Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California

Friday, July 02, 2004



SAN JOSE, Calif. — The United States may have come a long way in the fight against institutionalized racism but in California, black children are still being denied access to an important educational tool.

Pamela Lewis wanted to have her 6-year-old son Nicholas take a standardized IQ test (search) to determine if he qualifies for special education speech therapy. Officials at his school routinely provide the test to kids but as Lewis soon found out, not to children who are black, due to a statewide policy that goes back to 1979.

At that time, many black kids performed poorly on the IQ test and wound up in special education classes. A lawsuit claimed the test was biased and a judge agreed — banning public schools from giving the test to black children while allowing it for everyone else.

Lawyers for the New Haven School District (search) claim they assess black children through academic performance and other criteria.

The state is looking into Lewis' appeal but she said as a final insult a district official suggested if she changed her son's paperwork to re-classify him as white, as she is, he'd be able to take the test.

She refused and redoubled her commitment to fight for her child's right to be measured by the same standards as other kids.

Another example of the all-knowing campassionate white people doing what they think is best for the blacks.

We profess equality among races. Yeah right. This affirmative action needs to go I think. I think it has served it's purpose.

[Xzion]

Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California

Friday, July 02, 2004



SAN JOSE, Calif. — The United States may have come a long way in the fight against institutionalized racism but in California, black children are still being denied access to an important educational tool.

Pamela Lewis wanted to have her 6-year-old son Nicholas take a standardized IQ test (search) to determine if he qualifies for special education speech therapy. Officials at his school routinely provide the test to kids but as Lewis soon found out, not to children who are black, due to a statewide policy that goes back to 1979.

At that time, many black kids performed poorly on the IQ test and wound up in special education classes. A lawsuit claimed the test was biased and a judge agreed — banning public schools from giving the test to black children while allowing it for everyone else.

Lawyers for the New Haven School District (search) claim they assess black children through academic performance and other criteria.

The state is looking into Lewis' appeal but she said as a final insult a district official suggested if she changed her son's paperwork to re-classify him as white, as she is, he'd be able to take the test.

She refused and redoubled her commitment to fight for her child's right to be measured by the same standards as other kids.

Another example of the all-knowing campassionate white people doing what they think is best for the blacks.

We profess equality among races. Yeah right. This affirmative action needs to go I think. I think it has served it's purpose.

Sure affirmitive action looks bad on paper, and in a eutopic world it isnt necissary, at one time i was against it.

Yet in REALITY do you think some racist fucking conservative white asshole living in mississippi would judge a black person equal to a white. Do you think, being with the modern day, arabs would get equal treatment in job hiring, or worse, in college applications?
If you think it would be fair for everyone, then you are a fucking idiot (im not saying you are) With the modern day neoconservative movement and racist people STILL in the supreme court and in the white house, this country isnt ready to get rid of affirmitive action, maybe we will be in 25-50 years from now

[Pherr the Dorf]

Do you know what affirmative action is?

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Do you know what affirmative action is?

uh-huh. Do you?

Great question. Instead of de-railing with this bullshit, how about talking about the post.

I happen to support affirmative action. I just think maybe it has served it's purpose. But, Xzion is probably right....we still have a large contingent of racist assholes who haven't seen that black people are just as capable as white people.

[Pherr the Dorf]

Do you know what affirmative action is?

uh-huh. Do you?

Great question. Instead of de-railing with this bullshit, how about talking about the post.

I happen to support affirmative action. I just think maybe it has served it's purpose. But, Xzion is probably right....we still have a large contingent of racist assholes who haven't seen that black people are just as capable as white people.

Affirmative Action, policies used in the United States to increase opportunities for minorities by favoring them in hiring and promotion, college admissions, and the awarding of government contracts. Depending upon the situation, “minorities” might include any underrepresented group, especially one defined by race, ethnicity, or gender.

Note, it's about favoring one race or group over another, which your article can't even really tangent off, hence why I asked.

[Avestan]

Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California

Friday, July 02, 2004



SAN JOSE, Calif. — The United States may have come a long way in the fight against institutionalized racism but in California, black children are still being denied access to an important educational tool.

Pamela Lewis wanted to have her 6-year-old son Nicholas take a standardized IQ test (search) to determine if he qualifies for special education speech therapy. Officials at his school routinely provide the test to kids but as Lewis soon found out, not to children who are black, due to a statewide policy that goes back to 1979.

At that time, many black kids performed poorly on the IQ test and wound up in special education classes. A lawsuit claimed the test was biased and a judge agreed — banning public schools from giving the test to black children while allowing it for everyone else.

Lawyers for the New Haven School District (search) claim they assess black children through academic performance and other criteria.

The state is looking into Lewis' appeal but she said as a final insult a district official suggested if she changed her son's paperwork to re-classify him as white, as she is, he'd be able to take the test.

She refused and redoubled her commitment to fight for her child's right to be measured by the same standards as other kids.

Another example of the all-knowing campassionate white people doing what they think is best for the blacks.

We profess equality among races. Yeah right. This affirmative action needs to go I think. I think it has served it's purpose.

Sure affirmitive action looks bad on paper, and in a eutopic world it isnt necissary, at one time i was against it.

Yet in REALITY do you think some racist fucking conservative white asshole living in mississippi would judge a black person equal to a white. Do you think, being with the modern day, arabs would get equal treatment in job hiring, or worse, in college applications?
If you think it would be fair for everyone, then you are a fucking idiot (im not saying you are) With the modern day neoconservative movement and racist people STILL in the supreme court and in the white house, this country isnt ready to get rid of affirmitive action, maybe we will be in 25-50 years from now

You ever been to Mississippi? How is what you say any less racist than the person you are describing. Affirmative action was put into place to keep people for categorizing any group with wide sweeping generalizations. Please do not try to argue against affirmative action by pointing out that everyone in Mississippi is racist. That is racist.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Note, it's about favoring one race or group over another, which your article can't even really tangent off, hence why I asked.

Ummmm, yeah. The reason they stopped giving IQ tests to black children was because they said it was unfair, as in saying they aren't smart enough. It is a form of affirmative action. They were favoring one group over another. Play semantics if you wish, but it gets old.

Anyway, I agree Av. Blanket statements like that are the same as racism.

[Lalanae]

Note, it's about favoring one race or group over another, which your article can't even really tangent off, hence why I asked.

Ummmm, yeah. The reason they stopped giving IQ tests to black children was because they said it was unfair, as in saying they aren't smart enough. It is a form of affirmative action. They were favoring one group over another. Play semantics if you wish, but it gets old.

Anyway, I agree Av. Blanket statements like that are the same as racism.

Had nothing to do with saying they aren't smart enough. IQ tests have been controversial in the past because they had been often culturally bias. However, they should have absolved the use of the tests for everyone, not just blacks. These days there are better IQ Tests that are not culturally biased, so its just a matter of someone forcing the system to overturn the ruling.

Edit: Larry P. vs. Riles is the case if you want to know what really was behind the ruling.

[Pherr the Dorf]

Note, it's about favoring one race or group over another, which your article can't even really tangent off, hence why I asked.

Ummmm, yeah. The reason they stopped giving IQ tests to black children was because they said it was unfair, as in saying they aren't smart enough. It is a form of affirmative action. They were favoring one group over another. Play semantics if you wish, but it gets old.

Anyway, I agree Av. Blanket statements like that are the same as racism.

Had nothing to do with saying they aren't smart enough. IQ tests have been controversial in the past because they had been often culturally bias. However, they should have absolved the use of the tests for everyone, not just blacks. These days there are better IQ Tests that are not culturally biased, so its just a matter of someone forcing the system to overturn the ruling.

Edit: Larry P. vs. Riles is the case if you want to know what really was behind the ruling.

Now I don't have to respond

[Xzion]

Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California

Friday, July 02, 2004



SAN JOSE, Calif. — The United States may have come a long way in the fight against institutionalized racism but in California, black children are still being denied access to an important educational tool.

Pamela Lewis wanted to have her 6-year-old son Nicholas take a standardized IQ test (search) to determine if he qualifies for special education speech therapy. Officials at his school routinely provide the test to kids but as Lewis soon found out, not to children who are black, due to a statewide policy that goes back to 1979.

At that time, many black kids performed poorly on the IQ test and wound up in special education classes. A lawsuit claimed the test was biased and a judge agreed — banning public schools from giving the test to black children while allowing it for everyone else.

Lawyers for the New Haven School District (search) claim they assess black children through academic performance and other criteria.

The state is looking into Lewis' appeal but she said as a final insult a district official suggested if she changed her son's paperwork to re-classify him as white, as she is, he'd be able to take the test.

She refused and redoubled her commitment to fight for her child's right to be measured by the same standards as other kids.

Another example of the all-knowing campassionate white people doing what they think is best for the blacks.

We profess equality among races. Yeah right. This affirmative action needs to go I think. I think it has served it's purpose.

Sure affirmitive action looks bad on paper, and in a eutopic world it isnt necissary, at one time i was against it.

Yet in REALITY do you think some racist fucking conservative white asshole living in mississippi would judge a black person equal to a white. Do you think, being with the modern day, arabs would get equal treatment in job hiring, or worse, in college applications?
If you think it would be fair for everyone, then you are a fucking idiot (im not saying you are) With the modern day neoconservative movement and racist people STILL in the supreme court and in the white house, this country isnt ready to get rid of affirmitive action, maybe we will be in 25-50 years from now

You ever been to Mississippi? How is what you say any less racist than the person you are describing. Affirmative action was put into place to keep people for categorizing any group with wide sweeping generalizations. Please do not try to argue against affirmative action by pointing out that everyone in Mississippi is racist. That is racist.

lol i never said everyone in mississippi was racist, but im sure theres a lot more racist people in mississippi then say california, massachusets, or florida
For one, a lot of the nations worst hate crimes happened in mississippi, and is probrably one of the top 2 or 3 most racist states in the country

For the record i have been there, for a good 3-5 hours when i was 7 on a trip with my grandparents to Tennessee

[Zaelath]

Jailer's pet! Don't see him spitting on me!

[kyoukan]

what kind of a freaked out fucking redneck reads this and comes to the conclusion that affirmative action needs to go? are you some kind of simpleton?

[Zaelath]

what kind of a freaked out fucking redneck reads this and comes to the conclusion that affirmative action needs to go? are you some kind of simpleton?

Bush == Invader Zim.

Mid == Gir.

The parallels are undeniable!!

[Lynks]

Fuck Mid, you're so full of negativity.

[Fesuni Chopsui]

I am for Affirmative Action on principle - but one thing really bothers me about it. A lot of people continually say that "oh well, black people are just as capable as white people and so we need to give them that oppurtunity to show that they are just as capable." If minority groups in general are as capable as majority groups - why are they in such need of help? Can you really argue that they need it because of financial set backs due to race when in reality there are hundreds of thousands of "majority" people being denied work, education, money, "help" because of this.

I can't really argue against Affirmative Action because to be honest, if it wasn't for that ideal, I probably wouldn't be going to the college I am going to now and getting the education and oppurtunities I am being given. But I have to beg the question - why me? Why did they choose to look at me differently, to treat me differently and ultimately come to a decision and conclusion about me based on a character trait of mine that I did not in fact ask them to even notice. I think the concept of AA is a good one, but I think the current system it's manifested in is not the right way to go about it.

[Avestan]

For the record i have been there, for a good 3-5 hours when i was 7 on a trip with my grandparents to Tennessee

Well then I bow to the expert.

For reference, please look at the information in the following:

http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/p20-541.pdf

Now. . .for all enlighteded Westerners (including California), please note that 8.6% of blacks live in your neck of the woods, versus over 50% in the south.

What does this mean? This means that there are a lot (A LOT) more opportunities for racial issues to arise.

I have lived in Texas, Mississippi, Boston, and California (for the last 8 years). No doubt in my mind that people in California (at least northern) are completely ignorant when it comes to racial issues and more nocibily afraid of the opposite races. I hear comments here that I cannot imagine I would ever hear in the south because people are so much more conscious of race relations there. There is far more animosity towards blacks in the northeast than anywhere else in this country and I would say that in California, you have a ton of white people who speak for black people and sound really stupid doing so.

It is easy to see why people think that racism is contained to the south, but that is horseshit. There are more black people in the south, there are stupid people everywhere.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

what kind of a freaked out fucking redneck reads this and comes to the conclusion that affirmative action needs to go? are you some kind of simpleton?

I suppose the kind whose mind can think beyond one concept at one time.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

Fuck Mid, you're so full of negativity.

uh-huh

Gosh you are funny. Would be funnier if you saved that comment for a time when I was actually being negative though.

[Marbus]

All you morons missed the freakin' point!

The LAW that was pass in 79 or whenever was DONE because, in all likelyhood a BLACK person complained that the test was biased, saying that it negatively effected their child... while I can't find that in the article I can tell you the EXACT same thing happend ALL over the US... WHY? BECAUSE THE TEST IS BIASED!

A test is ONLY as good as who it's scored against or who the "normal" population is that initially gives the developer the resources on how to score it. Up until the late 70s almost ALL standardized IQ and Psych test were VERY biased towards white males. That's not racist, it's the truth because when the tests were developed earlier this century the only people "allowed" to participate in the initial scorings were... yup you guessed it, white males

Now I do know that many of the test since then have been updated. Is CA using the old test? possibly and if so it would not be fair to her, her child or the taxpayers to have her child tested on a test not scored properly... as they say, they use other criteria which I'm sure works just fine.

My Dad use to do Psych testing for a living so I know all about his and I did a lot of reseach in college on how biased some of the tests are to minorities and women... some of the questions are actually quite funny or sad depending on how you look at it. Sad that people still put stock in whether a 6 year old inner city kid checks yes or no on "I enjoy riding horses"

On the flip side though my Dad was attacked, without much harm of course by a mother when he told her, most excitedly, that her 5th child was not mentally retarded... Rather that being elated that he had the chance for a bright future she hit him and tried to scratch him in anger because that meant if he wasn't retarted she would loose an extra $400+ a month from the Government... very sad, definitely one of the people Bill Cosby is talking too

Not going to touch the AA part tonight, it's too late...

Cheers!
Marb

[Pherr the Dorf]

For the record i have been there, for a good 3-5 hours when i was 7 on a trip with my grandparents to Tennessee

Well then I bow to the expert.

For reference, please look at the information in the following:

http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/p20-541.pdf

Now. . .for all enlighteded Westerners (including California), please note that 8.6% of blacks live in your neck of the woods, versus over 50% in the south.

What does this mean? This means that there are a lot (A LOT) more opportunities for racial issues to arise.

I have lived in Texas, Mississippi, Boston, and California (for the last 8 years). No doubt in my mind that people in California (at least northern) are completely ignorant when it comes to racial issues and more nocibily afraid of the opposite races. I hear comments here that I cannot imagine I would ever hear in the south because people are so much more conscious of race relations there. There is far more animosity towards blacks in the northeast than anywhere else in this country and I would say that in California, you have a ton of white people who speak for black people and sound really stupid doing so.

It is easy to see why people think that racism is contained to the south, but that is horseshit. There are more black people in the south, there are stupid people everywhere.

You Sir, haven't a clue. race issues don't only invlove blacks, with 39.5% of homes in california speaking a language other then english as the primary language in the home, I dare say we have a damn good clue about minorities. Who do you think does all the work in the feilds, be it the food for your table or the wine you drink, it certainly isn't white people. Please before you go making statements like that, see outside your little bubble.

[Avestan]

this thread was about blacks, not hispanics. VERY different issues. The post was about blacks, the discussion was about blacks, I constrained my comments to blacks.

Race relations are not limited to black people, but you do have to treat the issues separately because the problems are very different.

As far as my "bubble" is concerned, I would put money down on the fact that I have visited and resided in more states and countries than you will in your lifetime.

Please do not assume to know anything about me or what I have done in my life. If you want to discuss the facts, go for it, but please try to restrict yourself from debasing me when you know nothing about me and my past.

Saying that all minority issues should be lumped together, would be offensive in itself to most people and the fact that you think having a large hispanic population is anything like having a large black population is ignorant. Mind you, there is nothing wrong with either, but the issues are "black and white". . .pun intended.

[Midnyte_Ragebringer]

this thread was about blacks, not hispanics. VERY different issues. The post was about blacks, the discussion was about blacks, I constrained my comments to blacks.

Race relations are not limited to black people, but you do have to treat the issues separately because the problems are very different.

As far as my "bubble" is concerned, I would put money down on the fact that I have visited and resided in more states and countries than you will in your lifetime.

Please do not assume to know anything about me or what I have done in my life. If you want to discuss the facts, go for it, but please try to restrict yourself from debasing me when you know nothing about me and my past.

Saying that all minority issues should be lumped together, would be offensive in itself to most people and the fact that you think having a large hispanic population is anything like having a large black population is ignorant. Mind you, there is nothing wrong with either, but the issues are "black and white". . .pun intended.

It's important for the labelers on this board to view people they don't agree with, as red necks who have lived in a little hick town all their life.

[Xzion]

this thread was about blacks, not hispanics. VERY different issues. The post was about blacks, the discussion was about blacks, I constrained my comments to blacks.

Race relations are not limited to black people, but you do have to treat the issues separately because the problems are very different.

As far as my "bubble" is concerned, I would put money down on the fact that I have visited and resided in more states and countries than you will in your lifetime.

Please do not assume to know anything about me or what I have done in my life. If you want to discuss the facts, go for it, but please try to restrict yourself from debasing me when you know nothing about me and my past.

Saying that all minority issues should be lumped together, would be offensive in itself to most people and the fact that you think having a large hispanic population is anything like having a large black population is ignorant. Mind you, there is nothing wrong with either, but the issues are "black and white". . .pun intended.

I was arguing in the name of all minorities, thats why i mentioned arabs, blacks, etc in my posts on this thread.
Afirmitive action and racism isnt only geared towards blacks

[Avestan]

The Thread:

"Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California"

You simply cannot talk about black, hispanic, asian, arab, etc issues in the same discussion. Not all of these groups even want affirmative action much less deserve it. My point was directly related to black issues in the United States and that was clear from the beginning. I would be happy to talk about hispanic issues as well, but that was not the topic and I was attacked for limiting my discussion to blacks. . .thus I defended my position. Never once did I say anything about problems pertaining to other cultures and races in the United States. That is a battle for another thread.

[Pherr the Dorf]

The Thread:

"Black Children Denied IQ Tests in California"

You simply cannot talk about black, hispanic, asian, arab, etc issues in the same discussion. Not all of these groups even want affirmative action much less deserve it. My point was directly related to black issues in the United States and that was clear from the beginning. I would be happy to talk about hispanic issues as well, but that was not the topic and I was attacked for limiting my discussion to blacks. . .thus I defended my position. Never once did I say anything about problems pertaining to other cultures and races in the United States. That is a battle for another thread.

See I thought YOU were talking about racism, racism can be linked for racism is hate, it matters not race, or nationality, hate is hate, racism is racism

this would be why I thought that

No doubt in my mind that people in California (at least northern) are completely ignorant when it comes to racial issues and more nocibily afraid of the opposite races. I hear comments here that I cannot imagine I would ever hear in the south because people are so much more conscious of race relations there.

Sorry if I mistook what you were speaking of, it still looks like you were discussing racism to me tho

[Avestan]

fair enough. I should have been more specific. I guess I assumed the theme of the thread would be enough to limit it, but I can understand the confusion. I was referring specifically to blacks.