"We will not rest -- we will not rest, we will keep the pressure on until the Cuban people enjoy the same freedoms in Havana they receive here in America," Bush said to cries of "Viva Bush!"
Then, in a direct reference to Castro, Bush said, "I strongly believe the people of Cuba should be free from the tyrant."
Lets see, were talking freedom, tyrants, and people should be free. Guess Fidel are now being targetted as Saddam 2.0.
Last edited by Hesten on November 2, 2004, 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Terrorism is the war of the poor, and war is the terrorism of the rich"
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
It isn't a WMD issue. It's a "step on the cockroach that's busy throwing its droppings at our country" issue.
Dispose of Castro, clean up, make Cuba the next state in the union and be done with it already. Should have taken him out as a warmup to Iraq, imo.
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
Akaran you should really limit your posts to the occasional retelling of your own cock & ball torture stories. When you try to wade into any other topic, you just make yourself look like a bigger jack off than most of the community already believed you to be.
"When I was a kid, my father told me, 'Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it.'" - Russel Ziskey
/shrug
Sorry Xag. Cuba is an insignificant stain that sits right next to us. Don't forget I'm pro american imperalism and would have 0 problem with cleaning up the areas directly next to us regardless of any sort of gain for the American public. Castro isn't on the same level as Saddam in any way you want to look at it, but he is a viable target for a cleanup opperation. We have so many refugees trying to GET to America, why not bring America to Them?
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
Akaran_D wrote:It isn't a WMD issue. It's a "step on the cockroach that's busy throwing its droppings at our country" issue.
Dispose of Castro, clean up, make Cuba the next state in the union and be done with it already. Should have taken him out as a warmup to Iraq, imo.
I really hope you're joking Akaran.
If you're not, why the fuck not invade Mexico, Canada and all of Central and South America? After all, they are all just 'insignificant stains' on Empire America's quest for world domination.
Castro isn't on the same level as Saddam in any way you want to look at it, but he is a viable target for a cleanup opperation.
Get rid of the economic sanctions and maybe the country will clean up itself. I have no idea why the US still has sanctions on Cuba when the rest of the world lifted them ages ago.
I've got 99 problems and I'm not dealing with any of them - Lay-Z
But..but.... I thought Embargos and Sactions and economic pressures were the way to bring about change of an unfriendly dictatorship. Isnt that what you all wanted to do in Iraq? Let the UN Sanctions have more time!! Economic pressures will bring about the desired change in Iraq!
I thought Sanctions and Embargos were good! They are the way to go!! Non violent means!!!
I guess that doesnt hold true in Cuba. Again, the evil United States has brought about the demise of another country.
I am in no way in favor of military action against Cuba. We've waited this long...its only a matter of a couple years before Castro finds himself 6 feet under.
Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
Akaran_D wrote:Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
The fact that there are Americans like yourself that believe your country is just and right in invading, occupying and annexing sovereign nations is really quite scary.
Do you not understand the concept of a 'global community' or do you just see every other nation as a potential 'state' of your Empire? Didn't Hitler have the same sort of ideals and ambitions?
I've got 99 problems and I'm not dealing with any of them - Lay-Z
Akaran_D wrote:Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
Akaran, you're a good guy and I like you, but please step back a bit, and try to look at what you posted from a big picture perspective.
I understand the concept. However, I don't particulary want to share my community with dictators, mass murderers, and civil rights abusers. I also think that as long as the rest of the 'community' is unwilling to stop our actions, then you are, in essence, agreeing with them in silence.
Lack of action to stop it = support for it.
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
Akaran_D wrote:Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
Akaran, you're a good guy and I like you, but please step back a bit, and try to look at what you posted from a big picture perspective.
Looking at attacking the drug cartels on their homeland, is big picture.
I gotta agree with Mid here.
Listen, here's the point I'm trying to get to.
Cuba, by and large, is not very critical to world events. Cuban citizens are under controll of a dicator who has caused problems in the past that warranted a hardline series of embargoes and the like for a very long time. Those embargoes are not working, Cuba is still under the controll of a facist dicator. Cuban refugees are trying to escape FROM Cuba to our soil so they can be granted citizenship and find such important things as food.
Placing Cuba under our direct controll would eliminate the embargo and the problems facing the cuban republic under it. It would also, as Mid stated, do wonders to help us controll the drug trade comming out from its borders to our soil. (Yes, we haven't mastered the drug trade HERE, either, but shutting down a pipline at a critical juncture CANNOT hurt).
See where i'm comming from now?
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
Homercles wrote:
But..but.... I thought Embargos and Sactions and economic pressures were the way to bring about change of an unfriendly dictatorship. Isnt that what you all wanted to do in Iraq? Let the UN Sanctions have more time!! Economic pressures will bring about the desired change in Iraq!
Don't you think it's about time to start negotiations to make them not so unfriendly so we can lift the sanctions? I mean we've had them for almost 50 years!
Castro will be dead soon. There is no worry about him. I'd not want to invade any other country. I'd rather play tactical turtle and protect our assets at home. Even if that meant building a wall along our southern border.
Akaran_D wrote:Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
Akaran, you're a good guy and I like you, but please step back a bit, and try to look at what you posted from a big picture perspective.
Looking at attacking the drug cartels on their homeland, is big picture.
Supply and Demand
I digress. I am sure that we will enjoy the same success in the War on Terror and the War on Drugs; there is nothing like going to war against inanimate objects and ideas. Can we have a War on Circles next please?
If they don't want america brought to them, why are they comming to us?
edit: Hesten, this isn't a Bush question or a God question. I'd support it if Kerry was for it just the same.
Akaran of Mistmoore, formerly Akaran of Veeshan I know I'm good at what I do, but I know I'm not the best.
But I guess that on the other hand, I could be like the rest.
I thought Sanctions and Embargos were good! They are the way to go!! Non violent means!!!
I guess that doesnt hold true in Cuba. Again, the evil United States has brought about the demise of another country.
Besides the US, can you name another country that is currently holding economic sanctions against Cuba?
I know of none, and that leaves how many hundreds of other countries able to contribute to Cuba's GNP? Are you saying that a country without any sort of US economic interaction is incapable of lifting itself out of the shithole it's in? Are you arguing that US money is a requirement for economic success?
Makora
Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
Akaran_D wrote:Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
You've been playing WAY too much Risk! lately. Put the armies and the cards downand step away from the fucking board
Akaran_D wrote:Not joking. Mexico would be costly right now, given its size, and south america is too unrealistic (but it'd be nice to see what sort of damage a full scale invasion would do to the drug trade).
Cuba is a relatively small problem and there would be a really ugly uproar here if we decided to lift sanctions on them from the people around here that were still alive when it first became an issue. It would be easier just to go in, set up shop, and bring America to them, straightforward and cut and dried.
Akaran, you're a good guy and I like you, but please step back a bit, and try to look at what you posted from a big picture perspective.
Looking at attacking the drug cartels on their homeland, is big picture.
Sorry but once again, the USA isn't the big bad cop and this isn't the movies where we wade into a sovereign country and blast the bad guys in the name of FREEDOM and JUSTICE FOR ALL!!1
The moral code of the USA is not necessarily the moral code of the rest of the world and it is not our responsibility to enforce that. The New World Order does not exist (overtly at least).
Cracc wrote:Actually Mak, yes. Getting embargoed by the worlds only remaning superpower equals economic death more or less.
Unless you export oil instead of tobacco products... and the French, Germans, and Russians all have their tongue down the back of your national pants- then you'd be pretty well off.
If the rest of the world cared a whit for Cuba it'd be fine too.
Embargo/don't embargo... Yankee Go Home/Yankee Stay and Help Us... make up your minds, please.
Makora
Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
I have very few issues with that, Cracc. I wonder how much easier it would be to fund Social Security if we weren't feeding and clothing and providing medicine to the vast majority of the 3rd world. Glad we could agree.
Makora
Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
you should look up the amount we spend in foreign aid and compare it to our annual budget, and specifically the costs of social security. I have a hard time believing they are even in the same ballpark.
And so does my country, and probably to a greater extent versus the amount of people living here and the state of our economics, the only diffrence is that my country hasnt been at war for over 300+ years, we havent invaded, and we havent been invaded, how about yours?
Oh, don't get me wrong- I'm not saying it's the foreign aid budget equals the SS shortfall. I'm sure most Americans over-estimate the actual dollar amount spent in foreign aid- but many folks think any amount spent is too much considering the negativity the US receives in spite of it.
Makora
Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
Castro has proven time and time again that he doesn't give a shit about the people of Cuba. There are 13 year old prostitutes all over Havana Airport selling their asses to keep their families from starving. There are farmers harvesting tobacco and sugarcane on empty stomachs because not enough land is set aside for food.
The difference between Cuba and some of the African countries is that Cuba is 90 miles away, not 9000. This country was as developed as America not 50 years ago, and now they starve. Their starving not because of drought or war, they are starving because their leader is too stupid to actually RUN a country, and too proud to step aside.
How can anyone say it would be wrong to oust this fucker?
"There is at least as much need to curb the cruel greed and arrogance of part of the world of capital, to curb the cruel greed and violence of part of the world of labor, as to check a cruel and unhealthy militarism in international relationships." -Theodore Roosevelt
Voronwë wrote:you should look up the amount we spend in foreign aid and compare it to our annual budget, and specifically the costs of social security. I have a hard time believing they are even in the same ballpark.
Would you like that to include sponsored loans, and breaks on loan repayments? Would you like that to include the cost of aid workers, military spending, and peace keeping operations? I have no doubt that the direct foreign aid does not compete with the Social Security shortfall but I suspect that if you include all the indirect financing that it does.
Cracc wrote:And so does my country, and probably to a greater extent versus the amount of people living here and the state of our economics, the only diffrence is that my country hasnt been at war for over 300+ years, we havent invaded, and we havent been invaded, how about yours?
The Nazi's didn't invade Sweden because Sweden provided iron ore and steel to Germany and, in general, cooperated with them. Sweden wasn't the richest country in Europe after WW2 by accident.
Makora
Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
So what you are saying more or less is that the foreign aid the US gives, more or less allows your goverment to act like bullies in other places of the world?
Voro
