WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Singer Yusuf Islam, formerly known as Cat Stevens, was taken off a diverted United Air Lines flight from London to Washington after his Muslim name turned up on a "watch list" designed to keep terrorists from boarding flights, a Transportation Security Administration spokesman has said.
He expects us to believe he flies commercial flights?Thess wrote:Senator Edward Kennedy has also been stopped and told he can't fly 2-3x because his name is close to someone elses on the watchlist.
August 20, 2004
A Watch List Stops Kennedy at Airport
By RACHEL L. SWARNS
ASHINGTON, Aug. 19 - The meeting had all the hallmarks of an ordinary Congressional hearing. There was Senator Edward M. Kennedy, Democrat of Massachusetts, discussing the problems faced by ordinary citizens mistakenly placed on terrorist watch lists. Then, to the astonishment of the crowd attending a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing on Thursday, Mr. Kennedy offered himself up as Exhibit A.
Between March 1 and April 6, airline agents tried to block Mr. Kennedy from boarding airplanes on five occasions because his name resembled an alias used by a suspected terrorist who had been barred from flying on airlines in the United States, his aides and government officials said.
Instead of acknowledging the craggy-faced, silver-haired septuagenarian as the Congressional leader whose face has flashed across the nation's television sets for decades, the airline agents acted as if they had stumbled across a fanatic who might blow up an American airplane. Mr. Kennedy said they refused to give him his ticket.
"He said, 'We can't give it to you,' " Mr. Kennedy said, describing an encounter with an airline agent to the rapt audience. " 'You can't buy a ticket to go on the airline to Boston.' I said, 'Well, why not?' He said, 'We can't tell you.' "
"Tried to get on a plane back to Washington," Mr. Kennedy continued. '' 'You can't get on the plane.' I went up to the desk and said, 'I've been getting on this plane, you know, for 42 years. Why can't I get on the plane?' "
The hearing room erupted in laughter.
Mr. Kennedy said his situation highlighted the odyssey encountered by people whose names had mistakenly appeared on terrorist watch lists or resembled the names of suspected terrorists on such lists. In April, the American Civil Liberties Union sued the government on behalf of seven airline passengers who said they had wrongly been placed on no-fly lists or associated with names on the lists and could not find a way to clarify their identities.
In Mr. Kennedy's case, airline supervisors ultimately overruled the ticket agents in each instance and allowed him to board the plane. But it took several weeks for the Department of Homeland Security to clear the matter up altogether, the senator's aides said.
Just days after Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge called Mr. Kennedy in early April to apologize and to promise that the problems would be resolved, another airline agent tried to stop Mr. Kennedy from boarding a plane yet again. The alias used by the suspected terrorist on the watch list was Edward Kennedy, said David Smith, a spokesman for the senator.
At the hearing, Mr. Kennedy wondered how ordinary citizens could navigate the tangled bureaucracy if a senator had so much trouble. "How are they going to be able to get to be treated fairly and not have their rights abused?" he asked.
Asa Hutchinsonof the Department of Homeland Security, who was testifying at the Senate hearing, said his department was working to address the situation. He said travelers with such problems should contact the ombudsman at the Transportation Security Administration, a division of homeland security, who would help them take steps to clarify their identities.
"There is a process to clear names," said Mr. Hutchinson, the department's undersecretary for border security. "But it does illustrate the importance of improving the whole system, which we are very aggressively working to do."
On Monday, Mr. Hutchinson told Congress that homeland security officials planned to take over the checking of names of passengers against the no-fly lists. The responsibility is now carried out by the airlines, to ensure that terror suspects do not board airplanes and that law enforcement officials are promptly notified of potential security risks.
Advocates for tougher screening requirements say the current system is ineffective because the government does not provide the airlines with a comprehensive set of watch lists, in part because some of that information is classified. Civil libertarians also cite instances in which airlines have mistakenly denied passengers the right to fly.
The ticket agents who tried to block Mr. Kennedy from boarding planes to Washington, Boston, Palm Beach and New York worked for US Airways, Senate officials said. Amy Kudwa, a US Airways spokeswoman, acknowledged that Mr. Kennedy was a frequent passenger, but declined to comment on the incidents.
Lawyers for the American Civil Liberties Union said they did not know how many people had been mistakenly placed on watch lists. But they said the sluggish responses from the airline and the government to Mr. Kennedy's efforts to clear his name demonstrated the absurdity of the no-fly system.
"It demonstrates all those things that we found problems with in the first place, " said Reginald Shulford of the A.C.L.U."If you're Ted Kennedy, you can call a friend," Mr. Shulford said. "If you're an average citizen you cannot. You can complain to the Department of Homeland Security, but to no avail."
At the hearing, Mr. Kennedy emphasized his concern for passengers stuck on no-fly lists. But he tried to make light of his own troubles.
He said, to much laughter, that he did not believe the mistake was a conspiracy engineered by his Republican colleagues. And as Mr. Hutchinson offered up his apologies, Senator Orrin G. Hatch, Republican of Utah, responded jokingly in kind.
Mr. Hutchinson said, "Senator, we do regret that inconvenience to you."
Mr. Hatch said, "Quit smiling when you say that."
It's not like they'd admit it publicly : ) Ted Kennedy is a bozo though. Do democrats actually like this guy or is he like a handful of republicans that are hated by their own party as well?Thess wrote:He said, to much laughter, that he did not believe the mistake was a conspiracy engineered by his Republican colleagues. And as Mr. Hutchinson offered up his apologies, Senator Orrin G. Hatch, Republican of Utah, responded jokingly in kind.
To be fair to Laura Bush - she was never found to be intoxicated. Personally - I don't know how you run a stop sign unless you are intoxicated, especially if it's in an area you know.Aaeamdar wrote:You mean like, for example, Laura Bush? The parallels are nice. He killed his mistress, she killed her boyfriend. Maybe both of them just have serious problems breaking up with someone.He should be in prison for killing someone while drunk driving
No on both accounts. I especially can't fathom doing it in the neighborhood surrounding my house. I know where every stop sign and light are.Winnow wrote:Are you telling me that you've NEVER run a stop light or stop sign accidentally?
I...call...bullshit! It happens without malicious intent.
On the flip side...have you ever driven home drunk, rolled your car into a river and then left the passenger for dead?
What about the second part of my post! Can you fathom that? : )Thess wrote:No on both accounts. I especially can't fathom doing it in the neighborhood surrounding my house. I know where every stop sign and light are.Winnow wrote:Are you telling me that you've NEVER run a stop light or stop sign accidentally?
I...call...bullshit! It happens without malicious intent.
On the flip side...have you ever driven home drunk, rolled your car into a river and then left the passenger for dead?
Here, read all about it:"Senator Kennedy killed that girl the same as if he put a gun to her head
and pulled the trigger" - George Killen ~ State Police Detective-Lieutenant
That's all well and good but from the responses on this thread, it appears that someone sober and accidentally killing someone is judged harsher than a drunk doing the same.Thess wrote:I am aware of the case - however, it's one of those things we'll never know 'what really happened' cases.
I have never said he was completely innocent in this case, I can't even imagine my actions killing someone, let alone my reaction to doing so.
Our laws have taken more harsh and aggressive stances on drunk driving for a reason, it is fact that your judgement is skewed when you are drunk.
Kelshara wrote:wow is this true? You just get a monetary fine if you're sober? That is.. amazing.Right now it's a monetary fine for sober people and an average of 9 years in the slammer for a drunk.
A fine of less than 1,000.00 if sober. It seems like an extremely easy way to kill someone and get away with it for a small fine if you were the deviant type.The vehicular manslaughter bill is the result of one mother’s crusade to change the law, Baton Rouge’s WBRZ TV reported. Sharon Cemo lost her son, P.J., in a traffic accident March 9, 2003, when his vehicle was broadsided on its driver’s side door while traveling through an intersection in Marrero, LA. He died later that day at a hospital.
State law now permits the man who struck her son to walk away with nothing more than a traffic ticket.
“The man who hit him was on his way to work and ran a red light,” Cemo said. “He said he didn’t see the red light.”
whoahoawh that goes double for your first lady!Winnow wrote:He should be in prison for killing someone while drunk driving. Just another coverup for the Kennedy family.Thess wrote:Senator Edward Kennedy has also been stopped and told he can't fly 2-3x because his name is close to someone elses on the watchlist.
Back this shit up with quoted references, sir!Voronwë wrote:Today's anti-propaganda tidbit for conservatives: Massachusetts has the 35th highest tax burden in the United States. For those of you not well versed in math, that is 15th lowest. So yeah if you have ever used the expression "Taxachusetts" you were mislead.
Is Laura Bush runnning?Voronwë wrote:Is Ted Kennedy running for president? is it 1984?
Yucca mountain is a safe facility. I toured it along with a tour of the nuclear test site. Kerry likes to use it as a scare tactic but it's safe as can be. It's a shame people are too lazy to check into it themselves and rely on second hand info.Toshira wrote:Wonder if Winnow's mouth could surplant Yucca mountain?
for nuclear power. My home power runs off it from the Palo Verde plant.
No, I've NEVER run a stop sign or stop light. I have had them sneak up on me and I've had to step on my breaks quickly. That happens when it's mostly hidden behind bushes or laying in a ditch, which I believe is the city's fault. I've only driven for 7 years, though, so I still have a lot of time to make this mistake I suppose. Still, I find it hard to understand how one could be so irresponsible as to completely run a stop sign, and ESPECIALLY run a red light, those are hard to miss. Laura was probably putting on make-up or some other kind of multitasking, which is irresponsible as well. I wouldn't be suprised if more people have gotten in accidents from multi-tasking than from drunk driving. Not because multitasking is more dangerous, but because it's becoming more and more common in our fast-paced culture.Are you telling me that you've NEVER run a stop light or stop sign accidentally
If you are just trying to kill someone it would be much safer for you if you just run off the road and hit a jogger or other pedestrian going like 55 or so. Won't fuck up your car as much either!Winnow wrote:Kelshara wrote:wow is this true? You just get a monetary fine if you're sober? That is.. amazing.Right now it's a monetary fine for sober people and an average of 9 years in the slammer for a drunk.A fine of less than 1,000.00 if sober. It seems like an extremely easy way to kill someone and get away with it for a small fine if you were the deviant type.The vehicular manslaughter bill is the result of one mother’s crusade to change the law, Baton Rouge’s WBRZ TV reported. Sharon Cemo lost her son, P.J., in a traffic accident March 9, 2003, when his vehicle was broadsided on its driver’s side door while traveling through an intersection in Marrero, LA. He died later that day at a hospital.
State law now permits the man who struck her son to walk away with nothing more than a traffic ticket.
“The man who hit him was on his way to work and ran a red light,” Cemo said. “He said he didn’t see the red light.”
This is good information. I think that the state label of "Taxachussetts" could be historical, and further attributed to the high cost of living for non-real estate related reasons, for example, the high local taxes on items like tobacco and alcohol.Marbus wrote:Here ya go Arch
http://www.taxfoundation.org/statelocal04.html
I think this one says they are 36th or the 14th lowest though...
Marb
