Prosecutor won't bring charges in MySpace suicide

[Winnow]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/12/03/intern ... index.html

Let me get this straight...they were actually trying to charge someone with murder because they told the person they were mean to their friends?

Everyone on this board might be going to jail if one of its members commits suicide.

How retarded.

Prosecutor won't bring charges in MySpace suicide

(CNN) -- A Missouri prosecutor said Monday no charges would be sought in the case of a teen who hanged herself last year after chatting on MySpace, although he said adults should have prevented the tragedy.

Megan Meier, shown in an undated photo, killed herself after receving a critical message on MySpace.

Megan Meier, 13, killed herself after receiving a critical message on the MySpace social networking site from someone she thought was a boy named "Josh."

St. Charles County, Missouri, Prosecuting Attorney Jack Banas said an 18-year-old woman posed as "Josh" on MySpace to find out what Megan was saying about a neighbor's daughter.

The message said Megan was "mean" to her friends, Banas said. Video Watch Megan's parents describe the tragedy »

"There is no way that anybody could know that talking to someone or saying that you're mean to your friends on the Internet would create a substantial risk," Banas said. "It certainly created a potential risk and, unfortunately for the Meiers, that potential became reality. But under the law we just couldn't show that."

But Banas said that conclusion doesn't mean no one is to blame. "Regardless of what we can charge or what we can't charge, there is no question the adults should have said something to stop this," he said.

Over several weeks, many of the exchanges on MySpace concerned innocuous topics such as what sports they liked, Banas said.

But on October 15, 2006, "another teenage young lady" was given the password to the "Josh" account, Banas said. She reportedly sent Megan a message saying she had heard the girl was "mean to your friends" and adding, "I don't know if I want to be your friend anymore."

Banas said that Megan responded, "Who's saying this? Who's saying I'm mean?"

The next day, the 18-year-old woman -- who was working for a neighbor of Megan's -- used the account to send messages to Megan. Megan asked "Josh" why the messages were nice a day after they were unkind, Banas said.

The 18-year-old woman then reviewed the history of the earlier messages, including Megan's request about who had accused her of not being nice to her friends, he said.

The woman then "fired a statement back to Megan saying, 'I'm not going to tell you who told me that, I don't do that, I don't tell on my friends,' " Banas said.

Megan responded with a message expressing anger and calling "Josh" "a few names," according to Banas.

"Josh" then sent a statement that included something to the effect of "this world would be a better place without you," Banas said. Accounts differ as to who was with the 18-year-old during the typing of the messages, he said.

When Megan's mother returned home, she found her daughter crying at the computer. After reading the messages, she criticized her daughter for using inappropriate language, Banas said.

Telling her mom that "I can't believe you're not on my side," Megan ran upstairs and hanged herself, Banas said.

Are you kidding me? Do these people not know what a flame is on the internet? There's got to be 10's of thousands of comments like that flying around the net each day. Each one of those is a possible crime? What a bunch of tools.

[noel]

Seems like social Darwinism was executed (pun intended) perfectly.

[Keverian FireCry]

Who the fuck is "Josh" and why the fuck would she care about anything "he" said?

I have 5 nieces/nephews. Three of those are teens. Between them they already know 5 people their age who've killed themselves over social bullshit/relationships. I'm not sure if it's that the online networking generation(and other aspects of are hyper-society) is forcing them to "grow up" too fast or if it just amplifies the effects of things like gossip/bullying, but this kind of stuff is making me not want to have children.

Or maybe I'll home school them and teach them that computers are tools of Satan.

[Boogahz]

Not everyone is an ass to people over the internet just because they know they can't be touched for it. This girl already had some mental health issues, and the "boy" she met played on those and pushed her past her limits to cope. There really are no criminal charges that would fit what was done, but I am guessing civil charges will still be brought.

[Lalanae]

Who the fuck is "Josh" and why the fuck would she care about anything "he" said?

According to another article, "Josh" was a ficticious person...

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/17/intern ... index.html


"Her family learned later that Josh never actually existed; he was created by members of a neighborhood family that included a former friend of Megan's."

"Another parent, who learned of the MySpace account from her own daughter who had access to the Josh profile, told Megan's parents about the hoax in a counselor's office about six weeks after Megan died. That's when they learned Josh was imaginary, they said.

The woman who created the fake profile has not been charged with a crime. She allegedly told the St. Charles County Sheriff's Department she created Josh's profile because she wanted to gain Megan's confidence to know what Megan was saying about her own child online.

The mother from down the street told police that she, her daughter and another person all typed and monitored the communication between the fictitious boy and Megan."


They apparently had "Josh" sending her affectionate messages, gaining her confidence. 13 is a pretty sensitive age, with or without existing emotional problems. While I don't think criminal charges are warranted, I hope the family goes after the woman who created "Josh" civily. I also put some responsibility on her own parents for letting an emotionally-troubled girl become involved with an anonymous "boy" online. In this day and age, there's no excuse for allowing your kids to communicate with strangers online, especially when it seems to be heading down a romantic path.

[Winnow]

That's why FanFaire's are around so that you know people exist!

I understand the age thing. Being 13, don't you have to have consent from a parent to use a certain chat IMs? If anything, I could see a requirement for a warning before you use IM's that you must be 18 in order to use them or have parental consent. That might not prevent underage people from chatting on the IMs but it would cover the IMs and their users, and that's the important part! You can't prevent emo kids from killing themselves but you can prevent adults from getting in trouble for it! (kidding a little, don't get excited)

Now, deliberately logging onto something like, "Disney Chat", lying about your age (lying that you're under 18) and then screwing with a kid's head in chat is something that should be punishable by law. A chat group that is designated for children should be given some protection.

Of course, MMORPGs kind of screw that up with all ages playing them but there is some sort of parental consent age requirement on those I think.

This is a serious issue. Unfortunately, the solution may be more internet government regulations which most people don't want for other reasons.

[Ashur]

[Boogahz]

Being 13, don't you have to have consent from a parent to use ...

There are so many hoops to go through to get into about anything if you're underage...I mean...you have to put a DOB into a form, or maybe just click a box stating you're over a certain age.

My niece started a myspace profile when she was 10 without my sister knowing. Now my sister monitors her computer usage a lot more than before. It used to be that she just assumed those sites would not allow a 10-year-old to create a profile since they had age limits.

[Winnow]

Being 13, don't you have to have consent from a parent to use ...

There are so many hoops to go through to get into about anything if you're underage...I mean...you have to put a DOB into a form, or maybe just click a box stating you're over a certain age.

I'm more concerned about protecting the adults in this case. I realize it's easy to bypass and don't care about that. As long as there is some sort of warning and policy agreement, the onus is back on the parents. Otherwise, as an adult, you really can't talk to anyone on the internet unless you know them IRL as it could be a kid lying about their age and then you'll get into trouble for telling them to go die in a fire.

[Boogahz]

Being 13, don't you have to have consent from a parent to use ...

There are so many hoops to go through to get into about anything if you're underage...I mean...you have to put a DOB into a form, or maybe just click a box stating you're over a certain age.

I'm more concerned about protecting the adults in this case. I realize it's easy to bypass and don't care about that. As long as there is some sort of warning and policy agreement, the onus is back on the parents. Otherwise, as an adult, you really can't talk to anyone on the internet unless you know them IRL as it could be a kid lying about their age and then you'll get into trouble for telling them to go die in a fire.

Maybe we're not talking about the same thing then. Yes, parents should be more involved, which is why I brought up my sister's situation. The comment about having to have a parent's consent to use various sites on the web is the part I was talking about being piss poor. What web site actually makes your mommy log in for you in order to show their consent before it can be used? Besides, what kind of warning would be present to tell an adult not to fuck with a disturbed 13-year-old girl that they know in real life? I would assume it was common sense.

[Xyun]

I just want everyone to know that Xyun is a fictitious person created by a random person none of you have ever met. Should any of Xyun's words cause you to commit suicide or murder, the random person creating the fictitious character is not criminally or civilly responsible.

I will be sending out legal contracts to the people I flame the most via PMs to be electronically signed. Thanks.

[Canelek]

I just want everyone to know that Xyun is a fictitious person created by a random person none of you have ever met. Should any of Xyun's words cause you to commit suicide or murder, the random person creating the fictitious character is not criminally or civilly responsible.

I will be sending out legal contracts to the people I flame the most via PMs to be electronically signed. Thanks.

Is this why you want people to meet you at Banana Joe's?

[Lalanae]

As soon as Eric put a computer in his kid's room, he installed software that prevents his son from visiting any site without Eric approving it first. His son was caught looking at a porn site at Eric's Dad's house less than a year ago. He didn't stumble across it either. He was given a URL by friends and typed it in. Eric went back over the logs of his computer here and saw that he had typed the same URL in (and was denied access of course).

The kid was barely NINE YEARS OLD! If you have kids, never assume they are too young to get in trouble with such things. After that incident, Eric made sure the computer at his ex's house and his Dad's house were protected.

The kids today are gonna be some fucked up individuals later in life... I'm so glad I don't have of my own...

[Ashur]

Lala,

Nine year old boys looking for pr0n is pretty darn normal.

I'm pretty sure we were passing around the Playboys in the tree fort in the Third or Fourth grade. Computer at home? That's instant satisfaction.

That said, my daughter is in trouble. I'm going to put the Gestapo and KGB to shame in my looking out for her and protecting her from teh evil interlopers and fake "Josh" types. She'll probably have issues later in life as a result.

That is if she doesn't outsmart me! Which she probably will since by the time she's 13 I'll be in my 50s. :/

[Canelek]

My buddy's wife had twin girls on Halloween. He called my from London that morning. I told him congratulations and you are in for a world of pain.

[Boogahz]

Lala,

Nine year old boys looking for pr0n is pretty darn normal.

I'm pretty sure we were passing around the Playboys in the tree fort in the Third or Fourth grade. Computer at home? That's instant satisfaction.

yeah, we were passing one around around that time too...pretty sure it was 4th grade. A friend found some that belonged to his dad or older brother, and they were then stashed in our "club house." Thinking back on it, we really were pretty damn clueless about what we were looking at in a way too.

[Winnow]

I think I was around 10 when I acquired my first Penthouse/Hustler on the schoolyard black market.

Dirty mags are safer than net porn so I'd advise preemptively buying a few and laying them on the coffee table for your children to steal. On the other hand, half the fun is the challenge of obtaining contraband as a kid so that might not be a good idea, making your child weak willed and unresourceful.

Maybe just let them watch Californication instead.

[Lalanae]

There is a HUGE difference in seeing naked women in Playboy/Penthouse and seeing the shit on the internet these days.

I can't believe anyone would think its OK for 9 year old boys to surf the web for porn...

[Boogahz]

There is a HUGE difference in seeing naked women in Playboy/Penthouse and seeing the shit on the internet these days.

I can't believe anyone would think its OK for 9 year old boys to surf the web for porn...

I can't believe you would think we were saying it was okay for them to do so! Normal does not mean acceptable.

Yes, there is a difference, but I also left out the videos found as well! I still can't hear someone say "pass the butter" without blushing!

[Zaelath]

There is a HUGE difference in seeing naked women in Playboy/Penthouse and seeing the shit on the internet these days.

I can't believe anyone would think its OK for 9 year old boys to surf the web for porn...

Yeah, they really need to legislate that .xxx top level domain and put all the "more than nudes" pornography onto that.

Kids are curious, then they're horny, then they get mortgages and have kids, it's the circle of life. However, I think boys expectations of partners has gone way up with the amount of hardcore porn around, and it seems like the girls have been "groomed" by porn into being quite indiscriminate...

That said, I think discussion is better than filters, and .. really ... Eric put a computer with internet access into a kid's room... game over.

[pyrella]

I still can't hear someone say "pass the butter" without blushing!

Do tell! I also remember something about promised pics of the girl in the avatar.


[/reverting to being a 9 year old]

Oh yeah - stuff in the OP - tragic. I hear the people involved have been getting fucked with quite a bit as well - phone calls, rocks through windows, emails/real mails, etc.

While I don't think they should be criminally prosecuted, I do think they should have the shit kicked out of them before, during, or after some civil retribution is received. What if someone was to do that to their child that they were trying to 'protect'? Not defending the emo girl - but adults shouldn't fuck with kids, or recruit their children to do it for them. If Girl A has a problem with Girl B, Girl A's parent's need to bring it to Girl B's parents.

[Boogahz]

I still can't hear someone say "pass the butter" without blushing!

Do tell! I also remember something about promised pics of the girl in the avatar.


[/reverting to being a 9 year old]

One person (leaving him nameless for a reason!) here has seen many of them

The butter movie I remember involved a couple getting ready for anal...a stick of butter was used for lube

[Boogahz]

Being 13, don't you have to have consent from a parent to use ...

There are so many hoops to go through to get into about anything if you're underage...I mean...you have to put a DOB into a form, or maybe just click a box stating you're over a certain age.

I'm more concerned about protecting the adults in this case. I realize it's easy to bypass and don't care about that. As long as there is some sort of warning and policy agreement, the onus is back on the parents. Otherwise, as an adult, you really can't talk to anyone on the internet unless you know them IRL as it could be a kid lying about their age and then you'll get into trouble for telling them to go die in a fire.

In regards to the age-related "filters:"

Attorney General Abbott Takes Action Against Web Sites That Illegally Collect Personal Information From Minors
Millions of children registered with the popular sites; Texas first state to take action under COPPA

AUSTIN – Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott today took legal action against two Web sites that cater to children but fail to adequately protect their privacy and safety. Texas is the first state to file an enforcement action under the Children’s Online Privacy Protection Act (COPPA), a federal law that generally prohibits Web sites from unnecessarily collecting personal information from children under 13.

According to Attorney General investigators, TheDollPalace.com and Gamesradar.com unlawfully collect personal information such as names, ages, and home addresses from children. Investigators also discovered that the sites’ parental consent features were easily manipulated and circumvented. The lack of reasonable controls readily allow children to access the sites’ various features, including interactive chat rooms and forums, without their parents’ knowledge.

“These defendants are charged with operating child-oriented Web sites that violate the law by failing to protect young users,” Attorney General Abbott said. “Federal law provides important protections to prevent children from divulging sensitive personal information and to shield them from inappropriate sexual or violent content online. The Office of the Attorney General will continue aggressively enforcing laws to protect young Internet users.”

Both Web sites violate COPPA by failing to include necessary disclosures and failing to obtain parental consent before collecting personal information from children. TheDollPalace.com, for example, simply asks young users who are attempting to register, “Is a parent with you right now?” Children who click “Yes” are directed to a page that allows them to simply click “OK” to vague disclosures regarding information collection and use. Gamesradar.com similarly fails to properly obtain parental consent.

Under COPPA, these Web sites must make a greater effort to ensure that parents consent to their children providing personal information online. The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) offers several options for Web site operators to obtain verifiable parental consent. Among them, the FTC recommends that Web sites maintain a toll-free telephone number staffed by trained personnel for parents to call in their consent or provide a form for the parent to print, complete, sign, and mail or fax back to Web site operators.

Investigators also found that the sites allow children to access potentially inappropriate content. TheDollPalace.com allows users to access chat rooms and interactive forums that discuss topics parents may find inappropriate for young children.

COPPA further prohibits sites from requiring children to disclose excessive personal information as a precondition to participating in online games and features. Today’s enforcement action alleges that TheDollPalace.com requires children to fill out a 10-page personal profile in order to meet other site users and “search for friends.” The questionnaire asks children for detailed personal information, such as height, weight and eye color, and personal habits, including smoking and drinking behaviors. It also asks children about the type of person they would like to meet, including the options, “I would like to meet someone older than myself,” “My idea of a fun date,” and “sexual issues.” Despite collecting this detailed information, much of it does not appear on the user’s profile nor is it otherwise used for purposes of allowing users to meet and interact.

Attorney General Abbott has earned a national reputation for aggressively arresting and prosecuting online child predators. In light of today’s enforcement actions, Attorney General Abbott reminded parents to closely monitor their children’s Internet activities by using the following safety tips:

• Teach children never to give out personal information such as their last name, birthday, home address or telephone number, especially in a chat room, over an online bulletin board, or to an online pen pal, without your permission.
• Make sure your children know never to agree to a face-to-face meeting with someone they meet online.
• Instruct your children never to respond to e-mail or chat messages that make them feel uncomfortable or from someone they don’t know. Stress that they should show such messages to you.
• Surf the Internet with your kids. If it is not possible for you to actually surf with your children, at least talk to them about the Web sites they are visiting.
• Place the computer in a public room in your home so that even when you are not surfing online with your children, you can monitor their use. Do not allow computers in a child’s bedroom or permit the use of Web cams.
• Establish ground rules for your children’s Internet usage, including the hours they may surf and the kinds of Web sites they may visit. Post the rules near the computer.
• Learn how to use parental controls and archiving features. You should be able to check your child’s e-mail account and review the sites your child has visited on the Internet.

To find out more about Attorney General Abbott’s efforts to protect children and crack down on online predators, visit the Attorney General’s Web site at http://www.oag.state.tx.us or call (800) 252-8011.

[Funkmasterr]

I am curious to see what how they are defining "parental consent features were easily manipulated and circumvented." I can certainly tell you that I will be furious if I have to start using my credit card to verify my age like some sites do because lazy fucking parents won't take responsibility for their own children.

If you are concerned about what your kid is viewing online (and you should be) then you should be educating yourself on ways to monitor and select what content your kids view, not expecting every other site and program to do this work for you. Just another display of a lawsuit that will attempt to take more personal responsibility away from lazy, ignorant fucking people.

[Boogahz]

I am curious to see what how they are defining "parental consent features were easily manipulated and circumvented." I can certainly tell you that I will be furious if I have to start using my credit card to verify my age like some sites do because lazy fucking parents won't take responsibility for their own children.

If you are concerned about what your kid is viewing online (and you should be) then you should be educating yourself on ways to monitor and select what content your kids view, not expecting every other site and program to do this work for you. Just another display of a lawsuit that will attempt to take more personal responsibility away from lazy, ignorant fucking people.

This was a game related site, and the circumvention was answering Yes to the parent being there, and then clicking Ok.

[Funkmasterr]

I am curious to see what how they are defining "parental consent features were easily manipulated and circumvented." I can certainly tell you that I will be furious if I have to start using my credit card to verify my age like some sites do because lazy fucking parents won't take responsibility for their own children.

If you are concerned about what your kid is viewing online (and you should be) then you should be educating yourself on ways to monitor and select what content your kids view, not expecting every other site and program to do this work for you. Just another display of a lawsuit that will attempt to take more personal responsibility away from lazy, ignorant fucking people.

This was a game related site, and the circumvention was answering Yes to the parent being there, and then clicking Ok.

So what would you consider acceptable? It's not much harder to enter a fake birthdate, anyone above the age of about 6 would be able to figure that one out.

[Zaelath]

Don't look now: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/05/15 ... uicide.ap/

but it looks like the FBI doesn't agree w/ Missouri.