GeForce FX 5900 is out!

Aruman · Post by **Aruman** » May 15, 2003, 8:23 pm

Winnow wrote:Here's a non biased article comparing the ATI 9800 256MB to the FX 5900.

Although they are close, they give the edge to the already in stores ATI 9800.

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDcyLDE=

It even talks about drivers for the history buffs.

The comparison was a good one, and to me it seemed the cards outperform each other in different areas, but I think you are letting your bias through in your post Winnow.

While the author says what he would use, I find the following text from this article interesting, and conveniently left out, or you missed it:

One thing we hate to do around here is ride the fence. Currently, given the results we have here, it is hard to firmly suggest one card over the other.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 15, 2003, 8:38 pm

Aruman wrote:
One thing we hate to do around here is ride the fence. Currently, given the results we have here, it is hard to firmly suggest one card over the other.

That's because if they want more nVidia cards to test in the future, they won't firmly recommend anything so they wishy wash their way into not upsetting anyone : ) I found several areas in the article where the reviewer said if he had to choose it would be the ATI 9800.

Aruman · Post by **Aruman** » May 15, 2003, 10:25 pm

I could have written that same article and said I would pick the nVidia card over the 9800, since I don't use my computer strictly for games.

Anyway, all of this changes nothing...

You won't buy anything except ATI.

I won't buy anything except nVidia.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 16, 2003, 1:44 am

Aruman wrote:I could have written that same article and said I would pick the nVidia card over the 9800, since I don't use my computer strictly for games.

Anyway, all of this changes nothing...

You won't buy anything except ATI.

I won't buy anything except nVidia.

Eh? Wrong again! I own GeForce ti4400 @ 4600 and an ATI9700. I like them both. ATI better! but if nVidia makes something better i'll buy it.

Aruman · Post by **Aruman** » May 16, 2003, 3:00 am

Winnow wrote:
Aruman wrote:I could have written that same article and said I would pick the nVidia card over the 9800, since I don't use my computer strictly for games.

Anyway, all of this changes nothing...

You won't buy anything except ATI.

I won't buy anything except nVidia.
Eh? Wrong again! I own GeForce ti4400 @ 4600 and an ATI9700. I like them both. ATI better! but if nVidia makes something better i'll buy it.

Oh, so you are taking up the Slick Willie role... playing both sides.

One think I know I am not wrong about, and that is I will never use an ATI video card in any machine I build for myself. I can guarantee you that.

Go ahead, instigate some more... you know you want to.

noel · Post by **noel** » May 16, 2003, 7:22 am

Voro, please don't judge NVIDIA on MX cards. Those things are horrible pieces of budget trash. Sorry, that's the reality.

As someone that has a Ti4700, and a 9800 at his disposal virtually all the time, I don't think there's a significant difference with either card.

Sure one may score a few frames per second higher in some 3D test, but neither is a significant enough improvement over the other to make me care which one I had.

Pahreyia · Post by **Pahreyia** » May 16, 2003, 8:43 am

Scored a free 5900 from E3. Was disappointed because it wasn't much better than my Ti4700.

Eh.. Free is free, right?

Yo, Aranuil. No love from the PMs anymore?

miir · Post by **miir** » May 16, 2003, 11:25 am

One think I know I am not wrong about, and that is I will never use an ATI video card in any machine I build for myself. I can guarantee you that.

Then what's the point of having a discussion about it?
The ATI supporters seem to have less bias when it comes to opinions on video cards. The nVidia supporters are becoming as blindered as the rabid 3DFX supporters of days gone by.

I use both ATI and nVidia cards myself and I now recommend ATI over nVidia. Before the 9500, nVidia clearly had the better cards. The ti4600 was a kickass product when it came out.

But seriously, when looking at a next generation product (the FX 5800/5900 are next gen cards)... you should aim for a sizeable improvement over the product your competition currently has on the market.

This is not happening for nVidia.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 16, 2003, 2:13 pm

Aruman wrote:
Oh, so you are taking up the Slick Willie role... playing both sides.

I wouldn't call it the Slick Willie role. I'd call it buying the best available product with all things considered. I have no attachment to ATI or nVidia. I should automatically despise ATI because they're canadian yet I don't!

Now, if I owned stock of either, I'd sell my soul and lie my ass off to you to make a buck.

jk...no I'm not...yes I am..no I'm not...yes I am. I'd be out of the stock by the end of the day : )

Sanden · Post by **Sanden** » May 16, 2003, 4:08 pm

Since its my first post here I thought I would throw myself into the fire. I just went through upgrade hell in the last 4 days since my old Ti 200 bit the dust. I first started off with a MSI 4800se , for the life of me I could not get it work on my SiS 648 chip MB. It could have been my 300 watt PS or maybe that my AGP x4 slot wasn't putting out enough power for the newer cards. I took it back and swapped it for a ASUS 5600 pro , well that was a huge mistake. The card was so big I could use it as a surf board and it posted lower 2001 / 2003 scores than the 4800. It also had a nasty problem with just freezing for short periods of time in IE or Outlook.

Well after 3 days of this I swapped the ASUS in for an ATI 9500 pro , even after hearing all the horror stories about the drivers. I spent a day or two on the Rage3d boards picking up some tips and haven't had any problems at all. Basically the ATI drivers are pure crap for gaming so everyone said to use the modified Omegacorner.com drivers for stable game drivers.

The best part about the ATI cards is I can run virtually the exact same FPS in any game as the 4800se but with 4 x AA and 8 x AF turned on

Looks way better with zero performance hit. Also the ATI cards plug straight into your power supply, which is great for people like me who have average MB and cant increase the AGP voltage.

Jackass?

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 16, 2003, 4:21 pm

Sanden wrote:...SiS 648 chip MB... which is great for people like me who have average MB and cant increase the AGP voltage.

I think calling that bargain basement POS "average" is giving yourself too much credit.

Sanden wrote:Jackass?

But definitely, JACKASS!

Sanden · Post by **Sanden** » May 16, 2003, 4:29 pm

From Tom's Hardware.

Summary: MSI Dominates, Elitegroup Underestimated
Even before we began testing, we could have easily assumed that an 850E would be impossible to beat. What's all the more amazing, then, is that the difference is almost zero in several of the benchmarks. The average performance of the five test candidates in 3D games was only modestly behind that of the 850E reference system.

In the benchmarks, it is mostly Elitegroup and MSI that dominate. Elitegroup has a reason to celebrate, because the board is respectably equipped and could easily be counted among the most attractive in terms of price. MSI struts its stuff and equips the 648 Max with Gigabit Ethernet and Bluetooth interface, with the attitude "the sooner the better."

AOpen also offers a balanced product with good features and standard results. For minimalists, the Gigabyte board is still interesting: apart from a sound system, it does not include any additional price-enhancing components.

The SiS chipset made a brave showing, offering a lot of performance for comparatively little money (from about $100). If you look more closely at the high reliability of the SiS648 motherboard, it looks as though the manufacturers have worked more intensely with the SiS chipset. And maybe some of us should do the same!

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 16, 2003, 5:11 pm

Sanden wrote:The SiS chipset made a brave showing...

They say the same thing about the retarded kids that run in the Special Olympics. But you have that keen gig Ethernet port!

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » May 16, 2003, 5:23 pm

miir wrote:Then what's the point of having a discussion about it?
The ATI supporters seem to have less bias when it comes to opinions on video cards. The nVidia supporters are becoming as blindered as the rabid 3DFX supporters of days gone by.

I'm not so much a mindless Nvidia fan than I am a hater of all things ATI. If another company came around and offered an alternative I don't have a problem with not using an Nvidia card.

I've wasted my money on ATI cards before. I won't again. Having to download a compatibility patch to see my desktop doesn't inspire me.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 16, 2003, 6:47 pm

kyoukan wrote:I'm not so much a mindless Nvidia fan than I am a hater of all things ATI.

I used to feel exactly the same way. A buddy of mine has one of the last generation All-in-Wonder cards, and he would continually gush about hwo awesome it was. I took over Q3A and The Sims (I think) to show him how much they sucked for games, but no matter which quake demo I ran or how many free-willed toons I let loose, the fucker wouldn't crash.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 23, 2003, 2:15 pm

Looks like nVidia's popular DAWN demo runs faster on ATI cards than on nVidias:

http://www.rage3d.com/articles/atidawning/

What a shame. Looks like nVidia needs to optimize their demos a little better for their own cards. ATI cards are already running the demo faster than the unreleased N35 card according to the article.

Oh, there's a new ATI card announced for the fall. Bummer. Enjoy your 5900's die hard fans : )

BTW, if you have an ATI9700pro(or 9800), get this DEMO. IT rocks. It was running on a computer in the store room at Fan Faire-Vegas. Most nVidia cards won't run it and if the FX's do, it's slower than their competition.

When I first saw Nvidia’s new GeForce FX Dawn demo I was quite impressed. ATI’s demos done by Alex and the ATI Research crew are of course impressive as well, but the Dawn demo had a certain appeal. Maybe it was the human form, life-like facial expressions, realistic skins tones and texture, or most likely the sexual appeal. So it was disappointing to find out that this magnificent demo would not be able to run on ATI’s DX9 graphic cards. Luckily a group of MIT engineering students were disappointed by the same thing (also rumoured that they were unhappy with Nvidia's image quality and performance) and were up to the task of making it work on ATI hardware (and the brains!). The end result was an opengl wrapper that made the demo run smoothly on ATI hardware. Most impressive!

The following was said about the opengl wrapper:

It runs 15% faster than NV30 on the 9800pro, and it also runs faster than NV35 (we are unable to personally confirm this but a user with both cards and FRAPS could).
Creates higher quality images than the original due to the normalization being done in a fragment program (dp3/rsq/mul) instead of in a normalization cubemap which the FX extensions does directly in hardware
The OpenGL wrapper adds more overhead, as it has to interperet code calls for Nvidia extensions and map them to ATI/ARB extensions, and yet it still runs faster on the ATI card, due to its more sophisticated pixel shader engine.

Vailex Darkfury · Post by **Vailex Darkfury** » May 28, 2003, 12:54 pm

I put together a machine with a SiS chipset. Was pretty disapointed. Had a lot of bells and whistles but wasnt stable at all. Had to drop the clock on the ram.

Ive put together plenty of comps. Eventually I got to the point where stability and solid drivers were more important than time invested in tweaking bios settings and reinstalling drivers to get the comp to work with Just ONE game.

My next machine will most likely have an Nvidia card and an Intel MB in it. I may not get that extra 3 or 4 FPS but that wont bother me much. If Nvidia keeps up their current pricing and marketing scheme they will crumble just like 3dfx did and ATI will take their place. History repeating itself. Maybe ATI will notice the pattern and wont make Nvidia's mistakes.

miir · Post by **miir** » May 28, 2003, 2:21 pm

Maybe ATI will notice the pattern and wont make Nvidia's mistakes.

The sales of ATIs low end chipsets finance the R&D required for the cutting edge cards like the 9800. The vast majority of ATIs profit comes from OEM deals.

ATI has a solid business model and have been around for nearly 20 years.
In reality, nVidia should be trying to avoid making the same mistakes as 3DFX.... interestingy, nVidia's revenue is down almost 40% from last year while ATI has been on a steady upturn of 5-10% over the past 3-4 years.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 28, 2003, 3:49 pm

nVidia is overestimating the power of brand recognition. Most folks couldn't give a shit what kind of card Dell or Gateway uses inside the magic box. As long as it connects to AOL, they're happy.

Gamers are whores. We'll go with whoever pimps out the trickest card (FPS & grafix options) without smacking us around too much (driver support & price).

Searyx · Post by **Searyx** » May 28, 2003, 4:17 pm

<a target="_blank" href="http://www6.tomshardware.com/graphic/20 ... tml">Tom's Hardware Review Conclusion</a>

GeforceFX 5900 Ultra beats the ATI 9800, in their opinion.

Xanupox · Post by **Xanupox** » May 28, 2003, 6:27 pm

Actually this is a rather ignorant discussion.

I have the ATi 9700 Pro and it rocks anything made by Nvidia off this planet.

First, I removed the standard heatsink and also a small copper shim that was around the GPU core.

I installed a Zalman Z80A Heatpipe cooler onto the Graphics Core and applied it with Arctic Silver 3.

I put an 80mm fan on top of the heatsink, installed a PCI slot exhaust fan under the heatsink blowing air out of the back of the PC.

I preformed a voltage modification on the card itself, pumping more power into the core of the GPU using a variable pot resistor and multimeter.

I installed a couple heatsinks on the samsung RAM on the card and also did a small volt mod on the ram chips.

My card runs faster then anything I could have imagined an its only gets to around 40c.

Core is setup at 430 Mhz and the memory is at 355mhz.

My 3DMark03 score with the Cat 3.4 drivers was over 6000

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » May 28, 2003, 6:40 pm

Well that is nice if you know how to do all that stuff. I don't think the average gamer is able to perform those kind of mods to their boards much less be able to afford a fuck up.

Adelrune Argenti · Post by **Adelrune Argenti** » May 28, 2003, 9:24 pm

That is just because Xanupox learned how to do all that from his stint as an Air Force Sniper.

Xanupox · Post by **Xanupox** » May 29, 2003, 11:37 am

Naw no sniping skills needed for this stuff, but you will need a similar steady hand when it comes time to use the soldering iron.

http://www.extremeoverclocking.com/arti ... mod_1.html

Its pretty basic, and if you decide to use the SMD grabber then you wont have to actually solder on the PCB (printed circut board) just on the potentiometer.

more general info here http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/for ... forumid=85

miir · Post by **miir** » May 29, 2003, 11:45 am

I have no idea what the fuck they are saying but doesn't a thread qualify for auto-retard if both Searyx and Xanupox are posting on it?

And does xanupox still have that big cocksucking starwars picture in his sig?

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 29, 2003, 11:46 am

The ridiculous e-Bay auction aside, I have yet to see the FX 5900 for sale anywhere. IMO, silicon > vapor every day of the week.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » May 29, 2003, 12:37 pm

miir wrote:I have no idea what the fuck they are saying but doesn't a thread qualify for auto-retard if both Searyx and Xanupox are posting on it?

And does xanupox still have that big cocksucking starwars picture in his sig?

no Yoda on this thread.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 29, 2003, 2:08 pm

I started building my new computer. Picked up an Abit IC7 Motherboard 800Mhz FSB, P4 2.4C 800MHz CPU Hyper Threading, 2X512MB Corsair PC3500 433MHz DDR No Serial ATA HD yet. (WD80Gig 8MB Cache Special Edition atm) ATI9700Pro for now.

So far, with stock air cooling and only upping the voltage a tad on the memory to 2.8, I've OC'd the 2.4C to 3.2GHz. I'll bump it to a full 1GHz OC @3.4GHz if everything is stable. (time and effort it takes to Overclock = about 45 seconds in the softbios, ...change 200 to 275FSB and hit F10 to save) I think the new Intel 2.4C 800MHz CPUs are actually underclocked 3 or 3.2GHz CPUs as I haven't seen a single person on the nerd forums unable to OC the 2.4c to 3.2GHz with the proper memory. $180.00 for 2.4 or $469 for 3.0GHz cpu that's slower than an OC'd 2.4C...tough decision.)

My Mad Onion scores are hella high. I'm going to get laid for sure with this rig!

Seriously though, with a little effort, you can build a much cheaper and faster computer than Pre-Made ones.
----------------
BTW, to the CTers that whined about OC'ing, I think Aruman was one. My 1.6A OC'd to 2.4GHz is still running stable coming up on 2 years with no problems. Oooh, my CPU is stressed! It might burn out 100 years before yours around the year 2105. The CPU museum will be so dissapointed!

Lexien · Post by **Lexien** » May 29, 2003, 4:55 pm

Winnow think i can OC my pIII 500 to 1 Gig ?

^_^

My vid card is too fast for the processor (GF Ti 4600 128) and my framerate is horrible with No luclin models in all Luclin zones with max clip plane..

I have 512 megs of ram, dunno the brand tho and this is residing on a Intel motherboard that i don't remember off hand the model #.

I could just try to save up and buy a new computer alltogether been wanting to do that for a while just can't seem to muster up enough cash to get me the Ideal one id like to Build myself.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 29, 2003, 5:22 pm

Lexien wrote:Winnow think i can OC my pIII 500 to 1 Gig ?

^_^

My vid card is too fast for the processor (GF Ti 4600 128) and my framerate is horrible with No luclin models in all Luclin zones with max clip plane..

I have 512 megs of ram, dunno the brand tho and this is residing on a Intel motherboard that i don't remember off hand the model #.

I could just try to save up and buy a new computer alltogether been wanting to do that for a while just can't seem to muster up enough cash to get me the Ideal one id like to Build myself.

Unfortunately no. Intel Brand MBs can't be OC'd. If you are going to overlclock you need to do a little research beforehand and buy a MB that has a softbios that is OC friendly (able to adjust voltages and FSB MHz) Other important factors are your memory. You need high quality memory that will enable you to crank up the speed. In the old days, you'd need some serious cooling to OC. Huge fans etc. On some of the new CPUs, all it takes is changing the Front Side Bus MHz as was the case for me. AMD sucks, their CPUs run very hot. Intel P4 chips are much easier to OC. Use some Arctic Silver III thermal grease between your heatsink and the CPU instead of the crap thermal pad that comes with the retail Intel CPUs and you will lower the temp of your CPU by 6-7C.

There are lots of good sites and forums on the net which discuss Overclocking. If you're new to it, you can read the forums and find what combinations were most successful/reliable OCs and then buy the same parts and do it yourself.

Lexien · Post by **Lexien** » May 29, 2003, 6:33 pm

Thanks

I am not new to building pcs (more like putting them together i mean)

But overclocking and getting my hands dirty, yes, i would be new to that.

Xanupox · Post by **Xanupox** » May 30, 2003, 11:10 am

P4 2.4B is prolly the best bang for the buck right now. I have mine overclocked in a very old case and poor air flow, to 3.0Ghz now. I didnt even have to adjust the voltage. The heatsink is standard Intel.

I also have a true HT 3.0 up to 3.4Ghz. Thats a lot of money though to get the .4 Ghz more, but it does have Hyper Threading (which is underutilized now)

Gigabyte or Asus boards seem to be the best for OCing. I picked up the PE667 from Gigabyte for the 2.4B chip. Its smooth as silk.

Lexien · Post by **Lexien** » May 30, 2003, 11:44 am

Ohh thanks for the nice sugestions Xanupox.

I'll be looking into abit and Gigabit mb's and also for that 2.4b processor.

And what's the best memory?

Kingston, corsair, or something else??

Since we were talking about video cards if i keep my GForce 4 TI 4600 AGP 2x will it be good enough for a while or would i need to get one with agp 4x or 8 x maybe?

For the rest i kinda know what to get anyways, so all i need now is the cash.. hehe or maybe get a 24 month lease thing going lol

How does that look? it's from http://www.directpc.ca

Our Price : Cdn $2261 US $1615

Warranty 1 1-Year Limited Warranty
Motherboard 1 Giga-Byte GA-8SQ800
Processor 1 Intel Pentium 4 2.4 Ghz 512K Cache 533Mhz Fsb
Memory 2 2x512MB DDR 400 Mhz PC3200 (1.02 Gb Total)
Hard Drive 1 80 Gb - 7200 Rpm 8Mb
DVD-ROM or CD-ROM Drive 1 16X Dvd-Rom
CD-RW DRIVE 1 52x24x52 Cd-Rw
Video Card 1 Geforce FX5200 128 Mb AGP 8x Tv-Out
Sound Card 1 Creative Sound Blaster Live 5.1
Network Card 1 10/100 Mb Network Integrated
Floppy Drive 1 1.44 Mb Floppy Disk Drive
Power Supply 1 450Watt Atx Power Supply
Case 1 21 Inch Thermaltake 6000 - Aluminium - Temp Control - Usb - I1394 - 5 Fans
Keyboard and Mouse 1 Microsoft Multimedia Keyboard W/Optical Mouse
Speakers 1 Altec Lansing 251 5-Pc 90W
Case accessories 1 Neon Light Sound sensitive ( Blue )
Operating Systems (OS) 1 Microsoft Windows Xp Home Edition
Monitor CRT - 19" 1 19-Inch Nec As95F .20Mm Flat

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 30, 2003, 11:52 am

Micron also makes good memory.

http://www.crucial.com

Pubin · Post by **Pubin** » May 30, 2003, 12:50 pm

I get my kicks above the waistline sunshine.

I think it is important to note that one can purchase a full 2ghz system with an AMD processor for the price of one of these silly cards. Monitor included.

Lexien · Post by **Lexien** » May 30, 2003, 1:21 pm

I'll try and compare prices for amd system with the equivalent.

thanks for the tip

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 30, 2003, 2:25 pm

Xanupox wrote:P4 2.4B is prolly the best bang for the buck right now. I have mine overclocked in a very old case and poor air flow, to 3.0Ghz now. I didnt even have to adjust the voltage. The heatsink is standard Intel.

I also have a true HT 3.0 up to 3.4Ghz. Thats a lot of money though to get the .4 Ghz more, but it does have Hyper Threading (which is underutilized now)

Gigabyte or Asus boards seem to be the best for OCing. I picked up the PE667 from Gigabyte for the 2.4B chip. Its smooth as silk.

I would highly recommend getting the 2.4C over the 2.4B at this point. Newegg has it for 185.00 right now (vs 161.00 for 2.4b). With the 2.4C you get Hyper Threading, 800MHz BUS and almost assured OC to 3.2MHz air cooled over the 2.4b sketchy at best 3.0GHz. Well worth the $24.00 IMO. Always remember, you need the proper motherboard and memory for OC'ing.

I would also look into the Abit IC7 or IC7-G MB for OCing. the board design is the best I've ever seen and I've seen a lot of MBs. The OC options in the Bios are plentiful and easy to access.

Lexien · Post by **Lexien** » May 30, 2003, 4:39 pm

I will take that in to consideration Winnow thank you.

And by air cooling you mean just multiple fans with a clip-on heatsink and fan?? Like thermal-take heatsink fan?

Also are the new GFX chip set from nvidia really worth it over the GF4 ?

And does ATI really kick Nvidia's ass? Cuz i saw some prices (cdn funds) and they were mostly the same for some 9000, to 9700 ati radeon cards compared to the new GFX and stuff or GF4.

Xanupox · Post by **Xanupox** » May 30, 2003, 10:18 pm

I would check on the value of a ATI 9700 Pro over that FX Card, not sure how much they were charging you for that one, but ATIs latest drivers 3.4s really kick ass.

The 2.4b or 2.4c are both good, but not sure that motherboard will support the 800FSB.. the extra you would have to spend on a 800FSB board makes the 24 dollar differnce in the two processors quite a bit more. I am familiar with the board you picked out, I have the 2nd version of that board its called the GA-1394SINXP, or 8SQ800 Ultra2.

I use Corair memory, DDR-3500XMS CAS2, its nice and fast and has heatsinks already installed, plus Corsiar offers lifetime warranties.

Also make sure your power supply is not generic. Get a name brand its only a few dollars more but power flow and voltage even on all "rails" is so important, I shop at http://www.monarchcomputer.com they have some good examples of top notch components to base your decision on check them out. My power supply is Enermax Dualswitching.

Searyx · Post by **Searyx** » May 30, 2003, 10:25 pm

Overclocking is retarded. Almost as retarded as Xanupox.

Metanis · Post by **Metanis** » June 2, 2003, 6:42 pm

I want to replace my wife's Dell P991 19" monitor with an similar size and quality LCD display capable of 1280 x 1024. Her existing system is running a GEForce3 TI500, but I want a new monitor to "go forward" to a new system I plan on buying her soon.

Any recommendations for a good "gamer" 17 to 19" LCD that won't cost me a thousand bucks? I'd be willing to pay about $600 for one. I'm more concerned that it will work with the next generation of games coming along like EQ2 and WOW...

A short period of research today indicates that the Pixel Refresh Rate is important for gamers, but then none of the review sites list that spec for easy comparison.

I may be partial to NEC because my company has an Employee purchase arrangement with them, but the NEC equipment stats appear to be mediocre at best.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » June 3, 2003, 11:10 am

Tom's revently reviewed a bunch of 17 inch LCDs. Feel the wisdom.

Metanis · Post by **Metanis** » June 3, 2003, 6:58 pm

masteen wrote:Tom's revently reviewed a bunch of 17 inch LCDs. Feel the wisdom.

Thanks for the link, based on that article I just ordered the NEC LCD1760V for $449 (incl shipping) thru NM-Select.

VeeshanVault

GeForce FX 5900 is out!

Hi

Re: Hi

thanks

Re: thanks

ATI owns all

No Sniping ....

.

Re: .

Just from looking at your system

What about the display panel?