Built-in Vista extractor adding encryption to files.

[noel]

I've been researching the hell out of this to try and determine the exact cause/reason Vista is behaving in the manner it is. I've been posting on forums, googling my little heart out, and testing shit on my own.

Update - New information is emboldened:

The fact that the files are encrypted in the first place appears to be a bug/feature of Vista's built-in extractor when dealing with files compressed in OS X with OS X's built-in GUI compression utility.

This issue can be easily recreated. Take any file on any Mac running OS X 10.4.x or higher (I've been unable to test this with earlier versions of OS X) and Ctrl-click/Right-Click on it and choose 'Compress "Filename".

Then move that file to a PC running Windows Vista with all current updates and no additional extraction software (i.e. no WinZip or WinRAR).

In Vista, right-click on the file and choose 'Extract All...' Vista extracts the file(s) to a folder with the same name as the compressed file, the files contained in the folder have green filenames indicating they are encrypted. Vista's extractor encrypts the files during the extraction process. Examining the properties of the file shows me that the account associated with the encryption is vista_user(vista_user@vista_machine_name).

It's easy enough to remove the encryption by right clicking and modifying the attributes. This only occurs with files compressed in OS X and extracted with Vista's built-in extractor. This does not occur if WinZip or WinRAR is used to extract the files on the Vista machine or with XP's built-in extractor. This also does not occur the OS X command-line zip utility is used to compress the file(s). The command line-utility does not include the HFS metadata for the compressed files that the GUI compression utility does include. It seems that if Vista's extractor sees that data it decides that it needs to encrypt the files it's extracting.

[Fash]

weird.

one, i can't figure out why there would be any code in the vista built-in extractor to encrypt files during decompression.

two, i can't figure out why having mac system files in the archive would trigger it.

three, vista sucks.

[Boogahz]

Well, this is the first "issue" I have had with Vista.

Noel, if your files are still there, I can check to see if the encryption tag is there before being extracted. For some reason I think that I remember it being there before I extracted it.

[noel]

I agree Fash. I'm baffled by this. I'm guessing there's some good reason for it, I just can't for the life of me find any information on it.

Boog,

The Punisher Files and All Star Batman and Robin files are exactly the same.

It's impossible for them to be encrypted before extraction... If they were, the files would be unreadable by you when extracted (you wouldn't have encryption keys from my machine, and the encryption keys from the properties page in Vista would not/could not be associated with your username/machinename.

In the meantime, I'll use the command-line zip utility for anything I compress.

[Boogahz]

I'll try one of those later today. I already had the Punisher and All Star books, and I deleted them once I realized it. You mentioned that the ._filename files were for something on the Mac. What are those?

[Winnow]

Winrar works fine on the files in question. I'd advise downloading that from the newsgroups.

The Apple plague is growing so you may as well get one of the most common/popular apps to handle compression as it will msot likely be kept up to date to deal with multiple Operating Systems.

[Fash]

http://rarlab.com

download winrar trial and never register it... it doesn't even nag. It add's compression/decompression options to the right click context menu for files and works great.

the apple plague? winnow, you troll...

[noel]

Winrar works fine on the files in question. I'd advise downloading that from the newsgroups.

The Apple plague is growing so you may as well get one of the most common/popular apps to handle compression as it will msot likely be kept up to date to deal with multiple Operating Systems.

You can't possibly be blaming Apple for what is very clearly a Vista issue (note that I'm not saying bug at this point).

Boog, the files contain HFS Metadata or, the tagging information used by UNIX OSes for files. There's a good writeup here.

I'd add that WinRAR is a minimum of 4 times faster to extract everything I've been testing with (CBRs, Word Docs, text files, HTML files, Excel Spreadsheets).

[Boogahz]

Winrar works fine on the files in question. I'd advise downloading that from the newsgroups.

The Apple plague is growing so you may as well get one of the most common/popular apps to handle compression as it will msot likely be kept up to date to deal with multiple Operating Systems.

I have a registered version of WinRar, I choose not to have it be the default program to perform certain actions as I noted before.

[Winnow]

dump Bitlocker and all is solved or at least it's a good step in the right direction.

[Boogahz]

dump Bitlocker and all is solved or at least it's a good step in the right direction.

I think you missed the post where I commented on Bitlocker not being involved. That is also why the thread title no longer has any mention of it

[noel]

dump Bitlocker and all is solved or at least it's a good step in the right direction.

Unfortunately, this has nothing to do with Bitlocker.

[Aslanna]

dump Bitlocker Vista and all is solved or at least it's a good step in the right direction.

[Fash]

dump Bitlocker Vista and all is solved or at least it's a good step in the right direction.

[Boogahz]

So, what do y'all actually know is wrong with Vista? I laugh every time I hear the anti-Vista whining since I have not had any problems with it. Except for the strange encrypted Mac files!

[noel]

I do not, as a general practice hate on Vista. It is what it is, and it's usable. It's definitely not the OS I prefer to use. I really like XP, and think MS made a big mistake moving away from it as they did.

Only because you asked:
The issue this thread is now about. Fash brings up a good point... why would extraction trigger encryption EVER? Especially without specifically prompting the user.

For starters... File moving/copying takes ridiculously long. Extracting files takes ridiculously long.

UAC is a great idea with one of the worst software implementations I've ever seen. I realize it can be removed/disabled, but you shouldn't have to. Linux and OS X both do this in a much less annoying way. Don't agree? Copy a folder into the \Program Files\ directory. How many times are you prompted? Twice. Once wasn't good enough I guess.

The only improvement over XP... are DX10.

Performance numbers are percentage points slow across the board when compared to XP. I personally don't care about the drop in percentage points, but it begs the question... why?

The search utility doesn't even index outside of the Users directory unless you tell it to. Have fun searching for that text file you're looking for so you can modify a config file for something in the program files directory.

My OSes of preference are: OS X, XP SP2, Vista

THE MAC FILES AREN'T FUCKING ENCRYPTED. VISTA IS ENCRYPTING THEM. FUCK.

[Aslanna]

So, what do y'all actually know is wrong with Vista? I laugh every time I hear the anti-Vista whining since I have not had any problems with it. Except for the strange encrypted Mac files!

My post wasn't entirely serious. It was mainly taking Winnow's response and refining it to take a dig at Vista in the same way Winnow bags on Apple at every opportunity. However dumping Vista would solve your issue would it not? Well there you go!


I'm not going to go into why I don't like Vista as that has been covered to death in one or two threads here already.

[Fash]

Noel summed it up with good details... I just see no reason. I've installed it a few times, had problems of some sort each time, and saw no benefit to it. XP runs marvelously, supports all my hardware, and runs every application I need.

Some other bad points, imo... destroying EAX and other hardware sound acceleration, DRM and HDCP scans every few milliseconds, and DX10 being Vista only.

[Boogahz]

THE MAC FILES AREN'T FUCKING ENCRYPTED. VISTA IS ENCRYPTING THEM. FUCK.

lol, I threw that line in after getting ready to hit submit just to rile you. Like my post saying you were trying to corrupt our systems with your Mac stuff!

I haven't noticed extracting files taking any longer than it did/does for me on XP, but I also do not generally extract super-large files.

I had problems with EAX before Vista...probably before XP, it's been so long I don't remember.

Granny Smith Apples are greater than Macs.

The Vista search function could be better, but I have rarely found a need, personally, to use it beyond searching for files that it was able to find.

The new Explorer was a bit rough to use, but it has not been all that bad. The only thing I really disliked about it was that it always defaulted to the user folder rather than "my computer" which is where I prefer to start.

Stability, display driver issues (go nvidia!) and one failing power supply have been the only issues that killed my system stability number. I thought that being able to actually see this with the tools included was kind of cool. It at least appears to be more transparent when it comes to showing you how good, or bad, your system has been running.

I don't think I would recognize the Apple IIc anymore, even though the free one from my bank was my first computer.

The Logitech G15 LCD monitor must be activated on each reboot rather than automatically going to the screen with time/date/etc.. This was annoying, but since I do not shut my system down often, it has not been a "real" issue.

[Winnow]

Leopard creates folder names that can't be read by Windows!

I thought I actually had one single little app (Unison) from OSX that was better (well different, not better than Newleecher for specialty image group use) than something in Windows but even that isn't possible because I can't access the files from Windows due to the folder gayness.

[noel]

THE MAC FILES AREN'T FUCKING ENCRYPTED. VISTA IS ENCRYPTING THEM. FUCK.

lol, I threw that line in after getting ready to hit submit just to rile you. Like my post saying you were trying to corrupt our systems with your Mac stuff!

I've been working on this for two days because I felt bad that it caused an issue on your PC. The first post I saw from you I thought was a joke just because you saw the Mac folder there. No one else complained because pretty much everyone else is using WinRAR. You have yet to say why winRAR or winZip or whatever isn't your default program for handling these files.

You SAY you just put that in to rile me, and yet you're going to go home tonight and test the files to make sure they're not encrypted before they're extracted by Vista... I've wasted enough time on this already to ASSURE YOU that they're not.

For reference, my comparison of extraction times wasn't between XP and Vista it was between WinRAR and Vista's built in extractor.

If you're dying to test something meaningful when you get home, try this:

1. Grab any 10 zip files from ANYWHERE.
2. Right click on each of them and unzip them with Vista's built in extractor.
3. Make WinRAR your default program to unzip files.
4. Unzip the same 10 files.
5. Explain to us why you're using Vista's built in extractor again...

[Winnow]

It's not a good idea to use Vista's built in zip app....for the (n)th time.

Use Winrar

It's not a good idea to use Vista's built in zip app....for the (n)th time.

Use Winrar

It's not a good idea to use Vista's built in zip app....for the (n)th time.

Use Winrar

It's not a good idea to use Vista's built in zip app....for the (n)th time.

Use Winrar

[Boogahz]

THE MAC FILES AREN'T FUCKING ENCRYPTED. VISTA IS ENCRYPTING THEM. FUCK.

lol, I threw that line in after getting ready to hit submit just to rile you. Like my post saying you were trying to corrupt our systems with your Mac stuff!

I've been working on this for two days because I felt bad that it caused an issue on your PC. The first post I saw from you I thought was a joke just because you saw the Mac folder there. No one else complained because pretty much everyone else is using WinRAR. You have yet to say why winRAR or winZip or whatever isn't your default program for handling these files.

You SAY you just put that in to rile me, and yet you're going to go home tonight and test the files to make sure they're not encrypted before they're extracted by Vista... I've wasted enough time on this already to ASSURE YOU that they're not.

For reference, my comparison of extraction times wasn't between XP and Vista it was between WinRAR and Vista's built in extractor.

If you're dying to test something meaningful when you get home, try this:

1. Grab any 10 zip files from ANYWHERE.
2. Right click on each of them and unzip them with Vista's built in extractor.
3. Make WinRAR your default program to unzip files.
4. Unzip the same 10 files.
5. Explain to us why you're using Vista's built in extractor again...

If that is the reason you were working on it, please feel free to stop. I just thought it was strange, and I thought you were looking because you were curious as well. I never intended to make you go through so much trouble to figure out why this was happening. I was only going to test it tonight in an attempt to assist in breaking down where exactly this was happening. I agree that it is something annoying that Vista is doing, and I think that knowing why would not be a bad thing.

[Truant]

The why is because it's Vista.
That's what vista does. It asks you for confirmation 531890521 times when you tell it to do something. And it gives no mention at all when it does things you didn't tell it to do.

[Boogahz]

The why is because it's Vista.
That's what vista does. It asks you for confirmation 531890521 times when you tell it to do something. And it gives no mention at all when it does things you didn't tell it to do.

My Vista install asks me once. That is it. The only time it asks again later is if I tell it to.

[Winnow]

First thing you should do with Vista is disable UAC.

UAC is there for old grannys.

[Truant]

The why is because it's Vista.
That's what vista does. It asks you for confirmation 531890521 times when you tell it to do something. And it gives no mention at all when it does things you didn't tell it to do.

My Vista install asks me once. That is it. The only time it asks again later is if I tell it to.

Good for you. Enjoy your Vista. Try not to waste anyone else's time trying to figure out how it works.

[Boogahz]

The why is because it's Vista.
That's what vista does. It asks you for confirmation 531890521 times when you tell it to do something. And it gives no mention at all when it does things you didn't tell it to do.

My Vista install asks me once. That is it. The only time it asks again later is if I tell it to.

Good for you. Enjoy your Vista. Try not to waste anyone else's time trying to figure out how it works.

I haven't been wasting anyone's time figuring out how Vista works. I asked a question, and I accepted that it was odd. Noel decided to research it further on his own. I thank him for that, but it was not my intention to have him continue to look beyond saying "wow, that's fucked up that the Vista extraction tool acts that way!"

[noel]

This is resolved in Vista SP1.

[Boogahz]

Thank you for the update.

[noel]

weird.

one, i can't figure out why there would be any code in the vista built-in extractor to encrypt files during decompression.

I haven't figured out your second point from the above post, but I think I have an idea about the first... The only time you'd want this to occur automatically was if your drive was running BitLocker and everything was encrypted. You'd get an zip file, which I assume would be encrypted as soon as you wrote it to the disk. When you extract that .zip all the contents would also be encrypted. This is the only case I can think of where you'd want that to happen automatically.

Following that hypothesis, and given that SP1 has fixes for the extractor and for BitLocker, I'm going to say that something in the Mac .zip file made Vista incorrectly think that it should behave in the same manner it would if BitLocker was running. I have no idea what that would be, but this is the only logical reason I can think of for this to occur.

[Zaelath]

Well, they had a bug in the old XP EFS where files would be created in plain text then encrypted, which meant they were all over the HDD in plain text if you looked. Could be they err on the side of caution after being stung previously.