Bye scumbag

Midnyte_Ragebringer · November 4, 2004, 1:49 pm

Arafat is a goner.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » November 4, 2004, 1:49 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:Arafat is a goner.

Hospital spokesman denies Arafat is dead.

but i think if he isnt yet, he will be soon.

BBC, CNNI, CBS, reporting same thing (but probably all got it from Reuters).

Akaran_D · Post by **Akaran_D** » November 4, 2004, 1:49 pm

To clarify, it's being reported he's in a coma.
I hae a strong feeling that the Isreali / Palestine border is going to erupt in fireworks that will put the Shock and Awe back into the Middle East.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » November 4, 2004, 1:56 pm

"The situation with Yassar Arafat is now more complicated....He is not dead"

cant give link, Fionnuala Sweeney reporting on CNNI at the hospital. Reporters had speculated he was in a coma as much as 8 hrs ago. But no word from the doctors on his condition.

4 people in the hospital directly linked to him in the hospital. Wife, Chief of Staff, Palestinian Envoy to Paris, and Ambassador to the UN. The leaks come from Palestine where those 4 people have been talking to persons on the phone, etc.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » November 4, 2004, 1:58 pm

Midnyte, tell me what you know about Arafat. If anything.

Jice Virago · Post by **Jice Virago** » November 4, 2004, 2:01 pm

He knows he is a towel head and therefore a terrorist!

Midnyte_Ragebringer · November 4, 2004, 2:09 pm

I know he has been a major roadblock in a peaceful exsistance between Israel and Palistine. I know that the guy who is supposed to take his place, whom Arafat fired, is one whom Israel is willing to work with. I know I can't wait till he is gone, because I look forward to those people having the possibility of a peaceful future.

Not the answer you expected huh?

Nick · Post by **Nick** » November 4, 2004, 2:12 pm

Exactly the answer I expected dickforbrains.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » November 4, 2004, 2:13 pm

Didn't Israel agree to move their people out of the West Bank and parts of the Gaza? Looks to me like Israel and Palestine might actually be on the road to peace already.

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » November 4, 2004, 2:14 pm

I don't think theres going to be peace for them as long as isreal exists.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » November 4, 2004, 2:16 pm

what was wrong w/ Mid's answer? hehe

Masteen, yeah they voted to approve the move, but there have been no substantial moves, and there have to be more votes.

also some ISraeli settlers have threatened to assasssinate Sharon like they did his predecessor for making this move.

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » November 4, 2004, 2:17 pm

In recent years he's been less fairly useless and probably concentrated too much on maintaining his position.
It's hardly fair to call him a scumbag though. He was ignored for years when he was prepared to negotiate and by the time Israel's stance softened enough to allow any talks hardline islamic zealots had taken over at grassroots level. By the time they talked to him it was too late and with the best will in the world there has been nothing he could do for the last 5+ years. The leaders of Hamas and the like decide on how the Palestinian side of the conflict is waged. Arafat has been pretty irrelevant. A position not helped by the systematic destruction of his means of political control in the early years of the Sharon regime.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » November 4, 2004, 2:28 pm

I assume your playing Devils advocado here Voro.

Here is why he is wrong.

Arafat is not the cause of the Palestine/Isreal conflict, if you think this is the case, I am afraid you have been sadly misinformed.
Therefore, your entire reason for wishing he is dead is based on a falsehood.

Also, if you are gullible enough to think that Palestine are the ones responsible for this whole fiasco, you may re read (or read for the first time) anything that may tell you the facts of the situation.

Wide spread human rights violations on Palestine equals Arafat is a bastard, great logic Midnyte

Not that they are entirely innocent, but Midnyte's hatred of Arafat clearly stems from ignorance rather than knowledge.

A common situation.

Rivera Bladestrike · Post by **Rivera Bladestrike** » November 4, 2004, 2:32 pm

Israel, Palestine and their neighboring countries are so fucked up, I wish we'd pull all support out of Israel and let em do it themselves. Sure if they nuke each other then its one less country for us to care about!

Avestan · Post by **Avestan** » November 4, 2004, 4:23 pm

while I am not happy anyone is dead, Arafat has been a scourge on the Middle East peace process for far too long.

By turning down what was an excellent offer by the Israelis to create a palastinian state, he threw the area into another decade of strife.

In cannot be realistically argues that he does not have close ties to many terrorist groups that use suicide bombing as a way of life. He has also approved financial awards to these groups and their members.

He blocked all efforts to empower another individual with whom the Israelis would actually work with due to his own ego. . .finally annointing his brother in law. . .cmon. . .really.

It has been clear to me that Arafat has not been interested in peace in a long time and while I will do not rejoice in his death (or near death). I do believe that he has been a long time roadblock to securing the middle east and creating a lasting peace.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » November 4, 2004, 4:26 pm

While I do believe Arafat has changed a lot to deny the fact that at one time he was a terrorist is well dumb.

Wulfran · Post by **Wulfran** » November 4, 2004, 4:31 pm

Be careful: a lot of the negatives you Arafat detractors like to throw around apply equally if not more so to Sharon...

Personally, I'm not big on hoping for anyone's death, but I hope that with his (and hopefully one day soon Sharon's) that some of the "personal hatred" will be avoided and make the peace process a little easier. But I tend to be more of an optimist...

noel · Post by **noel** » November 4, 2004, 4:40 pm

Arafat was a man of compromise. I have no doubt he had to compromise a lot of things to hold his position. Without him holding that position, things could have been better, or they could have been worse.

I know that the Peace agreement that Clinton and Rabin (I think it was Rabin) had penned with him had almost all of what the Palestinians wanted, but still he left it on the table. I think that says a lot.

It's unfortunate that every middle-Eastern leader who works for peace in the middle-East ends up assassinated by his own people.

Neost · Post by **Neost** » November 4, 2004, 5:05 pm

I know he has been a major roadblock in a peaceful exsistance between Israel and Palistine.

How does the above statement equate to:

Arafat is not the cause of the Palestine/Isreal conflict

Rekaar. · Post by **Rekaar.** » November 4, 2004, 5:16 pm

Of course he's not the cause of the confilct, being a roadblock to resolving it makes you the cause of the roadblock. Teeny's liberal semantics at it again!

Neost · Post by **Neost** » November 4, 2004, 5:21 pm

So midnyte's contention that arafat has been a roadblock can be translated as midnyte saying he is the cause of the Palestine/Israeli conflict?

That's what it looks like it says to me, but I'm just an ignorant redneck motherfucker since I supported the Republican party in this year's election what the fuck would I know?

Midnyte_Ragebringer · November 4, 2004, 5:48 pm

Neost wrote:So midnyte's contention that arafat has been a roadblock can be translated as midnyte saying he is the cause of the Palestine/Israeli conflict?

That's what it looks like it says to me, but I'm just an ignorant redneck motherfucker since I supported the Republican party in this year's election what the fuck would I know?

That's why I have flip flopped on my position about never adding someone to my ignore list. I always thought I was better than that, but then Teeny began puking up this nonsense all over me. /shrug

Xzion · Post by **Xzion** » November 4, 2004, 5:53 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:I know he has been a major roadblock in a peaceful exsistance between Israel and Palistine. I know that the guy who is supposed to take his place, whom Arafat fired, is one whom Israel is willing to work with. I know I can't wait till he is gone, because I look forward to those people having the possibility of a peaceful future.

Not the answer you expected huh?

Sharon, who once was a terrorist is almost 2x as bad as arafat. Both of them need to die/be assassinated or just concede if you want relative peace in that region....that and we need to impeach or find some other way to get rid of dubyah...

Midnyte_Ragebringer · November 4, 2004, 5:59 pm

Xzion wrote:
Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:I know he has been a major roadblock in a peaceful exsistance between Israel and Palistine. I know that the guy who is supposed to take his place, whom Arafat fired, is one whom Israel is willing to work with. I know I can't wait till he is gone, because I look forward to those people having the possibility of a peaceful future.

Not the answer you expected huh?
Sharon, who once was a terrorist is almost 2x as bad as arafat. Both of them need to die/be assassinated or just concede if you want relative peace in that region....that and we need to impeach or find some other way to get rid of dubyah...

I agree that both Israel and Palistine are to blame. I'm not really familiar with Sharon. But, hopefully with new leadership in Palistine things can work out between the two and they will give Palistine their own state and they stop killing eachother.

Apostate · Post by **Apostate** » November 4, 2004, 7:40 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote: I agree that both Israel and Palistine are to blame. I'm not really familiar with Sharon. But, hopefully with new leadership in Palistine things can work out between the two and they will give Palistine their own state and they stop killing eachother.

Really doubt it. Sharon's government took a pretty hardline stance with Palenstine (see putting Arafat under house arrest and so on), and Arafat was essentially a moderate who was having trouble controlling more radical elements in Hamas and so on. Even things like incredibly basic concessions (like Arafat recognizing Israel's right to exist) are pretty moderate compared to a lot of mideast feelings. I think in the short run will probably see much more extremism and an escalation in violence rather than any kind of gains in the peace process. I hope I'm wrong, but I think things will get worse before they get better.

It's not like he suddenly started becoming obstructionist since the Oslo Accords at random. More radical groups gained much more widespread support, and coming down on them would alienate moderate Palenstinans who sympathized with them in the face of increasingly hostile Israeli reactions. I doubt things would see real improvements without concessions from Tel Aviv, which won't happen with a Sharon government I think, especially not with republican support in the states. Even if a moderate like Mahmoud Abbas takes charge, chances are he'll never be able to accept Israeli annexing any of the West Bank, and probably have to at first appear much tougher than Arafat was to not discredit himself in arab eyes. Unforunately, leaders that appear moderate and give concessions at the bargaining table in the Mideast have a habit of being assassinated.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » November 4, 2004, 9:10 pm

Arafat has done bad things. Sharon has done equally bad thing (worse imho, but that is a different story). And I'd dare say that in the recent years Sharon has been more of a roadblock than Arafat due to how holed up Arafat has been.

Fredonia Coldheart · November 4, 2004, 10:51 pm

If you think Arafat is a monster - just do a google for Qibya, Sabra, or Chatila and you will find one of the main reasons there will be no peace as long as Sharon is in power:

http://www.geocities.com/indictsharon/bio.html

Israeli historian Avi Shlaim wrote this about the massacre: "Sharon's order was to penetrate Qibya, blow up houses and inflict heavy casualties on its inhabitants. His success in carrying out the order surpassed all expectations. The full and macabre story of what happened at Qibya was revealed only during the morning after the attack. The village had been reduced to rubble: forty-five houses had been blown up, and sixty-nine civilians, two thirds of them women and children, had been killed. Sharon and his men claimed that they believed that all the inhabitants had run away and that they had no idea that anyone was hiding inside the houses" (The Iron Wall: Israel and the Arab World since 1948, New York: W. W. Norton & Company, 1999, page 91).

The UN observer who inspected the scene, Major General Vagn Bennike, chief of staff of the U.N. Truce Supervision Organization reached a different conclusion: "One story was repeated time after time: the bullet splintered door, the body sprawled across the threshold, indicating that the inhabitants had been forced by heavy fire to stay inside until their homes were blown up over them. Benziman Uzi writes that "the check for civilians had been superficial: a soldier entered a building, shout and called out. If no one answered, it was assumed that the building was empty. The soldiers and officers claimed that it would have been impossible to check the buildings thoroughly if they were to complete their mission and return before dawn" (Benziman Uzi, Sharon: an Israeli Caesar, 1985, page 53).

http://johnw.host.sk/articles/israel_cr ... record.htm

15-18th September 1982 The principle war criminal bearing responsibility for the massacres of Sabra and Chatila refugee camps in Lebanon is Ariel Sharon. Sharon with Rafeel Eitan sent the Lebanese Christian Phalangist into the two camps with orders to wipe out the Palestinian refugees. While the Phalangist were committing the massacres, the Israeli forces sealed off the camps to prevent Palestinians from escaping. More than 2, 750 innocent Palestinian women, children and men were murdered. On Sept 19th 1982 the UN passed a resolution 521 stating, " Horrified by the massacres of Palestinian civilians in Beirut" and later on Dec 16th qualifying the Sabra and Chatila massacre as "GENOCIDE". Israeli's own investigative body, the Kahan Commission found Sharon responsible for the massacres and further recommended Sharon be removed from Public Office.

These are just a few of the many horrors that Sharon has done ...

Dregor Thule · Post by **Dregor Thule** » November 4, 2004, 11:09 pm

When Apostate finds it within himself to post on a subject here, you motherfuckers better listen! He's one smart cookie, even for a wonder twin.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » November 4, 2004, 11:20 pm

Arafat lead the PLO and while he led it they were responsible for the deaths of over 10k civilians.

He is a scumbag, pure and simple, don't try to rewrite history, the man intentionally ordered attacks on civilians because it was better covered by the press than attacks on military targets

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » November 4, 2004, 11:33 pm

So did Sharon. Don't see you or your buttbuddies screaming at him.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » November 5, 2004, 3:15 am

I think the Israeli government is a terrorist state, but that does not make Arafat anything other than a murderer.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » November 5, 2004, 5:29 am

Kylere wrote:Arafat lead the PLO and while he led it they were responsible for the deaths of over 10k civilians.

He is a scumbag, pure and simple, don't try to rewrite history, the man intentionally ordered attacks on civilians because it was better covered by the press than attacks on military targets

Seriously, get off the fucking high horse about attacking civilian targets. It's been practiced in every major conflict, by both sides. Arafat's 10K doesn't even rate a mention against the US civilian kill rate.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » November 5, 2004, 5:58 am

Wow, just when you think people can't get any more retarded.

Hesten · Post by **Hesten** » November 5, 2004, 6:38 am

Kylere wrote:I think the Israeli government is a terrorist state, but that does not make Arafat anything other than a murderer.

And the US support Israel, right?
Lets see, that makes the US a sponsor for terrorists, according to your own words. Does that mean youre gonna start a war on yourself, or should the international community start to put up blockades for US trade?

Nick · Post by **Nick** » November 5, 2004, 6:43 am

Oh my god Hesten you pussy liberal dont you realise that all animals are equal but some are more equal than others?!!exclamationmark1

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » November 5, 2004, 8:10 am

No, dumbass. Might makes right. Duh.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » November 5, 2004, 11:50 am

He's on life support (supposedly), and they are basically trying to work out where he will be buried (Egypt, Gaza, Jeruselum, wherever) and some succession issues before they make the announcement.

Akaran_D · Post by **Akaran_D** » November 5, 2004, 11:55 am

That's sad. You have to wait to find where you can be buried before they let you die.. that's almost barbaric. I feel a little sorry for him.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » November 5, 2004, 12:05 pm

he wants to be buried in Jeruselem, and Israel doesnt want that to happen.

which is disgusting.

Xzion · Post by **Xzion** » November 5, 2004, 12:06 pm

What kind of a fucking asshole is Sharon to not allow a dying man to be buried where he would want to be. That fucking idiot wants anything but peace in the region, Sharon is even more of a war monger then Bush...he honestly needs to be shot

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » November 5, 2004, 12:16 pm

well it has a lot more meaning in that context than something like that would in our culture.

The symbolism is perhaps that for the ultra-militant Palestinians, they view Jeresulem as the capital of Palestine, and to bury him there only strengthens this symbolism, and basically all you need to know about Israel (in my opinion), is the very last stand of that army will be in the city of Jeruselem. There is no way they will ceed that ever.

i wish the US had been engaged in the Arab Israeli conflict for the past few years, because it would be good if there was some impartial moderation here.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » November 5, 2004, 12:18 pm

yes because the Bush administration is so impartial.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » November 5, 2004, 8:12 pm

1. Anyone who does not understand the difference between making war on civilians and civilians who die unintentionally is a complete and utter fucking moron.

2. We should not be backing Israel, they made their bed, and I personally think we should let them deal with it. When you escape Nazi's and in 2 generations start building walls and camps I have no sympathy for you.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » November 5, 2004, 9:00 pm

Kylere wrote:1. Anyone who does not understand the difference between making war on civilians and civilians who die unintentionally is a complete and utter fucking moron.

And if you think 250K Japanese that died in Hiroshima and Nagasaki were unintentional, you are that moron.

If you think fire bombing Dresden was not making war on civilians, you are that moron.

The list goes on, but to win a war you have to defeat your opponent's will to fight. Hence attacking civilian targets. Unfortunately neither the terrorists or the US seem to have any fucking clue how to take the fight out of each other, so it looks set to continue for decades.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » November 5, 2004, 9:52 pm

Zealath, first have your mom stop calling me.

Now, buy a clue, first use of unrestricted warfare in the 1900's against civilians were the Japanese and the Germans, and both the examples you gave were strikes following them.

You can defend a terrorist all you want, being as you are too ignorant to understand anything dealing with reality only goes to ensure you will be stuck in the disbelieving rut the rest of your life.

Lynks · Post by **Lynks** » November 5, 2004, 9:55 pm

Ya Zae, attacking civiallians is only permitted by the US.

VeeshanVault

Bye scumbag

Bye scumbag

Re: Bye scumbag