevent experience but not as much as a gov of a large state, especially considering how isolated and different AK is they have little interaction with the lower 48 so she isn't up to speed on many mainstream issues.
She is currently being investigated and the report comes in shortly before election day. She also seems to have weird funding priorities, made some retarded financial decisions and has no issue raising taxes.

Sirton wrote:She said thanks but no thanks to the bridge to know were.

Not quite true.

Sirton wrote:Shes been to visit our troops over seas aswell.

Is this her foreign policy experience?

Sirton wrote:She has more political executive experience than all 3 of the senators.

True. I would argue that the best gauge of how these people perform as executives is how they run their campaigns.

Sirton wrote:Its going to be all about negative adds and the Debates...after these conventions. And negative adds on Sarah will backfire after many women have reservations about Obama already.

It looks like Obama's camp after their initial dumb response has smartened up and will ignore her, let her be the story and let the media focus on her. She is the new shiny new object for them and there is a lot for the media to discuss with her very rightwing stances on the environment, gay rights, abortion and birth control. She seems to be more fundy than Bush. With the media scrutinizing her record I think the McCain camp may have to spend time defending her while also giving Obama a respite from the constant media scrutiny.

Bottom line: even if you believe all these talking points and you view her as mother america wrapped in a flag while baking apple pies...If McCain wins and on the morning of Jan 21 he fails to wake up, what would your reaction be?

Markulas · Post by **Markulas** » August 30, 2008, 6:58 pm

The fact that McCain met with her one time before his decision makes me wonder who the hell told him to pick her. Wouldn't McCain like to talk further with the next possible leader of the free world? The choice brings up McCain's age, which according to polls is more important to voters than Obama's race, while discounting McCain's strongest argument against Obama. Pure and simple I think Palin was chosen to distance himself from Bush and appease the base all the while pandering to women.

Also, Palin had a kid like 4 months ago at the age of 43 and somehow the kid was born with Down's syndrome; who would have thought? (apparently she's never seen this http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... _graph.jpg)

She's a creationist though, what would science know.

edit: Just saw a guy with a shirt that read: The average onset of Alzheimers is 72.

Lynks · Post by **Lynks** » August 30, 2008, 8:25 pm

Who cares if she wanted a kid at 43 and it had DS. That's irrelevant.

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 30, 2008, 8:37 pm

Lynks wrote:Who cares if she wanted a kid at 43 and it had DS. That's irrelevant.

I would guess it calls her judgement into question. If she makes poor, uneducated decisions in her personal life, how can we expect her to make the right choices in office?

At least, that's what I think Markulas and others are trying to say without actually saying it. It's similar to people that feel as though she has chosen to put her political career ahead of her special needs baby. I'm indifferent to the whole thing, but I can see how some people can have a problem with it.

Lynks · Post by **Lynks** » August 30, 2008, 10:29 pm

You consider a "poor, uneducated decision" of her personal life is having a baby at 43 because the % for DS is 3.5%?

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 30, 2008, 10:53 pm

That's pretty funny

Here's another story that alleges Palins daughter had her baby in a big coverup

http://www.mediatakeout.com/2008/26264- ... _own_.html

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 30, 2008, 11:05 pm

Winnow wrote:Here's another story that alleges Palins daughter had her baby in a big coverup

The woman is not qualified but people shouldn't be smearing her and (especially) her kid. Even if it is true who gives a fuck.

Mak · Post by **Mak** » August 31, 2008, 2:17 am

Fairweather Pure wrote:If she makes poor, uneducated decisions in her personal life, how can we expect her to make the right choices in office?

I thought one's personal life was irrelevant- or is that just when Bill's getting his dick sucked in the oval office by an intern?

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 31, 2008, 1:00 pm

Lynks wrote:You consider a "poor, uneducated decision" of her personal life is having a baby at 43 because the % for DS is 3.5%?

No, I wouldn't. But some people would.

As I said, I don't really care about the personal lives of our elected officials. However, many people do.

Edit: That is somewhat untrue. I do care that she is a creationist and so aniti abortion she wouldn't even allow for it in cases of rape or incest. I would never, ever vote for a creationist. The thought makes my head spin.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 31, 2008, 1:53 pm

The weekend after you rollout your VP nomine and she isn't on any of the Sunday news shows?

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 31, 2008, 2:49 pm

Fundamentalist. Here is your Dukakis question for the debate.

The candidates were pressed on their stances on abortion and were even asked what they would do if their own daughters were raped and became pregnant.

Palin said she would support abortion only if the mother's life was in danger. When it came to her daughter, she said, "I would choose life."

http://dwb.adn.com/news/politics/electi ... 6781c.html

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 31, 2008, 6:46 pm

Forthe wrote:The weekend after you rollout your VP nomine and she isn't on any of the Sunday news shows?

Gallup Daily has Obama up 8 points, which is tied for his highest lead ever. I think the Palin factor just isn't going to pull in very many undecided voters to the Republican cause. The debates will be the next major challange. I think Biden will eat Palin alive, and Obama is chomping at the bit to get McCain in a public setting. I bet Biden was grinning ear to ear and rubbing his hands together when he found out about the McCain VP choice.

If McCain does lose, I'm sure many will point to the VP choice.

Obama is speaking about a mile from my house right now. I was going to go, but when I drove by at 9:30 this morning there were already a couple thousand people waiting outside the gates. Fuck that. He already has my vote, so I saw no need to stand in 95 degree weather for 8 hours! Anyway, I was getting my hair cut, and no one in the room knew McCain even chose a running mate. It was packed in there today, so I would guess about 25-20 people were in there. I was explaining all the pros and cons, and I was just struck by how much the average person simply do not follow politics. I guess I've been in a very politically active bubble lately. They all seemed very interested in my opinions, so I tried to inform these people about both sides and encouraged them to go to websites and what-not to educate themselves about each candidate and how they related to issues that are important to them. I could've just dogged McCain and put Obama on a pedestal, and these people would've eaten it up. Crazy. I doubt most of them will vote anyway.

Siji · Post by **Siji** » August 31, 2008, 10:12 pm

Fairweather Pure wrote:
Lynks wrote:Who cares if she wanted a kid at 43 and it had DS. That's irrelevant.
I would guess it calls her judgement into question.

Have to disagree with you here. It's not like she intentionally did something reckless and stupid. A higher risk could be said for any woman over 35, and yet thousands and thousands of women are having babies later in life these days. The risk of autism is rising astronomically as well and is more prevalent in boys than girls.. I don't see people aborting their babies if they find out it's a boy however.

That said, I still think it was a dumb ass decision by McCain to allow her to be the choice, and if nothing else it leads me to believe more than ever that he isn't capable of running things on his own, and that other people are making his decisions for him. And really, do we need another 4 years of that? 8 is enough.

Kaldaur · Post by **Kaldaur** » August 31, 2008, 11:11 pm

Fair, you missed out. I've been to see him 3 or 4 times, and it's just a wonderful experience. I wonder if this is how the crispies felt when G Dub was running in 2004, but I always felt inspired by Obama when I hear him speak.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » August 31, 2008, 11:54 pm

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » September 1, 2008, 12:03 am

What Forthe posted above, combined with her daughter being held out of school for FIVE months, supposedly with mono, does allow for serious consideration of the daughter being the pregnant one.

A conspiracy theorist would surmise that the daughter was pregnant, went into labor, Sarah Palin didn't want to jeopardize her career so went ahead with the speech in Texas, but then had to make a speedy return flight to the backwoods hospital where her daughter was having the baby, which would also allow for some shuffled paperwork that couldn't be done in a large hospital.

I can't close the books on this one yet. I want to see a picture of her having the baby and a doctor swearing that he/she delivered it, etc.

Markulas · Post by **Markulas** » September 1, 2008, 12:26 am

The probability of Palin's daughter having a baby with Down's syndrome = less than 1/1000

The probablility of Palin having a baby with Down's syndrome = roughly 1/33

Some might say that trying to agrue those odds requires a conspiracy theory.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » September 1, 2008, 12:47 am

Markulas wrote:The probability of Palin's daughter having a baby with Down's syndrome = less than 1/1000

The probablility of Palin having a baby with Down's syndrome = roughly 1/33

Some might say that trying to agrue those odds requires a conspiracy theory.

While the odds of having a a baby with down's increases with age dramatically (especially over 45), 80% of Down's cases are for women under 35. She is certainly more likely to have a kid with Down's than her daughter but it doesn't require a conspiracy theory.

The whole water breaking and then flying back to AK from Texas is crazy tho. Especially considering its her 5th kid, labor should be shorter.

I think it is much more likely this whole my water broke and I flew back to AK was just a lie to show she was tuff. Her 'sniper' story.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » September 1, 2008, 12:58 am

Now this is the only thing about this VP pick that would make sense to me

Bait and switch?

The selection of Gov. Sarah Palin as McCain's running mate was shocking and mystifying. Stunning for its demonstration of bad judgment on the part of McCain, I just could not figure out why he would select someone who was already under investigation in her home state. But what if that was not the strategy to begin with? What if instead the design was to select a woman who they already knew would pull out quickly?

Much has already been written about the questionable tactic of appealing to former supporters of Sen. Hillary Clinton by naming a woman as pick for Veep. As if a anti-abortion, pro-petroleum industry, political novice would take the place of a woman running for the Presidency.

While Palin' much discussed conservative and "maverick" views have invigorated the Christian Right who had heretofore been cool to McCain's candidacy, think of what may be about to come. here is the scenario:

Within the next 48 hours a viral, and actually quite vile, rumor currently exploding on the internet about the circumstances about Trig's birth -- the one with Down's Syndrome -- will get vetted. Whether true or not, they will place Palin on the spot and the fact of her being under investigation herself will loom larger.

Then McCain, being the alpha male he is, will accept her withdrawal from the race to "protect her from the vicious assault on the left" and thereby accomplish a move even Karl rove (assuming he didn't orchestrate it) would envy. McCain can then name another Veep, one he actually wants, and still claim the "high ground" and support for women and conservative values.

It really won't matter whether the rumor is true, whether she is indicted for ethics violations or whether any other of the sure to follow mistakes in her background dent her appeal. She was never intended to be the candidate anyhow.

She was the bait. Watch for the switch.

http://www.capitolhillblue.com/cont/node/11122

This also lends itself to the theory:

First, 'Country First'Posted: Sunday, August 31, 2008 5:31 PM by Domenico Montanaro

From NBC's Ben Weltman and Domenico Montanaro
ST. PAUL, Minn. -- Some observations from the red-carpet-lined Republican convention floor…

The most obvious thing when walking in the hall -- after the giant screen waving American flag on stage -- are the plethora of “Country First” slogans engulfing the arena.

In fact, “Country First” appears prominently in 23 places around the arena at varying sizes and on LCD screens.

There are two American flags draped from high podiums that are about 20-feet long, and there are seven waving ones on LCD screens, including the huge one on stage, which is about 30-feet high.

The seating is perhaps a window into the states the McCain campaign thinks are important. Hint: It's not Guam or the Northern Marianas Islands. They are way in the back and the Northern Marianas sign is barely legible and covered over by a black drape.

The states with preferential seating -- front and center: Ohio, Pennsylvania and Colorado; on either side of the stage: Arizona (McCain's home state), and battlegrounds New Hampshire, Missouri, Michigan, Virginia, Nevada, Wisconsin, North Carolina and Minnesota.

And interestingly, we did not see anything that said Palin on it, except for a few stickers you could count on one hand.

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/ ... 16043.aspx

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » September 1, 2008, 5:00 am

It's pretty much what I expected. Palin is generating discussion, but not the good kind. She'll be a major distraction for the Republicans, which will take the scrutiny and unfounded rumors off Obama for awhile and place them in Palin's lap. Even the talking heads are too busy trying to prop up Palin, they've had to lay off attacking Obama.

People are latching onto the "Palin pregancy cover up" rumor as much as they were with the "Obama is a muslim" rumor. Everyone seems to know about the "what does a VP do?" video from last year too. She's also under investigation for corruption, just like the Republican senator from Alaska. Then you have mothers that are concerned about her turning her back on her special needs infant. She's a creationist. She's anti-abortion to the freaky degree. That's just off the top of my head, and it's only been 3 days.

I feel bad about seeing all the dirt on her. It's such a Republican thing to do. I guess you reap what you sow. It reminds me of the righties that prayed for God to rain out Obama at the DNC, and look what's happening to the RNC! I'm glad they're cancelling their convention. America needs to focus on one disaster at a time! Meanwhile, Obama recieved more viewers than the Olympic opening ceremony and the American Idol finale. He's also still enjoying his bump in the polls.

If the Republicans want to use Palin, they better get cracking. She's going to be old news faster than she was new news if they do not strike while the iron is hot.

What the Dems really need is for McCain to pass out on stage from a heatstroke or something. This election would be fucking over.