A legal drug experience (Long, hopefully interesting)

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 14, 2006, 4:19 pm

Disclaimer:

So hey, if you're a huge anti-drug person and assume that anything that messes with your head is evil, stop reading.[/b]

First, let me just say that I do smoke marijuana sometimes, though not usually in a party environment. I usually like to take a few puffs before I go to bed, and lay and listen to music with my eyes closed. (try it sometime). It does really enhance the music, and you'll sleep like a baby.

So, when I heard of Salvia Divinorum (google it for more info), and found out that it was legal and obtainable in any smoke shop I was pretty thrilled.

It's a pretty potent hallucinogen (sp) and has been compared to LSD, PCP, etc. I've never triend anything but pot and don't really intend to, so I wouldn't know.

Anyhow, 1 gram of Salvia extract (17x for those who are familiar, it comes in 5x, 10x, 15x, 17x, 20x, 25x and 30x, which are different potencies) cost me $40, and one hit is supposed to be 1/10th of a gram.

(Trip 1)

I got a friend who also wanted to try it, and we took turns in my yard one night. (I highly suggest having a sober sitter around if you do try it).

So since I paid i went first, I packed up the pipe, took one huge hit and held it as long as I could (45 seconds or so). As I blew out the smoke I was already feeling it.

Immediately I felt like the ground shifted into a vertical plane, so I started leaning forward more and more to compensate. Eventually I knelt down and sat on all fours, and suddenly it seemed like daytime and I was like a bug or something on the side of a big yellow house so I started crawling (thought I was climbing).

It felt more and more like I was going to lose my grip and slide down and for some reason that seemed hilarious, and I couldn't keep myself from laughing. I kept crawling until I got to a tree and went to the side which seemed like the top to me and tried to get on it so I wouldn't fall, found that I couldn't so I just laid on the grass holding on.

The whole thing lasted about 5 minutes, after which the strange feelings went away and I was left with a great mood, a lot of crazy thoughts and wanting to try it again another time.

(Trip 2)

I was alone this time, in my bedroom. I took the same sized hit, put down the pipe and lighter and got into bed. I blew out the smoke in complete darkness with the red hot chili peppers playing in the background (quietly).

Immediately I felt like I melted into the blankets (I had one on top of me). I felt like I fell into the bed and the blanket was pushing me further and further down. I was completely convinced that there was another dimension on top of the blanket and thats where all of the weight was coming from.

I closed my eyes and concentrated and was able to look "into" that dimension, where I was a city of really freaky buildings all leaning over a huge red glowing ball that was obviously some sort of heat or energy source. I opened my eyes again and then I felt as though I was looking at myself from outside of the window. I didn't feel like my body moved, just my conciousness.

When I blinked again I felt almost completely normal, and fell asleep shortly after.

If you're the type of person who's into meditation, self exploration, etc, I would recommend this. Supposidely shamans from other cultures used to smoke Salvia to enhance their visions.

WARNING I would not recommend using this as a party drug. Noisey environments and unfamiliar people would be absolutely terrifying. Trying to fight the effects of the drug to act "normal" would be iimpossible. Do it alone or better yet with one or two good friends to keep an eye on you.

Asheran Mojomaster · Post by **Asheran Mojomaster** » August 14, 2006, 4:36 pm

Haha, yeah I love Salvia. Just because its legal doesn't mean anything, its one of the most intense drugs I've ever used. I think I've tripped on it probably 10-15 times now, not really sure, and I've used up to 45x before (believe thats as potent as you can get it from a store atm, though labs have created up to 100x or maybe beyond).

Anyway, sounds like you had some fun trips on it. The hysterical laughing is a very common part of it. Doesn't always happen but it seems to be about 50\50 with me.

It also can be terrifying. The first time I did it I saw the items and people in the room morph into numbers, though I could still see them in their normal form at the same time, and I thought the numbers were counting down to the apocalypse. Then I heard a voice that I thought was Satan talking to me telling me I was going to hell. It was really one of my friends talking about something completely off the wall and unrelated.

I took a huge hit of 20x that time though and I was nervous to start off. I couldn't even remember exactly what happened until a few weeks later when I really thought hard back to it. I had just remembered running out of the hotel room and catching myself as I went out the door. I had to take a few deep breaths and calm down so I could go back to the couch.

Haven't had any bad trips on it since then though. Also, while it seems like it would be bad at parties, its really not. I've smoked it about 1\3rd of the times I've did it around 20+ people and had no problem. Its all about how well you react to situations like that though, I could see some people flipping their shit.

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 14, 2006, 4:41 pm

I've heard that on some of the more intense trips people have felt as though they lived an entire life as a different person / thing. From creation to death all within the 10 - 20 minute trip period.

That would be amazing and I want to experience it

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » August 14, 2006, 4:49 pm

Sounds fun. How long does the $40 gram last? One hit every two days, so it lasts for about three weeks? Or is it something you can do again and again and bust hundreds of dollars in a week?

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 14, 2006, 5:00 pm

If you wanted to you could do it over and over.

After every "trip" you get an "afterglow" as it's commonly referred to. A few hours of feeling relaxed, feeling happy, and feeling like you know a lot more about yourself than you ever have before.

It's not like "whoa that was amazing lets do it again!" for me I want to take a break, think about what I just went through, try to figure out what it meant, etc.

1 Gram of 17x extract ($40) is probably good for 8- 12 trips. I still say you need a quiet environment and to be in the right mood to really appreciate the effects. It might be fun at a party, but it's absolutely amazing when you can be alone to concentrate on what's going on.

You can order the leaves online by the ounce for maybe $25, and either smoke them, chew them, cook them into food, but they're nowhere near as strong as extract and you need to use a lot more at a time for the same effect.

EDIT: Just found this - different levels of the high based on how much you use.

The SALVIA Experiential Rating Scale

Level -1 "S stands for SUBTLE effects." A feeling that "something" is happening, although it is difficulty to say just what. Relaxation and increased sensual appreciation may be noted. This mild level is useful for meditation and may facilitate sexual pleasure.
Level - 2 "A stands for ALTERED perception." Colors and textures are paid attention to. Appreciation of music may be enhanced. Space may appear of greater or lesser depth than is usual. But visions do not occur at this level. Thinking becomes less logical, and more playful; short term memory difficulties are may be noted.

Level - 3 "L" stands for LIGHT visionary state." Closed eye visuals (clear imagery with eyes closed: fractal patterns, vinelike and geometric patterns, visions of objects and designs). The imagery is often two dimensional. If open eyed visual effects occur these are usually vague and fleeting. At this level phenomena similar to the hypnagogic phenomena that some people experience at sleep onset occur. At this level visions are experienced as "eye candy" but are not confused with reality.

Level - 4 "V stands for VIVID visionary state." Complex three dimensional realistic appearing scenes occur. Sometimes voices may be heard. With eyes open contact with consensual reality will not be entirely lost, but when you close your eyes you may forget about consensus reality and enter completely into a dreamlike scene. Shamanistic journeying to other lands, foreign or imaginary; encounters with beings, entities, spirits; or travels to other ages may occur. You may even live the life of another person. At this level you have entered the shaman's world. Or if you prefer you are in "dream time." With eyes closed you experience fantasies (dream like happenings, with a story line to them). So long as your eyes are closed you may believe they are really occurring. This differs from the "eye candy" closed eye imagery, of level 3.

Level - 5 "I" stands for IMMATERIAL existence." At this level consciousness remains and some thought processes are still lucid, but one becomes completely involved in inner experience and loses all contact with consensual reality. Individuality may be lost; one experiences merging with God/dess, mind, universal consciousness, or bizarre fusions with other objects real or imagined, e.g. merging with a wall may be experienced. At this level it is impossible to function in consensual reality, but unfortunately some people do not remain still but move around in this befuddled state. For this reason a sitter is essential to ensure the safety of someone voyaging to the inner levels. To the person experiencing this, the phenomenon may be terrifying or exceedingly pleasant; but to an outside observer the individual may appear confused or disoriented.

Level 6 - "A stands for AMNESIC effects " At this stage either consciousness is lost; or at least one is unable to later recall what one is experiencing. The individual may fall, or remain immobile or thrash around; somnambulistic behavior may occur; injuries can be sustained without pain being felt; on awakening the individual will have no recollection of what he/she did, experienced or said in level 6. People cannot ever recall what they experience in this very deep trance state. This is not a sought after level as later nothing can be recalled of the experience.

Arborealus · Post by **Arborealus** » August 14, 2006, 5:42 pm

You should just cultivate it yourselves...All the sages are quite easily propagated via seed or cuttings...And it should be a moderately cold tolerant perennial...say USDA Zone 7+...

Ebumar · Post by **Ebumar** » August 14, 2006, 9:18 pm

Well, by that scale... Ive hit level 2 and 3 the first few times. Level 5 I have experienced three times, and 6 I have experienced once. Each time I have taken a higher dosage or more potent amount. I have to say, Level 5 is the most intense trip I have ever had. Completely out of my body watching myself. Very intense stuff. Highly recommended!

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » August 14, 2006, 10:00 pm

Is there any THC in salvia?

Sirensa · Post by **Sirensa** » August 14, 2006, 11:32 pm

Neziroth wrote: So, when I heard of Salvia Divinorum (google it for more info), and found out that it was legal and obtainable in any smoke shop I was pretty thrilled.

Not legal everywhere. I just hope it doesn't have any lasting permanent damaging effects - not that they'd be noticeable in some of you

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 14, 2006, 11:54 pm

Metallic spray paint is legal too. So is butane. Now get huffing.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 15, 2006, 12:20 am

You aren't really cool these days until you've tripped out and seen Jesus.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » August 15, 2006, 12:29 am

I just took two deep lungs of 15x extract about 15 minutes ago. That was some crazy shit. I kept the room pitch black, put Vicarious on very low volume, and went to sit on the couch after I took my hits.

I didn't make it to the couch. As soon as I stood up from the chair, the air literally left the room and caused the ground to stand up to take its place until it got back. To compensate I forced myself to stand on the gorund as it was in the air (my friend told me I had my face pressed against the floor and was making snow-angel motions) and tiptoe across the room to safety. I told myself there was air in the next room so I could stand on the ground like a normal person. But as I made my way to the door, it moved behind me.

So I turned around and started walking toward it. But there was a drum set in the way, and whoever was playing it rigged the snare drum with bullets. I ducked out of the way of fire every time I thought it shot but then realized since there was ground instead of air that I could breathe. Thankfully at the point where my lungs were about to burst the air came back in the room and the ground slowly began to go back down level. But the air came in from the doorway first, so I had to run with the last of my energy to that side of the room to get to the air since it wasn't making it to my side of the room fast enough.

at about that point i realized the ground had been there the whole time and i was coming down from my buzz.

that was some serious shit. legal too. go tigers. i'm still a little coming off of my buzz so if the post doesn't make sense you'll know why.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » August 15, 2006, 12:43 am

you know that anything that does that to your brain isn't good for it, right?

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » August 15, 2006, 12:55 am

Yeah, I was thinking you can get about the same effect by holding your breath for about 90 seconds instead of 45 with a lung full of shit...

But really, enjoy, enjoy, just don't reproduce.

Arborealus · Post by **Arborealus** » August 15, 2006, 2:20 am

kyoukan wrote:you know that anything that does that to your brain isn't good for it, right?

Alkaloids Schmalkaloids...

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 15, 2006, 3:09 am

It would depend on how you define what's good for your body/mind/life experience.

Arborealus · Post by **Arborealus** » August 15, 2006, 3:41 am

Leonaerd wrote:Is there any THC in salvia?

No, the psychoactive substance is Salvorinin which is a Kappa Opioid agonist.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » August 15, 2006, 4:42 am

Nick wrote:It would depend on how you define what's good for your body/mind/life experience.

not really. it's poison. the reason you get euphoric from it is because your brain releases a bunch of chemicals to try and clean the toxins out.

it kind of worries me to have to mention the fact that just because something is legal doesn't mean that it isn't harmful. I'm all for recreational drug use, but the kind of comments I hear from people that use this stuff always seem to justify the health risks by saying that it's perfectly legal.

Asheran Mojomaster · Post by **Asheran Mojomaster** » August 15, 2006, 6:14 am

There have been no studies to show that Salvia has any negative effects at all. In fact, every study that has been done on it has shown no side effects or only positive ones once you come down. That does not mean that it may not have longterm detrimental effects...but we can only hope I guess. I have reached the 6th level twice now, but it is kinda pointless because you dont know what happens, you just get told a crazy story about what you did later. 5th level is amazing though.

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 15, 2006, 6:41 am

Obviously it's not good for you. I think all of us have some idea of that.

But you know what? Even if I never do it again, I'm glad I've had those experiences. Curiousity got the best of me I guess?

Also, I posted the fact that it was legal to show how accessable it is, and also because I can't believe something with effects that strong is legal. Not to make it sound safe.

Arborealus · Post by **Arborealus** » August 15, 2006, 1:29 pm

Actually in this case the reason you get high is that the psychoactive component directly activates opioid receptors. So it isn't causing a neurotransmitter dump or a toxic reaction to produce the effect. Directly modulating neurotransmission leads me to believe it may well prove addictive ie you would see decreased production of endogenous opioids and see rebound dysphoria with heavy usage.

There doesn't appear to be significant research on toxicity of Salvorinin. It is not an alkaloid and probably no more toxic than most mint family volatiles. There is a long history of usage in native medicines without adverse side-effects. No research as to carcinogenicity or terratogenicity (though of course, inhaling burning plants is going to expose you to tar and other carcinogens and terratogens).

So ya know...don't operate heavy machinery...and maybe try baking it into cookies (or maybe a pork roast) instead of smoking it...I know that is widely chewed in shamanistic usage. On net I would guess that is about as dangerous as say a sage rich cornbread dressing...

If you wanna alter your state I would recommend just moving though...

Nick · Post by **Nick** » August 15, 2006, 1:53 pm

kyoukan wrote:
Nick wrote:It would depend on how you define what's good for your body/mind/life experience.
not really. it's poison. the reason you get euphoric from it is because your brain releases a bunch of chemicals to try and clean the toxins out.

it kind of worries me to have to mention the fact that just because something is legal doesn't mean that it isn't harmful. I'm all for recreational drug use, but the kind of comments I hear from people that use this stuff always seem to justify the health risks by saying that it's perfectly legal.

I don't think anyone's saying it "justifies" the health risks because it's perfectly legal. I think they are saying the experience itself justifies the health risks - it just happens to be legal too \o/

There a billion "harmful to the body" things that are legal, it doesn't mean they aren't worth doing - if all we did was worry about what was harmful to our bodies we would avoid a lot of the things that make life such a super duper experience.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » August 15, 2006, 2:15 pm

kyoukan wrote:you know that anything that does that to your brain isn't good for it, right?

kyoukan wrote:it kind of worries me to have to mention the fact that just because something is legal doesn't mean that it isn't harmful.

It doesn't have to be mentioned. Most acquaintances of mine that are drug users understand fully that what they're doing to their bodies probably isn't good for their health (that's -not- to say that there aren't tons upon tons of people that don't), and simply think the experience is worth the risk.

Nick put it well in saying that the legality of the drug is more icing than it is cake.

edit: acquaintAnces

Post by **Xouqoa** » August 15, 2006, 2:33 pm

one time i took a hit of acid that my friend gave me and i was tripping out and saw some freaky stuff then some monsters were trying to rape me and they tore off all my clothes and i was running down the street naked and then when i got back my friend told me it was just a piece of paper and i wasnt really tripping and i was a dumbass cool story right

.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 15, 2006, 2:43 pm

What you experienced was a bad trip Xou. If done properly, you would have seen Jesus.

PS, were the monsters male or female? Tentacles?

cadalano · Post by **cadalano** » August 15, 2006, 4:28 pm

what level is it when i wake up in a dumpster with a weird feeling in my ass

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 15, 2006, 5:58 pm

I hope all of you who are preaching about the harmful effects are non-smokers and non-drinkers. I'd rather take a hit of salvia every day than smoke 40+ cigarettes or down a bunch of alcohol.

I don't usually agree with your opinions Nick but you hit it on the head. Obviously inhaling smoke isn't healthy. However, the experience that you get from it (if you don't end up inhaling too much and passing out) is so amazing and unique that it's well worth it.

Taking a hit of Salvia isn't something I do without a great deal of planning, concentrating to clear my head and with great caution because this stuff will put you on your ass in about 30 seconds.

I can't even describe what's going through my mind when I take that hit. It's not like anything else. The smoke's in your lungs and you realize that you're 100% committed to experiencing whatever wild / amazing / terriftying / mindblowing events that your brain has in store for you - that alone is a huge rush.

You have just about enough time to set down the lighter and pipe and then before you know it the world as you know it is gone, you're experiencing something so completely real and unique, something so completely different from what you're used to no words cannot describe it.

Being an aspiring writer I'll take any source of inspiration I can get. Being interested in psychology and the human mind and what it's capable of, I'll go pretty far to unlock it's potential.

Being that this is a legal method, with some health risks that provides a huge payoff in the end and it's an exteremely short trip that still seems to take forever (literally it feels like you're in that dream state for eternity) I don't mind trying it every now and again.

Flame away but I fully intend to experience everything I can in life (except for synthesised (sp) drugs)

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 15, 2006, 6:12 pm

Neziroth wrote: Taking a hit of Salvia

I keep misreading that as saliva and picture people spitting into your mouth. It's disturbing.

Arborealus · Post by **Arborealus** » August 15, 2006, 6:14 pm

Neziroth wrote:I hope all of you who are preaching about the harmful effects are non-smokers and non-drinkers. I'd rather take a hit of salvia every day than smoke 40+ cigarettes or down a bunch of alcohol.

I don't usually agree with your opinions Nick but you hit it on the head. Obviously inhaling smoke isn't healthy. However, the experience that you get from it (if you don't end up inhaling too much and passing out) is so amazing and unique that it's well worth it.

I can't even describe what's going through my mind when I take that hit. It's not like anything else. The smoke's in your lungs and you realize that you're 100% committed to experiencing whatever wild / amazing / terriftying / mindblowing events that your brain has in store for you - that alone is a huge rush.

You have just about enough time to set down the lighter and pipe and then before you know it the world as you know it is gone, you're experiencing something so completely real and unique, something so completely different from what you're used to no words cannot describe it.

Being an aspiring writer I'll take any source of inspiration I can get. Being interested in psychology and the human mind and what it's capable of, I'll go pretty far to unlock it's potential.

Being that this is a legal method, with some health risks that provides a huge payoff in the end and it's an exteremely short trip that still seems to take forever (literally it feels like you're in that dream state for eternity) I don't mind trying it every now and again.

Flame away but I fully intend to experience everything I can in life (except for synthesised (sp) drugs)

Give Yage' and Peyote a pass too...You will vomit uncontrollably and have a splitting headache for weeks from the alkaloids in both of those...There are lots of natural highs that are very toxic. Plants evolved these chemistries to prevent their being eaten largely. I would recommend good courses in phytochemistry and pharmacology (esp psychopharm) before monkeying around with plants much...

...

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 15, 2006, 6:16 pm

Haha, point well taken. I'd like to point out though that I researched Salvia online for months before actually trying it.

To me experimentation like that seems stupid to go into blind.

Abelard · Post by **Abelard** » August 20, 2006, 5:14 pm

NEZ! Long time no chat. Are you still living around the big apple?

I've been out of the old drug scene for a couple years now, but I remember my salvia experiences well. A friend of mine was gone to Montreal for awhile and brought some of it back. I decided to give it a try and the room turned upside down and I was eaten by flowers.

Freaky stuff!

Truant · Post by **Truant** » August 30, 2006, 12:54 am

adrenochrome bitches.

I have no idea what's actually going on in this thread.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » August 30, 2006, 12:57 am

Truant wrote:adrenochrome bitches.

As your attorney, I advise you to take a hit, from the little brown bottle in my shaving kit.

Trias · Post by **Trias** » August 30, 2006, 4:08 am

Winnow wrote:
Neziroth wrote: Taking a hit of Salvia
I keep misreading that as saliva and picture people spitting into your mouth. It's disturbing.

aahahah...also reading it like that, i'm gagging a little bit.

Trias · Post by **Trias** » August 30, 2006, 4:14 am

out of curiosity... everything i am reading when i go to order this shit on the intertron says "NOT FOR HUMAN CONSUMPTION FOR USE AS AN INCENSE COMPONENT ONLY"

are you sure i am supposed to ingest/smoke/chew this shit hah?

http://www.botanicmagic.com/eshop/10Bro ... 0Divinorum

and is it feasible to just down the shit in a glass of water...i dunno if i want to smoke anything ever again ^^...if this stuff is legit i'll order it and see what all of this biz is about.

also, woodrose seeds seem to be an exciting thing to buy as well haha.

Neziroth · Post by **Neziroth** » August 30, 2006, 8:10 pm

On a lot of websites it's marketed as an Incence, but rest assured if it's called Salvia Divinorum leaves or Extract 5X 10X 15X etc it's consumable, and as an extra little treat the "scent" that you get is going to be the flavor.

I'm sure there are Incence around that give off a Salvia like smell, and I wouldn't recommend smoking those.

The smoke shops around here market it as a smokable substance, just do a little research before you purchase, or search google for a Salvia Faq and those usually link you to sites to purchase it from.

Just, please, use it carefully.

EDIT: The package I bought says "Incence use only" and right below it it says "Recommended Dosage: 1/10th Gram".

Draw your own conclusions.

EDIT AGAIN:

You can chew the leaves, I assume you use them like chewing tobacco but I'm not sure if you actually continously bite them or not. Research that. Chewing gives you a much longer, less intense high.

The smoke from the Extract isn't harsh at all (if you're used to smoking), I used a pipe, but a Water Bong is recommended, as it cools the smoke.

Smoking it provides instant results (45 seconds or so, usually just as you're exhaling) and is way more intense, although it only lasts 5 - 20 min.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » August 30, 2006, 11:41 pm

Incense only, much in the same way radar guns used in cars are to prevent people from being exposed to harmful radiation.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » August 30, 2006, 11:45 pm

Neziroth wrote:On a lot of websites it's marketed as an Incence, but rest assured if it's called Salvia Divinorum leaves or Extract 5X 10X 15X etc it's consumable, and as an extra little treat the "scent" that you get is going to be the flavor.

Is

an alien or a really pissed off Iksar?

Asheran Mojomaster · September 12, 2006, 2:24 am

Yeah, I've been told its labled as incense for legal reasons. Don't know why anyone would use it as incense though, it doesnt smell that great.

Mr Bacon · Post by **Mr Bacon** » September 12, 2006, 1:20 pm

Asheran Mojomaster wrote:Yeah, I've been told its labled as incense for legal reasons. Don't know why anyone would use it as incense though, it doesnt smell that great.

The purpose of incense is not to smell it, but to receive an incense's traditonally soothing feeling.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » September 12, 2006, 5:41 pm

also, woodrose seeds seem to be an exciting thing to buy as well haha.

They're not.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » September 12, 2006, 9:01 pm

Took some mushrooms for the first time in 2 years this last weekend, was a beautiful experience. Very peaceful and joyous!

Asheran Mojomaster · September 12, 2006, 9:55 pm

Mr Bacon wrote:
Asheran Mojomaster wrote:Yeah, I've been told its labled as incense for legal reasons. Don't know why anyone would use it as incense though, it doesnt smell that great.
The purpose of incense is not to smell it, but to receive an incense's traditonally soothing feeling.

Hrmm, well I always liked the smell of incense lol.

VeeshanVault

A legal drug experience (Long, hopefully interesting)

A legal drug experience (Long, hopefully interesting)

Re: A legal drug experience (Long, hopefully interesting)