The fucking state of this place

[Lynks]

Midnyte: You have demonstrated very little respect for those who disagree with your views.

I must respectfully disagree.

proof that you don't

Do I respect their opinions? Not always.

Way to not read, its become your trademark.

[Cartalas]

And Selective Quoting out of context is yours Gratz on Michael Moore school of posting.

[Nick]

.........

[Lynks]

I took you off ignore for a split second to see that? Well, not that I need to justify it to you but, I had to make it as simple as I could for the man with no brain.

[Kylere]

What is a shame is that while I agree with Teeny about Mid and others, I think that another sign of being a dumbass is thinking that anyone who does not agree with you is less intelligent by default.

[Zaelath]

What is a shame is that while I agree with Teeny about Mid and others, I think that another sign of being a dumbass is thinking that anyone who does not agree with you is less intelligent by default.

I'll give anyone respect that has a reasonable foundation for their argument, and I'll happily call a jackass a jackass if they try and push opinion as fact, try and push religious belief as fact, regurgitate single source propaganda as fact.

I discern who is less intelligent than I based on more than a difference of opinion..

[Nick]

Edit: Exactly Zealath

Nearly every single one of you has taken from this your own slant.

It is not about just people I disagree with. I disagree with Winnow often, and Akaran, did I mention them? NO!
It is not creating a leftist Utopia? Did I ever state that? Or did I in fact no already state that it is about people literally not even discussing, just being bigoted hatemongers about inane things like dead guitarists and gay marriage?
It is not about assuming that just because someone differs in opinion they are less intelligent.

Watch your don't put words in my mouth or anything !

Btw, in reality, much to the many friends I have here, as I have already stated infinity times, its the small few, of which even a few of them seem slightly more reasonable after this.

A lil bit.


>< this much

[Jice Virago]

Midnyte is a nessecary evil, because every social heiriarchy has to have a lowest common denomenator. I don't care for his opinions and bigotry, but he has show himself to at least take in some of what people are saying from time to time. Mid is a valued member of this forum, wether lefties choose to accept it or not.

Brotha really says some crackpot things, but hes not the hardcore righty people think he is and occasionally manages to get a really good point across. He also has proven to have a sense of humor unlike many people on his side of the fence. I submit that Brotha is a useful contributor to the forum.

Cartalas (and to a lesser degree, Metanis) is a waste of oxygen and reading time. He is like that 14 year old kid that no matter how many times you beat him, always came back to the rear of the bus and sat around annoying the cap out of the older kids. Cartalas is totally useless and the only person to ever make me consider advocating a ban from these boards. (In Metanis' defense, he actually structures his arguments and tries to make coherant statements 99% of the time)

Atokal was fun to provoke back when arguments with him (and his brothers) used to consist of EQ related shenanigans, but now his gay bashing and GW fanboism are just simply boorish. I admit to feeling a certain level of guilty pleasure (akin to watching a fight break out on Jerry Springer) from watching people whip him up into a rabid frenzy. There is also a certain irony in how Dar, who once probably endured annoyance over the 47 chromosome bothers antics on this board tanishing the image of his guild, now getting hounded on a daily basis by Toker; over gay related issues of all things (guess Dar should have put out for him that night they shared a hotel room!). Atokal has endless entertainment value, however, much the same way that people never get tired of seeing Donald Duck all pissed off.

Winnow is an enigma to me, in as much as his hobbies and interests run counter to his proffessed political leanings. This has led me to conclude that either he is the most sophisticated troll ever to exist (bluntly arguing points counter to the board majority purely for the sake of self amusement) or that he simply likes a double standard that favors him, personally. In either case, his only method of argument is to post pictures and repeat the same simple argument a billion times, no matter if its been deconstructed every previos time. As a result, I generally listen to his opinions but ignore his arguments, as debating an unchanging paleolithic brick wall is fairly boring.

The lefties are not without our annoying people either, to be fair. I am sure there are times when Kyo in particular made posts that caused others who shared her position to cringe. I think, however, for the most part, the leftist and moderate posters in this forum are far more open minded and receptive of counter arguments than the righties.

Oh well, I am sure there are people who hate me posting my long winded shit, but thats my opinion.

[*~*stragi*~*]

You just can't seem to grasp that there are people out there who are just as intelligent as you, know just as much as you do regarding current events and politics, yet still support Bush. The difference between me and you is I realize that there are intelligent people with valid reasons who disagree with me, while in your mind anyone who disagrees with you is ignorant and/or dumb.

Bingo!

Exactly the same thing I have been saying for way too long now.

Dunno about that.. I seem to recall you saying something to everyone who supported kerry (even your friends) along the lines of "i am better than you, but i still cherish our time together!"

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

You just can't seem to grasp that there are people out there who are just as intelligent as you, know just as much as you do regarding current events and politics, yet still support Bush. The difference between me and you is I realize that there are intelligent people with valid reasons who disagree with me, while in your mind anyone who disagrees with you is ignorant and/or dumb.

Bingo!

Exactly the same thing I have been saying for way too long now.

Dunno about that.. I seem to recall you saying something to everyone who supported kerry (even your friends) along the lines of "i am better than you, but i still cherish our time together!"

Sure. Most definitely. On that issue, I sure did feel I knew more and cared more than others who would vote for the Democratic platform over the Republican platform, but most passionate Kerry supporters felt the same way about us. Do you really need me to point that out? Have you not read any of these threads over the last 2 years? You can easily see that many reasonable people have thrown some crazy passionate responses out toward eachother. It happens.

An example for you....Arch and I go way back in EQ. We had been in 5 guilds together and spent many hours online with eachother from level 12 to 65, from 1999 to 2004. We never spoke about politics in game, but over the past year these boards drew out our distinct different philosphies and visions. He is a more articulate/liberal and I am a more crass/conservative type. We have grown apart it seems. Not on my end, but on his. I could give a shit less about all this political mumbo jumbo, because no matter what I or anyone lese on these boards thinks or says, the government and world will do as it wishes. I cherish the time Arch and I spent together in game and respect the fact he finds some of the things I say to be stupid, crass, inaccurate, etc.

I don't however have respect for many of the people on these boards who haven't shown me any what so ever......who have done nothing but make claims of bigotry and racism on a daily basis. /shrug

Arch, I hope you don't mind me using you as an example, but I felt it fitting.

[Fat]

I believe the problem I have with your arguments is that they always seem to be dripping with condescension while generally being extremely opinion oriented. You may jump to a conclusion rather quickly and then pull out the “I told you so!” attitude. Sure, others do this from time to time as well, but it seems like you’ve become so reactionary that this form of post has become almost knee-jerk. Beyond that if you want to be condescending it would probably help to write an grammatically correct and error free post.

Anyways, toodles.

-Alfan

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

I believe the problem I have with your arguments is that they always seem to be dripping with condescension while generally being extremely opinion oriented. You may jump to a conclusion rather quickly and then pull out the “I told you so!” attitude. Sure, others do this from time to time as well, but it seems like you’ve become so reactionary that this form of post has become almost knee-jerk. Beyond that if you want to be condescending it would probably help to write an grammatically correct and error free post.

Anyways, toodles.

-Alfan

Nah. I just don't care about the structure of my writing on this board. It's a message board. I do however find it hilarious how that is all most people can come up with against other posters all the time. It's pretty sad and pathetic. And yes many times I do come off as condescending, because I am talking down to people sometimes on this board.

[Jice Virago]

I would have to say the various "fuck muslims" posts have also strongly prejudiced people against you Mid.

[Lynks]

Its the "I have to talk down to people" which makes you a fucking ass.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

I accept the two of those. I am not a perfect being. I don't expect to ever be perfect. I also firmly believe none of you are either. Problem is I don't think you understand that.

[Fat]

There is a radical difference between understanding self-imperfection and understanding self-imperfection while actively working to change any character flaws that you may possess.


Shieeeet, I'm like a kid and can recognize how asinine that last statement was.

-Alfan

[Tyek]

I think the problem is teeny that you seem to come off as a person who feels there is always a black and white answer to every issue and that you are the one person in the world that holds that answer. The world is shades of gray. People tend to hang with other people who share the same beliefs, this reinforces their belief system and gives them the sense that they are right.

Midnyte and I disagree on a number of issues, gay marriage among them and I feel his opinion is ignorant, just like I am sure Aemadar thinks I am ignorant because I eat meat when he feels their are better options. Am I right, in my mind I am. I bet Aemader and Midnyte think their are right too. THERE IS NO RIGHT ANSWER only opinions and while some may be less valuable to you, they may not to others. If you can't hang, put them on ignore or leave.

I can honestly tell you my belief system changes. Not everything, but some things have changed and if you say you have the same beliefs your whole life I will have to disagree with you. Ask any kid who the smartest man he knows is at age 5 he will say it is his dad. At age 15 his dad is WAYYYYYYYY down that list and as he grows older his dad starts getting smarter again.

It is insane to claim you have the right answers. I try and respect every opinion for what it is, that person's opinion. Does it give you insight into their character, you bet. If you want to judge a person on their character go for it, but understand that you do not have the answers, no one does and that your opinion is just another shade of gray.

[Metanis]

This has teh makings of a good retard thread... hence my natural urge to get at least one post in...

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

This has teh makings of a good retard thread... hence my natural urge to get at least one post in...

[Rekaar.]

I'm going to have to disagree with you Teeny, much along the lines of Winnow. For the most part I tend not to agree with the Brothas and Midnytes, and I think in recent weeks the quality of Rekaar's posts has gone down drastically, but if you never hear the opinions of the other side, your own thought process is stunted because you will not take all factors into account.

We all get fed up trying to explain what feels like common sense to someone that won't admit 1 + 1 = 2

[Cartalas]

Midnyte is a nessecary evil, because every social heiriarchy has to have a lowest common denomenator. I don't care for his opinions and bigotry, but he has show himself to at least take in some of what people are saying from time to time. Mid is a valued member of this forum, wether lefties choose to accept it or not.

Brotha really says some crackpot things, but hes not the hardcore righty people think he is and occasionally manages to get a really good point across. He also has proven to have a sense of humor unlike many people on his side of the fence. I submit that Brotha is a useful contributor to the forum.

Cartalas (and to a lesser degree, Metanis) is a waste of oxygen and reading time. He is like that 14 year old kid that no matter how many times you beat him, always came back to the rear of the bus and sat around annoying the cap out of the older kids. Cartalas is totally useless and the only person to ever make me consider advocating a ban from these boards. (In Metanis' defense, he actually structures his arguments and tries to make coherant statements 99% of the time)

Atokal was fun to provoke back when arguments with him (and his brothers) used to consist of EQ related shenanigans, but now his gay bashing and GW fanboism are just simply boorish. I admit to feeling a certain level of guilty pleasure (akin to watching a fight break out on Jerry Springer) from watching people whip him up into a rabid frenzy. There is also a certain irony in how Dar, who once probably endured annoyance over the 47 chromosome bothers antics on this board tanishing the image of his guild, now getting hounded on a daily basis by Toker; over gay related issues of all things (guess Dar should have put out for him that night they shared a hotel room!). Atokal has endless entertainment value, however, much the same way that people never get tired of seeing Donald Duck all pissed off.

Winnow is an enigma to me, in as much as his hobbies and interests run counter to his proffessed political leanings. This has led me to conclude that either he is the most sophisticated troll ever to exist (bluntly arguing points counter to the board majority purely for the sake of self amusement) or that he simply likes a double standard that favors him, personally. In either case, his only method of argument is to post pictures and repeat the same simple argument a billion times, no matter if its been deconstructed every previos time. As a result, I generally listen to his opinions but ignore his arguments, as debating an unchanging paleolithic brick wall is fairly boring.

The lefties are not without our annoying people either, to be fair. I am sure there are times when Kyo in particular made posts that caused others who shared her position to cringe. I think, however, for the most part, the leftist and moderate posters in this forum are far more open minded and receptive of counter arguments than the righties.

Oh well, I am sure there are people who hate me posting my long winded shit, but thats my opinion.

And your opinion means? Here let me help you




Zero,Nada,Nill,Nothing.


Whats funny is in 10 years how many of you wet behind the ear leftys will start swinging right.

[Siji]

...

And your opinion means?

In summary? More than the extent of your existance.

[Thess]

Right Rekaar, I was born into a rich family, I have literally gotten everything I have ever asked for or wanted for in my life. I made $1,000 while sleeping this morning - and yet I have trouble following you conservatives.

[Nick]

I rest my case.

[vn_Tanc]

There's almost no debate here any more due to the retards on both sides.

Any issue that is even slightly left-leaning is blown off as "anti-bush" and then the issue gets ignored in favour of mudslinging.
Any issue that is right-leaning is immediately jumped on by the hysterical left-wingers who post with more emotion than reason and then the issue gets ignoed in favour of mudslinging.
Any issue to AT ALL gets derailed into a religion/abortion debate and frankly they are boring now.

Most of the interesting voices have long gone. A few interesting lefties are still hanging around but the righties who would actually engage in some kind of adult debate are nowhere to be seen. And now we've got to the point where topics are posted where the subject matter is just used as an excuse to attack the "opposition" and this place is in the shitter.

Which is why my own posting here has tailed off lately. It's a waste of life.

[Atokal]

I made $1,000 while sleeping this morning - and yet I have trouble following you conservatives.

High priced hooker?

I seriously doubt you made $1000. Oh wait you said while sleeping then you woke up.

[Cartalas]

I made $1,000 while sleeping this morning - and yet I have trouble following you conservatives.

High priced hooker?

I seriously doubt you made $1000. Oh wait you said while sleeping then you woke up.

Hmmm Lets see Thats $1,000 a day times 5 days = $5,000 a week times that by 4 weeks, holy shit thats $20K a month!!!

Ok you take that 20k

$20,000
- 340 Mobile Home Rent
- 1,640 Electricity to run your web site (dirtywhitecrackhoes.com)

$18,020 Total Left over for Crack

Its a good gig if you can get it.

[Akaran_D]

How plesant. Let's go after one of the more intelligent and reasonable posters on the board by calling her a high priced hooker. Classy, much?

[*~*stragi*~*]

well regardless, i'm glad you post here mid.
this forum has been a huge source of entertainment over the past year... we still on for our nine o'clock thess? )))

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

well regardless, i'm glad you post here mid.
this forum has been a huge source of entertainment over the past year... we still on for our nine o'clock thess? )))

I aim to please (not in a gay way though) lol

[Winnow]

I used to make like 100,000 VVs an hour back in the day!

Now that the VV inflation has been taken care of, the hard work of this conservative has made me the richest VVer on the board! ...that and winning the electoral vote challenge!

I'm not beyond using my VVs to buy cyber but for the most part I've used them to reward resourceful or creative thinkers on this board. I'd also like to spread the wealth and help our economy out by creating some new jobs.

HELP WANTED:

EDITOR:
Currently looking for someone to edit my posts for typos and liberal biased comments. Editor position starts out at 100VVs/week.

CHEERLEADER:
Entry level position. Job entails searching for my posts each day and replying to them with positive praise and "me too's" Job pays 10 VVs per generic one liner and a bonus 10 VVs for a retaliatory flame against anyone that's flamed me in the thread.

LIBERAL HAWK:
Job requires employee to scan the current events forum and report all liberal whining via PM to me by noon each day. 50vvs/week.

VV GIRLFRIEND:
100VV/s week plus bonuses. Pretend to be my VV GF and randomly send me PMs boosting my self esteem and telling me what jerks people are for disagreeing with me.

More jobs to follow!

[Rekaar.]

I made $1,000 while sleeping this morning - and yet I have trouble following you conservatives.

High priced hooker?

I seriously doubt you made $1000. Oh wait you said while sleeping then you woke up.

Hmmm Lets see Thats $1,000 a day times 5 days = $5,000 a week times that by 4 weeks, holy shit thats $20K a month!!!

Ok you take that 20k

$20,000
- 340 Mobile Home Rent
- 1,640 Electricity to run your web site (dirtywhitecrackhoes.com)

$18,020 Total Left over for Crack

Its a good gig if you can get it.

Instead of showing everyone that you have no class, please try not to become that which you condemn. It makes me feel dirty when your view on anything agrees with mine after you both say shit like that.

[Sueven]

I'm curious as to what the hell Thess was posting about when she posted that. Is it a joke or something that I'm just totally missing, or is she really bragging on an EverQuest message board about being rich?

[Fash]

I felt it was loaded with sarcasm and I'm surprised anyone thought she was being serious..

I miss chattin with her on the phone.

[Thess]

I'm curious as to what the hell Thess was posting about when she posted that. Is it a joke or something that I'm just totally missing, or is she really bragging on an EverQuest message board about being rich?

It was a joke, loaded with sarcasm. Rekaar posted that he doesn't see how people don't understand his point of view, I posted that even being well off - I don't understand his views economically or socially.

Akaran - I told Atokal in real life I found him to be a retard, so he'll take any swing possible at me. It's not a big deal.

[Winnow]

Thess lost 300.00 or so one night in like 20 minutes gambling with me. (BJ was involved*) I felt bad, but she didn't seem to mind much. I did buy the drinks! It's all good as long as that money isn't put toward a democrat's campaign fund!







*Blackjack

[Sueven]

well that makes sense.

[Winnow]

well that makes sense.

was it supposed to?

[Thess]

Thess lost 300.00 or so one night in like 20 minutes gambling with me. (BJ was involved*) I felt bad, but she didn't seem to mind much. I did buy the drinks! It's all good as long as that money isn't put toward a democrat's campaign fund!







*Blackjack

I remember the drinks being free!

[Winnow]

Thess lost 300.00 or so one night in like 20 minutes gambling with me. (BJ was involved*) I felt bad, but she didn't seem to mind much. I did buy the drinks! It's all good as long as that money isn't put toward a democrat's campaign fund!







*Blackjack

I remember the drinks being free!

We weren't at the tables long enough to get free drinks! Red Bull/Vodka thingies from Mr. Bartender is what I recall : )

[Thess]

Oh yeah I lost to quickly.

[Kylere]

I want to have rich parents so I can be a far left liberal, or really poor parents so I can be a far right conservative!!

Damn it, I was just at the federally determined poverty line growing up so I joined the Army to build resume, got out and gota job using my skills. So I hate both fringe groups, because the one thing they both seem to think is that they know better than I how to spend my money. Both of them are wrong.

[Rekaar.]

I'm curious as to what the hell Thess was posting about when she posted that. Is it a joke or something that I'm just totally missing, or is she really bragging on an EverQuest message board about being rich?

It was a joke, loaded with sarcasm. Rekaar posted that he doesn't see how people don't understand his point of view, I posted that even being well off - I don't understand his views economically or socially.

If it was sarcasm then what the hell were you talking about? So you're not rich and still can't understand - let alone not agree with - my views? You know neither does Soros or Moore. What's your point?

Conservativism and liberalism have nothing to do with personal wealth. Both camps have a broad spectrum of participation. Any more baseless stereotypes you'd like to toss out there? Maybe kylere has a few more to throw at the wall for you.

[Rekaar.]

I want to have rich parents so I can be a far left liberal, or really poor parents so I can be a far right conservative!!

Damn it, I was just at the federally determined poverty line growing up so I joined the Army to build resume, got out and gota job using my skills. So I hate both fringe groups, because the one thing they both seem to think is that they know better than I how to spend my money. Both of them are wrong.

Are you then in favor of private SS accounts?

[Xyun]

Teeny grow the fuck up. That is all.

[archeiron]

An example for you....Arch and I go way back in EQ. We had been in 5 guilds together and spent many hours online with eachother from level 12 to 65, from 1999 to 2004. We never spoke about politics in game, but over the past year these boards drew out our distinct different philosphies and visions. He is a more articulate/liberal and I am a more crass/conservative type. We have grown apart it seems. Not on my end, but on his. I could give a shit less about all this political mumbo jumbo, because no matter what I or anyone lese on these boards thinks or says, the government and world will do as it wishes. I cherish the time Arch and I spent together in game and respect the fact he finds some of the things I say to be stupid, crass, inaccurate, etc.

As my name has been evoked, I will post a response to this particular piece of the conversation.

As Midnyte has said, he and I have known each other for five years now. His political leanings as manifested on these boards do not match with my own; this has absolutely nothing to do with my consternation as expressed in our PM exchanges.

As one of the minority of posters who takes this forum seriously (to an extent), I aspire to write intelligent, well constructed posts whenever I choose to respond. I would like to take this opportunity to once again thank everyone who has sent me a PM over the years to voice their support of my posting style.

I do not appreciate or respect those posts by certain people who label groups of posters here as incoherent idiots based upon their politcal leanings. From the left Sylvus and Teeny have been guilty of this of late and from the right Midnyte and Brother have been the chief offenders. While I do not take it personally from anyone else, it does irritate me when a supposed friend of mine chooses to refer to me as an ignorant, incoherent, inferior idiot (Editor's Note: Please appreciate the illiteration. That is all.) by virtue of my liberal ideas. I try not to personally attack anyone and I think that many of us here would get along better if we all worked harder attacking the topics not the posters in this forum.

This is a place for the free exchange of ideas and opinions. Not all of those ideas and opinions will be compatible. This confrontation can lead to heated discussion, but a healthy respect for the person on the receiving end of a lashing and their feelings would probably do everyone some good.

[Nick]

Yeah I could give a fuck Xyun.

This whether anyone wants to admit or not has been a productive thread.
I am not closed to concept of change, far from it, in fact, this thread has warmed my heart a little that we can in fact address at least partially issues that have bugged people. Not only me btw. No?

[Spang]

i'll reference this thread here:

http://veeshanvault.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12081

i don't think you're any different than the ones you claim have ruined this forum.

[Sylvus]

I do not appreciate or respect those posts by certain people who label groups of posters here as incoherent idiots based upon their politcal leanings. From the left Sylvus and Teeny have been guilty of this of late and from the right Midnyte and Brother have been the chief offenders. While I do not take it personally from anyone else, it does irritate me when a supposed friend of mine chooses to refer to me as an ignorant, incoherent, inferior idiot (Editor's Note: Please appreciate the illiteration. That is all.) by virtue of my liberal ideas. I try not to personally attack anyone and I think that many of us here would get along better if we all worked harder attacking the topics not the posters in this forum.

Huh? When did I label people for being stupid because of their political leanings? And what makes you think I'm on the left? I'm in the middle, I just like to argue against stupid people or positions that I find ridiculous, so it may appear that I take the side of the left more often than not on this board. Please note that I'm not saying that people on the right are stupid, it just so happens that many (not all) of the less-intelligent, closed-minded people on this board are, by coincidence, also conservatives.

While we're on the topic of your posting style, it's probably the most irritating style on this whole board. I take that back, it's the most irritating coherent style on this whole board; Cartalas and Xzion still have you beat in the irritation department. You seem like a pretty intelligent guy but fuck if you aren't the most condescending, tightass poster I've ever seen, or at least you come off that way.

Your posts are often less about attacking the points that people try to make than they are trying to demonstrate some sort of superiority in your logic and your ability to spot a logical fallacy. Congratulations, you've retained a good deal from your college logic class(es), do you feel entitled to a hand job or something? Just because you're "above" coming out and calling someone a douchebag doesn't mean that your subtle jabs at their inefficiency in intelligently instigating inferior idiots (Editor's note: Yeah, thanks, I learned about illiteration[sic] in 5th grade as well. FOR FUCK'S SAKE WHO MAKES AN EDITOR'S NOTE?!) aren't the same thing as coming out and directly calling them a douchebag. Maybe it's because you're British and you can't help it, but you really need to loosen up.

As my name has been evoked, I will post a response to this particular piece of the conversation.

I aspire to write intelligent, well constructed posts whenever I choose to respond. I would like to take this opportunity to once again thank everyone who has sent me a PM over the years to voice their support of my posting style.

Christ, it's like nails on a fucking chalkboard...

[Lohrno]

While we're on the topic of your posting style, it's probably the most irritating style on this whole board. I take that back, it's the most irritating coherent style on this whole board; Cartalas and Xzion still have you beat in the irritation department. You seem like a pretty intelligent guy but fuck if you aren't the most condescending, tightass poster I've ever seen, or at least you come off that way.

I don't find the way he posts to be like that at all. I've never seen Archeiron post anything condescending or tightass. I'd say he's probably one of the best posters on this board in fact. Now if we had more like him, this would be a way more interesting place. Not once have I seen him flame anyone...

Unlike 90% of the people here who when they don't have a better argument either shut up or resort to calling people a retard or ignorant.

-=Lohrno