Fire missile. Miss target completely. Success!

What do you think about the world?
Post Reply
User avatar
Jassun
Gets Around
Gets Around
Posts: 131
Joined: July 3, 2002, 12:45 pm

Fire missile. Miss target completely. Success!

Post by Jassun »

http://slate.msn.com/id/2084665/
By Fred Kaplan
Posted Friday, June 20, 2003, at 11:23 AM PT


It looked like a headline from the Onion, but it was from CNN and the story was real: "Missile Misses Target, Officials Call It a Success." The Pentagon's Missile Defense Agency had conducted a test the afternoon of June 18. A Standard Missile-3, fired from a Navy cruiser 160 miles off the Hawaiian island of Kauai, tried—but failed—to intercept a target missile that had been launched a few minutes earlier from the island's test range. And so it seemed another setback had afflicted President Bush's most cherished military program.


However, the Missile Defense Agency's spokesman, Chris Taylor, saw the test differently. "I wouldn't call it a failure," he told CNN, "because the intercept was not the primary objective. It's still considered a success, in that we gained great engineering data. We just don't know why it didn't hit."

Oh, it's hard to be a satirist these days.

The thing is, Taylor's reasoning is common in the Pentagon, and always has been, for tests not just of the missile-defense program but of all weapons programs.

Officials planning a test usually divide it into several discrete phases. If only one of the phases goes off successfully, and if the others at least yield some interesting data, then the test is marked down as a "success" or, if it was an almost (but not quite) total failure, a "partial success." In the June 18 missile defense test, these phases would have included a) launching the test missile; b) detecting and tracking the target-missile in midflight; c) transmitting information about the target back to control panels on the ship; and d) intercepting the target missile.

The system passed a) through c) with flying colors. Three out of four isn't bad. Call it "success." That's what happened, even though the point of missile defense is to intercept missiles. In fact, the specific aim of this test was to assess a new solid-state engine for the interceptor's guidance system. It now appears that the two missiles didn't collide because the engine malfunctioned. In other words, by any serious measure, broad or narrow, the test was an abject failure, regardless of how the Pentagon grades it.

"This happens all the time," one Pentagon official told me with a sigh. "It's incredible."

Just recently, the Air Force tested a new type of air-to-air missile for its F-22 stealth fighter plane. The missile missed its target by a long shot, but its firing mechanism worked, so the test was counted as a "success."

The problem with this practice is that, when it comes time to decide whether to move ahead on a particular weapons program, an assistant secretary or deputy chief of staff, not having time to study the raw test data, will look at the summary report. The sheet will say, "Eight successes, three partial successes, one failure." That will seem pretty good, and the program will graduate to the next stage of development. At some point, the flaws might get ironed out in the field, but at great cost, not only financial but—if the weapon has to be used on the battlefield in the meantime—strategic and human.

Of course, the Pentagon's standard of success in testing is not entirely ridiculous. In the early stages of a weapon's R & D, especially if the program involves advanced technology, there is real value in learning practically anything about its performance. If one part of the test fails but the other parts work fine, it might legitimately be called a success. However, President Bush plans to start deploying the missile-defense program in the fall of 2004. In order to do so, he formally abrogated the 30-year-old Anti-Ballistic-Missile Treaty. He has requested, and Congress has approved, $9.1 billion for the program next year, and he plans to ask for more than $10 billion the following year. Either the tests should be judged by the standards of an advanced program, or the program should be scaled back to what it really is, despite its advocates' fervent efforts: an interesting but still quite primitive research project.
I was in the USMC for 8 years. I have always been a big supporter of spending whatever amount of money is reasonably necessary for our national defense programs.

However, after seeing the results of the SDI test over the last 3 years and considering the amount of money the U.S. is pouring into it, I can't help but agree with Fred, not matter how liberal his Slate articles may be.
The statement below is true.
The statement above is false.
User avatar
Metanis
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 1417
Joined: July 5, 2002, 4:54 pm
Location: Wisconsin

Post by Metanis »

Hiya Jarhead! Semper Fi!

I know how you feel about this SDI stuff, but I would ask you to try a different perspective.

Let's say some yo-yo launches a couple missiles and we can intercept just one of them.

If you lived in the city that dodged the bullet don't you think you'd call it a success?

PS ex-Marine here also
Kelgar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 591
Joined: July 3, 2002, 3:01 pm
Location: Houston

Post by Kelgar »

The military are bullshitting the public as well as their bosses the politicians with an absurd definition of what counts as a "success".

Good going! Like the atypical sheep, you will completely ignore that the government is stretching the truth to extremes with regards to how well your tax dollars are being spent. This article isn't even about looking towards the end result of what you're hoping the program will achieve.

What if William Wallace really did stand 7 feet tall and shoot lightning bolts out of his ass? Well then Maybe Scotland would be its own country! WTF does this have to do with the issue of grossly misleading results so that the politicians will shit more money your way? Jack and shit. Your "what if" scenario is just a good lapdog's way of attempting to derail the issue at hand.
User avatar
kyoukan
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 8548
Joined: July 5, 2002, 3:33 am
Location: Vancouver

Post by kyoukan »

Metanis wrote:PS ex-Marine here also
ex-navy seal here.
Kelgar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 591
Joined: July 3, 2002, 3:01 pm
Location: Houston

Post by Kelgar »

:lol:
Zamtuk
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4781
Joined: September 21, 2002, 12:21 am
Location: Columbus, OH

Post by Zamtuk »

kyoukan wrote:
Metanis wrote:PS ex-Marine here also
ex-navy seal here.
xanupox?
User avatar
Jassun
Gets Around
Gets Around
Posts: 131
Joined: July 3, 2002, 12:45 pm

Post by Jassun »

LOL Zam

Metanis, I understand what you are saying, but read this first (especially the last few parts) which comes from a fairly unbiased source...

http://www.discover.com/nov_01/featshield.html

...then tell me if you think SDI is worth 10 BILLION a year. That's $10,000,000,000.

I think of a few other things that I feel are a higher priority, considering the amount of protection we are getting (very, very little; actually none right now or for years to come) for the amount money we are spending.
The statement below is true.
The statement above is false.
User avatar
Mplor
Star Farmer
Star Farmer
Posts: 429
Joined: January 7, 2003, 4:54 am
Location: UK

Post by Mplor »

Like many things (except flying cars), I think SDI will one day be a reality. I also believe, in principle, that throwing money at a problem will hasten innovation to a certain extent (e.g. the Manhattan Project). What $$ cannot do is guaranty innovation on a timetable. After a certain point, throwing more money at a problem like this only allows for more extravagance, not more results.

We should continue to fund SDI research, but at one-tenth the cost. One-beeelion dollars is still "real" money. Let them work the math out and then fire off the SM3s.

Keep in mind that the cost of SDI is potentially far greater than $10B a year. The US pulled out of the ABM treaty in order to fast-track this, and that was part of the reason Russia was willing to side with France on the Iraq issue instead of with us. Word has it that the Russians aren't over that insult yet, and these hidden costs of SDI may be payed out on an installment plan over the next decade or two.

Mippy

p.s. Where's my goddamn flying car!?
The Boney King of Nowhere.
User avatar
Salis
Star Farmer
Star Farmer
Posts: 274
Joined: July 3, 2002, 6:10 pm
Location: Glasgow

Post by Salis »

Fire missile. Miss target completely

Cartalas love making attempt 3 failed??! Cattle stocks down, ranch futures fluctuating wildy, what will become of teh mid-West?!?!11!!
User avatar
Cartalas
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4364
Joined: July 3, 2002, 2:39 pm
Location: Kyoukan's Mouth

Post by Cartalas »

Salis wrote:Fire missile. Miss target completely

Cartalas love making attempt 3 failed??! Cattle stocks down, ranch futures fluctuating wildy, what will become of teh mid-West?!?!11!!

Yeah your mom was pissed.
Trek
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 1670
Joined: July 5, 2002, 3:31 am
Contact:

Post by Trek »

X-NJROTC here.
User avatar
Mak
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 834
Joined: August 5, 2002, 4:13 pm
Location: Tucson, AZ
Contact:

Post by Mak »

The article quoted that "the intercept was not the primary objective"- so what's the problem with it not hitting it's target? Hitting it's target was 4th on it's list of objectives, and probably so for a reason.

And of course, if it worked perfectly it wouldn't be in the testing phase, right?
Makora

Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
Burke
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 621
Joined: July 25, 2002, 3:13 pm

Post by Burke »

Anyone know when this goes into open Beta?
Voronwë
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 7176
Joined: July 3, 2002, 12:57 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA

Post by Voronwë »

ex-i had some GIJoes
User avatar
Cartalas
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4364
Joined: July 3, 2002, 2:39 pm
Location: Kyoukan's Mouth

Post by Cartalas »

Voronwë wrote:ex-i had some GIJoes
My GI-Joes use to Gangbang my sisters Barbies.
User avatar
Kylere
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 3354
Joined: July 3, 2002, 6:26 pm
Location: Flint, Michigan

Post by Kylere »

You know, when I was in the military I did not think there could ever be any organization as inefficient or as blantantly stupid.

Then I became a civilian and learned the military was actually squared away by comparison. If this missile had been fired by a dtcom company 4 years ago, it would have been called a "High Impact Target Evasion" and gotten the firm 400049994903 billion dollars in venture capital.
She Dreams in Digital
\"Led Zeppelin taught an entire generation of young men how to make love, if they just listen\"- Michael Reed(2005)
vn_Tanc
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2398
Joined: July 12, 2002, 12:32 pm
Location: UK

Post by vn_Tanc »

lol right, cos the military isn't know for it's preposterous official-speak and euphemisms.
A man with a fork
In a world of soup
Image
Post Reply