Don't let Kerry re-write history

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

We ask every nation to join us. We will ask, and we will need, the help of police forces, intelligence services, and banking systems around the world. The United States is grateful that many nations and many international organizations have already responded -- with sympathy and with support. Nations from Latin America, to Asia, to Africa, to Europe, to the Islamic world. Perhaps the NATO Charter reflects best the attitude of the world: An attack on one is an attack on all.

Iraq continues to flaunt its hostility toward America and to support terror. The Iraqi regime has plotted to develop anthrax, and nerve gas, and nuclear weapons for over a decade. This is a regime that has already used poison gas to murder thousands of its own citizens -- leaving the bodies of mothers huddled over their dead children. This is a regime that agreed to international inspections -- then kicked out the inspectors. This is a regime that has something to hide from the civilized world.

States like these, and their terrorist allies, constitute an axis of evil, arming to threaten the peace of the world. By seeking weapons of mass destruction, these regimes pose a grave and growing danger. They could provide these arms to terrorists, giving them the means to match their hatred. They could attack our allies or attempt to blackmail the United States. In any of these cases, the price of indifference would be catastrophic.

We will work closely with our coalition to deny terrorists and their state sponsors the materials, technology, and expertise to make and deliver weapons of mass destruction. We will develop and deploy effective missile defenses to protect America and our allies from sudden attack. (Applause.) And all nations should know: America will do what is necessary to ensure our nation's security.

We'll be deliberate, yet time is not on our side. I will not wait on events, while dangers gather. I will not stand by, as peril draws closer and closer. The United States of America will not permit the world's most dangerous regimes to threaten us with the world's most destructive weapons. (Applause.)

[Asheran Mojomaster]

Ok ok, so I take it this is something Kerry said after 9\11? If so, sure, thats 100% right, we were attacked, we had to respond, but if you are trying to say this was in support of invading Iraq, then you are an idiot. As it has been stated more times than I can count, Iraq and 9\11 had NO CONNECTION AT ALL...actually based on this people should be banding together to attack us as an attack on 1 is an attack on all! And we fucking attacked Iraq for no reason.

[Forthe]

You have some kind of point Midnyte?

And how about linking your sources when you quote something.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Ok ok, so I take it this is something Kerry said after 9\11? If so, sure, thats 100% right, we were attacked, we had to respond, but if you are trying to say this was in support of invading Iraq, then you are an idiot. As it has been stated more times than I can count, Iraq and 9\11 had NO CONNECTION AT ALL...actually based on this people should be banding together to attack us as an attack on 1 is an attack on all! And we fucking attacked Iraq for no reason.

Saddam stokes war with suicide bomber cash
March 26 2002




The Iraqi leader's payments to the families of dead Palestinian terrorists means more trouble for Yasser Arafat, writes Paul McGeough in the West Bank.


The hall was packed and the intake of breath was audible as a special announcement was made to the war widows of the West Bank - Saddam Hussein would pay $US25,000 ($47,000) to the family of each suicide bomber as an enticement for others to volunteer for martyrdom in the name of the Palestinian people.

The men at the top table then opened Saddam's chequebook and, as the names of 47 martyrs were called, family representatives went up to sign for cheques written in US dollars.

Those of two suicide bombers were the first to be paid the new rate of $US25,000 and those whose relatives had died in other clashes with the Israeli military were given $US10,000 each.

The $US500,000 doled out in this impoverished community yesterday means that the besieged Iraqi leader now has contributed more than $US10 million to grieving Palestinian families since the new intifada began 18 months ago.

But the timing of this clear signal that Saddam is stoking the Middle East conflict with his new $US15,000 bonus to encourage more suicide bombers - and exclusive pictures from the distribution ceremony, which was attended by the Herald - could make it more difficult for the Palestinian leader, Yasser Arafat, to manage his already strained relationship with the United States.


Because the Palestinians and the Israelis have been unable to agree to a ceasefire during the US-brokered talks that began in Jerusalem two weeks ago, Mr Arafat may be denied an opportunity to put the Palestinian case directly to the US Vice-President, Dick Cheney.

As well, the Israelis have yet to decide if they will lift Mr Arafat's effective house arrest to allow him to travel to Beirut for this week's summit of Arab leaders that is to discuss a Saudi Arabian plan to end the crisis.

And now, the US and Israel will have the opportunity to accuse Mr Arafat of being in the embrace of two of President Bush's three "axis of evil" countries, Iraq and Iran.

The New York Times reported on Saturday the suspicion of US and Israeli intelligence agencies that Mr Arafat had developed an alliance with Iran to import weapons worth millions of dollars to be used by Palestinian fighters.

Mr Arafat has denied any knowledge of a recent shipment of Iranian arms seized by the Israelis on its way to Palestine.

But he may be hard pressed to deny knowledge of a public ceremony on his own territory, during which supporters of Saddam handed out $US500,000 and encouraged others to become suicide bombers with the blessing of the Iraqi leader.

The US will also be keen to use Saddam's provocative intrusion into the Palestinian-Israeli conflict as another reason for its planned military strike against him.

Yesterday's ceremony at Tulkarm, about 90 kilometres north of Jerusalem, was the first public distribution organised by the Arab Liberation Front, a small PLO faction closely aligned with Saddam's Ba'ath Party. Previously, the cheques were delivered privately by officials of the front to the homes of martyr families.

A senior front official, Ma'amoon Tayeh, said that the extra $US15,000 was to encourage more Palestinians to volunteer as suicide bombers to help "confirm the legitimacy of our national questions".

He said: "Saddam Hussein considers Palestine to be a governate of Iraq and he thinks the same of the Palestinian martyrs as he does of Iraqi martyrs - they all are martyrs for the whole Arab nation."

Dr Hassan Khraisheh, a member of the Palestinian Legislative Council who told the crowd he had just returned from a solidarity conference in Baghdad, said some families believed the money should be sent back to Iraq because of the hardships imposed by sanctions; others used the money to " buy weapons to defend Palestine".

Later, he praised Iraq as the only Arab country officially donating to the Palestinian cause.

"The Saudis used to give $US4000 to the martyrs, but now it depends on public donations.

"Saddam Hussein's $US25,000 is a message to those who might offer themselves as martyrs that their families will be supported ..."

Yeah you're right. Saddam didn't support terrorism at all. We had no right at all.

[Kelshara]

Well first of all, he said 9/11 had nothing to do with Iraq. Which it had not. Secondly, if you go after Saddam for supporting suicide bombers in Iraq you need to go after the US for supporting IRA in Northern Ireland.

[Asheran Mojomaster]

Ok ok, so I take it this is something Kerry said after 9\11? If so, sure, thats 100% right, we were attacked, we had to respond, but if you are trying to say this was in support of invading Iraq, then you are an idiot. As it has been stated more times than I can count, Iraq and 9\11 had NO CONNECTION AT ALL...actually based on this people should be banding together to attack us as an attack on 1 is an attack on all! And we fucking attacked Iraq for no reason.

Saddam stokes war with suicide bomber cash
March 26 2002




The Iraqi leader's payments to the families of dead Palestinian terrorists means more trouble for Yasser Arafat, writes Paul McGeough in the West Bank.


The hall was packed and the intake of breath was audible as a special announcement was made to the war widows of the West Bank - Saddam Hussein would pay $US25,000 ($47,000) to the family of each suicide bomber as an enticement for others to volunteer for martyrdom in the name of the Palestinian people.

The men at the top table then opened Saddam's chequebook and, as the names of 47 martyrs were called, family representatives went up to sign for cheques written in US dollars.

Those of two suicide bombers were the first to be paid the new rate of $US25,000 and those whose relatives had died in other clashes with the Israeli military were given $US10,000 each.

The $US500,000 doled out in this impoverished community yesterday means that the besieged Iraqi leader now has contributed more than $US10 million to grieving Palestinian families since the new intifada began 18 months ago.

But the timing of this clear signal that Saddam is stoking the Middle East conflict with his new $US15,000 bonus to encourage more suicide bombers - and exclusive pictures from the distribution ceremony, which was attended by the Herald - could make it more difficult for the Palestinian leader, Yasser Arafat, to manage his already strained relationship with the United States.


Because the Palestinians and the Israelis have been unable to agree to a ceasefire during the US-brokered talks that began in Jerusalem two weeks ago, Mr Arafat may be denied an opportunity to put the Palestinian case directly to the US Vice-President, Dick Cheney.

As well, the Israelis have yet to decide if they will lift Mr Arafat's effective house arrest to allow him to travel to Beirut for this week's summit of Arab leaders that is to discuss a Saudi Arabian plan to end the crisis.

And now, the US and Israel will have the opportunity to accuse Mr Arafat of being in the embrace of two of President Bush's three "axis of evil" countries, Iraq and Iran.

The New York Times reported on Saturday the suspicion of US and Israeli intelligence agencies that Mr Arafat had developed an alliance with Iran to import weapons worth millions of dollars to be used by Palestinian fighters.

Mr Arafat has denied any knowledge of a recent shipment of Iranian arms seized by the Israelis on its way to Palestine.

But he may be hard pressed to deny knowledge of a public ceremony on his own territory, during which supporters of Saddam handed out $US500,000 and encouraged others to become suicide bombers with the blessing of the Iraqi leader.

The US will also be keen to use Saddam's provocative intrusion into the Palestinian-Israeli conflict as another reason for its planned military strike against him.

Yesterday's ceremony at Tulkarm, about 90 kilometres north of Jerusalem, was the first public distribution organised by the Arab Liberation Front, a small PLO faction closely aligned with Saddam's Ba'ath Party. Previously, the cheques were delivered privately by officials of the front to the homes of martyr families.

A senior front official, Ma'amoon Tayeh, said that the extra $US15,000 was to encourage more Palestinians to volunteer as suicide bombers to help "confirm the legitimacy of our national questions".

He said: "Saddam Hussein considers Palestine to be a governate of Iraq and he thinks the same of the Palestinian martyrs as he does of Iraqi martyrs - they all are martyrs for the whole Arab nation."

Dr Hassan Khraisheh, a member of the Palestinian Legislative Council who told the crowd he had just returned from a solidarity conference in Baghdad, said some families believed the money should be sent back to Iraq because of the hardships imposed by sanctions; others used the money to " buy weapons to defend Palestine".

Later, he praised Iraq as the only Arab country officially donating to the Palestinian cause.

"The Saudis used to give $US4000 to the martyrs, but now it depends on public donations.

"Saddam Hussein's $US25,000 is a message to those who might offer themselves as martyrs that their families will be supported ..."

Yeah you're right. Saddam didn't support terrorism at all. We had no right at all.

I didn't say anything about Saddam supporting or not supporting terrorism, I said we were never fucking attacked or threatened by him at all and he had no involvement in 9\11.

Also, ya know, I don't really fucking count suicide bombers between Israel and Palestine as terrorists. Just because the people, not just the military, are involved in that war doesn't make it terrorism. And really, I think Palestine is in the right there, Israel shouldn't even be a fucking country.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

You sad pathetic people. Do you really need a fucking map for everything?

9/11 increased our awareness of global terrorism. It was the fucking catalyst. So, to people who have a brain, Iraq makes total fucking sense.

[Hoarmurath]

The invasion of Iraq was necessary in order to promote globalization.

[Animale]

You sad pathetic people. Do you really need a fucking map for everything?

9/11 increased our awareness of global terrorism. It was the fucking catalyst. So, to people who have a brain, Iraq makes total fucking sense.

Hehe... yep, Iraq makes total fucking sense if I was a terrorist who wanted to open up a whole new area for soldier recruitment and safe bases of operation.

Animale

[Truant]

You sad pathetic people. Do you really need a fucking map for everything?

9/11 increased our awareness of global terrorism. It was the fucking catalyst. So, to people who have a brain, Iraq makes total fucking sense.

I would say for the majority of America, which happens to be relatively stupid and unaware of global events that that statement is true. Plenty of us here, however, were completely aware of global terrorism before 9/11.

I'm not sure what that has to do with Iraq though. Or what point you are trying to make for that matter. Maybe explaining it instead of labelling us with insults would help your argument better.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Maybe explaining it instead of labelling us with insults would help your argument better.

Nope. I've tried that. I only got labeled myself. So, I'll just revert back to being painfully honest with you pathetic people.

FYI: The source is Bush's State of the Union address in Sept. 2001. Through all the bullshit from Kerry and his clan, sometimes the feeble minded forget what really happened and was said.

It's Kerry's entire mindset. He speaks as if media recording devices don't exist. Problem is most people won't remember or go look for what the true time line of events are.

Iraq/Saddam supported terrorism. The US said any country harboring terrorists will be dealt with. Iraq is being dealt with. End of fucking story.

[Akaran_D]

What terrorists did they support, Mid?

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

What terrorists did they support, Mid?

Scroll up and read.

[miir]

What terrorists did they support, Mid?

The same ones that every other arab country in the middle east supports.

[Akaran_D]

So a few suicide bombers in another non-us coutnry that hasn't struck out at the US yet is teh terrorist link you need?

You know there are countless of orginizations in the US that do the same thing too, right?

[Splatter]

Curious myself I did a search. Here is what I found. I can not confirm the validity of the information although I found multiple sources.

Among the rabid, anti-American killers found in Iraq was Palestinian terrorist Abu Nidal, whose gang murdered 407 people (including ten Americans) and maimed 788 more in attacks in 20 countries; he reportedly “committed suicide” in August 2002 in Baghdad by shooting himself in the head four times. He had taken refuge in Iraq since 1999. Experts speculate that Saddam may have been cleaning up loose ends as the American government probed his terror links.

One of Abu Nidal Organization’s attacks included the bombing over the Ionian Sea of a TWA airliner flying from Israel to Greece in 1974 which killed all 88 people on board. His group was also famous for attacking a TWA ticket counter at Rome’s Leonardo Da Vinci airport in 1986 and targeting Lt. Col. Oliver North for death in the mid-1980s.

Khala Khadar al Salahat, a member of ANO, surrendered to the First Marine Division in Baghdad on April 18, 2003. According to an August 25, 2002 report in the Sunday Times of London, a Palestinian source claimed that Salahat and Nidal had furnished Libyan agents the Semtex (plastic explosive) bomb that destroyed Pan American Flight 103 over Lockerbie Scotland in 1988. Among the 259 persons killed in the air and 11 killed on the ground were 35 American college students.

Another vicious terrorist found in Iraq was Abu Abbas, who was captured by US Special Forces just outside Baghdad on April 14, 2003. He had been living there under Iraqi protection since 2002. Abbas was the mastermind behind the 1985 hijacking of the Italian cruise ship Achilles Lauro in the Mediterranean.

We should recall that during that terrorist attack, Abbas’s men shot Leon Klinghoffer, a retired 69-year old American, in cold blood before rolling him in his wheelchair into the sea. Importantly, Italian authorities had detained Abbas briefly at the time but released him because he held an Iraqi diplomatic passport.

Ramzi Yousef, the Iraqi architect of the 1993 World Trade Center (WTC) bombing which killed six persons and wounded 1,042 others, entered America on an Iraqi passport before fleeing after the attack on Pakistani papers.

Abdul Rahman Yasin, indicted for mixing the chemicals in that WTC bombing, and still on the FBI’s Most Wanted Terrorists list, fled to Baghdad after the attack and lived there for years afterwards.

Murdock adds that according Richard Miniter, author of this year’s bestselling book, Losing Bin Laden, documents discovered by US forces in Tikrit, Saddam’s hometown, showed that the Iraqi government gave Yasin both a house and a salary.

Saddam’s terror links were most recently and openly on display in conjunction with Palestinian terror groups. In March 2002, Iraq’s former deputy prime minister, Tariq Aziz announced publicly at a meeting in Baghdad that Saddam Hussein would raise the reward given to the families of Palestinian “martyrs’ (i.e.; suicide bomb terrorists) from $10,000 per family to $25,000.

On March 12, 2003, just eight days prior to the US-led assault on Iraq, Knight-Ridder reported from Gaza City that at a ceremony organized by the Saddam-backed Arab Liberation Front, “the families of 22 Palestinians killed fighting the Israelis each received checks for $10,000 or more, certificates of appreciation and a kiss on each cheek—compliments of Saddam Hussein.”

Hussein’s largesse proved increasingly deadly. According to Murdock, between March 2002 and March 2003 when the US forces closed own Saddam's "Terror, Inc.," 28 Palestinian homicide bombers killed 223 innocent people including 12 Americans, and injured 1,209 others.

And while Bill Clinton’s former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright boldly declared in October 2003 that: she “never believed the link between Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden. Al Qaeda, and Islamic terrorism,” clues to those links too have been confirmed.

Murdock shows that Abu Musab al Zarqawi, who previously ran an al Qaeda training camp in Afghanistan and is currently at large, fled to Iraq and received medical care in Baghdad shortly after the Taliban fell. He then opened an Ansar al-Islam terrorist camp in northern Iraq and reportedly arranged the October 2002 assassination of US diplomat Lawrence Foley in Jordan. He has since been liinked to terror attacks against American troops in Iraq.

Back in January of 2002 Nawaz al-Hamzi and Khalid al-Midhar (9-11 hijackers who slammed American Airlines flight 77 into the Pentagon, killing 216 people) reportedly met Iraqi diplomat and VIP airport greeter Ahmed Hikmat Shakir in Kula Lampur, Malaysia. Shakir reportedly then escorted them to an al Qaeda 9-11 planning meeting. Shakir was arrested in Qatar six days after 9-11. Authorities then discovered documents linking him to the 1993 WTC bombing and al Qaeda’s plot to blow up 12 American jets over the Pacific Ocean.

Significantly, a Clinton-appointed Manhattan federal judge, Harold Baer, recently ordered Saddam Hussein, his ousted regime, Osama bin Laden, and others to pay $104 million in damages to the families of the 2,750 victims of the 9-11 attacks on the Twin Towers. He found “by evidence satisfactory to the court, that Iraq provided material support to bin Laden and al Qaeda.”

[vn_Tanc]

You sad pathetic people. Do you really need a fucking map for everything?

9/11 increased our awareness of global terrorism. It was the fucking catalyst. So, to people who have a brain, Iraq makes total fucking sense.

OK brainiac, riddle me this.
Your own government has stated it's goal is to SPECIFICALLY target INTERNATIONAL terrorism (entirely to get around the NORAID controversy). Hamas is a local terror group, NOT international.
So how do you continue to have the gall to claim justification?

[miir]

I can not confirm the validity of the information although I found multiple sources

Pretty much most of what is in that quote is wrong.
I recommend sourcing your information and quotes before posting them.

Op-Ed pieces from nutjob sites like townhall.com ond moveon.org are never taken seriously.

[Marbus]

He can't Tanc...

[*~*stragi*~*]

100 vv's to anyone able to draw the funniest MSPaint picture of the fantasy reality Midnyte seems to be living in.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

You sad pathetic people. Do you really need a fucking map for everything?

9/11 increased our awareness of global terrorism. It was the fucking catalyst. So, to people who have a brain, Iraq makes total fucking sense.

OK brainiac, riddle me this.
Your own government has stated it's goal is to SPECIFICALLY target INTERNATIONAL terrorism (entirely to get around the NORAID controversy). Hamas is a local terror group, NOT international.
So how do you continue to have the gall to claim justification?

Oh. Hamas has it in their charter they will not commit international terrorism? I didn't know that. A group of killers like this should and must be trusted to only propagate local murder and violence. I got ya. Good point. Boy you showed me.

[Tenuvil]

100 vv's to anyone able to draw the funniest MSPaint picture of the fantasy reality Midnyte seems to be living in.

It's too complex and disturbing to be captured in MS Paint.

I think drawings of Jesus and GWB rendered in finger-painted feces on the wall would capture Midnyte's reality well enough.

[vn_Tanc]

Oh. Hamas has it in their charter they will not commit international terrorism? I didn't know that. A group of killers like this should and must be trusted to only propagate local murder and violence. I got ya. Good point. Boy you showed me.

Now replace "Hamas" with "The IRA" and re-read that sentence. If you still think it holds I'll be waiting for you to take action against all the citizens and organizations in the US who openly donated cash and support to Irish terrorists for decades.
Am I getting through yet?

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Oh. Hamas has it in their charter they will not commit international terrorism? I didn't know that. A group of killers like this should and must be trusted to only propagate local murder and violence. I got ya. Good point. Boy you showed me.

Now replace "Hamas" with "The IRA" and re-read that sentence. If you still think it holds I'll be waiting for you to take action against all the citizens and organizations in the US who openly donated cash and support to Irish terrorists for decades.
Am I getting through yet?

Dissension within the IRA over support for the Northern Ireland peace process resulted in the formation of two more radical splinter groups: Continuity IRA in 1995 and the Real IRA in 1997. Until its cease-fire in July 1997, the Provisional IRA had sought to remove British forces from Northern Ireland and unify Ireland by force. In July 2002, the IRA reiterated its commitment to the peace process and apologized to the families of what it called “non-combatants” who had been killed or injured by the IRA. The IRA is organized into small, tightly knit cells under the leadership of the Army Council.

In October 2003, the IRA conducted a third act of arms decommissioning that the Independent International Commission on Decommissioning (IICD) called “considerably larger” than the previous IRA move. The group disposed of light, medium, and heavy weapons, ammunition, and explosives. The IRA retains the ability to conduct paramilitary operations. The IRA’s extensive criminal activities reportedly provide the organizations with millions of dollars each year.

Try comparing apples to apples before you spooge yourself thinking you made an excellent point.

[Kelshara]

hahaha yeah after all, the long period of time when IRA was funded by Americans is irrelevant! It was Americans after all!

[Krurk]

Yea we done good, taking out that tyranical despot who was ready to wipe out the western world with his armada of nuclear armed UAV's.


But back in reality...

Thanks to Emperor Bush fucking around in Iraq, we now have a bigger problem. You see, Iran and North Korea actually HAVE nuclear weapon programs and missiles with a range greater then the 150ish mile scuds Saddam was hiding in broad daylight.

Source - http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/485352.html

I hope that is a nice, conservative news source for you. I could not find any articles on Fox's site.

Now the problem is why should Iran and North Korea fear an American response? We are bogged down in Iraq without significant means of shiftin forces to either country to present the force ratio that the Pentagon requires to engange in a conventional war. Meanwhile, Iran and North Korea, along with our ass buddy Pakistan will work together on developing the missile technology to turn their current missiles into INTER FUCKING CONTINENTAL MISSILES capable of hitting your corner of Dumbfuck, America.

It just warms the cockles of my heart knowing that Iran can flip us the bird with the US sitting on their doorstep, KNOWING we can't do shit.

And for those of you who said fuck France and all the other asshole Europeans, do you think they will come to our aid now against Iran after seeing the world class clusterfuck we arranged in Iraq?

Yea, I feel safer already

[Splatter]

I can not confirm the validity of the information although I found multiple sources

Pretty much most of what is in that quote is wrong.
I recommend sourcing your information and quotes before posting them.

Op-Ed pieces from nutjob sites like townhall.com ond moveon.org are never taken seriously.

You need to pull your head out of the sand and do some reading yourself. I managed to find all but one item being reported by the main stream (CNN, CBS, BBC, ect...) media.

[miir]

I can not confirm the validity of the information although I found multiple sources

Pretty much most of what is in that quote is wrong.
I recommend sourcing your information and quotes before posting them.

Op-Ed pieces from nutjob sites like townhall.com ond moveon.org are never taken seriously.

You need to pull your head out of the sand and do some reading yourself. I managed to find all but one item being reported by the main stream (CNN, CBS, BBC, ect...) media.

Provide soem quotes from reliable sources please.
The shit you posted is op-ed from townhall.com

[Splatter]

Do some research, your the one that said the facts were wrong.

[miir]

Do some research, your the one that said the facts were wrong.

I did, shithead.
You should do the same.


The truth is, you cannot find a credible news source to corroborate the claims made in that 'article'.

[Brotha]

I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat.

Five bucks if someone can tell me who said that and when.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

And for those of you who said fuck France and all the other asshole Europeans, do you think they will come to our aid now against Iran after seeing the world class clusterfuck we arranged in Iraq?

Nov 12, 1997: In response to a question about unanimity over a U.N. resolution, kerry responded: where's the backbone of Russia, where's the backbone of France, where are they in expressing their condemnation of such clearly illegal activity, but in a sense, they're now climbing into a box and they will have enormous difficulty not following up on this if there is not compliance by Iraq....It was disappointing a month ago not to have the French and the Russians understanding that they shouldn't give any signals of weakening on the sanctions and I think those signals would have helped bring about this crisis because they permitted Saddam Hussein to interpret that maybe the moment was right for him to make this challenge.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat.

Five bucks if someone can tell me who said that and when.

EDWARDS: "I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat."

[Lynks]

I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat.

Five bucks if someone can tell me who said that and when.

EDWARDS: "I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat."

July 08, 2004

Wow Midnyte, why don't you quote the whole fucking thing. The question was...which country is a more serious threat to the US, Iraq or North Korea.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat.

Five bucks if someone can tell me who said that and when.

EDWARDS: "I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country, and I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat."

July 08, 2004

Wow Midnyte, why don't you quote the whole fucking thing. The question was...which country is a more serious threat to the US, Iraq or North Korea.

Edwards vs. Kerry
From the July 19, 2004 issue: Look who doesn’t buy the presidential candidate’s critique of the Iraq war.
by Stephen F. Hayes
07/19/2004, Volume 009, Issue 42

“THE UNITED STATES of America should never go to war because it wants to,” said John Kerry last weekend in a speech in Cloquet, Minn., accusing the Bush administration of bellicosity. “We should only go to war because we have to.”

Did we go to war in Iraq just because we wanted to, or because Iraq posed a threat? Kerry’s new running mate John Edwards addressed that question from the Senate floor on October 10, 2002, explaining his decision to vote to authorize war in Iraq.

“I’m here to speak in support of the resolution before us, which I cosponsored. I believe we must vote for this resolution not because we want war, but because the national security of our country requires action.”

The Bush administration “misled America.” Kerry is fond these days of claiming that the Bush administration “misled” the country to go to war in Iraq. Here he is during a June 25 appearance on Nightline with Ted Koppel. The administration “deeply misled the American people. I think the evidence is quite clear.”

For Edwards,
however, the evidence wasn’t quite so clear. “So did I get misled? No. I didn’t get misled,” he said on Hardball with Chris Matthews on October 13, 2003, almost a year to the day after he voted to authorize the Iraq war and some six months after major combat ended. When Matthews followed up, asking Edwards if he got an “honest reading on the intelligence,” the junior senator from North Carolina seemed to place much of the blame on the intelligence community.

EDWARDS: “And as you know, I serve on the Senate Intelligence Committee. So it wasn’t just the Bush administration. I sat in meeting after meeting after meeting where we were told about the presence of weapons of mass destruction. There is clearly a disconnect between what we were told and what, in fact, we found there.”

What’s more, on February 24, 2002, Edwards was asked by CNN’s John King about President Bush’s labeling of Iraq, Iran and North Korea as an “axis of evil.” His response: “You know, the most imminent, clear and present threat to our country is not the same from those three countries. I think Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country. . . . And they do, in my judgment, present different threats. And I think Iraq and Saddam Hussein present the most serious and most imminent threat.”

[Marbus]

Nov 12, 1997: In response to a question about unanimity over a U.N. resolution, kerry responded: where's the backbone of Russia, where's the backbone of France, where are they in expressing their condemnation of such clearly illegal activity, but in a sense, they're now climbing into a box and they will have enormous difficulty not following up on this if there is not compliance by Iraq....It was disappointing a month ago not to have the French and the Russians understanding that they shouldn't give any signals of weakening on the sanctions and I think those signals would have helped bring about this crisis because they permitted Saddam Hussein to interpret that maybe the moment was right for him to make this challenge.

I don't see anything about war in Kerry statement... seems to follow what he is saying today. Iraq is/was a threat, just not the biggest threat

Marb

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

http://www.kerryquotes.com

[Markulas]

And don't let ppl fool you into thinking that Iraq= ppl who attacked us 9/11 shit I forget where they from Iraq?

[vn_Tanc]

Try comparing apples to apples before you spooge yourself thinking you made an excellent point

I made an excellent point and your quotes are entirely irrelevant. That there was/is a peace process that marginalised certain hardline factions is exactly NOTHING to do with the funding for terrorism the US provided before that time. The citizens of the US lent direct support to an organization that murdered innocent civilians including children. By the definitions of your own government this is exactly the same as Saddam Hussein paying Hamas.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Try comparing apples to apples before you spooge yourself thinking you made an excellent point

I made an excellent point and your quotes are entirely irrelevant. That there was/is a peace process that marginalised certain hardline factions is exactly NOTHING to do with the funding for terrorism the US provided before that time. The citizens of the US lent direct support to an organization that murdered innocent civilians including children. By the definitions of your own government this is exactly the same as Saddam Hussein paying Hamas.

umm no. You cannot compare the Hammas to the IRA.

[Kelshara]

And why is that Midnyte? Please give us your insightful and detailed analyzis of the two terrorist organizations.

[vn_Tanc]

Yes. Do tell.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Hamas Threatens US After Yassin Assassination
By Patrick Goodenough
CNSNews.com Pacific Rim Bureau Chief
March 23, 2004

(CNSNews.com) - The Palestinian terrorist group Hamas has called on Muslims around the world to avenge Israel's assassination of its leader, and it threatened retaliation against the United States.

"The Zionists didn't carry out their operation without getting the consent of the terrorist American administration and it must take responsibility for this crime," Hamas said in a statement. "All the Muslims of the world will be honored to join in on the retaliation."

Hamas founder and head Sheikh Ahmed Yassin was killed at daybreak Monday when an Israeli helicopter fired three missiles as he and a group of men left a mosque in Gaza City.

Israeli officials said he had been targeted for death because of his direct links to terrorism that has cost 377 Israeli lives since late 2000, including 288 lost in 52 suicide attacks.

On Monday, U.S. National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice stressed that the Bush Administration believed Yassin was "personally ... involved in terrorist planning."

Later in the day, however, White House and State Department spokesmen called the assassination "troubling," although State Department spokesman Richard Boucher, demurred when asked whether the U.S. condemned the killing.

He stressed that the U.S. government had no prior knowledge of the Israeli operation, nor had it approved it.

Boucher said the incident "doesn't help efforts to resume progress towards peace."

Israeli ministers said earlier the removal of Yassin would, in the long run, bring increased security because terrorist leaders would be aware that they are not exempt from reprisals.

Israel's killing of the most senior Palestinian figure in a decade has prompted calls for revenge by Hamas and other terrorist groups and triggered fury in the Muslim world.

In the U.S., the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) -- which has itself been accused in testimony before Congress of being closely linked to Hamas -- condemned the killing of Yassin, whom it called "a religious leader."

The assassination has sparked considerable debate.

Noting that Hamas has now threatened both Israel and the U.S., Charles Pena, director of defense policy studies at the Cato Institute said the U.S. "cannot afford to make other countries' terrorist threats our terrorist threat."

"With Hamas now holding the U.S. responsible for the death of its spiritual leader and founder, the U.S. may have taken on a new terrorist enemy," he said. "This is exactly the opposite of what we need to do."

Organizations supportive of Israel, on the other hand, strongly supported its decision to kill Yassin and said the Bush Administration should do so too.

"The U.S. has been targeting the orchestrators of global terror. Israel can be expected to do no less," said American Jewish Committee executive director David Harris, adding that Yassin was "Israel's Osama bin Laden."

"Israel has been in a war not of its choosing," Harris said. "It must take the necessary steps to protect its citizens as it continues to seek a Palestinian partner ready to reach a permanent peace through bilateral negotiations and a renunciation of violence."

Zionist Organization of America national president Morton Klein said Israel had "every right and obligation to protect Israelis by pursuing and eliminating terrorists in Gaza without restraint," just as U.S. forces had that right and obligation in Afghanistan, Iraq and elsewhere.

He noted that 38 out of the 51 Americans killed by Palestinian terrorists in the Middle East since 1993 died at the hands of Hamas.

The Simon Wiesenthal Center, a Jewish human rights group, also compared Israel's killing of Yassin to the U.S. targeting of al-Qaeda leaders.

Center founder Rabbi Marvin Hier said it was the" the height of hypocrisy and an unacceptable double standard to tie Israel's hands and prevent her from destroying the terrorist cancer that currently afflicts all of mankind.

"Let the world now focus on Yassin's victims -- the burnt-out buses and restaurants and charred remains of children," he said.

The Washington-based Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs voiced little sympathy for Yassin, whom it said Israel had dispatched "to his just reward."

It said Yassin had "formulated policy and was the senior decision maker for Hamas terrorism," quoting him as recently praising the use of women as suicide bombers.

After Hamas killed 17 Israelis in a bus bombing in Jerusalem last June, President Bush himself had strong words for the organization when asked whether Israel was justified in its operations against it.

"It is clear that the free world, those who love freedom and peace, must deal harshly with Hamas and the killers," he said in comments posted on the White House website. "And that's just the way it is in the Middle East," the president added.

Trying like hell to find a recent time the IRA has threatened to kill the American infidels.

Therefore, they aren't compareable. Not fucking rocket science you numbskulls. A little logic and common sense goes a long way.

[vn_Tanc]

So you have to threaten Americans (not actually do anything) to qualify?
If the US had supported the UKs occupation of NI who is to say the IRA wouldn't attack US interests?
Until Hamas makes good on its big talk it is an organization that fits the EXACT definition that describes the IRA that was supported by US citizens.

You can splutter "but but but they're ARABS" by way of justification any time now.

[Wonko Wenusberg]

Have fun with it.

[archeiron]

Trying like hell to find a recent time the IRA has threatened to kill the American infidels.

Therefore, they aren't compareable. Not fucking rocket science you numbskulls. A little logic and common sense goes a long way.

Please indugle me while I quote from the United States Navy:

http://library.nps.navy.mil/home/tgp/ira.htm

Description
Radical terrorist group formed in 1969 as clandestine armed wing of Sinn Fein, a legal political movement dedicated to removing British forces from Northern Ireland and unifying Ireland. Has a Marxist orientation. Organized into small, tightly knit cells under the leadership of the Army Council.

Activities
Bombings, assassinations, kidnappings, punishment beatings, extortion, and robberies. Targets have included senior British Government officials, British military and police in Northern Ireland, and Northern Irish Loyalist paramilitary groups. Bombing campaigns have been conducted against train and subway stations and shopping areas on mainland Britain, as well as against British and Royal Ulster Constabulary targets in Northern Ireland and a British military facility on the European Continent. The IRA has been observing a cease-fire since July 1997 and previously observed a cease-fire from 1 September 1994 to February 1996.

Strength
Largely unchanged--several hundred members, plus several thousand sympathizers--but the IRA's strength may have been affected by operatives leaving the organization to join hardline splinter groups.

Local/Area of Operation
Northern Ireland, Irish Republic, Great Britain, and Europe.

External Aid
Has received aid from a variety of groups and countries and considerable training and arms from Libya and, at one time, the PLO. Is suspected of receiving funds and arms from sympathizers in the United States. Similarities in operations suggest links to the ETA.

http://library.nps.navy.mil/home/tgp/hamas.htm

Description
Formed in late 1987 as an outgrowth of the Palestinian branch of the Muslim Brotherhood. Various HAMAS elements have used both violent and political means— including terrorism—to pursue the goal of establishing an Islamic Palestinian state in Israel. Loosely structured, with some elements working clandestinely and others openly through mosques and social service institutions to recruit members, raise money, organize activities, and distribute propaganda. HAMAS’s strength is concentrated in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank. First designated in October 1997.

Activities
HAMAS terrorists, especially those in the Izz al-Din al-Qassam Brigades, have conducted many attacks—including large-scale suicide bombings—against Israeli civilian and military targets. HAMAS maintained the pace of its operational activity during 2002-03, claiming numerous attacks against Israeli interests. HAMAS has not yet directly targeted US interests, although the group makes little or no effort to avoid targets frequented by foreigners. HAMAS continues to confine its attacks to Israel and the territories.

Strength
Unknown number of official members; tens of thousands of supporters and sympathizers.

Location/Area of Operation
HAMAS currently limits its terrorist operations to Israeli military and civilian targets in the West Bank, Gaza Strip, and Israel. The group’s leadership is dispersed throughout the Gaza Strip and West Bank, with a few senior leaders residing in Syria, Lebanon, Iran, and the Gulf States.

External Aid
Receives some funding from Iran but primarily relies on donations from Palestinian expatriates around the world and private benefactors, particularly in Western Europe, North America, and the Persian Gulf region.

The similarities between the two organizations should be readily apparent. Both groups were founded to engage in para-military (terrorist) activities in order to foricibly evict a group of people that colonized what they believe to be their homeland. Both groups have found support from places like Libya, Syria, and Iran. Both groups have engaged in terrorist bombings within their area. However, the IRA engaged in a tremendous amount of bombing outside of Northern Ireland when they attacked Manchester and London.

In both cases, a colony of people supported by the English speaking powers displaced a local government to build a new nation (Northern Ireland and Israel).

The fact that the IRA have been very quiet for a number of years does not negate their accountability. The fact that they aren't an Arab group does not make their activities any more acceptable.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

The fact that they have been quiet for over 7 years does have everything to do with it. They are not compareable. One is a current threat to the world, one is not.

Move on to another distraction.

[vn_Tanc]

The current threat level isn't the issue here. It's your use of Saddam's support of HAMAS to justify invading Iraq when US support of the IRA is politically and morally identical but doesn't warrant even the slightest concern on your part.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

The current threat level isn't the issue here. It's your use of Saddam's support of HAMAS to justify invading Iraq when US support of the IRA is politically and morally identical but doesn't warrant even the slightest concern on your part.

sigh

[archeiron]

The fact that they have been quiet for over 7 years does have everything to do with it. They are not compareable. One is a current threat to the world, one is not.

Move on to another distraction.

I will concede that the current activity level of Hamas makes them a higher priority if you will concede that your line of thinking would have warranted making IRA an equal or higher priority if their activity today was that of seven years ago.