Most dominating active athlete!

Jice Virago · Post by **Jice Virago** » July 8, 2004, 8:18 pm

Cartalas wrote:Jice the poll was most dominating active !!!! While Favre has had a decent carrer he is by no means dominate anymore hell he isint even in the top 5 in the NFL QB ratings anymore.

I disagree. Look at how strong the Packers finnished the last two years when they had otherwise shitty rosters. He had some of the best games of his career last season, in fact. Ratings mean shit when your team is not a contender, just ask the Rams about that. If his numbers have dropped the last couple years, it has mainly to do with GB running the ball more than once or twice a game lately. If the coaching had not been so piss poor last season, GB would have likely gone all the way last year.

This really points out a basic problem with this poll. The means and criterea to dominate are drastically different between team and individual sports. Lance is unquestionably the most dominant individual athelete, but how does one measure that against someone who plays basketball or football and has to carry their entire team to achieve championships?

noel · Post by **noel** » July 8, 2004, 8:36 pm

Jice Virago wrote:This really points out a basic problem with this poll. The means and criterea to dominate are drastically different between team and individual sports. Lance is unquestionably the most dominant individual athelete, but how does one measure that against someone who plays basketball or football and has to carry their entire team to achieve championships?

As someone who grew up on Football, Basketball and Baseball (read American sports), and now understands cycling, I can assure you that Lance is only dominant because A) he's good and talented and B) he has a good team who are all focused on him winning the tour. I realize the American media makes it seem like A) the only bike race in the world is the Tour de France and B) Lance Armstrong is some sort of superhero that does it all by himself every year so I don't expect anyone who's not from Europe or doesn't cycle to understand that.

Arguably, the most dominant cyclist prior to the Tour this year was Alessandro Pettachi.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 8, 2004, 8:57 pm

Cycling is interesting.. you got the yearly races.. and then you got Tour de France. Pettachi has done good this year - but has a horrible Tour so far. O'Grady has had a bad year, yet won today's stage of the Tour after excellent riding. Really really strange how things involving the Tour works sometimes.

Oh and Serena Williams should probably have been in the pool.. I forgot her. I am not a fan of the Williams sisters though because I consider them squandering their talent.

Siji · Post by **Siji** » July 9, 2004, 1:01 am

No love at all for hockey players.

Vetiria · Post by **Vetiria** » July 9, 2004, 1:55 am

Winnow, Randy Johnson isn't even the most dominant pitcher this year, let alone most dominant in all of baseball or most dominant athlete. He's still an All-Star, but not the best.

Roger Clemens? Over-hyped and should have stayed retired.

Jason Schmidt is by far the best pitcher this year.

Besides, Randy won't be in Pheonix by the end of the month, so you won't have any reason to like him anymore

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 2:43 am

Vetiria wrote:Winnow, Randy Johnson isn't even the most dominant pitcher this year, let alone most dominant in all of baseball or most dominant athlete. He's still an All-Star, but not the best.

Roger Clemens? Over-hyped and should have stayed retired.

Jason Schmidt is by far the best pitcher this year.

Besides, Randy won't be in Pheonix by the end of the month, so you won't have any reason to like him anymore

All I was arguing was that he still dominates and not that he is the most dominant pitcher right now. The comment about switching the vote from Randy to Clemens needed to be addressed. He's still throwing 95mph heat at 40 and managed a perfect game at 40 and is on pace for yet another 300K season. I have an argument that The Big Unit still can intimidate and takeover a game...how does it get any better than perfect?

I voted for Lance and would have voted for Bonds if I went the baseball route.

Karae · Post by **Karae** » July 9, 2004, 4:34 am

Someone please tell me why you would consider Lance Armstrong more dominating than Michael Schumacher.

Am I missing something or are you just anti-racing bigots?

Spang · Post by **Spang** » July 9, 2004, 4:50 am

Jason Schmidt is by far the best pitcher this year.

this isn't the best pitcher this year poll. it's most dominant athlete (active).

Jason Schmidt? what has he done in his career? does he have a Cy Young? 300 wins? 4000 Ks?

let's take a look at Clemens as a dominant athlete:

Graduated from Spring Woods H.S. (TX) in 1980...played first base and pitched in high school and Legion ball...was All-State in baseball while in high school...helped Legion team win the State Championship in 1979...won three letters as a football defensive end and two more as a basketball center...made All-District in football...received All-American honors at San Jacinto Junior College (TX) in 1981...went 25-7 in two years (1982-83) at the University of Texas with 241 strikeouts in 275.0 innings...received All-American honors in both years at Texas...was the winning pitcher in the final game of the 1983 College World Series as Texas beat Alabama, 4-3.

has struck out 150 or more batters in a season 16 times...only two pitchers have done it more-Nolan Ryan, 20; and Steve Carlton; 18.

is the active leader in career wins (293), games started (573), innings pitched (4067.0), strikeouts (3909), complete games (116) and shutouts (45)

with a .660 career winning percentage (293-151), Clemens ranks second all-time among righthanders with at least 250 decisions (careers starting after 1900)

also owns a .645 career winning percentage on the road (140-77), which ranks fourth on the all-time list among pitchers with at least 150 road decisions behind Whitey Ford (.695), Christy Mathewson (.665) and Three Fingers Brown (.654)*

in 1998 won his second straight Cy Young Award, going 20-6 with a 2.65 ERA in 33 starts with Toronto...was the unanimous winner for the second time in his career, making history by becoming the first pitcher to capture the Cy Young Award five times.

*those career numbers above the * are as of 2003

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » July 9, 2004, 9:23 am

Vetiria wrote:Roger Clemens? Over-hyped and should have stayed retired.

I'm pretty sure just about any owner wishes they had him on their roster. He has a workout players 10 years his junior can't even do.

Gagne? Hahaha, he's not even the best reliever right now, let alone the most dominant in the sport.

It has to be, either, Phelps or Bonds. I chose the former because he kills everyone in so many different events.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 9, 2004, 10:56 am

No love at all for hockey players

I am not an expert on hockey, but I couldn't think of ONE player that truly dominates the sport. Is there one? If so, I apologize.

And I still stand by my Schumacher vote even though I can't stand the guy

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 12:52 pm

Some Randy Highlights:

10 Time All-star (1990, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1997, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004)
World Series co-MVP (with Curt Schilling)
American League Cy Young Award winner (1995)
4 Time National League Cy Young Award winner (1999, 2000, 2001, 2002)
Finished 2nd in American League Cy Young Award voting (1993, 1997)
Finished 3rd in American League Cy Young Award voting (1994)
Led the league in ERA four times (1995, 1999, 2001, 2002)
Led the league in wins (2002)
Led the league in Strikeouts (1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002)
Won Triple Crown (led league in wins, ERA and strikeouts) (2002)
Struck out 19 batters in a game (June 24, 1997 against Oakland Athletics; August 8, 1997 against Chicago White Sox)
Struck out 20 batters in a game (May 8, 2001 against Cincinnati Reds; game went 11 innings, but Johnson recorded all strikeouts in the first nine innings)
4000 career strikeouts (as of June 29, 2004. 4th overall)
Career 238-118 record
Threw no-hitter: June 2, 1990 (Seattle Mariners 2, Oakland Athletics 0)
Threw perfect game: May 18, 2004 (Arizona Diamondbacks 2, Atlanta Braves 0)

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 1:29 pm

Karae wrote:Someone please tell me why you would consider Lance Armstrong more dominating than Michael Schumacher.

Am I missing something or are you just anti-racing bigots?

First of all, I am hardly an anti-racing bigot. Second, as I stated previously, my vote goes for Karch Kiraly. However since you asked and since I'm relatively familiar with cycling, I'll attempt to explain it.

The Tour de France is the most difficult sporting event in the world... Especially if your goal is to win. You have to be consistent, lucky, in peak physical condition, agile, attentive, intelligent and most importantly have enormous recuperative powers for 21 days in a row. There is no sporting event on the planet that is more demanding of an athlete over that period of time.

In the history of cycling, no rider including Eddy Merckx who is the greatest cyclist of all time has won more than 5 Tours. Since recovering from cancer, Lance has won 5, and barring accident, injury, illness or one of his competitors beating him, he's poised to win his sixth... something no other cyclist has done.

Here's some information about the demands of the Tour from a New Yorker article written prior to Lance's fourth Tour win:

The Tour de France has been described as the equivalent of running twenty marathons in twenty days. During the nineteen-eighties and nineties, Wim H. M. Saris, a professor of nutrition at the University of Maastricht, conducted a study of human endurance by following participants in the Tour. "It is without any doubt the most demanding athletic event," he told me. "For one day, two days—sure, you may find something that expends more energy. But for three weeks? Never."

Looking at a wide range of physical activities, Saris and his colleagues measured the metabolic demands made on people engaged in each of them. "On average, the cyclists expend sixty-five hundred calories a day for three weeks, with peak days of ten thousand calories," he said. "If you are sedentary, you are burning perhaps twenty-five hundred calories a day. Active people might burn as many as thirty-five hundred."

Saris compared the metabolic rates of professional cyclists while they were riding with those of a variety of animal species, and he created a kind of energy index—dividing daily expenditure of energy by resting metabolic rate. This figure turned out to range from one to seven. An active male rates about two on Saris's index and an average professional cyclist four and a half. Almost no species can survive with a number that is greater than five. For example, the effort made by birds foraging for food sometimes kills them, and they scored a little more than five. In fact, only four species are known to have higher rates on Saris's energy index than the professional cyclists in his study: a small Australian possum, a macaroni penguin, a large seabird called a gannet, and one species of marsupial mouse.

Shumacher is no doubt a great athlete, no doubt a brilliant racer, no doubt dominating his sport. But the simple fact is... his sport is nowhere near as demanding as the Tour de France, and far easier to remain at the top of; especially given F1's dependence on equipment. While Shumacher has dominated his sport under the power of Ferrari, Lance has dominated his sport under his own power.

In closing, given that you've never cycled, never closely followed cycling, never watched a complete Tour de France, I'd have to say: Yes, you ARE missing something. But don't feel bad, so are the majority of the people who voted for Lance. I bet there are 2-3 people at the most who voted for him who could name every person on his team without doing an Internet search, and probably less that could name at least 5 of his main rivals in this year's Tour.

Spang · Post by **Spang** » July 9, 2004, 1:36 pm

more Clemens Highlights:

6 time Cy Young Award (American League) (Best pitcher); 2001, 1998, 1997, 1991, 1987, 1986
3 time Players Choice Awards (American League) (Outstanding Pitcher); 2001, 1998, 1997
8 time All-Star; 2001, 1998, 1997, 1992, 1991, 1990, 1988, 1986
2 time Triple Crown Winner; 1998, 1997 (4th person to do this twice)
Most Valuable Player Award (American League); 1986
All-Star Game - Most Valuable Player; 1986
Led the league in ERA 6 times; 1986, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1997, 1998
Led the league in strikeouts 5 times; 1988, 1991, 1996, 1997, 1998
Led the league in wins 4 times; 1986, 1987, 1997, 1998

and

Clemens has struck out 20 batters in a game twice, a major league record.

Clemens struck out eight straight batters, tying an AL record held jointly by Nolan Ryan and Ron Davis

From mid-1998 and into 1999, Clemens won 20 straight games to tie the mark held by Hall of Famer Rube Marquard.

he should be on the list!

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 1:54 pm

Nice post Aranuil.

When you look at degree of difficulty in maintaining dominance combined with actual physical demands on the body of a sport it's hard to vote against Lance Armstrong.

If Kelshara changed the topic and removed the word "athelete" I'd have an easier time even considering a person driving a car.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 9, 2004, 2:20 pm

You are an idiot if you don't consider F1 drivers athletes. You wouldn't last for 2 laps in the environment they run.

Edit: Also, Schumacher might require equipment (even though he won when other teams had CLEARLY better cars), but Lance is completely dependent on his team and manager.

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 2:23 pm

Kelshara wrote:You are an idiot if you don't consider F1 drivers athletes. You wouldn't last for 2 laps in the environment they run.

Edit: Also, Schumacher might require equipment (even though he won when other teams had CLEARLY better cars), but Lance is completely dependent on his team and manager.

Shumacher is also completely dependent upon his pit crew, his mechanics, and his racing team.

I think it's safe to say that EVERY athlete dominating his or her sport is dependent upon someone; be it a coach, a team, a trainer, parents with good genetics, a supportive family, good financial backing, etc.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 2:41 pm

Kelshara wrote:You are an idiot if you don't consider F1 drivers athletes. You wouldn't last for 2 laps in the environment they run.

Edit: Also, Schumacher might require equipment (even though he won when other teams had CLEARLY better cars), but Lance is completely dependent on his team and manager.

Racecar drivers are not atheletes. I'd last more than two laps. I'll bet you my soul.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 9, 2004, 2:57 pm

Well you are an idiot then

And honestly, you probably wouldn't even be able to start a F1 car. Not to mention the 3.5 G you'll pull in corners, the insane forces you face while breaking and downforce enough to drive upside down at high speeds.

IF you managed to get the car started you might surpass 2 laps but you sure as hell would be "Driving Ms. Daisy"

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 3:01 pm

I would consider myself extremely happy and proud to go around an F1 course in an F1 car at an extremely low speed! I'd also like to say that if anyone can arrange such a drive, I'd gladly give up MY soul!

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 9, 2004, 3:07 pm

There are places where you can take.. erh I think it is F3000 car out for 15 or 30 minutes. It is basically a whole day thing where you have some classes etc. Friend of mine did it, said it was the most fun he has had EVER. Personally, I'd almost just as much take Petter Solberg's WRC Subaru WRX out for a spin on a dirt course.. woah!

Now please make me post more today, I am trying to avoid packing stuff up for moving!

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » July 9, 2004, 3:14 pm

Racers are not atheletes....they are drivers. You need absolutely no athletic ability to drive a vehicle. You need good reflexes and some stamina, but so much of winning any racing event is actually your equipment. Jeff Gordon should not even be on the list as it took the NASCAR officials forcing Ford to cut back on their spoilers for him to even be able to win a race again.

If you must insist on racing, then John Force would be the most dominant "athelete".

Personally, I would have to say that Tiger Woods....even with the "slump" of this year has been the most dominating male athelete in the last 5 years without even a question. The guy has never missed a cut.....ever. Even without winning much this year he has still been in the top 10 consistently. If he goes back to Butch Harmon like he should he will win everything again.

Edit: I looked back and noticed you included women in this. In that case there is only one clear cut....Annika Sorenstam. No one else is even close.

Vetiria · Post by **Vetiria** » July 9, 2004, 3:22 pm

Spang wrote:this isn't the best pitcher this year poll. it's most dominant athlete (active).

No, really?!? It was a side conversation Mr. Smart Guy.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 9, 2004, 3:24 pm

Yeah somebody not missing a cut is definitely more dominating than somebody who wins everything in the same 5 years.. *rolls eyes*

And Nascar can't even be compared to F1.

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 3:26 pm

Kelshara wrote:There are places where you can take.. erh I think it is F3000 car out for 15 or 30 minutes. It is basically a whole day thing where you have some classes etc. Friend of mine did it, said it was the most fun he has had EVER. Personally, I'd almost just as much take Petter Solberg's WRC Subaru WRX out for a spin on a dirt course.. woah!

Now please make me post more today, I am trying to avoid packing stuff up for moving!

My best friend went to a two-week Skip Barber racing school that was either in CA, or AZ or maybe TX I can't remember. He got to drive some open wheel vehicles and had a blast. I think the class was like 2 or 3 grand.

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 3:28 pm

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:Personally, I would have to say that Tiger Woods....even with the "slump" of this year has been the most dominating male athelete in the last 5 years without even a question. The guy has never missed a cut.....ever. Even without winning much this year he has still been in the top 10 consistently. If he goes back to Butch Harmon like he should he will win everything again.

Edit: I looked back and noticed you included women in this. In that case there is only one clear cut....Annika Sorenstam. No one else is even close.

I don't know enough about Annika to comment, but I have to take exception at your Tiger comment. Making the cut != dominating in any sport/language. Tiger WAS dominating, and if he had stayed with his swing coach, he probably still would be.

Wulfran · Post by **Wulfran** » July 9, 2004, 3:49 pm

No love at all for hockey players.

Thing is for active athletes, there isn't one name that comes to the top in hockey right now. There a some great players, that will no doubt make it into the Hall of Fame, but no single player dominates the sport. You take 5 hockey fans right now and I bet you get different answers from each in terms of who is best at each position, never mind who is the best player in the game. IMO, hockey hasn't had a truly dominant player since Mario had his bout with Hodgkins disease.

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 4:00 pm

Kelshara wrote:Edit: Also, Schumacher might require equipment (even though he won when other teams had CLEARLY better cars), but Lance is completely dependent on his team and manager.

Since you said you didn't want to pack, I thought I'd force your hand. In response to the above comment, I have to ask... Who has won the most individual time trial stages in the last 5 Tours de France?

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 4:05 pm

Kelshara wrote: And Nascar can't even be compared to F1.

Yeah, in Nascar you only have to make left hand turns...in F1 you have to make left AND right hand turns.

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 4:08 pm

I believe NASCAR has an actual road course at some point during the season.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 4:13 pm

Demolition Derby takes skill. If someone dominated the demolition derby circuit consistently I'd be impressed.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » July 9, 2004, 4:21 pm

Karae wrote:It's a no brainer - it's Schumacher.

I realize Formula 1 doesn't get much play in the U.S., but he's won 7 World Championships in the last decade - including the last 5 straight. Finishing second twice, due to mechanical failures in the last race of the season in a Ferrari that had been unreliable the entire season, and 5th once despite missing half the season due to a broken leg. He holds the Fastest Lap record at more than half of the current Formula 1 tracks, and several former tracks. He has the most wins in a career (79 wins - next closest 51), most championships all-time, most consecutive championships, most wins in a season (11 out of 17, twice), and is the youngest ever to become champion. He has won 9 out of 10 races in the current season, has already clinched the world championship with 7 races remaining, and will almost assuredly break his single season win record.

Not even Armstrong can boast that kind of dominance...he's arguably not even the most dominant in the history of his sport. He's just tying records now, Schumacher has already broken every major Formula 1 record after just 13 seasons (actually he broke/tied most of them after 10), and is now proceeding to extend them to marks that are likely to last at least a generation.

I can't believe I'm the only one that got this question right so far...

Quoted this just as a side by side comparison. Tiger is still number 1 in the world despite not having won anything of note this year.

1996 ---- Becomes the first golfer in history to win three consecutive U.S. Amateur titles. Wins the NCAA individual men's championship with a 69-67-69-80-285. Ties the British Open record for an amateur with a 75-66-70-70-281

1997 ---- Leading money winner on the PGA Tour with a record $2,066,833 in earnings. Wins first major championship, The Masters, by an amazing 12 strokes, the widest margin of victory the tournament has ever seen. Becomes youngest Masters winner ever, and the first of African or Asian descent. Wins three other PGA events. Achieves No. 1 world ranking in his 42nd week as a pro.

1999 ---- Earns the most money on the PGA Tour with a record $6,616,585 in winnings for the year. Records 16 top-10 finishes in 21 PGA Tour starts and makes the cut in all 21. Wins second PGA major title with a one-shot victory over Sergio Garcia in the PGA Championship. Records eight PGA victories overall, including the final four official tournaments of the year.

2000 ---- Opens the year with wins at the Mercedes Championship and AT&T Pebble Beach National Pro-Am, his fifth and sixth consecutive PGA Tour victories (the longest streak since Ben Hogan in 1948). Wins U.S. Open at Pebble Beach by a record 15 strokes (65-69-71-67--272), the largest margin of victory ever recorded at a major tournament. Breaks or ties a total of nine records at the U.S. Open. Becomes the Tour's all-time career money leader.

Becomes the fifth player in history (and youngest ever) to complete the career Grand Slam by winning the British Open by eight strokes. His 19-under 269 is the best score ever at St. Andrews and the lowest score (in relation to par) at a major tournament.

Defeats Bob May in a three-hole playoff at Valhalla in Louisville to win his second consecutive PGA Championship and third consecutive major title. He joins Ben Hogan (1953) as the only two players to win three majors in one season.

2001 ---- In April, wins the Masters tournament, becomes the first golfer to be reigning champion of all four majors simultaneously. Wins five overall PGA events and takes home PGA Player of the Year honors for the third consecutive year.

2002 ---- Wins second consecutive Masters, third overall, with a three-stroke victory over Retief Goosen. Becomes the youngest golfer in history to win seven PGA majors.

2003 --- Although he didn't win any of the major titles this year, Tiger still came in first in 5 of the 18 tournaments he entered, and ended the season winning over $6.6 million dollars.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » July 9, 2004, 4:22 pm

And more records.....

MOST PGA TOUR WINS PRIOR TO 25TH BIRTHDAY: Tiger Woods holds record with 24. Horton Smith is second with 17 (1933).

MOST PGA TOUR WINS BETWEEN AGES 20-29: Tiger Woods holds record with 34. Jack Nicklaus had 30.

MOST PGA TOUR WINS AFTER 25 STARTS: Tiger Woods holds record with 6. Ken Venturi is second with 5.

MOST PGA TOUR WINS AFTER 50 STARTS: Jack Nicklaus holds record with 8. Tiger Woods tied in second with Ken Venturi (7).

MOST PGA TOUR WINS AFTER 75 STARTS: Tiger Woods holds record with 17. Jack Nicklaus is second with 12.

MOST PGA TOUR WINS AFTER 100 STARTS: Tiger Woods holds record with 28. Jack Nicklaus is second with 17.

YOUNGEST PLAYER TO WIN 5 PGA TOUR EVENTS: Record held by Horton Smith (20 years, 10 months, one day) in 1929. Tiger Woods is second youngest (21 years, four months, 20 days).

YOUNGEST PLAYER TO ACHIEVE #1 WORLD RANK: Tiger Woods at 21 years, 24 weeks. Previously held by Bernhard Langer (29 years, 31 weeks) in 1986.

LOWEST 72-HOLE SCORE: 259 (21 under par) in 2000 WGC NEC Invitational.

LOWEST 72-HOLE SCORE IN RELATION TO PAR: 25 under par (263) in 2000 Johnnie Walker Classic and 2002 WGC American Express Championship. PGA TOUR record is 28 under par (260) by John Huston in 1998 United Airlines Hawaiian Open and 28 under par (256) by Mark Calcavecchia in 2001 Phoenix Open.

LOW 72-HOLE SCORE IN RELATION TO PAR IN MAJORS:
1997 Masters Tournament 18 under par
2000 U.S. Open Championship 12 under par
2000 British Open Championship 19 under par
2000 PGA Championship 18 under par (tied with Bob May)

LOWEST FIRST 36 HOLES: 125 (64-61) in 2000 WGC NEC Invitational. Mark Calcavecchia tied PGA TOUR record with 125 (65-60) in 2001 Phoenix Open. Tom Lehman also tied this record 125 (63-62) in 2001 Invensys Classic in Las Vegas.

LOWEST FIRST 54 HOLES: 192 in 2000 WGC NEC Invitational. PGA TOUR record is 189 by John Cook in 1996 Fed Ex St. Jude Classic and by Mark Calcavecchia in 2001 Phoenix Open.

LOWEST 18-HOLE SCORE: 61 in 1999 GTE Byron Nelson Classic and 2000 WGC NEC Invitational. PGA TOUR record is 59 by Al Geiberger in 1977 Memphis Classic, Chip Beck in 1991 Las Vegas Invitational, and David Duval in 1999 Bob Hope Chrysler Classic.

LARGEST MARGIN OF VICTORY: 15 strokes in 2000 U.S. Open Championship. PGA TOUR record is 16 strokes by J.D. Edgar in 1919 Canadian Open, Joe Kirkwood, Sr. in 1924 Corpus Christi Open and Bobby Locke in 1948 Chicago Victory Championship.

LARGEST MARGIN AFTER 54 HOLES: 10 strokes in 2000 U.S. Open Championship.

LARGEST MARGIN AFTER 36 HOLES: 7 strokes in 2000 WGC NEC Invitational.

MOST CONSECUTIVE EVENTS WITHOUT MISSING CUT: Tiger Woods has missed the cut in only one event in his career, 1997 Bell Canadian Open. He withdrew from 1998 AT&T Pebble Beach National Pro-Am, because of postponement. Since then, Woods has made the cut in 96 consecutive events. PGA TOUR record is 113 events by Byron Nelson, followed by Jack Nicklaus with 105.

LOWEST ADJUSTED SCORING AVERAGE: Tiger Woods’ adjusted scoring average of 67.79 in 2000 was the lowest in PGA TOUR history, exceeding his 68.43 average in 1999.

LOWEST ACTUAL SCORING AVERAGE: Tiger Woods’ actual scoring average of 68.17 in 2000 was the lowest in PGA TOUR history, exceeding the 68.33 average by Byron Nelson in 1945.

LOWEST CONSECUTIVE ROUNDS: 125 (64-61) in the first and second rounds of the 2000 NEC Invitational. Mark Calcaveccia broke this record 124 (60-64) in the 2001 Phoenix Open second and third rounds.

MOST CONSECUTIVE ROUNDS AT PAR OR BETTER: Tiger Woods' 52 consecutive rounds at par or better from the second round of 2000 GTE Byron Nelson Classic, through the first round of the 2001 Phoenix Open, was a PGA TOUR record. He had 66 consecutive rounds worldwide.

MOST CONSECUTIVE EVENTS AT PAR OR BETTER: Tiger Woods' 35 consecutive events at par or better (stroke-play events only) on the PGA TOUR (all under par), starting with the 1999 PGA Championship, through the 2001 Memorial Tournament, was a PGA TOUR record. In 2000, Woods became the first to be under par in every event played on the PGA TOUR for an entire year.

MOST CONSECUTIVE VICTORIES IN A SINGLE EVENT: Tiger Woods is one of three (possibly four) players to have three consecutive victories in two single events and is the first to do so in the same years. He won both Memorial Tournament and WGC NEC Invitational in 1999, 2000 and 2001. Walter Hagen won PGA Championship in four consecutive years (1924-27) and Metropolitan Open in three consecutive years (1916-20, no event in 1917-18 because of war). Arnold Palmer won Texas Open (1960-62) and Phoenix Open (1961-63). Some records keepers credit Gene Sarazen with three consecutive victories in two single events in 1920s and other records keepers dispute this. The records are inconclusive.

MOST PRIZE MONEY FOR ONE YEAR AND FOR CAREER: Tiger Woods set PGA TOUR record with earnings of $9,188,321 for 2000 and $33,103,852 for his career through 2002. His worldwide total was $41,213,162 for his career through 2002.

MOST USGA NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS: Tiger Woods has won eight USGA national championships. Those who have won eight or more are Robert T. Jones, Jr. (9), Joanne Gunderson Carner (8) and Jack Nicklaus (8).

MOST MASTERS VICTORIES: Tiger Woods has won the Masters Tournament 3 times. Jack Nicklaus has won 6 Masters titles, Arnold Palmer has won 4, and others with 3 victories are Jimmy Demaret, Sam Snead, Gary Player and Nick Faldo.

noel · Post by **noel** » July 9, 2004, 4:26 pm

Well maybe if he starts winning again he can be on the poll for next year.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » July 9, 2004, 4:26 pm

As for Anika....she set 30 records in the LPGA in the year 2001 alone.

She won 19 tournaments in 2001-2002 and I have not even looked up last year or this year. She is easily the best female golfer to have played the game to this point. She would finish in the top 75 of the rankings if she played on the men's courses in my opinion.

Post by **Sylvus** » July 9, 2004, 4:39 pm

If she made the cut.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » July 9, 2004, 4:52 pm

Anika screwed up by playing her one men's event at a short course. She should have played at an event like a U.S. Open or the British Open. Those courses absolutely DEMAND you hit the fairways to have a chance. That would have played into her biggest strength. The balls also tend to run forever there, which would have given her some extra distance off the tees. Would have been her best chance at making a cut.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 9, 2004, 4:55 pm

Honorary mention goes to Bobby Fischer as best Athelete of all time (you have to physically move the chess pieces)

Huge quote but great read if you're interested in total domination of something that takes mental skill:

The Amazing Bobby Fischer

It does not take a chessplayer to realize that Bobby Fischer is an absolutely amazing man. Aside from his numerous chess accomplishments, he has an astronomical I.Q. with an exceptional memory; in the world of chess, no player has ever proved to be as devoted as Bobby Fischer. Fischer is "generally acknowledged as the greatest chessplayer of all time" (Pandolfini 1). Robert James Fischer was born in Chicago, Illinois, on March 9, 1943. His parents were divorced in 1945, and his mother moved him and his sister to Brooklyn a year or so later. "At the age of six he acquired a chess set and soon became deeply absorbed in the game" (Hooper and Whyld 115). This was the beginning of a legend.

Bobby Fischer had many incredible chess accomplishments. At age twelve, Fischer began to visit the great Manhattan Chess Club ,which had the best players in the country, and "even then hardly anybody could beat him" (Schonberg 258). At age thirteen, Fischer beat International Master, Donald Byrne, in what was generally acknowledged as the "game of the century." "The winning moves were perhaps the most insightful ever played by a youngster" (Pandolfini 2). In 1957, at age fourteen, he won the U.S. Junior Championship, which was a nice accomplishment for a young man of his age. However, that same year he won the U.S. Senior Championship overtaking the renowned Samuel Reshevsky, which was an amazing accomplishment for a man of any age. Fischer became the youngest grandmaster in the history of chess at age fifteen. "At 16 he was able to earn his living from chess" (Hooper 115), and he added status to any tournament he attended. Now the only steps left were to win the Candidates Matches and then the World Championship Match. In 1971, step one was completed with superior dominance, leaving only the World Championship Match. In 1972, Fischer domineered Borris Spassky to become the World Champion.

Contributing to Bobby Fischer's numerous chess accomplishments, was his high I.Q. and enormous memory. "There is probably no other topic that intrigues chessplayers as much as the inner machinations of the mind of Bobby Fischer" (Brady V). Chessplayers universally feel that they can improve their own game by understanding how Fischer's mind operates, but it does not take a chess player to realize that Fischer has enormous mental capabilities. A political scientist, at Fischer's high school in Brooklyn, had an opportunity to study Fischer's personal records. He was amazed to see that Fischer's I.Q. was in the range of 180, a very high genius. In addition, Fischer has an incredibly retentive memory. On one occasion, right before the World Championship Match in Reykjavik, Fischer toured Iceland for a few days. One morning he called Frederick Olaffson, who was Iceland's only grandmaster. Olaffson's Icelandic speaking daughter answered the phone and Fischer said, "Mr Olaffson, please." The girl explained that her father and mother were out of the house and would not return until dinner. Fischer did not know one word of Icelandic and he did not understand the little girl. Fischer had to hang up with an apology. Later that day Fischer met up with another Icelandic chess player that spoke English. After explaining what had happened, Fischer "then repeated every Icelandic word he had heard over the telephone, imitating the sounds with perfect inflection, so well, as a matter of fact, that the Icelander translated the message word for word" (Brady vii). Another amazing example of his the mental capacity was witnessed by Frank Brady:

In 1963 Fischer played in and won the New York State Open Championship at Poughkeepsie, New York. During the last round I was involved in a complicated ending with Frank S. Meyer . . . Fischer, on his way to the washroom, briefly paused at my board -for perhaps five seconds- and then walked on. A few months later, he visited me at my office . . . "How did that last round game turn out?" he inquired. I told him I had won, but with difficulty. "Did you play Q-B5?" he asked. I told him quite frankly I couldn't remember what I had played. He immediately set up the exact position to "help" me remember, and then demonstrated the variation I should have played to have secured a much more economical win. The main point is . . . he remembered not only the position but also his fleeting analysis as he had passed my board months previously. (VII)

"It is said that he has never forgotten a game he has played or an analysis he has read" (Schonberg 264). Fischer can also remember most of his speed games, in which both players are limited to five minutes to make all of their moves. After the World Speed Chess championship at Hercegnovi, Yugoslavia, in 1970, "Fischer rattled off the scores of all his twenty-two games, involving more than 1,000 moves, from memory!" (Brady VIII). Not only does he remember speed chess directly after a match, he has also been known to remember for years. "Fischer met the Russian Player Vasiukov and showed him a speed game that the two had played in Moscow fifteen years before. Fischer recalled the game move by move" (Brady VII). It is plain to see that these qualities were instrumental in producing the chess accomplishments of Bobby Fischer, but his I.Q. and memory capacity could have gone nowhere without one final quality.

Bobby Fischer had an overwhelming desire to win. One of his teachers remarked about his abnormal competitive urge.
"No matter what he played, whether it was baseball in the yard or tennis, he had to come out ahead of everybody. If he had been born next to a swimming pool he would have been a swimming champion. It just turned out to be chess." (Schonberg 261) "The boy, of a poor family and without any friends, had an overwhelming urge to win, to dominate, and chess became his outlet" (Schonberg 261).

Fischer was a monomaniac, he had an obsession with one idea and that was to be the "Best Chessplayer of All time." People who were around Fischer would say that he studies chess day and night, and that they have never seen him do anything but chess. Fischer was totally dedicated to chess and had no room for girls or friends. The only people he saw socially were chessplayers. "Regarded as anti-social, resentful of all authority, he increasingly became alienated from his fellow men" (Hooper 115). Fischer satisfied his emotional life through the losses of his opponents, and that was why it was so important to win. After Fischer took the World Championship title from Spassky, Spassky later commented "Fischer has a burning desire to win every game."

Bobby Fischer's chess career was full of accomplishments that earned his peer-given title "The Best Chessplayer of All Time." His I.Q. and memory were essential to his success, and without his total devotion, he would have never became legend.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » July 9, 2004, 11:22 pm

Heh, there are others in such regards in Go, a game which can even be considered to be more challenging than chess (certainly has more history). This "kid" is/was quite the prodigy. Very few, if any ever receive his skill designation, and at his age, unheard of.

http://www.leechangho.com/

Karae · Post by **Karae** » July 12, 2004, 5:41 am

Kelshara wrote:Oh and Serena Williams should probably have been in the pool.. I forgot her. I am not a fan of the Williams sisters though because I consider them squandering their talent.

Given that she just got her ass handed to her by Maria Sharapova - who had never previously won a major - it's safe to say she doesn't belong on the list.

Karae · Post by **Karae** » July 12, 2004, 5:48 am

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:Quoted this just as a side by side comparison. Tiger is still number 1 in the world despite not having won anything of note this year.

You state he hasn't won anything of note, then try to make the case that he's the "most domininate." Jesus fucking christ, shut your mouth moron. Tiger isn't even the best player in golf right now let alone dominating on the level of Michael Schumacher.

Nope, I'm not reading your next post. Have fun, kid.

P.S. Nobody is debating whether or not he was dominating 4-5 years ago. Simple fact is, right now, he's just another golfer.

Spang · Post by **Spang** » July 12, 2004, 6:54 am

why isn't Roger Clemens on the list yet?

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » July 12, 2004, 9:56 am

And Schumaker is not an athelete. Your arguments for him are not valid.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 12, 2004, 10:09 am

Well considering I posted the poll and I consider him an athlete (which he is for sure): Yes he is.

He is as much of an athlete as a golfer.

Siji · Post by **Siji** » July 12, 2004, 10:24 am

"Golf isn't a sport. Golf is men in ugly pants walking."

noel · Post by **noel** » July 12, 2004, 12:23 pm

"Golf is a walk spoiled."

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 12, 2004, 1:31 pm

In light of all these arguments about what's a sport and what's not, I'm sticking with Bobby Fischer. He dominated the chess scene and left on top of his game...actually returned years later, beat his opponent then vanished again.

Chess has no excuses like "his team helped him" or "he had a bionic arm that helped him move his pieces faster". If you want pure one on one competition, play chess.

Edit: I suppose if you wanted to add some physical activity, you could have a chess match with 1 minute Ultimate Fighting rounds thrown inbetween moves. UFC is pretty pure competition so it would be a good fit to go along with chess.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » July 12, 2004, 1:43 pm

Whatever dude, Fischer was roided to the max, dumbass

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » July 12, 2004, 1:47 pm

Unless Fischer is currently active he doesn't qualify!

masteen · Post by **masteen** » July 12, 2004, 1:47 pm

Doesn't Team Ferrari also dump more money into their teams than any other sponsor? In auto racing it's a fact that money = wins, unless your driver is a retard. Schumacher is not an athlete, he's just a really good driver.

A perfect game is a bigger accomplishment than anything else Rocket has done. The Unit is also putting up comparable stats in every category in less games. That's big.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » July 12, 2004, 2:04 pm

Spang wrote:why isn't Roger Clemens on the list yet?

You mean that Nolan Ryan wannabe?