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Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » March 29, 2005, 5:00 pm

ok i have to do a problem anaylist paper for english and im doing child abuse but anyways ....

one of the ways one of the kids were killed was the father injected freon gas into the kids bathtub water ... what would that do? kinda puzzled me

Morgrym · Post by **Morgrym** » March 29, 2005, 5:10 pm

Just theories, I suck at chemestry:

I imagine it would rapidly drop his core temperature causing systemic shut down and stroke.

Either that or the vapors from it being mixed with the water caused an environment that he could not breath in, thus suffocating.

Both scenerios would give a pretty viable accident excuse if pulled off properly.

Traz-KOE · Post by **Traz-KOE** » March 29, 2005, 5:54 pm

Well...

CFC-12 (Freon) is highly unreactive. It will not hydrolyze (or even dissolve, save for a negligible amount) in water, so I'm not sure what (if any) kinds of reactions might occur by that process. However, I do know that freon vapors are somewhat toxic, and in sufficient quantity can cause asphixiation. As for lowering the temperatire of the water; I'm not sure if that is realistic. There are reports of Freon causing forstbite when applied as a liquid spray (which then readily evaporates, producing the characteristic rapid cooling), but aerating bathwater with it would likely cause little or no effect; the Freon is already in gasseous form, so it will have little cooling capacity if any.

Some (maybe) useful links:

http://www.scorecard.org/chemical-profi ... id=75-71-8

http://msds.ehs.cornell.edu/msds/msdsdod/a92/m45912.htm

Sirensa · Post by **Sirensa** » March 29, 2005, 5:57 pm

Drasta wrote:one of the ways one of the kids were killed was the father injected freon gas into the kids bathtub water ... what would that do? kinda puzzled me

Is that a real situation or a hypothetical?

Taequanleep · Post by **Taequanleep** » March 29, 2005, 6:01 pm

Certain forms of freon are also known as Halon. This is an oxygen displacer in atmoshperes and is used for fire suppression systems.

I have never heard of that story, but if true, the purpose would be to cause asphyxiation from lack of oxygen in the room. It's not something that would be discreet since it would have the effect of turning the tub into a jacuzzi.

Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » March 29, 2005, 6:33 pm

Victim: Jeremy Bunting, 4 years

Died: Nov. 6, 1999

How died: Undetermined

Accused: Michael J. Bunting, father

Evidence: Father injected Freon -- a gaseous refrigerant -- in boy's bathtub water

Charge: Murder

Outcome: Pleaded guilty to child-abuse homicide, a second-degree felony; 3rd District Judge Timothy Hansen ordered 1-15 years in prison.

thats the thingie that i got it from there is an entire list of them

Nilaman · Post by **Nilaman** » March 29, 2005, 7:13 pm

Is that the same stuff as what can be found inside cans of Dust Off and other computer cleaning canned air products?

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » March 29, 2005, 7:19 pm

that dust off stuff is cold because the gas is pressurized.

sarlen · Post by **sarlen** » March 29, 2005, 7:42 pm

A possible side effect of heating Freon is the creation of phosgene gas. It can be absorbed into the skin or breathing the gas will quickly suffocate you. Mind you this, to my knowledge, can only happen at extreme high temperatures like when a compressor in an air conditioner over heats and burns up. Not sure how bath water could be hot enough to do it..

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