A real man speaks out

Revs · Post by **Revs** » May 7, 2003, 10:45 pm

I wonder if he ever made it out alive

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » May 7, 2003, 10:49 pm

Ahahahaha that picture rocks

especially if it's real

Fovol · Post by **Fovol** » May 7, 2003, 10:49 pm

Haha, that's awesome.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » May 7, 2003, 10:50 pm

Yes I chuckled, guess I'm a bad man.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » May 7, 2003, 10:53 pm

I think it is funny only because protesters make me all giggly

Post by **Xouqoa** » May 7, 2003, 11:13 pm

bahahahaha

Rianna · Post by **Rianna** » May 7, 2003, 11:22 pm

ROFL, thats hilarious

Kithyen · Post by **Kithyen** » May 7, 2003, 11:37 pm

Lol, gold. Took me a sec to catch the sign.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 8, 2003, 12:24 am

lol : )

Axien_Dellusions · Post by **Axien_Dellusions** » May 8, 2003, 12:57 am

hehe that man's car is going to get covered with tampons or maxi pads if he isn't careful.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » May 8, 2003, 3:05 am

Women expect certain things from men.
Men expect certain things from women.

If you don't give up on both sides there is no point in protesting.

If your a stay at home mom then you need to do 8 hours housework incl the kids...but when kids are in school you sit on your ass all day and expect us to be a father at night.

If your expecting us to pay for dinenr don't complain about wage descrepencies.

Just my 2 cents, flame away.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » May 8, 2003, 3:26 am

Pilsburry wrote:Women expect certain things from men.
Men expect certain things from women.

If you don't give up on both sides there is no point in protesting.

If your a stay at home mom then you need to do 8 hours housework incl the kids...but when kids are in school you sit on your ass all day and expect us to be a father at night.

If your expecting us to pay for dinenr don't complain about wage descrepencies.

Just my 2 cents, flame away.

Not really an intentional flame, but I think you missed to humor in this post entirely. Let go of the hate and anger and frustration. It clothes you like a cheap suit man.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 8, 2003, 3:31 am

Canelek wrote:
Pilsburry wrote:Women expect certain things from men.
Men expect certain things from women.

If you don't give up on both sides there is no point in protesting.

If your a stay at home mom then you need to do 8 hours housework incl the kids...but when kids are in school you sit on your ass all day and expect us to be a father at night.

If your expecting us to pay for dinenr don't complain about wage descrepencies.

Just my 2 cents, flame away.
Not really an intentional flame, but I think you missed to humor in this post entirely. Let go of the hate and anger and frustration. It clothes you like a cheap suit man.

Haven't you been reading Pil's Stephen King Novel length posts on women? How can you be surprised that he doesn't get it?

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » May 8, 2003, 3:35 am

Winnow wrote:
Canelek wrote:
Pilsburry wrote:Women expect certain things from men.
Men expect certain things from women.

If you don't give up on both sides there is no point in protesting.

If your a stay at home mom then you need to do 8 hours housework incl the kids...but when kids are in school you sit on your ass all day and expect us to be a father at night.

If your expecting us to pay for dinenr don't complain about wage descrepencies.

Just my 2 cents, flame away.
Not really an intentional flame, but I think you missed to humor in this post entirely. Let go of the hate and anger and frustration. It clothes you like a cheap suit man.
Haven't you been reading Pil's Stephen King Novel length posts on women? How can you be surprised that he doesn't get it?

Yep, I have read. However, this thread was pretty obvious in intent(humor

). Hell, we all have our moments of denial/frustration/etc. but jeez.. *shrug* Oh well, the pic is still damn funny, as I am sure it is to most folks(man and woman alike) that post on this forum.

Pahreyia · Post by **Pahreyia** » May 8, 2003, 8:25 am

...like a neutered dog...

Kluden · Post by **Kluden** » May 8, 2003, 9:58 am

Actually, that guy was all over sports center when that whole thing was going on with the Masters.

On the opposite side of the sign it says "Make Me Dinner!!!"

Although I don't agree with him being like that towards women...I do find it flippen' hilarious that he went and did that to the protestors. He basicly ruined their protest because everyone who saw them was just looking for that guy and his "sign of the day". The reason he "made it out alive" is because the protestors are all fucken rich bitch lawyers...they new better than to assault someone in public, it would have defunked their protest even further...as if that were possible.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » May 8, 2003, 10:16 am

I never could real his posts all the way through, but I can say his attention to detail is hoaned to a dull luster

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 8, 2003, 10:40 am

Quality humor right there. I'd have gone with "Make Me Some Pie" but other than that, it's fab.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 10:49 am

I may not respect the action the guy is demanding of women, but I do find it freakin' awsome what he is doing especially considering just how much ghay protesting has been going on lately. I just want to be able to use my streets without protesting.

I dont care whether or not we go to war, I want to get to work on time.
I dont care about womens rights, I want to get to work on time.

These are my political stances.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » May 8, 2003, 10:53 am

Rojer wrote: I dont care whether or not we go to war, I want to get to work on time.
I dont care about womens rights, I want to get to work on time.

These are my political stances.

You are kidding right? As much as it pains me, being a dumbass is a valid political stance.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 10:55 am

What does wanting to get to work on time have to do with being a dumbass?

Shaerra · Post by **Shaerra** » May 8, 2003, 11:01 am

Fucking moron...

Trek · Post by **Trek** » May 8, 2003, 11:01 am

I guess getting to Mcdonalds to get the floors squeeky clean for sunrise is more important then our friends and families going to war killing and being killed, not to mention keepin them bitches where they belong. Yes yes, in the grand sceme of the world around us, god forbid that Rojer is late to work.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 11:03 am

I just realized what I wrote, and I didnt mean it like u guys read it, I meant it like, I don't care about anything if it means that my day is gonna be spent in my car at a stop because of some protesters. Its not that I dont care about women's rights like I wrote, its that I am completely anti protesting if its done in the way of what I am trying to do.

Hopefully that clarifies things.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 11:06 am

And Yea Trek, pls explain to me how the peace protests have saved american lives, I am all ears. Please explain to me how these protests have really done anything. I have seen effective protests in the past, but these protests lately have had no effect as far as I can tell, if I am wrong, I am all ears.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » May 8, 2003, 11:13 am

Exactly where did I say they saved lives? It could asked if we would stop at Iraq if the world did'nt voice their oppinion or just didnt care.

This has nothing to do with the actual conversation

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 11:25 am

Trek - You are too into flaming first and asking questions later to even read what I am saying, or even proofread what your writing (

It could asked if we would stop at Iraq if the world did'nt

) so I am not even going to refute you. I am gonna go back to my job scrubbing floors, since you owned me so hard with your incredibly intelligent flame at me. Learn how to read and write, and then step into the ring with us literate people.

Taly · Post by **Taly** » May 8, 2003, 11:27 am

LOL to funny.

Xyphir · Post by **Xyphir** » May 8, 2003, 11:35 am

Rojer wrote:And Yea Trek, pls explain to me how the peace protests have saved american lives, I am all ears. Please explain to me how these protests have really done anything. I have seen effective protests in the past, but these protests lately have had no effect as far as I can tell, if I am wrong, I am all ears.

Try looking from another prospective besides your own for a change. Protests are not about getting something accomplished necessarily. Jesus... haven't you ever felt compassionately about ANYTHING? If not, you need to wake up to the world around you and find out what's going on. Stop living in your little bubble and confront the truth. We share this rock with 7 billion other souls, and if you choose to be apathetic about the issues, don't come down on those willing to voice their opinions. Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of our culture, and to say, "Protest, as long as it doesn't bother me" is pretty ignorant.

Not flaming... just informing.

Edit: I loved the pic. My wife however gave it a 'hurmph'.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 11:47 am

Xyphir - I respect what your saying, but I guess I do not quite understand why it is a good thing that every single driver in a major city needs to be inconvenienced if nothing is meant to be accomplished. I am compassionate, I give my money to United Way. And I am 100% anti censoring and freedom of speach, but I guess I do not understand why freedom of expression should be protected if it makes others lives worse. What if you were trying to support your family and protestors caused you to be late work and then you temporarily lost the ability to support your family the way they are accustomed to, I am not saying that this has happened to me, but I could see it happening, and all this when nothing is meant to be accomplished? I guess I don't see it. I am all for people voicing there opinions, making themselves heard in loud ways, but I am also a white collar business man just trying to support my way of living.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » May 8, 2003, 11:54 am

yes I iz da mostest ilitratit, u reely gets me gud ther

Lor · Post by **Lor** » May 8, 2003, 12:08 pm

Bahahaha Revs, Good one!!

Xyphir · Post by **Xyphir** » May 8, 2003, 12:11 pm

This goes back to my suggestion to look at things from other people's prospective. I seriously doubt every major city was effected by these acts of civil disobedience. Hell, I work in DC, and we weren't bothered one iota. There was some guy who drove his tractor out to the reflecting pond a few weeks ago, but it was completely non-violent, and he just wanted his voice to be heard and issues addressed. So you're a little late to work because of it. Do you get pissed at people who are injured in car accidents because it makes you late for work too? I passed by an accident this morning, and there was a woman in obvious pain in the passenger seat as the ambulence pulled up. Do you feel anger at these people for inconveniencing you? Try using empathy. It works too.

If your employer is upset or fires you because some people are exercising their constitutional rights to voice their opinion, it's probably not the best place to work for, and pretty fucked up to begin with. The united way is probably one of the worst ways to spend your charitable contributions. Don't quote me on this, but somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 cents on the dollar is actually put towards charity. The other 70% goes to overpaid executives. A recent report done by the Washington Post showed the wonton abandon some non-profits are behaving towards their own mission statements. You might remember the Nature Conservancy from those return envelope stickers you get through the mail. Just giving to some charity is not enough. Know what you're contributing FOR. And just because you give money does not make you compassionate. If you truly are, find out what non-profits give the most to their intended charities and the least to their executives. Wasn't the United Way the organization that collected money from the 9/11 disaster and didn't give it to anyone? It's an organization rife with scandal. Just do a google search and see what you come up with.

If you still don't get it, you're just another white guy on the way to work. I hope I didn't make you late.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » May 8, 2003, 12:12 pm

Rojer, despite expressing himself poorly, is right. Freedom of speech has nothing to do with these fucking protestors. The right to public assembly is not so sacred as to allow them to impinge on the freedoms of others to live their lives.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 12:20 pm

Xyphir - I do not remember writing that every major city was effected, if you read what I wrote you would see that I said in "a" major city. I'm not really sure what car accidents have in common with people who chain themselves onto things, and stop traffic. And, Congratulations on hating United Way, now please tell me why you think it is a good thing for people to be effected negatively when nothing is meant to be accomplished.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » May 8, 2003, 12:23 pm

Protesting is just another way of saying "I will be so fucking annoying that they wil want to change they way I want just so I shut the fuck up".

A similar situation occurs in toy stores and in the candy isle in grocery stores with women and young children, you see the kid gets to be so annoying because he knows his mother will cave in to make him shut the fuck up.

Of course a good mother doesn't cave because that just makes the situation worse.

P.S. Trek, if your going to flame....read the persons post first, then read it to someone with a higher IQ so he can explain it to you, and then if you finally grasp what the poster said, then you can flame.

Toshira · Post by **Toshira** » May 8, 2003, 12:41 pm

Xyphir wrote:Wasn't the United Way the organization that collected money from the 9/11 disaster and didn't give it to anyone?

American Red Cross, I'm thinkin.

Xyphir · Post by **Xyphir** » May 8, 2003, 1:17 pm

funny... i don't remember saying 'it is a good thing for people to be effected negatively when nothing is meant to be accomplished.'

Since you missed the parallel, accidents make you late to work, and are as unavoidable as people practicing civil disobedience.

And I didn't say that I hated the United Way either. If you're going to fabricate my arguements for me, atleast make them interesting. I respect what the United Way is trying to do, but the larger a non-profit gets, the easier it is to misplace, say $2M. I like to know exactly what my contributions are going towards. United Way does not give to environmental or social justice groups, which are two groups I like to give to.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » May 8, 2003, 1:43 pm

Np I don't mind helping you put the puzzle together.

Protests are not about getting something accomplished necessarily

Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of our culture, and to say, "Protest, as long as it doesn't bother me" is pretty ignorant.

Your statement that freedom of expression, which in this situation you are referring to protests, is the cornerstone of our culture, you are quite obviosly saying that you feel protesting is a good thing.

I really feel that the whole car crash thing your trying to make me understand is really weak, and barely worth my responding to, but its a slow day at work, so here goes..

Protests are as unavoidable as car crashes? OMG I wish my friends and family would have known that they could quite simply have NOT gotten hit by a drunk driver. Since protests are something that the protesters themselves choose to make happen, it is not something that is forced apon them regardless of all other things in the world. If they feel that there political stance forces them to protest, this is not nearly the same as a drunk driver forcing your life to end.

And, if someone said this

The united way is probably one of the worst ways to spend your charitable contributions.

it would be a logical conclusion that they feel ill will towards united way.

So when your ready to answer my questions that you keep avoiding, I am ready to listen, until then I consider my point proven.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » May 8, 2003, 2:34 pm

Fucking Christ.

The point of a protest is to express an opinion. A protest is held when a large group of people feel that their opinions are not being heard through normal methods of communication with the government (ie voting, letters, and so on), and more drastic measures are required to inform the government and the world as a whole of their opinion. Generally a protest is also held to demonstrate strength of opinion, to show that the issue being protested is so important to the people protesting it that they are willing to inconvenience themselves in order to express their opinion.

The vast majority of protests are peaceful and convenient. The vast majority of protests are permitted. These protestors stay on sidewalks, closed streets, or other approved areas. It is only when protesters feel that the people they are trying to reach with their protest- government, citizens, whatever- are not listening to them that they take to civil disobedience. Is civil disobedience wrong? Well, it's illegal. The people who partake in it know this, and often get arrested as a result.

So when you're sitting in your car waiting for the police to finish beating down a protester, realize that these people are putting the sanctity of their lives on the line in order to try to make things better for everyone else. This is noble, whether or not you agree with their cause or their methods of furthering it.

Protests are a cornerstone of our democracy.

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » May 8, 2003, 2:47 pm

i wish i was a cop so i got to tear gas protestors

Raistin · Post by **Raistin** » May 8, 2003, 2:56 pm

Fuck yea stragi!!

rhyae · Post by **rhyae** » May 8, 2003, 3:10 pm

hehehe, cute.

Vannoth · Post by **Vannoth** » May 8, 2003, 3:26 pm

Nevermind.

Wulfran · Post by **Wulfran** » May 8, 2003, 4:14 pm

So when you're sitting in your car waiting for the police to finish beating down a protester, realize that these people are putting the sanctity of their lives on the line in order to try to make things better for everyone else. This is noble, whether or not you agree with their cause or their methods of furthering it.

Bullshit. There are some causes that are worth protesting for, there are some that nothing but crap. These women protesting about not being allowed in a golf club is laughable: I don't approve of sexism, but this is more about some rich egos being stroked than fighting sexism. If they want to fight sexism and help protect womens right they should stop wasting money on a frivolous protest and do something like support a halfway home for abused women.

Civil disobedience isn't noble either. Most of the time its destructive, disruptive and misguided: what the fuck has a shop keeper done to deserve his store being trashed and looted by some of these mobs. Most of the "police beating down protestors" are people trying to do their job and make the world a safe place. Not to mention that the silly fuckers who want to elevate a peaceful protest to a violent confrontation or a riot deserve to get their empty fucking skulls kicked.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » May 8, 2003, 4:45 pm

Sueven wrote:Fucking Christ.

The point of a protest is to express an opinion. A protest is held when a large group of people feel that their opinions are not being heard through normal methods of communication with the government (ie voting, letters, and so on), and more drastic measures are required to inform the government and the world as a whole of their opinion. Generally a protest is also held to demonstrate strength of opinion, to show that the issue being protested is so important to the people protesting it that they are willing to inconvenience themselves in order to express their opinion.

No offense but your obviously a protest attendee....

Ever think the reason people aren't listening is because they don't care or don't give a fuck? The majority of people disagree or don't care....so in order to GET THIER WAY they throw a TANTRUM.

If the majority of people thought that it was an issue that needed addressed, a protest would not really be required. This is about a minority trying to FORCE thier views on the majority.

If it affects my day then your violating my rights to pursue happiness. And I'll laugh if anyone kicks your ass.

You can go ahead and stand in the city square and speak or petition and submit it wherever....but if you make a picket line I can't cross, I'm going to knock your ass down if I want to get to the other side...and IMHO, I've done no wrong because you were interferring with my right to pursue happiness.

Don't give me that shit about freedom of speech, were not talking about speeches, were talking about protests and there is a hell of a difference. It's like the difference between 2 consenting adults having sex or rape. It's obviously not the same thing when you force it on someone.

And yes the right to persue happiness applies to everyone...unless it interferrs with someone elses rights...like again in the case of rape...the rapist was pursuing his own happiness but it's illegal to rape people because it violates rights of the victim.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » May 8, 2003, 5:04 pm

Wulfran: I completely agree that the cause of Burk and her cronies is complete bullshit. That doesn't mean that they don't have a right to apply for a permit and protest within established boundaries.

Additionally, there is a strong difference between "civil disobedience" and "rioting." As far as I'm concerned, for civil disobedience to be civil disobedience, it must be targetted. The environmentalists living in trees to prevent loggers from cutting them down, or people chaining themselves to an applicable federal building are examples of this. Flipping cars, setting fires, and looting shops are riots, not protests.

I'm not saying that the police beating down protesters aren't justified. Of course that's their job, and the protesters who choose to go the path of civil disobedience (or rioting) should be expecting this when they make their decision.

Pilsburry: I've attended one protest in my life. It was a permitted, approved march (on the sidewalks) in support of my local police department. Next time you feel like making snap judgements about people, just shut the fuck up instead.

In response to your point that if the majority thought one way, a protest would not be required: Well, that's the entire fucking point. A protest is a method of gaining attention. It calls an issue to the forefront of the public eye, forcing people who have never formed an opinion on the issue to form an opinion, and the hope is that the opinion formed will coincide with that of the protesters. Had you ever really thought about the fact that Augusta National has no female members before Martha Burk started bitching? Odds are you had not. Odds are you have now. The fact that 90% of the world thinks that Martha Burk is an idiot proves that the system works: Her legal protests forced America to consider her issue. The fact that she is wrong does not mean that her protests were ineffective.

Next, keep in mind that the "right to pursue happiness" is not a right guaranteed by the bill of rights. It is mentioned in the declaration of independence, so don't try citing it as a reason for anything that you or anyone else does, because it is never guaranteed by our government.

Your points about freedom of speech are irrelevant. I never defended protesting by using that argument. I defended it by saying that it is legal, effective, and necessary.

Arborealus · Post by **Arborealus** » May 8, 2003, 8:28 pm

Wulfran wrote: Civil disobedience isn't noble either. Most of the time its destructive, disruptive and misguided: what the fuck has a shop keeper done to deserve his store being trashed and looted by some of these mobs. Most of the "police beating down protestors" are people trying to do their job and make the world a safe place. Not to mention that the silly fuckers who want to elevate a peaceful protest to a violent confrontation or a riot deserve to get their empty fucking skulls kicked.

Civil disobedience is a tool which is necessary in some cases. The civil rights demonstrations of the 60's often required civil disobedience simply because those wishing to protest were not given permits because tof the nature of the permits. Rosa Parks behavior which was civilly disobedient could not be construed as riotous.

"Beating down" protestors who are peacefully civilly disobedient is illegal for a reason...It's unecessarily forceful. Is it my right to inconvienience you in a way which is illegal...nope if I am practicing civil disobedience, I expect to be arrested...

Sometimes to be heard it is necessary to go beyond what is strictly legal...The question becomes how important is my protest to me.

If my protest is important enough I may picket/demonstrate, practice civil disobedience, or start a rebellion...its a question of degrees.

Mumblefug · Post by **Mumblefug** » May 8, 2003, 11:23 pm

There are different KINDS of protesting though. I fully support people's rights to sit in front of the grocery with a petition, or to take ads in the paper. Then it is my choice to support their cause or decline.
But a few years back there was an ultra-conservative preacher going to abortion clinics in the area I live in. They would picket and harass the women in a most uncalled for manner (calling them sluts and murderers is NOT going to change their minds, just make them feel more awful about this horrible decision they had to come to). The final straw: he had gigantic 8 ft by 10 ft posters made showing pictures of dead fetuses, and set these up facing the street so people driving by would naturally glance at them. The first time I almost threw up (I just can't describe how disgusting these pictures were), and my then-girlfriend had her child in the car. The child was pretty fucked up about the whole thing. Did it make any of us support their view? HELL NO. Did it piss us off that we were shown this shit against our wills? YES. It pissed her off so bad she called the cops on them, and she BELIEVED THAT ABORTION WAS WRONG (thus she was a single mom).
Protest of the second variety DOES INDEED infringe on others' rights, and thus is unconstitutional. It's not a black and white issue of protest vs. don't protest. The fact that you CAN protest is a major reason this country is a tolerable place to live. But the manner in which you go about it is what makes you a good person standing up for your rights, or a trash talking asshole who only wants his way at any cost.

Mumble

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » May 9, 2003, 5:02 am

Sueven wrote:A protest is a method of gaining attention. It calls an issue to the forefront of the public eye, forcing people who have never formed an opinion on the issue to form an opinion, and the hope is that the opinion formed will coincide with that of the protesters.

Next, keep in mind that the "right to pursue happiness" is not a right guaranteed by the bill of rights. It is mentioned in the declaration of independence, so don't try citing it as a reason for anything that you or anyone else does, because it is never guaranteed by our government.

1. FORCING. Forcing is wrong. I don't care what your forcing on me, if you force me to do shit....I will force my foot up your ass. Oh and thier hope isn't that *maybe* I will take thier side. Thier hope is "if I get in your way you can't do what you want any fucking way". They force you to choose thier side or suffer thier wrath....for the most part...some things like a march are FINE. Like I said....you want to do a petition, march, write your congressman...FINE. Hell you want to picket, FINE... Just don't get in other peoples way, I have the right to go into the building. If I own the building I have the right to knock it the fuck down...etc...don't FORCE. End of Story.

2. The Declaration of Independance and specifically the "right to persue happiness" is commonly the #2 defense in favor of protesters, with the #1 being "freedom of speech". Feel free to toss those out the window entirely, I wanted to...so I addressed them before you even tried to use them against me. But you see if you willingly toss those items out the window, then protesters are just a bunch of jackasses forcing thier opinion on people and causing a civil disturbance. With no legal justification at all.