Apple dumps IBM for Intel Processors....

Animalor · Post by **Animalor** » June 7, 2005, 10:14 am

http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,67757,00.html

It's gonna be interesting to see how this plays out.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 7, 2005, 1:12 pm

Apple Sucks. I hated my Mac.

I hate the one button mice. I hate the limited software and expensive peripherals. Macs are only good for grandmothers. Apple is all about glitz and robbing the end user.

Hate hate hate. Commodore should have survived to be the PC's competion, not Apple! Apple = Windowblinds.

Steve Jobs knows how to market and that's it. He gets raped on the business end by people like Gates.

*flame post!

Neost · Post by **Neost** » June 7, 2005, 1:25 pm

hmm...apple using intel processors, microsoft using powerpc processors for the xbox.

"Rivers and seas boiling! … The dead rising from the grave! ... Human sacrifice! Dogs and cats living together!"

Niffoni · Post by **Niffoni** » June 7, 2005, 1:28 pm

I didn't read anything about this in my gossip magazines!

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 7, 2005, 1:34 pm

as much as i love apples for their look and the display, i have to agree with a lot of what Winnow says.

for starters 1 button mice are a fucking joke. period

if you use a 1 button mouse i dont' know how you even found this webpage. (i think the mice are USB, so you can use a normal mouse...but still...)

and yeah the fucking price tag is ridiculous. i mean an iPod is a 20GB hard disk for $300.

HUH?!

is it 1995?

that being said, i want one.

and if i were buying a laptop i would seriously think about getting a mac. that being said, i would always end up going PC in the end, because i can equal the performance for half the fucking price.

Macs are marketed BRILLIANTLY. BRILLIANT branding. you look at the laptops, and you want one.

i love iTunes, which is actually in my opinion one of the best CD burning applications ever. My mom can use it - thats how easy it is.

not having right click menus with Paste on the pulldown is pretty fucking lame though.

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » June 7, 2005, 2:42 pm

Voronwë wrote:not having right click menus with Paste on the pulldown is pretty fucking lame though.

They DO have "right click" menus. You CAN use them if you have a multi-button mouse. If you have a one button mouse, it is accessed by pressing the Apple button and then using the mouse to click.

All in all, I consider OSX to be a fantastic platform. I was planning on moving (via a laptop for my wife) in the next month or so, but I will wait for the new x86 laptop before moving.

For what she uses a computer for (documents, email, etc), Apple is an amazing choice. I can get Cuisine (a nice recipe management program), a .Mac account, Entourage, Omni Graffle, Office for Mac, etc and give her an amazing user experience with a computer that does everything she would want without being intimidating or complicated to use. At the same time, when I want to manage her computer, I have the power of the underlying "unix" through the console that lets me move and manage files in a much more powerful environement than is offered by a DOS shell.

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » June 7, 2005, 2:43 pm

p.s. It is shaping up more and more like OSX Tiger really is Windows Longhorn.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » June 7, 2005, 3:27 pm

Mac's are a great platform ever since OS X. I had to buy a mac laptop in 2000, and it's a sleek 15" titanium wireless machine. I use a real mouse via usb, built-in airport for wireless access at home, and a bluetooth adapter for remote internet through my cellphone. Tiger is a fantastic OS, with the Dashboard and the Spotlight search being the new main additions.

As for gaming on a mac... console emulators and a usb gamepad are the best bet.

If anyone wants Tiger, pm.

Stalker Vacio · Post by **Stalker Vacio** » June 7, 2005, 4:48 pm

Apple will always have place for students, teachers, artists, musicians, graphics design peeps and those who don't use the left side of there brain.

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » June 7, 2005, 4:51 pm

Stalker Vacio wrote:Apple will always have place for students, teachers, artists, musicians, graphics design peeps and those who don't use the left side of there brain.

Do people that don't use the left side of their brains often confuse there, their, and they're?

Marbus · Post by **Marbus** » June 7, 2005, 4:55 pm

Apple should have done this years ago but if they don't do it right it could really screw things up. If they do it correctly it could mean the end of Microsoft's Domination of the desktop.

Example... IF and that's a big IF when talking about Jobs, they make it so that OSX will run on ANY x86 platform they will succeed. I know they are partnering with Intel but they need to make sure that it will run on what people can build from New Egg. They must make OSX and alternative to Windows. Because OSX is UNIX, and not bloated, it will run circles around Windows on a the same machine. All it will take is a few people do switch and the floodgates will open. When they do, software developers, including game developers will port games to both OSX and Windows...

Personally I can't wait to install OSX on my next Dell Laptop... that should be their goal. If they can convince the business community that it's easier to the point of increasing productivity at the same cost as Windows, they will switch and Jobs will finally win the war that has been going on since 84"

Just think of the Sever opportunities alone... Screw Solaris, HP-UX and Linux... I'm running OSX... it could be great! or it could suck... only time will tell.

Marb

Stalker Vacio · Post by **Stalker Vacio** » June 7, 2005, 6:15 pm

http://www.uhv.edu/ac/student/writing/g ... 032305.htm

The words their, there, they’re, and there’re can be confusing since they all sound the same. Words that sound the same but have different spellings and meanings are called homophones. Be careful when typing your documents in a word processing program such as MS Word or WordPerfect since these types of programs have spell checkers that merely determine whether or not the word is spelled correctly, not whether it is the correct word. As always, in order to be sure that the correct word is used, it is necessary to reread the document completely or have someone else read it to check for spelling and word errors.
Let’s go over the uses of the words in question.

Their: this word is a possessive pronoun that denotes that something belongs to more than one person or group.

Example: The Chinese are very proud of their heritage.

They’re: This is a combination of the words “they” and “are.” Typically this word is used to specify what a group is doing.

Example: They’re going to Disneyworld for the summer.

There: This word denotes a place. Tip: you may need to identify the place in the same sentence that the word “there” is used. The place will at least need to be identified in a previous sentence so that the reader will know which place the word “there” is referring to.

Example: After agreeing about the quality of the food at Red Lobster, the couple finally decided they would go there.

There’re: this is a contraction of “there are.” Quite frankly, you should probably avoid using it for formal or professional papers. Your readers will probably view it as an odd contraction and you may lose credibility as a result. It can be used in less formal assignments or artistic prose such as short stories, dialogue, or poetry.

Example: The woodsman gave the ominous yet comical warning “There’re bars in dem woods.”

Correct Boy Wonder!

Spelling > Me

My point is Apple has it's 5% market niche and that's not going anywhere. It's been proven that people who use the right side of [glow=green]their[/glow]brain more (artists, musicians) tend to perfer Macs. These are the computer users that simply don't "get it" (Windows)

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 7, 2005, 6:35 pm

You can get a Mac for the fancy OS or just get Copernic for free on a PC and have easy access to your files.

Windows XP OS sucks for searches etc but there are free add ons. If you are a creative person, you want a PC because you can modify it to your liking much more than a Mac. If you avoid buying a coffee maker because you have to figure out how to set the time on it, then you want to get a Mac.

I don't avoid Macs because they are expensive. I avoid them because they suck balls.

Ashur · Post by **Ashur** » June 7, 2005, 6:47 pm

Stalker Vacio wrote:http://www.uhv.edu/ac/student/writing/g ... 032305.htm

Correct Boy Wonder!

Spelling > Me

My point is Apple has it's 5% market niche and that's not going anywhere. It's been proven that people who use the right side of [glow=green]their[/glow]brain more (artists, musicians) tend to perfer Macs. These are the computer users that simply don't "get it" (Windows)

Grammar > You too.

Surprised there wasn't a section on that site for "it's" versus "its" (the section that covered the use of apostrophes didn't cover this common misuse).

That said, I agree with you entirely!

I'd like to snag a Mac Mini to augment my PC. They are beautiful little machines.

Stalker Vacio · Post by **Stalker Vacio** » June 7, 2005, 6:48 pm

Winnow wrote:You can get a Mac for the fancy OS or just get Copernic for free on a PC and have easy access to your files.

Windows XP OS sucks for searches etc but there are free add ons. If you are a creative person, you want a PC because you can modify it to your liking much more than a Mac. If you avoid buying a coffee maker because you have to figure out how to set the time on it, then you want to get a Mac.

I don't avoid Macs because they are expensive. I avoid them because they suck balls.

Well said.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 7, 2005, 10:38 pm

Voronwë wrote: and if i were buying a laptop i would seriously think about getting a mac. that being said, i would always end up going PC in the end, because i can equal the performance for half the fucking price.

Base Dell notebook in $AUD: 1,596.10 (w/ XP pro, +99 delivery)

Base Apple iBook in $AUD: $1,599.00 (free delivery)

Where's the "twice the price"?

And yeah, I'll never have a Mac desktop or as my main computer, but if you just *work* with your notebook, the OSX machines are fan-fucking-tastic compared to using comparable Windows XP machines.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 7, 2005, 11:17 pm

Zaelath wrote:
And yeah, I'll never have a Mac desktop or as my main computer, but if you just *work* with your notebook, the OSX machines are fan-fucking-tastic compared to using comparable Windows XP machines.

What's the big difference? I bought a nice PC Laptop recently and am very happy with it. What is the Mac doing that the PC isn't besides looking good externally at a coffee shop?

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 8, 2005, 12:08 am

I do a lot of ad-hoc consultancy, so the time between hibernate and useable is important; w/ OSX it's near instantaneous, on a PC it takes longer to start than the work I need to do on it.

I also deal w/ a lot of network issues, so being able to pop a terminal window and use the full range of tools *nix has saves a lot of farking about; whois, dig, tcpdump, etc. Sure you can get such tools on windows, as an after-thought, with a GUI so they run slower, and the useable ones all cost extra.

After those two, which are probably enough for me, you start looking at memory profiles, Windows shitty page file handling and it's effect on your battery/harddisk life, etc.

Oh, and I don't slut out my notebook at the coffee shop =)

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » June 8, 2005, 12:12 am

Winnow wrote:
Zaelath wrote:
And yeah, I'll never have a Mac desktop or as my main computer, but if you just *work* with your notebook, the OSX machines are fan-fucking-tastic compared to using comparable Windows XP machines.
What's the big difference? I bought a nice PC Laptop recently and am very happy with it. What is the Mac doing that the PC isn't besides looking good externally at a coffee shop?

I know for a fact that you aren't stupid. Why don't you go read up on OSX with an open mind? I started life as a software developer and now I manage such software development. I have always been a Microsoft developer that supports their work rather than railing against it. My professional life ought to establish my credentials, or at least clear up that I am not a Microsoft basher. I just happen to think that Apple has a good product too.

I imagine that you would like many things about a Mac if you read up on them. Given your "gadget" budget, I can even imagine you buying a Mac Mini to have as a second (third, fourth, whatever you are up to now) computer.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 8, 2005, 12:29 am

Zaelath wrote:I do a lot of ad-hoc consultancy, so the time between hibernate and useable is important; w/ OSX it's near instantaneous, on a PC it takes longer to start than the work I need to do on it.

Hmm, mine takes ~5 seconds which is about how long it takes me to open it up and get situated. Doesn't seem that bad to me.

Zaelath wrote:Oh, and I don't slut out my notebook at the coffee shop =)

Really? The other day at Starbuck's I opened my case, whipped out my massive 17"er, rubbed my fingers on the touchpad and skejwi eriwh apeowp!!2~)(%_4

Got a free latte out of it!

Drolgin Steingrinder · Post by **Drolgin Steingrinder** » June 8, 2005, 12:44 am

archeiron wrote:I started life as a software developer

omg, child prodigy?

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 8, 2005, 12:45 am

Winnow wrote:
Zaelath wrote:I do a lot of ad-hoc consultancy, so the time between hibernate and useable is important; w/ OSX it's near instantaneous, on a PC it takes longer to start than the work I need to do on it.
Hmm, mine takes ~5 seconds which is about how long it takes me to open it up and get situated. Doesn't seem that bad to me.

What memory/HD profile? I'm thinking w/ you, perhaps not your base model notebook

Also, is that to display the desktop, or to actually be operating at a reasonable speed and not just faking it? (Windows has a bad habit of displaying the GUI long before it's finished loading crap, so you end up bound by HD IO for a good while)

I'm not trying to preach for conversion, I religiously avoided Macs prior to OSX because while their hardware was nice, if overpriced, their OS was complete rubbish.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 8, 2005, 12:48 am

archeiron wrote:
I imagine that you would like many things about a Mac if you read up on them. Given your "gadget" budget, I can even imagine you buying a Mac Mini to have as a second (third, fourth, whatever you are up to now) computer.

I'd buy a Mac if I could think of a reason for using one. I just don't see the reason for a Mac over having all the available software from PC'land at my fingertips with a PC. Seriously, if there was something that the Mac did a lot better than the PC I'd buy one and use it.

I'm not even sure Mac LCDs look as nice as PC laptops now. Mine has a beautiful display and Samsung 24" LCD panels (Dell) eclipsed Apples 23" LCD displays at like half the price with a better image.

As far as I know, Macs don't even have a DVDShrink type application yet. The one thing I admit they did better than PCs was search for files which is why I have raved so much about Copernic. It rocks. It looks like Longhorn will finally have some decent search capabilities as well.

Macintosh has 2 percent of the home/business computer market from what I understand. When it comes to computers, I want what gives me the most opportunity to find the programs I want to use now and in the future. Yes, you can have a better product and it doesn't matter if there's nothing to run on it. (remember Xbox when it first came out vs the PS2?) ...well Macs are like a new product that's nice but never gets the support. iPods are ok as they are basically standalone things with a single purpose. Even those don't have tuners which is retarded. Gotta have an FM tuner on your MP3 player...wtf are they thinking.

Apple is shit to me until Steve Jobs and the other Yahoos allow the OS to run on any PC. Then I might try OSX as long as I could stil lrun all the PC Apps until 10 years down the road when the OSX has a 10th of the apps the PC has available.

I'll take a look at OSX though to see if I'm missing something.

Fash · Post by **Fash** » June 8, 2005, 1:01 am

OS X has a dvd ripper, it's called, Mac The Ripper.

I use OSX because I have an apple laptop, and it's my only notebook. It's great as a portable... other than games, I can do everything else.

I have office for osx though i like the free openoffice.. i have photoshop cs, quarkexpress, macromedia studio mx, iLife05, Virtual PC 7.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 8, 2005, 1:17 am

Fash wrote:OS X has a dvd ripper, it's called, Mac The Ripper.

Not just a ripper/decrypter but also a shrinker to fit the DVD on a single DVD-R. Does mac have something like that?

PC just got something that may end up being even better than DVD Shrink called RatDVD which will reduce a DVD9 (7-8GB to about 2GB keeping all menus and extras intact. A normal DVD reduces to less than 1gb..great stuff for saving your DVD collection onto your HD with full functionality including menus and extras all included in a single file.

http://www.ratdvd.dk/index.htm

You can then convert it back to full dvd and burn it later if you want/wish.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 8, 2005, 1:32 am

I don't think you're really missing anything, and I wouldn't suggest someone who has a Windows notebook they're happy with also get an iBook. As a replacement for my old Windows notebook, and for what I have to do, Apple wins.

Mac v's PC LCDs I can't talk that much about, other than to note when looking about for 30" LCDs for a customer, the normal optimal screen size was 1280x, where as the Apple was 1920x (and yes, it was at least twice the price) Similarly w/ their CRTs, the 21" G4 screen I borrowed for a while ran at 2048x with a good refresh rate.

They're a niche company when it comes to desktops/graphics workstations.. I think their notebooks are definitely more mass market.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 8, 2005, 1:59 am

Zaelath wrote:
Mac v's PC LCDs I can't talk that much about, other than to note when looking about for 30" LCDs for a customer, the normal optimal screen size was 1280x, where as the Apple was 1920x (and yes, it was at least twice the price) Similarly w/ their CRTs, the 21" G4 screen I borrowed for a while ran at 2048x with a good refresh rate.

They're a niche company when it comes to desktops/graphics workstations.. I think their notebooks are definitely more mass market.

The resolution os only part of it. (and what's 2048X? Seems like an odd res...1920X1200 is what the 24" run. Ghosting and viewing angle are two important factors as well. The 30" Apple LCDs look like one big blurry mess if anything is in motion on the screen.

Anyways, Macs do look visually nice. They're like the well kept living room you never use because all the activity takes place in the family room.

I wish the PC makers would learn a little about aesthetics from Apple.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 8, 2005, 2:07 am

Was a 4:3 CRT, so 2048x1536 (ie, double 1024x768)

Not completely certain that was it's max res.. that's as high as my video card would go :>

I think refresh is why the common res on the 30" LCDs is so low.. I only get 1280x1024 on my 17" Benq, but it's the 8ms version, no blur, about 120 degree viewing angle.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 8, 2005, 12:17 pm

archeiron wrote:
Voronwë wrote:not having right click menus with Paste on the pulldown is pretty fucking lame though.
They DO have "right click" menus. You CAN use them if you have a multi-button mouse. If you have a one button mouse, it is accessed by pressing the Apple button and then using the mouse to click.

i was speaking of the iTunes application running on a PC using a 3 button mouse

. sorry for not being precise though. if you copy a song from your library, and past it into a playlist , you have to use keystrokes or the actual Edit menu.

thats retardation.

but i still love apple.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 8, 2005, 12:24 pm

Winnow wrote:
archeiron wrote:

Apple is shit to me until Steve Jobs and the other Yahoos allow the OS to run on any PC. Then I might try OSX as long as I could stil lrun all the PC Apps until 10 years down the road when the OSX has a 10th of the apps the PC has available.

there has been a version for i86 chips available via GPL for a long time i believe.

Darwin was the initial version of the *nix variant, correct?

Fash · Post by **Fash** » June 8, 2005, 12:26 pm

Voronwë wrote: if you copy a song from your library, and past it into a playlist , you have to use keystrokes or the actual Edit menu.

thats retardation.

but i still love apple.

how about just dragging them?

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 8, 2005, 12:29 pm

i like right click

the point is that a well designed application in 2005, has all of those things, drag and drop, keystroke, right click menus, everything for all user styles.

i think that is a problem with Mac design in general. They have an aesthetic that they will stick to above functionality in some occurances.

regardless i worship their coolness

yes i manage though, thanks

Hoarmurath · Post by **Hoarmurath** » June 12, 2005, 12:51 am

Voronwë wrote:Darwin was the initial version of the *nix variant, correct?

OS X evolved from the NEXTSTEP operating system. Darwin is essentially an open source version of OS X that runs on both PowerPC and x86 architecture.

<a href="http://developer.apple.com/darwin/proje ... ml">Darwin FAQ</a>