Misalignment of Values

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Kylere
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Misalignment of Values

Post by Kylere »

The US government placed unethical pressure on Sweden to close down the Pirate Bay (unsuccessfully) but we are allowing the worlds oceans to be run by actual pirates.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2006 ... acks_x.htm
KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia (AP) — Pirates attacked two U.N.-chartered ships carrying construction materials off the Indonesian coast in the Strait of Malacca, a maritime watchdog said Tuesday, raising fears about a resurgence of piracy in one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world.

Both ships, flying Indonesian flags, were heading to Indonesia's Aceh province on the northern tip of Sumatra island when they were attacked Sunday night, said Noel Choong, chief of the International Maritime Bureau's piracy reporting center in Kuala Lumpur.

He said no injuries were reported among the all-Indonesian crew aboard the two boats, which were transporting construction materials for the rebuilding of the tsunami-hit Aceh province. The ships had been chartered by the U.N. World Food Program.

"The attacks took place not far apart from each other. There is a possibility that they were carried out by the same pirates," Choong told The Associated Press. He did not know how many pirates were involved or what kind of boats they used.

The pirates stole and damaged equipment on the first ship and robbed the crew of cash and personal belongings on the other, he said.

The Strait of Malacca, a major waterway linking Asia with Europe and the Middle East, had been one of the most pirate-infested areas in the world, but attacks fell to an all-time low last year after increased naval patrolling by Indonesia and its neighbors.

"At the moment we don't know if these are isolated cases or the start of attacks again in the Malacca straits," Choong said. "We are still monitoring. But we urge ships to keep a strict piracy watch."

According to the IMB, there were no pirate attacks in the strait in the first three months of 2006, but Sunday's attack raised to five the number of incidents reported since April.

Malaysia, Singapore and Indonesia officially began coordinated patrols in the 550-mile strait in July 2004 after prodding from Washington, which said terrorists could link up with pirates already established in the narrow waterway to blow up an oil tanker or use it as a floating bomb.

Each year, more than 50,000 ships carrying half the world's oil and a third of its commerce use the route bordered by Malaysia and Singapore on one side and Indonesia's Sumatra on the other.
Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

I don't know about you, and I am sure the dumbas crowd will be all "well it is what file sharers get" but this is the real deal. Several read a few months ago about the pirates being warded off a cruise ship via some type of sonic weapon but many people are forming convoys in the Indian Ocean, and in the Carribean for mutal protection. A yacht in the Gulf of Aden had a bloody mortar fired at it.

What is the solution, should the US coordinate with other nations to introduce "Q-ships"? What woudl you propose the international community does about the issue?
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Post by miir »

What jurisdiction does the US have in foreign waters?
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Post by Boogahz »

miir wrote:What jurisdiction does the US have in foreign waters?
little to none.
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Post by Siji »

Out of curiosity, does the US have any authority over ships/boats in international waters? (5 miles off coast correct?) e.g. If a boat was carrying 2 tons of drugs could the US authorities do anything?

Perhaps I should clarify that a bit and say do anything legally. It's not like our government pays much attention to rules these days.
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Post by Hesten »

Siji wrote:Out of curiosity, does the US have any authority over ships/boats in international waters? (5 miles off coast correct?) e.g. If a boat was carrying 2 tons of drugs could the US authorities do anything?

Perhaps I should clarify that a bit and say do anything legally. It's not like our government pays much attention to rules these days.
Yes, they just need to say there are suspected terrorist on board, then they can do anything they want.
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Re: Misalignment of Values

Post by cadalano »

god i just love it when you talk about current events you sound like such an intellectual it drives me crazy


Q-Ships MMmmm
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Post by Metanis »

Sigh.

You guys really need to read a bit of history and law.
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Post by kyoukan »

I could use a good laugh. Why don't you enlighten us with your knowledge?
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Post by Zaelath »

I'm not sure what the old man of the sea is trying to say, but pirates are open season for whatever country wants to take them on. I would expect any country that had a military vessel in range of a reported pirate attack would head towards it.

In short, there's no question of juristiction in international waters, and it can only be piracy if it's a private vessel in international waters/airspace; so if you're talking about a military vessel or they make it to territorial waters it's a whole different kettle of fish.
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Post by Kylere »

The US can act unilaterally against pirates, the US Navy and Marines make sure every song they have includes references to anti-pirate actions on the Barbary Coast (aka the shores of tripoli) when we refused to keep paying tribute for "protection" from pirates, so we invaded a sovereign nation, spanked them, and even attempted to replace their pasha with one more in line with US interests ( aka he would do what we wanted). But I personally some other nation/nations need to step up and do it.

Many modern pirates operate from Somalia, and I think we all understand why the US is not keen on invading there. I really am not sure what action we should take, it is another damned if we do/don't situation.

If this board was half as good at solutions as we are at critique, it would be impressive.
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Post by Siji »

This is the solution to everything.
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Post by kyoukan »

Kylere wrote:The US can act unilaterally against pirates, the US Navy and Marines make sure every song they have includes references to anti-pirate actions on the Barbary Coast (aka the shores of tripoli) when we refused to keep paying tribute for "protection" from pirates, so we invaded a sovereign nation, spanked them, and even attempted to replace their pasha with one more in line with US interests ( aka he would do what we wanted). But I personally some other nation/nations need to step up and do it.

Many modern pirates operate from Somalia, and I think we all understand why the US is not keen on invading there. I really am not sure what action we should take, it is another damned if we do/don't situation.

If this board was half as good at solutions as we are at critique, it would be impressive.
what a fucking windbag.

the only reason you pulled somalia out of your asshole is because the last ones in the news were from there. stop acting like you know anything other than the entire menu at krispy kreme, because you are so fucking transparent that it would funny if it wasn't so gay.
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Post by miir »

what a fucking windbag.
No shit.
US and NATO warships already patrol the international waters off the coast of Somalia but they are not permitted in Somali waters.


Simple solution.
No ships should enter Somali territorial waters... keep a minimum of 150-200 miles off coast within the patrol covered areas.
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Post by cadalano »

if you ask me, 200 year old examples make the best examples. I dont care what everyone else says
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Post by Boogahz »

cadalano wrote:if you ask me, 200 year old examples make the best examples. I dont care what everyone else says
Considering that most of the applicable laws/treaties are based on those same examples, it is rather valid.
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Post by cadalano »

the barbary pirates operated well outside of any law or treaty and were openly supported by the nations that harbored them. do you think anyone gave a shit about borders or international relations? they were practically a freelance naval force from the ottoman empire, even going so far as to invade and capture Mediterranean cities in their name.

comparing that to the situation in somalia is a big stretch.
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Post by Boogahz »

cadalano wrote:the barbary pirates operated well outside of any law or treaty and were openly supported by the nations that harbored them. do you think anyone gave a shit about borders or international relations? they were practically a freelance naval force from the ottoman empire, even going so far as to invade and capture Mediterranean cities in their name.

comparing that to the situation in somalia is a big stretch.

I never said it wasn't a stretch, just that it was valid when discussing a response to piracy. :P
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Post by Kylere »

Maritime law is mostly based in rules developed during the 16th to 19th centuries. Somalia was used as an example because it was the most recent news that I assumed people would have encounted.

Ye gods, bring the piggies out.
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Post by Zamtuk »

oh i get it, piratebay.org and pirate both still have the word pirate in it.

yarrr
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Post by Arborealus »

Clearly we need to recruit ninjas to attack the pirate bases...Or maybe Vikings...
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Post by Neroon »

Bill Murray needs to take those bastards down Steve Zissou style.
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Post by Kylere »

Zamtuk wrote:oh i get it, piratebay.org and pirate both still have the word pirate in it.

yarrr
I am glad you are just pretending to be that dumb!
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