Nvidia GeForce GTX 260/280 Review

[Winnow]

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvi ... ,1953.html

First look not so good with new nVidia cards.

Looks like there's no need to get one unless you're running higher than 1920X1200, even then, with current drivers, the 9800GTX2 beats it them out sometimes. Then again, the 9800GTX2 is a pretty beastly card.

Still, no rush to buy after seeing those initial stats.

[Aardor]

There is no such think as a 9800gtx2, it's a 9800gx2.

Though I agree with most of the "final thoughts" or "conclusions" parts of the reviews of the 260/280, they are all pretty much a failure. Barely any reviews tested in resolutions lower than 1920x1200, and I don't recall seeing any below 1680x1050. Here, the gtx 280 would have plowed the competition. With games taking advantage of multiple GPUs more and more, it comes as no surprise to me that last generation SLI/CF solutions keep up with the new generation cards at the huge resolutions. Having another GPU to split rendering pixels with just becomes too important at 1920x1200+.

So sure it is disappointing that the new card did not absolutely blow the last generation out of the water, like what happened with the 8800gtx, but the card is still damn good, if you are willing to pay the extreme price. I think ATI will hit a very good market spot (finally) with it's cards that perform pretty closely to the 260, but at a much reduced price. The 4850/4870 benchmarks come out on Monday, so I will be able to say that more conclusively then, or I might be wrong.

[Winnow]

There is no such think as a 9800gtx2, it's a 9800gx2.

my bad

I'll be sticking with 1920x1200/1080 gaming for awhile so the newer cards aren't looking like a must have. Multimedia/Desktop Publishing, etc is continuing to creep up in importance for me.

ATi does look like it has a chance to make a comeback this round. The last dominant card they had was the 9700Pro!

[Kluden]

The 1900xtx had a supreme advantage in picture quality over the nvidia 7 series of cards...so that was the last dominent ATI card...but, just like the new nvidia 280 gtx...the price did not work for what you could have for less money.

The 280gtx and 260gtx are fantastic video cards. Matching or beating the dual gpu card from a few months ago is a good feat. The drivers will make it a clear winner POSSIBLY in a few weeks.

The other issue right now, and this one pisses me off, is that Nvidia has now stated that they are released a new driver that will up the performance of the 9800GTX by leaps and bounds. Well, if you think about that, it would mean that in the least, all G92 GPU based nvidia cards will have the improvement. Well, that's your 8800GT, GTS, 9800GTX, and 9800GX2. So, what that also means is that Nvidia was holding back some performance on these cards...which will also make the new cards more worthless at their current price/performance points.

The prices will come down. They will not survive that high, plus the die shrink will help slightly with pricing when that happens sooner, rather than later, now that all the reviews bitch about the size, heat, power and price.

But keep in mind, the 280 gtx is twice as fast as the "last gen" fastest single GPU card (9800GTX)...and that is a HUGE feat. Downplaying that is just silly, to say the least. So give the card its propers, because it is the king of the hill, for now.


Lots of folks seem to think the ati 4870 will be some crazy monster...I don't think it will be. Its not going to beat the 280 gtx. But it will easily win in price to performance ratio...and that's where it matters because it will sell.

I'm thinking that by september, the 280gtx will be $500, and the 260gtx will be $330. Much more attractive pricing than currently. The real question is, in august, will the ati 4870x2 be faster than the 280gtx?

[Winnow]

The 1900xtx had a supreme advantage in picture quality over the nvidia 7 series of cards...so that was the last dominent ATI card...but, just like the new nvidia 280 gtx...the price did not work for what you could have for less money.
?

I don't call that dominating. Price and speed play a factor. The ATi 9700Pro blew away the competition in Price/Performance, picture quality and pure power and did so for over a year (and more). It's been nVidia's 6800, 7800, 8800, 9800 since then with Ati entering back into the playing field over the last year. nVidia has dominated but not with a single card as much but with continued releases.

If ATi can put out a card that owns the new 2800 gtx with a better price, it will be a "dominating" card like the 9700Pro, 6800GT, etc. (the nVidia GT's being the best price/performances cards)

Either way, ATi is back in the game and since they are considered to have better picture quality, might be a better choice for people focused on multimedia or not gaming over 1920x1200 resolution since any of the new cards will handle that res easy.

[Kluden]

performance dominance, yes, the 9700.

The picture quality thing is over rated now a days though. Its pretty standard and great for either company cards. The advantage for ATI this time around, not including gaming performance...but the advantage that is most intriguing to me is that 7.1 surround sound over HDMI straight from the graphics card. Nvidia cards use a pass through from the sound card or on board sound, from what I can tell, to get sound over their HDMI interface.

So, big advantage ati to have it all on one card for HD Decoding purposes.

[Winnow]

The advantage for ATI this time around, not including gaming performance...but the advantage that is most intriguing to me is that 7.1 surround sound over HDMI straight from the graphics card. Nvidia cards use a pass through from the sound card or on board sound, from what I can tell, to get sound over their HDMI interface.

So, big advantage ati to have it all on one card for HD Decoding purposes.

Now that's a nice feature for me with my HTPC setup. The current 9600GT specialized card I recently purchased with HDMI and audio pass through has been hit or miss depending on the source. AoC sometimes works with my TV and othertimes I have to use my full Home Theater system, unless I want to listen to it on my little creative PC speakers which aren't really that bad but are pointed at me from the side instead of front when I'm playing on the big screen.

Reliable audio through DVI-->HDMI would lean me toward the ATi cards. On the other hand, I have TOS Link from my PC to my Home Theater Receiver so that takes care of the audio unless I'm using the TV's built in speakers.

[Aardor]

Translated conclusion from a french site regarding the 4850 (looks very promising):

This small glimpse of the performance of the Radeon HD 4850 is rather promising. Contrary to what some would have thought given its marketing early, before the official launch date, the card has a real interest. Available at a price of 159 €, it displays a value for money with which currently no Nvidia card can not fight. Without antialiasing she displayed a level of performance similar to the GeForce 9800 GTX, but it is negotiated in the best case to € 220, often more.


Once that is antialiasing turned on that map is most comfortable and this time ahead of the GeForce 9800 GTX, sometimes significantly in situations where consumption memory is important, the GeForce having more difficulty manage that. With its new GPU, AMD thus seems to have finally corrected this defect of the Radeon HD 2000 and 3000 and returned to its traditional strong point.

See you next week for a full test of Radeon HD 4800!

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/724-1/p ... -4850.html

On par with a 9800GTX till AA is on, then it surpasses it. Not bad at all for $200. Also, Google Translation is pretty awesome.

[Kluden]

If these articles are true, than the 4850 will be the greatest vid card since the 9700 days...and probably would be considered better considering the UDM2 featureset. The resolutions they are testing at is the true test though. Turning AA on at super low resolutions proves nothing. its what it can do with AA when showing a 1080p gaming scene that matters.

AA destroys the 2900xt I have...but I don't seem to notice no AA in most games at 1680x1050 anyways.

I'm still going to wait and see what the 4870 has to offer, as I would much rather have a single card over dual cards, and I believe that the reviews next wednesday will have both the 4850 and 4870 reviewed.

edit: That french review has its charts shown in a thread over at Hardforum. Looks on par with the 3870X2...that's a damn good thing.

God damn I feel like such a dork getting all excited for video cards...wtf is wrong with me?

[Canelek]

I am glad to hear they are going to have a new driver for the 9800GTX. If it makes a visible differnece, that would be pretty killer. Still waiting for the prices to drop....would be cool to cheaply add another! Hell, 3 would be even better, but I am not sure I would want those monsters all jammed together like that!

[Kluden]

OH, this is a good one.

Apparently, thousands of 4850's have already been sold and shipped out because the etailers "screwed up"...so AMD has decided to OK their release to TODAY, instead of next wednesday. I can confirm that buy.com sent out 4850's on Tuesday if you bought one on their store before they marked it as "unavailable".

So, 4850 reviews should start popping up today since the NDA on 4850 is now officially lifted. 4870 still embargoed to next wednesday. The etailers apparantly know the price/performance ratio is so killer...they wanted to get it on with sales.


edit: Nvidia, you so crazy! To combat the 4850/4870 price and performance numbers, nvidia is releasing a NEW 9800GTX. Its the G92b core...ie, 55nm instead of 65nm process. Higher clocks stock and all that jazz. MSRP will be $229. This may be fantastic for those that won't buy anything but nvidia, that's for sure. And beyond that, the "old" 9800GTX is going to have an MSRP of 199.

What a great time to be in the market for a video card.

[Winnow]

edit: Nvidia, you so crazy! To combat the 4850/4870 price and performance numbers, nvidia is releasing a NEW 9800GTX. Its the G92b core...ie, 55nm instead of 65nm process. Higher clocks stock and all that jazz. MSRP will be $229. This may be fantastic for those that won't buy anything but nvidia, that's for sure. And beyond that, the "old" 9800GTX is going to have an MSRP of 199.

What a great time to be in the market for a video card.

nVidia has been ahead for so long now they've been just waiting for ATi to release a competitive card to slash their prices. I imagine it makes it hard for ATi to compete when they have to always sell their cards at lower prices to begin with.

Great to have competition again! Looking forward to seeing the 4870 benchmarks.

[Canelek]

Just checked newegg for the prices on the EVGA 9800GTX cards (which I have). Still $270-$300, but hopefully will drop as soon as the new shit is available. Would be sweet to go SLI on the cheap soon!

[Aardor]

Just checked newegg for the prices on the EVGA 9800GTX cards (which I have). Still $270-$300, but hopefully will drop as soon as the new shit is available. Would be sweet to go SLI on the cheap soon!

I hope you only use one monitor.

[Canelek]

Yeah. Although I could find uses for a second monitor, I prefer a single large monitor for gaming.

[Kluden]

Winnow, if that's true...which it may very well be for the G92 stuff...if should piss you off to be an nvidia customer if they "rip you off" from the start. I know it boils me to have to buy something at an inflated price because they just want to or can.

This is not the case with the GTX 280/260 though. Those cards cost way to much to make...so there really isn't a way for nvidia to make those two more price attractive without losing money, which they won't do, because that's just bad business.

Cano, you are going to have to wait for those prices to be active. My guess is sometime in July.

[Winnow]

This is not the case with the GTX 280/260 though. Those cards cost way to much to make...so there really isn't a way for nvidia to make those two more price attractive without losing money, which they won't do, because that's just bad business.

They don't need to make those cards cheap. They can make the 9800GTX card cheap which is the one that competes with the new ~$200 ATi card.

I don't blame nVidia for keeping prices high when there's no competition. I blame ATi for slacking off, allowing nVidia to keep prices high. Intel does the same thing although lately, everything's cheap.

[Kluden]

Its nice that there is competition to keep these guys in check, I just hate seeing the making money just because we can method.

Either way, Larabee will be the king hopefully and it will all get cheaper in 2010.

and yes, they need to make the GTX 280 cheaper. It is no better than their own solution at <$450 right now in the GX2 when playing at normal resolutions that most folks use (1920x and less).

So if the 4870 competes with the GTX 260 for $100 less, then you bet the GTX280 will be short lived, or cheaper by august.

[Kluden]

And so it begins: EVGA 9800GTX for $199.

Even better, the Asus 9800GTX has an instant rebate WHEN YOU ADD IT TO YOUR CART, along with a mail in rebate, making it $164.99 for a 9800GTX. Go get it HERE, ADD IT TO YOUR CART...mail in rebate.

So, its $229.99 - $35 instant rebate - $30 mail in rebate = $164.99. Outstanding price I may even buy it now.

[Canelek]

Oh hells yeah!

Just ordered a 2nd EVGA 9800GTX, as well as a couple Thermaltake 120mm fans. The fans have a higher top cfm that will go nicely with my Zalman fan controller.

[Aardor]

Have my machine running with 2 x 4850's. Liking the cards a great deal so far. I have Age of Conan running at 1920x1200 16AF 4xAA pretty much maxed everything else, and get an average of 40fps.

[Canelek]

Cool! I bet it looks really nice.

I am expecting my second 9800GTX today, so will see if that makes a big difference in a few games.

[Canelek]

At around $400 it seems going 9800GTX in SLI (2) is the most cost effective route. Benchmarks are fantastic, with huge gains over the single 9800GTX, while getting outperformed by 9800GX2 SLI and 9800GTX 3-SLI.

Any numbers on the new shit yet compared to 9800GTX, SLI, GX2, GX2 SLI, etc?

I took some shots of my machine as I was cleaning up some wiring & installing the 2nd card. Will post as soon as I get a new image editor.

[Aslanna]

Only a year ago I picked up a 8800GTX for like.. $500. So $200 for the 'latest and greatest' seems like a good deal. I doubt I'll replace the 8800 anytime soon though as I don't really do much graphically intensive stuff. Which hopefully means when I do upgrade things will be even cheaper. I don't really think I was "ripped off" though. When you're the market leader you can pretty much charge what you want. Nobody was forcing people to pay that much for a video card. Having said that it's nice to see things at a more reasonable level.

(Oh. Guess the 9800 isn't the latest and greatest. My mistake!)

[Canelek]

Definately not the greatest (9800GTX), but once you go SLI, you see huge increases and it becomes a solid/top performer among its peers. A 3rd card yields not as much improvement and alone it gets smoked.

So, $400 gets you a SLI option that is very nice, but not omgthebest!

[Aardor]

Definately not the greatest (9800GTX), but once you go SLI, you see huge increases and it becomes a solid/top performer among its peers. A 3rd card yields not as much improvement and alone it gets smoked.

So, $400 gets you a SLI option that is very nice, but not omgthebest!

I would recommend 2 4850's over 2 9800GTX's due to SLI not doing multiple monitors, and forcing you to use nvidia chipsets. However, both of them are $400 solutions that give you the performance of the $650 solution (GTX 280).

[Aardor]

Wow. Fastest price drop ever? 2 weeks? Owned.

$90 and $30

As of tomorrow, Nvidia plans drop the prices of Geforce GTX 280 and 260. The reason for this sudden price cut is that the cards are not selling as well as Nvidia expected. The second part of the story is that Radeon HD 4870 ended up better than Nvidia had hoped.


Nvidia will cut $90 of the Geforce GTX 280 price-tag, but this is Nvidia's price to partners and we are not sure just how much will this affect the suggested etail price. We are sure that end user prices will also drop but probably a bit less than $90.

The Geforce GTX 260 will be $30 cheaper to partners and Nvidia will only offer limited price protection which means that some partners / distributors and stores might end up with some overpriced cards at their warehouses.

Many people won’t be happy but as of tomorrow GTX 280 and GTX 260 should be cheaper.

http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?optio ... 2&Itemid=1

I would not have thought ATI could force something like that less than a year ago. Hell, less than a month ago.

[Kluden]

Price/Performance competition is the shit during upgrade season, that's for sure!

Cano, I know you have (1) 9800GTX, so go buy the second...here's a PNY 9800GTX for $199 - $50 main in rebate for a nice price of $149 +tax/shipping for you.

I myself am going with either a 4870 or a 260GTX...whichever I can get cheaper in about a month.

[Canelek]

Oh, I already bought the 2nd EVGA 9800GTX for $199 the other week when the price dropped. 2 X 9800GTX fucking rocks, whereas just 1 is not so great.