New phone time

[Funkmasterr]

I think there are a lot of phones out there that are much better feature and quality wise.

/sigh I think we've played this game before...

Why do you think there are phones out there that are better feature and quality wise? There are no phones out there at all that have Apple's software capability, web browsing capability, and integration with your desktop. Please quantify your statement so that I may respond point-by-point.

I'd be glad to do that for you.. Maybe I'll have some time tonight. Features matter to me, but adding software other than what came on my phone and any integration with my computer mean almost nothing to me.. I think when it comes to phones I fall more in the mainstream and less in the techie crowd.

The stuff that is more important to me are the features phones in other countries have that no one has here.. Video phone, better camera phone capability (there are no camera phones in the US that compare to the Japanese phones), amongst other things are what are important to me.

Japanese phones tend to be a bit bigger so that these other/better refined features can be included, and that's fine with me.. I don't have the infatuation with making phones as tiny as possible like most people in the U.S. seem to.

Edit: to be clear right away, there are plenty of Jap phones that have just as good web browsing as the Iphone, minus the touch screen (which I already stated I can't stand.) That one should be easy enough to prove on your own.

What is this world coming to where you give a totally reasonable response?

Anyway, if all you care about is the phone then it's really not worth your time to enumerate why you aren't interested in the iPhone.

The only thing I disagree with is the browser comment.

You're begging if you think you can find a better phone browser than Safari on the iPhone.

I can be civil and discuss things when I feel the other party actually wants to do so in a adult manner

I can agree to disagree with you on this, really. It just comes down to what is more important for you in a phone, and I think we probably differ there quite a bit, which explains why we have continuously disagreed on the topic

[Winnow]

Interesting news about the capped speeds of the iPhone 3G:

http://gizmodo.com/5015307/giz-explains ... iphones-3g

Yeah, yeah, you get it: The new iPhone uses AT&T's best-in class (in NYC at least), 3G high-speed network, one that's getting faster and more spread out all the time. But there's a lot you probably didn't know about the technology involved: How fast can you really go on the thing? Why did AT&T feel the need to cap the iPhone's speed? If you want answers to these and other questions, you came to the right place.

Hokay, the iPhone 3Gness makes browsing a whole 2.4x faster than EDGE in Apple's test. (One thing that we can't explain: Why did Apple chose lonelyplanet.com for its performance benchmarks?) The 3G goodness is real: We've been conducting our own testing of AT&T's HSDPA in the New York area (including suburbs) and it really is faster and more readily available than Verizon's EV-DO 3G network. (For a quick primer on different kinds of 3G like HSDPA vs. EV-DO and other mobile terms, click here.)

But the iPhone 3G is rated for 1.4Mbps, a nice clip but not the 3.6Mbps downstream that AT&T's HSDPA is capable of. (The carrier loves to brag that it'll have 7.2Mbps by the end of the year.) So why not crank up the iPhone to those better data rates? Turns out, according to AT&T people we talked to, 1.4Mbps is the capped bandwidth for all mobile smartphones on the network for a few reasons.

(UPDATE: AT&T is saying they're not capping the phone at 1.4mbps, but that's what its capable of doing now, due to factors below. There's no difference except intent, and AT&T is careful around words like "Cap" these days.)

A major one is battery life—the faster you burn, the faster your battery dies, so going full steam at 3.6Mbps would cut you well short of that nice round five hours. A second one is cell site congestion and backhaul (carrier-speak for size of the wired dataline that connects cell sites to the actual telecom infrastructure). While everyone at AT&T, from the top down, is adamant that AT&T is "comfortable" with their ability to meet the huge data draw once 3G iPhones hit the streets, it's not like the pipe is unlimited.

AT&T wasn't able to give a breakdown as to how many of their towers have fiberoptic pipes as opposed to slower copper T-1 lines. Nor could they say how quickly they could add capacity to a site that is pummeling their demand expectations, since it varies from site to site. Ones in dense urban areas are loaded up with more backhaul and can handle more users than one closer to the edge of their 3G footprint. Still, generally speaking, more users on a site means more congestion, so if you're slurping from a site that's really slammed, it will be slower. As with all radio technologies, proximity also matters. (Hint: For the absolute fastest speeds, wait until 3am and then go sit right next to your favorite cell site.)

[noel]

Seems to me that's not just iPhone specific.

[Funkmasterr]

Seems to me that's not just iPhone specific.

Yeah, I would imagine that will be a major hurdle for us period until battery technology moves forward a bit.

[Sylvus]

There are no phones out there at all that have Apple's ... integration with your desktop.

Is that true for Mac's only, or for PC's as well? Can you give any examples?

I'm thinking of upgrading to the iPhone, but I know very little about it's interaction with a PC.

[Boogahz]

For the brief time that I had a phone with Windows Mobile 6, it was pretty much the same as the iPhone's sync. The only real difference I can think of would be that it syncs with iTunes.

Unless you want to count things that are added by jailbreaking the iPhone.

[noel]

There are no phones out there at all that have Apple's ... integration with your desktop.

Is that true for Mac's only, or for PC's as well? Can you give any examples?

I'm thinking of upgrading to the iPhone, but I know very little about it's interaction with a PC.

I'll be totally honest with you. It's now true for both. It is also however, not a complete statement of the facts.

Here are the facts:

The iPhone 2.0 software represents a night and day difference in usefulness/capability of the iPhone's first software package. The iPhone 2.0 software will be on all iPhone 3Gs and is available for free download/install for the first-Gen iPhone owners. Software developers now have the ability to push information to your phone through a service offered by Apple to the developers. What this means is that IM applications, gmail, etc. don't require you to launch them or for you to have them running constantly and periodically poll for information. The server software can now 'push' a 'wakeup call' to your iPhone that will notify you that an IM or a mail message is waiting. (this software is also available to iTouch users for $10, and of course requires them to be on a WAP to take advantage of it)

Additionally in the 2.0 software, Apple has integrated support for all of their office apps (iWork) and all of MS Office (Word, Excel, Powerpoint) apps.

Finally, for true PC/Mac synchronization with your iPhone they're offering the 'Mobile Me' service. This will essentially allow you to synch folders on your PC, calendars, contacts, mail, etc. with your iPhone without the need for even a synch cable to your PC from your iPhone. If you get a new email, calendar invite, etc. on your PC, it's automatically (after you set it up with the mobile me service) pushed in realtime to your iPhone. So if you get an email, create a calendar event, add a todo item or whatever on your PC, it's on your iPhone within seconds through the cellular or wifi network without you needing to do anything. You don't need iTunes for any of that, I'm speculating, but you might only need iTunes to manage your media library and do occasional firmware/software upgrades on the iPhone.

This service has been around in a more limited capacity and only for your Mac called .mac or 'dot mac'. The service is not part of the iPhone package and costs $99 per year. They're giving away a free 60-day trial of the service to anyone that gets the 3G iPhone, so you have plenty of opportunity to try it out before you decide if it's worth your money. Apple is billing it as 'an exchange server for the rest of us', meaning that you'll have the same benefits as someone running their own exchange server without the need to do so. Part of the mobile me service is also a 20GB webspace where you can host files and allow your friends to download from, online photo albums you can populate with pics from your digital cameras or iPhone (on the fly as I understand it-- i.e. you're out at a bar, take a pic from your phone and you can have it in an album online without the need to go home) and some other stuff I'm not yet aware of.

The other nice aspect of the .me service is that you can use it to keep your mail synched between your PC and Mac even if you don't have an iPhone and again, it all happens in realtime.

There's an overview of the service in the video link I already posted, or more PC specific information can be found here: http://www.apple.com/mobileme/features/pc.html

I'm already subscribed to .mac and my service will be automatically rolled over to the .me service so there's no additional cost to me. I downloaded the introduction video for .me, but I haven't had a chance to watch it yet.

So to be fair, it's not your iPhone by itself, it's a $100 per year service, but the service has other meaningful benefits, so it's really up to you to decide if they're worth it to you. I'm sure there are people that it won't be worth it to.

There's also a shitload of Enterprise stuff built in to the 2.0 sofware. Cisco VPN client, support for most every Wifi security protocol available, and quite a bit of other things that are too numerous to list, and not really what you asked about. For me, the Cisco VPN is meaningful because it allows me to VPN into my company's network and access my webmail page for my work email, essentially removing the need for me to use my Blackberry for work email. There may be some application for you there as well.

One thing I'd add, and this is just personal preference, but I looked at every single smartphone out there, and played with them quite a bit in the Sprint store, AT&T store, and Apple store. I have yet to see a US based phone with a UI that I liked. I was actually pretty disappointed in the screens/look/feel of the Windows based phones. I expected them to look a lot better for some reason. I'm in no way anti-Microsoft, and I frequently recommend Windows Mobile phones to people that need to support windows apps on their mobile. In my opinion for UIs, it's iPhone, Blackberry, and Windows Mobile at a distant third, but the manner in which you can web browse on the iPhone and the quality of the screen puts it ahead of every other US based phone I've seen for browsing.

I'm gonna try to watch the Mobile Me intro video after the Lakers get done assraping the Celtics, so I'll let you know if there's anything more that's worth knowing.

Edit: Watched the video during halftime/commercials. There's a free 60 day trial available for everyone. Given that you can use it to keep your work/home PC synched in a fashion, it might be worthwhile to watch the video and try it out. Depending on your level of computer savvy, it might be more than you need/want, but it also might be rather useful.

[Spang]

I'm gonna try to watch the Mobile Me intro video after the Lakers get done assraping the Celtics, so I'll let you know if there's anything more that's worth knowing.

Too bad there's more than 1 quarter in a basketball game.

[noel]

I'm gonna try to watch the Mobile Me intro video after the Lakers get done assraping the Celtics, so I'll let you know if there's anything more that's worth knowing.

Too bad there's more than 1 quarter in a basketball game.

No doubt. Hopefully this game has a happy ending for those of us rooting for Phil Jackson's 10th ring. (I'd be totally happy seeing Garnett get a ring cause I think he's a good guy, but I'm rooting for Jackson, not really the Lakers)

[Boogahz]

I think the Lakers went to watch the video before they wrapped the game up too...

[Truant]

I ended up getting this phone:
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone- ... =sku980089

I'm extremely happy with it. It meets all the requirements I needed, and i enjoy using it more than my last phone.

[Winnow]

I ended up getting this phone:
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone- ... =sku980089

I'm extremely happy with it. It meets all the requirements I needed, and i enjoy using it more than my last phone.

Looks like it has some nice features. The ones that stand out for me:

# Stereo Bluetooth® connectivity
# 3G high speed data access via Broadband 3G network
# Multitasking use voice and data simultaneously
# Instant Messaging - AOL®, Windows Live and Yahoo!® Messenger ( probably wouldn't use but nice that it has it)
# microSD(TM) memory slot for Picture, Video, and Music storage

[Winnow]

I called one of the local Sprint Stores and the rep had no idea how many or what the cost would be for the new Samsung Instinct Phone on Friday.

Several sources say it will be priced at $200 now that the iPhone 3G has been set to that price. Of course, that's after a rebate, etc. I want to pick one up but have a feeling they'll sell out their first batch pretty fast. You might be able to buy it outright for 350 or 450.00.

I might have to try Best Buy:

The instinct is gonna be $199 with rebates unless you go to a best buy mobile store they will have it for $199 straight up no games no rebate forms no rebate going on a card just $199 plus tax. and other than Sprint corporate stores best buy will be the only place you'll find it for 60 days.

I just called up a Best Buy store and the rep said they had 15 on order with a street date of 6/29 (nine days later) with a $599.00 price tag without contract. Hmmm. Maybe they don't tell the little guys the scoop until close to the release date.

[Winnow]

someone posted a site with the full training guide for the Instinct:

https://training.samsungtelecom.com/sprint

Go here.

enter

Username-jcollins12@sprint.com
Password-ahead

full training guide straight from samsung.


Including a full emulator.

Theres some cool stuff on that training site for Samsung salespeople : )

After you logon using the info above, hit "get started" and then you can access various things including the simulator.

Check out the simulator. When you get to the simulator, click the menu and select: Innovative User Interface and Menus for a long list of viewable demos.

Also check out "Selling the Instinct" for a chuckle.

YOu might be able to directly access the simulator here:

https://training.samsungtelecom.com/spr ... index.html

There's also the manual for the Instinct but that's not as cool:

Here's the Instinct Manual in PDF format for those curious:

http://www.sprint.com/cdma/assets/pdfs/ ... 6=instinct

[Boogahz]

When I was phone shopping last December, I realized that there was really no reason at all to shop at places like the Sprint stores. Their prices were undercut by Sprint's online site, big box stores, and other site's that specialize in phones/plans. Also, they often had less information than you would find at the other sources. I suspect that you might actually be able to find some Sprint stores that actually have Sprint employees, but the stores I checked all appeared to basically be franchise-type stores with employees that were working there for a free phone or service. They didn't know crap.

[Funkmasterr]

When I was phone shopping last December, I realized that there was really no reason at all to shop at places like the Sprint stores. Their prices were undercut by Sprint's online site, big box stores, and other site's that specialize in phones/plans. Also, they often had less information than you would find at the other sources. I suspect that you might actually be able to find some Sprint stores that actually have Sprint employees, but the stores I checked all appeared to basically be franchise-type stores with employees that were working there for a free phone or service. They didn't know crap.

Sprint has the worst customer service of almost any large corporation I can think of, and their in-store staff is pathetic, as you outlined. They also don't mind doing dirty business, like giving a 5% discount a month without saying anything and renewing another 2 year contract for you.

Fuck Sprint.

[Ashur]

I don't know, I think T-Mobile can give Sprint a run for their money in shitty service...

I got totally screwed by them and "to make it up to me" they offered me 6 free months of service when I called to cancel. While I was adamant about quitting, the 6-free months did change my attitude. I confirmed I was going to get 6 months with no charges and the CSR confirmed that. So I didn't cancel.

Yet every month they billed me, I would call in and the CSR would apologize and take care of it.

FIVE MONTHS LATER of this stuff I asked to talk to a supervisor because no matter what the CSR said each month, I kept getting charged and it kept adding up with "past due charges", so there was something systematic in the works I needed assistance with. Said supervisor "clarified" for me that what I had been offered was not "six free months" but the "the sixth month free" (i.e. I get billed 5 in a row, they credit the 6th) and told me that I had misunderstood them and was obliged to pay the charges.

There's a HUMONGOUS difference between "six free months" and "the sixth month free" and there's no way in fucking hell I "misunderstood" them or agreed to that. The CSR making the offer did not understand it, because I asked a dozen clarifying questions to ensure that was precisely what they were offering and confirmed the offer I'd been made every month when I spoke to a billing representative about the error. Yet the manager "confirmed" that not only was I NOT offered that but that no one there was AUTHORIZED to offer that.

I immediately informed him I was canceling service and would not pay any invoices sent my way and then he informed me I faced a cancellation fee for ending the contract early. I was like "I ended my two year contract close to six months ago and have not agreed to an extension, there is no early termination in play here.", yet it appears the same CSR who gave me "six free months" noted that I had agreed to a new two-year contract. I told him that was not only a blatent untruth, but unless they could produce a tape of me agreeing to those terms I never wanted to hear from them again.

I think I saw one more invoice from them, which I didn't pay, and then I never heard from them (or a creditor representing them) again.

Fuck T-mobile! I'm quite happy with Verizon (especially since it's free as a gift from my Mom, two extra line costs her all of $20 or so and we use negligible minutes and she can call us for free ).

[Funkmasterr]

I don't know, I think T-Mobile can give Sprint a run for their money in shitty service...

I got totally screwed by them and "to make it up to me" they offered me 6 free months of service when I called to cancel. While I was adamant about quitting, the 6-free months did change my attitude. I confirmed I was going to get 6 months with no charges and the CSR confirmed that. So I didn't cancel.

Yet every month they billed me, I would call in and the CSR would apologize and take care of it.

FIVE MONTHS LATER of this stuff I asked to talk to a supervisor because no matter what the CSR said each month, I kept getting charged and it kept adding up with "past due charges", so there was something systematic in the works I needed assistance with. Said supervisor "clarified" for me that what I had been offered was not "six free months" but the "the sixth month free" (i.e. I get billed 5 in a row, they credit the 6th) and told me that I had misunderstood them and was obliged to pay the charges.

There's a HUMONGOUS difference between "six free months" and "the sixth month free" and there's no way in fucking hell I "misunderstood" them or agreed to that. The CSR making the offer did not understand it, because I asked a dozen clarifying questions to ensure that was precisely what they were offering and confirmed the offer I'd been made every month when I spoke to a billing representative about the error. Yet the manager "confirmed" that not only was I NOT offered that but that no one there was AUTHORIZED to offer that.

I immediately informed him I was canceling service and would not pay any invoices sent my way and then he informed me I faced a cancellation fee for ending the contract early. I was like "I ended my two year contract close to six months ago and have not agreed to an extension, there is no early termination in play here.", yet it appears the same CSR who gave me "six free months" noted that I had agreed to a new two-year contract. I told him that was not only a blatent untruth, but unless they could produce a tape of me agreeing to those terms I never wanted to hear from them again.

I think I saw one more invoice from them, which I didn't pay, and then I never heard from them (or a creditor representing them) again.

Fuck T-mobile! I'm quite happy with Verizon (especially since it's free as a gift from my Mom, two extra line costs her all of $20 or so and we use negligible minutes and she can call us for free ).

I have been with T-Mobile and haven't had anything but good experiences with their customer service. The one big difference I noticed right away was language, no one at Sprint's customer service spoke english very well.. And I'm not being nitpicky here, they were all in india and I would have to ask the rep I was speaking to to repeat themselves 2 or 3 times on average before I figured it out. T-Mobile is the exact opposite.

Maybe you just had a bad experience with T-Mobile. I haven't heard anything bad from other people around here, and pretty much anyone I know that has ever had Sprint detests their customer service.

Verizon wasn't bad when I had them either, I just can't get behind the restrictions and pricing they have on their data plans.

[Boogahz]

I have heard horror stories about all of the carriers (except Verizon, but I don't know anyone that uses them personally). Each of them has been said to have extended contracts, and from news reports, that seems to be a very common practice when any type of change is made. The only way I got around it was by knowing someone that worked for the company I was with years ago. They had a way to make a change and NOT renew the contract, but there was no guarantee that it would happen that way.

Personally, I have "tried" Sprint three times. The first two times, I canceled within a week and within two days due to receiving tons of calls for people that apparently had the numbers a short time before I got them. I even had the number reset once, and received two calls for someone else within 15 minutes of them doing this. The last time I canceled with them, it was because the phone I had was not capable of what the sales person sold it to me as. It was a Moto9q(something) which Sprint had disabled wi-fi on. I canceled within the first month every time, and I never really had any issues with billing. I usually ended up with a refund, but some error happened the last time I had them. It was resolved with a phone call though. Rather than just prorating the billing based on when I had the service, they actually waived the entire thing.

[Winnow]

I've been in a Sprint store once and have been with them for 12-14 years. If I go to one on Friday it will be my second visit. I bought my last Sprint phone at Fry's and the sales person activated it there.

I have 150.00 24 month phone credit to put towards a new phone but I think it doesn't matter for the instinct. They're offering 150.00 off if you sign a 24 month extension which is pretty much what my 150.00 is anyway except I think anyone can get it.

After going through that entire Instinct simulator (which is very well done and a big help in determining if the phone does what you want BTW), I think I'll be happy with the phone. I have an iTouch and it rots on a shelf. I'm looking forward to the stereo bluetooth the most. Much hate for wires. I like the actual phone functionality of the Instinct with the voice commands I'm used to from previous Samsung phones. The GPS abilities of the Instinct look to be much better than what the new iPhone 3G's as well. (check the simulator).

I wouldn't rate the Instinct over the iPhone by any means but it does have a few areas where it shines, one being as an actual phone/GPS device.

[Ashur]

Maybe you just had a bad experience with T-Mobile.

You could say that. Isn't "a bad experience" as a customer the definition of "bad customer service"?

[Funkmasterr]

Maybe you just had a bad experience with T-Mobile.

You could say that. Isn't "a bad experience" as a customer the definition of "bad customer service"?

I guess I could have made that clearer. I am thinking maybe you just had a bad experience but T-Mobile isn't so bad overall. I can't think of anyone I know that hasn't had multiple bad experiences with Sprint (winnow is always the exception to the rule, so I'm not counting him.)

[Ashur]

OK, yeah, they were bombarding me with how great their JD Power rankings were while I was on hold to be called a liar. So I guess I'm the exception.

Let me clarify something. I got my start in Customer Service and was in management in a Customer Service group. I know the scoop and am very courteous to all CSRs.

This isn't "sour grapes" this was horrible customer service.

[Knarlz]

Cell Phones Warn of Elephant Stampede

http://tech.msn.com/news/articlepcw.asp ... &GT1=40000

Why is the US always last to get cutting edge tech????

[Boogahz]

Cell Phones Warn of Elephant Stampede

http://tech.msn.com/news/articlepcw.asp ... &GT1=40000

Why is the US always last to get cutting edge tech????

We don't have herds of 5,000 rampaging elephants?

[Winnow]

To expand on the few things that Samsung's Instinct is more beneficial than Apples new 3G iPhone:

GPS:

Sprint uses the best service for their GPS. Having seen the demos, they take advantage of the service in several ways besides the voice line by line instructions search features for local stores, gas stations, etc.

Apple's iPhone GPS is a shittier implementation and on top of that, their 3rd party rules specifically state that you can't develop a "turn by turn" GPS app.

Sprint Navigation system is built-in and powered by Telenav, the first navigation system adopted by cell phones in US.
It offers voice or onscreen turn-by-turn driving directions directly on your mobile phone, so you can easily locate places you need to arrive at, like restaurants, hotels, shops, totalizing more than 10 million points of interest.

Also, Telenav shows the lowest gas prices in your area, alerts you about the traffic conditions and suggests smart reroutes and the maps are in full color.

On the other side, iPhone uses the Apple’s Maps application developed especially for it, which approximates the location by using cell tower information and Wi-Fi networks.

The hybrid maps show major street names over satellite imagery and the user can also check traffic information in real time.

Apple's GPS sounds lame.

Watching the demos of the Instinct's GPS in action, it actually looks useful, especially finding local places no matter where you travel. This is one area where ease of use is critical otherwise I'd never use it.

SMS:

Sprint includes text messaging in their all inclusive package. AT&T charges for SMS outside of their "unlimited" data plan.

I'm not a texter but I know lots of people are these days.

[Boogahz]

GPS:

Sprint uses the best service for their GPS. Having seen the demos, they take advantage of the service in several ways besides the voice line by line instructions search features for local stores, gas stations, etc.

*cough*bullshit*cough*

okay, maybe it is better than other places, but my first experience using Sprint's GPS and turn-by-turn service left me in the middle of NOWHERE in the middle of the night back in December. I was trying to get to an Office Depot that I had not been to for a last minute Christmas present they had in-stock. It was kind of funny when I told the salesperson about my experience getting there though. He instantly asked if it was with Sprint, and he said that for some reason they didn't comprehend the difference between a State Highway and a Farm-to-Market road.

[Winnow]

GPS:

Sprint uses the best service for their GPS. Having seen the demos, they take advantage of the service in several ways besides the voice line by line instructions search features for local stores, gas stations, etc.

*cough*bullshit*cough*

okay, maybe it is better than other places, but my first experience using Sprint's GPS and turn-by-turn service left me in the middle of NOWHERE in the middle of the night back in December. I was trying to get to an Office Depot that I had not been to for a last minute Christmas present they had in-stock. It was kind of funny when I told the salesperson about my experience getting there though. He instantly asked if it was with Sprint, and he said that for some reason they didn't comprehend the difference between a State Highway and a Farm-to-Market road.

That was before the Instinct! It also very well may depend on where you live. I'm curious to use it from home to work and work to home to see which route is suggests for me as there are three ways for me to get home taking freeways (four but one wouldn't be suggested by GPS and is a longer route)

[Boogahz]

GPS:

Sprint uses the best service for their GPS. Having seen the demos, they take advantage of the service in several ways besides the voice line by line instructions search features for local stores, gas stations, etc.

*cough*bullshit*cough*

okay, maybe it is better than other places, but my first experience using Sprint's GPS and turn-by-turn service left me in the middle of NOWHERE in the middle of the night back in December. I was trying to get to an Office Depot that I had not been to for a last minute Christmas present they had in-stock. It was kind of funny when I told the salesperson about my experience getting there though. He instantly asked if it was with Sprint, and he said that for some reason they didn't comprehend the difference between a State Highway and a Farm-to-Market road.

That was before the Instinct! It also very well may depend on where you live. I'm curious to use it from home to work and work to home to see which route is suggests for me as there are three ways for me to get home taking freeways (four but one wouldn't be suggested by GPS and is a longer route)

Austin, TX. We have no shortage of towers and tech here. The place I was going was to one of the larger shopping areas in town, which means it was nowhere near the FM it was sending me to. It was taking me over 40 miles PAST the store.

[laneela]

If Sprint uses the same system for their GPS as they do for their Mobile Locator, I refuse to believe it's any good anywhere. I have to track some of the dude's from work and often, it'll put them 10+ miles away from their actual location. I thought Cingular had the worst customer service - that is, until I had to deal with Sprint. If my phone wasn't a company phone, I'd deal with whatever cancellation penalties I'd have to and go back to Metro PCS. Their phones are crap but the service is stellar.

[Winnow]

I've considered paying the early contract termination fees and getting an iPhone but I'm not sure I want to. (with the fees not being a factor)

As for GPS, I've never used any GPS device before but I can't imaging Apple's version being better based on what others that are in the know about GPS stuff have said on forums.

I don't know why anyone would want this (most of the time) but there's a Buddy Beacon that will tell your friends exactly where you are. That's not something I would want to be on all the time...BUT!...say you're at a bar and you call a friend or a friend calls you wanting to meet up. You can set your beacon to ON and they can GPS their way right to you using turn by turn navigation. In theory, that sounds pretty cool.

[Boogahz]

I don't know why anyone would want this (most of the time) but there's a Buddy Beacon that will tell your friends exactly where you are. That's not something I would want to be on all the time...BUT!...say you're at a bar and you call a friend or a friend calls you wanting to meet up. You can set your beacon to ON and they can GPS their way right to you using turn by turn navigation. In theory, that sounds pretty cool.

I can do that with software on my Touch...as long as I am in a wi-fi spot

[noel]

To expand on the few things that Samsung's Instinct is more beneficial than Apples new 3G iPhone:

GPS:

Sprint uses the best service for their GPS. Having seen the demos, they take advantage of the service in several ways besides the voice line by line instructions search features for local stores, gas stations, etc.

Apple's iPhone GPS is a shittier implementation and on top of that, their 3rd party rules specifically state that you can't develop a "turn by turn" GPS app.

Sprint Navigation system is built-in and powered by Telenav, the first navigation system adopted by cell phones in US.
It offers voice or onscreen turn-by-turn driving directions directly on your mobile phone, so you can easily locate places you need to arrive at, like restaurants, hotels, shops, totalizing more than 10 million points of interest.

Also, Telenav shows the lowest gas prices in your area, alerts you about the traffic conditions and suggests smart reroutes and the maps are in full color.

On the other side, iPhone uses the Apple’s Maps application developed especially for it, which approximates the location by using cell tower information and Wi-Fi networks.

The hybrid maps show major street names over satellite imagery and the user can also check traffic information in real time.

Apple's GPS sounds lame.

Watching the demos of the Instinct's GPS in action, it actually looks useful, especially finding local places no matter where you travel. This is one area where ease of use is critical otherwise I'd never use it.

SMS:

Sprint includes text messaging in their all inclusive package. AT&T charges for SMS outside of their "unlimited" data plan.

I'm not a texter but I know lots of people are these days.

That's how Apple's maps application works pre-iPhone 3G. The iPhone 3G makes use of actual GPS (there's a new chip/antenna array in the phone). You can get your exact location now.

I have the cell tower triangulation functionality on my Blackberry through Verizon (and before that with AT&T), and though it doesn't work perfectly (how could it?), it's easily good enough to find your location if you're lost, and will normally tell you the level of accuracy by drawing a large circle on the map to show you where you are.

Of course it should go without saying that it's entirely dependent upon your carrier's coverage etc.

The first-gen iPhone and iPod Touch will do triangulation with either cell towers or wifi hot spots.

The only limitation of the 3G is that a data connection (edge or 3G is required to use the maps application). Before you say that sucks, bear in mind that the alternative is to waste 2GB of disk space on map data that's going to change all the time anyway. That said, Tomtom has an application coming out for the iPhone 3G that's supposed to provide just that, so it would appear that the turn-by-turn limitation has been dissolved.

[Winnow]

The only limitation of the 3G is that a data connection (edge or 3G is required to use the maps application). Before you say that sucks, bear in mind that the alternative is to waste 2GB of disk space on map data that's going to change all the time anyway. That said, Tomtom has an application coming out for the iPhone 3G that's supposed to provide just that, so it would appear that the turn-by-turn limitation has been dissolved.

From my understanding, the iPhone lacks the turn by turn navigation and Live Search capabilities. Things like voice command location, example"Locate Pizza" and the Instinct pops up the closest pizza joints based on distance and also ratings. This is more important if traveling of course.

iPhone lacks voice commands altogether unless there's a solid third party app, while the Instinct integrates voice commands throughout it's applications.

This is false advertising! No voice commands. Scotty needs to be using an Instinct!

[noel]

Definitely no voice commands, but it definitely supports turn-by-turn, and offers the location of all the nearest pizza places if you simply type 'pizza'.

Also, their API allows developers to use the GPS data in whatever way they like. As I said, TomTom is planning an app, which could offer audible voice directions as opposed to point by point live updating realtime GPS location data.

http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/maps.html

[Winnow]

Dunno, that doesn't look as detailed this:












Some of the types of voice commands:



Instinct can learn your accent so if you have one, you can still use the voice commands with more success:



I like the idea of the favorites button on the main screen, allowing you to place a mix of all sorts of stuff on one screen (scrollable for more)



Doesn't show here but bookmarks, etc for quick access to VV, etc. You can move iPhones icons around (I think you need to hack it first) but this seems to make more sense with easy click and drag to favorites.

[Truant]

ooc, do you guys actually use those features often enough for them to be determing factors on a phone purchase?

[Funkmasterr]

ooc, do you guys actually use those features often enough for them to be determing factors on a phone purchase?

In the past I would have said no, but lately I have gotten a lot more use out of those types of features.. I hate to say this, and Noel can go ahead and enjoy a laugh at my expense, the iPhone might not be completely out of the picture for me if T-Mobile were to offer it.

I could get a phone from Japan and end up paying upwards of 1k once its shipped, unlocked, and activated, or I could just buy a iPhone for cheaper and actually get a warranty.

I thought having google maps on my phone was nice, it would be TITS to have GPS on my cell phone.. I assure you I would use the hell out of it.

[Winnow]

ooc, do you guys actually use those features often enough for them to be determing factors on a phone purchase?

I don't know. I hope so. I want it to be convenient enough that I will use it.

Here's an example of voice activation and voice guided driving directions:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we0nZEe5yYw

The ease of sending a video to your friend or your own email (which iPhone can't do because it can't make videos)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zWsRfkLu30 (might be gayest demo video I've seen but does show how it's done)

Nice for sending quick videos (like when drunk at Quarks at a FanFaire)

More voice commands: (another direction example at end)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojeaALTX_qg

Now, I think using this to get something like the weather is stupid but using voice commands for calling someone or searches makes a lot of sense while driving, etc.

Also, using touch keypads (iPhone or Instinct) isn't the greatest so being able to voice your searches is a very nice option. For GPS, it looks like Apple offers weak sauce, even with that third party app compared to the Live Search and clearer map screens of the Instinct.

[Fairweather Pure]

I'm also up for a new phone within the next couple of months. I've been with Sprint for almost a decade, but am willing to switch providers if I find a phone I want. The problem is that everytime my contract is up with Sprint, they throw some damn good deals my way and manage to retain my business. If they don't have a phone that really grabs me, they won't retain me again. I've also had some billing issues with Sprint, and their customer service is the very essence of shitastic.

After looking at phones for the past week or so, the LG Voyager is my phone of choice unless something better comes out in the very near future. I really like the option of both touch screen and full keyboard.



http://search.vzw.com/?market=48710&q=v ... b2eFlag=N#

[Boogahz]

FYI: That is the exact same navigation system that could not get me to an established shopping area with a clear address in December.

[Winnow]

Looks like the Instinct will be $230.00 out of pocket with 100.00 rebate returned later:

NEW YORK (Reuters) - The Instinct, Sprint Nextel Corp's (S.N) answer to the iPhone, will sell for $130 after rebate, Sprint said on Wednesday.

Sprint, which has been suffering from steep customer losses, has said it will spend more than $100 million to market the touch-screen Instinct, made by Samsung Electronics (005930.KS), in hopes the phone can help turn around its fortunes.

This was about three times the marketing budget for the biggest phone launch in 2007 by Sprint, which has been bleeding subscribers to rivals such as AT&T Inc (T.N) and Verizon Wireless, a venture of Verizon Communications (VZ.N) and Vodafone Group Plc (VOD.L).

Apple Inc's (AAPL.O) iPhone is sold exclusively by AT&T.

Analysts say it will be tough for Instinct to compete with a new, high-speed iPhone model due to go on sale for $199 on July 11.

Sprint, the No. 3 U.S. mobile service, said the $130 price for the Instinct includes a two-year service contract and a $100 rebate by mail. First announced in early April, the Instinct is expected to go on sale June 20.

(Reporting by Franklin Paul and Sinead Carew; editing by John Wallace)

[noel]

ooc, do you guys actually use those features often enough for them to be determing factors on a phone purchase?

That's a great question, and it's one I used to ask myself... before I had phones that could perform that functionality in a meaningful way. I think the reason that a lot of people are put off by some of the new applications just appearing on phones is because either they've never had a phone that had the functionality, or they never had a phone that did it in a way that was appealing to them. As an example, more and more phones are being released with web browsing applications. VERY few of them do it well, or do it in a way that would make you want to use the application. Add to that that to date, data connections on most providers networks have been too slow to do meaningful data-intensive apps on a phone.

I use lots of apps on my phone constantly. Maps are great, and the new 'my location feature' with cell triangulation has been an awesome, the browser on the Blackberry is probably the third best going right now, I use my notes app, my calendar, my email EXTENSIVELY, and the ability to open standard office apps and PDFs on the Blackberry is nice, but sometimes not rendered in a way that's useful.

I think as more and more phones support these applications in a meaningful way that's appealing to a user, the more they'll start to be seen as essentials instead of luxuries.

Hope that kind of made sense.

I'd also agree with Winnow about the touchpad. The touch screen is probably the thing I'm most concerned about when I move to the iPhone. I've played with it a bit, and it seems nice, but it's also nice to have a tactile keyboard, especially when you're texting while driving. I have some good friends that don't seem to mind it, so hopefully it'll work out for me.

Finally, what do all LG phone interfaces and Fairweather have in common?

They both suck ass. Sounds like a match made in heaven to me.

[Winnow]

I received an email today saying I could pick up the Instinct a day early on the 19th (tomorrow).

It doesn't reserve a phone for me and anyone who preregistered got the email. If there's still some left around early lunchtime, I'll have one tomorrow. I have a feeling there won't be any for Friday.

Word is they have decent stock 20-30 per store but that's really not many.

----

Instinct has the full qwerty landscape keyboard (unlike iPhone's portrait layout) and also has haptic vibration feedback (unlike the iPhone). I don't know if the feedback will make a difference or not until I try it. The bigger keyboard will help.

[Funkmasterr]

ooc, do you guys actually use those features often enough for them to be determing factors on a phone purchase?

That's a great question, and it's one I used to ask myself... before I had phones that could perform that functionality in a meaningful way. I think the reason that a lot of people are put off by some of the new applications just appearing on phones is because either they've never had a phone that had the functionality, or they never had a phone that did it in a way that was appealing to them. As an example, more and more phones are being released with web browsing applications. VERY few of them do it well, or do it in a way that would make you want to use the application. Add to that that to date, data connections on most providers networks have been too slow to do meaningful data-intensive apps on a phone.

I use lots of apps on my phone constantly. Maps are great, and the new 'my location feature' with cell triangulation has been an awesome, the browser on the Blackberry is probably the third best going right now, I use my notes app, my calendar, my email EXTENSIVELY, and the ability to open standard office apps and PDFs on the Blackberry is nice, but sometimes not rendered in a way that's useful.

I think as more and more phones support these applications in a meaningful way that's appealing to a user, the more they'll start to be seen as essentials instead of luxuries.

Hope that kind of made sense.

I'd also agree with Winnow about the touchpad. The touch screen is probably the thing I'm most concerned about when I move to the iPhone. I've played with it a bit, and it seems nice, but it's also nice to have a tactile keyboard, especially when you're texting while driving. I have some good friends that don't seem to mind it, so hopefully it'll work out for me.

Finally, what do all LG phone interfaces and Fairweather have in common?

They both suck ass. Sounds like a match made in heaven to me.

[Spang]

If you're texting while driving, you need your license revoked.

[noel]

I love you guys.

[Fairweather Pure]

Finally, what do all LG phone interfaces and Fairweather have in common?

They both suck ass. Sounds like a match made in heaven to me.

You really seem to have quite the little boner for me lately. I'm not sure what I've done to garner you're incessant trolling, but maybe you could limit the "out of the blue" insults to just every other thread I post in instead of every single thread? I would rather not put you on ignore seeing as how I've never had to resort to that during my entire time posting on this board.


Here's one comparison between iphone and voyager from cnet.

http://reviews.cnet.com/4370-11399_7-33 ... l?tag=lnav

All the reviews and comparisons I've read either rank the voyager ahead, or the results are so close it dosen't really make a difference, even with fanbois from both sides chiming in. It's going to come down to what you want out of your phone, and the iphone is lacking some key features for what I will be using my phone for. A neet-o interface will only carry a product so far if it's lacking key features. Oh yeah, AT&T sucks in my area.

I researched the iphone, voyager, glyde, and instinct (thanks to Winnow). It's between the voyager and instinct now. It will come down to who can offer me a better deal. I would rather have the voyager, but I have a feeling Sprint is going to go out of their way to retain my business, like they always do. I think Friday is the day my wife and I are going out to purchase new phones. I'll keep you posted on what I decide and why.

[Boogahz]

If you're texting while driving, you need your license revoked.

[Spang]

I'm not sure what I've done to garner you're incessant trolling...

Probably downloading 1200 gb of porn within a month and murdering Pepé Le Pew.