Bush & Economy

Siji · Post by **Siji** » December 31, 2002, 9:07 pm

Ok.. I'm at a loss here and while I know people like to argue back and forth over this crap, I seriously have to ask why our president would make any type of statement like this:

"President Bush delivered a New Year's Eve warning on Tuesday that any attack on the United States by Iraq or a group working on its behalf could cripple the U.S. economy."

"An attack from Saddam Hussein or a surrogate of Saddam Hussein would cripple our economy," said Bush.

"Our economy is strong, it's resilient, we've got to continue to make it strong and resilient. This economy cannot afford to stand an attack," he said.

Why the hell would you say that? Why not just reword it and say, "Hey guys! We're really screwed up over here - please don't attack us or make us attack you, because we'd be seriously up shit's creek without a paddle or boat worse than ever before!" I mean, is this supposed to make the American public feel all warm and fuzzy about going to this war Bush is gunning for? Or is it some twisted and demented way to try to lure Iraq to attack us so Bush finally has a legit reason to go to war?

For fuck sake, someone shoot this asshole between the eyes.

PS: Don't know if it's been mentioned in another thread, but I heard today that for the first time in a very long time, not a single member of congress has a child in the military. No wonder they don't care about going to war.. what have they to lose?

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » December 31, 2002, 9:46 pm

Because he is trying to make it sound like Iraq is being aggresive and that an attack is imminent to scare Americans in supporting his pet war for his billionaire oil buddies.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · December 31, 2002, 10:14 pm

Question: What did one liberal retard say to the other liberal retard?

Give up?

Answer: Look above

Truant · Post by **Truant** » December 31, 2002, 10:22 pm

What amazes me still is his statement that our economy is strong and resilient.

He still won't admit our economy is sucking a giant cock right now. Everything is ok! Economy is doing fine! Keep it up folks, you're doing great.

Know anyone in the retail/service industry? Ask them how business was this year, including the holidays. Know anyone looking for a job? Ask them how much luck they're having. Ask around to see how many people had to blow some of their retirement this year, and how many people were laid off from major consistent corporations.

Economy strong and resilient...like a limp dick.

T

Innkubbus · Post by **Innkubbus** » December 31, 2002, 10:23 pm

What's worse is that there's a senator trying to re-instate the draft so if we do end up in this pointless war with Iraq, all of us 18-27 year old men will have to watch out...IF (big if) his bill passes. Someone really needs to assassinate Bush or I'm moving to Canada. Think about this song...

"A.D.D. (American Dream Denial)"

We fought your wars with all our hearts,
You sent us back in body parts,
You took our wills with the truth you stole,
We offer prayers for your long lost soul.

The remainder is,
An unjustifiable, egotistical, power struggle,
At the expense of the American Dream,
Of the American dream, of the American, of the American.

We don't give a damn about your world,
With all your global profits and all your jeweled pearls,
We don't give a damn about your world,
Right now, right now.

We don't give a fuck about your world,
With all your global profits, and all your jeweld pearls,
We don't give a fuck about your world,
Right now, right now.

There is no flag that is large enough,
To hide the shame of a man in cuffs,
You switched the signs then you closed our blinds,
You changed the channel then you changed our minds.

You bring about the stick,
We bring about the confusion,
Bring about the solution,
Bring about the fusion,
Bring about the collusion,
Bring about revolution,
Bring about revolution,
Bring it about.

We don't give a damn about your world,
With all your global profits and all your jeweled pearls,
We don't give a damn about your world,
Right now, right now.

We don't give a fuck about your world,
With all your global profits, and all your jeweld pearls,
We don't give a fuck about your world,
Right now, right now.

No flag large enoguh,
Shame on a man un cuffs,
You closed our blinds.

The remainder is,
An unjustifiable, egotistical, power struggle,
At the expense of the American Dream,
Of the American dream, of the American, of the American.

We don't give a damn about your world,
With all your global profits and all your jeweled pearls,
We don't give a damn about your world,
Right now, right now.

We don't give a fuck about your world,
With all your global profits, and all your jeweld pearls,
We don't give a fuck about your world,
Right now, right now, right now, right now, right now, right now, right now, pararara...

Akaran_D · Post by **Akaran_D** » December 31, 2002, 10:39 pm

That's actualy a democrat asking for that bill, FYI, if my memory serves correctly. According to CNN, when the story was ran, he said he was doing it to "give the other senators and congressmen somthing to think about when they consider sending chil;dren to iraq, if it's their own kids", more or less.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · December 31, 2002, 10:49 pm

Wishing for your President to be assassinated?

Please do leave the US. We will all be better off without you.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » December 31, 2002, 10:56 pm

Truant wrote:What amazes me still is his statement that our economy is strong and resilient.

Because fucking the economy by lowering taxes, increasing corporate welfare and doubling defense spending is what made his Dad into a one-termer.

Bush and his cabinet are probably hoping that they can fuck the economy and trick Americans into thinking that they didn't.

Sionistic · Post by **Sionistic** » December 31, 2002, 11:40 pm

Actually i think they are beefing up the defense because they are worried about china. Our "war on terror" catched china off guard. Our fighting in the east has made conflict with china trying to spread its influence. I wouldnt be surpised to hear news sone concerning america, china, and pakistan

Siji · Post by **Siji** » January 1, 2003, 12:01 am

Wishing for your President to be assassinated?
Please do leave the US. We will all be better off without you.

And while "you all" that are better without those of us that think Bush needs to go, immediately, are unemployed, unable to collect unemployment that actually pays for anything, and your stocks are worth less than the paper they're printed on, not to mention your no longer existant 401k program, and the social security money that's come up missing - we'll be snowboarding in Canada and learning French.

I suppose if you're not employed in a career type of job as opposed to McDonalds or Blockbuster, have no 401k and/or don't own stocks as just a few examples, you wouldn't have any idea why some people are wishing for Bush to be gone. But then again you might, when your parents have to move you to the projects, or worse.

I dread seeing the statistics of how many families are forced to claim bankruptcy in 2003. Or how much more employment will go up. Or how many companies will close. Or how much the suicide rate goes up. Or how close the US actually gets to another great depression.

Anuin · Post by **Anuin** » January 1, 2003, 4:11 am

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:Wishing for your President to be assassinated?

Please do leave the US. We will all be better off without you.

Watch the American Media machine go. It works on some people I suppose.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 1, 2003, 4:13 am

Hrmmm,

Holiday spending at the same levels as both a year and two years ago.

Housing starts at an all time high over the last three months.

Unemployment STILL lower than it was ten years ago, hovering right around a whopping six percent depending on what seasonal adjustments you make.

Yeah, obviously we're fucked.

Those of you who think that statement from Bush was FOR either you or Hussien, try and think about the rest of the world.

Every allied country ont he planet has their economic fortunes tied to ours. Can you think of a better scare tactic to get some of them off their asses than to threaten their wallets?

Penlog · Post by **Penlog** » January 1, 2003, 7:01 am

Well, if you've read any articles written by Mr. Bush you'd realize that he is very good at saying one thing, but doing another. For instance, an article in the New York times about a month ago was called "Securing Freedoms Triumph". All through the article it talks about peace, and the power of democracy, and so on and so forth. How peace is needed for us to prosper, then he talks about seizing the opportunity in going over and fighting terrorist. I mean damn George practice what you preach, you say we need peace yet we are flexin our muscles at Iraq to bring about peace? Oh well just some generalized thoughts I've had about this whole George W. Bush adminstration choices. I think the guy is a bum, he wouldnt know his @$$hole from a hole in the ground.

Latez
Penlog

Mak · Post by **Mak** » January 1, 2003, 7:52 am

Siji wrote:I dread seeing the statistics of how many families are forced to claim bankruptcy in 2003.

This wouldn't have anything to do with rampant over-spending due to readily available credit would it?

Debt in this country (and the resulting bankruptcies) has gone up every year for as long as I can remember, and it didn't have a damn thing to do with what party happened to be holding office at the time.

And I will say this everyone- at the height of my distaste for Bill Clinton I never once wished him dead. I'm not sure what to say about those of you that are wanting GW assassinated- maybe folks like Rush Limbaugh and Michael Savage are right about you.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · January 1, 2003, 11:43 am

Anuin wrote:
Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:Wishing for your President to be assassinated?

Please do leave the US. We will all be better off without you.
Watch the American Media machine go. It works on some people I suppose.

You asshole. It's called believing in America and what it stands for. Jesus didnt you learn anything in school? It's called respecting my history, my freedom, and the people who make it all possible everyday.

ZZtheAssassin · Post by **ZZtheAssassin** » January 1, 2003, 12:11 pm

Actually consider this.

We are a war driven economy and Bush knows this. This is his way of getting around the lack of support by trying to goad people into attacking us.

He just better hope his plan doesnt backfire.

Truant · Post by **Truant** » January 1, 2003, 2:57 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:It's called believing in America and what it stands for. Jesus didnt you learn anything in school? It's called respecting my history, my freedom, and the people who make it all possible everyday.

Just checking, but you are aware that you can do this and still disagree with some, or much, of what they do everyday, right?

Sometimes you act as if not, so I'm really just asking for my own curiosity.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » January 1, 2003, 3:42 pm

Expressing your desire that the President be assassinated is un-American, sorry.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » January 1, 2003, 4:55 pm

groan. Not ANOTHER thread on Bush hating. Move this thread to the *Canadian flames for Bush/USA* board please.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » January 1, 2003, 7:57 pm

Siji, promoting the violent overthrow of the government is illegal, and especially moronic in a society which allows you to change it peacefully.

Truant · Post by **Truant** » January 1, 2003, 8:23 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:Expressing your desire that the President be assassinated is un-American, sorry.

Way to NOT answer the question. That's not even an issue.

You weren't talking to the person that stated that desire either. WTF were you talking to? Yourself?

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » January 1, 2003, 8:58 pm

Truant wrote:Way to NOT answer the question. That's not even an issue.

You weren't talking to the person that stated that desire either. WTF were you talking to? Yourself?

Hey, Boris, go back to the USSR with your commie talk.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » January 1, 2003, 9:04 pm

Truant go back and read how the thread progressed. If you can't piece it's progression together, pick this up, it may help you.

Siji · Post by **Siji** » January 1, 2003, 10:04 pm

Expressing your desire that the President be assassinated is un-American, sorry

There are many things that "America" does that are "un-American".

promoting the violent overthrow of the government is illegal, and especially moronic in a society which allows you to change it peacefully.

Feel free to report me to the FBI, Secret Service, CIA and your local high school principal. I'm sure they'll be knocking on my door any day now looking for my sekrit plans of world domination.. If you really believe that John Q Public has any say so about the government these days, you've obviously been hibernating through several elections.

Forthe · Post by **Forthe** » January 1, 2003, 10:51 pm

Kylere wrote:Siji, promoting the violent overthrow of the government is illegal, and especially moronic in a society which allows you to change it peacefully.

You have the right to bear arms for exactly this purpose.

You must also be aware that this is a favorite excercise of the American government right?

The blue print for US foreign policy:
1) Find an evil guy that is in a position to help you and make friends.
2) Ignore the evil guys' evil doings. Block any attempts to invesigate said evil doings.
3) Give evil guy weapons, money and military\diplomatic support. You can even put him on the CIA payroll.
4) When evil guys either a) stops helping, b) is no longer of use, c) the media (or renegade justice department) reports his evil doings -> try to get evil guy to step away from power.
5) When #4 doesn't work (it never does) try to get his party\group to presure him to step down.
6) When #5 doesn't work (it never does) put in place illegal sanctions against evil guys' country. Hopefully when the people start starving to death they will violently overthrow the evil guy. At this point start the media blitz about how evil this evil guy is.
7) Evil guy is a bastard that won't go away. Make him public enemy #1. Try to assasinate him. American assasins must suck badly btw.

Send in operatives to start\support small guerilla\terrorist groups so they can violently overthrow the evil guy. They loose every time but the odds say it will work at least once eventually.
9) Invade evil guys' country, imprison or kill evil guy...kill a bunch of civilians while you are at it and fuck up their infrastructure.
10) Forget evil guy's country exists.
11) Find an evil guy that is in a position to help you and make friends.

Truant · Post by **Truant** » January 1, 2003, 11:27 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:Truant go back and read how the thread progressed. If you can't piece it's progression together, pick this up, it may help you.

Oh I KNOW who you were talking to, But thanks again for not answering the question directed solely at you.

You win today's award.

I'll go back to my communist hideout now.

Keverian FireCry · Post by **Keverian FireCry** » January 2, 2003, 12:33 am

If by being a good american you mean being an ignorant and selfish dumbfuck then you are doing a good job midnyte

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » January 2, 2003, 12:46 am

Keverian FireCry wrote:If by being a good american you mean being an ignorant and selfish dumbfuck then you are doing a good job midnyte

Hey, Fidel, go pound a cigar up your ass you fucking Marxist.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » January 2, 2003, 12:50 am

Just get rid of all the lefty treehuggers and I will be content.

OMG! That statement raised my taxes again! Fucking Hippies.

Millie · Post by **Millie** » January 2, 2003, 4:56 am

An assassination wouldn't be enough. I'm thinking about asking Jack Nicholson for permission to run a Code Red on George W. Bush.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » January 2, 2003, 5:04 am

Millie wrote:An assassination wouldn't be enough. I'm thinking about asking Jack Nicholson for permission to run a Code Red on George W. Bush.

Hey, Mao, go suck on a wonton you fucking people's republic of asshole.

Cotto · Post by **Cotto** » January 2, 2003, 7:59 am

Aaah the love and good will to all man-kind, shared upon the boards at this time of year.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » January 2, 2003, 10:18 am

Siji, I can tell by your attitude that you do not vote, therefore you do not count, and can shut the fuck up.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » January 2, 2003, 11:55 am

Fallanthas wrote:Hrmmm,

Holiday spending at the same levels as both a year and two years ago.

Housing starts at an all time high over the last three months.

Unemployment STILL lower than it was ten years ago, hovering right around a whopping six percent depending on what seasonal adjustments you make.

Housing starts are super high cause Mortgage rates are at a 40 year low and people dont want to put any money in the stock market. housing starts are also different than closing on home sales. what percentage of those are spec homes and what percent are ones buyers have purchased the lots and so on.

Some analysts that i've seen on TV are saying that they expect the housing bubble to pop/deflate in 2003. It is already a major buyers market as it is, these new housing starts only make that distinction more dramatic. new home sales prices going down on average will fuck people in their appraisals if they need equity lines and so on.

as for the holiday spending being the same, maybe it was, but all reports i heard were major retailers (federated, target, etc) saying they did worse than last year (which sucked).

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » January 2, 2003, 12:03 pm

It was the worst holiday spending in years. Where the fuck did you read it was anything above horrible?!?

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 2, 2003, 12:16 pm

Well, first I tossed the big three, then started paying attention to what malls and smaller retailers were saying.

Wal-Mart didn't get the holiday bucks. Boo fucking hoo.

Locally, our three decent-sized are malls are predicting they are up 3-4%.

Where the fuck did you get the idea it was bad?

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » January 2, 2003, 12:28 pm

Maybe people are finally trying to take some responsibility for their spending habits? Nah
The concept called budgeting, which has been so foreign these past few years, may finally try and be practiced again.
It's just a fucking joke. I'm pretty sure I earn more than most across this fine land and the wife is close behind me. Yet we have never come close to spending what others who earn less do. Why do I need a $55k car when our civics do the job just fine? Why do I need one of the $750k+ homes with 5,000+ sq ft when we only intend to have two children(god damn McMansions in Jersey are still popping up at a ridiculous rate)? Do I need a $15k home theater system when there's the possibility I'll need work to be done on the bathroom in the next year or two?
Sad part is, I can't even come up with enough examples where people piss their money away. What the fuck are people doing with it?

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 2, 2003, 12:32 pm

OM MY GAWD THE WORLD IS COMING TO AN END!

Holiday spending only increased a piddly 5.6% this year.

"Last year at this time, a lot of analysts and newspapers were saying it was going to be a terrible year and in the end, we saw a 5.6% increase over the previous year," said Tracy Mullin, National Retail Federation.

[/url]

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » January 2, 2003, 12:33 pm

Where the fuck did you get the idea it was bad?

Do a Google search and read, fucktard. The fact that you base your opinion on what you hear at your local mall is not surprising in the least. You need to admit you are way off base on this one and stfu.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » January 2, 2003, 12:37 pm

Maybe when people realize that businesses don't have to increase earnings by double digits each year to be successful, they won't have the panic attitude.
I for one love the fact that the market took a spill. I can buy more with less now and the stupid 20-something idiot day traders got scared off and, hopefully, will stabilize the market over the long term.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 2, 2003, 12:47 pm

See post above, Fair.

GOOD GAWD WE DIDN'T GET DOUBLE DIGIT SPENDING INCREASES THIS YEAR. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » January 2, 2003, 1:10 pm

Fallanthas wrote:OM MY GAWD THE WORLD IS COMING TO AN END!

Holiday spending only increased a piddly 5.6% this year.

"Last year at this time, a lot of analysts and newspapers were saying it was going to be a terrible year and in the end, we saw a 5.6% increase over the previous year," said Tracy Mullin, National Retail Federation.

[/url]

http://onlineretailing.about.com/librar ... ding02.htm

There are the actuals, retard. -10.9%

Once again, you are wrong.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » January 2, 2003, 1:21 pm

Fair, read that page again. Very first paragraph.

Retail spending up 1% in December over last year.

Up 5% for the year.

Cmon, it's not that hard.

Kguku · Post by **Kguku** » January 2, 2003, 1:25 pm

Fairweather Pure wrote: There are the actuals, retard. -10.9%

Once again, you are wrong.

That was you adding the "National Retail Sales Estimate"

Those are estimates, not actuals.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » January 2, 2003, 1:42 pm

Fair, you just don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Where the hell did you get -10.9%? You can't just add up percentages and expect to come up with the number. Based solely off of that table, holiday period retail sales decilned -1.03% year over year. No, I'm not going to explain to you how the number is obtained.
In addition, every accounting firm listed in that link estimates year over year gains.
Please, you just made yourself look ridiculous with that link. Don't assume you know more about the economy than a few of the posters here, including myself. I didn't even bother to respond to Siji's or Traunt's takes on it because it would be worthless. I certainly wasn't going to waste my time mocking Innkubbus' foolish lyric post whom I'm sure was written by an economic professional.
Please, just stop

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » January 2, 2003, 1:52 pm

a NY Times article wrote:"It's pretty clear that we've had a lackluster retail season," said Charles L. Hill, director of research for Thomson First Call, which compiles and distributes investment research. "Things got a little worse each week."

When all is said and done on the holiday shopping season of 2002, he said, "You'd probably have to go back a long ways to find something this low."

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » January 2, 2003, 1:55 pm

Give anyone free reign to web access, you can find any number of links providing opinions one way or another.
In addition, that provides absolutely no explanation as to why it may have happened aside from the redundant blurb of "concerned about the effects of a weak economy, rising unemployment and war jitters".
Where are the unemployment numbers? What criteria do they use for unemployment percentages(there are no less than 20 ways to report it as an fyi)? Why is there no mention of the self inflicted credit crisis?

miir · Post by **miir** » January 2, 2003, 2:07 pm

I SAW IT ON TEH INTARNET SO IT MUST BE TRUE!!!!

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » January 2, 2003, 2:08 pm

Voronwë wrote:
a NY Times article wrote:"It's pretty clear that we've had a lackluster retail season," said Charles L. Hill, director of research for Thomson First Call, which compiles and distributes investment research. "Things got a little worse each week."

When all is said and done on the holiday shopping season of 2002, he said, "You'd probably have to go back a long ways to find something this low."

A person thought he would give a fact-less opinion in order to make dim-witted people buy into it and sway a few more people to vote Democratic in the next election.

What a shocker.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » January 2, 2003, 2:10 pm

look i understand what you are saying that the overall trend in credit card spending in the US over the past 10-20 years had contributed to a false elevation of the economic condition with respect to how much people can really afford to spend.

i'm not sure why retailers would report that their sales suck (which they have been doing) since it hurts their stock price, and modern american companies tend to bend over backwards to elevate stock prices. so i think that sales are in fact not good. whether that is an overall indictment of the economy is a different matter of course, and certainly up for debate.

VeeshanVault

Bush & Economy

Bush & Economy

Reminds me