Obama WILL be the next president

[Fash]

At least he doesn't have blood on his hands yet.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Thank you Forthe.

I agree with you, of course. Any semi-intelligent person would.

In the same vein, why do white rich people run the country? Could it be because woman and blacks were held down in the past and are working their way up? Could it also be, because white men make up a fuckton of the percentage of people in power today? Is that changing every year? Sure as fuck is. Could it be because blacks only represent 13% of the population? Someone has to fuckign run things! Could it be, because women bear our fucking children? Do they have an innate desire to stay home sometimes and take care fo their children when financial possible for them to do so? Yes, sometimes. Jesus fucking christ already! You fucking narrow minded short sighted cock suckers are never going to learn. *breathe....breathe....clam down Midnyte....clam down*

[Forthe]

Had to go off on a schitzo rant didn't you.

You fail to recognize that exclusionary policies and laws are a big part of the reason rich white men run the show today.

Is it changing? Yes, but fairly slowly. How many decades or centuries would you estimate before this is no longer the case?

[Asheran Mojomaster]

Obama is selling people a dream world that will never work and never happen, and the people dumb enough to buy into that load of bullshit make up for the rest of the momentum he has gained. I really think without those two factors he would be nowhere.

That sums him up for me. He talks a great line, he might even mean it. Doesn't mean he'll be successful.

I'll have to dig up the article, if you look at the people paying for both his and Hilary's campaign, they're both eating from the same trough. Which just means more of the same old BS. He's not an alternative, just a slicker package.

He may have gotten money from some of the same places as her, but has has way more total number of contributors, and the majority of them are from low-mid income families. Unlike Hillary, who got most of her money from the rich and the super rich.

[Asheran Mojomaster]

Had to go off on a schitzo rant didn't you.

You fail to recognize that exclusionary policies and laws are a big part of the reason rich white men run the show today.

Is it changing? Yes, but fairly slowly. How many decades or centuries would you estimate before this is no longer the case?

I believe it has been slowly changing for the past few decades, but that the rate of change is increasing exponentially now. My generation, while still present, has very little racism compared to the older generations that were around for segregation or soon after.

Edit: BTW, I'm from Alabama. Supposedly the south is full of racists, yet Obama not only won Alabama, but has won every one of the south eastern states.

[Daboohk]

Edit: BTW, I'm from Alabama. Supposedly the south is full of racists, yet Obama not only won Alabama, but has won every one of the south eastern states.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/11/ ... topstories

tl;dr?

As has been the case in many primary states, Obama won overwhelming support from African-American voters. They went for him over Clinton 91-9 percent.

But Mississippi white voters overwhelmingly backed the New York senator, supporting her over Obama 72 percent to 21 percent.

[Forthe]

Just reading this now but Obama responding to his pastor:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articl ... hurch.html

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Is it changing? Yes, but fairly slowly. How many decades or centuries would you estimate before this is no longer the case?

A very long time if people like this Rev., Rev. Sharpton, Jesse Jackson and many many Democrats continue to keep the races divided.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Just reading this now but Obama responding to his pastor:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articl ... hurch.html

He's saying the right things now, yet he has been going to this church for 20 years. Taking his kids to listen to this devisive racist bullshit. Breeding more and more racists.

[Kaldaur]

We get it. You're trailblazing us to the path of equal opportunity, and people like Obama are standing in your way. It's a good thing history is cyclical, and all of this has happened before! That means things will get better soon, if only so they can go to shit again. Amirite?

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Not at all. I don't think people like Obama are at fault at all. He puts forth a wonderful and positive message. People like his pastor are the ones at fault. People like Clinton who use race to try and get herself back in the race are at fault.

[Ashur]

You say that as if I've accused people of parroting. I also don't think it's parroting if you reference the fact that it came from a source outside of yourself. I liked McCain once, specifically in 2000, but he's bent to Bush's will in the last few years. He had to or else risked political suicide, but that doesn't excuse him. And I still think he'd be a much better President than Bush was.

I'm sorry Sylvus, I suppose it was a general comment that came out as targeting you specifically and for that I apologize. You have a pretty fair mind. I just get tired of anytime anyone says anything around here that's remotely conservative they get the "sheep of the right" (thx Animale) or "there you go parroting Fox News Talking Heads amirite!??!" shit. It's happening a lot less since Kyo stopped posting, so I guess I should just lighten up, since that also prompted more people to post because they wouldn't feel like they were slamming their proverbial dicks into the pencil sharpener.

That said, nowhere have I seen McCain labeled as Bush III and I usually get my news from the BBC or CNN, so where is it you're seeing this? I've always felt McCain was the guy who's been more of an Independent trying to make it in the Republican party. Hell, when Bush beat him last time for the nomination he was being prompted to run as an independent and I believe his comment was like "I'm a Republican for chrissakes".

I'm voting for McCain in the Fall, but I voted for Obama in the primary as a way of hedging my bets. While some people voted for Hillary because she'd be "easier to beat", I'd just rather have a choice between two people I could stomach in the office.

[Noysyrump]

Most people seem to be missing the real point of this whole reverend dilema.

Is what he said really truely hateful? Yes AND no. Some things are just gov't bashing, somethings are just statements of the percieved. The real problem is the devisivness of his words. By simply saying "Those rich white people" you set it into the minds of those who listen that they are different. Then to say "they control the world" you set it that they are better, and that it is they that keep you down! So what this man has been doing, is generating (or keeping alive) segragation. What does that all mean in the grand scheme?

Well the fact that Obama has been attending for 20 years, he has had this put into his head. It is a marvolouse thing that he wants to get into power, and set things straight. My problem with it is, that if he believes in the segregatory aspect of it, what happens to the other 85% of the population? Is this man going to ignore you because you are white? Is he going to reduce your chances to succeed so that he can increase the chances of a black person? Is he going to line me up against a wall and shoot me?

I personally believe in equality 100%. Every single person should have the very same chance to succeed in life (barring status at birth). But when you do things such as "affirmative action" to help the minorities, you then hurt the majority. My very own brother wanted to be a police officer. He signed up, and went to police accademy on his own dime (before acceptance, when they would pay you to do it.) But he was denied because, wait for it, he was a white male. So now he dispatches for animal control, and he is upset. You can all thank slick willy and his democratic party for that. But they needed a quota of black officers to prove that there was no racism. Beeing racist against a white male is still racism.

[Forthe]

Most people seem to be missing the real point of this whole reverend dilema.

Is what he said really truely hateful? Yes AND no. Some things are just gov't bashing, somethings are just statements of the percieved. The real problem is the devisivness of his words. By simply saying "Those rich white people" you set it into the minds of those who listen that they are different. Then to say "they control the world" you set it that they are better, and that it is they that keep you down! So what this man has been doing, is generating (or keeping alive) segragation. What does that all mean in the grand scheme?

Well the fact that Obama has been attending for 20 years, he has had this put into his head. It is a marvolouse thing that he wants to get into power, and set things straight. My problem with it is, that if he believes in the segregatory aspect of it, what happens to the other 85% of the population? Is this man going to ignore you because you are white? Is he going to reduce your chances to succeed so that he can increase the chances of a black person? Is he going to line me up against a wall and shoot me?

I personally believe in equality 100%. Every single person should have the very same chance to succeed in life (barring status at birth). But when you do things such as "affirmative action" to help the minorities, you then hurt the majority. My very own brother wanted to be a police officer. He signed up, and went to police accademy on his own dime (before acceptance, when they would pay you to do it.) But he was denied because, wait for it, he was a white male. So now he dispatches for animal control, and he is upset. You can all thank slick willy and his democratic party for that. But they needed a quota of black officers to prove that there was no racism. Beeing racist against a white male is still racism.

Are you somehow mind controlled by your pastor or priest?

I find this argument a bit weak when it is applied to Obama. He was raised by a single white mother and two white grandparents and certainly didn't lead a life in the hood. We also have plenty of background from his previous jobs that would have revealed any such attitude.

You could argue he has been playing the nice guy for the last 20 years concealing his true black separatist but that would make you as nutty a conspiracy theorist as his pastor.

And to the pastor's defense his generation has a right to be angry. Even his crazy AIDS rant isn't so far fetched from the perspective of people that actually know what the Tuskegee experiment was.

[Siji]

People have become so jaded that they can't begin to accept that someone might actually be a good person.

[Kaldaur]

Syrup, I've been directing a church choir for three years now. I had not previously attended this church before taking the job. I sit through services and sermons, every week, every month, of every year. I listen and interact with all the members of this congregation, and am exposed to their viewpoints. Since I don't share any of those viewpoints or agree with any of their doctrines, I will assume I haven't been 'participating' in this church long enough. You said Obama was a member for 20 years. How long does it take for someone to be sucked into their pastor's view? 5 years? 10? Do you wake up one morning and suddenly say, "I now agree with things that previously I disagreed with. Lead me further, dear Pastor."
The pastor at the church I attend is one of the nicest, most caring human beings on the planet. He works 15 hour days, teaching at schools, visiting the sick in the area, giving freely of his time and energies to help those around him. I also know that he and I would not get along on virtually any topic of conversation regarding politics or society. Does this lessen my opinion of the man? Not at all.
Here we have a man who mentored Obama and helped set him down the path of Christianity. They obviously have a close relationship. Does that mean that Obama blindly follows whatever views the pastor holds? Because of their relationship, they must have exactly identical viewpoints? Wright made his comments, Obama has said that he disagrees with those comments. Case closed. Quit looking for an issue when there is none.

[Sueven]

I still say the "if he wasn't black" argument is completely irrelevant like "if the sky weren't blue"...

Damn right

Animale. It isn't about me reading it. I'm not a supporter of his. Ask his supporters why they are voting for him. They don't have any good reasons. They don't know what he's done or what he stands for. THEY haven't read his book.

Is your criticism really that Obama has stupid supporters? Have you looked at the supporters of, well, every single major candidate in memory?

John Edwards was a different white voice. He didn't get the press coverage and media push that Barack got and continues to get. He is where he is because he has been put there.

John Edwards is a shittier candidate.

I don't think people like Obama are at fault at all. He puts forth a wonderful and positive message. People like his pastor are the ones at fault.

Exactly right!

Well the fact that Obama has been attending for 20 years, he has had this put into his head. It is a marvolouse thing that he wants to get into power, and set things straight. My problem with it is, that if he believes in the segregatory aspect of it, what happens to the other 85% of the population? Is this man going to ignore you because you are white? Is he going to reduce your chances to succeed so that he can increase the chances of a black person? Is he going to line me up against a wall and shoot me?

No. Jesus, his pastor said some bullshit and you're afraid that President Obama means shoot all the white people? Obama has said he doesn't believe in any of that shit. He hasn't acted like he believes in any of that shit during his life. Nobody who knows him seems to think that he believes in any of that shit. What would make you think that he believes it, beyond the fact that he's black?

If you're worried about shit like affirmative action-- hey, guess what, it's already here, and guess who was president when we got it-- a white person!

[Fash]

Barack Obama will give a major speech on "the larger issue of race in this campaign," he told reporters in Monaca, PA just now.

He was pressed there, as he has been at recent appearances, on statements by his former pastor, Jeremiah Wright.

"I am going to be talking about not just Reverend Wright, but the larger issue of race in this campaign," he said.

He added that he would "talk about how some of these issues are perceived from within the black church issue for example," he said.

He also briefly defended Wright from the image that has come through in a handful of repeatedly televised clips from recent Wright sermons.

"The caricature that’s being painted of him is not accurate," he said.

The speech could offer Obama an opportunity to move past the controversy over his pastor, and to turn the conversation to a topic he'd rather focus on: his Christian faith. But the speech also guarantees that the Wright story will continue to dominate political headlines.

Mitt Romney's attempt directly to address his Mormonism last year never decisively put the issue to rest for some voters.

Obama's schedule puts him in Philadelphia tomorrow.

Could be an interesting speech tomorrow... Not that it will put the issue to rest, but other than denouncing Rev. Wright I think he has been relatively quiet on the larger issue.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Not sure how he can lie his way out of this. He spends 17-20 years at this church, soaking in this separatism and white hatred, calling Rev. Wright his spritiual mentor and an important influence in his life, a personal friend.........and now all of the sudden we are to believe he doesn't agree with anything he has said, his mind set, his basic belief structure, his hatred for America?

I thought Barack was different than the normal politicians. He was going to bring change. He was an outsider. LOL

He's a liar like the rest of them. He'll say anything to stay alive in the race. Didn't he give a speech recently after a primary win where he talked about how there is no red states, no blue states, just the United States of America. Ahhhhh, how touching and uplifting. Finding it hard to believe he really believes that.

His wifes slip up with that shit about being proud of America for the first time was the truth about how they feel. The link is there between her slip up and Rev. Wrights preachings.

Here's an excerpt from Trinity's website explaining their "Black Value System":

“Disavowal of the Pursuit of ‘Middleclassness.’ Classic methodology on control of captives teaches that captors must be able to identify the ‘talented tenth’ of those subjugated, especially those who show promise of providing the kind of leadership that might threaten the captor’s control.

“Those so identified are separated from the rest of the people by:

1. Killing them off directly, and/or fostering a social system that encourages them to kill off one another.

2. Placing them in concentration camps, and/or structuring an economic environment that induces captive youth to fill the jails and prisons.

3. Seducing them into a socioeconomic class system which, while training them to earn more dollars, hypnotizes them into believing they are better than others and teaches them to think in terms of ‘we’ and ‘they’ instead of ‘us.’

4. So, while it is permissible to chase ‘middleclassness’ with all our might, we must avoid the third separation method – the psychological entrapment of Black ‘middleclassness.’ If we avoid this snare, we will also diminish our ‘voluntary’ contributions to methods A and B. And more importantly, Black people no longer will be deprived of their birthright: the leadership, resourcefulness and example of their own talented persons.”

[Nick]

You are the finest example of why everyone I know thinks Americans are retarded.

Obama is the first politician in the last 10 years who has any desire whatsoever to actually consider all angles, whilst still making an informed choice that doesn't involve murdering Arabians. He is right to distance himself from this Pastor, because in the media the Pastor has been portrayed as a Zealot and a lunatic. The reality is, as you of all people are quick to point out when in regards to Republican candidates, this man will of course have been misrepresented to some greater or lesser degree. Disagree with that point and you'll be the (even more so than before) the biggest hypocrite on this board.

Not that I'm saying this Pastor is a swell guy, he rants and raves like a fucking lunatic. Obama is right to distance himself from him. Obama claims to be a christian, and normally I would consider anyone who claims to be a christian/muslim/Jew to be a total fucking moron. But the US president has to be christian. That's a fucking fact whether you like it or not.

It's obvious that Obama takes christianity with a pinch of salt, he's a fucking politician. Your bellyaching that OBAMA IS A SOCIALIST AND A POLITICIAN JUST LIEK TEH REST OF TEHM LOL is not unfounded, although embarrassingly naive. We all know he's a fucking politician. Wanna know how?

Because he is a politician you shithead.

The fact remains though, regardless of the obvious smear campaigns that will be waged against him, is that his message of unity above division, withdrawing from Iraq, peace instead of war, knowledge instead of fear and most notably change from the status quo in a inarguably corrupt Washington DC is an inspiring message that none of the rest of the fucking moronic elite politicians (or fuckheads like you) have the brains to realise is as a legitimate point of view. Also, it's winning voters at a rate that makes the other ones like like fucking passers by.

No one thinks Obama has all the answers, but he has a fucking shitload more credibility and intellect to consider ways in which to tackle the multiple answers to the myriad of questions brought up after the disasterous decisions made by the fuckwits you support (apathetically or consciously). The ultimate question lies with morons like you, in whether you will choose for 4 more years of this retarded Bush Regime when voting for McCain, or have any respect for your country, fellow countrymen, history of your country and the rest of the fucking world to vote for him come the general election.

I won't get my hopes up.

The only reason supporting Obama could be considered "naive" is because fuckheads who hate the concept of a better world still exist (to the detriment, embarrasment and tragedy of everyone else - eugenics probably would have helped in your case). So fuck you, ok?

The USA is a fucking laughing stock, everywhere, even within the USA, deal with it boy. Obama is the only one symbolically who has even a vague chance of changing that perception. That's not opinion, that's fact (do a fucking poll if you need proof - i dare you)

[Xyun]

Not sure how he can lie his way out of this. He spends 17-20 years at this church, soaking in this separatism and white hatred, calling Rev. Wright his spritiual mentor and an important influence in his life, a personal friend.........and now all of the sudden we are to believe he doesn't agree with anything he has said, his mind set, his basic belief structure, his hatred for America?

I thought Barack was different than the normal politicians. He was going to bring change. He was an outsider. LOL

He's a liar like the rest of them. He'll say anything to stay alive in the race. Didn't he give a speech recently after a primary win where he talked about how there is no red states, no blue states, just the United States of America. Ahhhhh, how touching and uplifting. Finding it hard to believe he really believes that.

His wifes slip up with that shit about being proud of America for the first time was the truth about how they feel. The link is there between her slip up and Rev. Wrights preachings.

Lol. This drivel is coming from a supposed atheist. You, midnyte, are a closet christian. I look forward to the day when you finally admit that you've been wrong all along and you have accepted Jesus Christ into your heart. Only a fanatical christian would believe that a man's pastor has such zealous control over the man's belief system and thoughts that it is impossible for them to disagree. Furthermore, stating that they disagree is, in your ignorant mind, an overt lie. Only a naive person who himself is susceptible to such persuasion and propaganda would in turn accuse others of being as weak, as gullible, and ignorant as themselves. Strong willed independent thinkers have the natural ability to identify other strong willed independent thinkers easily, and the fact that you cannot recognize this characteristic in Obama entails that you are not one of us. So start praying, stupid bitch.

[Fash]

Full text of Obama's speech today in Philadelphia:

“We the people, in order to form a more perfect union.”

Two hundred and twenty one years ago, in a hall that still stands across the street, a group of men gathered and, with these simple words, launched America’s improbable experiment in democracy. Farmers and scholars; statesmen and patriots who had traveled across an ocean to escape tyranny and persecution finally made real their declaration of independence at a Philadelphia convention that lasted through the spring of 1787.

The document they produced was eventually signed but ultimately unfinished. It was stained by this nation’s original sin of slavery, a question that divided the colonies and brought the convention to a stalemate until the founders chose to allow the slave trade to continue for at least twenty more years, and to leave any final resolution to future generations.

Of course, the answer to the slavery question was already embedded within our Constitution – a Constitution that had at is very core the ideal of equal citizenship under the law; a Constitution that promised its people liberty, and justice, and a union that could be and should be perfected over time.

And yet words on a parchment would not be enough to deliver slaves from bondage, or provide men and women of every color and creed their full rights and obligations as citizens of the United States. What would be needed were Americans in successive generations who were willing to do their part – through protests and struggle, on the streets and in the courts, through a civil war and civil disobedience and always at great risk - to narrow that gap between the promise of our ideals and the reality of their time.

This was one of the tasks we set forth at the beginning of this campaign – to continue the long march of those who came before us, a march for a more just, more equal, more free, more caring and more prosperous America. I chose to run for the presidency at this moment in history because I believe deeply that we cannot solve the challenges of our time unless we solve them together – unless we perfect our union by understanding that we may have different stories, but we hold common hopes; that we may not look the same and we may not have come from the same place, but we all want to move in the same direction – towards a better future for of children and our grandchildren.

This belief comes from my unyielding faith in the decency and generosity of the American people. But it also comes from my own American story.

I am the son of a black man from Kenya and a white woman from Kansas. I was raised with the help of a white grandfather who survived a Depression to serve in Patton’s Army during World War II and a white grandmother who worked on a bomber assembly line at Fort Leavenworth while he was overseas. I’ve gone to some of the best schools in America and lived in one of the world’s poorest nations. I am married to a black American who carries within her the blood of slaves and slaveowners – an inheritance we pass on to our two precious daughters. I have brothers, sisters, nieces, nephews, uncles and cousins, of every race and every hue, scattered across three continents, and for as long as I live, I will never forget that in no other country on Earth is my story even possible.

It’s a story that hasn’t made me the most conventional candidate. But it is a story that has seared into my genetic makeup the idea that this nation is more than the sum of its parts – that out of many, we are truly one.

Throughout the first year of this campaign, against all predictions to the contrary, we saw how hungry the American people were for this message of unity. Despite the temptation to view my candidacy through a purely racial lens, we won commanding victories in states with some of the whitest populations in the country. In South Carolina, where the Confederate Flag still flies, we built a powerful coalition of African Americans and white Americans.

This is not to say that race has not been an issue in the campaign. At various stages in the campaign, some commentators have deemed me either “too black” or “not black enough.” We saw racial tensions bubble to the surface during the week before the South Carolina primary. The press has scoured every exit poll for the latest evidence of racial polarization, not just in terms of white and black, but black and brown as well.

And yet, it has only been in the last couple of weeks that the discussion of race in this campaign has taken a particularly divisive turn.

On one end of the spectrum, we’ve heard the implication that my candidacy is somehow an exercise in affirmative action; that it’s based solely on the desire of wide-eyed liberals to purchase racial reconciliation on the cheap. On the other end, we’ve heard my former pastor, Reverend Jeremiah Wright, use incendiary language to express views that have the potential not only to widen the racial divide, but views that denigrate both the greatness and the goodness of our nation; that rightly offend white and black alike.

I have already condemned, in unequivocal terms, the statements of Reverend Wright that have caused such controversy. For some, nagging questions remain. Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely – just as I’m sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests, or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed.

But the remarks that have caused this recent firestorm weren’t simply controversial. They weren’t simply a religious leader’s effort to speak out against perceived injustice. Instead, they expressed a profoundly distorted view of this country – a view that sees white racism as endemic, and that elevates what is wrong with America above all that we know is right with America; a view that sees the conflicts in the Middle East as rooted primarily in the actions of stalwart allies like Israel, instead of emanating from the perverse and hateful ideologies of radical Islam.

As such, Reverend Wright’s comments were not only wrong but divisive, divisive at a time when we need unity; racially charged at a time when we need to come together to solve a set of monumental problems – two wars, a terrorist threat, a falling economy, a chronic health care crisis and potentially devastating climate change; problems that are neither black or white or Latino or Asian, but rather problems that confront us all.

Given my background, my politics, and my professed values and ideals, there will no doubt be those for whom my statements of condemnation are not enough. Why associate myself with Reverend Wright in the first place, they may ask? Why not join another church? And I confess that if all that I knew of Reverend Wright were the snippets of those sermons that have run in an endless loop on the television and You Tube, or if Trinity United Church of Christ conformed to the caricatures being peddled by some commentators, there is no doubt that I would react in much the same way

But the truth is, that isn’t all that I know of the man. The man I met more than twenty years ago is a man who helped introduce me to my Christian faith, a man who spoke to me about our obligations to love one another; to care for the sick and lift up the poor. He is a man who served his country as a U.S. Marine; who has studied and lectured at some of the finest universities and seminaries in the country, and who for over thirty years led a church that serves the community by doing God’s work here on Earth – by housing the homeless, ministering to the needy, providing day care services and scholarships and prison ministries, and reaching out to those suffering from HIV/AIDS.

In my first book, Dreams From My Father, I described the experience of my first service at Trinity:

“People began to shout, to rise from their seats and clap and cry out, a forceful wind carrying the reverend’s voice up into the rafters….And in that single note – hope! – I heard something else; at the foot of that cross, inside the thousands of churches across the city, I imagined the stories of ordinary black people merging with the stories of David and Goliath, Moses and Pharaoh, the Christians in the lion’s den, Ezekiel’s field of dry bones. Those stories – of survival, and freedom, and hope – became our story, my story; the blood that had spilled was our blood, the tears our tears; until this black church, on this bright day, seemed once more a vessel carrying the story of a people into future generations and into a larger world. Our trials and triumphs became at once unique and universal, black and more than black; in chronicling our journey, the stories and songs gave us a means to reclaim memories that we didn’t need to feel shame about…memories that all people might study and cherish – and with which we could start to rebuild.”

That has been my experience at Trinity. Like other predominantly black churches across the country, Trinity embodies the black community in its entirety – the doctor and the welfare mom, the model student and the former gang-banger. Like other black churches, Trinity’s services are full of raucous laughter and sometimes bawdy humor. They are full of dancing, clapping, screaming and shouting that may seem jarring to the untrained ear. The church contains in full the kindness and cruelty, the fierce intelligence and the shocking ignorance, the struggles and successes, the love and yes, the bitterness and bias that make up the black experience in America.

And this helps explain, perhaps, my relationship with Reverend Wright. As imperfect as he may be, he has been like family to me. He strengthened my faith, officiated my wedding, and baptized my children. Not once in my conversations with him have I heard him talk about any ethnic group in derogatory terms, or treat whites with whom he interacted with anything but courtesy and respect. He contains within him the contradictions – the good and the bad – of the community that he has served diligently for so many years.

I can no more disown him than I can disown the black community. I can no more disown him than I can my white grandmother – a woman who helped raise me, a woman who sacrificed again and again for me, a woman who loves me as much as she loves anything in this world, but a woman who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street, and who on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe.

These people are a part of me. And they are a part of America, this country that I love.

Some will see this as an attempt to justify or excuse comments that are simply inexcusable. I can assure you it is not. I suppose the politically safe thing would be to move on from this episode and just hope that it fades into the woodwork. We can dismiss Reverend Wright as a crank or a demagogue, just as some have dismissed Geraldine Ferraro, in the aftermath of her recent statements, as harboring some deep-seated racial bias.

But race is an issue that I believe this nation cannot afford to ignore right now. We would be making the same mistake that Reverend Wright made in his offending sermons about America – to simplify and stereotype and amplify the negative to the point that it distorts reality.

The fact is that the comments that have been made and the issues that have surfaced over the last few weeks reflect the complexities of race in this country that we’ve never really worked through – a part of our union that we have yet to perfect. And if we walk away now, if we simply retreat into our respective corners, we will never be able to come together and solve challenges like health care, or education, or the need to find good jobs for every American.

Understanding this reality requires a reminder of how we arrived at this point. As William Faulkner once wrote, “The past isn’t dead and buried. In fact, it isn’t even past.” We do not need to recite here the history of racial injustice in this country. But we do need to remind ourselves that so many of the disparities that exist in the African-American community today can be directly traced to inequalities passed on from an earlier generation that suffered under the brutal legacy of slavery and Jim Crow.

Segregated schools were, and are, inferior schools; we still haven’t fixed them, fifty years after Brown v. Board of Education, and the inferior education they provided, then and now, helps explain the pervasive achievement gap between today’s black and white students.

Legalized discrimination - where blacks were prevented, often through violence, from owning property, or loans were not granted to African-American business owners, or black homeowners could not access FHA mortgages, or blacks were excluded from unions, or the police force, or fire departments – meant that black families could not amass any meaningful wealth to bequeath to future generations. That history helps explain the wealth and income gap between black and white, and the concentrated pockets of poverty that persists in so many of today’s urban and rural communities.

A lack of economic opportunity among black men, and the shame and frustration that came from not being able to provide for one’s family, contributed to the erosion of black families – a problem that welfare policies for many years may have worsened. And the lack of basic services in so many urban black neighborhoods – parks for kids to play in, police walking the beat, regular garbage pick-up and building code enforcement – all helped create a cycle of violence, blight and neglect that continue to haunt us.

This is the reality in which Reverend Wright and other African-Americans of his generation grew up. They came of age in the late fifties and early sixties, a time when segregation was still the law of the land and opportunity was systematically constricted. What’s remarkable is not how many failed in the face of discrimination, but rather how many men and women overcame the odds; how many were able to make a way out of no way for those like me who would come after them.

But for all those who scratched and clawed their way to get a piece of the American Dream, there were many who didn’t make it – those who were ultimately defeated, in one way or another, by discrimination. That legacy of defeat was passed on to future generations – those young men and increasingly young women who we see standing on street corners or languishing in our prisons, without hope or prospects for the future. Even for those blacks who did make it, questions of race, and racism, continue to define their worldview in fundamental ways. For the men and women of Reverend Wright’s generation, the memories of humiliation and doubt and fear have not gone away; nor has the anger and the bitterness of those years. That anger may not get expressed in public, in front of white co-workers or white friends. But it does find voice in the barbershop or around the kitchen table. At times, that anger is exploited by politicians, to gin up votes along racial lines, or to make up for a politician’s own failings.

And occasionally it finds voice in the church on Sunday morning, in the pulpit and in the pews. The fact that so many people are surprised to hear that anger in some of Reverend Wright’s sermons simply reminds us of the old truism that the most segregated hour in American life occurs on Sunday morning. That anger is not always productive; indeed, all too often it distracts attention from solving real problems; it keeps us from squarely facing our own complicity in our condition, and prevents the African-American community from forging the alliances it needs to bring about real change. But the anger is real; it is powerful; and to simply wish it away, to condemn it without understanding its roots, only serves to widen the chasm of misunderstanding that exists between the races.

In fact, a similar anger exists within segments of the white community. Most working- and middle-class white Americans don’t feel that they have been particularly privileged by their race. Their experience is the immigrant experience – as far as they’re concerned, no one’s handed them anything, they’ve built it from scratch. They’ve worked hard all their lives, many times only to see their jobs shipped overseas or their pension dumped after a lifetime of labor. They are anxious about their futures, and feel their dreams slipping away; in an era of stagnant wages and global competition, opportunity comes to be seen as a zero sum game, in which your dreams come at my expense. So when they are told to bus their children to a school across town; when they hear that an African American is getting an advantage in landing a good job or a spot in a good college because of an injustice that they themselves never committed; when they’re told that their fears about crime in urban neighborhoods are somehow prejudiced, resentment builds over time.

Like the anger within the black community, these resentments aren’t always expressed in polite company. But they have helped shape the political landscape for at least a generation. Anger over welfare and affirmative action helped forge the Reagan Coalition. Politicians routinely exploited fears of crime for their own electoral ends. Talk show hosts and conservative commentators built entire careers unmasking bogus claims of racism while dismissing legitimate discussions of racial injustice and inequality as mere political correctness or reverse racism.

Just as black anger often proved counterproductive, so have these white resentments distracted attention from the real culprits of the middle class squeeze – a corporate culture rife with inside dealing, questionable accounting practices, and short-term greed; a Washington dominated by lobbyists and special interests; economic policies that favor the few over the many. And yet, to wish away the resentments of white Americans, to label them as misguided or even racist, without recognizing they are grounded in legitimate concerns – this too widens the racial divide, and blocks the path to understanding.

This is where we are right now. It’s a racial stalemate we’ve been stuck in for years. Contrary to the claims of some of my critics, black and white, I have never been so naïve as to believe that we can get beyond our racial divisions in a single election cycle, or with a single candidacy – particularly a candidacy as imperfect as my own.

But I have asserted a firm conviction – a conviction rooted in my faith in God and my faith in the American people – that working together we can move beyond some of our old racial wounds, and that in fact we have no choice is we are to continue on the path of a more perfect union.

For the African-American community, that path means embracing the burdens of our past without becoming victims of our past. It means continuing to insist on a full measure of justice in every aspect of American life. But it also means binding our particular grievances – for better health care, and better schools, and better jobs - to the larger aspirations of all Americans -- the white woman struggling to break the glass ceiling, the white man whose been laid off, the immigrant trying to feed his family. And it means taking full responsibility for own lives – by demanding more from our fathers, and spending more time with our children, and reading to them, and teaching them that while they may face challenges and discrimination in their own lives, they must never succumb to despair or cynicism; they must always believe that they can write their own destiny.

Ironically, this quintessentially American – and yes, conservative – notion of self-help found frequent expression in Reverend Wright’s sermons. But what my former pastor too often failed to understand is that embarking on a program of self-help also requires a belief that society can change.

The profound mistake of Reverend Wright’s sermons is not that he spoke about racism in our society. It’s that he spoke as if our society was static; as if no progress has been made; as if this country – a country that has made it possible for one of his own members to run for the highest office in the land and build a coalition of white and black; Latino and Asian, rich and poor, young and old -- is still irrevocably bound to a tragic past. But what we know -- what we have seen – is that America can change. That is true genius of this nation. What we have already achieved gives us hope – the audacity to hope – for what we can and must achieve tomorrow.

In the white community, the path to a more perfect union means acknowledging that what ails the African-American community does not just exist in the minds of black people; that the legacy of discrimination - and current incidents of discrimination, while less overt than in the past - are real and must be addressed. Not just with words, but with deeds – by investing in our schools and our communities; by enforcing our civil rights laws and ensuring fairness in our criminal justice system; by providing this generation with ladders of opportunity that were unavailable for previous generations. It requires all Americans to realize that your dreams do not have to come at the expense of my dreams; that investing in the health, welfare, and education of black and brown and white children will ultimately help all of America prosper.

In the end, then, what is called for is nothing more, and nothing less, than what all the world’s great religions demand – that we do unto others as we would have them do unto us. Let us be our brother’s keeper, Scripture tells us. Let us be our sister’s keeper. Let us find that common stake we all have in one another, and let our politics reflect that spirit as well.

For we have a choice in this country. We can accept a politics that breeds division, and conflict, and cynicism. We can tackle race only as spectacle – as we did in the OJ trial – or in the wake of tragedy, as we did in the aftermath of Katrina - or as fodder for the nightly news. We can play Reverend Wright’s sermons on every channel, every day and talk about them from now until the election, and make the only question in this campaign whether or not the American people think that I somehow believe or sympathize with his most offensive words. We can pounce on some gaffe by a Hillary supporter as evidence that she’s playing the race card, or we can speculate on whether white men will all flock to John McCain in the general election regardless of his policies.

We can do that.

But if we do, I can tell you that in the next election, we’ll be talking about some other distraction. And then another one. And then another one. And nothing will change.

That is one option. Or, at this moment, in this election, we can come together and say, “Not this time.” This time we want to talk about the crumbling schools that are stealing the future of black children and white children and Asian children and Hispanic children and Native American children. This time we want to reject the cynicism that tells us that these kids can’t learn; that those kids who don’t look like us are somebody else’s problem. The children of America are not those kids, they are our kids, and we will not let them fall behind in a 21st century economy. Not this time.

This time we want to talk about how the lines in the Emergency Room are filled with whites and blacks and Hispanics who do not have health care; who don’t have the power on their own to overcome the special interests in Washington, but who can take them on if we do it together.

This time we want to talk about the shuttered mills that once provided a decent life for men and women of every race, and the homes for sale that once belonged to Americans from every religion, every region, every walk of life. This time we want to talk about the fact that the real problem is not that someone who doesn’t look like you might take your job; it’s that the corporation you work for will ship it overseas for nothing more than a profit.

This time we want to talk about the men and women of every color and creed who serve together, and fight together, and bleed together under the same proud flag. We want to talk about how to bring them home from a war that never should’ve been authorized and never should’ve been waged, and we want to talk about how we’ll show our patriotism by caring for them, and their families, and giving them the benefits they have earned.

I would not be running for President if I didn’t believe with all my heart that this is what the vast majority of Americans want for this country. This union may never be perfect, but generation after generation has shown that it can always be perfected. And today, whenever I find myself feeling doubtful or cynical about this possibility, what gives me the most hope is the next generation – the young people whose attitudes and beliefs and openness to change have already made history in this election.

There is one story in particularly that I’d like to leave you with today – a story I told when I had the great honor of speaking on Dr. King’s birthday at his home church, Ebenezer Baptist, in Atlanta.

There is a young, twenty-three year old white woman named Ashley Baia who organized for our campaign in Florence, South Carolina. She had been working to organize a mostly African-American community since the beginning of this campaign, and one day she was at a roundtable discussion where everyone went around telling their story and why they were there.

And Ashley said that when she was nine years old, her mother got cancer. And because she had to miss days of work, she was let go and lost her health care. They had to file for bankruptcy, and that’s when Ashley decided that she had to do something to help her mom.

She knew that food was one of their most expensive costs, and so Ashley convinced her mother that what she really liked and really wanted to eat more than anything else was mustard and relish sandwiches. Because that was the cheapest way to eat.

She did this for a year until her mom got better, and she told everyone at the roundtable that the reason she joined our campaign was so that she could help the millions of other children in the country who want and need to help their parents too.

Now Ashley might have made a different choice. Perhaps somebody told her along the way that the source of her mother’s problems were blacks who were on welfare and too lazy to work, or Hispanics who were coming into the country illegally. But she didn’t. She sought out allies in her fight against injustice.

Anyway, Ashley finishes her story and then goes around the room and asks everyone else why they’re supporting the campaign. They all have different stories and reasons. Many bring up a specific issue. And finally they come to this elderly black man who’s been sitting there quietly the entire time. And Ashley asks him why he’s there. And he does not bring up a specific issue. He does not say health care or the economy. He does not say education or the war. He does not say that he was there because of Barack Obama. He simply says to everyone in the room, “I am here because of Ashley.”

“I’m here because of Ashley.” By itself, that single moment of recognition between that young white girl and that old black man is not enough. It is not enough to give health care to the sick, or jobs to the jobless, or education to our children.

But it is where we start. It is where our union grows stronger. And as so many generations have come to realize over the course of the two-hundred and twenty one years since a band of patriots signed that document in Philadelphia, that is where the perfection begins.

Tough to pick out what should be bolded... just read the whole damn thing. I think it's very very well said.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Listening now. What a great speaker. I wish he was a Republican

[Kilmoll the Sexy]

What in the fuck does slavery have to do with today's presidency? You want reparations? You already got your reparations when millions of white men went to fucking war and died because of their belief that you should be free in a unified United States. Even bringing race up only shows that there is a difference in your own damn heart that there SHOULD be voting based on race.

[Fash]

He wasn't the one who brought up race... The murdering psycho-bitch is trying to use it to railroad his campaign. I think it's fair for him to respond, don't you?

[Sylvus]

What in the fuck does slavery have to do with today's presidency? You want reparations? You already got your reparations when millions of white men went to fucking war and died because of their belief that you should be free in a unified United States. Even bringing race up only shows that there is a difference in your own damn heart that there SHOULD be voting based on race.

Wow, did we read the same speech? Or do the words mean something different in the Ohio dialect of the English language?

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Don't be ridiculous Kill. He's responding to a very valid racial issue at hand and doing a fantastic job.

[Fairweather Pure]

Love him or hate him, that man can speak. He certianly has a gift.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Very inspirational. I hope the media gets off his back a bit on this. I think he answered my concerns very clearly. Going to listen to Rush today and see if he is reasonable about this.

[Funkmasterr]

I got bored before reading the whole thing, but what I basically derived is that this guy hadn't said these kind of racially charged things in the past, either that or he is implying that they did occur in the past and it wasn't as important then because he was not running for president and didn't have the scrutiny of the American public to worry about.

Either way I'm not ok with it. I do not have the time of day for any "white man holdin me down, damn the man" bullshit from any black person anywhere, especially not a presidential candidate. Him going to a church where this kind of crap was obviously spewed more than just this one time people are focusing on is enough to put him in that category for me, guilty by association - if he really doesn't agree he wouldn't be there.

Edit: If I come off as pessimistic, it's because I am. And to be honest it's really more realistic than pessimism, even though it sounds that way. If there is any way something can be negative or bad when it comes to politicians I'm probably going to assume and/or expect the worst.

[Boogahz]

Going to listen to Rush today and see if he is reasonable about this.

Honest question: Is Rush ever reasonable about anything?

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Going to listen to Rush today and see if he is reasonable about this.

Honest question: Is Rush ever reasonable about anything?

Actually, yes. Quite often. I've found Hannity to be way more blindly right wing conservative than Rush, by a long shot.

So far he has said it was a great speech and that Hillary must be fuming.

He's still talking about at 1:10pm. He's being a bit unreasonable to me. I'm a little more forgiving I guess. I want to believe the best in people. I understand though why he must continue to harp on it. He's party obligated, hehe.

[Forthe]

Now on YouTube for those that didn't see it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWe7wTVbLUU&feature=user

[Animale]

This speech had some elements that reminded me of the best off-the-cuff speech in modern American History, by Robert F. Kennedy in Indianapolis after Martin Luther King Jr. was shot. The crowd, largely African-American, had not yet heard the news - and he had to break it to them.

Ladies and Gentlemen - I'm only going to talk to you just for a minute or so this evening. Because...

I have some very sad news for all of you, and I think sad news for all of our fellow citizens, and people who love peace all over the world, and that is that Martin Luther King was shot and was killed tonight in Memphis, Tennessee.

Martin Luther King dedicated his life to love and to justice between fellow human beings. He died in the cause of that effort. In this difficult day, in this difficult time for the United States, it's perhaps well to ask what kind of a nation we are and what direction we want to move in.

For those of you who are black - considering the evidence evidently is that there were white people who were responsible - you can be filled with bitterness, and with hatred, and a desire for revenge.

We can move in that direction as a country, in greater polarization - black people amongst blacks, and white amongst whites, filled with hatred toward one another. Or we can make an effort, as Martin Luther King did, to understand and to comprehend, and replace that violence, that stain of bloodshed that has spread across our land, with an effort to understand, compassion and love.

For those of you who are black and are tempted to be filled with hatred and mistrust of the injustice of such an act, against all white people, I would only say that I can also feel in my own heart the same kind of feeling. I had a member of my family killed, but he was killed by a white man.

But we have to make an effort in the United States, we have to make an effort to understand, to get beyond these rather difficult times.

My favorite poet was Aeschylus. He once wrote: "Even in our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, until, in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God."

What we need in the United States is not division; what we need in the United States is not hatred; what we need in the United States is not violence and lawlessness, but is love and wisdom, and compassion toward one another, and a feeling of justice toward those who still suffer within our country, whether they be white or whether they be black.

(Interrupted by applause)

So I ask you tonight to return home, to say a prayer for the family of Martin Luther King, yeah that's true, but more importantly to say a prayer for our own country, which all of us love - a prayer for understanding and that compassion of which I spoke. We can do well in this country. We will have difficult times. We've had difficult times in the past. And we will have difficult times in the future. It is not the end of violence; it is not the end of lawlessness; and it's not the end of disorder.

But the vast majority of white people and the vast majority of black people in this country want to live together, want to improve the quality of our life, and want justice for all human beings that abide in our land.

(Interrupted by applause)

Let us dedicate ourselves to what the Greeks wrote so many years ago: to tame the savageness of man and make gentle the life of this world.

Let us dedicate ourselves to that, and say a prayer for our country and for our people. Thank you very much. (Applause)

Robert F. Kennedy - April 4, 1968

I'm sure Obama and his speech-writers meant this speech to have echoes of RFK's famous words. Maybe, 40 years later, we can continue RFK's dedication and the savageness of the world can ease.

Animale

[Fairweather Pure]

I got bored before reading the whole thing, but what I basically derived is that this guy hadn't said these kind of racially charged things in the past, either that or he is implying that they did occur in the past and it wasn't as important then because he was not running for president and didn't have the scrutiny of the American public to worry about.

Jesus fucking christ. You didn't read it, but formed an opinion on what you think it might possibly say? You are everything that is wrong with this country. Uninformed and too lazy/apathetic to educate yourself. From one American to another, fuck you.

[Funkmasterr]

I got bored before reading the whole thing, but what I basically derived is that this guy hadn't said these kind of racially charged things in the past, either that or he is implying that they did occur in the past and it wasn't as important then because he was not running for president and didn't have the scrutiny of the American public to worry about.

Jesus fucking christ. You didn't read it, but formed an opinion on what you think it might possibly say? You are everything that is wrong with this country. Uninformed and too lazy/apathetic to educate yourself. From one American to another, fuck you.

Actually, I read 3/4 of it before quitting, so I got a pretty damn good idea of what he was saying considering the length. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with my logic, I have zero tolerance for this shit, no exceptions. It's pretty cut and dry.

I'm such a terrible person because I am not in love with your precious obama is what it boils down to,so actually sir, fuck you.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

I got bored before reading the whole thing, but what I basically derived is that this guy hadn't said these kind of racially charged things in the past, either that or he is implying that they did occur in the past and it wasn't as important then because he was not running for president and didn't have the scrutiny of the American public to worry about.

Jesus fucking christ. You didn't read it, but formed an opinion on what you think it might possibly say? You are everything that is wrong with this country. Uninformed and too lazy/apathetic to educate yourself. From one American to another, fuck you.

Funk is just being honest about how he feels. It is very likely Obama has feelings that mirror those of the Rev. Wright, but he knows he must say he doesn't, if he wants to be elected. He very clearly explained that in his speech. Funk is willing to write him off. I'm not. I'm hoping as a country we can take another step towards equality for all from this speech. Problem is, his own party is the one who politically benefits from this constant racial division. A very unique position he and the Democrat party are in.

[Fairweather Pure]

this guy hadn't said these kind of racially charged things in the past, either that or he is implying that they did occur in the past and it wasn't as important then because he was not running for president and didn't have the scrutiny of the American public to worry about.

You have the entire speech quoted above you. Take your time and post the lines from his speech that brought you to either one of these conclusions. I'll save you some time, you won't find any because they aren't fucking in there. Your skimming of the material brought you to not only one, but two completely incorrect conclusions that are no where in the fucking speech, you simpleton.

OH HERE IS WHAT I THINK BASED ON WHAT I THINK I KIND OF READ. I AM A RETARD, THANKS.

You are ignorance incarnate.

[Fash]

This is a speech for the history books. It's very open-minded, inclusive, and inspirational.

[Spang]

Just another reason why Obama needs to be our next president.

[Funkmasterr]

this guy hadn't said these kind of racially charged things in the past, either that or he is implying that they did occur in the past and it wasn't as important then because he was not running for president and didn't have the scrutiny of the American public to worry about.

You have the entire speech quoted above you. Take your time and post the lines from his speech that brought you to either one of these conclusions. I'll save you some time, you won't find any because they aren't fucking in there. Your skimming of the material brought you to not only one, but two completely incorrect conclusions that are no where in the fucking speech, you simpleton.

OH HERE IS WHAT I THINK BASED ON WHAT I THINK I KIND OF READ. I AM A RETARD, THANKS.

You are ignorance incarnate.

I have already condemned, in unequivocal terms, the statements of Reverend Wright that have caused such controversy. For some, nagging questions remain. Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely – just as I’m sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests, or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed.

This strikes me as total bullshit. If I was going to a church where these kinds of things that I strongly disagree with were being stated I would not continue going there for 20 years, and I would expect anyone else that did not agree to also leave. So to me this sounds like back pedaling bullshit, he's been going there all these years and I'm guessing it's never truly bothered him, but because he is in the spotlight now of course he is going to say what people want to hear, he's a politician, that's what they do. And yes, the few times I was at church when I was younger, I too did hear shit I didn't agree with, WHICH IS A BIG PART OF THE REASON I DON'T FUCKING GO THERE ANYMORE, I'm not a hypocrite.

As such, Reverend Wright’s comments were not only wrong but divisive, divisive at a time when we need unity; racially charged at a time when we need to come together to solve a set of monumental problems – two wars, a terrorist threat, a falling economy, a chronic health care crisis and potentially devastating climate change; problems that are neither black or white or Latino or Asian, but rather problems that confront us all.

Given my background, my politics, and my professed values and ideals, there will no doubt be those for whom my statements of condemnation are not enough. Why associate myself with Reverend Wright in the first place, they may ask? Why not join another church? And I confess that if all that I knew of Reverend Wright were the snippets of those sermons that have run in an endless loop on the television and You Tube, or if Trinity United Church of Christ conformed to the caricatures being peddled by some commentators, there is no doubt that I would react in much the same way

This is a complete bullshit fucking joke. What would your reaction be if I told you that I associate myself with a radical white supremacist, and even though he has said some sketchy things about niggers and slaves that I don't agree with or condone at all, he has said some real things of substance and other people don't see that side?

As I stated before, I have zero tolerance for the "damn the white man" bullshit that was said at his church, and I don't have the time of day for a presidential candidate that would associate himself with that for any reason, ever, end of story.

Just because I don't share your same peace loving everyone get along fantasy world bullshit views doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about or have justification for why I say what I say, so do yourself a favor and shut your miserable fucking mouth unless you know what you are talking about, asshole.


Edit: And for clarification, I might have liked other things he said in this speech. Hell, for arguments sake (although it's not the case) we can say I agreed with 75% of it, but for me I feel strongly enough about what I said above that I would (assuming I hadn't already, which I have) completely write him off.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

I understand what you're saying Funk, but in this case, I think you are over doing it a bit. Yes, it is a double standard. The views of Rev. Wright are not acceptable, but understandable. Many people are having a hard time getting over racism. It wasn't but 40-50 years ago we had some serious racial problems. It wasn't until the 80's when we got affirmative action. While we have made tremendous strides, it is going to take a few more generations to get rid of many of the past hatred and rhetoric. Hopefully, the Dems, make a shift away from a devisive platform that keeps us divided, so they have a built-in group of voters.

[Funkmasterr]

I understand what you're saying Funk, but in this case, I think you are over doing it a bit. Yes, it is a double standard. The views of Rev. Wright are not acceptable, but understandable. Many people are having a hard time getting over racism. It wasn't but 40-50 years ago we had some serious racial problems. It wasn't until the 80's when we got affirmative action. While we have made tremendous strides, it is going to take a few more generations to get rid of many of the past hatred and rhetoric. Hopefully, the Dems, make a shift away from a devisive platform that keeps us divided, so they have a built-in group of voters.

I don't feel I am overdoing it. I was raised to not make excuses for myself, and that is a quality I demand of other people. You are exactly right it is a double standard, it's reverse racism in a lot of cases and it's inexcusable bullshit in every case.

I have no problem with us making an effort to continue moving towards the goal of not being as divided as we still are, but even one comment from someone like the pastor or whatever the guy is a step back. And that is where my biggest problem with this whole situation lies; It is always the people that make those bullshit comments that claim to be the ones trying to make the situation better, but they are hurting it. But that doesn't stop people from getting behind them, obviously.

Laying blame, making excuses, and re hashing shit of the past is not going to better the situation for anyone. And for that reason I have zero tolerance for anyone that does (or anyone that associates themself with someone who does) any of those things under the guise of working towards equality.

[Animale]

Either way I'm not ok with it. I do not have the time of day for any "white man holdin me down, damn the man" bullshit from any black person anywhere, especially not a presidential candidate. Him going to a church where this kind of crap was obviously spewed more than just this one time people are focusing on is enough to put him in that category for me, guilty by association - if he really doesn't agree he wouldn't be there..

This is the center of Funk's opinion, and what I have a problem with. Again (just like all over the world) there is a REASON that black people feel this way - and in many parts of the country the idea of systemic racial inequality is real and tangible in the lives of racial minorities. Is it worse than the systemic economic inequalities present in America? I would argue yes, but it is a debateable point.

What isn't debatable is that the U.S. has a history of systematically infringing upon the constitutional rights of the black man. Be it slavery, Jim Crow, or the Birminham Police Department, that history still lives on in the memory of many around this country. Denying this and saying "it's all better now" cannot, and will not, solve the problems inherent by those actions. We still have a lot of racism to face in this country, whether we like it or not. Denying the legitimate feelings of those historically disenfranchised by our government only serves to strengthen the divides between us (for both the white, the black, the hispanic, etc. etc.).

Saying that people who feel this way don't deserve a place at the discussion table is just as bad as saying that your opinions are invalid. They may be wrong-headed, but one needs to understand their point of view before outright condemning it.

Animale

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Agreed Animale. Another good thing that may come from this, is that it is okay to discuss race. It is obviously still important. I'm sure this church in question is not the only black church continuing this divisive negative views, just as there is probably white churchs still spewing racist inuendos the other way. Maybe every time someone brings up race, they won't be fingered as a racist. Race is an important issue and tryign to pretend we are at a point in time where it doesn't is the problem. We aren't there yet. Open honest discussions should be welcomed. Obama tried to run without bringing up race, Hillary made sure that never happened. He answered it, in this speech, beautifully.

[Funkmasterr]

Either way I'm not ok with it. I do not have the time of day for any "white man holdin me down, damn the man" bullshit from any black person anywhere, especially not a presidential candidate. Him going to a church where this kind of crap was obviously spewed more than just this one time people are focusing on is enough to put him in that category for me, guilty by association - if he really doesn't agree he wouldn't be there..

This is the center of Funk's opinion, and what I have a problem with. Again (just like all over the world) there is a REASON that black people feel this way - and in many parts of the country the idea of systemic racial inequality is real and tangible in the lives of racial minorities. Is it worse than the systemic economic inequalities present in America? I would argue yes, but it is a debateable point.

What isn't debatable is that the U.S. has a history of systematically infringing upon the constitutional rights of the black man. Be it slavery, Jim Crow, or the Birminham Police Department, that history still lives on in the memory of many around this country. Denying this and saying "it's all better now" cannot, and will not, solve the problems inherent by those actions. We still have a lot of racism to face in this country, whether we like it or not. Denying the legitimate feelings of those historically disenfranchised by our government only serves to strengthen the divides between us (for both the white, the black, the hispanic, etc. etc.).

Saying that people who feel this way don't deserve a place at the discussion table is just as bad as saying that your opinions are invalid. They may be wrong-headed, but one needs to understand their point of view before outright condemning it.

Animale

Tell me where I said that everything is "all better now". I said that there is work to be done, however people like this guy, jesse jackson, al sharpton, and every ignorant sonofabitch that stands behind them are the BIGGEST factor working against this goal.

[Sueven]

Tell me where I said that everything is "all better now". I said that there is work to be done, however people like this guy, jesse jackson, al sharpton, and every ignorant sonofabitch that stands behind them are the BIGGEST factor working against this goal.

You claim to categorically reject anybody who talks about being 'held down' by 'the white man.' However, you admit that there is still 'work to be done' and everything is not 'all better now.' This means that, in fact, black people ARE being held down by 'the white man,' to some extent.

How, precisely, do you plan on getting that necessary work done if it's categorically unacceptable to point out the problem that we're supposed to be working to fix?

[Funkmasterr]

Tell me where I said that everything is "all better now". I said that there is work to be done, however people like this guy, jesse jackson, al sharpton, and every ignorant sonofabitch that stands behind them are the BIGGEST factor working against this goal.

You claim to categorically reject anybody who talks about being 'held down' by 'the white man.' However, you admit that there is still 'work to be done' and everything is not 'all better now.' This means that, in fact, black people ARE being held down by 'the white man,' to some extent.

How, precisely, do you plan on getting that necessary work done if it's categorically unacceptable to point out the problem that we're supposed to be working to fix?

1- There is a difference between trying to work things out in a civil, professional manner and going about things in the Jesse Jackson fashion. You don't get things done by bitching and saying borderline reverse racist nonsense, and dwelling on the past instead of focusing on a point in the future.

2- A lot of the comments I'm talking about are vast exaggerations of the actual situation at hand.

[Nick]

Wait a minute, you're actually trying to compare Obama to Jesse Jackson?



Jesus christ.

[Funkmasterr]

Wait a minute, you're actually trying to compare Obama to Jesse Jackson?



Jesus christ.

No, I'm not. Follow from where I started posting instead of skimming what I posted and looking for something you can grasp onto to insult me about you tool.

Edit: To help you out since I think that might be too daunting a task for you, the comparison was to the pastor (or whatever) of Obama's church.