9/11 victims awarded damages against Iraq

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Brotha
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9/11 victims awarded damages against Iraq

Post by Brotha »

http://www.upi.com/view.cfm?StoryID=200 ... 4105-7452r
WASHINGTON, May 7 (UPI) -- A federal judge in New York Wednesday awarded damages against the government of Iraq after ruling that the families of two victims of the Sept. 11, 2001, suicide hijackings had shown "albeit barely" that Iraq had provided material support to Osama bin Laden and al-Qaida.

Judge Harold Baer ruled that the two families were entitled to $104 million compensation from Iraq, bin Laden, al-Qaida, the Taliban movement and their government of Afghanistan. He had entered a default judgment against these defendants on Dec. 23, 2002, after they failed to show up to contest the case.

But he dismissed the families' suit against deposed Iraqi President Saddam Hussein on the basis that -- as head of state -- he enjoyed absolute immunity.

Lawyers for the two families said they would attempt to recover the money from the $1.7 billion in Iraqi assets frozen in the United States, and victims' relatives involved in a separate lawsuit against the Saudi government said it was an important precedent.

Baer, in a written decision released Wednesday by the U.S. District Court in Manhattan, said that the standard of proof required for the case was much lower than that in a normal civil action, because the defendants did not contest the case.

Even so, he said that the families had only scraped over the evidential bar, referred to in a quotation from the relevant legislation as "evidence satisfactory to the court."

"Plaintiffs have shown, albeit barely, 'by evidence satisfactory to the court' that Iraq provided material support to bin Laden and al-Qaida."

Baer said that most of the evidence the families had tried to introduce -- such as TV interviews with unidentified Iraqi defectors -- was "classically hearsay" or even "multiple hearsay" -- second or third hand. He said his decision was based only on the opinion testimony of the families' two expert witnesses, former CIA Director James Woolsey Jr., and author Laurie Mylroie.

"I think that in many respects, al-Qaida acts as a front for Iraqi intelligence ... Iraq provides the direction, the training and the expertise," Mylroie told the court.

Woolsey was more circumspect. "I believe it is definitely more likely than not that some degree of common effort in the sense of aiding and abetting or conspiracy was involved (in the Sept. 11 attacks) between Iraq and al-Qaida," he said.

It remained unclear how much money the families might actually receive, attorney Slade McLaughlin told United Press International.

"Although the president has recently indicated he's earmarked that ($1.7 billion in frozen assets) to help rebuild Iraq, he did set aside $300 million to pay any judgments outstanding against the old government there," he said.

He added that $118 million of that had been paid out recently to the so-called "human shields" from the 1991 Gulf War, and that he hoped to be able to secure the whole $104 million for his clients from the remainder "in short order."

McLaughlin said he hoped President Bush would be sympathetic to their appeal, "because we're the first people to prove what he's been saying all along -- that Iraq was involved in Sept. 11."

Michael Dempsey, who was injured whilst evacuating the second tower and represents a group of victims and their families who are suing the Saudi government in a separate case, told UPI the case was a "symbolic precedent," and said he was encouraged by the result.

"My concern," he said, "is how to collect on the judgment."

Lawyers said the case might create a wave of litigation against the former Iraqi regime.

"A lot depends on what happens with our attempts to get paid," said McLaughlin. "A lot of people will have their interest piqued if we get paid ... If we're not successful -- and I do think we will get paid -- but if we don't, I think that will discourage people."
I couldn't stop laughing when I read this part:
Judge Harold Baer ruled that the two families were entitled to $104 million compensation from Iraq, bin Laden, al-Qaida, the Taliban movement and their government of Afghanistan. He had entered a default judgment against these defendants on Dec. 23, 2002, after they failed to show up to contest the case.
It's just like Bin Laden to not show up for court...NO RESPECT!

I'm really suprised a judge would actually rule that Iraq owes 9/11 victim's families money, I'm sure a bunch of people are going to make a big fuss about this.
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Post by Xouqoa »

that's pretty stupid...
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Post by kyoukan »

If Bush and Cheney can use 911 as an excuse to grow their personal fortunes I fail to see why these people can't.
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Post by Animalor »

Greedy fucks milking their loved ones deaths.
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Post by Akaran_D »

Dude, if my family had the brains to do this, I'd give them full credit.
I would honestly be happy if they managed to get somthing out of my death.
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Post by Spangaloid_PE »

isn't that what life insurance does?
Last edited by Spangaloid_PE on May 8, 2003, 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Kelgar »

What a fucking joke.

Figures that the US has over 50% of the world's lawyers.
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Post by Korell »

Just proves to show you... if we can't find you.. we will still SUE THE CRAP OUT OF YOU. Its the american way it seems these days.
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Post by Krimson Klaw »

Kelgar wrote:What a fucking joke.

Figures that the US has over 50% of the world's lawyers.
I think that has something to do with everyone in America having *a right to an attorney, if you cannot afford one, one will be appointed to you*.

Just a guess.
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Post by Kelshara »

That case symbolizes everything that is wrong with the justice system heh..
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Post by Voronwë »

Krimson Klaw wrote:
Kelgar wrote:What a fucking joke.

Figures that the US has over 50% of the world's lawyers.
I think that has something to do with everyone in America having *a right to an attorney, if you cannot afford one, one will be appointed to you*.

Just a guess.
you dont have the right to an attorney in a civil case like this one (where damages are awarded). and you only have the right to an attorney if you are the defendant against the government in a case.

it is a joke regardless. Kind of like this stupid bitch who sued the school board because she didnt want to share Valedictorian with 2 other kids. Nevermind that her Daddy is a federal judge and undoubtedly is using his influence to get the absurd case heard.
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Post by Wulfran »

sooo... how are these people going to collect? do they get the first couple millions barrels Iraq produces, when they get everything back on line over there?

I'd also like to se the evidence they used linking OBL and Iraq... I haven't seen anything in the press that I would call anything beyond supposition, but then I'm not a judge or even a lawyer...
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Post by miir »

Wulfran wrote:I'd also like to se the evidence they used linking OBL and Iraq... I haven't seen anything in the press that I would call anything beyond supposition, but then I'm not a judge or even a lawyer...

Listen motherfucker... George W Bush says that Iraq was linked to al Qaeda... you're an anti american terrorist supporter if you don't believe him. The word of George W Bush is taken as law in an American court.


Evidence?
Fuck the evidence...
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Post by Toshira »

Voronwë wrote:
Krimson Klaw wrote:
Kelgar wrote:What a fucking joke.

Figures that the US has over 50% of the world's lawyers.
I think that has something to do with everyone in America having *a right to an attorney, if you cannot afford one, one will be appointed to you*.

Just a guess.
you dont have the right to an attorney in a civil case like this one (where damages are awarded). and you only have the right to an attorney if you are the defendant against the government in a case.

it is a joke regardless. Kind of like this stupid bitch who sued the school board because she didnt want to share Valedictorian with 2 other kids. Nevermind that her Daddy is a federal judge and undoubtedly is using his influence to get the absurd case heard.
I think Krimson was merely referring to the actual number of lawyers that exist in the United States, not the types of cases where you recieve a court-appointed attorney.

And on a different note, with the exception of class-action lawsuits, it really takes a specific CLIENT to make a case. Blaming the lawyers and saying they "create cases" is a tad foolish.
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Post by Soriathus Serpentine »

The sad part here is that 104 million dollars was awarded to 2 people's families of 1.7 billion of the countries assets. That's a little over 6% of the countries assets. All we need is about 16 more people to file similar lawsuits based on judicial presidence and Iraq will be bancrupt.

Give me a friggin break, yeah go ahead and rebuilt your country with no money, see how far it gets you. Moron judges...
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Post by Fairweather Pure »

do they get the first couple millions barrels Iraq produces, when they get everything back on line over there?
That would imply that the oil is Iraq's, which is arguable at best.
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Post by Adelrune Argenti »

Soriathus Serpentine wrote:The sad part here is that 104 million dollars was awarded to 2 people's families of 1.7 billion of the countries assets. That's a little over 6% of the countries assets. All we need is about 16 more people to file similar lawsuits based on judicial presidence and Iraq will be bancrupt.

Give me a friggin break, yeah go ahead and rebuilt your country with no money, see how far it gets you. Moron judges...
Read again. The 1.7 Billion is from assets within US jurisdiction that was seized from Iraqi accounts. This is by no means a sizable portion of the wealth Saddam had. This is only the money we could get to. Several other countries have also frozen the assets of Iraq that were in their banks.
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Post by Sabek »

Soriathus Serpentine wrote:The sad part here is that 104 million dollars was awarded to 2 people's families of 1.7 billion of the countries assets. That's a little over 6% of the countries assets. All we need is about 16 more people to file similar lawsuits based on judicial presidence and Iraq will be bancrupt.

Give me a friggin break, yeah go ahead and rebuilt your country with no money, see how far it gets you. Moron judges...
That 1.7b is Iraq's assets in the US not in the entire world.
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Post by Forthe »

I expect Osama and Sadam to launch a joint appeal against the infidels. This will surely prove they are working together.
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Post by Voronwë »

Tosh: i seriously doubt that public defenders make up a large percentage of the lawyers in this country.

it is all the corporate type lawyers that jack that number up. The fact that to conduct any significant business transaction, you need to have a lawyer.

to die you need to have a lawyer.

to buy a house you need to have a lawyer, etc.
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