Where to go?

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 12, 2009, 2:07 pm

Long story short: I had a new account from late last year and lost my account information, I hadn't logged in since January. After waiting on hold for almost an hour, They hooked me up with my original account that hadn't been touched since some time in 2007 and has a level 70 dwarf rogue (My brother levelled this char) and 3 free months of playtime.

Where do I go?.. Does anyone play on Area 52?

Thanks in advance..

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » May 12, 2009, 2:11 pm

Start by rerolling a Horde. Then I'd choose a class that is ranged dps. Rogues are kind of rare now. At least on my server.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 12, 2009, 3:27 pm

I want to use the 70 rogue, though... I just don't know where to go.

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » May 12, 2009, 4:17 pm

Fash wrote:I want to use the 70 rogue, though... I just don't know where to go.

If you want to use him to PvE, search for decently progressed servers with strong Alliance guilds, usually pretty easy to do on forums. If you want to use him for PvP, search for a server where your ping doesn't fucking suck balls, and then check it's top Arena teams and how it stands compared to the rest of the BG.

Those are just my guesses really. I'm at the point again where the people I played with don't really play the game anymore and I'd like to do more than just some casual arena, rarely raid. However, there isn't a whole lot of demand for a Rogue who plays EST on a PST server (Hyjal), so I'm sort of in the same boat as you, but I'm considering quitting more than bothering to research servers/guilds to try and get in with.

Fenna · Post by **Fenna** » May 13, 2009, 10:28 am

Regarding rogue utility, they're really not very helpful on the WotLK raid content. Death Knights way out-DPS rogues, even when equally equipped. We're talking a difference of 1K DPS on average.

That being said, I still love my rogue. It's my favorite class.

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » May 13, 2009, 12:24 pm

I never understood how people can just up and move servers. Haven't you made friends and rivals? I would rather just leave the game than go out trying to find fun on another server (and paying for it to boot).

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » May 13, 2009, 12:26 pm

Oh, and rogues...

I never understood why anyone would play a rogue over a feral druid. I wouldn't be locked into a class that has little to no diversity.

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » May 13, 2009, 12:59 pm

Fairweather Pure wrote:Oh, and rogues...

I never understood why anyone would play a rogue over a feral druid. I wouldn't be locked into a class that has little to no diversity.

I played a Priest and liked being Shadow Spec. I was basically regulated to Holy Spec for 2 years because nobody would let Shadow near the fucking door. Even when Shadow became viable/popular, I was still asked to heal more often than not because I could do it well, and quite frankly, it was needed due to people not really wanting to heal. This caused much angst because I'd have to respec and carry 4 sets of gear (PvE healing, PvP healing, PvE Dmg, PvP Dmg). Obviously, game changes have alleviated most of those concerns between Dual Specs and Spell Power changes, but by then I'd already rolled my Rogue and leveled. At the time, Druids were relegated to pretty much Healing or bust, a few Ferals and Boomkins were around, but I really wasn't all into having my T8 look like my level 40 gear (hi2uanimalforms), so I'm vain...

I did have access to a Feral Druid in Vanilla and early to mid TBC and it really just wasn't my style. I think if I had my choice of 80 character right now, I'd go back to Priest. I just can't be bothered to play the leveling game.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 13, 2009, 1:09 pm

This game is sounding really stupid to me right now.

The idea of starting at 1 doesn't appeal to me, that's why I had them give me this account instead of my newer account where I was building a new character (was under 20 when I got busy and stopped playing)...

If I'm committed to picking up this 70 rogue and learning it despite not playing it to this point, and all I have is burning crusade.... you're saying I'm wasting my time because no one is going to want to group with me?

Some game...

Funkmasterr · Post by **Funkmasterr** » May 13, 2009, 1:18 pm

Fash wrote:This game is sounding really stupid to me right now.

The idea of starting at 1 doesn't appeal to me, that's why I had them give me this account instead of my newer account where I was building a new character (was under 20 when I got busy and stopped playing)...

If I'm committed to picking up this 70 rogue and learning it despite not playing it to this point, and all I have is burning crusade.... you're saying I'm wasting my time because no one is going to want to group with me?

Some game...

Yeah, I've always just played whatever class I want to play in games. If it's not the class that everyone wants I'll just have fun soloing and whatnot until I get bored.

miir · Post by **miir** » May 13, 2009, 1:37 pm

I found that WOW players are really fucking judgemental when it comes to gear, class, talent build, etc.

Last fall when I was playing WOW, I got into a couple of pickup groups only to be booted after they saw my gear.
It can be a difficult game to get into if you're not playing with a group of friends.

Funkmasterr · Post by **Funkmasterr** » May 13, 2009, 1:40 pm

miir wrote:I found that WOW players are really fucking judgemental when it comes to gear, class, talent build, etc.

Last fall when I was playing WOW, I got into a couple of pickup groups only to be booted after they saw my gear.
It can be a difficult game to get into if you're not playing with a group of friends.

, that's ridiculous.

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » May 13, 2009, 1:43 pm

The problem with Rogues is that there used to be a billion of them. Now there are still quite a few and a lot of them are still the baddies that plagued Guilds before. You know the type, the ones who couldn't grasp the, "The ground beneath me is x,y,z color, WHAT SHOULD I FUCKING DO? WHAT DOES THIS BIG CAPS WITH RESOUNDING NOISE MEAN?" or the egotistical cockmongers who constantly link damage meters or link gear they want and assume is theirs. That seemed ot have pretty much embodied what Rogues were for a while. I think it's moved on to DK's.

I don't run into the problem of being 1k below everyone else's DPS. I also don't run that many 25 man raids. In every raid I've been on, I've been on top, or near top of DPS. It's always going to be a little rough starting back up in a game where you know nobody, so you'll have to do pugs, but if you play well, people notice. Don't die to stupid things (read boss mechanics before you go on that pug raid) and do decent damage, people will like you. I've gotten a few guild invites, not all were quality guilds, and most I turned down due to time commitment conflicts.

Being a Rogue can work well if you can work well. My only caveat is that now that there are Dual Specs and Spell Power changes, being any Healing or Tank class seems to have such a boon of being able to swap hats without the annoying aspects it used to have.

Edit: Miir is right about the gear checks, the best you can do is reply with something like, "Let my performance dictate it for me, then boot me if I'm not up to par" This was my default answer to any raid that asked, "Link me achievement for this boss and you can come" BS. I go to a lot of these raids because I have no alternative to see the content, not because I want to farm it with fucking people I don't know.

miir · Post by **miir** » May 13, 2009, 1:43 pm

Hehe yea no shit...
I can be quite the douchebag here but in MMOs, I always try to be a nice guy... so I obviously wasn't booted for being an asshole. In one of those groups I didn't say anything beyond 'hey guys, what's up'

Funkmasterr · Post by **Funkmasterr** » May 13, 2009, 1:48 pm

miir wrote:Hehe yea no shit...
I can be quite the douchebag here but in MMOs, I always try to be a nice guy... so I obviously wasn't booted for being an asshole. In one of those groups I didn't say anything beyond 'hey guys, what's up'

I know, when I first started playing with you in EQ2 I kept waiting for you to go into douche-mode and I was confused after a few weeks when it still hadn't happened

Fenna · Post by **Fenna** » May 13, 2009, 2:16 pm

Rogues are still useful in groups and raids, as they do good DPS, but they just don't stack up *quite* as high as they used to. So I wouldn't be worried about not getting groups.

Like Psy said, I think DKs are the most popular class for former rogues now. DKs are a lot of fun, and from what I can tell it's almost like playing in "god mode," as out of the gates they are well geared and very powerful. Thus, very easy.

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » May 13, 2009, 2:32 pm

Fash wrote: If I'm committed to picking up this 70 rogue and learning it despite not playing it to this point, and all I have is burning crusade.... you're saying I'm wasting my time because no one is going to want to group with me?

Buy WotLK for 30$ and go fight the new content. If you are lvl 70, you will be the same gear level as anyone else playing in your level range in WotLK. Also, it's a damn fine expansion and worth the money. It's just lacking anything for the casual player to do IMO. It kept me busy for a good 2-3 months though.

Your groups will probably consist of you and 4 DKs though

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 13, 2009, 2:34 pm

I will look into creating a DK since they start at 55, and might grab WoTLK... thanks for nothing, jerks.

j/k

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » May 13, 2009, 3:14 pm

Fash wrote:I will look into creating a DK since they start at 55, and might grab WoTLK... thanks for nothing, jerks. j/k

DK starting quest line is great and fun. Take time to read some of it if you like lore, I thought it was funny. I was Unholy going from 55-71 and loved it. There's been quite a bit of changes to DK's since I did it though, so Unholy might blow goats compared to Frost or Blood.

cadalano · Post by **cadalano** » May 13, 2009, 4:27 pm

i'd boot you for having shitty gear. i'm too hardcore for you to be riding my coattails. this isn't a fucking charity drive

Sabek · Post by **Sabek** » May 13, 2009, 4:55 pm

miir wrote:Hehe yea no shit...
I can be quite the douchebag here but in MMOs, I always try to be a nice guy... so I obviously wasn't booted for being an asshole. In one of those groups I didn't say anything beyond 'hey guys, what's up'

Don't let him fool you. Miir was the douchebag that stole every shield for himself in EQ1.

miir · Post by **miir** » May 13, 2009, 6:04 pm

Haha...

i'm too hardcore for you to be riding my coattails

You're too hardcore for PUGs!

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » May 14, 2009, 10:06 am

Fenna wrote:Like Psy said, I think DKs are the most popular class for former rogues now. DKs are a lot of fun, and from what I can tell it's almost like playing in "god mode," as out of the gates they are well geared and very powerful. Thus, very easy.

All the guild recruiters have a "no DKs" tag and the end of their recruiting spiel now

Awesome class, lots of idiots playing it, I keep expecting a sound nerfing that doesn't seem to be coming.

But yeah, WotLK seems pretty limited for casual folks. The wife and I both switched over to LoTRO.

First time I've been a newb not knowing anyone in a long time

Post by **Sylvus** » May 14, 2009, 11:17 am

I started playing again in January as a level 60 Shaman who hadn't played since right after BWL was first released. I soloed almost exclusively to level 80, am still tagged Ixtlan and there are only like 5 people in the guild who ever login, and have done exactly one instance that was bigger than a 5-man since then (Naxx 10 which we were kicking ass on through 3.5 wings until it got late and we had to go). I run a lot of heroic 5-mans with PUGs, do a lot of solo daily quests, fishing/cooking/etc.

I'm having a really good time. Most of the rogues I've seen have been welcome in any group I've been in, there's actually one that I always look for when I'm looking to fill up a group. Sure, maybe some uber raiding guild isn't looking to add a rouge with sub-par gear, but I'm guessing you probably don't want to commit to that level of playing anyway. You can re-gear pretty easily in the progression to 80, so that you won't be totally laughable. As I was soloing from 60-70 in TBC content, I was constantly vendoring vanilla WoW epics with upgrades from regular quests. When I was going from 70-80, I did the same. Run some 5 man normal mode dungeons to get geared up for heroics, repeat, and you'll be good to go before too long.

If you're in a pug where someone would kick you because of your gear, you don't want to be with them anyway. If it keeps happening (which I wouldn't expect), re-roll after that.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 15, 2009, 6:13 am

The gearing process has been streamlined considerably since pre-BC days. Even if you put a minimal amount of time into it, you can easily obtain competitive epics via heroics and badges, and the 10 man raid zones are quite accessable even without a guild (Naxx 10 can easily be done in blues and mixed epics and will be your primary source of upgrades, however Ulduar 10 generally requires mostly Naxx epics). Even 25 man Naxx is fairly easily pugable at this point, although it can be a headache of you get into an annoying or shitty group.

This is all generally easier on a higher populated, more PUG-friendly server. I know on Medivh there are dozens of 10 man pugs that happen nightly, and generally 2-3 25 man pugs as well.

WoW has never been better for casual players, and it's very easy to have an enjoyable gaming experience, either via pugging or joining a small 10-man oriented guild. Gear is easy to come by, and the content is VERY accessible even for inexperienced players.

Make sure you've got a decent spec, the right glyphs, and after a bit of gearing you should have no problems getting into groups at all. Unlike in BC, Melee aren't disadvantaged on many raid bosses, and rogues seem in short supply these days.

Rogue is not a hard class to learn. It's got fairly simple mechanics, and isn't hard to become decent at, or even to master. Combat being the simpler of the specs and generally the higher dps, Assasination is viable and, frankly, more enjoyable. It has a much more complex rotation though. Subtlety is a PVP spec, and nothing else. The one thing about rogue is that unlike playing a caster, you're fairly gear dependant (that goes with any melee class)... so it takes a bit of sticking with to really get the kind of damage that is going to be desirable, but it's generally worth it, as rogues are still very strong dps classes at mid range gear levels. Just don't expect to walk into a 10 man in blues and top meters like some kind of an elemental shaman

.

And for gods sake, don't roll a deathknight. They might be overpowered to level, but if you want a chance at finding a group (or a guild) I strongly discourage leveling one. Even getting into pugs as a DK can be a nightmare.

WoW players might be judgmental, but it's pretty easy to mitigate that. Simply get a spec and glyph setup that isn't terrible, know how to gear yourself (as a rogue, it' VERY straightforward anyhow), and work out a decent rotation (again, as a rogue, not hard) and you really shouldn't have any problems at all. If you're unsure of specifics, just ask. Most WoW players are fuckstick asswipes, but some are genuinely helpful. Ask here, or even in trade chat, and you're sure to get at least a few helpful answers.

In all honesty, if you've got 15 dollars to blow and want to transfer to Medivh, I'd be more than happy to help you out and shit.

Aardor · Post by **Aardor** » May 15, 2009, 7:28 am

Bagar- wrote:Combat being the simpler of the specs and generally the higher dps, Assasination is viable and, frankly, more enjoyable. It has a much more complex rotation though. Subtlety is a PVP spec, and nothing else.

Actually combat and assassination rotations are pretty much the same now, with the hfb changes. Both are very competitive dps in raids, it generally comes down to what weapons you have. I like combat because it fights a bunch of the ulduar fights (need for burst at some point, whereas assassination only has cold blood, which isn't much burst on a raid boss). OH, and Subtlety is currently the top DPS spec (given gear, and a semi-optimal group), with Honor Among Thieves.

Everything else Bagar- said was spot on, just make sure you go to a server with a high alliance population.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 15, 2009, 8:34 am

Thought they fixed HAT. I know for awhile it was bugged, and I thought that was the only thing that made subtlety worthwhile.

I'm just speaking from what I've heard and seen from our rogues, mind you, as my rogue is still level 70 and probably will be for awhile.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 15, 2009, 8:49 am

It's just lacking anything for the casual player to do IMO. It kept me busy for a good 2-3 months though.

I find this to be ironic.

Blizzard has tried so hard to make the game so "casual" friendly, that at this point, even casual players are simply running out of things to do. If you're casual, and you can clear the raid zones just as quickly as the hardcore players, what else are you going to do? You can't really do the hard achievements, gear is pointless since the non-achievement content is so easy, so there's nothing to do at all.

At least in BC, which was deemed "too hardcore" by so many, if you were casual you ALWAYS had something to work on, something to strive for. You didn't clear BT? Boo fucking hoo, but at least you weren't BORED. At least you were working on something, which trust me, is better than farming Illidan fucking Lootrage every fucking week. That's the point of the game, to have something to work on, not to clear the content and be goddamned bored off your ass. In BC, 5 to 10% of the guilds cleared content pre-nerf, and 5 to 10% of the playerbase was bored. Now it's a whole hell of a lot higher.

The difference is that the hardcore players won't quit if they run out of shit to do. Casual players will. Blizzard needs to go back to the BC model, frankly. But I suppose, you know, rose-colored glasses...

/derail off

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » May 15, 2009, 9:06 am

HaT is the top spec if you're with good people, since it's dependent on your group members staying alive, their gearing and their performance. I don't recommended it at all anyone who isn't with very good people who know what they are doing.

I'd agree that Combat is ahead of Mut but really it depends on what weapons you have available to you. I'd also agree that finding a decently populated server which has nightly pug 10/25's is the way to go because up until Ulduuar, you can more or less see everything. I'm sure it's just a matter of time, if it isn't happening already on some servers, before that becomes accessible even more to pugs.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 15, 2009, 9:53 am

Well I created a DK last night and played through 2 levels, then I come here and Bagar says don't make a DK. Lol. Anyways, if playing the DK is going to get me more familiar with the high level game, then I can go back to the rogue at any time. I had fun last night, that's all that matters to me.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 15, 2009, 10:21 am

Don't get me wrong. The DK starting quests are probably the best designed, most humorous, and most entertaining quests in the entire game. The entire experience is fun and leads through a lot of important lore (if you care about that stuff).

I'm just advising you that if you decide to level your DK, be prepared for some difficulties down the road. In the end, it's about playing what you find to be engaging and fun.

Honestly, if you literally don't care about ever really raiding, and are just looking to piddle around and waste some time, leveling a DK might be a good thing. You get to see the Burning Crusade stuff and the Northrend stuff without having to start at level 1, and you get to do it playing the single most overpowered class for leveling and soloing in the game. All i'm saying is that if you plan on doing raids, be it with a guild or PUG, it's going to be rough. Even 5 man heroics are going to be hard to get into sometimes. Not impossible by any means, just more difficult than most other classes.

I highly recommend Blood, by the way.

Diseases (plague strike / icy touch) ---> Heart Strike X2 ---> Death Strike

Rinse, repeat, mobs die. It's also extremely easy to kill 2 or 3 things at a time with heart strike Cleave AOE.

Also, keep in mind that if you have a level 55+ character on ANY server, you can make a DK on ANY server. Not just the server that your level 55+ character is on.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » May 16, 2009, 10:57 pm

Fash wrote:Well I created a DK last night and played through 2 levels, then I come here and Bagar says don't make a DK. Lol. Anyways, if playing the DK is going to get me more familiar with the high level game, then I can go back to the rogue at any time. I had fun last night, that's all that matters to me.

Meh, I think Bagar is limited by his own perceptions.

We've found DK's to be the best tanks in several encounters, and amongst the best DPS, and in some situations the best DPS while tanking (AE tank) ;p

I don't even want to go to Malygos w/o at least one DK, and I often favour pulling them in for pugs because 80% of their DPS is achievable by slapping the keys in a random fashion.

YMMV.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 17, 2009, 4:56 am

You're right. Sarth 3, Malygos, and a few Ulduar fights make DKs pretty good / necessary.

But whenever you play an overpopulated class (Hunters in Vanilla, Rogues in BC, DKs now) you're going to have trouble getting loot and getting spots in guilds / pugs, as most pugs will try to have at least SOME semblance of class balance.

NEVER did I say DKs were BAD, and NEVER did I say DKs weren't necessary in certain (but rare) situations. I simply advise caution when you're a new player and are creating a massively overpopulated class, as it makes it hard to see content and better yourself.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » May 17, 2009, 7:13 am

I didn't want to start a new thread because I'm a wow noob. Also, this is a 6 AM post after a 12 hour gaming binge. I can barely feel my legs.

I have a 50 Warrior (Arms) that I love playing. Juggernaut / Mortal Strike is a beast and I enjoy my role in pvp. I'm at the point where Sunken Temple is fun and BRD is challenging. Soloing is a little too easy for my liking (god I miss EQ). A few thoughts I have:

When will I stop being a good tank as an Arms build? I feel being a good tank is much more about instincts and reactions than gear or spec. I love tanking and how easy it is to appear skilled in the eyes of others, but I can feel the creep of ineffectuality looming near.

Why the FUCK does Plate gear never drop?

There are a ton of female characters that are a lot more ridiculous than the few that graced EQ. Are there a bunch of horny girls that play WoW or are they all 50-something dudes?

WoW is built to be a drug. It provides just enough easy gratification that you want to come back for more. I can spot a miserable WoW addict from a mile away. I started playing to take my mind off a girl. I don't think I'll have as much fun once I'm 80 because it'll be so difficult to separate myself from all the ubers. I don't play an MMO to be part of the rank and file. Most players are assholes and I don't want to see myself become one of them.

Pretty much what will keep me in the game is the promise of a fulfilling pvp experience at level 80. I stayed at 19, 29, 39, and 49 until I'd earned all of the WSG / AB gear that I could get. The class balance is unreal and the strategy deep. I'm on a pvp server, and the leveling guild I'm in (and somehow an officer of) will raid Alliance cities from time to time. It's a blast knowing that I'm never safe in a contested zone. Pvp all the way.

And now that I've finally played EQ and WoW, I can say without a doubt that EQ is the better game. One is built to be a challenging game that makes money, the other is built to be a cash guzzling drug that dilutes the fantasy with each new upgrade. I'd prefer to see depth of pvp strategy as the game's focal point, with gear acting as an aid to one's chosen strategy and not as the crutch that it is. The concept of Gear was done the best in Neverwinter Nights.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 17, 2009, 9:16 am

When will I stop being a good tank as an Arms build? I feel being a good tank is much more about instincts and reactions than gear or spec. I love tanking and how easy it is to appear skilled in the eyes of others, but I can feel the creep of ineffectuality looming near.

By the time you hit Outlands, you'll need to actually start using a shield / sword and Defensive stance, and once you hit Northrend you'll actually want to use some defensive gear. Otherwise you can tank 5 mans with Arms all the way through 80, provided you don't have a terrible group. They've really made DPS specs quite viable for tanking non-raid content, which is really nice.

Why the FUCK does Plate gear never drop?

You'll see plenty in Outlands

There are a ton of female characters that are a lot more ridiculous than the few that graced EQ. Are there a bunch of horny girls that play WoW or are they all 50-something dudes?

All chicks

WoW is built to be a drug. It provides just enough easy gratification that you want to come back for more. I can spot a miserable WoW addict from a mile away. I started playing to take my mind off a girl. I don't think I'll have as much fun once I'm 80 because it'll be so difficult to separate myself from all the ubers. I don't play an MMO to be part of the rank and file. Most players are assholes and I don't want to see myself become one of them.

It's quite easy to establish yourself into a somewhat casual raiding guild and still maintain a casual playstyle. The days of raiding 7 days per week for 5 hours a day are OVER. This isn't Everquest and it isn't Vanilla WoW or Burning Crusade. The raiding content, sans hardmodes, is easily clearable in a few hours (for Naxx) and 2-3 days (for Ulduar) and most players with elitist attitudes are merely remnants of pre-BC and BC-Sunwell raiders that think raiding gives you a free passport to doucheville. Ignore those people. Most raiders AREN'T elitist assholes. I know I personally boot people from my guild that act like dicksocks to other players, regardless of the situation

.

Pretty much what will keep me in the game is the promise of a fulfilling pvp experience at level 80. I stayed at 19, 29, 39, and 49 until I'd earned all of the WSG / AB gear that I could get. The class balance is unreal and the strategy deep. I'm on a pvp server, and the leveling guild I'm in (and somehow an officer of) will raid Alliance cities from time to time. It's a blast knowing that I'm never safe in a contested zone. Pvp all the way.

They've revamped the Arena system to make it even more rewarding and accessible, along with Wintergrasp and Bg's giving shittons of Honor, and the fact that Warriors are just so goddamned fun to play.

If you plan on focusing on PVP, you won't be disappointed. I play around with PVP outside of raiding, and myself (Holy paladin), an Arms Warrior, and an Unholy DK have been absolutely raping arenas. About to get out Furious Gladiator weapons. And I am by no means good at Arena

.

I was pretty into PVP about halfway through Burning Crusade, but it got pretty stale. I really like the new BG though, I love wintergrasp, and the Arena Rating changes have made it possible for even mediocre PVPers like myself to be competitive by streamlining the brackets and matchmakings so I don't get raped by teams that are fucktons more skilled and geared than mine

.

And now that I've finally played EQ and WoW, I can say without a doubt that EQ is the better game.

I'm about as much of a Blizzard fanboy as Winnow, but I have to disagree. EQ was massive timesink after timesink, with a huge focal point being on grinding and farming, and with the real challenge in raids not being complex or dynamic boss strategies, but being able to coordinate dozens upon dozens of people together at one time with no voice comm. Don't judge WoW as a game until you've at least experienced all it has to offer. EQ was a fantastic game in its hayday, but not because it was a shining example of strategy or skill. Most classes had 1-3 relevant abilities, and most bosses even fewer. Raiding on WoW is significantly more engaging than EQ raiding was. On EQ, to stay even remotely entertained during raids, I had to box a necro and cleric along with my paladin. Shit got boring son. EQ had a shitty interface even for its time, especially the original one, and while WoW had a fuckton of bugs at release, it's generally a pretty polished and relevant game, even for being 4 years old. WoW also tries to at least attempt class balancing, rather than having 1 relevant tank, 1 relevant healer, 4 relevant dps, and a bunch of shitty filler buff classes. I'm looking at you, anyone that wasn't a warrior / cleric / magician / wizard / necromancer / rogue / ranger after kunark / monk whenever they became good. You know what you did on raids shaman? You fucking buffed people. That's it. You know what I did as a paladin? I tanked trash while the warriors regened their shitty ability point things and then I cured people of fucking diseases while watching T.V. during boss fights. Don't get me wrong, that shit was awesome at the time. I'm just saying, don't say it's "Better" than WoW until you've actually raided something on Wow.

What I will say is that EQ fostered a generally much more mature and interesting community, by virtue of forcing people to work together in such large groups at all times and those large groups generally being led by somewhat mature individuals (Xanupox aside). WoW's community, like most online games these days, fucking sucks. This is largely because unlike Everquest, it doesn't matter what you do to the people around you. Piss off enough people by being an ass or ninjalooting in a pug or something, and you can just drop 10 dollars for a namechange or server transfer. Many guilds are so desperate for players, they'll take anybody, regardless of past actions or history. This generally wasn't the case in EQ; your reputation meant something, and each player was a representation of the guild as a whole*. WoW does NOT have that mentality generally, although there ARE many guilds that try to maintain a positive image. Some (most) simply don't care. I could give anecdotes, but I'm sure you're already familiar. However, there are also many, many more guilds per player on each server. On Medivh alone there are something like 45 active 25 man raiding guilds, and hundreds of small, casual guilds. It's simply easier to get away with being an asshole on WoW that it was on EQ. Unless you had air force buddies.

Find a group of players you like and don't let them go, because WoW players as a group are fucking annoying pieces of cretinous shit. Best of luck to you, and if you've got any questions or anything, don't hesitate to post them =D.

*P.S. I'm not saying every guild on Veeshan was a shining example of everything that is good in humanity - but most EQ guilds at least cared somewhat about their reputation even outside of a raiding-progression level and the reputations of their players, and wouldn't take applicants that were known to be asinine fuckups.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 17, 2009, 9:23 am

The other thing that is different about WoW as compared to EQ is that Class Balancing is a constantly shifting... I don't know a good metaphor, so just insert one here.

Classes get nerfed and buffed in a matter of weeks and months, not YEARS like in EQ. So one day Arms might be amazing, and the next it might not. I can tell you that prior to Shattering Throw and Juggernaut, Arms Warriors were severely underpowered in Arena. Now they're basically back on top. It could very easily shift again at the start of Season 6.

They're actually already nerfing Juggernaut down to a 25% crit chance rather than 100%. So be prepared for that. It's usually small changes, but they come at a pretty rapid pace sometimes, and it can really change the PVP dynamic. Just be prepared to have to keep up-to-date with sites like http://www.mmo-champion.com and stuff for relevant class changes. Knowing your own class (and every other class) changes is extremely important, especially for PVP scenarios, and there is very likely to be at least a few tweaks each patch, and a few in between.

Oh, and I hope you rolled a Human. Or Orc if you're horde.

Bojangels · Post by **Bojangels** » May 17, 2009, 8:31 pm

I just started playing WoW...it's pretty fun, but I wish it was easier to do instances. Seems like it takes forever just to zone in, and it's a pain to get a group to stay together. Is this a new problem? I hadn't ever heard of it before. Seems like something they'd want to fix.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » May 17, 2009, 11:37 pm

Bojangels wrote:I just started playing WoW...it's pretty fun, but I wish it was easier to do instances. Seems like it takes forever just to zone in, and it's a pain to get a group to stay together. Is this a new problem? I hadn't ever heard of it before. Seems like something they'd want to fix.

Haven't had that problem for a long time...

There is *still* an issue w/ the entire server lagging every time Wintergrasp is running, but I haven't had issues zoning lately.

NB, zoning requires people to reload their mods every time they zone, so if someone has a lot of mods they can time out from the server before all that is loaded. A lot of people needed to turn off all their mods to zone into Dalaran once it started to get busy.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » May 18, 2009, 12:30 am

Oh, and I hope you rolled a Human. Or Orc if you're horde.

Tauren. My war stomp and I are inseparable.

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » May 18, 2009, 10:12 am

Moo

Love the cows.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 18, 2009, 11:10 am

I'm glad I could spark some WoW discussion around here... I've been playing the DK (yes, human) every night so far and enjoying it. Finished the DK entry quest line two days ago and was disappointed that now I'm against the Lich King. I was like hey wait a minute, nobody asked me what I think! I didn't agree to this!

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » May 18, 2009, 12:58 pm

Fash wrote:I'm glad I could spark some WoW discussion around here... I've been playing the DK (yes, human) every night so far and enjoying it. Finished the DK entry quest line two days ago and was disappointed that now I'm against the Lich King. I was like hey wait a minute, nobody asked me what I think! I didn't agree to this!

This weekend I went back and played my 3 70-72 range characters because I've gotten a little bored of being nothing but DPS (Rog). Between my DK, Paladin and Priest, I found my Paladin to be the most fun. Both DK and Paladin cleared quests/packs of mobs incredibly well and pretty much never died (afk deaths), while my Priest didn't die, but also didn't clear things in near the amount of time. DK and Paladin both had like 0 downtime, Priest ended up drinking now and then.

I ended up going from 72 to halfway through 76 this weekend on my Paladin because I liked the idea of being non-stop DPS fest to jumping into a healer role (I paid for dual spec) when grinding quests got old. I still haven't really gotten that great at dealing with spread damage well, I always feel like I'm panicing trying to heal everyone in group while keeping the tank alive.

I think I'll end up hitting 80 on my server, and making the decision of which character I want to keep playing between Rogue and Paladin. I will probably also transfer off this server to one of the "Horde Disneyland" servers like Mal'ganis so I can have the added bonus of increased and successful pugs.

Do yourself a favor and learn both aspects of the DK, DPS and Tanking, as it opens up a lot more options for grouping. I really dislike people who's classes can easily fill 2 roles but refuse to do one over the other. Especially when we're doing leveling instances when presumably people are questing as well as grinding and can build 2 sets of gear. DK's especially have it easy imo since most of their specs can hold reasonable agro and simply just need to throw on some Tank gear to bust through some leveling instances. This is why I paid for dual spec and run Ret/Holy, I'm still learning how to effectively manage healing group dmg/keeping tank alive. I like Bacon of Light, although I still haven't reached a comfortable balance of, when to keep it up and when not to -- although I think this will come as I remember what abilities mobs do in these instances.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » May 18, 2009, 8:58 pm

mmm bacon of light

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 19, 2009, 2:03 pm

Paladin ftw. I prefer Prot over Ret as my dualspec, but I suppose that's because I have an Arms warrior alt, and Ret seems so dull in comparison to Arms.

Too bad you can't make a blood elf warrior. If there's any racial more goddamned annoying it's that "hey let me instant silence your entire fuckmothering team while I rape your fucking face off" bullshit. At least warstomp has a cast time, even if it's short.

Their racial instantly makes up for how innately gay blood elves are.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » May 26, 2009, 1:08 pm

Having a blast on the battlegrounds! I had never played them before this weekend... In the past 4 days I played and won AV and WSG a couple times each and racked up 23 achievements, 2600 honor. It kinda stopped my levelling (at 59) but this I can get hooked on.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 27, 2009, 5:59 am

Wait til you can do Strand of the Ancients. I believe that comes at 80. SOTA is incredibly fun, although the Horde seem to lose it - a lot.

At 70 you get to do Eye of the Storm, but I personally am not fond of EOTS.

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » May 27, 2009, 9:32 am

Much love for the Strands. I have 99 tokens for them and under 10 for each of the others. The hardest part about Strands is getting people to understand how to play it. They still like to fight people when they are in the tanks instead of going for the objective or they stay on the beach when the fight is long past that.

Bagar- · Post by **Bagar-** » May 29, 2009, 7:56 am

My pet peeve is when we're trying to keep the countyard clear after taking Yellow Gate down, and the resing people at the south / east / west graveyards zerg their stupidasses BACK TO THE FUCKING COURTYARD rather than grabbing more Demolishers to take down the chamber door.

EVERY time I res I check to see if any Demos are available, but apparently simply rushing up and fighting the horde is more important than actually winning

.

Avestan · Post by **Avestan** » June 1, 2009, 10:03 pm

Got 3-4 old Veeshan players in a guild on Proudmoore (alliance). We are doing Uludar 25, but only raid twice a week and are casual friendly.

If anyone is looking for a decent group of friendly people and you are willing to transfer, lemme know.

Psyloche · Post by **Psyloche** » June 1, 2009, 11:27 pm

Avestan wrote:Got 3-4 old Veeshan players in a guild on Proudmoore (alliance). We are doing Uludar 25, but only raid twice a week and are casual friendly.

If anyone is looking for a decent group of friendly people and you are willing to transfer, lemme know.

Why couldn't you be horde!