Return of the King [SPOILERS]

[Fairweather Pure]

I cannot find any reference to Sam actually putting the ring on his finger anywhere. If you can provide proof, I'll believe you. Until then, I see him being labled a "ring bearer" by the other characters in the book as simply ceremonious

[Sheryl]

i thought in the books sam wore the ring so he could be invisible while he followed the orcs around trying to rescue frodo.

[Chmee]

I cannot find any reference to Sam actually putting the ring on his finger anywhere. If you can provide proof, I'll believe you. Until then, I see him being labled a "ring bearer" by the other characters in the book as simply ceremonious

Even if he didn't actually put it on, he is a "ring bearer" even if not a "ring wearer" .

[noel]

I cannot find any reference to Sam actually putting the ring on his finger anywhere. If you can provide proof, I'll believe you. Until then, I see him being labled a "ring bearer" by the other characters in the book as simply ceremonious

My pleasure. (apologies for the length, but there was no way for me to link this)

`But what can I do? Not leave Mr. Frodo dead, unburied on the top of the mountains, and go home? Or go on? Go on?' he repeated, and for a moment doubt and fear shook him. `Go on? Is that what I've got to do? And leave him?'
Then at last he began to weep; and going to Frodo he composed his body, and folded his cold hands upon his breast, and wrapped his cloak about him; and he laid his own sword at one side, and the staff that Faramir had given at the other.
'If I'm to go on,' he said, `then I must take your sword, by your leave, Mr. Frodo, but I'll put this one to lie by you, as it lay by the old king in the barrow; and you've got your beautiful mithril coat from old Mr. Bilbo. And your star-glass, Mr. Frodo, you did lend it to me and I'll need it, for I'll be always in the dark now. It's too good for me, and the Lady gave it to you, but maybe she'd understand. Do _you_ understand, Mr. Frodo? I've got to go on.'

But he could not go, not yet. He knelt and held Frodo's hand and could not release it. And time went by and still he knelt, holding his master's hand, and in his heart keeping a debate.
Now he tried to find strength to tear himself away and go on a lonely journey – for vengeance. If once he could go, his anger would bear him down all the roads of the world, pursuing, until he had him at last: Gollum. Then Gollum would die in a corner. But that was not what he had set out to do. It would not be worth while to leave his master for that. It would not bring him back. Nothing would. They had better both be dead together. And that too would be a lonely journey.
He looked on the bright point of the sword. He thought of the places behind where there was a black brink and an empty fall into nothingness. There was no escape that way. That was to do nothing, not even to grieve. That was not what he had set out to do. 'What am I to do then? ' he cried again, and now he seemed plainly to know the hard answer: _see it through_. Another lonely journey, and the worst.
`What? Me, alone, go to the Crack of Doom and all? ' He quailed still, but the resolve grew. `What? _Me_ take the Ring from _him_? The Council gave it to him.'
But the answer came at once: `And the Council gave him companions, so that the errand should not fail. And you are the last of all the Company. The errand must not fail.'
`I wish I wasn't the last,' he groaned. `I wish old Gandalf was hare or somebody. Why am I left all alone to make up my mind? I'm sure to go wrong. And it's not for me to go taking the Ring, putting myself forward.'
'But you haven't put yourself forward; you've been put forward. And as for not being the right and proper person, why, Mr. Frodo wasn't as you might say, nor Mr. Bilbo. They didn't choose themselves.'
`Ah well, I must make up my own mind. I will make it up. But I'll be sure to go wrong: that'd be Sam Gamgee all over.
'Let me see now: if we're found here, or Mr. Frodo's found, and that Thing's on him, well, the Enemy will get it. And that's the end of all of us, of Lorien, and Rivendell, and the Shire and all. And there s no time to lose, or it'll be the end anyway. The war's begun, and more than likely things are all going the Enemy's way already. No chance to go back with It and get advice or permission. No, it's sit here till they come and kill me over master's body, and gets It: or take It and go.' He drew a deep breath. 'Then take It, it is! '
He stooped. Very gently he undid the clasp at the neck and slipped his hand inside Frodo's tunic; then with his other hand raising the head, he kissed the cold forehead, and softly drew the chain over it. And then the head lay quietly back again in rest. No change came over the still face, and by that more than by all other tokens Sam was convinced at last that Frodo had died and laid aside the Quest.
`Good-bye, master, my dear! ' he murmured. 'Forgive your Sam. He'll come back to this spot when the job's done – if he manages it. And then he'll not leave you again. Rest you quiet till I come; and may no foul creature come anigh you! And if the Lady could hear me and give me one wish, I would wish to come back and find you again. Good-bye! '
And then he bent his own neck and put the chain upon it, and at once his head was bowed to the ground with the weight of the Ring, as if a great stone had been strung on him. But slowly, as if the weight became less, or new strength grew in him, he raised his head, and then with a great effort got to his feet and found that he could walk and bear his burden. And for a moment he lifted up the Phial and looked down at his master, and the light burned gently now with the soft radiance of the evening-star in summer, and in that light Frodo's face was fair of hue again, pale but beautiful with an elvish beauty, as of one who has long passed the shadows. And with the bitter comfort of that last sight Sam turned and hid the light and stumbled on into the growing dark.

He had not far to go. The tunnel was some way behind; the Cleft a couple of hundred yards ahead, or less. The path was visible in the dusk` a deep rut worn in ages of passage, running now gently up in a long trough with cliffs on either side. The trough narrowed rapidly. Soon Sam came to a long flight of broad shallow steps. Now the orc-tower was right above him, frowning black, and in it the red eye glowed. Now he was hidden in the dark shadow under it. He was coming to the top of the steps and was in the Cleft at last.
'I've made up my mind,' he kept saying to himself. But he had not. Though he had done his best to think it out, what he was doing was altogether against the grain of his nature. `Have I got it wrong? ' he muttered. `What ought I to have done? '
As the sheer sides of the Cleft closed about him, before he reached the actual summit, before he looked at last on the path descending into the Nameless Land. he turned. For a moment, motionless in intolerable doubt, he looked back. He could still see, like a small blot in the gathering gloom, the mouth of the tunnel; and he thought he could see or guess where Frodo lay. He fancied there was a glimmer on the ground down there, or perhaps it was some trick of his tears, as he peered out at that high stony place where all his life had fallen in ruin.
'If only I could have my wish, my one wish,' he sighed, `to go back and find him! ' Then at last he turned to the road in front and took a few steps: the heaviest and the most reluctant he had ever taken.

Only a few steps; and now only a few more and he would be going down and would never see that high place again. And then suddenly he heard cries and voices. He stood still as stone. Orc-voices. They were behind him and before him. A noise of tramping feet and harsh shouts: Orcs were coming up to the Cleft from the far side, from some entry to the tower, perhaps. Tramping feet and shouts behind. He wheeled round. He saw small red lights, torches, winking away below there as they issued from the tunnel. At last the hunt was up. The red eye of the tower had not been blind. He was caught.
Now the flicker of approaching torches and the clink of steel ahead was very near. In a minute they would reach the top and be on him. He had taken too long in making up his mind, and now it was no good. How could he escape, or save himself, or save the Ring? The Ring. He was not aware of any thought or decision. He simply found himself drawing out the chain and taking the Ring in his hand. The head of the orc-company appeared in the Cleft right before him. Then he put it on.

The world changed, and a single moment of time was filled with an hour of thought. At once he was aware that hearing was sharpened while sight was dimmed, but otherwise than in Shelob's lair. All things about him now were not dark but vague; while he himself was there in a grey hazy world, alone, like a small black solid rock and the Ring, weighing down his left hand, was like an orb of hot gold. He did not feel invisible at all, but horribly and uniquely visible; and he knew that somewhere an Eye was searching for him.
He heard the crack of stone, and the murmur of water far off in Morgul Vale; and down away under the rock the bubbling misery of Shelob, groping, lost in some blind passage; and voices in the dungeons of the tower; and the cries of the Orcs as they came out of the tunnel; and deafening, roaring in his ears, the crash of the feet and the rending clamour of the Orcs before him. He shrank against the cliff. But they marched up like a phantom company, grey distorted figures in a mist, only dreams of fear with pale flames in their hands. And they passed him by. He cowered, trying to creep away into some cranny and to hide.
He listened. The Orcs from the tunnel and the others marching down had sighted one another, and both parties were now hurrying and shouting. He heard them both clearly, and he understood what they said. Perhaps the Ring gave understanding of tongues, or simply understanding, especially of the servants of Sauron its maker, so that if he gave heed, he understood and translated the thought to himself. Certainly the Ring had grown greatly in power as it approached the places of its forging; but one thing it did not confer, and that was courage. At present Sam still thought only of hiding, of lying low till all was quiet again; and he listened anxiously. He could not tell how near the voices were, the words seemed almost in his ears.

'Hola! Gorbag! What are you doing up here? Had enough of war already? '
'Orders, you lubber. And what are you doing, Shagrat? Tired of lurking up there? Thinking of coming down to fight? '
'Orders to you. I'm in command of this pass. So speak civil. What's your report? '
'Nothing.'
`Hai! hai! yoi!' A yell broke into the exchanges of the leaders. The Orcs lower down had suddenly seen something. They began to run. So did the others.
`Hai! Hola! Here's something! Lying right in the road. A spy, a spy! ' There was a hoot of snarling horns and a babel of baying voices.

With a dreadful stroke Sam was wakened from his cowering mood. They had seen his master. What would they do? He had heard tales of the Orcs to make the blood run cold. It could not be borne. He sprang up. He flung the Quest and all his decisions away, and fear and doubt with them. He knew now where his place was and had been: at his master's side, though what he could do there was not clear. Back he ran down the steps, down the path towards Frodo.
`How many are there?' he thought. `Thirty or forty from the tower at least, and a lot more than that from down below, I guess. How many can I kill before they get me? They'll see the flame of the sword, as soon as I draw it, and they'll get me sooner or later. I wonder if any song will ever mention it: How Samwise fell in the High Pass and made a wall of bodies round his master. No, no song. Of course not, for the Ring'll be found, and there'll be no more songs. I can't help it. My place is by Mr. Frodo. They must understand that – Elrond and the Council, and the great Lords and Ladies with all their wisdom. Their plans have gone wrong. I can't be their Ring-bearer. Not without Mr. Frodo.'

But the Orcs were out of his dim sight now. He had had no time to consider himself, but now he realized that he was weary, weary almost to exhaustion: his legs would not carry him as he wished. He was too slow. The path seemed miles long. Where had they all got to in the mist?
There they were again! A good way ahead still. A cluster of figures round something lying on the ground; a few seemed to be darting this way and that, bent like dogs on a trail. He tried to make a spurt.
'Come on, Sam! ' he said, `or you'll be too late again.' He loosened the sword in its sheath. In a minute he would draw it, and then-
There was a wild clamour, hooting and laughing, as something was lifted from the ground. 'Ya hoi! Ya harri hoi! Up! Up! '
Then a voice shouted: `Now off! The quick way. Back to the Undergate! She'll not trouble us tonight by all the signs.' The whole band of orc-figures began to move. Four in the middle were carrying a body high on their shoulders. `Ya hoi! '

They had taken Frodo's body. They were off. He could not catch them up. Still he laboured on. The Orcs reached the tunnel and were passing in. Those with the burden went first, and behind them there was a good deal of struggling and jostling. Sam came on. He drew the sword, a flicker of blue in his wavering hand, but they did not see it. Even as he came panting up, the last of them vanished into the black hole.
For a moment he stood, gasping, clutching his breast. Then he drew his sleeve across his face, wiping away the grime, and sweat, and tears. 'Curse the filth! ' he said, and sprang after them into the darkness.

All was ominously quiet. The light was no more than that of dusk at a dark day's end. The vast vapours that arose in Mordor and went streaming westward passed low overhead, a great welter of cloud and smoke now lit again beneath with a sullen glow of red.
Sam looked up towards the orc-tower, and suddenly from its narrow windows lights stared out like small red eyes. He wondered if they were some signal. His fear of the orcs, forgotten for a while in his wrath and desperation, now returned. As far as he could see, there was only one possible course for him to take: he must go on and try to find the main entrance to the dreadful tower; but his knees felt weak, and he found that he was trembling. Drawing his eyes down from the tower and the horns of the Cleft before him, he forced his unwilling feet to obey him, and slowly, listening with all his ears, peering into the dense shadows of the rocks beside the way, he retraced his steps, past the place where Frodo fell, and still the stench of Shelob lingered, and then on and up, until he stood again in the very cleft where he had put on the Ring and seen Shagrat's company go by.
There he halted and sat down. For the moment he could drive himself no further. He felt that if once he went beyond the crown of the pass and took one step veritably down into the land of Mordor, that step would be irrevocable. He could never come back. Without any clear purpose he drew out the Ring and put it on again. Immediately he felt the great burden of its weight, and felt afresh, but now more strong and urgent than ever, the malice of the Eye of Mordor, searching, trying to pierce the shadows that it had made for its own defence, but which now hindered it in its unquiet and doubt.
As before, Sam found that his hearing was sharpened, but that to his sight the things of this world seemed thin and vague. The rocky walls of the path were pale, as if seen through a mist, but still at a distance he heard the bubbling of Shelob in her misery: and harsh and clear, and very close it seemed, he heard cries and the clash of metal. He sprang to his feet, and pressed himself against the wall beside the road. He was glad of the Ring, for here was yet another company of orcs on the march. Or so at first he thought. Then suddenly he realized that it was not so, his hearing had deceived him: the orc-cries came from the tower, whose topmost horn was now right above him, on the left hand of the Cleft.
Sam shuddered and tried to force himself to move. There was plainly some devilry going on. Perhaps in spite of all orders the cruelty of the orcs had mastered them, and they were tormenting Frodo, or even savagely hacking him to pieces. He listened; and as he did a gleam of hope came to him. There could not be much doubt: there was fighting in the tower, the orcs must be at war among themselves, Shagrat and Gorbag had come to blows. Faint as was the hope that his guess brought him, it was enough to rouse him. There might be just a chance. His love for Frodo rose above all other thoughts, and forgetting his peril he cried aloud: 'I'm coming, Mr. Frodo!'
He ran forward to the climbing path, and over it. At once the road turned left and plunged steeply down. Sam had crossed into Mordor.

He took off the Ring, moved it may be by some deep premonition of danger, though to himself he thought only that he wished to see more clearly. `Better have a look at the worst,' he muttered. `No good blundering about in a fog!'

Agree with all of what Chmee said, save the Gollum deceiving Frodo part which though was not in the book worked well in the movie and didn't detract from the meaning imho.

[Sirensa]

haha damn you Aranuil I was about to cut and paste that same passage ;D

[noel]

haha damn you Aranuil I was about to cut and paste that same passage ;D

^_^

[Truant]

Yeah sam wore it...and wore it for a considerable amount of time...

[Deneve]

-A flaming Denethor leaping off the precipice at the top of Minas Tirith (was pretty hilarious actually)

that was great imo. There were several discrepencies from the book though, most of which i chose to ignore in favor of just enjoying the movie.
Conflicting parts i noticed
-the undead army never made it to minaz tirath, they just killed the army arriving from the south and then departed
-when Eowyn stabbed the witch king she was incapacitated by the energies that ran into her through the blade, and she was originally assumed dead
-when they approached the black gate orcs did not charge out to attack, they met with one of sauron's officers a corrupted elf (dark elf?) and then the battle began shortly after
-they totally skipped the "Scarring of the Shire"
btw, i want to be the witch king for halloween, his helm was way too kickass.

[noel]

The 'Mouth of Sauron' character was credited at onering.net, but did not appear in the movie. I'm betting we'll see it in the EE.

[Voronwë]

yeah i was hoping to see him/it

[suppin]

I never read the books, so what were some things that if were "filled in" would make the movie make more sense?.. someone mentioned the eagles at the end, I didn't know that part had a meaning other than what we saw, but what else was there that they didn't show in the movie that you "should" know?

[noel]

A lot of it has been alluded to elsewhere on this thread, but I believe the two most important things that weren't shown in the movie were:

1) Denethor had a palantir and used it to see far and wide. Unbeknownst to him, as Chmee stated, he was being shown images that Sauron wanted him to see. This attributed in a large part to the madness you saw projected in the movie.

2) As the true King of Gondor, Aragorn had the power to heal. I believe it was with his bare hands, but perhaps I'm mistaken and he used the plant Kingsfoil as he did on Frodo in The Fellowship of the Ring. It's my recollection that he used this power on Faramir, Éowyn, Merry and I think Pippen to heal them after the battle of Pelennor Fields. It was not directly shown in the movie, but though Éowyn was able to slay the Witch King, the killing blow nearly killed her. As a matter of fact, she was thought dead by her brother, Éomer.

By using his touch to heal, Aragorn showed that he was the true King of Gondor.

Edit: Because pasting in names that start with É is HARD. Thanks Truant.

[Truant]

Typo, Eowyn killed the witch king, not Eomer, tho I know what you meant.

Aragorn only laid hands on Faramir...which only revived him...he used kingsfoil on him for healing, as well as on Eowyn and Merry. His knowledge of how to heal them as well as his miraculous hands were the indicators of the prophecy, etc, etc.

[Voronwë]

personally i dont think that is that big of a deal to not have the healing powers.

all that we really need to know is that Aragorn is Isildur's heir. He's got the bloodlines and the sword, thats pretty much good enough for your archtypical ascension.

[Dregor Thule]

Fucking unbelievably good movie. No complaints on the story, no matter how they deviated from the books, because I'm not overly anal and just appreciate the translation and sacrifices needed to be made for it to go from book form to movie form. Any gripes I do have are technical ones, be it the midget stand-ins being way too obvious sometimes, the faking of perspective to alter the size of an actor compared to others (I'm forgetting what this is called and it's killing me.. parallax?), or just noticeable errors on the digital effects side/compositing side of things. I tell ya, knowing how it's done ruins it a bit because you look for the errors

As for cameo's in the film, the other beacon guard was the storyboard artist. And I noticed the Peter Jackson thing as the pirate captain, but it didn't click until afterwards.

Oh ya, and the Legolas "riding" the "trunk" was tacky!

[noel]

personally i dont think that is that big of a deal to not have the healing powers.

all that we really need to know is that Aragorn is Isildur's heir. He's got the bloodlines and the sword, thats pretty much good enough for your archtypical ascension.

You have to realize that I'm probably the biggest Aragorn fanboi of all time, so this is why I feel it's important.

[Arborealus]

(I'm forgetting what this is called and it's killing me.. parallax?)

Forced perspective?

[Cotto]

Holy good fuck.

It was superbe, the whole damn thing was brilliant. I cant think of one part of it I didnt.

Well I can, but it wasnt in the film, three kids at the very front where banging their screwball icecream cones on something, and then one started to jump (infront of the fucking screen) at the end. Parents calmly sitting three rows behind them. Little fuckers.

[Arborealus]

I'm thinking there may well be more of the Rangers of the North in the extended version...At the Black gate Aragorn says "Brothers"...and Elladan and Elrohir were at the coronation: black haired elves = house of elrond...And Elladan and Elrohir were always up north with the Rangers...
So maybe this was shot...

Back to the Palantir...yeah Saruman's needs to be thrown out of Orthanc...And we need to see the one in Gondor which Sauron used to warp the will of Denethor...I think we will...

I did want to see the Mouth at the Black Gate...I know when Aragorn said let the Lord of this Black Land etc etc My first though was ooooh Mouth of Sauron...but, I can see why he didn't pop in a character on the scale of The Mouth here...

Houses of the healing...yup it was the Athelas (Kingsfoil) used in healing Faramir and Eowyn and Merry as I recall...This is such a Tolkien thing...showing the origin of a name so graphically......He loved the names of things and places...

I really didn't have an issue with the ending...Sam had to go back to Rosie and Elanor and ay "well I am back"...there was just no reason to say the "last ship"...I also loved seeing Narya on his finger at the Grey Havens with Cirdan...A nod to the fact that he had received the ring from Cirdan when he came into Middle Earth...

And the bit about Gandalf being the eldest had nada to to with the movie...that was an aside...Gandalf wasn't reborn though...He says..."Naked was I sent back"...

[Runcade]

just thought i would post and say that i read Time magazine and they said that aragorns healing would be put in the EE as would a 7 min scene at Orthanc with the palantir better explained. i personally liked the attention to some smaller details. like the launching of the heads into minis tirith. was kind of sad about the Mouth of Sauron and that they didnt have frodo and sam,disguised as orcs, travel with them, also the palantir with denethor was kind of important. they had all the orcs move towards the gate which isnt exactly how it happened in the book but close enough. i loved how pippen sang while faramir's men rode to their deaths and the Lord Nazguls Mace was kick ass. got some questions for the people that are even more hardcore than i am. How are the beacons lit in the book and do the eagles fight the nazgul at the gate in the book. and did anyone else see the Darth Maul orc with the black and red face?

[noel]

The beacons were actually already lit when Gandalf and Pippen arrived in Minas Tirith.

'When?' said Pippin. 'Have you a guess? For I saw the beacons last night and the errand-riders; and Gandalf said that it was a sign that war had begun. He seemed in a desperate hurry. But now everything seems to have slowed up again.'
'Only because everything is now ready,' said Beregond. 'It is but the deep breath before the plunge.'
'But why were the beacons lit last night?'
'It is over-late to send for aid when you are already besieged,' answered Beregond. 'But I do not know the counsel of the Lord and his captains. They have many ways of gathering news. And the Lord Denethor is unlike other men: he sees far. Some say that as he sits alone in his high chamber in the Tower at night, and bends his thought this way and that, he can read somewhat of the future; and that he will at times search even the mind of the Enemy, wrestling with him. And so it is that he is old, worn before his time. But however that may be, my lord Faramir is abroad, beyond the River on some perilous errand, and he may have sent tidings.
'But if you would know what I think set the beacons ablaze, it was the news that came yestereve out of Lebennin. There is a great fleet drawing near to the mouths of Anduin, manned by the corsairs of Umbar in the South. They have long ceased to fear the might of Gondor, and they have allied them with the Enemy, and now make a heavy stroke in his cause. For this attack will draw off much of the help that we looked to have from Lebennin and Belfalas, where folk are hardy and numerous. All the more do our thoughts go north to Rohan; and the more glad are we for these tidings of victory that you bring.

I believe the eagles did in fact fight the Nazgul, but not certain.

[cid]

RUDY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[vn_Tanc]

I was very pleased to see the Witch King weilding his sword as well as that motherfucker morning star. Cos I've got a replica and it's pretty badass You can barely make it out in FotR and it doesn't appear at all in TTT but I was treated to a good look when Mr Angmar's bird got the chop.
I have Glamdring too which also got good mileage. And now the company that makes them is tempting me with Theoden's sword and "coming soon: The staff of Gandalf The White".
Yes I am geeky enough that I had to get them both out for a whirl after returning from the cinema

[Arborealus]

Gwaihir and Landroval arrived with the Eagles moments before the Ring was destroyed...Just as the Nazgul fled back to Barad-dur...No mention of any engagement at all...Though the eagles swooped down on them...I reckon artistic license would allow an eagle to take a swipe at a Nazgul but not much more...

[Siji]

Great movie.. lots of applause from the audience in the theater.

The whole thing with Sam just before Shelob was pointless and stupid imho. Elephant surfing was also dumb. One shot from his bow kills it when there's 300 others on the other critters?

The big battle didn't seem drawn out like TTT's did. There were several camera angles that I didn't care for, and there's one place in particular (perhaps its at the last goodbye if I remember) that you can easily see the outline on the hobbits versus the background they were pasted against. They could have done better at that with all the other amazing feats they pulled off.

All in all, the best of the 3 easily. Anxiously awaiting The Hobbit.

[Kwonryu DragonFist]

Perhaps Legolas is using special magic arrows!

Or just hit the 'spot'!

[Cotto]

Are they even doing The Hobbit. If they did it would have to be Ian Holm as Bilbo, there really isnt a choice there.

I think Legolas managed to kill the olephant with his arrows cause he shot them at point blank range into his brain.. Imagine someone shooting sewing needles at you. Yeah theyd fucking hurt, but youd still be walking around, probably beating the shit out of them, but if they managed to get two directly into your skull so it hit your brain you could die.

[noel]

Are they even doing The Hobbit. If they did it would have to be Ian Holm as Bilbo, there really isnt a choice there.

Jackson had initially stated he wouldn't be doing the Hobbit, but in recent memory has been very seriously considering it. Only info I have is below:

In interviews given at the European premiere of Return of the King, Peter Jackson was saying today that he now would quite like to make a movie version of "The Hobbit" (when asked before he always said that he wanted to see it adapted to cinema but he didn't want to be the one to make it).

He also said that he'd want to try and get Ian McKellan back as Gandalf, Andy Serkis to reprise Gollum, etc. Yeah, he'd fuck with it (he specifically mentioned writing Arwen in so Liv Tyler can be in it) but even so it would probably rock. A nice linear story, lots of fights with orcs, a big goddamn dragon... yeah, sign me up for some of that.

[Runcade]

legolas put three arrows into the back of the oliphants head/brain. that would be enough to kill it imo.

[Vetiria]

The Hobbit is tied up in legal wranglings right now. I read somewhere that after he makes King Kong he's going to try to get the rights to make it. He'll only do with New Line, and I think it's Paramount that owns the rights to the movie (don't quote me on that).

[Xzion]

a fucking awesome movie in every perspective, but i still have a few rants

notice the elophant(sp) riders were the first and only non-white people in the movie? i actually couldnt tell if they were white or indian/arab...but that was still a bit unrealistic...in a fantasy middle earth setting with different races like elves, dwarfs, humans etc...everyone is white?
some black and asian hobbets would be pretty cool

also i didnt like how the movie had to many "close calls", like you see in almost every cheezy action flick...like where the orc was about to stab frodo, but then all of a sudden sam appears behind him and kills him? at least 2 more scenes like that happened with the spider, as well as countless times in that major battle

the last thing you heard about saruman was when gimli showed up and said something like "lets have his head and move on" when someone else just said let him be, no backround on what happend saruman really pissed me off, they could have cut out a lot of other scenes if they had to to make room for that...even if only 5 minutes in total

edit:didnt read the book thats all based on the movie

[Salis]

Did you read the book dickwad?

[Sartori]

notice the elophant(sp) riders were the first and only non-white people in the movie? i actually couldnt tell if they were white or indian/arab...but that was still a bit unrealistic...in a fantasy middle earth setting with different races like elves, dwarfs, humans etc...everyone is white?
some black and asian hobbets would be pretty cool

Don't mean to sound uncaring, but really after reading that i'm starting to picture NAACP picketing the fucking theater...and no, there's nothing unrealistic about it. Southrons are black I think, but honestly it's an old book written by an old english dude who was probably racist as hell irl, so deal.

[Xzion]

As I was saying, its NOT THAT BIG of a rant, but i think it would have helped a lot if even just the humans had a more diverse cast of even just extras, instead of making the battle scenes look like oneof hitlers wet dreams. I know Rohan was sposed to have more of a nordic theme, but if some of gondors soldiers were black, spanish, asian etc it would have been more fitting.
Even if jrr was an old racist brit, jackson obviously put some of his own interpritations of the novel in the movie and could have easily implicated that.
I wonder what they would say to a qualified black stuntman that auditioned for a part?
sorry, only white people allowed in middle earth...boy

I only read some of the fellowship so far, but i doubt that when helms deep was taken place he mentioned somewhere a long the lines "the few (WHITE, ONLY WHITE, NO NIGGERS) soldiers ready to resist the invasion at helms deep..."

[Zaelath]

What a bunch of cock, next you'll be what, complaining that Spike Lee movies don't have enough white people in it? Or how about that the Cosby Show only ever had one white kid and he was a little fat, mute, retard kid?

Get a grip, stroke it, feel better.

[noel]

Now would be a good time to start reading in general.

[Xzion]

What a bunch of cock, next you'll be what, complaining that Spike Lee movies don't have enough white people in it? Or how about that the Cosby Show only ever had one white kid and he was a little fat, mute, retard kid?

Get a grip, stroke it, feel better.

the cosby show is about a black family...LOTR is about an entire fucking planet

nice job comparing THE COSBY SHOW to LOTR

[Kwonryu DragonFist]

Would've been interesting to see some tribal Zulu Warriors from the South and some Oriental Cavalry-Archers(Mongols) hehe!

Perhaps they will show up in another movie!

[Truant]

LoTR is not about a planet, it's about one continent on a planet. The Southrons were from a desert area, and hence dark skinned. The rest of Middle Earth was very temperate...you could compare it to Europe...how many dark skinned people evolved in Europe...none? Fucking think about it before you start spewing your ignorance. I know it's hard for you to understand things, but at least stfu sometimes instead of making yourself into a bigger ass.

[Cotto]

LOTR is not about an entire fucking planet. Its about part of, one continent.

Lets not bring racisim into LoTR, its bad enough that some wank thought the Two Towers was reference to Sept 11th.

[Zaelath]

What a bunch of cock, next you'll be what, complaining that Spike Lee movies don't have enough white people in it? Or how about that the Cosby Show only ever had one white kid and he was a little fat, mute, retard kid?

Get a grip, stroke it, feel better.

the cosby show is about a black family...LOTR is about an entire fucking planet

nice job comparing THE COSBY SHOW to LOTR

It makes far more sense to talk about racism on a show that was based on EARTH than one based in a FANTASY WORLD. Not to mention, negros are a minority in the US yet there is one token white freak in the entire show (basically). Yes, it's a black family, but they interact w/ a LOT of people in the show...

[noel]

One of Tolkein's main goals when writing LotR was to develop a mythology unique to the British Isles... The book is very much a reflection of Europe, not the entire world...

Enjoy the book for what it is, or don't, but for fuck's sake, don't start whining because your race of choice isn't given proper representation. Do a little research, and you'll probably figure out why. Affirmative action doesn't apply to literature. It's not racism that caused him to omit pseudo-african culture... If I wrote a book about Norse Vikings, would you expect to see africans in it? Complain about Greek, Roman, Norse and Arthurian mythology not representing the black man first, since they came much earlier than LotR.

[Legenae]

I finally got to see RotK last night. Absolutely loved it! I'll be going to see it a second time for sure.

I will say, I'm kind of sad that this trilogy has finally come to an end. I doubt that there will ever be another movie that will build up the anticipation as these 3 movies have done... for me anyways. I think Peter Jackson did an excellent job of bringing the world of Lord of the Rings to life (even if there were some deviations from the books).

i like the rohan 'theme' =)

I love the Rohan theme!

That is all. Back to your flame fest.

[Fairweather Pure]

sorry, only white people allowed in middle earth...boy

Rumor has it that in the Extended Edition of RotK, the horsemen of Rohan's charge will be led by a black lesbian in a wheelchair. Check it out!

[Aabidano]

If you'd read the book, both the hobbits and the rohirrum<sp> were both originally from the far north. Hence no "hobbits of color".

As someone else mentioned, the southrens on the elephants were dark as they were from a desert area.

The mouth of sauron was a dark numenorean, says that in the footnotes of the third book.

Just got back from the movie, it was pretty good. Think I like the first one best though.

[Kithyen]

Just got back from watching this. The only thing I didn't like was the over drawn ending (The tidal wave of urine smashing up against the walls of my blatter like the flaming wolf head battering ram may have had something to do with that) and the image that came to my mind during the aftermath of the ring's destruction.



I had to sanitize my eyes.

[murr]

sorry, only white people allowed in middle earth...boy

Rumor has it that in the Extended Edition of RotK, the horsemen of Rohan's charge will be led by a black lesbian in a wheelchair. Check it out!

Hahahaha
gold

[Xzion]

It seems you all expect me to know the origin and backround of every race in LOTR and the climate and geography of every region, hence giving me a knowlage of the skintone and racial backround of all of middle earths kingdoms, and for being "ignorant" of useless Middle earth trivia someone like truant has to go waving his cock around on teh intArweb and try to put down those lesser to him in such trivia.

Shit all someone would have to bring up is middle earth was supposed to represent a continent or region of the LOTR world, and not the entire world itself...then it would have all made sence eh?

[noel]

I thought my description was pretty fucking good. Apparently you just want to argue, OR perhaps... you're just too stupid to get it.

[Vetiria]

Shit all someone would have to bring up is middle earth was supposed to represent a continent or region of the LOTR world, and not the entire world itself...then it would have all made sence eh?

Perhaps you would have caught that throughout all the movies when they show elves leaving Middle Earth to go off to the West to another part of the world. But then again I guess some people are more worried about what Jesse Jackson would do instead of paying attention to the plotline of a movie.