Sigh

masteen · Post by **masteen** » June 9, 2003, 4:55 pm

One thing I've never understood is why, in these black/white discussions, every black dude with a job eventually gets called an Uncle Tom, and because they don't generally make a Sharpton-esque show of their "African heritage" (I used quotes because they're about as African as I am German) they have no spine.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 4:56 pm

kyoukan wrote:Sorry, I meant I was having a debate, and you were spewing stupid moron bullshit as usual and then you started the attacks on my personal life like you have a fucking clue.

I mean, yeah I could go off and call you a glad handing uncle tom and expouse publically about how a woman could possibly stay married to a man with absolutely no spine, zero dignity and zero pride, but I don't really bother because a) you aren't really worth my time, and b) you really don't why you are such a failure of a person.

Now for the flipside:

In regards to b), why do you think you are an apt judge to determine if Krimson is a failure of a person? I mean, have you met him and equated him against the majority of human beings on this planet who consequently you would also have to of met in order to form a basis of comparison?

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 9, 2003, 4:58 pm

Acies wrote:Now for the flipside:

In regards to b), why do you think you are an apt judge to determine if Krimson is a failure of a person? I mean, have you met him and equated him against the majority of human beings on this planet who consequently you would also have to of met in order to form a basis of comparison?

yes congratulations on reiterating my point.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 5:02 pm

kyoukan wrote:
Acies wrote:Now for the flipside:

In regards to b), why do you think you are an apt judge to determine if Krimson is a failure of a person? I mean, have you met him and equated him against the majority of human beings on this planet who consequently you would also have to of met in order to form a basis of comparison?
yes congratulations on reiterating my point.

Actually hun, that did nothing for your point except hurt it. Allow me to explain:

I mean, yeah I could go off and call you a glad handing uncle tom and expouse publically about how a woman could possibly stay married to a man with absolutely no spine, zero dignity and zero pride, but I don't really bother because a) you aren't really worth my time, and b) you really don't why you are such a failure of a person.

Now, you said you could do these things (call him uncle tom, etc, yatta)
but... you do not really bother etc.
I really do not need to explain this to you further, as I know you get it being anything but stupid.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 9, 2003, 5:07 pm

masteen wrote:One thing I've never understood is why, in these black/white discussions, every black dude with a job eventually gets called an Uncle Tom, and because they don't generally make a Sharpton-esque show of their "African heritage" (I used quotes because they're about as African as I am German) they have no spine.

I don't care whether he has a job or not. It annoys me that in every discussion about racial issues, krimson starts in with the "THERE IS RASICM. NO ONE IS EVER DISCRIMINATED AGAINST. EVERYTHING IS FINE. HOORAY FOR THE STATUS QUO." rhetoric. Every single time. I would call someone an uncle tom when they consistantly act as shameless apologists for a society that is not even 1 full generation removed from a civil rights movement. To continually deny the existance of racial discrimination, or to say it's "not really a problem" either shows extreme ignorance and stupidity or a wide streak of sycophancy.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 5:08 pm

Kyoukan calling a successful black man an uncle tom. You are really showing your leet debating skills there oh mighty oppressed one. I think you just released the dam on everything you have been building on this board the past year. You really are full of shit, you just proved that not even you believe the crap you post.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 5:15 pm

kyoukan wrote:
masteen wrote:One thing I've never understood is why, in these black/white discussions, every black dude with a job eventually gets called an Uncle Tom, and because they don't generally make a Sharpton-esque show of their "African heritage" (I used quotes because they're about as African as I am German) they have no spine.
I don't care whether he has a job or not. It annoys me that in every discussion about racial issues, krimson starts in with the "THERE IS RASICM. NO ONE IS EVER DISCRIMINATED AGAINST. EVERYTHING IS FINE. HOORAY FOR THE STATUS QUO." rhetoric. Every single time. I would call someone an uncle tom when they consistantly act as shameless apologists for a society that is not even 1 full generation removed from a civil rights movement. To continually deny the existance of racial discrimination, or to say it's "not really a problem" either shows extreme ignorance and stupidity or a wide streak of sycophancy.

You are deluded if you really think the white man has a conspiracy to hold teh coloreds down. I never said racism no longer exists, matter of fact, I said it will never go away. I simply stated that from my own experiences as an adult, that I have never been denied a promotion or a job simply because I am black. Heaven forbid someone get somewhere in this world on their merrits and hard work, could it be kyoukan, that the reason you are a failure is simply because you simply suck as a human being, and not because you are a minority? If your insane ramblings on this board are any indication of who you are as a person in real life, no wonder you are bitter and a failure in life. Here is a hint, blame yourself instead of teh white man, you may get employed that way. Look at your calender, it's 2003, not 1953. Much has changed for the better as far as racial equality. No wait, there is a conspiracy, the white man made me successful to get me on their side, it's a crrrrrraaaaaazy plan, but it's true!

You are a sad example of what hate can do to the other color. I hope you are proud of yourself, because we are not. Krimson shoots, he scores, game over, go blame the white man, it's what you are best at.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 5:16 pm

Ah, I see.

I agree with Kyoukan on that point:
There is racial descrimination, certainly within this country. There are of course exceptions to this rule, but over-all I agree it is a problem. If it wasn't, then I could walk around Martin Luther King Dr. in Oakland screaming racist remarks and not get shot at.

This is simply not the case, as well you can imagine

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 5:20 pm

Acies wrote:Ah, I see.

I agree with Kyoukan on that point:
There is racial descrimination, certainly within this country. There are of course exceptions to this rule, but over-all I agree it is a problem. If it wasn't, then I could walk around Martin Luther King Dr. in Oakland screaming racist remarks and not get shot at.

This is simply not the case, as well you can imagine

That's right Acies, I see more racial hatred from blacks to whites than I do anything. How do I know? I have a whole family tree, and guess what, they are black. I have firends, you got it, they are black. I hear more racist conspiracy shit from my own family and friends that are black than I ever do from the white people I am around. You are absolutely right Acies, racism is out there to stay, it just plays the field with no allegiance.

This hatred comes from 200 years of oppression, I understand where it comes from, I just choose to not take part in it. You can either point the finger and be pissed off about 200 years of history, or you can honor your people that were part of that unfair system and be successful, I chose to be successful in this country built on the backs of my people, with a footnote of never forgetting.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 5:31 pm

Krimson Klaw wrote:
Acies wrote:Ah, I see.

I agree with Kyoukan on that point:
There is racial descrimination, certainly within this country. There are of course exceptions to this rule, but over-all I agree it is a problem. If it wasn't, then I could walk around Martin Luther King Dr. in Oakland screaming racist remarks and not get shot at.

This is simply not the case, as well you can imagine
That's right Acies, I see more racial hatred from blacks to whites than I do anything. How do I know? I have a whole family tree, and guess what, they are black. I have firends, you got it, they are black. I hear more racist conspiracy shit from my own family and friends that are black than I ever do from the white people I am around. You are absolutely right Acies, racism is out there to stay, it just plays the field with no allegiance.

This hatred comes from 200 years of oppression, I understand where it comes from, I just choose to not take part in it. You can either point the finger and be pissed off about 200 years of history, or you can honor your people that were part of that unfair system and be successful, I chose to be successful in this country built on the backs of my people, with a footnote of never forgetting.

Then that is absolutely commendable. To be honest, I really do not care what color is on someone's skin. If anything, we all bleed red, which is good enough for me (though I may be racist against aliens.. I dunno

).
However, YOUR view is the exception, and generally so is mine. There are people out there that still think of African Americans as (excuse me for this) niggers and whites as devils. Fortunately, they are all gonna die of old age soon enough

VariaVespasa · Post by **VariaVespasa** » June 9, 2003, 5:37 pm

Acies- lemme see if I got that straight- The idea that you cant run around on Martin Luther King Drive and act like a racist without being censured (shot at) for it is proof to you that racism still exists??? People trying to stop you behaving in a racist way would sorta be proof of the opposite wouldnt it?.... Bozo.

Of course racism still exists, although less so than it used to, but that example is ludicrous as proof.

*Hugs*
Varia

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 5:39 pm

VariaVespasa wrote:Acies- lemme see if I got that straight- The idea that you cant run around on Martin Luther King Drive and act like a racist without being censured (shot at) for it is proof to you that racism still exists??? People trying to stop you behaving in a racist way would sorta be proof of the opposite wouldnt it?.... Bozo.

Of course racism still exists, although less so than it used to, but that example is ludicrous as proof.

*Hugs*
Varia

Lol yea, that would be a nice staurday night live skit.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 5:41 pm

VariaVespasa wrote:Acies- lemme see if I got that straight- The idea that you cant run around on Martin Luther King Drive and act like a racist without being censured (shot at) for it is proof to you that racism still exists??? People trying to stop you behaving in a racist way would sorta be proof of the opposite wouldnt it?.... Bozo.

Of course racism still exists, although less so than it used to, but that example is ludicrous as proof.

*Hugs*
Varia

Actually Varia, the principle of "turning the other cheek" applies. You see I COULD do it if nobody gave a shit about the words or felt offended. They would only be able to laugh and brush me off if they really didn't care enough to blow my brains out.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 5:45 pm

Acies wrote:
VariaVespasa wrote:Acies- lemme see if I got that straight- The idea that you cant run around on Martin Luther King Drive and act like a racist without being censured (shot at) for it is proof to you that racism still exists??? People trying to stop you behaving in a racist way would sorta be proof of the opposite wouldnt it?.... Bozo.

Of course racism still exists, although less so than it used to, but that example is ludicrous as proof.

*Hugs*
Varia
Actually Varia, the principle of "turning the other cheek" applies. You see I COULD do it if nobody gave a shit about the words or felt offended. They would only be able to laugh and brush me off if they really didn't care enough to blow my brains out.

Acies, let me give you some free advice, as enlightened as I am, not even I would hesitate to kick your ass if you said something racist to me. Maybe you could get away with that in another 200 years or so, but anytime soon and you will be getting a foot to face technique performed on you. The words are too painful to ever be laughed at.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 5:54 pm

OMG, do you actually *think* that I would march down anywhere and scream racial obseneties? It was all a hypethetical scenario, god damn...

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 5:57 pm

Acies wrote:OMG, do you actually *think* that I would march down anywhere and scream racial obseneties? It was all a hypethetical scenario, god damn...

I would hope not. I am basically saying you can't use your example as a census on racism. You just can't.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 5:59 pm

Ahhh, I see. Okay, well what would use use then?

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 6:12 pm

Acies wrote:Ahhh, I see. Okay, well what would use use then?

That's a difficult question. Blacks tend to exaggerate on racist claims, and whites tend to think they are not racist, but in the same breath say their daughter can't date any minorities (the I'm better than you factor).

I don't see how an accurate census on racism can be done, it's all a matter of perspective.

Acies · Post by **Acies** » June 9, 2003, 6:30 pm

Heh, if and when I have a daughter and she decides to date anyone, black or white, I will judge him only by personality and not looks.
If he is a mac playa, then he dies. If he is a jock with a hard on he dies. If he tries to touch my daughter in anyway beyond first base, he dies.
I am an equal opportunist really

Raistin · Post by **Raistin** » June 9, 2003, 7:45 pm

Krimson is good people. He and leeroie can stay at my place anytime they need a place to stay!

Willowwing · Post by **Willowwing** » June 9, 2003, 9:13 pm

What makes someone of color? I mean according to ky im white but im not im italian and growing up in an all black neighborhood I was never considered white. If you say european thats wrong because spain is part of Europe and that's hispanic. Supposedly it's anglo-saxon but judging anyone on their race is dumb. More and more I see more color lines being crossed. Growing up in my neighborhood even though I was cool with everyone when my mom found out I was dating a black girl she flipped as did the girl's mom. It was funny to me how it's ok to a point. My wife is totally white but that's not why I love her. I have to explain slang all the time to her. Racism is just plain dumb period. Blaming another race for you not succeeding is even more dumb. If you want to succeed you will plain and simple. Our country and society still have a ways to go as far as growing up with racism and sexism. 2cp

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » June 9, 2003, 10:24 pm

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SET UP A BANK ACCOUNT AND I WILL SEE YOUR US DOLLAR MADE HAPPY, RIGHT? OK. OK, RIGHT, HERE WE GO! SEND 5 US DOLLAR CURRENCY TO THIS ADDRESS:

101 E. TOUGH HOOD LN
PROVO, UT
91FUCKO

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PSS: I DO NOT CONSIDER MYSELF WHITE?

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 9, 2003, 11:11 pm

Damn Canelek, you just had to go ruin my high from owning Kyoukan didnt ya. That post made my head hurt.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » June 9, 2003, 11:15 pm

Sorry, Krimson, I could not help myself, yes?

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 9, 2003, 11:40 pm

You have a funny definition of owning someone. But then I guess we have already established the fact that your are a moron with an incredible naive and painfully deluded outlook on reality.

I don't blame anyone for anything in my life because I live in a society where I generally don't have to. I probably made more money last year than you will make in the next three (there goes your other "theory" about me being a failure in life and can't get a job) all on my own merits. You probably got to where you are by calling your boss "massa" and shining his shoes. You certainly have the mentality for that kind of work.

My only argument is that racial and gender discrimination is still a serious issue, and that white males in most cases are the only social class that never have to worry about it. And ignoring it isn't going to make it go away. Your only argument is that I suck and am stupid. And then you say that I can't debate.

OMG OWNED WOW I'M SO FUCKING BRILLIANT AND SMART I AM GOING TO ANNOUNCE MY GREATNESS EVERY TIME I TOTALLY FUCKING OWN YOU BECAUSE LOL I'M SO CLEVER. OWNED LOL

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:13 am

Was that a come back? I believe you make a lota money and don't suck irl, no, really. I see when the going gets tough, the stupid use caps again, eh Kyoukan? I missed that gem. Welcome back, her name be's stupid. You are so owned on this thread it's scary. Go back to counting your millions, rofl.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 10, 2003, 12:18 am

I knew you would focus on the caps again and not what is being said. gee you really are owning me.

I think I hear miss daisy calling you, better get your hat on and warm up the car.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:19 am

Affirmative action got me my millions you uncle tom!

As for concentrating on the non caps, my first post was me agreeing with you about white males not understanding, but your crotch clammed up faster than shit at the opportunity to flip it to me being an uncle tom. I am not a millionaire, but I get by!

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 10, 2003, 12:21 am

now you're just babbling

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:22 am

And you are the sore losing kid that lost a fight but still won't go home. Shoo!

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 10, 2003, 12:32 am

What exact argument did I lose? Please restate for clarity because I am fairly certain that you aren't going to find many people that agree with your postulation that discrimination isn't a problem in America.

All you've really said is LOL KYOUKAN FAILS AT LIFE AND SUCKS AND LOL I JUST OWNED YOU.

And yes I am aware I just used many capital letters there. Restating the obvious also does not count as "owning me."

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:34 am

kyoukan wrote:What exact argument did I lose? Please restate for clarity because I am fairly certain that you aren't going to find many people that agree with your postulation that discrimination isn't a problem in America.

All you've really said is LOL KYOUKAN FAILS AT LIFE AND SUCKS AND LOL I JUST OWNED YOU.

And yes I am aware I just used many capital letters there. Restating the obvious also does not count as "owning me."

And all you have said is those that don't join the black panthers are uncle toms. Ok you have firmly established that you suck irl and blame your failures on white males, so why do you keep posting. We get it already. You are out of your league here, go back to the Bush slamming threads. Outside of your household, the globe does not revolve around eskimos. Grown ups are talking here, get lost. Bar none the most racist minority I have ever had the dishonor of meeting.

Where is your normal band of Kyoukan supporters? They are agreeing with me, that's where. This is one topic that you are truly insane on. No one is saying there is no discrimination in this country, if they did I missed it. All I am saying is I don't let it run my life and wear 200 years of slavery on my sleeve like you think I should, piss off and go make mud pies kid.

-edit and common sense tells you that if me bringing light to your stupid use of caps offends you, then you should stop doing it.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 10, 2003, 12:38 am

Krimson Klaw wrote:And all you have said is those that don't join the black panthers are uncle toms.

I did? Where did I state or even mildly infer that? Please provide relevant quotes where I said anything even remotely to that effect.

Ok you have firmly established that you suck irl and blame your failures on white males, so why do you keep posting. We get it already. You are out of your league here, go back to the Bush slamming threads. Outside of your household, the globe does not revolve around eskimos. Grown ups are talking here, get lost. Bar none the most racist minority I have ever had the dishonor of meeting.

Where did I blame anything on anyone? Are you even reading the same thread? Are you a moron? I don't even fucking know where you are getting this from? What is this about eskimos?

Good lord you're just ranting like a crazy person now.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:45 am

Backpeddling does not suit you, stay on the clumsy attack, at least I'm used to that. I've met some racist and stupid people in my life, but you take the cake girl.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 10, 2003, 12:49 am

where am I backpedalling? I have asked you 3 times now to clarify what you think I am even arguing about and I have asked you 3 times to stay on the fucking topic and you have failed to do even that. You just keep ranting and ranting about nothing while I plead for you to address my points.

Do you honestly think you look like anything but a babbling fool?

Jesus christ you are the black Cartalas. Although I am sure he is horrified to learn there is a minority version of himself.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:50 am

Going to bed now.Kyou, please come up with something better than all white males hate you cause you are a minority, and they'll never understand your plight (ok that part I agree with). I want to own you on something different in the morning, don't dissapoint please.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » June 10, 2003, 12:53 am

when did I say that?

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 1:09 am

Ok seriously, you did not, I was over-simplfying some of your posts for arguments sake. I just think some people are too quick to label things as racist or discriminatory. I've seen the extreme side of racism first hand. My best friend and I have had to defend ourselves from 4 white guys just because we were black. I've actually had 2 white guys come into my house while my parents were at work, and had to fight them out, all because I was the *nigger* in their neighborhood. I've seen real racism, fought through it, and am still here. Just be careful on what you label racist or discrimination or you risk watering down the real cases. I am blunt because i have had to fight through the extremes. I am cautious on where I place my labels is all. You can disagree with that if you like, call me an uncle tom etc.

Ok for real, off to bed this time, night.

Kelgar · Post by **Kelgar** » June 10, 2003, 7:07 am

Black Cartalas!!!1!

OMG, now them's fightin' words!

Kelgar · Post by **Kelgar** » June 10, 2003, 7:14 am

BTW, unofficial rule of flaming:
Saying anywhere in your own post that you so owned someone, in actuality, means you didn't.

I didn't make that up. It's just a general observation that is pretty much agreed upon by almost everyone (exceptions being the ones guilty of doing the above mentioned).

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » June 10, 2003, 7:40 am

Can someone enlighten this Eurowhitey as to the meaning and origin of some of the vernacular here?
Specifically, wtf is an uncle tom and can someone explain the term "cracker".

Then perhaps I can do a cultural exchange of the UK slang equivalents and we can all have a good chuckle about nations divided by a common language

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 10, 2003, 9:37 am

"Uncle Tom" is a term from a book called "Uncle Tom's Cabin" where the character (if i recall correctly) Uncle Tom is a slave who is actually allied with the Slaveowner. It is set in the pre-civil war Southern US.

even if that is not 100% accurate, that is more or less the important point. Basically an "uncle Tom" is a black person who doesnt stick up for other black people, but is instead allied with "the man".

As for the origin of the word "Cracker", i don't know.

i'm looking that one up!

ok no conclusive explanation of the origin of the term "cracker" from my 5 minutes of research.

several competing theories, none with any significant backing though.

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » June 10, 2003, 9:49 am

Then I guess the equivalent slang in the UK is (or was) "bounty bar" after the local chocolate-coated coconut confection. Brown on the outside etc.

Keep working on the "cracker" thing!

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » June 10, 2003, 10:05 am

kyoukan wrote:where am I backpedalling? I have asked you 3 times now to clarify what you think I am even arguing about and I have asked you 3 times to stay on the fucking topic and you have failed to do even that. You just keep ranting and ranting about nothing while I plead for you to address my points.

Do you honestly think you look like anything but a babbling fool?

Jesus christ you are the black Cartalas. Although I am sure he is horrified to learn there is a minority version of himself.

Hmm now that was a lame attempt to drag me into this. Im starting to get the feeling that Kyoukan might be the racist here.

Estrosiath · Post by **Estrosiath** » June 10, 2003, 10:13 am

In a world where everyone wants equality, any kind of parade flaunting your difference is a paradox.

As for the good old 'You're a middle class white male, you don't know what you are talking about' that is just as much a stereotype as any you can come up with about black people, asiatic people, gays... It is an ignorant comment that really drips of ignorance, and something which I am not used to coming from Kyoukan ( who is always highly polemical and often plays the devil advocate, but never gives up and most always has intelligent arguments ).

I think people forget that racism or discrimination goes both ways. The white people are always the perpetrators, never the butt of such acts. It's so easy... Maybe it was true at one time, but it certainly is not today. I hope you don't think that nowadays, racism is only a white heterosexual middle-class male picking on poor minorities... Because you are sorely mistaken. I will not speak about the situation in the US, since I do not know it. I just happen to know in France, Italy and Switzerland it most certainly is not the case.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » June 10, 2003, 10:30 am

In a world where everyone wants equality, any kind of parade flaunting your difference is a paradox.

BINGO !!!

50 VV's for the pasty mage.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 11:29 am

Owned you, made you look like a moron, made you look stupid, these are all kyoukans catch phrases. So you are saying she never ownes anyone? I'm cool with that.

Cracker, that's the best thing us poor blacks could come up with to battle with witty terms like darkie, nigger, coon, and the like. In short, we get the raw end of the deal, what a poor insult....cracker, ooh, that'll make them teary eyed! I remember as a kid hearing some guy call my dad a nig in traffic, my dad would retaliate with this one or honkey, I was always left feeling anti-climactic, like, that's all you're gonna say to em dad? BTW, where the heck does honkey come from, and what does it mean? I am GUESSING honkey tonk man? Heck I don't know so don't laugh. Anyway, as an adult riding with my dad he used a racial slur against an Indian in front of me and we ended up discussing it for a while, at the end of which he said he'd never do it again, still proud of my dad for that one.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » June 10, 2003, 12:10 pm

It has been my observation that the only people who face discrimination are those expecting to face it, if you work hard, train in the skills your desired job requires and then do the work and do it well, you get ahead.

If you whine like a little child about how unfair the world is all day, you get no where.

Sure racism exists, and it always will exist. I know people of Amerind heritage that are lame on their history, and feel they are not "Indian Enough" and I know Amerinds who feel I do not LOOK "Indian enough". Then there are black people attack darker skinned black people, dark skinned ones who pick on light skinned ones. Japanese who consider the entire world gaijin, French who think the rest of the world is uncultured etc. But the fact is that there will always be closeminded people who are unable to see beyond their smug comfortable version of reality. I am sure there are places with active discrimination, I even dealt with it once being the only guy who was not black in my chain of command in the Army, but it was not viscious, nor was it necessarily intended, it just occured as a minor issue, I never complained, and just worked to be a better soldier and overcame it.

BTW Hang it up Krimson, Kyoukan thinks anyone that does not agree with her is a moron, there is no middle ground, there is no debate. In her little closeminded world there is only her views and morons.

miir · Post by **miir** » June 10, 2003, 12:39 pm

It has been my observation that the only people who face discrimination are those expecting to face it, if you work hard, train in the skills your desired job requires and then do the work and do it well, you get ahead.

That's the biggest load of horseshit I've ever seen you post.... It's very 'metanish'.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » June 10, 2003, 12:52 pm

Funny thing is the argument started when I posted that I agreed with her. She's just a mean millionaire.