RL Quest for the Quiet, Small, PC :D

noel · Post by **noel** » January 5, 2005, 9:24 pm

I woke up one morning in the not too distant past, and decided that my home PC's case was too big, and too loud. Almost as though it were a mission from God, I decided to remedy the issue.

I went to newegg.com, and after a bit of reading I decided to purchase the Shuttle SB83G5 (incidentally, newegg.com has it for around $100 less than you can get it other places).

When the system arrived I was pretty excited to get my PC up and running. Due to a lack of reading comprehension on my part, I had to also purchase a new CPU, memory and video card. I should have probably beat myself in the head with a hammer for not reading more closely that the CPU was a socket 775, the video slot was PCI-Express, and the minimum memory requirement was PC-2700.

I was not dissuaded. The promise of a small-form factor PC, and quiet running had me giggling like an idiot, and since I was just able to cover up my idiocy by throwing cash at the problem, I pressed on.

Once the system was completely assembled, I was stoked. It ran fantastically well. I actually tested a few games running the onboard Intel Graphics Media Accelerator it worked better than I expected an onboard video solution to work, but my old video card was a RADEON 9800 Pro w/128 so there was no way I’d be satisfied with an onboard card. That said, running with only the onboard card, the system was practically silent. If you got up really close, you could hear the cooling unit, but sitting normally, it was barely audible.

So I went out to look at a new video card. I didn’t want to spend $400+ again to go top of the line. The 9800Pro had been meeting all of my needs, so all I really wanted was to match or exceed the performance of my old card. I did some research on tomshardware.com. They had one table for performance of the PCI-E cards, and another for the older AGP cards. The 9800 Pro was a close 3rd on the AGP performance chart, and a comparable card, the new RADEON X800 had around the same performance. So I went out to pick one up. Unfortunately, my local Fry’s didn’t have an X800, but they did have an X700 w/256MB ($200). I decided to try it out, so I brought it home and installed. My peacefully quiet SFF system was now a roaring monster. The X700 has a small, variable-speed fan that changes speed constantly. I was kind of a fool to think (hey, I admit when I’m wrong) that ANY video card wouldn’t make the system significantly louder, but this thing was horrible. It was constantly changing speed, and because of that it was just annoying. Also, the performance for the card was shit. Choppy video at a level I wasn’t willing to compromise to.

I returned the X700, and brought home a PNY GeForce 6600GT 128/PCI-E. The 6600GT is sex. The performance is fantastic, crisp, beautiful. The fan runs at a constant speed, and is quieter than the X700 fan even at low speed. It set me back $249ish. I realize I could’ve saved a bit if I’d purchased it online, but I really don’t like not being able to take immediate action with a video/sound card if I don’t like it.

At any rate… I still have this dream of a near quiet PC. As such, I’ve been looking at alternatives to the fan that comes stock on the card. Zalman USA has just released the VF700-CU fan for GPUs, notably for my 6600. My main concern is… will it fit in my case? I’m curious if anyone has any experience with Zalman’s products, and whether or not anyone else has attempted to quiet their SFF PC. I’ve checked quite a few sites… Zalman’s forums, http://www.sfftech.com, etc. but as the fan is pretty new, there just doesn’t seem to be that much out there in terms of information. One of my friends mentioned passive cooling systems, but we’ve pretty much ruled those out due to lack of space inside the case. If anyone has any advice, etc. please let me know.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » January 6, 2005, 3:25 am

good luck.. but that's pretty lame... obsessing and throwing money away to get a 'quieter' computer...

i've got 2 towers running 24/7 right next to me... i dont hear them over the air purifier 8 feet away.

silence is a tragedy, i need white noise.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » January 6, 2005, 3:53 am

noel wrote:
I returned the X700, and brought home a PNY GeForce 6600GT 128/PCI-E. The 6600GT is sex. The performance is fantastic, crisp, beautiful. The fan runs at a constant speed, and is quieter than the X700 fan even at low speed. It set me back $249ish. I realize I could’ve saved a bit if I’d purchased it online, but I really don’t like not being able to take immediate action with a video/sound card if I don’t like it.

Yeah the 6600GT is nice. It has the WMV9 hardware acceleration that the 6800GT was supposed to have but nVidia screwed up on. It's a small thing but as WMV9 HD videos become more common, it would have been nice to have it in my 6800GT.

I want quiet PCs as well these days as my computers sit in my living room and I don't want fan noise interfering with movie time. The Antec Sonata case works fairly well and several people have commented on that case previously in this forum. Hard Drives can be louder than your fans. If I didn't have my 10K raptor and 250 WD drives in a Sonata, they'd be screaming like banshees.

I considered a Shuttle mini case but think I'm going with a laptop of some sort for my next PC addition. I'm kind of hooked atm on reading scanned comics and a laptop would work well for while in bed, travelling, or when avoiding work at work.

Last thought...the new Belkin Wireless Pre-N Router kicks ass.

http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,118666,00.asp

Much faster than previous wireless standards, better coverage and more reliable. I transfer lots of huge files between computers so this is the win for me.

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » January 6, 2005, 10:05 am

I've been looking at SFF systems, that will probably be my next system purchase. Small size and near silence will be very nice.

Antec has a line of low noise cases in various sizes, well worth looking in to if you want quiet and good quality. The Sonata case I'm running now is nearly silent, the loudest noise is the drives chattering.

Antec ARIA

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » January 6, 2005, 10:44 am

http://www.frozencpu.com/noi-02.html

You might want to look at noise dampening padding. As you have gone for the micro-ATX form factor, you may have issues finding padding that is designed for the size of your case, but a straight edge razor can solve that issue

. My only concern would be that the smaller case will be designed with less free space inside that may not leave enough room to attach the padding. If you do take this approach, remember to measure twice and cut once!

Deward · Post by **Deward** » January 6, 2005, 12:16 pm

I bought one of those pci slot rotary fans a few years ago. It moves a lot of air and is fairly quiet. With the small case you definitely got to watch the heat. That is my main reason for having big cases. The small ones just burn up too quick.

noel · Post by **noel** » January 6, 2005, 2:43 pm

Fash wrote:good luck.. but that's pretty lame... obsessing and throwing money away to get a 'quieter' computer...

Winnow wrote:I want quiet PCs as well these days as my computers sit in my living room and I don't want fan noise interfering with movie time.

Bubba Grizz · Post by **Bubba Grizz** » January 10, 2005, 8:59 pm

So could you post the specs of your quiet computer for us and list price so we have an idea of what it would cost to do this? I tried to go this route in the past but something in me just has a problem with going to a passive heat removal system. I guess I don't want to disable all my fans in my Thermaltake case. I did buy a nice quiet chip fan and a Baracuda hard drive to help reduce noise but I'd love to have a near silent beast.

noel · Post by **noel** » January 10, 2005, 9:47 pm

Ummm... the cooling system is NOT passive at all. There are cooling pipes that go from the CPU to a fan that is probably 4" in diameter. The fan however is extremely quiet. Also, you don't turn off the fans on your GPU... yet.

Intel has presented a new motherboard standard called BTX where you will only have a single fan cooling the entire chassis and peripheral cards. This will likely change the way PCs are built as soon as the motherboard clone manufacturers and case manufacturers start flooding the market with hardware built to the BTX standard.

tomshardware.com wrote:At first glance, the BTX form factor may not seem to be fundamentally different from ATX. However, looking closer, the important changes can be found in the details. With BTX, the layout of the components is based on the in-line principle. This ensures that air can flow through the PC case (ideally from front to back) with the least possible hindrance. This linear layout also reduces air turbulence, which in turn lowers the noise level.

As far as creating a SFF PC, here's a rough price estimate with all prices from newegg.com. Bear in mind, each for each component, you could spend more, or less money depending on your needs:

Barebones Small Form Factor (SFF) Case/MB/PS: $250-400
Intel CPU P4 2.8Ghz+ Socket LGA 775: $160 or more.
1GB of RAM (2 x 512MB PC3200 DIMMs): $160 or more.
Harddrive 80GB or higher: $80+
DVD-ROM w/CD-RW: $60+
Floppy (if you're still living in the 90s): $20

The case has onboard sound, video, and networking of varying quality levels, so it's basically what you want to add on from there.

As it stands, you can get into one for something in the $800 range. Though you could spend more or less depending on how new you want your hardware to be. I went on the assumption that you wanted to be somewhat future proof.

Alienware has created a new system based on the Shuttle case I bought and you can find it here.
The cheapest you can get it from them is $849, but that's with a Celeron, and I would NEVER recommend that.

Leonaerd · Post by **Leonaerd** » January 11, 2005, 12:21 am

Get some Incredible Bose Headphones for $150. I have been using headphones since Luclin. If you're not familiar with this model, the quality is greater than any, and I mean -any- set of speakers that you could ever purchase.

I know because I used to be a sound whore myself. The sound of my rigs would impede on my ability to fully enjoy my games, and I can't really stand the sound of my own typing sometimes.

With these headphones on, I'm in my own surround-sound world of perfection. Of course, the noise from my computer is negated, too.

zerokarma · Post by **zerokarma** » July 10, 2005, 10:57 pm

You can also try something like these guys offer:

http://www.stealthcomputer.com/littlepc.htm
http://www.littlepc.com

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » July 11, 2005, 12:09 am

I hate to say it, but if all I want is a small quiet basic pc I would buy a mac mini instead.

Mr Bacon · Post by **Mr Bacon** » July 11, 2005, 7:46 am

zerokarma wrote:You can also try something like these guys offer:

http://www.stealthcomputer.com/littlepc.htm
http://www.littlepc.com

I'd rather have a 6 foot monster than a PC I could never modify.

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » July 11, 2005, 1:36 pm

Rellix wrote:
zerokarma wrote:You can also try something like these guys offer:

http://www.stealthcomputer.com/littlepc.htm
http://www.littlepc.com

I'd rather have a 6 foot monster than a PC I could never modify.

How often do you modify a PC beyond changing memory or video card?

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » July 11, 2005, 1:58 pm

Who says you can't modify them? Looks like all the standard computer worikngs to me. Sure, you may have to be more selective, but as long as it has an original component slot, I'm sure that it could be replaced or upgraded.

miir · Post by **miir** » July 11, 2005, 1:59 pm

I picked up a Antec Sonata on the weekend and it's remarkably quiet.

How often do you modify a PC beyond changing memory or video card?

You can't really upgrade or modify those things at all.
I frequently upgrade my video card and I try to upgrade my motherboard/cpu at least every 12-18 months.

Those things are just gimmick PCs... functional but stupidly overpriced.

You could get a high end Dell laptop for about the same price...
What's the point in getting a PC that small unless it's for portability? And if you need portability, just get a bloody laptop.

Mr Bacon · Post by **Mr Bacon** » July 11, 2005, 2:02 pm

archeiron wrote:
Rellix wrote:
zerokarma wrote:You can also try something like these guys offer:

http://www.stealthcomputer.com/littlepc.htm
http://www.littlepc.com

I'd rather have a 6 foot monster than a PC I could never modify.
How often do you modify a PC beyond changing memory or video card?

Weekly.

Fairweather Pure wrote:Who says you can't modify them? Looks like all the standard computer worikngs to me. Sure, you may have to be more selective, but as long as it has an original component slot, I'm sure that it could be replaced or upgraded.

Having to be selective is NOT the way to go. One of the main computers I use is a Dell 4600c (c for compact) - it's a great computer and it fits really well at a smaller desk I use 8/12 months a year, but I being a gamer am limited to very few graphics cards - they have to be "half-size" (aka half-powered). It still runs games great but I was almost forced to choose out of about 4 cards.

miir · Post by **miir** » July 11, 2005, 2:14 pm

Who says you can't modify them? Looks like all the standard computer worikngs to me. Sure, you may have to be more selective, but as long as it has an original component slot, I'm sure that it could be replaced or upgraded

The base model has no expansion slots at all.
No PCI, AGP, PCI Express... nothing.

You can pay an extra $200+ to get one with a single PCI slot... but what's the point? If you could even find a decent PCI video card, you'd be nuts to put it in such a small, poorly ventilated case.

By the looks of it, you'd need to rip the whole thing apart if you wanted to upgrade the RAM or hard drive.

Same goes for the optical drive.
It looks like they use a proprietary design for the cd rom.
It would be easier to replace/upgrade if they had used a standard laptop optical drive formfactor.

If someone were obsessed about getting a small computer, I'd just tell them to get a Mac mini. It's smaller, lighter, it looks cooler, it's cheaper, has better support and more features (DVI, Bluetooth, ATI Radeon).

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » July 11, 2005, 2:17 pm

I've been looking into puny computers now that I've centralized my storage I don't need a big case to hold several HDs...although I still have three HDs in my PC in addition to the teraserver thingy I could reduce that to one pretty easily.

The biggest concern is cooling and silence over size though. The little cases have probably come a long way but in the past, they've been a bitch to work with compared to a well designed mid-tower case. Flexibility is limited.

VeeshanVault

RL Quest for the Quiet, Small, PC :D

RL Quest for the Quiet, Small, PC :D

Re: RL Quest for the Quiet, Small, PC :D