I might be early!

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 30, 2006, 12:56 pm

Sueven wrote:Phoenix against Miami would be an interesting matchup. On one hand, Shaq wouldn't be able to guard anyone or keep up with the running. On the other hand, Phoenix has absolutely no-one to stop Shaq.

I won't cry if Dallas beats Phoenix.

Regarding Miami vs Phoenix, I've seen the games and Shaq just can't hang with the Suns. He sits on the bench. If he is in the game near the end, he gets hack a Shaq'd.

No game is going to be a cake walk but Shaq does not dominate the Suns any more than any other bigman and probably less so than an Elton Brand type that can run wuth the Suns. I've watched all four Suns/Heat games these past two years and Shaq isn't the force you think he is vs Phoenix.

I'm overstating my enthusiasm but I'd much rather face Miami than Detroit due to the matchups. The Suns have had success vs the Heat the past two years.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » May 30, 2006, 2:09 pm

Winnow wrote:
Sueven wrote:Phoenix against Miami would be an interesting matchup. On one hand, Shaq wouldn't be able to guard anyone or keep up with the running. On the other hand, Phoenix has absolutely no-one to stop Shaq.
I won't cry if Dallas beats Phoenix.

Regarding Miami vs Phoenix, I've seen the games and Shaq just can't hang with the Suns. He sits on the bench. If he is in the game near the end, he gets hack a Shaq'd.

No game is going to be a cake walk but Shaq does not dominate the Suns any more than any other bigman and probably less so than an Elton Brand type that can run wuth the Suns. I've watched all four Suns/Heat games these past two years and Shaq isn't the force you think he is vs Phoenix.

Maybe we're both reading his post differently, but he specifically said that Shaq couldn't keep up with the Suns (which is what you're saying as well). If the Heat could keep the tempo down to a half-court game would be when Shaq "could" have free-reign in the paint.

noel · Post by **noel** » May 30, 2006, 2:25 pm

I think it's pretty clear (at least it's clear to me) that to play the Suns effectively, you need to not run with them. If the Heat plays their game it shouldn't affect Shaq too much... Also, lets not forget who backs up Shaq off the Bench. Mourning is a monster to deal with, and he'd be able to run as much as the Heat needed him to.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 30, 2006, 2:46 pm

The Suns beat Miami both games this year. Why does everyone insist things will change in the playoffs?

111-93
http://www.nba.com/games/20060106/MIAPHX/boxscore.html

and

107-98
http://www.nba.com/games/20060126/PHXMIA/boxscore.html

The Suns are 3-1 over the past 2 years and 2-0 vs Miami this year. I watched the games. Miami does not match up well vs the Suns. The one loss which was last year came with Nash out of the lineup. Wade was out one of the games this year as well. Still. It's all Suns the past two years in this one.

I'm not being homer on this one.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » May 30, 2006, 2:46 pm

Not to mention they still got Wade to run with them as needed. Suns hasn't exactly defended slashers that great.

That said, I agree with Winnow would have a heck of a better chance against the Heat than the Pistons.

noel · Post by **noel** » May 30, 2006, 2:56 pm

Winnow wrote:The Suns beat Miami both games this year. Why does everyone insist things will change in the playoffs?

Why did both LA teams take the Suns to seven games?

Why did the Cavs take the Pistons to seven games?

Why did the Mavs beat the Spurs?

Why are the Heat walking across the Pistons?

Things do change in the playoffs.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 30, 2006, 4:48 pm

noel wrote: Things do change in the playoffs.

Yeah, the playoffs are supposed to be where you can shit gold if you can play defense (Spurs and Pistons). What happened?

Detroit's not out of it yet. If the Suns can come back from three down, the Pistons sure can.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » May 30, 2006, 5:06 pm

Winnow wrote:Yeah, the playoffs are supposed to be where you can shit gold if you can play defense (Spurs and Pistons). What happened?

Not quite the same, since that applies to games during the regular season. The playoffs are the reason why teams still look for veteran players who have "been around the block" when it comes to the playoffs/finals. They can be an even hotter commodity if they have actually won championships with one or more teams. That experience is what generally helps come playoff time. They bring intangibles to the team that stats will not always be able to show.

Once you can step back an realize that not every post is attacking your beloved Phoenix Suns, you might come to enjoy life again.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » May 30, 2006, 5:17 pm

I do think the Suns would have a pretty decent shot against the Heat. I'd give them probably 65% odds or so. I also agree that Elton Brand is a tougher matchup for you than Shaq. Of course, I also think that Dwayne Wade is a tougher matchup for you than Quinton Ross or whoever the hell the Clippers have on the wing. Pat Riley is also a significantly better coach than Mike Dunleavy, so you probably wouldn't get any free wins when the other team throws a rookie into the game to guard your best three-point shooter when they're down three with 1.5 seconds left. But I digress.

The point is that it's ridiculous to say 'Dallas is blocking our easy championship, wah wah wah.' You already admitted that you'd rather be playing Dallas than San Antonio. You have absolutely no reason to think that Phoenix would be able to handily beat Miami or Detroit in a series. You're not being blocked from an easy championship; you're being beaten by a superior team. If things go as you predict and Dallas wins out, you'll be somewhere in that next group with San Antonio, Miami and Detroit.

Regarding Boogahz' point about veteran leadership: Miami has Shaq, Gary Payton, and Alonzo Mourning. Phoenix has... Steve Nash. Even third-year pro Dwayne Wade has made it farther in the playoffs than Steve Nash has.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » May 30, 2006, 5:28 pm

All 4 Teams in the Finals have thae ability of being a Champion.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » May 30, 2006, 5:48 pm

Cartalas wrote:All 4 Teams in the Finals have thae ability of being a Champion.

Only 2 teams can be in the "Final" Finals though!

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 30, 2006, 6:09 pm

Sueven wrote:I do think the Suns would have a pretty decent shot against the Heat. I'd give them probably 65% odds or so. I also agree that Elton Brand is a tougher matchup for you than Shaq. Of course, I also think that Dwayne Wade is a tougher matchup for you than Quinton Ross or whoever the hell the Clippers have on the wing. Pat Riley is also a significantly better coach than Mike Dunleavy, so you probably wouldn't get any free wins when the other team throws a rookie into the game to guard your best three-point shooter when they're down three with 1.5 seconds left. But I digress.

The point is that it's ridiculous to say 'Dallas is blocking our easy championship, wah wah wah.' You already admitted that you'd rather be playing Dallas than San Antonio. You have absolutely no reason to think that Phoenix would be able to handily beat Miami or Detroit in a series. You're not being blocked from an easy championship; you're being beaten by a superior team. If things go as you predict and Dallas wins out, you'll be somewhere in that next group with San Antonio, Miami and Detroit.

Regarding Boogahz' point about veteran leadership: Miami has Shaq, Gary Payton, and Alonzo Mourning. Phoenix has... Steve Nash. Even third-year pro Dwayne Wade has made it farther in the playoffs than Steve Nash has.

I didn't say the Suns would have an easy time against Detroit, I did mention several times that I really liked how the Suns matchup vs Miami and that team has lost to the Suns even with all their ancient vets you mentioned. You mention Nash but I'd say Marion deserves some vet credit at this point as well. Another thing that even though Boris Diaw is basically a rookie when it comes to being an impact player, he is cool, calm and collected. All you need to do is watch any playoff game this year to see that Diaw is not hindering the Suns in any way by being new to the playoffs. He's the MVP of the Suns post season possibly as it stands.

Yes, Dallas is blocking Phoenix's great chance at a championship if Miami makes it to the finals and I'll eat my words if Dallas doesn't take it all this year. Last year it was Phoenix that punked Dallas out of a possible championship. I won't say that Phoenix "would have won" if they don't get there, just that they would have had a great chance if they did...same as last year. Bottom line is where a team ends up and so far the Suns have made it to the WCF the last two years and are the only Western team to be in the WCF the past two years. That's the start of some consistency.

Now, back to more urgent matters...the Suns need to win tonight and it looks like Raja Bell might be done for the season. That blows.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » May 30, 2006, 7:15 pm

Winnow wrote:Bottom line is where a team ends up and so far the Suns have made it to the WCF the last two years and are the only Western team to be in the WCF the past two years. That's the start of some consistency.

Unfortunately, consistency of that sort is not always a good thing. I remember watching teams when I was growing up that always made it to the playoffs, but they never really advanced for several years. Once those teams overcame whatever was in their way, they usually ended up with at least one championship or were completely out of the playoff picture when the owners decided to rebuild an "almost championship" team. They really need to get to the next step since being 3rd or 4th best is not helpful in building playoff experience as getting into the Finals can be. Getting to the WCF two years in a row is an achievement though.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 30, 2006, 7:39 pm

Boogahz wrote:Getting to the WCF two years in a row is an achievement though.

I'd say it's an impressive achievment considering the team was in the lottery the year before and both years (this year due to Amare being out) was expected to be a seventh seed or not make the playoffs.

So, while I see your point about teams hanging around, always being the bridesmaid, I don't think this team has been around long enough to be considered that yet. They're two years removed from the lottery and both years since have been trips to the WCF (so far).

These past two years are overachieving years. I expect the Suns to be picked to win the West next year so there will be no overachieving to be had.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » May 31, 2006, 12:38 am

Good to see that the Suns showed up tonight, heh.

valryte · Post by **valryte** » May 31, 2006, 2:18 am

The Suns beat Miami both games this year. Why does everyone insist things will change in the playoffs?

If that were true, then why is the Heat 3 to 1 against a team that they were 1 to 4 prior to the post season? By your logic, Detroit should be the one ahead in the series.

Like I said, I'm chearing for the Suns...

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » May 31, 2006, 2:34 am

valryte wrote:
Like I said, I'm chearing for the Suns...

Keep cheering : ) It helped Phoenix to a 20 point win tonight!

Glad to see Raja Bell back. Whew. He's huge for the Suns team. Howard went down again for Dallas but Avery says he'll be ok for game 5.

Diaw had a poor shooting night but got a good facial dunk in on Dirk.

I get the feeling this one's going seven but if Phoenix is going to grab another win in Dallas and win the series, it's got to be this next one and close it out at home. I don't see the Suns winning a game seven in Dallas.

valryte · Post by **valryte** » May 31, 2006, 4:51 am

...to beat Dallas that is.

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » May 31, 2006, 1:56 pm

Cartalas wrote:All 4 Teams in the Finals have thae ability of being a Champion.

I really disagree. In all honesty, the Pistons are a really good team and, IMO, are the only eastern team capable of winning this year. If it ends up being the Suns Vs Heat I probably won't even watch since I am 99 percent sure the suns will win that matchup because all the talent on the heat sans Wade are grandpas and the suns will just purely outpace them. I really want the heat to take them out and I'm confident they will, which is why I said the real finals are going to be Dallas and the Suns, which I'm not so sure about now with the injuries to some major players. Dallas beating the spurs and Heat taking out the pistons would be really fortunate because the Suns don't match up well against either of those teams.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » May 31, 2006, 5:06 pm

Lincoln Lolgs wrote:
Cartalas wrote:All 4 Teams in the Finals have thae ability of being a Champion.
I really disagree. In all honesty, the Pistons are a really good team and, IMO, are the only eastern team capable of winning this year. If it ends up being the Suns Vs Heat I probably won't even watch since I am 99 percent sure the suns will win that matchup because all the talent on the heat sans Wade are grandpas and the suns will just purely outpace them. I really want the heat to take them out and I'm confident they will, which is why I said the real finals are going to be Dallas and the Suns, which I'm not so sure about now with the injuries to some major players. Dallas beating the spurs and Heat taking out the pistons would be really fortunate because the Suns don't match up well against either of those teams.

We will see all in all I think everyone can agree this has been the best NBA Playoffs in years, Maybe im biased because Dallas is doing so well.

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » May 31, 2006, 5:38 pm

Note what I said about the Pistons is for the east only, I am confident that if the Heat knock out the Pistons then either dallas or phx will be the champs because the Heat won't beat either team.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » May 31, 2006, 5:57 pm

I'm feeling more confident every day that the Heat will be the champs this year.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » May 31, 2006, 8:03 pm

If it ends up being the Suns Vs Heat I probably won't even watch since I am 99 percent sure the suns will win that matchup

You're serious? You wouldn't watch your favorite team (at least I assume it's your favorite team, based on your posts in this forum) trying to win their first-ever championship because you're just so confident they'll win that it's unnecessary? Just like the Rams were so confident that they'd beat the Patriots and the Yankees were so confident that they'd beat the Diamondbacks and the Lakers were so confident that they'd beat the Pistons?

I mean, I understand that some people might not like sports as much as I do and might not enjoy watching sports as much as I do, but damn. With that sort of attitude, I'm shocked that you follow sports enough to even know who Steve Nash is.

Isn't watching your team win a championship the hoped-for primary joy of every sports fan? I wouldn't know, since Philadelphia hasn't won since before I was born, but I always kind of assumed so.

Post by **Sylvus** » June 1, 2006, 12:07 am

And the Pistons show some signs of life. It's not over yet, folks!

I hope this goes 7 games, the Palace is a tough place to play.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » June 1, 2006, 7:52 am

Man I am so torn now.

- Can't stand Shaq and Riley but I like Wade
- Can't stand Rasheed and Saunders but I like Rip
- Can't stand the Suns (mostly because of Winnow hah!) and I definitely can't cheer for Dallas even though I am a huge Avery Johnson fan!

Wtf should I cheer for? Damn the Spurs for losing!

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 1, 2006, 1:07 pm

Kelshara wrote: - Can't stand the Suns (mostly because of Winnow hah!) and I definitely can't cheer for Dallas even though I am a huge Avery Johnson fan!

Jump on the Solar Express! Most of the non Winnow haters of the world have!

I can't get a "vibe" feeling on the Suns/Mavs game tonight. Avery says they're going to attack the basket again this game. What that means to be is a very physical game with Dirk trying to draw lots of fouls every trip down the floor by doing his little spin move and then falling on his ass after the shot, taking out his mouthpiece and jawing at the officials.

What I hope it also means is that Dallas is going to try to keep the game fast paced by attacking quickly. If that happens, it's a matter of whether the Suns shoot their normal percentage or not and if Tim Thomas, Kurt Thomas, Marion and Diaw can stay out of foul trouble from the Dirk spin-fall-on-ass attack. The Suns must counter with the Raja-grab-jersey-fall-on-ass defense.

Post by **Sylvus** » June 1, 2006, 4:26 pm

And speaking of that Pistons game last night, how about that block where Ben Wallace dropped Shack to the ground, one-handed on his way down from a jump. That was pretty impressive!

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 1, 2006, 5:23 pm

Sylvus wrote:And speaking of that Pistons game last night, how about that block where Ben Wallace dropped Shack to the ground, one-handed on his way down from a jump. That was pretty impressive!

That was an impressive block. Shaq threw a rim rattling dunk down on Wallace the next possession after the time out because I think he was embarrassed about it.

Dwyane Wade has been the most impressive player in the Mia/Det series so far. He's shooting 69% and that's including all of his circus shots. The Suns need him! Marion and Barbosa for Wade!

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » June 1, 2006, 7:12 pm

Sylvus wrote:And speaking of that Pistons game last night, how about that block where Ben Wallace dropped Shack to the ground, one-handed on his way down from a jump. That was pretty impressive!

It would have been more impressive if he had done it on the way UP instead of down. Those were always the funnest blocks to get on someone. Knocking the ball 10 rows up into the stands meant jack if you passed up a chance to sit the mofo on his ass.

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » June 1, 2006, 7:40 pm

Sueven wrote:
If it ends up being the Suns Vs Heat I probably won't even watch since I am 99 percent sure the suns will win that matchup

You're serious? You wouldn't watch your favorite team (at least I assume it's your favorite team, based on your posts in this forum) trying to win their first-ever championship because you're just so confident they'll win that it's unnecessary? Just like the Rams were so confident that they'd beat the Patriots and the Yankees were so confident that they'd beat the Diamondbacks and the Lakers were so confident that they'd beat the Pistons?

I mean, I understand that some people might not like sports as much as I do and might not enjoy watching sports as much as I do, but damn. With that sort of attitude, I'm shocked that you follow sports enough to even know who Steve Nash is.

Isn't watching your team win a championship the hoped-for primary joy of every sports fan? I wouldn't know, since Philadelphia hasn't won since before I was born, but I always kind of assumed so.

It's pretty rare that I get to watch anything more than the highlights due to work and raids and just not being infront of a tv due to other shit :/ (or pretty much anything else i like to watch)
I wish people would put up games for download like they do episodes of 24!

the last actual playoff game i was able to watch was the pistons/heat game :/

also i'm not a giant sports fan, basketball is my favorite sport and the suns are my favorite team but i'm not the type of dude who would make a day out of watching the superbowl or anything. not that theres anything wrong with that)

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » June 1, 2006, 7:43 pm

Lincoln Lolgs wrote:It's pretty rare that I get to watch anything more than the highlights due to work and raids and just not being infront of a tv due to other shit :/ (or pretty much anything else i like to watch)
I wish people would put up games for download like they do episodes of 24!

dude....prioritities!

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » June 1, 2006, 7:44 pm

Boogahz wrote:
Lincoln Lolgs wrote:It's pretty rare that I get to watch anything more than the highlights due to work and raids and just not being infront of a tv due to other shit :/ (or pretty much anything else i like to watch)
I wish people would put up games for download like they do episodes of 24!
dude....prioritities!

hehe :/

noel · Post by **noel** » June 1, 2006, 8:51 pm

You're welcome, Stragi:

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/060508/20060508005875.html?.v=1

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*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » June 2, 2006, 6:14 pm

thinking more along the lines of illegal because i don't pay for nuttin' :>

noel · Post by **noel** » June 2, 2006, 11:28 pm

noel wrote:Shaq says he's ready! I hope he fucking is.

It appears that Shaq was in fact ready.

It would appear that Shaq was in fact saving himself for the playoffs and can in fact turn it on when he wants to.

It would appear that letting Stan Van Gundy go was in fact the right move.

It would appear that Pat Riley can in fact still coach.

It would appear that the decision to rip apart last year's Heat team and put together a team with all new components was in fact the right move.

I'm surprised by almost all of those things, but I'm absolutely elated for Shaq. I'm by no means a Kobe hater, but I really, really want to see him get a ring before Kobe does. I think he got pushed out of LA, and I hope Kobe fucking realizes that if they'd managed to bury the hatchet they could have won SEVERAL more rings together.

All of that said I'd be elated to see the Mavs win the championship as well.

The person I probably feel the worst for in all of this is Flip Saunders. If he's not out as a head coach, I'll be shocked and I kind of get the impression the players turned on him somewhat. That said it is ultimately his responsibility so it's understandable. It will be interesting to see what moves are made in the offseason for Detroit.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 2, 2006, 11:40 pm

Woot! Rest up Heat. One more tough series lies ahead.

valryte · Post by **valryte** » June 3, 2006, 1:09 am

FUCK YEAH! GO HEAT!

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 3, 2006, 4:18 am

Grats to the Heat for making it to the Finals!

It might be bittersweet for me! We'll find out soon enough.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » June 3, 2006, 9:04 am

I think this opens the door for the Suns if they can get past Dallas.. which I don't think they can.

Grats Heats fans.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » June 3, 2006, 2:16 pm

Noel wrote:The person I probably feel the worst for in all of this is Flip Saunders. If he's not out as a head coach, I'll be shocked and I kind of get the impression the players turned on him somewhat. That said it is ultimately his responsibility so it's understandable. It will be interesting to see what moves are made in the offseason for Detroit.

Explain please.

noel · Post by **noel** » June 3, 2006, 6:15 pm

Leonaerd wrote:
Noel wrote:The person I probably feel the worst for in all of this is Flip Saunders. If he's not out as a head coach, I'll be shocked and I kind of get the impression the players turned on him somewhat. That said it is ultimately his responsibility so it's understandable. It will be interesting to see what moves are made in the offseason for Detroit.
Explain please.

Explain what?

The Pistons had a phenomenal season. The postseason starts. The King starts heading for his throne and the players start sniping at their coach. This continues into the Miami series.

This isn't exactly news. What's there to explain? At some point if you're Joe Dumars, you have to sit back and ask yourself what went wrong and what you need to change to get to the Championship next year. What would you do?

noel · Post by **noel** » June 4, 2006, 12:18 am

Grats Dallas!

The bottom line is that the Suns just had too many injuries to do what they could have done. If Amare and Kurt Thomas had been healthy I have no doubt that they'd be advancing to the WCF to take on the Heat. Even with their injuries, they had an amazing season and while Nash might not be the most valuable player in my mind, he's definitely in the top two or three for people who make everyone around them better.

I'm going to go ahead and call my shot... Heat in 5.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 4, 2006, 12:46 am

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:
Cartalas wrote:
Winnow wrote:Grats Dallas on the NBA Championship if Phoenix plays like that the rest of the way.
Winnow dont Fret Phx is a great team this will go 7 games I just think Dallas has a little to much bench for ya.
Mavs will win in 5 or 6.

Yup yup

Pherr the Dorf · Post by **Pherr the Dorf** » June 4, 2006, 12:56 am

mavs in 5, you cannot shoot 15-20% worse from the line and win close games, gratz mavs

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 4, 2006, 12:56 am

Grats Cart and Mavs on Western Conference Championship. The Suns gave up their last burst in the first half and then ran out of steam.

My call for finals: Mavs in 6

I'd say 5 but I think the Mavs will be a little nervous out of the gate.

Grats to the Suns on a fine season.

Barbosa 23
Diaw 23
Amare 22

Hopefully the Suns will build around these players

Nash, Marion, Bell, Kurt Thomas all have a good year or two left in them.

Looking forward to a championship run next year and a great future with several draft picks loaded up. Things look bright for the Suns' future and haven't been too shabby these past two years.

noel · Post by **noel** » June 4, 2006, 1:23 am

Btw, the main reason I'm saying the Heat will win the finals is due to experience, Shaq looking like he did the first year he won the with the Lakers, Riley's experience, and the fact that the Heat are all healthy and appear to be peaking at the perfect time.

That said I'd be really happy to see the Mavericks win. I really like Dirk, I love watching him play...

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » June 4, 2006, 3:13 am

noel wrote:
Leonaerd wrote:
Noel wrote:The person I probably feel the worst for in all of this is Flip Saunders. If he's not out as a head coach, I'll be shocked and I kind of get the impression the players turned on him somewhat. That said it is ultimately his responsibility so it's understandable. It will be interesting to see what moves are made in the offseason for Detroit.
Explain please.
Explain what?

The Pistons had a phenomenal season. The postseason starts. The King starts heading for his throne and the players start sniping at their coach. This continues into the Miami series.

This isn't exactly news. What's there to explain? At some point if you're Joe Dumars, you have to sit back and ask yourself what went wrong and what you need to change to get to the Championship next year. What would you do?

I guess I was unaware of whatever "sniping" has been done. I've been working long hours so I haven't been able to follow my team as well as I'd normally like to. I'll look into it.

Post by **Sylvus** » June 4, 2006, 3:57 am

Apparently there's talk that Joey D. has been talking to the T-wolves about a possible KG for Rip and 'Sheed trade. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

The Pistons are still better than the Suns though!

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » June 4, 2006, 7:24 am

KG is overrated imo. Anyhow..

Ugh.. Grats Mavs fans.. you still suck! And Cuban wears panties!

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » June 4, 2006, 8:05 am

Im so Excited I just cant hide it.

Winnow:

You have,

I have:

Ill Raise and Call!