Elizabeth Smart, the 15-year-old girl who vanished from her bedroom nearly eight months ago, was found alive Wednesday during a traffic stop in suburban Salt Lake City, police said. "Miracles do exist," said the girl's uncle, Tom Smart.
Elizabeth Smart found alive!
Moderator: TheMachine
Elizabeth Smart found alive!
http://www.dallasnews.com
THE LARGE PRINT GIVETH
The fine print taketh away.
The fine print taketh away.
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Dregor Thule
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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s ... beth_smart
Nice to know there was a good ending to one of these kidnapping cases.
Nice to know there was a good ending to one of these kidnapping cases.
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Midnyte_Ragebringer
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Hammerstalker PE
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Kilmoll the Sexy
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I live in SLC, just a few blocks from the Smarts home. I've never seen this city the way it has been since this afternoon. Strangers standing in parking lots celebrating together. Impromtu vigils. When the news broke, work in my office came to a standstill as everyone huddled in offices with radios listening to news they couldn't belive until they heard with their own ears.
Salt Lake is a relatively small city (~1mil), and this part of town is pretty close-knit. If you see the photos of Elizabeth in that freaky veil, they were taken literally down the street from me. That Jesus-guy she was found with used to walk up and down the streets with his one veiled woman. Always made me wonder wtf, but I figured "Good for him, doin his own thing." Not so good, as it turned out.
Hope I don't like I'm saying 'hey look at me, I'm almost part of this cool thing'. I guess I'm affected more by this good news than I can keep quiet about. It's like we got one of our own back.
Mp
Salt Lake is a relatively small city (~1mil), and this part of town is pretty close-knit. If you see the photos of Elizabeth in that freaky veil, they were taken literally down the street from me. That Jesus-guy she was found with used to walk up and down the streets with his one veiled woman. Always made me wonder wtf, but I figured "Good for him, doin his own thing." Not so good, as it turned out.
Hope I don't like I'm saying 'hey look at me, I'm almost part of this cool thing'. I guess I'm affected more by this good news than I can keep quiet about. It's like we got one of our own back.
Mp
I hate to be the realist on this situation. But a 15 year old girl is held by a guy for 9 months, and never ever gets a chance to scream or run?
What was so bad in her life that made her not try madly to get away from this guy?
What was so bad in her life that made her not try madly to get away from this guy?
She Dreams in Digital
\"Led Zeppelin taught an entire generation of young men how to make love, if they just listen\"- Michael Reed(2005)
\"Led Zeppelin taught an entire generation of young men how to make love, if they just listen\"- Michael Reed(2005)
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Gurugurumaki
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Thing is, she is young. When you are young a few things easily happen in a situation like this:
1. She gets really scared and tries to do as she is told to not make the people angry. Probably reinforced this by punishment if she misbehaved and gifts if she behaved.
2. Kids have a natural tendency to and make adults happy (well until a certain age at least).
1. She gets really scared and tries to do as she is told to not make the people angry. Probably reinforced this by punishment if she misbehaved and gifts if she behaved.
2. Kids have a natural tendency to and make adults happy (well until a certain age at least).
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Kilmoll the Sexy
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Krimson Klaw
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I've seen kidnapping documentaries where the victim is so horrified, that they eventually end up helping the guy kidnap other people. It's true, and just goes to show you what a petrified mind can make you do. If a grown woman can be manipulated into helping a napper kidnap other people after she herself was kidnapped and raped on a daily basis, then imagine how impressionable a 15 year old mind would be, given similar circumstances. (note, I am not saying the little girl was raped). So I could actually see theis 15 year old having a chance to escape, and not taking it due to being brainwashed.
When I read this news, I picked up my little girl and squeezed her with joy, was so glad to hear this.
When I read this news, I picked up my little girl and squeezed her with joy, was so glad to hear this.
Last edited by Krimson Klaw on March 13, 2003, 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Krimson Klaw
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http://www.msnbc.com/news/884413.asp
Looks like I was right on all points. It's called Stockholm syndrome, when the victim identifies with the captor in order to stay alive.
This article indicates that this girl was put through some sort of polygamist marriage with this guy on the night of the kidnapping. I also heard on the news this morning that at one point, she was so close to the home that she actually heard her dad yelling for her. That's chilling.
Looks like I was right on all points. It's called Stockholm syndrome, when the victim identifies with the captor in order to stay alive.
This article indicates that this girl was put through some sort of polygamist marriage with this guy on the night of the kidnapping. I also heard on the news this morning that at one point, she was so close to the home that she actually heard her dad yelling for her. That's chilling.
news
SALT LAKE CITY (March 14) - After nine months of shabby living under bridges and in tents with a self-styled prophet and his wife, Elizabeth Smart returned to her million-dollar home alive - but not unchanged.
When stopped by police, she readily lied about her identity and said the two drifters were her parents. The 15-year-old was nervous and agitated when asked to remove her sunglasses and gray wig and never asked about her family once the truth emerged.
``There is clearly a psychological impact that occurred at some point,'' Salt Lake Police Chief Rick Dinse said.
Dinse said Mitchell had been excommunicated from the Mormon church, the religion Elizabeth was raised in, and considered himself a polygamist, but Dinse added, ``I do not want to attach his relationship with Elizabeth in that fashion.''
Asked Friday about reports that Elizabeth had been taken to be a wife, the girl's aunt Heidi Smart said, ``That's not actually information that we've been given at this point.''
``The information that we've been given is that she was kidnapped and she was held captive and what went on from there psychologically is information that is still to come out,'' she told NBC's ``Today'' show. ``I think we're looking at a lot of those speculations and stories as just that.''
Police briefly outlined Elizabeth's movements, saying she was snatched from her bed at knifepoint on June 5 and spent her first two months with Brian Mitchell and Wanda Barzee achingly close to home. She was held in a tent in Dry Creek Canyon, a popular hiking area within two miles of the Smart's house. The area was searched many times last summer.
Hours after she vanished, Elizabeth heard one of her uncles calling out her name but was unable to respond, her family said.
In October, Elizabeth and her captors rode a bus to San Diego and spent the winter there. They sometimes slept under a highway bridge. Mitchell was arrested twice during the time police say Elizabeth was with them, once in Salt Lake City on suspicion of shoplifting and once in San Diego for breaking into a church.
The trio returned to the Salt Lake area Wednesday in dirty clothes and carrying bedrolls. They were arrested within hours when two couples recognized Mitchell and called police.
When officers approached the teen, Sandy Officer Bill O'Neal said, ``she kind of just blurted out, `I know who you think I am. You guys think I'm that Elizabeth Smart girl who ran away.'''
Smart told police her name was ``Augustine'' and that her cheap black sunglasses protected her eyes while they healed from surgery. When they asked why she wore a wig and T-shirt for a head scarf, she became upset.
``Her heart was beating so hard you could see it through her chest,'' O'Neal said.
Handcuffed and loaded into a separate police car from Mitchell and Barzee for the ride to the station, Smart began to cry.
``We kept telling her, do this for your family, do this for yourself. Do the right thing - we know you're Elizabeth Smart,'' said Sergeant Victor Quezada.
Smart responded with a biblical quote, ``Thou sayest.''
The teen may have picked up the religious reference from Mitchell, a 49-year-old panhandler and self-proclaimed prophet for the homeless who called himself Emmanuel. The trio were seen wearing long white robes, with Barzee and Elizabeth often veiled and following silently.
Debbie Mitchell, Mitchell's ex-wife, told ``Today'' Friday that Elizabeth was likely manipulated psychologically.
``I think there must have been a lot of brainwashing to begin with. I know that's how he worked in our marriage, I know how controlling he was,'' she said.
Elizabeth's father, Ed Smart, credited his daughter's return to the power of prayer.
``Elizabeth is happy, she is well, and we are so happy to have her back in our arms,'' he said. The city planned a community party Friday evening to celebrate Elizabeth's return.
Elizabeth seemed to adjust well on her first night home. Sierra Smart said she and several other cousins spent about three hours with Elizabeth. ``She's like totally talking, totally casual,'' said Sierra, 22. ``She got all new clothes. She gave a fashion show.''
Elizabeth may have been kept from escaping or crying out for help by the growing influence of her captors, police said. Investigators have not talked to her since Wednesday evening and have no immediate plans to interview her again, Dinse said.
``That is subject to the information that we develop. We will work with her family about that,'' he said. ``We did have a productive day yesterday. She's a very bright, very smart young lady who answered our questions very articulately. She was very helpful in our discussion with her.''
Her father said he had not pressed his daughter for details of her ordeal.
``I don't have it in me to try and make this harder for her than it is,'' he said.
Mitchell and Barzee remain jailed Friday on suspicion of aggravated kidnapping.
Mitchell had been previously arrested in Salt Lake City, September 27, for allegedly shoplifting batteries, gum, a flashlight and beer, The Salt Lake Tribune reported Friday. The man, who told police his name was ``Immanuel'' and ``Lueal,'' skipped a subsequent court appearance, the paper reported, citing court records.
Authorities in California disclosed Thursday that Mitchell had been arrested and held for six days in San Diego County last month for vandalizing a church.
A fingerprint check done after the arrest indicated he was also known as Mitchell, but deputies had no reason to keep him in custody, sheriff's spokesman Chris Saunders said. Mitchell pleaded guilty and was released on probation Feb. 18.
``There's really nothing different we could have done because Salt Lake City authorities didn't identify him as a suspect until March 1,'' Saunders said.
Ed Smart has criticized police for focusing too much on another possible suspect and failing to act quickly on a tip from Elizabeth's younger sister that ultimately led to Mitchell. But he also sounded forgiving.
``I believe that they tried to do their best,'' he said.
Dinse acknowledged investigators were slow to release a sketch of Mitchell.
``Hindsight is 20-20 vision,'' he said. ``If we had to go back over it again, I think every one of (our investigators) would say, `I wish we had gone public with that ... earlier.''
When stopped by police, she readily lied about her identity and said the two drifters were her parents. The 15-year-old was nervous and agitated when asked to remove her sunglasses and gray wig and never asked about her family once the truth emerged.
``There is clearly a psychological impact that occurred at some point,'' Salt Lake Police Chief Rick Dinse said.
Dinse said Mitchell had been excommunicated from the Mormon church, the religion Elizabeth was raised in, and considered himself a polygamist, but Dinse added, ``I do not want to attach his relationship with Elizabeth in that fashion.''
Asked Friday about reports that Elizabeth had been taken to be a wife, the girl's aunt Heidi Smart said, ``That's not actually information that we've been given at this point.''
``The information that we've been given is that she was kidnapped and she was held captive and what went on from there psychologically is information that is still to come out,'' she told NBC's ``Today'' show. ``I think we're looking at a lot of those speculations and stories as just that.''
Police briefly outlined Elizabeth's movements, saying she was snatched from her bed at knifepoint on June 5 and spent her first two months with Brian Mitchell and Wanda Barzee achingly close to home. She was held in a tent in Dry Creek Canyon, a popular hiking area within two miles of the Smart's house. The area was searched many times last summer.
Hours after she vanished, Elizabeth heard one of her uncles calling out her name but was unable to respond, her family said.
In October, Elizabeth and her captors rode a bus to San Diego and spent the winter there. They sometimes slept under a highway bridge. Mitchell was arrested twice during the time police say Elizabeth was with them, once in Salt Lake City on suspicion of shoplifting and once in San Diego for breaking into a church.
The trio returned to the Salt Lake area Wednesday in dirty clothes and carrying bedrolls. They were arrested within hours when two couples recognized Mitchell and called police.
When officers approached the teen, Sandy Officer Bill O'Neal said, ``she kind of just blurted out, `I know who you think I am. You guys think I'm that Elizabeth Smart girl who ran away.'''
Smart told police her name was ``Augustine'' and that her cheap black sunglasses protected her eyes while they healed from surgery. When they asked why she wore a wig and T-shirt for a head scarf, she became upset.
``Her heart was beating so hard you could see it through her chest,'' O'Neal said.
Handcuffed and loaded into a separate police car from Mitchell and Barzee for the ride to the station, Smart began to cry.
``We kept telling her, do this for your family, do this for yourself. Do the right thing - we know you're Elizabeth Smart,'' said Sergeant Victor Quezada.
Smart responded with a biblical quote, ``Thou sayest.''
The teen may have picked up the religious reference from Mitchell, a 49-year-old panhandler and self-proclaimed prophet for the homeless who called himself Emmanuel. The trio were seen wearing long white robes, with Barzee and Elizabeth often veiled and following silently.
Debbie Mitchell, Mitchell's ex-wife, told ``Today'' Friday that Elizabeth was likely manipulated psychologically.
``I think there must have been a lot of brainwashing to begin with. I know that's how he worked in our marriage, I know how controlling he was,'' she said.
Elizabeth's father, Ed Smart, credited his daughter's return to the power of prayer.
``Elizabeth is happy, she is well, and we are so happy to have her back in our arms,'' he said. The city planned a community party Friday evening to celebrate Elizabeth's return.
Elizabeth seemed to adjust well on her first night home. Sierra Smart said she and several other cousins spent about three hours with Elizabeth. ``She's like totally talking, totally casual,'' said Sierra, 22. ``She got all new clothes. She gave a fashion show.''
Elizabeth may have been kept from escaping or crying out for help by the growing influence of her captors, police said. Investigators have not talked to her since Wednesday evening and have no immediate plans to interview her again, Dinse said.
``That is subject to the information that we develop. We will work with her family about that,'' he said. ``We did have a productive day yesterday. She's a very bright, very smart young lady who answered our questions very articulately. She was very helpful in our discussion with her.''
Her father said he had not pressed his daughter for details of her ordeal.
``I don't have it in me to try and make this harder for her than it is,'' he said.
Mitchell and Barzee remain jailed Friday on suspicion of aggravated kidnapping.
Mitchell had been previously arrested in Salt Lake City, September 27, for allegedly shoplifting batteries, gum, a flashlight and beer, The Salt Lake Tribune reported Friday. The man, who told police his name was ``Immanuel'' and ``Lueal,'' skipped a subsequent court appearance, the paper reported, citing court records.
Authorities in California disclosed Thursday that Mitchell had been arrested and held for six days in San Diego County last month for vandalizing a church.
A fingerprint check done after the arrest indicated he was also known as Mitchell, but deputies had no reason to keep him in custody, sheriff's spokesman Chris Saunders said. Mitchell pleaded guilty and was released on probation Feb. 18.
``There's really nothing different we could have done because Salt Lake City authorities didn't identify him as a suspect until March 1,'' Saunders said.
Ed Smart has criticized police for focusing too much on another possible suspect and failing to act quickly on a tip from Elizabeth's younger sister that ultimately led to Mitchell. But he also sounded forgiving.
``I believe that they tried to do their best,'' he said.
Dinse acknowledged investigators were slow to release a sketch of Mitchell.
``Hindsight is 20-20 vision,'' he said. ``If we had to go back over it again, I think every one of (our investigators) would say, `I wish we had gone public with that ... earlier.''
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Kilmoll the Sexy
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I told ya that 4 posts up ya silly SK.Krimson Klaw wrote:http://www.msnbc.com/news/884413.asp
Looks like I was right on all points. It's called Stockholm syndrome, when the victim identifies with the captor in order to stay alive.
This article indicates that this girl was put through some sort of polygamist marriage with this guy on the night of the kidnapping. I also heard on the news this morning that at one point, she was so close to the home that she actually heard her dad yelling for her. That's chilling.
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Silvarel Mistmoon
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My 13 year old daughter watched the night that the Smart girl was found and my daughter says to me "why didn't she yell if her sister was in the room? or try to get her attention?" I said to my daughter if it were you and your little brother (same age difference in my two as these sisters) were sleeping in your room, would you get his attention or would you do as told to keep your brother safe? She staired at me and had almost a sad look on her face and said "yeah I guess I wouldn't have made a peep".
It is really sick what people do to kidnapped kids or people for that matter but with children they use everything against them..... remember when mom or dad spanked you? they don't love you, whens the last time your parents did this or that, your brothers and sisters get more attention. Children want to be loved and they want to make adults happy for the most part. They very much want to please adults in general so you can just imagine what they go through when taken away like that.
They also said this family was very private and the children were home schooled so this child was totally out of her comfort zone.
It is really sick what people do to kidnapped kids or people for that matter but with children they use everything against them..... remember when mom or dad spanked you? they don't love you, whens the last time your parents did this or that, your brothers and sisters get more attention. Children want to be loved and they want to make adults happy for the most part. They very much want to please adults in general so you can just imagine what they go through when taken away like that.
They also said this family was very private and the children were home schooled so this child was totally out of her comfort zone.
Safe Travels,
Silvarel Mistmoon
Silvarel Mistmoon