Insurgents/terrorists kill 3 Iraqi children

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » June 1, 2005, 1:50 pm

and wound another 20+ civilians.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/06/ ... index.html

I think this will be my new daily contribution. Enjoy.

Aslanna · Post by **Aslanna** » June 1, 2005, 1:56 pm

Well obviously they only did it due to the continued illegal U.S. occupation of Iraq. So therefore it's really the U.S. that killed those people by their mere presence.

Ebumar · Post by **Ebumar** » June 1, 2005, 1:58 pm

You're a freaking retard.

miir · Post by **miir** » June 1, 2005, 2:10 pm

A suicide bombing wounded 15 people in Iraq on Wednesday, the second attack on the main American military complex in Baghdad in 24 hours, the military said."Terrorists attacked the entry point with small arms fire immediately after the explosion" on Wednesday, said a U.S. military news release..

Since when is an attack on a military complex considered terrorism?

In the al-Dora section of southern Baghdad on Wednesday, a mortar struck a house killing four people, including three children, police sources said. Also killed was a 20-year-old man. A child also was wounded in the attack. Police believe the mortar was targeting a nearby Iraqi military base.

So when the US accidentally kills children with clusterbombs or mortar fire or guided missles, it's called collateral damage.... but when an non a 'non-american' accidentally kills children with a mortar that was targeted for a military target, it's called terrorism?

I do believe that is refered to as hypocrisy.
Correct me if I am wrong.

cid · Post by **cid** » June 1, 2005, 2:17 pm

Can you name one fucking war that innocent civilians did not die? You guys are seriously grasping for straws here.

Niffoni · Post by **Niffoni** » June 1, 2005, 2:22 pm

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:Enjoy.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 1, 2005, 2:25 pm

Some of you people also believed it when Saddam said we were targeting his baby milk factories.

Aslanna · Post by **Aslanna** » June 1, 2005, 2:26 pm

Wheee... Reeling em in!

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 1, 2005, 2:29 pm

yet another thread where everybody is too busy foaming at the mouth to actually take the time to bother reading what it is they are responding too =)

Nick · Post by **Nick** » June 1, 2005, 2:42 pm

Stupidest thread of the week.

miir · Post by **miir** » June 1, 2005, 2:50 pm

I'm serious.

When the US military reports an attack on a US military base, how exactly can the attackers be referred to (in their own words) as, terrorists?

I'm no expert strategist nor do I claim to know a lot about wars, but it seems to me that a military base would be a valid military target.

Terrorism:

The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.

the unlawful use or threat of violence esp. against the state or the public as a politically motivated means of attack or coercion

I don't think their actions can be construed as terrorism by any stretch.

Now if it had been an attack where the intended target were Iraqi civilians, then I could understand calling it a 'terrorist' attack.

Seems like the American military/government is now just refering to any enemy attack in Iraq is terrorism. Pretty effective propaganda, judging from some posts in this thread.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » June 1, 2005, 4:12 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 1, 2005, 4:24 pm

Nick wrote:Stupidest thread of the week.

Yup. It is only important to point out when the US killed innocents.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 1, 2005, 4:24 pm

cid wrote:Can you name one fucking war that innocent civilians did not die? You guys are seriously grasping for straws here.

Common sense does not live here at VV.

Lohrno · Post by **Lohrno** » June 1, 2005, 4:36 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote: Yup. It is only important to point out when the US killed innocents.

The difference is if it was our fault, we probably could have prevented it.

Well if it was the insurgent's fault we are not doing a good enough job strategically.

I would bet that we kill more innocents than most other countries would in the same situation...

Nick · Post by **Nick** » June 1, 2005, 4:36 pm

The reason it is stupid is because if the US had not gone about the whole fucking fiasco in this way the insurgents may not be being quite so vicious.

It is the insurgents responsibility, no one is denying this, but proclaiming that they are oh so evil when you guys instigated the fucking thing (knowing this would happen) is STUPID.

Logic is alive and well here Midnyte, you just can't see it.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » June 1, 2005, 4:39 pm

miir wrote:
A suicide bombing wounded 15 people in Iraq on Wednesday, the second attack on the main American military complex in Baghdad in 24 hours, the military said."Terrorists attacked the entry point with small arms fire immediately after the explosion" on Wednesday, said a U.S. military news release..

Since when is an attack on a military complex considered terrorism?

I would say when you open fire on the civilians in line to go into it, that would constitute a cowardly attack on innocents.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » June 1, 2005, 4:41 pm

Well to be fair Nick, the administration thought we were going to be greeted with "flowers and chocolates".

cid · Post by **cid** » June 1, 2005, 4:42 pm

If what we are doing is so fucking wrong. Then why hasn’t any sanctions been taken towards us?

Us stoopid Americans did not elect the entire worlds leaders.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » June 1, 2005, 4:42 pm

I would say when you open fire on the civilians in line to go into it

Hi....shock and awe.

Oh and Cid, I think the sanctions such as no respect for the your views from the rest of the world is big enough.
You are also forgetting all politicians in power are a bunch of corrupt fucks.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 1, 2005, 4:42 pm

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:
miir wrote:
A suicide bombing wounded 15 people in Iraq on Wednesday, the second attack on the main American military complex in Baghdad in 24 hours, the military said."Terrorists attacked the entry point with small arms fire immediately after the explosion" on Wednesday, said a U.S. military news release..

Since when is an attack on a military complex considered terrorism?
I would say when you open fire on the civilians in line to go into it, that would constitute a cowardly attack on innocents.

Do we really need to go over the Clerks/Return of the Jedi argument AGAIN?!

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 1, 2005, 4:46 pm

cid wrote:If what we are doing is so fucking wrong. Then why hasn’t any sanctions been taken towards us?

Us stoopid Americans did not elect the entire worlds leaders.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

What sanctions do you suppose would have any meaning at all to the US, and who is in a position to antagonise you in such a way anyway?

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » June 1, 2005, 4:50 pm

Voronwë wrote:Well to be fair Nick, the administration thought we were going to be greeted with "flowers and chocolates".

Well since there are lines of Iraqis wanting to go into the bases to help, I am guessing that the opposition to us being there is not exactly off the charts. I have a newsflash for you......I don't think our people want to be there anymore than most of the Iraqis want us to be able to leave. Unfortunately, the insurgent asshats won't stop being retarded terrorist assholes and blowing up their own people and the things we have rebuilt for them.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 1, 2005, 5:15 pm

Voronwë wrote:Well to be fair Nick, the administration thought we were going to be greeted with "flowers and chocolates".

MLK knew he wouldn't be greeted with chocolates and flowers, but he continued on, because he knew what he was doing was right.

The US Government knew a large majority of the US workforce would not greet Afirmative Action with chocolates and flowers, but they forced it into action because they knew it was the right thing to do. They knew by forcing compliance, that eventually the behavior would change and soon to follow the mind set.

You people really need to look at the big picture and stop being such bitter, negative, short-sighted fucks.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » June 1, 2005, 5:24 pm

Comparing the current invasion of Iraq to MLK's struggle.

Wow.

Just Wow.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 1, 2005, 5:27 pm

Nick wrote:Comparing the current invasion of Iraq to MLK's struggle.

Wow.

Just Wow.

Again. You have to be able to look big picture Nick. If you sit on the specifics of the comparison instead of the point I am trying to convey, then you will never be able to see past your nose. Which is a problem for a boxer.

Lohrno · Post by **Lohrno** » June 1, 2005, 5:36 pm

cid wrote:If what we are doing is so fucking wrong. Then why hasn’t any sanctions been taken towards us?

Us stoopid Americans did not elect the entire worlds leaders.

Because that would hurt their economies as much as ours. Not only that but they have to be careful when dealing with a maniacal world leader who has access to nuclear weapons and is so quick to take military action.

miir · Post by **miir** » June 1, 2005, 5:37 pm

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:I would say when you open fire on the civilians in line to go into it, that would constitute a cowardly attack on innocents.

Since when are individuals working inside a military complex considered civilians?

Lohrno · Post by **Lohrno** » June 1, 2005, 5:39 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote: You people really need to look at the big picture and stop being such bitter, negative, short-sighted fucks.

Where is improving diplomatic relations with europe, getting "buy in" in general, improving our economy, and trying not to create terrorists in the big picture? I'm not seeing it...

miir · Post by **miir** » June 1, 2005, 5:40 pm

Oh and by American standards, the Iraqis who are helping the Americans are guilty of treason anyway.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 1, 2005, 6:23 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:The US Government knew a large majority of the US workforce would not greet Afirmative Action with chocolates and flowers, but they forced it into action because they knew it was the right thing to do.

It's a derail, but ... can I assume from this, "knew it was the right thing to do" is the new euphemism for "poorly thought out reactionary policy that has proven over time not to work"?

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » June 1, 2005, 6:41 pm

cid wrote:If what we are doing is so fucking wrong. Then why hasn’t any sanctions been taken towards us?

well, we have already ignored the UN once, what makes you certain we wouldn't do it again?

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » June 1, 2005, 8:38 pm

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:
miir wrote:
A suicide bombing wounded 15 people in Iraq on Wednesday, the second attack on the main American military complex in Baghdad in 24 hours, the military said."Terrorists attacked the entry point with small arms fire immediately after the explosion" on Wednesday, said a U.S. military news release..

Since when is an attack on a military complex considered terrorism?
I would say when you open fire on the civilians in line to go into it, that would constitute a cowardly attack on innocents.

Like bombing a restaurant because a wanted person MIGHT be in it? And I love how every other post by Midnyte is "short sighted idiots, see the bigger picture!" considering that was what he was told so many times. Guess he got brainwashed to sound like a broken hypocritical record.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » June 1, 2005, 9:18 pm

miir wrote:
Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:I would say when you open fire on the civilians in line to go into it, that would constitute a cowardly attack on innocents.
Since when are individuals working inside a military complex considered civilians?

I know several people who work on bases, and they are considered civilians. They do not have the clearance to go everywhere on those bases or see everything there is. Granted the people I know are currently working for companies who directly assist the US Army through repairs to machinery/vehicles and parts for those repairs, but there are also others responsible for other functions of running a base. Not all logistics operations are conducted by strictly military personnel. Civilians in the area can be employed by companies that have military contracts for services. This is one reason you might hear about the closing of a base having a great impact on the economy of the surrounding area. It is not all because of the money that is spent by the individual soldiers.

Moonwynd · Post by **Moonwynd** » June 1, 2005, 10:30 pm

Nick wrote:The reason it is stupid is because if the US had not gone about the whole fucking fiasco in this way the insurgents may not be being quite so vicious.

It is the insurgents responsibility, no one is denying this, but proclaiming that they are oh so evil when you guys instigated the fucking thing (knowing this would happen) is STUPID.

These "insurgents" would be cutting heads off and killing as many Americans and others that do not believe EXACTLY as they do...regardless of whether America went into Iraq at all.

If the 19 people that hijacked the planes on September 11, 2001 were alive today they would have found another way to kill themselves and take out as many people as they could...and if their own brethren were collateral damage...then that is the price they would be willing to pay.

You can go into all of the myriad of reasons that you believe America is to blame for 9/11...but when it boils down to it...it was terrorists killing civilians...of many nationalities.

Do you REALLY think they would be less vicious if we did not go into Iraq the way we did? Hell no. These people view nearly everyone but those that support their cause as less than human...as sheep to be slaughtered...cut off their heads....blow them up...taking out whomever happens to be nearby. They do not have an intensity dial on their viciousness.

I had a Lebanese professor that taught a class called "Problems of the modern world". Mind you this was back in the mid 80's...but he said "Even if peace were achieved between Israel and the rest of the Middle East, there will never be peace there" He went on to explain the history of the region and how warlords, mullahs, chieftains, etc. all had their own wants for power and how true fundamentalism is a rare bird as it is often a desire for power (land, money, or a devout following) that is cloaked in the veil of religious fundamentalism. Same could be said for non Muslim, power hungry wankers. But we are talking about the "insurgents" and terrorists here.

Respectfully,

Moon

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » June 1, 2005, 10:33 pm

But, if the Storm Troopers hadn't wiped out Luke's family he wouldn't have been free to join the rebellion and fuck everything up for the empire!

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » June 1, 2005, 11:10 pm

You can go into all of the myriad of reasons that you believe America is to blame for 9/11...but when it boils down to it...it was terrorists killing civilians...of many nationalities.

Nice way of justifying your idiotic invasion and occupation while ignoring the past history. When it boils down to it, your country has killed many times the number of civilians that dies on 9/11. Directly and indirectly.

Do you REALLY think they would be less vicious if we did not go into Iraq the way we did? Hell no. These people view nearly everyone but those that support their cause as less than human...as sheep to be slaughtered...cut off their heads....blow them up...taking out whomever happens to be nearby. They do not have an intensity dial on their viciousness.

Nah you just created a lot more of them. Oh and while doing that there's nothing like a little abuse here and there!

miir · Post by **miir** » June 2, 2005, 1:19 am

Moonwynd wrote:These "insurgents" would be cutting heads off and killing as many Americans and others that do not believe EXACTLY as they do...regardless of whether America went into Iraq at all.

If the 19 people that hijacked the planes on September 11, 2001 were alive today they would have found another way to kill themselves and take out as many people as they could...and if their own brethren were collateral damage...then that is the price they would be willing to pay.

You can go into all of the myriad of reasons that you believe America is to blame for 9/11...but when it boils down to it...it was terrorists killing civilians...of many nationalities.

Do you REALLY think they would be less vicious if we did not go into Iraq the way we did? Hell no. These people view nearly everyone but those that support their cause as less than human...as sheep to be slaughtered...cut off their heads....blow them up...taking out whomever happens to be nearby. They do not have an intensity dial on their viciousness.

I had a Lebanese professor that taught a class called "Problems of the modern world". Mind you this was back in the mid 80's...but he said "Even if peace were achieved between Israel and the rest of the Middle East, there will never be peace there" He went on to explain the history of the region and how warlords, mullahs, chieftains, etc. all had their own wants for power and how true fundamentalism is a rare bird as it is often a desire for power (land, money, or a devout following) that is cloaked in the veil of religious fundamentalism. Same could be said for non Muslim, power hungry wankers. But we are talking about the "insurgents" and terrorists here.

Respectfully,

Moon

What exactly does the invasion, occupation and installation of a 'pro-american' puppet government in Iraq have to do with terrorism... aside from creating a fertile recruiting ground for fundamentalist islamic terrorists?

Fash · Post by **Fash** » June 2, 2005, 1:46 am

oh those american bastards... training the new police force and stabilizing the country...

you're only morons for believing that more iraqis want us out than want us in.

for miir: hamid karzai, execute order 66.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » June 2, 2005, 3:04 am

Do you REALLY think they would be less vicious if we did not go into Iraq the way we did? Hell no. These people view nearly everyone but those that support their cause as less than human...as sheep to be slaughtered...cut off their heads....blow them up...taking out whomever happens to be nearby. They do not have an intensity dial on their viciousness.

Are you talking about the US government, yourself, or the insurgents?

Keverian FireCry · Post by **Keverian FireCry** » June 2, 2005, 3:57 am

MLK knew he wouldn't be greeted with chocolates and flowers, but he continued on, because he knew what he was doing was right

There is no comparison here whatsoever. MLK preached only NON VIOLENCE in his struggle. We are pre-empting violence with this war. Whether or not we justify these violent acts of war with lies or truth, a man like MLK would condemn them. MLK was bigger than the issue of equality, he struggled for the issues of peace, forgiveness, acceptance, and understanding.

I see none of the above in our actions in Iraq.

You can codemn my passivity all you want, but do not twist the words or actions of MLK into the acceptance of war of any type.

miir · Post by **miir** » June 2, 2005, 9:06 am

Fash wrote:oh those american bastards... training the new police force and stabilizing the country...

Stabilize?
How is Iraq more stable now than when it was 4 years ago?
The threat of a civil war and an insurgency that shows no signs of letting up are not signs of stability.

you're only morons for believing that more iraqis want us out than want us in.

Who believes that?

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 2, 2005, 9:50 am

miir wrote:
Fash wrote:oh those american bastards... training the new police force and stabilizing the country...
Stabilize?
How is Iraq more stable now than when it was 4 years ago?

LONG TERM!!!!! BIG PICTURE!!!! DON'T BE SO SHORT-SIGHTED!!!!

Lynks · Post by **Lynks** » June 2, 2005, 9:55 am

needs more exclamation points.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 2, 2005, 10:00 am

Lynks wrote:needs more exclamation points.

Yeah, I was thinking it might, but I was hoping no one would notice how deficient of exclamation points it was.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » June 2, 2005, 2:35 pm

Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:
miir wrote:
Fash wrote:oh those american bastards... training the new police force and stabilizing the country...
Stabilize?
How is Iraq more stable now than when it was 4 years ago?

LONG TERM!!!!! BIG PICTURE!!!! DON'T BE SO SHORT-SIGHTED!!!!

You don't have the first clue how this will turn out in the long term. Neither does Bush or anybody else.

Midnyte_Ragebringer · Post by **Midnyte_Ragebringer** » June 2, 2005, 2:51 pm

Kelshara wrote:
Midnyte_Ragebringer wrote:
miir wrote:
Fash wrote:oh those american bastards... training the new police force and stabilizing the country...
Stabilize?
How is Iraq more stable now than when it was 4 years ago?

LONG TERM!!!!! BIG PICTURE!!!! DON'T BE SO SHORT-SIGHTED!!!!
You don't have the first clue how this will turn out in the long term. Neither does Bush or anybody else.

Lynks · Post by **Lynks** » June 2, 2005, 2:53 pm

Didn't you hear? Midnyte's a psychic and can see the big picture in everything.

Niffoni · Post by **Niffoni** » June 2, 2005, 3:01 pm

Incidently, "Captain Clairvoyance" would be a sweet name for an apologist superhero.

Lohrno · Post by **Lohrno** » June 2, 2005, 3:14 pm

He never really explains the big picture. So I only have to assume that probably either:

A) The big picture is something not palateable. It's easier to say "Look at the big picture." than it is to say "Let's nuke them to hell and beat them into submission so we don't have to worry about them anymore." or "This will be great for the oil companies."

B) He is using that line as a cop out of some sort.

VeeshanVault

Insurgents/terrorists kill 3 Iraqi children

Insurgents/terrorists kill 3 Iraqi children

Re: Insurgents/terrorists kill 3 Iraqi children