Cops, and Why I sometimes hate them.

Drewno · Post by **Drewno** » January 16, 2003, 8:27 am

I respect police officers. They are the thin blue line that keeps utter chaos out of our society, and I thank them for that. But, what I've been experiencing over the last few weeks of Winter Break irritates me terribly.

First a little background,
Over short breaks like this, I have a waiting job for me at a resteraunt several towns over as a waiter. It is approximately a 35 minute commute both ways. I am a very good driver. Unfortunately, the hours are not so good - and I work 5pm - 1am every night, and usually get home around 2-3am.

And now for the problem,
On five, yes five, 5! Seperate occasions on my way home over the last three weeks I was tailed by police officers - all marked cars. I did not immediately know that these were police officers. Why didn't I know? They had their brights on and were blinding me with them, which was a horrible distraction. Normally this wouldn't have been so much of a problem except for the fact that these fuckers were also tailgating me, another potentially hazerdous and deadly act.

Now for my question: Why is this legal? Why are cops allowed to fucking chase after people who aren't breaking the law, blinding them with their brights and tailgating them - trying to entice them. This act is not only dangerous, but degrading as well...eroding an already shoddy public opinion on most police officers.

edit note: All 5 times were on the same 5-6 mile stretch of road.

Masekle · Post by **Masekle** » January 16, 2003, 9:20 am

The defensive thing to do sir,... If you are distracted, at ANY time, pull safley to the shoulder untill the distraction passes. whether its a cop or a bad case of gas, it makes no differance.

Another thing make sure your plate is clean and easily viewable =)

If you must make latenite commutes sell that B210 and upgrade

Drolgin Steingrinder · January 16, 2003, 10:33 am

Damn, I thought this thread was "Cobs, and why I sometimes hate him".

Move along!

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » January 16, 2003, 10:48 am

I think the Cops that are tailgating you Made polls on Veeshanvault.

No on a serious note Drewon I bartended for 11 yrs and the same shit happened to me.

Dexail · Post by **Dexail** » January 16, 2003, 10:49 am

Drolgin, now that was funny

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » January 16, 2003, 10:52 am

haha, teh drolgin strikes again!

Phugg_Innay · Post by **Phugg_Innay** » January 16, 2003, 10:54 am

Drewno,

I know some of the cops around town here very well. So I'll drop a little insight. 1am-33am they are looking for the drunks. Being that its probably the same cop that is following you every night, I would suggest just pulling over one of these times. Chances are the cop will follow you to a stop. Just explain your situation to him/her. My theory is they havnt seen your car out on that stretch before , so the idea in there head is " New guy around, he's probably drinkin at his old spot". I get pulled over about once a month in my piece of crap (but pretty) Jeep. Normally its leaving the court I live on. The road I have to cross to get out of here is always jammed with cars going both ways , so I have to really get on it to get out safely, no time for a friggin blinker (the main reason I have been stopped). The last time the guy actually had the balls to ask if I was on probation or anything. I was offended since I havnt even had a ticket in over 10 years.
My suggestion , just deal with it , I would rather know that a cop is out there on the stretch of road I am on at 1am keeping it safer , than to know there are people drunk as shit driving on the same stretch.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » January 16, 2003, 11:17 am

Oh just admit it Phugg your pulled over hoping for a little Nightstick action.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » January 16, 2003, 11:49 am

The problem with cops is that they are usually power-tripping egomaniacs who didn't quite make the football team in high school and treating complete strangers like shit is their way of revenge.

One time I got pulled over with 2 of my black friends in the car. The cop gave me a field sobriety test which I passed (I only had one beer) and then proceeded to ID and question both of my passengers. The initial reason he pulled me over was because "my tag light was too dim".

I have also been pulled over for countless other ignorant things including not wearing my seatbelt. They see a red flashy sports car and they get a fuckin boner. Another time I pull over not realizing there is a huge ditch and my car rolls right into the ditch. I attempt to get out of the car and I hear the cop yelling at the top of his lungs STAY IN THE CAR, STAY IN THE CAR. I look up and the motherfucker has his gun fucking pointed at me. That was the only time I feared for my life. GAWD I hate cops.

One thing I've noticed is that the older the cop is, the nicer and more down to earth he is.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 16, 2003, 12:10 pm

The problem with cops is that they are usually power-tripping egomaniacs who didn't quite make the football team in high school and treating complete strangers like shit is their way of revenge

And the problem with the young is they have no fucking idea what they are talking about, having had no life experience to hang their opinions on.

Climb in the car, dipshit. Explain to your loved ones that you might be home tongiht or not, depending on what the fourth driver you stop has running through his veins.

Drewno,

Sorry for the annoyance, man. I've worked with and around police officers for close to a decade now. I couldn't do their job. I can also tell you that as a group they are about the most arrogant DRIVERS I have met.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » January 16, 2003, 12:26 pm

I would never take a job to enforce laws I don't agree with. I am not saying that all cops are like that, just the trash that patrols the highways in order to meet their monthly quota.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » January 16, 2003, 12:46 pm

If you drive a lot at the prime hours for drunks, expect to get pulled over a lot. Usually it is nothing more than a random check to make certain that the roads are safe. When you start getting older you appreciate these things a little more. I imagine after you start a family that it will be even more important to you.

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » January 16, 2003, 1:15 pm

I dunno most of the stuff I've read here is harrassment if it's true.
Sure keep the roads clear of drunks but FFS have at least a decent reason for pulling people over (light too dim wtf?).

I'll never feel insecure enough for myself or my family to accept that harassment by overzealous armed rozzers is justified.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » January 16, 2003, 1:38 pm

Cops have shit jobs. They deal with the scum of society on a daily basis so I cut them some slack if they're cautious with everyone.

I've passed 4 separate DUI tests because of the time of night I was driving. I don't think it's harrassment though. I'm also thankful that I have some dexterity as I've known some uncoordinated people that get arrested because they're either nervous as hell or naturally clumbsy and can't pass the tests. I suppose I'd be less calm about this subject if I had to go down to the station and demand blood tests etc. One key point is to always be respectful and cooperative when stopped, say "officer" not "occifer" and you'll be on your way soon enough. Arguing gets you absolutely nowhere.

Draino, if you want to send a message or hint to unmarked police...get a bumper sticker that says "I'm a waiter, not a drunk driver" or "I'm a bartender, not a drunk driver"

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » January 16, 2003, 1:44 pm

Winnow wrote:Cops have shit jobs. They deal with the scum of society on a daily basis so I cut them some slack if they're cautious with everyone.

I've passed 4 separate DUI tests because of the time of night I was driving. I don't think it's harrassment though. I'm also thankful that I have some dexterity as I've known some uncoordinated people that get arrested because they're either nervous as hell or naturally clumbsy and can't pass the tests. I suppose I'd be less calm about this subject if I had to go down to the station and demand blood tests etc. One key point is to always be respectful and cooperative when stopped, say "officer" not "occifer" and you'll be on your way soon enough. Arguing gets you absolutely nowhere.

Draino, if you want to send a message or hint to unmarked police...get a bumper sticker that says "I'm a waiter, not a drunk driver" or "I'm a bartender, not a drunk driver"

And dont forget your shotgun on your gun rack

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » January 16, 2003, 2:12 pm

Cartalas wrote:
And dont forget your shotgun on your gun rack

the redneck disguise is complete : )

rhyae · Post by **rhyae** » January 16, 2003, 3:38 pm

Cops have dangerous, stressful jobs, and they do deserve a little slack.
BUT, tailgating someone with your highbeams on is not done in the interest of public safety, its harassment.

Mort · Post by **Mort** » January 16, 2003, 3:45 pm

Ever since I put the "I support the Local Police" sticker on my bumper, I haven't been pulled over once

Drewno · Post by **Drewno** » January 16, 2003, 4:22 pm

I have spoken with several people about this, and here is what I have decided to do.

Over the next two weeks I will write several letters to my city hall about this incident, complaining about the harassment. Then I will write a letter to two daily newspapers and a local news station. Then, the next time I get tailgated i'm going to SLAM on the brakes (I saw a beaver on the road, I swear !!! ) and let the cop rear end me - then i'm going to fake whiplash. Then I'm going to sue the fucking shit out of whatever police officers hit me and watch as their wages are garnished for the rest of their lives.
DIE!!!

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » January 16, 2003, 4:27 pm

or you are just going to get your ass beat to a pulp and left in a ditch in a shady part of town.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » January 16, 2003, 4:36 pm

/waves Goodbye to Drewon

Ajran · Post by **Ajran** » January 16, 2003, 4:55 pm

Drewno wrote:I have spoken with several people about this, and here is what I have decided to do.

Over the next two weeks I will write several letters to my city hall about this incident, complaining about the harassment. Then I will write a letter to two daily newspapers and a local news station. Then, the next time I get tailgated i'm going to SLAM on the brakes (I saw a beaver on the road, I swear !!! ) and let the cop rear end me - then i'm going to fake whiplash. Then I'm going to sue the fucking shit out of whatever police officers hit me and watch as their wages are garnished for the rest of their lives.
DIE!!!

and now that you've posted on a public message board that you are going to fake whiplash and you already know a beaver is going to run in front of yuo... well see ya in 10-20

Acies · Post by **Acies** » January 16, 2003, 5:14 pm

You know, if you slammed the brakes and let them rear end you, they would be at fault. Just say you saw a squirel and you brake for animals

rhyae · Post by **rhyae** » January 16, 2003, 6:16 pm

Video tape it all.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » January 16, 2003, 6:18 pm

no dude what you do is reach into your jacket really quickly to trick him into thinking you are pulling a gun, and then sue him when he kills you.

Colal · Post by **Colal** » January 16, 2003, 6:24 pm

If your young, male, or drive a flashy car you should take some time and read some of the search and seizure laws for your state. Cops do the things they do because they rely on these people to not know their rights. There are very strict definitions on "reasonable suspicion" and "probable cause" and both of these things are very different from each other. If you know your rights, you can tell the cop you will not allow him to test you, or to search or question you. At this point he can arrest you if he wants, but if you know your rights, you will be fine.

Let me give you an example. If you live in texas and attend a public school, your teachers are legally allowed to search you, and your bags based on "reasonable suspicion", and anything they find can be used as evidence against you. However a police officer is not allowed to search you or your bags unless they have "probably cause" If they only have "reasonable suspicion" they have to get a teacher to do it.

There are many laws like that, which apply to drivers. If you take the time to learn them, you can avoid OMGIAMRETARDEDCAUSEALOTISTWOWORDS of the things you are describing.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 16, 2003, 6:29 pm

Colal is 100% correct.

However.

The poster wasn't even stopped. Annoying as hell I know, and probably worthy of a phone call to a supervisor, but let's not get carried away here.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » January 16, 2003, 6:49 pm

Colal either sells weed or he is gonna grow up to be a lawyer.

or both

Millie · Post by **Millie** » January 16, 2003, 7:58 pm

I had the exact same experience with a traffic cop a few months ago. I was driving at or under the speed limit at night on a fairly empty freeway, when all of the sudden, this unidentified car starts tailgating me. He was riding my ass and high-beaming me like there was no tomorrow. I thought he might be drunk, he was so crazy. I tried switching lanes, but he followed with me -- and so close behind, I was scared even to change lanes in the first place. Sure enough, after I sped up a bit to try to shake him, he sprouts flashing red and blue lights, and I get pulled over.

He gave me a hefty ticket on that one, too. I would have taken it to court, but the citation was written up about 4 hours outside of my home town, and I had no interest in driving back there at 8 am one morning to defend myself.

Practices like the tailgating tactic are ridiculous, and I'm sure they'll only halfway legal. If it ever happens to me again, you can bet your ass I'm slamming on the breaks. Hopefully the cop will crash into me, so he can fly through my window and kiss my ass.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » January 16, 2003, 8:27 pm

I got a ticket last Sunday for careless driving. The reasons the cop stated for pulling me over: "It looked like you were pressed against your door during that turn and when you saw me you said 'Oh shit.'" When I denied those accusations, he then switched to "Well you still took that turn WAY too fast."

1) I'm a fairly big guy (50" chest) and I drive a little sports car. My shoulders always touch the door.
2) I was actually singing along to U2's "With or Without You" but since when is fucking swearing a stoppable offense?
3) I signaled, didn't break traction, made a clean turn, and didn't break the speed limit. In fact, I was going slow enough to accelerate UP to the 30 MPH limit.

From this jackhole's accent, he's a Miami cop who just transferred down. I'm most definitely taking this to court. I fucking HATE cops.

Drewno · Post by **Drewno** » January 16, 2003, 11:53 pm

I fucking HATE cops.

IMO they should have two seperate types of cops...Traffic cops - and everything else.

Everyone hates traffic cops, and that hate spills over to the average joes walking the beat - poor guys.

Masekle · Post by **Masekle** » January 17, 2003, 12:54 am

If you go to traffic court and expect to have a chance, YOU BETTER have a lawyer, at any cost....

When you get down to it a careless driving ticket is gonna bring your insurance up over the course of 3 yrs

The thing is Cops dont lose in traffic court.

After I sped up a bit to try to shake him.

UMM No this aint gonna work. In fact, you can be written up for several offenses, when you do that

Speed competiton being the worst.

[/quote]

Millie · Post by **Millie** » January 17, 2003, 6:44 am

Masekle wrote:...Cops dont lose in traffic court.

Most of the time they don't lose. I've beaten traffic cops twice in court, though. Both times on account of my kick-ass lawyer.

As for the tailgating thing, if I wanted to take that case to court, I would have. I don't give a crap whether he had a "right" to pull me over for speeding or not -- the fact of the matter remains, he baited me into doing so.

Aren't there any entrapment laws against something like that? It's almost the equivalent of a crooked cop smashing in your tail light and then citing you for driving with a broken light. Can they actually get away with shit like this in court?

Keverian FireCry · Post by **Keverian FireCry** » January 17, 2003, 6:51 am

Colal either sells weed or he is gonna grow up to be a lawyer

haha, that was great vor.

Masekle · Post by **Masekle** » January 17, 2003, 7:55 am

Cops get away with a lot of crap. Not saying all cops are not cool, but as a rule most, are either Bored and looking for someone to fuck with =you Some are Pissed at the old lady and looking for someone to take it out on=you. On the rag= watchout

Guess we could say cops are Humans with authority, the outcome of any encounter depends on your attitude=)

I have been called a smartass, but when a cop swoops on me, I signal and look for a safe place to pull over. He will either go on by or flip his lights. Keep a cheery cooperative facade, and its over in a few minutes, forgotten in a few more.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 17, 2003, 12:21 pm

Millie,

Entrapment is one of those legal ideas that has become almost impossible to use anymore. By that I mena you better be using an entrapment defense as a last resort.

Judges are slowly taking up the idea that the defendant makes a choice to commit an act, regardless of provocation. Entrapment can mitigate punishment, but I don't see too many folks walking out a winner on an entrapment defense anymore. This is from observation of our municipal and lower circuit court, so your mileage may vary.

I will say, if you want to stop this kind of behavior, forget the cop in the car. Make a call to the station. Talk to the shift sargeant. Be polite and explain you were having trouble with one of his officers driving in an unsafe manner. Wait a week and repeat the call. This time ask to speak to either the captain in charge of the traffic division or the chief of police if he is available. If neither will talk to you, call city hall and talk to your councilman. I've never known them to not take a phone call. Believe me, words from citizens such as "unsafe" grab admin staff attention in a big way.

If all else fails, write an op ed. Again, don't be belligerent. make yourself out to be the concerned citizen. Even if the police department in question is unresponsive, the city council or mayor will likely chew some ass.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » January 17, 2003, 1:40 pm

Hmm, cops are cops.

I have been pulled over roughly 8 times in the last 17 years. I was respectful and courteous to the guy in each case. As a result, I have 6 warnings, one ticket thrown out because their copy was altered and one speeding ticket (my one ticket was from a cop in Michigan and having Ohio plates that was a given the second he pulled me over). Of course I must admit that being in Class A unform saved my heinie for two of those warnings since they were immed. post Saudi.

My only truly bad experiences have been in Flint, Michigan. When I go there for a few days to visit family and friends, and being a night person stuck without net access, I tend to cruise. I almost ALWAYS pick up a tail. I have had county cops, city cops, state cops etc all play this game there. Last time I was there, it was midnight, I had a Flint cop pull out behind me, then start following me once, I took every back road and way from the far west side of the city to the far east side, and he was behind me the entire time. I pulled into a greasy spoon called Angelo's he parked next to me. I made a show of going thru a mapbook, then pulled out, he followed again.

So I drove my happy ass to the cop shop, parked, noted his plate and car number and walked in and talked to the guy at the desk.

He bumped me up to another guy, who bumped me to a third, they called the cop in and he said that I was behaving suspiously. I asked him exactly how I was, and he said that I had passed where he was parked 4 times in under an hour. I admitted to the crime, I went to Wendy's, got food at drivethru, realized after I got down the road a bit they had not given me fries, then went back, then headed home.

They apologized and I left.

But the thing is, if I had just pulled over and walked up to him, he could have killed me. All over picking up Wendy's. That is what is wrong with cops. When freedom to travel is summarily questioned, there is a rights violation occuring.

Millie · Post by **Millie** » January 17, 2003, 3:21 pm

Masekle wrote:Guess we could say cops are Humans with authority, the outcome of any encounter depends on your attitude=)

I have been called a smartass, but when a cop swoops on me, I signal and look for a safe place to pull over. He will either go on by or flip his lights. Keep a cheery cooperative facade, and its over in a few minutes, forgotten in a few more.

I'm guessing you've never dealt with the LAPD. Los Angeles cops are about as power-tripping and obnoxious as it gets. Most of them are would-be criminals that turned to policework as an alternative outlet for their thuggishness. Your attitude can be as respectful and straightforward as you want; it won't make the slightest difference.

If an LA cop pulls you over, you had better believe you're getting the full hassle: lecture, long wait, and fat ticket. And I'm white, so I'm getting off easy with just a ticket. God save you if you're a black man pulled over by the LAPD...

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 17, 2003, 3:29 pm

Trust me, other cops roll their eyes when someone mentions LAPD.

Worst example of police professionalism on the planet.

Millie · Post by **Millie** » January 17, 2003, 3:38 pm

Fallanthas wrote:Trust me, other cops roll their eyes when someone mentions LAPD.

Worst example of police professionalism on the planet.

Amen. I have nothing against cops in general, and I have the utmost respect for their profession. But the LAPD is a different story. When an LA cop gets shot on the beat, I don't shed a tear. It's just one more soul bound straight for Hell.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » January 17, 2003, 3:48 pm

Just as a note, hitting your brakes to cause someone to hit you from behind is not ALWAYS considered their fault. In fact I would highly recommend against doing that ESPECIALLY with it being a cop!

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 17, 2003, 4:08 pm

Technically, it is the responsibility of the driver to be in control of their vehicle at all times.

If you rear-end someone, chances are you are getting a ticket for C and I (Careless and Imprudent) for following too closely.

I wouldn't stake a lawsuit on it, though. I can guarantee it would get the officer in question a severe ass-chewing for aloowing his patrol until to be damaged and making the force look stupid doing it.

Unless it's in L.A., of course.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » January 17, 2003, 4:24 pm

I'm not referring to the ticket that would be issued to either driver, but to the "fault" in the accident. Depending on the state and the amount of damages, you could both basically be considered At Fault. If you are in California which is a "no fault" state...that just means no one person gets all the blame. You would both be charged for having an accident, for which some Insurance Companies charge the same number of points as if you had an At Fault accident in other states.

As for why not to hit the cop...well, they generally have a camera mounted in the car, and I believe some states no longer require the sirens/lights to be on to record.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » January 17, 2003, 5:35 pm

"No fault" insurance is the biggest scam of the century, it was supposed to lead to lower rates, what it led to was raising my insurance if some dumb sob runs into me.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 17, 2003, 5:35 pm

Hrmm, not familiar with "no fault" and it's consequences.

Around here, either there is no ticket issued (in the case of an environmental conditions accident), one driver is ticketed (in which case that driver is at fault) or both drivers are ticketed (in which case they can each be responsible for damages).

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » January 17, 2003, 5:49 pm

There are very few "no fault" states. The only reason I mention California is that it is the only on of those state I handle. btw, I work for an Auto Insurer handling approximately 20 states personally doing Underwriting. When I started handling California, I never understood why it would use that type of accident reporting. The main things I *could* come up with was that maybe it would lower the rate of fraud cases for the state. Also, accidents with very low claims payouts do not charge points (at least not with us). There is a threshold that I believe each company uses, but I only know what the company I work for has now. Having both drivers "equally at fault" would supposedly reduce the number of fraudulent claims also.

"Ok Bill, it's your turn to take the hit on this one so we can both buy new cars!"

I just love when someone calls in wanting to know if they would be considered at fault in a "hypothetical" accident, because there IS no firm answer to the questions. Basically it all comes down to the large amount of information gathered in researching the claim itself once it has happened.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » January 17, 2003, 6:33 pm

I got robbed in LA and my experience with the LAPD was that they were very professional and helpful. I don't blame for being uptight and cranky with all the fucking BS they have to deal with in that city.

Also the dude I talked to was fucking hot. That probably didn't hurt their case with me. Those dark blue and shiny LAPD uniforms are irresistable.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » January 17, 2003, 6:51 pm

kyoukan type-R wrote:I got robbed in LA and my experience with the LAPD was that they were very professional and helpful. I don't blame for being uptight and cranky with all the fucking BS they have to deal with in that city.

Also the dude I talked to was fucking hot. That probably didn't hurt their case with me. Those dark blue and shiny LAPD uniforms are irresistable.

If they read this board you'd still be locked away somewhere.

Millie · Post by **Millie** » January 17, 2003, 7:07 pm

kyoukan type-R wrote:I got robbed in LA and my experience with the LAPD was that they were very professional and helpful. I don't blame for being uptight and cranky with all the fucking BS they have to deal with in that city.

Also the dude I talked to was fucking hot. That probably didn't hurt their case with me. Those dark blue and shiny LAPD uniforms are irresistable.

You dealt with their Robbery division, which I'm sure runs quite a bit differently from Traffic. Either way, I'd say you got lucky. Most cops in LA are neither professional nor hot.

On a side note, driving in California (esp. in LA) is a pain in the ass. Insurance jacks you here, cops jack you here, and accidents will fuck up your record for years. Hell, insurance companies here consider a traffic ticket to be the equivalent of an accident on your record. So if you get as many as two tickets, you will have 2 "accidents" on your record, which won't be erased for 3 years each. It gets damned expensive over time, especially considering the rate at which traffic cops pull you over for no good reason.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » January 17, 2003, 7:10 pm

it was just a patrolman in a black and white.