A very interesting read

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » October 18, 2006, 2:26 pm

This is from a blog:

The top of what you ask? The height of World of Warcraft greatness.

A few weeks ago, a good friend of mine quit playing Warcraft. He was a council member on what is now one of the oldest guilds in the world, the type of position coveted by many of the 7 million people who play the game today, but which only a few ever get.

When he quit, I asked him if he would write a guest blog post about the experience. What follows is a cautionary tale about the pull an escape from reality can have on you.

Read it all here: http://soulkerfuffle.blogspot.com/2006/ ... m-top.html

Dregor Thule · Post by **Dregor Thule** » October 18, 2006, 2:39 pm

Only 70+ days played? Bitch is a lightweight.

Funkmasterr · Post by **Funkmasterr** » October 18, 2006, 2:41 pm

I have more played time then that on WoW and I haven't really played in 6 months.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » October 18, 2006, 3:19 pm

What a fucking crybaby. He moved back in with his mommy and played WoW, and is somehow trying to blame WoW for the shambles his life is in?

I can almost hear the emo song playing in the background. HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN TO MEEEEEEE?

Sargeras · Post by **Sargeras** » October 18, 2006, 4:42 pm

I guess the difference between me and that guy is I know when I need to put the keyboard and mouse down and take care of the RL shit. I refuse to dedicate that much time to a computer game that I negate any other responsibility I have. If you do that then you have nothing to worry about. WoW (EQ, EQ2, CoH or any other game) doesn't ruin peoples' lives, the people do.

This reminds me so much of Sean Wooley's mother. For those of you who don't remember, Sean is the guy who took a shotgun to his mouth just minutes after he logged off of EQ. His mother went apeshit on the SOE and the media had a field day with her. She tried to get EQ banned from the market, stating it's all the game's fault for her son's issues and his death... but she neglected to mention the fact that he had a history of mental issues long before he played EQ. The amount of time and effort he put into EQ made him even worse, and she just couldn't accept the fact that she was a shitty mother and had to put the blame on something else.

Lor · Post by **Lor** » October 18, 2006, 5:01 pm

F-Him

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » October 18, 2006, 10:14 pm

WoW does suck but this guy doesn't get it. He's like all the other nut jobs out there that want to blame a game for their lack of willpower.

You don't stop making entertaining pastimes because some people lack the ability to control themselves. He complains that Blizzard made a game that you can't win. If people want an end to the game, after a set amount of time, say 20 hours, the game could pop up a message saying "Congratulations! You Won! If you'd like to continue the game, please do so knowing that you've already won. You winner you! People like you. You are a winner!"

Teaching time management is not a game's responsibility the same as teaching money management isn't the responsibility of a Casino. If you lose your spouse, or gain 30 pounds because you play an online computer game, it's your own fault. Also, who's to say what is best for an individual's personal time? Playing an online game every waking moment may be the ultimate in entertainment for certain people. It's up to them to balance survival (paying bills, keeping a roof over their head, etc) with their passion.

I will say this though. As with credit, financial planning, and family planning...time management needs to be a mandatory class in High School. You can't rely on parents to teach their kids this stuff and I think everyone deserves at least a chance to learn the basics before the commercial world tries its best to rape them.

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » October 19, 2006, 11:02 am

game could pop up a message saying "Congratulations! You Won! If you'd like to continue the game, please do so knowing that you've already won. You winner you! People like you. You are a winner!"

This made me giggle.

Xyphir · Post by **Xyphir** » October 19, 2006, 12:03 pm

...I've seen it destroy more families and friendships and take a huge toll on individuals than any drug on the market today, and that means a lot coming from an ex-club DJ.

I wonder if this guy ever sucked dick for WoW.

miir · Post by **miir** » October 19, 2006, 12:19 pm

What a drama queen

Siji · Post by **Siji** » October 19, 2006, 12:22 pm

i fucked him. bong!

Nick · Post by **Nick** » October 22, 2006, 5:20 am

That guy is such a twat.

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » October 23, 2006, 1:58 am

I'll tell you what busts you out of an overdone EQ/WOW habit,,,, a good woman. The one in my life reminded me that there is adventure outside pixilated constructs. Bless her heart

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » October 23, 2006, 2:18 am

A wise choice going with "a good women" Adex. "Bible Study" would not have had the same impact in this thread. Although, are you implying that all the women on this board are lesbians or that gay men are out of luck and stuck in EQ/WoW hell forever?

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » October 23, 2006, 2:23 am

*shrug* I'm sure gay folk have adventuresome people in their ranks.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » October 23, 2006, 2:27 am

Am I the only one that thought this post was pretty good and maybe even a bit insightful?

Winnow wrote:WoW does suck but this guy doesn't get it. He's like all the other nut jobs out there that want to blame a game for their lack of willpower

He didn't blame the game while he was playing it. And once he did get the willpower to quit, he saw the forest from the trees and basically said that it's Blizzard's intention for a game to be played as these "people with lacking willpower" do. He wasn't playing a blame game. He was thankful that he overcame his addiction.

I don't mean to pick on Winnow. Everyone's posts just seemed the same.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » October 23, 2006, 3:16 am

Leonaerd wrote:Am I the only one that thought this post was pretty good and maybe even a bit insightful?

Winnow wrote:WoW does suck but this guy doesn't get it. He's like all the other nut jobs out there that want to blame a game for their lack of willpower
He didn't blame the game while he was playing it. And once he did get the willpower to quit, he saw the forest from the trees and basically said that it's Blizzard's intention for a game to be played as these "people with lacking willpower" do. He wasn't playing a blame game. He was thankful that he overcame his addiction.

I don't mean to pick on Winnow. Everyone's posts just seemed the same.

The only insight the article has is a general insight that applies to all addictions. People aren't taught about addictions and possible ways to handle them at an early enough age, or taught about them at all. Learning about addictions typically comes through experiencing one first hand or observing another person with an addiction that affects you.

Gambling, MMORPGs, kyoukan's addiction to huskys (a breed of heavy-coated Arctic sled dog), or any other addiction that isn't chemically altering like alcohol, other drugs, cigarettes, etc. can have an impact on someone's life just like WoW did on this guy.

It's a balance between escaping from reality and escaping from responsibilities. Would you rather play WoW than drain your dog's anal glands? Sure you would. Same goes for just about anything else. Avoiding your annoying family, work, school, etc....that's an issue with avoiding your responsibilities more than being addicted to a game. If you end up losing your wife and kids well it's not all that bad. You'll still most likely be able to see your kids one weekend or two a month and that frees up more time to play games. If you're choosing something else over fucking your significant other, then either they suck, or you suck in bed and the partnership was probably a mistake as most long term relationships are. I'm talking about entertainment with your family/spouse, not your responsibilities to feed, father/mother them, etc. That's an avoidance of responsibility issue.

Targeting a form of entertainment and then blaming it for losing your wife, job, lower grades, etc is weak. You can either blame parents or our school system partially for not preparing kids in high school with the knowledge that's actually useful to them when they turn 18 and start to make decisions for themselves, or blame yourself if this knowledge was bestowed upon you and you chose to ignore it.

There's an endless supply of sob stories about addictions of all kinds that you can read about if you dig reading about other people's problems. There are people out there, maybe mutants, that are able to play online games, gamble, use peanut butter is strange ways, and still function completely "normally" in what are considered "normal, god loving, christian, socially acceptable activities."

You've got one shot at life and there is no afterlife, so you need to take the time to understand your country's laws so you don't end up in jail, determine for yourself what you find most enjoyable in life, and then formulate a plan that will make you enough money to enjoy those activities until you die of natural or unnatural causes. Keep in mind, that if you decide that having a spouse/partner is part of your life plans, then you need to give up a certain part of your "freedom" in the name of harmony with that person(s) because you can't control that other person's feelings no matter how compatible you think you are and in return for your sacrifice, you get to cuddle and have sex and stuff.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » October 23, 2006, 3:57 am

The only insight the article has is a general insight that applies to all addictions. People aren't taught about addictions and possible ways to handle them at an early enough age, or taught about them at all. Learning about addictions typically comes through experiencing one first hand or observing another person with an addiction that affects you.

I have mixed feelings here. People should be taught at an early age about such addictions, but those learning experiences should be taught with actual experience, not by an adult with some degree. Naivety goes hand in hand with laziness, inexperience and ease of life. I don't really blame the school system here, but more or less accept that ignorance to addiction is a byproduct of advancement in humankind. Or at least I would finger the blame there if it really meant much to me.

Gambling, MMORPGs, kyoukan's addiction to huskys (a breed of heavy-coated Arctic sled dog), or any other addiction that isn't chemically altering like alcohol, other drugs, cigarettes, etc. can have an impact on someone's life just like WoW did on this guy.

I don't think he was one-upping his addiction as something spectacular and unique, but rather an oft unused perspective to be read by those who he felt could use such insight. Judging by how many hits the blog's gotten, it's worked at least to an extent.

It's a balance between escaping from reality and escaping from responsibilities. Would you rather play WoW than drain your dog's anal glands? Sure you would. Same goes for just about anything else. Avoiding your annoying family, work, school, etc....that's an issue with avoiding your responsibilities more than being addicted to a game. If you end up losing your wife and kids well it's not all that bad. You'll still most likely be able to see your kids one weekend or two a month and that frees up more time to play games. If you're choosing something else over fucking your significant other, then either they suck, or you suck in bed and the partnership was probably a mistake as most long term relationships are. I'm talking about entertainment with your family/spouse, not your responsibilities to feed, father/mother them, etc. That's an avoidance of responsibility issue.

Avoidance of responsibility sort of harks back to the lack of addiction education. I agree, but for the different reasons I listed earlier.

Targeting a form of entertainment and then blaming it for losing your wife, job, lower grades, etc is weak. You can either blame parents or our school system partially for not preparing kids in high school with the knowledge that's actually useful to them when they turn 18 and start to make decisions for themselves, or blame yourself if this knowledge was bestowed upon you and you chose to ignore it.

Common sense isn't taught in elementary school. Being unprepared is nobody's fault. It's the fault of a lack of hardships the person must endure. I wonder how many people that log 50 hours a week into an MMO live comfortably in the basement of their parents, while having grown up with no such request to accept responsibility for that which a person with more addictive expereince would have assumed more naturally.

Like someone said in the LSD thread, crack whores can be surprisingly intelligent. Is that true because they're addicted / overcame an addiction, or is it true because they experience hardships naturally in their less-than-adequately furnished lives, performing their less-than-violence-free jobs?

There's an endless supply of sob stories about addictions of all kinds that you can read about if you dig reading about other people's problems. There are people out there, maybe mutants, that are able to play online games, gamble, use peanut butter is strange ways, and still function completely "normally" in what are considered "normal, god loving, christian, socially acceptable activities."

If that's a slander on politics and the big, strong government lovers that have socially perfect god-fearing lives, then I agree. Relating to the LSD thread again, there's nothing like seeing someone bitch and moan about weed use and then make a joke about knocking back a few beers. Anything can be used in moderation. Anything can be used inappropriately.

You've got one shot at life and there is no afterlife

You don't know that!

so you need to take the time to understand your country's laws so you don't end up in jail, determine for yourself what you find most enjoyable in life, and then formulate a plan that will make you enough money to enjoy those activities until you die of natural or unnatural causes.

Not that having money really necessarily equates to having an enjoyable life, I agree with most of that.

Keep in mind, that if you decide that having a spouse/partner is part of your life plans, then you need to give up a certain part of your "freedom" in the name of harmony with that person(s) because you can't control that other person's feelings no matter how compatible you think you are and in return for your sacrifice, you get to cuddle and have sex and stuff.

I agree with that more than all else of your post. When I first started dating and experiencing all those cool emotions and shit, it was clear that I wanted to marry some day and maybe have a family. The more I experienced and the longer I carried a relationship, though, the more it seemed apparent that marriage isn't some genuine institution of truth that all should strive for. I've been dating someone for almost a year now and while what we have is nice, it's not as nice as it used to be. Not because there are muddy points, but because muddy points are resolved increasingly quickly with every one that surfaces. I miss having stupid arguments. But even moreso, I miss being too early in a relationship to even need to worry about arguing.

Marriage, right now, seems like something that's done to essentially ensure guaranteed sex for a lifetime between two people that worry they won't always have an adequate sex life if not lawfully connected. It's all flowers and happy and open bar and all that shit on the cover, but deeper down I think it's a nasty social construction. If I feel I want to be devoted to somebody, I don't want to have to make it a legal thing to prove it. If I promised somebody I was going to marry them some day during the first month of dating, there would be no surprise that I asked them to marry me a few years later.

But I'm only 19. I know little. To the point at hand:

I liked the blog entry, you didn't. But I agreed with most of what you wrote. What am I not understanding?

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » October 23, 2006, 11:23 am

Adex_Xeda wrote:*shrug* I'm sure gay folk have adventuresome people in their ranks.

they're all more adventuresome than I am!

Ashur · Post by **Ashur** » October 23, 2006, 1:05 pm

Leonaerd wrote:Marriage, right now, seems like something that's done to essentially ensure guaranteed sex for a lifetime between two people that worry they won't always have an adequate sex life if not lawfully connected.

Leonaerd wrote:But I'm only 19. I know little.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » October 23, 2006, 1:10 pm

Ashur wrote:
Leonaerd wrote:Marriage, right now, seems like something that's done to essentially ensure guaranteed sex for a lifetime between two people that worry they won't always have an adequate sex life if not lawfully connected.

Leonaerd wrote:But I'm only 19. I know little.

Compelling argument. I'm sorry you need a legal contract to tell you when you're in love.

cadalano · Post by **cadalano** » October 23, 2006, 3:11 pm

leo, youre a cool kid. but every now and then you just make me want to punch you in the face

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » October 23, 2006, 3:34 pm

And I'll use my 1000th post to say "no lol u suck."

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » October 23, 2006, 6:01 pm

Leonaerd wrote:
Ashur wrote:
Leonaerd wrote:Marriage, right now, seems like something that's done to essentially ensure guaranteed sex for a lifetime between two people that worry they won't always have an adequate sex life if not lawfully connected.

Leonaerd wrote:But I'm only 19. I know little.
Compelling argument. I'm sorry you need a legal contract to tell you when you're in love.

The funny thing about your statements that he quoted is that...you are wrong in several ways (not about your age I assume though). People that think marriage (straight or gay) is all about the sex don't have a clue what it is really about. There are too many intangibles to a true partnership to whittle it down to anything like that.

Lalanae · Post by **Lalanae** » October 23, 2006, 6:09 pm

"guaranteed sex"

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » October 23, 2006, 6:51 pm

Boogahz wrote: People that think marriage (straight or gay) is all about the sex don't have a clue what it is really about. There are too many intangibles to a true partnership to whittle it down to anything like that.

And I think there are too many intangibles in a true partnership to need to reinforce them with legality. Call marriage a celebration of love, I call it an unnecessary measure of love, and for many couples, a way to better boost their confidence in spousal fidelity.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » October 23, 2006, 8:14 pm

Leonaerd wrote:"guaranteed sex"

If you add the words 'by yourself' I think he's got something. Sex has nothing to do with being married.

Stalker Vacio · Post by **Stalker Vacio** » October 24, 2006, 8:28 pm

I read these blogs and get a chuckle

, nothing in WOW compares to the "grind" of EQ1 in it's hayday

Kwonryu DragonFist · Post by **Kwonryu DragonFist** » October 25, 2006, 3:16 am

Lalanae wrote:"guaranteed sex"

lol!

Only when you get diamonds huh?

Kryshade · Post by **Kryshade** » December 3, 2006, 11:58 am

Not to dig up an old post or anything, but I just read this (and the linked article). Now, being that this board arose from EQ, I would think that many of us can relate to the article in some way. Sure, there are the hard-core and there are the casual. I was one of the hardcore for quite some time. When I found EQ I was instantly hooked. It was the game I had always been looking for. Was I addicted to it at some point.... sure. Did I play it sometimes for 12 hours a day... sure. Did it sometimes detract from other points of my life... yep. Was it my fault? Hell yes.

I found two things that made it hard for me to quit. 1) Just the sheer amount of time I had put into it. I had the mentality " I can't quit, I've put 3 years into this, I can't just walk away from that" even when the game started to suck, and I wasn't having fun anymore. 2) The people. I met some very cool people playing EQ, had some very cool indepth conversations, a ot of fun goofing off before a raid, forming guild groups and getting tight with a smaller core of people within that guild. It was very hard to tell those people "goodbye".

Now, I'm the first to admit that I have an addictive personality. I smoked more weed in my highschool days and did more drugs back then just because they were "fun". I was addicted to EQ for similar reasons, it was an escape, and a fun one at that. Do I think they make the game to be addictive? No, I think it's purely business (and a good one at that). It's up to the players to control themselves.

You know what's funny, and how I know I was addicted to the game... I still, after 3 years or so of NOT playing EQ remember all the fond moments, and sometimes wish I could go back to killing lions in East Karana, running away from the cyclops, or sitting in NFP dueling people and playing the market game. I had OMGIAMRETARDEDCAUSEALOTISTWOWORDS of good times playing EQ, but I sacrificed a lot because of it. My fault completely, but there is something about the game that makes it easy for people with an addictive personality to abuse it.