Hate crime or not?

[Kelgar]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050630/D8B1N4400.html

NEW YORK (AP) - Three black men who ventured into a historically white neighborhood early Wednesday to steal a car were chased by a man with a baseball bat, police said. One man was beaten and suffered a fractured skull.

The attack happened several hours before dawn in the same section of the borough of Queens as an infamous 1986 beating of three black men whose car had broken down.

In Wednesday's attack, Nicholas Minucci, 21, was being charged with first-degree assault as a hate crime, menacing and criminal possession of a weapon, police Commissioner Ray Kelly said at a news conference.

The three blacks told investigators they had been looking for a car to steal when they entered the Howard Beach neighborhood. They told police a white man in an SUV passed them in the street, exchanged stares with them and then returned with two friends and a baseball bat before chasing them on foot.

Glen Moore, 20, stumbled to the ground and was beaten, suffering a fractured skull. He was in serious condition. The other two men escaped and summoned police, who scouted the neighborhood with them and spotted the SUV again.

Police stopped the vehicle and found the bat inside. The driver was arrested, and officers were seeking two other suspects.

The hate crime charge is punishable by a minimum of eight years in prison. The district attorney said that he didn't know if Minucci had a lawyer and that he would be arraigned Thursday.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg said he and the police commissioner would not allow such "an ugly incident" to divide the city.

"We've accomplished too much to let that happen," he said, noting that the area had been free of such crimes for at least two years.

On Dec. 20, 1986, a group of white teenagers attacked three black men who were stranded in the neighborhood when their car stalled.

One of the men was fatally struck by a car as he fled. Another was beaten with a baseball bat and tree branches. The third escaped.

The attack ignited racial tension in New York and was compared to a lynching by then-Mayor Ed Koch. Eight of the teenagers were convicted or pleaded guilty to charges of manslaughter, assault, conspiracy and rioting.

It's debatable whether or not the attack was racially motivated. The blacks admitted they were up to no good. Did the attackers know the same or were they just being racist?

Side note: What kind of retards admit to the police that they were casing a neighborhood for potential cars to jack?

[*~*stragi*~*]

it's hard to say without knowing all sides of the story and the details of the situation.

[Drasta]

to me it kinda sounds bogus (the hate crime thing)

[masteen]

It is bogus, but the NYPD has to kow tow to the minorities in order to avoid charges of racism.

[Fairweather Pure]

Where is the poll? Yes, I hate crime.

[Sueven]

Not enough information about the motivations of the assailants to be able to answer the question. Could be.

It's hard to imagine that this white guy knew that the black trio was looking for a car to jack.

[Drasta]

maybe he was them messing with some cars?

[Winnow]

Was it a wood or aluminum bat?

[Burke]

I hate crime, unless I am doing it, ....then it should be legal for me.

[Seebs]

Maybe the guys doing the batting can claim they are gay or Indian. Can Gay people cause a hate crime?

I've never signed on to this Hate Crime deal. If I shoot you, I'm assuming I'm not happy with you at the time.

[kyoukan]

Yeah it really depends on what the kids were doing when they got accosted by the white dudes on whether or not it was a hate crime. Also the guy could have been hollering racial epithets while he was being arrested (as guys from howard beach are wont to do almost constantly 24 hours a day), which would have given the cops some idea on their motivations.

I've been to howard beach, and man, they could be charging him as a hate crime cause of the fact the guy lives there. I don't think a single fucking minority resides in that entire district. the police are probably just taking it for granted that he is a racist bastard based solely on his credit address.

[Kilmoll the Sexy]

I guess we should just assume anyone from that area is a racist, just like we should assume that every negro is out to steal a car.

[Kelgar]

Where is the poll? Yes, I hate crime.

Added.

[Kelgar]

More info in NYT basically renders my poll moot.

http://nytimes.com/2005/06/30/nyregion/30beach.html

A group of white men set upon three black men on the streets of Howard Beach, Queens, early yesterday, beating one with a baseball bat and fracturing his skull, the police and prosecutors said.

The white men, who emerged from a black 2005 Cadillac Escalade before dawn, sent the black men fleeing into nearby swampland and through the streets of the largely white, insular neighborhood. One of the black men, Glenn Moore, 22, of St. Albans, Queens, tripped over a lawn. There, his assailants beat him with a metal bat, stole the sneakers off his feet and ripped an earring from one ear, the police said.

Mr. Moore suffered injuries to his head, back and legs and was in Jamaica Hospital Medical Center last night, listed in serious condition. His girlfriend's sister said he was going in and out of consciousness.

The police said they had taken Nicholas Minucci, a 19-year-old unemployed man from Howard Beach, into custody, and a senior law enforcement official said he would be charged with assault in the first degree as a hate crime, which carries a sentence of from 8 to 25 years. The police said that Mr. Minucci had admitted to part of the crime, and that he had given a videotaped confession.

The event took place mere blocks from the site of a 1986 attack in which a group of about a dozen white men set upon three black men whose car had broken down in the neighborhood, forcing one of the men to run for his life. He died when he was struck by a car. That assault ignited a furor in the city, leading to the appointment of a special prosecutor and laying bare a degree of racial tension in New York that would reverberate for years.

Four white men from Howard Beach were tried, and three were convicted on manslaughter and assault charges and sent to prison. The fourth defendant, a 16-year-old, was acquitted of all charges. The episode and the ensuing unrest made Howard Beach all but synonymous with racial discord, and played out as a charged political and social drama for months.

The details in the new attack, which were still emerging last night, appeared to be in some ways more complicated. Mr. Minucci, the accused, said that the three black men might have been looking at his jewelry earlier last week, and that he was responding to that when he came across them around 3 a.m. yesterday. For their part, two of the black men, according to police, admitted under questioning that they had been in the area with hopes of stealing a car.

But one law enforcement official said that at the time of the attack, the black men had done nothing more than be in Howard Beach around 3 a.m. And another official said that Mr. Minucci told investigators that after the beating, his companion said, "This is what you get if you want to rob white boys," finishing the sentence with a racial epithet.

"Crimes motivated by ethnic or racial bias, particularly those involving violence, can never be tolerated," the Queens district attorney, Richard A. Brown, said. "Bias crimes will be aggressively investigated and prosecuted, and crimes motivated by hate are to be condemned, and when they do regrettably occur, they will be vigorously prosecuted and punished."

In 2004, Mr. Minucci pleaded guilty to assault in an unrelated case. In that case, he was charged with stabbing a 15-year-old outside a Broad Channel bar in 2002, but the defendant in that case died in an accident before the case could go to trial. In his plea, Mr. Minucci was treated as a youthful offender.

Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg was briefed on yesterday's attack last night and went to the 106th Precinct in Queens, where he and Police Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly spoke to reporters. "The reason that we're here is that hate crimes will not be tolerated," Mr. Bloomberg said. Late last night, the Rev. Al Sharpton said that he had received a call from Mr. Bloomberg, assuring him that the city "would not tolerate" racial attacks, if this case proved to be one.

Mr. Kelly told reporters that the police were seeking Mr. Minucci's companions for questioning. He identified one of them as Anthony Ench, 24.

etc, etc

How often do you come across crimes where both perps and victims are equally despicable scumbags? I can't say I feel at all sorry for the guy who got his shit whacked with a bat while at the same time I hope the kid who did it spends a good while getting his shit pushed in in jail.



Sheesh. Talk about looking the part of racist white trash.

[kyoukan]

Fortunately Rev. Al Sharpton is on the case now!

[noel]

To me, it's two sets of bad guys going at each other. I think the white guy was hateful in general, but I don't know that it was a hate crime. Stealing the shoes and ripping the earring after you've already bashed someone's skull in is a bit much... Not a hate crime, just a fucking asshole.

This sentence jumped right out at me.

...but the defendant in that case died in an accident before the case could go to trial...

[Animalor]

I have no sympathy for any of these assholes. I wish they had all been carrying guns and shot eachother.

[Fash]

when was the last time a black person was charged with a "hate crime" against a white person? ...... yeah... it's a ridiculous double standard.

[Canelek]

a black 2005 Cadillac Escalade

That just screams out 'ignorant punkassbitch'. The kid probably is all blinged out, listens to dmx, but 'sure hates them darkies!'

[Sionistic]

Its tricky. The guy might not hate blacks, but is careful around them anyway. He saw the black guys eyeing him before, and now sees them looking around his neighborhood at 3am, so he figueres they are up to something.

Now when it comes down to the beating, it screams hate, but not racism. If I were that pissed at someone, Ide tear out their earing too. Im pretty sure hes gonna get convicted on something, but probably not a hate crime.

[Spang]

"All hate crime laws do is support the ideas that blacks are different from whites, that homosexuals need to be treated differently from non-homos, that we aren't the same!" - Stan

[Zaelath]

One wonders how you beat a person senseless with a baseball bat if you don't hate them. Stupid law.

[Chidoro]

aluminum bats are for pussies.

That's right, the whole lot of you anglo-negro mouth-breathers are PUSSIES. The last thing I want to hear when simpletons are pounding each other on the skull is ting!

check please

[Canelek]

The only racial tensions that exist are between people that are too fucking stupid to realize how fucking stupid they are.

[Truant]

aluminum bats are for pussies.

Aluminum bats are excellent choices for objects such as cars, storefronts. For people however, you're right. Wood all the way.

[Seebs]

Real men use Fungo.

[Tyek]

The guy on the bottom picture almost looks like he has Down's Syndrome or whatever it is being called now.

If the guys had already broken into a car, then they would be charged with assault and the hate crime thing is never brought up. By attacking them first they opened themselves to the political ramifications. That said, I wish they both had a bat and beat each other senseless. 2 less worthless individuals in the world would be a good thing.

I honestly do not get a mentality that thinks, I do not have this, therefore it is my right to liberate it from someone that does. There are lots of things I want. If I want them badly enough I save for it.