Guns guns guns

What do you think about the world?
User avatar
Dexail
Star Farmer
Star Farmer
Posts: 380
Joined: July 4, 2002, 6:17 am
Gender: Male
Location: Georgia

Post by Dexail »

Aaeamdar wrote:Dexail,
Do you really need your poor analogy explained to you? If so, let me know and I'll be happy to baby step it for you.
Sure, walk me through it.

Let's see, You derive pleasure from seeing a hunter die from the repercussions of his activities, which you find morally wrong.

Let's say a hunter posted that he derived pleasure from seeing a gay guy die from the repercussions of his activities, which the hunter finds morally wrong. (sterotyping here)

But, the point I was trying to make is that it's asinine to find any enjoyment from anyone dying. Finding it funny or "poetic justice" that people were shot by a wacko just doesn't register with me.
User avatar
Keverian FireCry
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2919
Joined: July 3, 2002, 6:41 pm
Gender: Mangina
Location: Seattle, WA

Post by Keverian FireCry »

Uh, Cane...you either support the killing of animals or you don't. We don't. If you value creatures as more than just meat or trophies, then vegetarians ARE right. If you don't, then go ahead and hunt and continue to be numb to it. I'm just saying that it's healthier and more humane to support vegetarianism. Some people view the earth as something that belongs to all creatures, not just humans.

Of course you can argue that we are their natural predators, and we were indeed given the capability to be hunters. We were also given minds that can find alternatives tohunting are more humane and more healthy, than eating meat, and we have found that alternative.
Lynks
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2774
Joined: September 30, 2002, 6:58 pm
XBL Gamertag: launchpad1979
Location: Sudbury, Ontario

Post by Lynks »

People don't eat meat out of force of habit. We are designed to eat meat. Just look at are teeth structure.

Btw, I find it funny and very hypocritical of you to say that Christians love to focre their beliefs on others while you go around trying to push your vegetarian ways on us. And before you say you aren't, you are, not in the exact words, but what the ntire message suggests.
User avatar
Arsecn
Star Farmer
Star Farmer
Posts: 357
Joined: July 4, 2002, 6:08 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Left Field

Post by Arsecn »

Xatrei wrote:
Arsecn wrote:
I don't hunt (or fish, for that matter), own a gun, and I don't really care to.
You work in a library or are you in prison?
I don't follow this at all. I don't hunt. I don't fish. I don't own a gun. I don't care to do any of those things, but I don't see anything wrong with any of them. What does that have to do with your response?
Ok Library it is. Lighten up, unclench those cheeks. Perhaps a relaxing day of fishing will do you well.
~ 70 Troll Scourge Knight ~

"You're talking a whole lotta Jibba-Jabba."
User avatar
Canelek
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9380
Joined: July 3, 2002, 1:23 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Canelek
Location: Portland, OR

Post by Canelek »

Kev, nothing wrong with not eating meat. I am referring to the attitude that many non-meat eaters take towards hunting or the consumption of meat in general, as was blatently pointed out by dar. I am sorry, but you are not more evolved if you do not eat meat. You just have a different lifestyle, and that is fine.
en kærlighed småkager
Aaeamdar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 721
Joined: July 8, 2002, 2:18 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Post by Aaeamdar »

One is a "lifestyle" that embraces the needless tourture of animals, one is not.
User avatar
Seebs
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 1158
Joined: June 5, 2003, 3:00 pm
Gender: Male

Post by Seebs »

I eat jelly beans. Copious amounts. The Bubble Gum and Cinnamon are scrumptious ... then you suddenly get a popcorn flavored one and it ruins everything.

I don;t want to know how they're made, I just know they're good .. kinda like steak.
Seeber
looking for a WOW server
User avatar
Canelek
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9380
Joined: July 3, 2002, 1:23 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Canelek
Location: Portland, OR

Post by Canelek »

Aaeamdar wrote:One is a "lifestyle" that embraces the needless tourture of animals, one is not.
Once again, that is your opinion. You have beliefs that you are trying to broadcast as fact. There are other groups of people who do the same thing. They are so very right and everyone else is wrong.
Aaeamdar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 721
Joined: July 8, 2002, 2:18 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Post by Aaeamdar »

Btw, I find it funny and very hypocritical of you to say that Christians love to focre their beliefs on others while you go around trying to push your vegetarian ways on us.
This is also in reply to your poor analogy, Dexail.

Explain (in a different thread preferably) the hypocracy. The "Christian" beliefs I object to being legislated have nothing to do with protecting an innocent life. You'll notice I never dismiss abortion (though I am pro-choice) as merely the beliefs of wacko Christians trying to impose their beliefs on others. There are a whole host of things "Christians" support as legislation - primarily these days relating to gays, but in its history also relating to women and blacks (and to a lesser extent other non-whites) - that have nothing to do with anyhting other than trying to prevent the consentual acts (not all related to sex) of others.

Hunting and farming/meat eating is abject cruelty. Meat no longer (and has not for quite a long time now) serves any purpose in modern human society, other than the pleasure (or as I would suggest - habits) of man. The pleasure of man is, generically, something I support. But here there is another side of the equation - the wanton cruelty being inflicted on these animals. That is not something any person needs to support and getting out of the habit of eating meat is both a means to that ends and has the beneficial side effect of being much healtier.
Aaeamdar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 721
Joined: July 8, 2002, 2:18 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Post by Aaeamdar »

You have beliefs that you are trying to broadcast as fact.
How is this merely an "opinion" or "belief." Are you suggesting that hunting and farming are, in fact, not cruel to the animals? Its one thing to say "yes, hunting and farming is cruel, but I will make the judgement that I am man, and my freedoms trump that cruelty." But to suggest that the cruelty is non-existant is absurd.
User avatar
Canelek
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9380
Joined: July 3, 2002, 1:23 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Canelek
Location: Portland, OR

Post by Canelek »

Are you one of those people that goes out into the woods with air horns during hunting season? I mean really. Look at you say how horrible hunters are because you disagree with the eating of meat from animals.

Good titty-fucking christ, the PETA people ain't got nothin' on you!
en kærlighed småkager
User avatar
Xatrei
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2104
Joined: July 22, 2002, 4:28 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Boringham, AL

Post by Xatrei »

Arsecn wrote:Ok Library it is. Lighten up, unclench those cheeks. Perhaps a relaxing day of fishing will do you well.
Maybe you should go reread everything I've posted on this thread, since you appear to have misunderstood my position. Here's the Readers Digest version:

I think it's disgusting that some people in this thread think that hunters being killed is funny.

I'm not saying that people shouldn't hunt, eat meat or anything else.

I said that hunting an animal was preferable to factory meat.

I love wild game, and I think people should hunt (for food) all they want - I simply don't enjoy hunting or fishing personally.

My comments about hunting or fishing were merely in resonse to the assertion that hunting is more barbaric than farming.
"When I was a kid, my father told me, 'Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it.'" - Russel Ziskey
User avatar
Keverian FireCry
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2919
Joined: July 3, 2002, 6:41 pm
Gender: Mangina
Location: Seattle, WA

Post by Keverian FireCry »

People don't eat meat out of force of habit. We are designed to eat meat. Just look at are teeth structure.

Btw, I find it funny and very hypocritical of you to say that Christians love to focre their beliefs on others while you go around trying to push your vegetarian ways on us. And before you say you aren't, you are, not in the exact words, but what the ntire message suggests.
I know all about our teeth structure. We are omnivores, which means we have the capablity to eat both meat and vegetation. We are not carnivores though, so we have a choice. As for pushing my views, this is the only thread I've ever even discussed them in, as it fits the discussion. The reason I chose to be vegetarian is because of health benefits primarily. It truly is more healthy and I can say that because I AM far more healthy than I was under a year ago, when I still did eat meat.

My intenet was to educate on the health benefits of it, didn't think that was pushing my values. As far as being more humane, I'm not sure how you can argue against that...NOT killing an animal is more humane than killing it. As for respecting animals I didn't mean that if you ate meat you must have no respect for them, but again, you could do better.

Comparing this with christians pushing values on you is bullshit and you know better. Vegetarianism is scientifically backed as being healthier and comes from empathy towards all animals on the planet. I've never heard of vegetarians rounding up and killing people in the name of vegetarianism. I've have never heard a vegetarian say that if you eat meat you are going to burn in eternal hellfire, and if some vegetarians do think that way, then they are as fucked up as any religious fanatic. Notice I say fanatics, because I don't have a problem with christians in general, just with fanatical types.

I view the spread of vegetarianism as education working well, not as a threat in any way. I don't think people who still eat meat are bad at all, I just think they could do better, and would be better off if they stopped eating meat. I do not support any banning of hunting for food, or banning people from eating meat. I do think it's important to educate people about the alternatives, and I do think most people have far too little respect for non-human life on the planet.
Lynks
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2774
Joined: September 30, 2002, 6:58 pm
XBL Gamertag: launchpad1979
Location: Sudbury, Ontario

Post by Lynks »

That respsonse about the christianity thing wasn't meant for you. :)

But I will responde to the last paragraphs. Most vegetarians I know like to scream foul, but only when it suits them. Meat offers protein, which is something we need. Of course you can get those things from eggs, but that still boils down to animal cruelty. We also need dairy products, ie calcium. I'm sure there are other ways of getting it, but milk is the best source that I know, but again, thats still animal cruelty.

Also, why fight agaisnt our primal urges. I don't feel like supressing anything.
Sueven
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 3200
Joined: July 22, 2002, 12:36 pm

Post by Sueven »

Just an observation:

'Dar is using logically sound arguments and drawing relevant distinctions between similar actions by explaining precisely what those distinctions are in precise, specifically defined terms. His arguments are sensible an easy to follow.

The rest of you are so shocked by his opinions that you've lost any ability to discuss the issue with him rationally. You're arguing using a combination of anecdotes, hyperbole, and outrage. Virtually every response to 'Dar's posts has totally ignored the logic he uses to make his arguments.

If you don't give a shit about my opinion, feel free to dismiss it and ignore this post. I just really think that those who are just ranting at 'Dar ought to back off, look at what's been written, and try using logic to respond to it.
User avatar
Keverian FireCry
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2919
Joined: July 3, 2002, 6:41 pm
Gender: Mangina
Location: Seattle, WA

Post by Keverian FireCry »

Ahh, yeah I was starting to think it was menat for Dar. One thing tho, protein, fat, calcium, are all covered by plants. You don't need eggs, milk, or meat for any of it.

Soy, leafy green veggies, figs, almonds, sesame seeds and rice are just some of things things that have calcium.

Nuts are PACKED with protein, as well as soy, certain grains, sprouts, and beans/legumes.
Lynks
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2774
Joined: September 30, 2002, 6:58 pm
XBL Gamertag: launchpad1979
Location: Sudbury, Ontario

Post by Lynks »

Sueven wrote:The rest of you are so shocked by his opinions that you've lost any ability to discuss the issue with him rationally. You're arguing using a combination of anecdotes, hyperbole, and outrage. Virtually every response to 'Dar's posts has totally ignored the logic he uses to make his arguments.
His opinion of laughing at the people that died? Ya, thats a good argument. Should I laugh at the abortion doctors that get killed? The loss of life is nothing to laugh about, no matter what that person was doing (hunting, aborting babies) and thats why people are so shocked.
User avatar
noel
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 10003
Joined: August 22, 2002, 1:34 am
Gender: Male
Location: Calabasas, CA

Post by noel »

If a single one of you ever gets between me and a chicken breast, or me and a steak, when I'm hungry for meat, I will fucking kill you without even blinking.

Before you say it's because you're gay or because I'm Christian or whatever, you're wrong.... It will be because you got between me and a steak when I wanted a steak.

Carnivore's for life!!!

PS I liked Kev's point, and the way he presented it. I've never before read anything credible stating you can get the necessary protein an athlete needs from non animal proteins, but I'll look into it. I generally eat mostly fish and chicken to cut down on unecessary fat and cholesterol.
Oh, my God; I care so little, I almost passed out.
User avatar
Winnow
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 27764
Joined: July 5, 2002, 1:56 pm
Location: A Special Place in Hell

Post by Winnow »

I am respectfully withholding my meat eating jokes until page three!
User avatar
Aabidano
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4861
Joined: July 19, 2002, 2:23 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Florida

Post by Aabidano »

Keverian FireCry wrote:As far as being more humane, I'm not sure how you can argue against that...NOT killing an animal is more humane than killing it. As for respecting animals I didn't mean that if you ate meat you must have no respect for them, but again, you could do better.
That's not a realistic argument though, back to the subject of hunting.

Domestic animals could be allowed to die off, nature will keep creating more critters until some agency interferes, be it predators, disease, starvation, etc.. Every other alternative has been tried all over the country, and come up wanting for various reasons. I don't think there's a great hunters conspiracy of people just itching to slaughter poor bambi.
"Life is what happens while you're making plans for later."
User avatar
Dregor Thule
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 5994
Joined: July 3, 2002, 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Xathlak
PSN ID: dregor77
Location: Oakville, Ontario

Post by Dregor Thule »

I think I'll have a nice juicy steak for dinner tomorrow night.
Image
User avatar
Lohrno
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2416
Joined: July 6, 2002, 4:58 pm
Location: California
Contact:

Post by Lohrno »

Aaeamdar wrote:Its one thing to say "yes, hunting and farming is cruel, but I will make the judgement that I am man, and my freedoms trump that cruelty."
I'll go ahead and say that.

-=Lohrno
User avatar
Funkmasterr
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9022
Joined: July 7, 2002, 9:12 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Dandelo19
PSN ID: ToPsHoTTa471

Post by Funkmasterr »

WOW. There is so much retarded tree hugging hippie bullshit going on in this post, that I actually had to take notes so as not to forget any of my points on how retarded a few of you actually are.

1- Let's get this out of the way right now, I have never hunted a day in my life. I have fished.

2- If you can honestly say that you don't think hunting is necessary to control the population of deer, then you are delusional. You should do a few things; first, contact someone at the DNR and talk to them about your concern and see how swiftly your beliefs are shot down. Second, come to the midwest, especially around this time of the year.

Personally, the thought of my 25,000 dollar car being ruined by a fucking animal almost makes me want to start hunting to keep the deer off the roads. I can't drive at night this time of year without having to slam the brakes on for a deer.

3- I will make it even more simple then I was going to. You live in this country, you live by the rules, you don't like the rules LEAVE. And guess what, I see nothing about a deer or a goose having the right to anything in the constitution. Animals that need to be protected by laws, ARE.

There is a reason it's legal to hunt certain things like deer. And believe it or not flowerchildren, but that is specifically why it is legal to hunt deer and not bald eagles. Because the Eagle needs to be preserved because of it's rareness. The deer population needs to be kept under control.

I still maintain to this day that peoples right to assembly should have been ammended in the 60's or so, so that peace protesters were killed or thrown in jail for life. Then just maybe I might be able to eat a steak without hearing one of you motherfuckers calling me a murderer.


Anyhow, to the article, which was the whole point to begin with(not you ignorant peta motherfuckers opinions.)

1- Yes an sks is a common gun for hunting, if you say this is incorrect, you are wrong, there is no argument to even be had here so just shut up.

And someone on the first page doesn't know the difference between a fully auto, and a semi auto gun.

2- What I would like to know is, when the second group of morons got the call informing them of the shooting, and the trouble they were in, why the fuck did they go un-armed?

I don't happen to know if they mentioned that in the article, because I didn't read it, I just heard about this all from one of the trim carpenters who works on my site, that owns the adjacent piece of property to the one this occured on.


Lastly, I sincerely hope that any of you that thought this was funny, or said these guys deserved it, die a slow painful death, only after watching the same thing happen to everyone you care about. You are the bacteria, that grows on the fungus, that grows on the fungus, that grows on shit.
Aaeamdar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 721
Joined: July 8, 2002, 2:18 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Post by Aaeamdar »

I've never before read anything credible stating you can get the necessary protein an athlete needs from non animal proteins, but I'll look into it.
The issue for atheletes, or truely more precisely "super atheletes" is quantity. You can get the quantity of proteins you need to maintain muscle growth from neither meats nor plants. Typically, a professional athele heavily supplements his or her diet with protien powders (also, btw, typically derived from plants).

I know you are an avid biker, but have no idea if you are at or near professional level. If you are not, then the only really important supplement you need is water. If you are, then what you need is the quantities of proteins found in powder supplements. That said, IF you are interested in only consuming natural products with a high protein concentration by mass, the soy beans, not meat, is what you want.
User avatar
Lohrno
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2416
Joined: July 6, 2002, 4:58 pm
Location: California
Contact:

Post by Lohrno »

Funkmasterr wrote: 2- If you can honestly say that you don't think hunting is necessary to control the population of deer, then you are delusional. You should do a few things; first, contact someone at the DNR and talk to them about your concern and see how swiftly your beliefs are shot down. Second, come to the midwest, especially around this time of the year.

Personally, the thought of my 25,000 dollar car being ruined by a fucking animal almost makes me want to start hunting to keep the deer off the roads. I can't drive at night this time of year without having to slam the brakes on for a deer.
There are other ways, but I'm not going to say hunting should be banned. There have been some successes with Deer sterilization techniques to keep the population down.

So I think hunting isn't strictly necessary, but let the hunters have at it if they want. I do have an issue with people just littering corpses everywhere though.

-=Lohrno

PS: You can drop the trolling anytime now please. "Flowerchildren, hippie bullshit" etc.
User avatar
Lohrno
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2416
Joined: July 6, 2002, 4:58 pm
Location: California
Contact:

Post by Lohrno »

Winnow wrote:I am respectfully withholding my meat eating jokes until page three!
http://maddox.xmission.com/sponsor.html

:D

-=Lohrno
User avatar
Funkmasterr
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9022
Joined: July 7, 2002, 9:12 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Dandelo19
PSN ID: ToPsHoTTa471

Post by Funkmasterr »

I am not trolling, I honestly believe the world would be a better place without the people I was directing those comments at (And religious people, for the record). Think or say what you want, I won't lose any sleep.
User avatar
Funkmasterr
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9022
Joined: July 7, 2002, 9:12 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Dandelo19
PSN ID: ToPsHoTTa471

Post by Funkmasterr »

Ok, now I am trolling (in an attempt to hasten page 3 for Winnow). BTW, I very swiftly ordered one of those T-shirts from the link above.
User avatar
Xzion
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2567
Joined: September 22, 2002, 7:36 pm

Post by Xzion »

im a bigger gun supporter then some conservatives myself, im also against an assault weapons ban (with restrictions)

Yet i dont understand why people hunt...im honestly too big of a pussy to fish, i really do feel bad for the fish :roll:

Is it an ego thing? killing animals for no reason, sure i would understand if you did it to survive but hunters dont, i have a brother and a few uncles that are big hunters (so no discrimination) but i still see no fascination in doing so,
and dont say you do it for the enviornment or fascination with the outdoors, ive been diving since i was like 13-14 and i never felt the need to take down a spear gun with me (and thats a lot more dangerous then pussy deer hunting)
If you love the outdoors just pitch tent and get some beer

if you want to kill a wild animal i always say make it a fair fight...like you and a machete vs a rhinoceros
Last edited by Xzion on November 22, 2004, 10:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
-xzionis human mage on mannoroth
-zeltharath tauren shaman on wildhammer
User avatar
Lohrno
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2416
Joined: July 6, 2002, 4:58 pm
Location: California
Contact:

Post by Lohrno »

It's an experience, and one that has very few drawbacks for society. I've never been hunting, but I can understand.

-=Lohrno
User avatar
Canelek
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9380
Joined: July 3, 2002, 1:23 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Canelek
Location: Portland, OR

Post by Canelek »

So I think hunting isn't strictly necessary, but let the hunters have at it if they want. I do have an issue with people just littering corpses everywhere though.
Where is this happening? The littered corpses that is. If you do see an deer carcass, for instance, that has been left behind say with its antlers or head removed, that would fall under poaching as the animal is not properly tagged(harvested). Of course, state regs are different, but that one should be pretty uniform.

If people are killing for a heads, antlers, paws, whatever, they most likely are not licensed, therefore common criminals and your state's Fish and Wildlife authorities should be contacted. These type of people do give legit hunters a bad rap and should be duly punished for their illegal behavior.

--Also note that hunting organizations such as Duck's Unlimited as well as fishing organizations such as NorthWest Steelheaders and Trout Unlimited (to name a few). Are constantly working to improve our environment by organizing litter cleanups, charity benefits and take part in environmental lobbying.

- Drunken hicks wandering around in the woods firing at whatever moves are not hunters--they are drunken hicks.

As far as the PETA-types, well, most people just laugh at those extremist nonces anyways, so no biggie--best leave them to throw red paint on people wearing faux-furs.

And Kev, thank you for posting your opinions and values without pointing fingers--we all have our own view of the food web, and friendly argument is much apperciated, especially in this crowd (CE section).
en kærlighed småkager
User avatar
Mak
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 834
Joined: August 5, 2002, 4:13 pm
Location: Tucson, AZ
Contact:

Post by Mak »

So we once again have people criticizing and condemning a lifestyle in which they do not agree. We have people casually, even gleefully, dismissing the loss of human life. We have an intolerant, inflexible, and unapologetic personal belief that led to attacks on others that do not hold to that same belief.

It all goes to show that we are all the same; no person is superior in their attitudes, reactions, level of enlightenment, or understanding. Apparently, if we feel we hold the moral high ground on a particular point, that alone is sufficient justification to deride and ridicule another person or a social/political viewpoint.

I am not one to throw the hypocrite card lightly, but we have seen a ton of it on this thread.
Makora

Too often it seems it is the peaceful and innocent who are slaughtered. In this a lesson may be found that it may not be prudential to be either too peaceful or too innocent. One does not survive with wolves by becoming a sheep.
User avatar
noel
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 10003
Joined: August 22, 2002, 1:34 am
Gender: Male
Location: Calabasas, CA

Post by noel »

Aaeamdar wrote:I know you are an avid biker, but have no idea if you are at or near professional level. If you are not, then the only really important supplement you need is water. If you are, then what you need is the quantities of proteins found in powder supplements. That said, IF you are interested in only consuming natural products with a high protein concentration by mass, the soy beans, not meat, is what you want.
I take several supplements including a BCAA supplement.

That said, I like the taste of steak, chicken, and fish.
Oh, my God; I care so little, I almost passed out.
User avatar
Aabidano
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4861
Joined: July 19, 2002, 2:23 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Florida

Post by Aabidano »

The Larch:

Image
"Life is what happens while you're making plans for later."
User avatar
Aabidano
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4861
Joined: July 19, 2002, 2:23 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Florida

Post by Aabidano »

Bleh, was hoping for page 3
"Life is what happens while you're making plans for later."
Ramseis
No Stars!
Posts: 36
Joined: July 10, 2002, 12:58 pm

Post by Ramseis »

One thing you all seem to be grouping is farmers all into the same boat. You can't just like you can't put all hunters in the same boat.

There is a huge difference between the 100,000 head feed lots and a 100 head farm/ranch. If you need to know the difference drive by the two of them and take a deep smell.

Deer sterilization may work if you can find every mature buck and give him a shot. Theres a reason they are mature bucks they are smart. If you want to ever see a reason why hunting should be allowed drive I-29 from Lincoln, NE to Kansas City, MO. The one and only time I went roundtrip there were a total of roughly 50 deer carcases (sp) and plenty other blood stains on the highway.

And people wonder why my insurance rates are so high.
User avatar
Xzion
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2567
Joined: September 22, 2002, 7:36 pm

Post by Xzion »

Mak wrote:So we once again have people criticizing and condemning a lifestyle in which they do not agree. We have people casually, even gleefully, dismissing the loss of human life. We have an intolerant, inflexible, and unapologetic personal belief that led to attacks on others that do not hold to that same belief.

It all goes to show that we are all the same; no person is superior in their attitudes, reactions, level of enlightenment, or understanding. Apparently, if we feel we hold the moral high ground on a particular point, that alone is sufficient justification to deride and ridicule another person or a social/political viewpoint.

I am not one to throw the hypocrite card lightly, but we have seen a ton of it on this thread.
if you talking about my point i can show you the difference

I dont want to ban hunting, i want hunters to have even more rights then they have now in the sport of hunting...at the same time i wonder why people do it...huntings not for me, but if its your thing i think you should have every right to do so...
others (paticularly conservatives, some liberals too) have a mentality of- "i dont like it, so i want it banned and noone else should enjoy it, everyone must think like me, free thought and diversity are not accepted"
-xzionis human mage on mannoroth
-zeltharath tauren shaman on wildhammer
User avatar
Denadeb
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 658
Joined: July 14, 2002, 6:45 pm
Location: Jacksonville, Fl.
Contact:

Post by Denadeb »

People that actually buy hunting and fishing lic. do more to preserve wildlife than most people that don't hunt and fish. Those Lic. are expensive for a reason and thinking hunting and fishing doesn't control poulations is just plain crazy.
Image
User avatar
Thess
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 1036
Joined: July 4, 2002, 1:34 am
Location: Connecticut

Post by Thess »

Canelek killed bambi's mom :(
User avatar
Xyun
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2566
Joined: July 3, 2002, 8:03 pm
Location: Treasure Island

Post by Xyun »

A true hunter shouldn't need a gun to kill his prey. The argument that the human race survived by hunting and therefore it is now acceptable only works if it doesn't involve guns. I'm not against hunting, though.

Image


DELICIOUS!!
I tell it like a true mackadelic.
Founder of Ixtlan - the SCUM of Veeshan.
User avatar
Canelek
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 9380
Joined: July 3, 2002, 1:23 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: Canelek
Location: Portland, OR

Post by Canelek »

Thess wrote:Canelek killed bambi's mom :(
:( sorry darlin' :(

Actually, I have never killed 'big game' so to speak. I used to go bird hunting outside of San Antonio in the late 80s.... My one deer hunting venture that I spoke of this year was futile, due to the proximity to a metro area.

But do not worry! :D I will save some lovely backstraps or jerky for you if ya want. :D

I do much prefer fishing over hunting though. Something about the rush of a river and the moan of the wind through the trees...good stuff with or without fish. ;)
en kærlighed småkager
Aaeamdar
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 721
Joined: July 8, 2002, 2:18 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

Post by Aaeamdar »

Something about the rush of a river and the moan of the wind through the trees...good stuff with or without fish.
I agree. So next time you go, leave the fish alone. :)
People that actually buy hunting and fishing lic. do more to preserve wildlife than most people that don't hunt and fish. Those Lic. are expensive for a reason
So, because the government has a specific tax on hunting and fishing (by way of licenses) - a tax that would come from some other source if not from hunting and fishing licenses and a tax hunters and fishers would not volunteer if not required to pay as part of a license to tourture animals - you conclude that they are all doing wonders for the preservation of wildlife. Interesting.
and thinking hunting and fishing doesn't control poulations is just plain crazy.
Yes it would be. Its irrelevant, but yes, it would be crazy to think that hunting and fishing does not reduce the population of the species being killed. It would also be crazy to think that birth control does not reduce the number of those creatures born. Neither statement on its own has any meaning other than the blanket obvious truths they contain. The question is not whether shooting animals reduces their population. The question is - what is the best way to control an animal population factoring in cost, effectiveness, environmental impact, and cruelty to the targetted population. I am sure there are other factors as well, but those four are fairly obvious.

Some cities have problems with stray cats and dogs, for example, but I don't know anyone that would advocate as a solution to that problem licenseing out the right to hunt and kill them. Many cities have a catch, sterilize and release policy. All of those that do not do that use a pound system - where, sadly, most of the captured the animals are ultimately killed. Not a single city has anything resembling a dog hunting license. If you want to argue that the only reason the population of dogs and cats are not kept in check by hunting is because of the dangers of hunting in urban environments, feel free. I am sure you know how stupid that response would be.

For some reason, however, the compasion man (at least in the United States) is willing to extend to dogs and cats it is not willing to extend to any other animals. I'll enjoy reading any rational argument someone wants to present for this distinction.
User avatar
Xzion
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2567
Joined: September 22, 2002, 7:36 pm

Post by Xzion »

Canelek wrote:
Thess wrote:Canelek killed bambi's mom :(
:( sorry darlin' :(

Actually, I have never killed 'big game' so to speak. I used to go bird hunting outside of San Antonio in the late 80s.... My one deer hunting venture that I spoke of this year was futile, due to the proximity to a metro area.

But do not worry! :D I will save some lovely backstraps or jerky for you if ya want. :D

I do much prefer fishing over hunting though. Something about the rush of a river and the moan of the wind through the trees...good stuff with or without fish. ;)
I agree, but for that rush i would rather use one of these http://kawasaki.com/index2.asp and leave my fishing pole at home 8)
-xzionis human mage on mannoroth
-zeltharath tauren shaman on wildhammer
User avatar
Kilmoll the Sexy
Super Poster!
Super Poster!
Posts: 5295
Joined: July 3, 2002, 3:31 pm
Gender: Male
XBL Gamertag: bunkeru2k
Location: Ohio

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

You are so uneducated about what hunting is and does that I really should not even bother. You probably won't take the dick out of your mouth long enough to read it anyway.

Hunters are actually responsible for the proliferation of many endangered species. The money collected by hunting and fishing licenses is what give the state and federal government the money to ensure that species that had problems due to human expansion could make a comeback. Whitetail deer were at one point in very limited supply due to being overhunted for food. They are now so overpopulated due to the lack of natural predators and the lack of hunters that it is causing disease (chronic wasting....look it up).

Deer are mean to be no more than 20 per square mile naturally. In most of Ohio, they are numbering in the vicinity of 200 per square mile. They are causing BILLIONS of dollars annually in damage with cars. Deer are also now causing an average of 200 human deaths a year in collisions with vehicles. 200 human deaths. What price do you put on human life? With no natural predators, this number has gone up every year for the last 10....and so far this year it will be another record high. Sooooo.....in Cincinnati, due to your uneducated imbecilic types, there are not enough deer being harvested by hunters. How do they stop the problem from being out of control? They hire sharpshooters to come in and gun down hundreds of them.....they donate the meat to shelters. Of course, they don't make the money from license sales and thus the state loses wildlife management funds.

You seriously need to do some research on DNR sites to see what good hunters really do.
User avatar
Zaelath
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4621
Joined: April 11, 2003, 5:53 am
Location: Canberra

Post by Zaelath »

I bet a lot of those deaths are due to ya'll being tailgating jackasses.
May 2003 - "Mission Accomplished"
June 2005 - "The mission isn't easy, and it will not be accomplished overnight"
-- G W Bush, freelance writer for The Daily Show.
User avatar
Sylvos
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 1828
Joined: July 7, 2002, 2:55 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Portland, OR
Contact:

Post by Sylvos »

Dregor Thule wrote:I think I'll have a nice juicy steak for dinner tomorrow night.

Dar has a nice juicy tubesteak every night.
Image
Lynks
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 2774
Joined: September 30, 2002, 6:58 pm
XBL Gamertag: launchpad1979
Location: Sudbury, Ontario

Post by Lynks »

6th hunter died.

This is getting even more hilarious* by the minute!!!





*not really hilarious.
User avatar
Aabidano
Way too much time!
Way too much time!
Posts: 4861
Joined: July 19, 2002, 2:23 pm
Gender: Male
Location: Florida

Post by Aabidano »

/pharm
"Life is what happens while you're making plans for later."
Burke
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 621
Joined: July 25, 2002, 3:13 pm

Post by Burke »

Nuts are PACKED with protein, as well as soy, certain grains, sprouts, and beans/legumes
But A1 doesn't taste good on them.



Who am I kidding, A1 tastes good on everything.

Seriously, though:
So killing is intrinsically cruel? I don't agree.
Toshira
Almost 1337
Almost 1337
Posts: 724
Joined: July 23, 2002, 7:49 pm
Location: White Flight Land, USA

Post by Toshira »

Some facts.

The hunters were on a 400 square acre lot of private land. It was surrounded by public land. In Sconni', there are tree stands for hunters on public land that are first come, first serve. "No Trespassing" signs do not have to be posted on private lands to prevent hunters from hunting there.

What might have happened:

Hmong man and honky hunter have a dispute over A) who's tree stand it is or B) who's land it is (or both, could have been confusion on either party's part). Add one language barrier + military training in Laos + semi-automatic weapon and boom.

It's a good thing the NRA is fighting to keep my 20 round clips, cause apparently he is indicating he wouldn't have stopped shooting if he didn't run out of ammo in his clip.
There is not enough disk space available to delete this file, please delete some files to free up disk space.
Post Reply