What the hell does this mean?

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miir
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What the hell does this mean?

Post by miir »

We've got an issue in America. Too many good docs are getting out of business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country
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Post by Akaran_D »

The latterpart is fucking scary.
The former.. think it means that higher and higher insurance premiums being forced on docs to have malpractice are driving them out of buisness because of a lawsuit happy american public.
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Post by Adex_Xeda »

"Barry White Voice"

I like to practice my love with women all over this country.
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Post by Akaran_D »

Adex!
Bad man, bad bad man!
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Post by Thess »

haha just reread that quote! No clue what practising their love means! I never got or wanted that perk with mine.
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Post by Marbus »

I'm sure he meant that they love their job, they love what they do. Hell they would have gone to school for LONG time to get their and frankly they better love that job or I'm sure they couldn't do it. Sure I would love to be an OB as long as I could leave off the GYN :) man... WHOOOO My wife's OB/GYN and I are pretty good friends, I tell him frequently - I have a lot of respect man, there is NO WAY I could do your job. I don't think he meant that they were practicing love in the office... but maybe :)

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Post by Acies »

Maybe Bush meant that OB-GYN's (Male) have a hard time becoming aroused because they deal with the 'gina all day?

Someone unriddle that fucking comment, please.
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Re: What the hell does this mean?

Post by Metanis »

miir wrote:
We've got an issue in America. Too many good docs are getting out of business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country
Do people even bother to read any more?

John Edwards the Democratic nominee for VP made a career out of ambulance-chasing down OB-GYN's. John Edwards is now a multi-millionaire. In his home state there are so many docs that have quit the business that women are having trouble finding docs to deliver their babies.

What a marvelous way to protect the little guy.

Typical Liberal Loonie Democrat too... demand perfection in everyone else but refuse to look in the mirror at your own imperfections.
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Re: What the hell does this mean?

Post by Acies »

Metanis wrote:
miir wrote:
We've got an issue in America. Too many good docs are getting out of business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country
Do people even bother to read any more?

John Edwards the Democratic nominee for VP made a career out of ambulance-chasing down OB-GYN's. John Edwards is now a multi-millionaire. In his home state there are so many docs that have quit the business that women are having trouble finding docs to deliver their babies.

What a marvelous way to protect the little guy.

Typical Liberal Loonie Democrat too... demand perfection in everyone else but refuse to look in the mirror at your own imperfections.
Um Met, hate to tell you this but OB-GYN's do not deliever babies. I think you are thinking of Midwives.
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Post by miir »

Actually, an OB/GYN is most often the person who performs/assists the delivery/childbirth.



Regradless, I fail to see what that has to do with practising their 'love with women'.
Last edited by miir on September 8, 2004, 1:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Cracc »

OB-GYN's are present at birthings acies..
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Post by Thess »

Going to an obgyn has to be one of the most uncomfortable experiences for any woman. Saying 'practising their love' is definately not the correct phrase to infere anything in regards to what an obgyn does.


If I *EVER* walked into an obgyn's office and they had a sign about practising their love, I would walk out and never return.

John Edwards believed the science at the time, and that's why he won the trials he did. Whether right or wrong, you really can't blame a man for being successful based on faulty science.
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Post by Marbus »

Errr... the OB in OB/GYN is for Obstetrics which is defined as: a branch of medical science that deals with birth and with its antecedents and sequels. (according to Webster). That IS what they do, deliver babies :) note my comment from the previous post.

Midwives help deliver babies as well but aren't Medical Doctors. In the UK many of them are RNs though and do a lot more business than those in the US. Most births in the US are still done by OB/GYNs.

In regards to Edwards though the guy came from nothing and yes built a pretty nice fortune. I'm sure some of the Dr.'s he prosicuted might have just made a mistake but not all of them. I know a lot of Physicians and some of them arn't nearly as intelligent as one would think. Most are but some shouldn't be practicing medicine. If it takes someone like Edwards to get these people to stop killing people due to their incompetence then so be it. The system has already failed those patients once when it let those people into Medical school, most likley due to a quota anyway. (Yes I know that sounds like two opposite viewpoints in one paragraph but that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it :))

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Post by Acies »

Learn something new everyday.

I was wrong Met, sorry.
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Post by masteen »

Women are starting to have the same problem here in Florida. It's REAL easy to find a GYN, but finding an OB/GYN is hard. Here in KW, you have one choice unless you feel like driving 300 miles for every checkup.
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Re: What the hell does this mean?

Post by Winnow »

miir wrote:
We've got an issue in America. Too many good docs are getting out of business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country
A verbal snafu. I'm sure he meant to say that they can't practice the occupation they love or something along those lines.

This is the last straw. I can't have my president screwing up when he's referring to OB-GYNs. The next thing you know he'll be getting the national OB-GYN convention date wrong.

Why do women find it funny when two men debate abortion but have no issues with two male OB-GYNs debating and practicing something they've never experienced either? Why do you take the advice of a male OB-GYN regarding your privates but it's none of their business when it comes to discussing pregnancy/abortion? I find it somewhat ironic. In both cases, they are not making a final decision. Do males somehow lose all rationale when it comes to pregnancy and have nothing useful to say? You seem pretty confident in males during birth and for other exclusively female issues. Isn't it worth at least getting opinions from as many people as possible?

Flame away. I'm just curious is all.
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Post by Thess »

I don't, I have a female gynocologist.
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Post by Hoarmurath »

My wife has had both male and female gynocologists. She actually prefers males because the women have always been less "gentle" with her. I also saw that on an episode of Oprah or something, that in general, women gynocologists were preferred because women felt that the female doctors "understood" them better, but the women who preferred male doctors usually said so because it was a less painful experience for them.
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Re: What the hell does this mean?

Post by Crav »

Winnow wrote: Why do women find it funny when two men debate abortion but have no issues with two male OB-GYNs debating and practicing something they've never experienced either? Why do you take the advice of a male OB-GYN regarding your privates but it's none of their business when it comes to discussing pregnancy/abortion? I find it somewhat ironic. In both cases, they are not making a final decision. Do males somehow lose all rationale when it comes to pregnancy and have nothing useful to say? You seem pretty confident in males during birth and for other exclusively female issues. Isn't it worth at least getting opinions from as many people as possible?

Flame away. I'm just curious is all.
Hmm I think the analogy is a bit flawed since in one the discussion revolves around rights while the other is a discussion of advice. If I break my arm while playing soccer or football I want my doctor's advice on what to do to mend it (he/she is trained to do this), I don't want my doctor to debate my right to play either sport. I wouldn't go to a random person on a message board and ask them for advice on how to mend it, let alone listen to them on whether I should have the right to play a sport.
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Post by Thess »

I've never had the problem with my female gynocologist being to 'rough' she even uses a lava lamp to make sure her hands aren't to cold, and doesn't have stirrups!
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Post by Sirton »

Its gotten so bad with suits that whole maternity ward hospitals have closed down because all the doctors left to other states, and in certain areas its hard to find a place to deliver a baby...example in north carolina.

Its gotten so bad that even in the best medical city in the United States Houston, TX....theres only one specialist in the whole city of Houston on child neurosurgery, because of malpractice and insurance all the others left.

Edwards and his kind are the biggest POS shark asswipes...Btw that faulty science at the time Edwards used wasnt or ever was science...it was unproven BS at the time he used it vs the defenders who had 100+ scientific journals and studys to back'em up...but remember its about BSin the jury. Edwards is a great BS'r...Hes got many of you hook line and sinker. I dont even dislike Kerry much, but Edwards is total fake and just plane crap. He brought himself up by ruining good people taking there hard erned money with false BS and he knew it was false...he should be disgusted in himself.
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Post by kyoukan »

yes because suing doctors for malpractice when they kill a baby due to incompetence in childbirth is a lot worse than lying to the entire world in order to justify an illegal invation of a sovreign country, mudering civilians in their tens of thousands in order to sieze control of it's natural resources.
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Post by Cartalas »

kyoukan wrote:yes because suing doctors for malpractice when they kill a baby due to incompetence in childbirth is a lot worse than lying to the entire world in order to justify an illegal invation of a sovreign country, mudering civilians in their tens of thousands in order to sieze control of it's natural resources.

Yeah that oil is flowing freely over here, I can see the trail of tankers floating in a steady stream across the Atlantic.
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Post by Metanis »

Thess wrote:John Edwards believed the science at the time, and that's why he won the trials he did. Whether right or wrong, you really can't blame a man for being successful based on faulty science.
But don't you dare have faulty Intelligence data!
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Post by Thess »

Faulty science and leaving out intelligence to create faulty intelligence imo are two different things.
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Post by Marbus »

That's Bullshit. Sirton do you have any Children? If so then you can probably at least imagine, no matter how painful, what it would be like to have a child taken from you because of someone's incompetence.

As I said in my post, in ANY collection of lawsuits there are going to be some that were wrongly convicted but there is no way you can say all of them were. I DO favor limiting the amount of compensation to stop some of these trial lawyers. A friend of mine, who is a trial lawer, dosen't have to look for cases or make up stuff. He reject more than he takes because many of them are unjustified yet he still works 70 hour weeks, has 3 houses and owns 2 Hotels in Florida. I'm sure Edwards was the same way. He made tons of cash by picking the cases in which there was obvious wrongdoing. As I alluded to earlier, if it got one incompetenet physician out of practice and saved even one life, it was probably all worth it.

My second son Ian was born on August 23rd (about 2 weeks ago). My wife had a very normal pregancy but he was so big and she has so much fluid there wasn't a lot of room in there the last week. When she began active labor it became quickly apparent that the cord was wrapped around his neck, we later learned it was wrapped around twice. While this is more common than one would think if not handeled correct and done quickly the baby could die or suffer serious brain damage. When he learned of the situation my wife's OB, who was cleaning up from an "tubeal" can running and brought another OB with him as well who focused only on my wife to help keep her from having to have a C-Section without endangering the life of our child. With their help Marley's active labor only lasted about 3 minutes and Ian was in the birth canal for only aboout 20 seconds, his heart rate never dropping below 70. When he was born he looked great and, Praise the Lord, sufferend no ill effects. However, the situation could have easily gone downhill quickly had our Physician not know exactly what to do in the situation and acted in a prompt precise manner.

I went to College and was headed for Medical School with a number of people who didn't know a B cell from a T cell. But they got in and some of them even graduated and now they are someone's Dr. Thankfully NOT mine :) In medical school they ingrane in you that you are untouchable in order to get you ready to deal with life and death decisions and situations. However not all people are ready for that OR cabable of handling that kind of pressure. If Edwards took their licenses away, or kept them from practicing because of insurance costs, then he did a service to the American people by doing so...

Don't get me wrong, nothing, well almost nothing, infurates me more than these frivilous lawsuites like some fat bastard trying to sue McDonalds because he won't get off the freakin' couch. But malpractice is real, I lost my father almost 5 years ago because of physician incompetence. But like others he didn't want to sue until it was almost too late. He passed away a month before the tral. He was the 4 or 5 person this Dr. murdered due to his incompetence. Yes I say murdered because he tried to cover everything up. Cleaning out someone's sinuses shouldn't result in minigitis unless the Dr. is incompetent.

Marb

PS - Picture of Ian :) since I haven't posted one.

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Last edited by Marbus on September 8, 2004, 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Sirton »

I know what Im talking about Marb., just so I dont have to sit here and deal with some libs or pretty girl Kelsh., saying some BS here some on my credentials.

http://www.amerchiro.org/about/saca/saca_texas.shtml Im a member of the ACA and a Doctor myself.

http://www.smugmug.com/gallery/160151 That is one of my photo gallerys showing a self portrait of me you can match that up with the name and my photo on http://www.veeshanvault.org/gallery/The ... ton_and_gf


http://www.med.uth.tmc.edu/comm/Scoop/a ... .%2023.pdf
This shows my father and his positions in the medical community...page 2 on installed officers...president of HAM and president of the HCMS...the largest county organizations in the USA of medical Drs.
http://www.houstondoctors.com/colonsurgery.htmlheres a quick link to the type of DR. he is...May of heard jokes about him on Jay Leno or how he was a advisor to Ronald Reagans Colon Cancer Surgery and what got my family into politics.

Sorry to post the crap, but almost everytime I post something a couple libs act like Im making up BS and discrediting me. This shows I know what Im talking about and it isnt me just making up BS...
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Post by Kluden »

That one about neursurgeons is insane. I don't think there are many competant neurosurgeons in general around the world...so what if a city only has one that can deal with baby brains?? I mean, that is one difficult ass MD to be.
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Post by Marbus »

Sirton,

Unlike some others on this board I don't doubt your credibility or you having a valid reason for your viewpoint. I was just trying to point out mine in regards to children which may or may not validate some, not all of course, lawsuits. I do apologize if it sounded like my post was attacking you directly, I just reacted too quickly in trying to make my point.

Based upon what you have posted I'm sure you realized that some physicians ARE imcompetent. Whether or not that should make them liable of course is another issue as well as how liable. As I said, I'm all for some type of stop gap to help keep insurance down for physicians. I've always considered I might actually go back myself someday after I retire just for the knowledge... but who knows. However I do think we need we need the ability to sure when it's justified.

Marb
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Post by Sirton »

Remember that city is Houston...Which in many opinions is the best medical city in the World. Its not like saying , Atlanta, Los Angeles, Orlando, San fran., Berlin, Tokyo. And its also important, because there were more, but there insurance went over 180k a yr. Then they get taxed in rich people bracket making there total income with high risk pitiful to what it once was.....now its around 100-200k more if they are great. And hell they can go somewhere else and get treated better...they dont have to worry so much about being sued have slightly lower insurance rates and make a extra 60-100k a yr.

My pop use to kick out bad doctors from our city...Now theyll get sued if they try. ITS FKIN CRAZY BS.... Bad Drs. deserve to be sued no doubt....but the govt should let the Drs. police there own. They did a great job at it in the 80s.

Lawyers like Edwards out sources your Doctors, because he sues the GOOD ones too.

Many Dr's in N.C. left or settled there cases, because the lawyer threatened to get Edwards in the case if they didn't. Because he was able to sweet talk his way to win a BS case by jury and not fact. Marb I agree bad Drs need to be exterminated from our fields, but the good ones need to be protected and not feasted on by the sharks.
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Post by Adex_Xeda »

People have now developed this attitude that if any thing goes wrong in their life, "THEY" are entitled to millions of dollars.

It has gone WAY beyond punishment for malpractice. It's now considered the friggen lottery.

A old adage says that there is no such thing as a free lunch.

People are being selfish and are abusing the courts to grab money. That money coesn't come from the doctor or the hospital, it comes from all of our wallets through higher taxes and insane health insurance premiums.

Individual selfishness, yet again is scarring our society.

Individuals DO have an impact on society. When we make decisions to profit ourselves at the expense of others we all pay.

We need to change our attitudes. We need to change our hearts.

As a society, we feed on our own flesh.
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Post by Sirton »

Sorry Marb to seem to get offended....Just anytime I hear or read Edwards name my blood starts really pumpin.
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Post by Marbus »

Marb I agree bad Drs need to be exterminated from our fields, but the good ones need to be protected and not feasted on by the sharks.
I agree with you 100% on this :) The difficulty is determining exactly who those are :) I also agree wtih Adex on the lotter, compensation isn't $20M dollars. Nothing is ever going to truly compensate people for their loss but it shouldn't be turned into a lotter either.

Marb


PS- NP Sirton, I understand completely :)
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Post by Kelshara »

Sorry to post the crap, but almost everytime I post something a couple libs act like Im making up BS and discrediting me.
Probably because your bragging of your l33t inside infoZ directly from the White House!
This shows I know what Im talking about and it isnt me just making up BS...
That would be a first.
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Post by Sirton »

Sorry Kelshy hun I have background to talk about some of these issues at there core, and you dont. I get tired of some of the comments from people like you, because I knew they were coming, so look up the credentials...Im sorry if some of my life and background gives me reasons to tell about examples, and reasons I feel certain ways..Im sorry your life doesnt have many stories or much to talk about ecept some Fairy Tales. Go ahead and keep being stupid Kelshy.



Marb. Bro,

One thing some medical communities did that worked much better in the 80's was they'd make you have to be a member of the county medical society to be able to practice at a hospital. If you were not a member then no hospital would have you on there staff.....Now what happened then is the great Drs running the societys would screen the Doctors and if they noticed idiot Dr's they kicked them out of the Society, therefore, they could not be on a hospital staff and patients could see this Dr. sucked or didnt have good credentials.

Then what happened is the Lawyers thought they knew better about medicine than Doctors, and used laws to destroy this and many other parts of the medical system to get a part of the pie.

I remember my pop coming home many nights yelling about how some Shitty Dr. was filing a suit against them for kicking him out of there society. Well they can't deal with that crap everyday, because the laws made it so easy for bad Dr's. to file lawsuits for there protection...This eventually destroy'd the Dr's policing there own and has hurt the quality of care the American people were getting.

The laws need to let Doctors run the medical community along with patients and alittle government, insurance, lawyers ect to makesure its not abused...
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Post by Kelshara »

I got plenty of background and stories. I just don't need to claim to be Bush' buttbuddy.
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Post by masteen »

How dare you say that doctors are more qualified to make medical decisions than lawyers! I'm suing you!
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Post by kyoukan »

sirton you are so fucking not a doctor. you probably can't even fucking spell doctor.
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Post by Lalanae »

kyoukan wrote:sirton you are so fucking not a doctor. you probably can't even fucking spell doctor.
He could have received his PhD via Milton Bradley...

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Post by Marbus »

What I do remember from my days at Childrens Hospital in LR was the transformation from the late 80s of a caring community to a business. Eventually it became a community much like before but something IMHO was lost. Before it was ALWAYS about the kids, for a while in the early 90s it was usually about the money. Which was due in part 2 two things. First was Clinton's talk about socalized medicine, that scared the crap out of many physicians to the point of forming larger practices in order to keep costs down... not necessarily a bad thing but definitely a change. The final blow though came from the Republican Congress cutting social programs without any forthough to the consequences. The industry seems to have stabalized somewhat now but the 90s, especially the mid 90s were not a pretty time to be in Health Care... which is one of the reasons I gave up my spot at Medical School to program Routers. Not many people could route themselves out of a paper sack in the early 90s much less run a large WAN... if only I had been so lucky as to have had a good finanical advisor back then I would be retired by now :(

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Post by Kelgar »

Lalanae wrote:
kyoukan wrote:sirton you are so fucking not a doctor. you probably can't even fucking spell doctor.
He could have received his PhD via Milton Bradley...

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Doctors aren't immune from being stupid fucks, but there's a different reason to doubt him. I vaguely recall that he is only around Xzion's age, give or take a year. The only 22-23 y/o MDs I've ever seen were on TV.

At best, maybe he's one of those "special" interns whose job is to do the important things. Like fetching coffee or something.
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Bojangels
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Post by Bojangels »

Actually I think he's 28 or 29. I remember him talking about school in gu and not being able to play a whole lot... If he says so I believe him. :)
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Post by Marbus »

You don't have to be a Dr. to know what's going on in the medical community. I'm not a teacher but my parents were for years so I always knew what was going on within the NEA etc... Sounds like Sirton listens to and respects his father. Might not be first hand info but that dosen't mean he is off base IMHO. Also not saying I agree with everything... heh I rarely agree with everything anyone says though, just like most of us here :)

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Post by Sueven »

Kelgar wrote:Doctors aren't immune from being stupid fucks, but there's a different reason to doubt him. I vaguely recall that he is only around Xzion's age, give or take a year. The only 22-23 y/o MDs I've ever seen were on TV.
Actually, that's totally wrong. Sirton was well into his medical education 3 or 4 years ago, long before I was in college (I think I'm a little older than Xzion).

Additionally, a lot of the liberals on this board regularly underestimate Sirton, who's arguments frequently carry far more depth and nuance than what's posted by Midnyte and Metanis. People get carried away by his tendency to make emotional posts and his lack of grammar, but those are just straw men. Hell, Arborealous connects most of his sentences with ellipses and makes liberal use of the smileys, but he makes some of the most intelligent, thoughtful posts on the board.

You can all keep ignoring and discrediting Sirton all you want, but the fact is, he's a smart guy who generally presents intelligent arguments, links more sources than almost any liberal here, and does legitimately have more life experience and knowledge than many people here. To ignore him is to deprive yourself of relatively intelligent debate in favor of listening to Midnyte rant about Muslims some more.
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Post by miir »

Additionally, a lot of the liberals on this board regularly underestimate Sirton, who's arguments frequently carry far more depth and nuance than what's posted by Midnyte and Metanis.
That's really not saying much as the Metanis/Midnyte/Brotha/Cartalas crew is generally considered the clowns of this forum.


People wouldn;t laugh at Sirton as much if he stopped trying to use his 'connections' to give his weak arguments and opinions credibility.
His posts would be taken more seriously if he could express his opinions using proper grammar, spelling and sentence structure.
His posts look and sound like they are written by a 15 year old highschool dropout.
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Post by Cartalas »

miir wrote:
Additionally, a lot of the liberals on this board regularly underestimate Sirton, who's arguments frequently carry far more depth and nuance than what's posted by Midnyte and Metanis.
That's really not saying much as the Metanis/Midnyte/Brotha/Cartalas crew is generally considered the clowns of this forum.


People wouldn;t laugh at Sirton as much if he stopped trying to use his 'connections' to give his weak arguments and opinions credibility.
His posts would be taken more seriously if he could express his opinions using proper grammar, spelling and sentence structure.
His posts look and sound like they are written by a 15 year old highschool dropout.

Awwww Look Miir is having a special moment. Loosen the special helmet boy, its getting to ya.
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Post by Chidoro »

Hoarmurath wrote:My wife has had both male and female gynocologists. She actually prefers males because the women have always been less "gentle" with her.
That's exactly the way my wife has explained it to me as well.
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Post by Marbus »

My wife won't go to a female OB/GYM because the few she knows seem to all have something to prove. One of the ones in town here was joking recently that she holds off on epidurals and other pain medication for any teenagers who get pregnant to make them pay for their poor choices... WTF kind of sicko would do that. I feel so sorry for those girls that unknowingly choose her because she is female. If I had the comment on audio I would put it on the Internet though so everyone would know what kind of a person she really is...

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Post by Sueven »

Miir wrote:That's really not saying much as the Metanis/Midnyte/Brotha/Cartalas crew is generally considered the clowns of this forum.


People wouldn;t laugh at Sirton as much if he stopped trying to use his 'connections' to give his weak arguments and opinions credibility.
His posts would be taken more seriously if he could express his opinions using proper grammar, spelling and sentence structure.
His posts look and sound like they are written by a 15 year old highschool dropout.
I don't disagree with the first part of that. However, your comments about Sirton are exactly what I said: you ignoring the valid contributions he makes due to superficial bullshit that has no bearing whatsoever on the validity of his arguments.
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Post by Kelshara »

At times Sirton comes across with valid arguments. But most of the times his posts make my head hurt due to the rambling in them. And quite frankly, if a doctor rambles like he does in some posts then that is a doctor I wouldn't go to if it saved my life. And the White House comment was classic :p
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