Texas University Shuts Down Bake Sale with Race based prices

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 25, 2003, 11:18 am

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld ... -headlines

DALLAS -- Southern Methodist University shut down a bake sale Wednesday in which cookies were offered for sale at different prices, depending on the buyer's race or gender.

The sale was organized by the Young Conservatives of Texas, who said it was intended as a protest of affirmative action.

A sign said white males had to pay $1 for a cookie. The price was 75 cents for white women, 50 cents for Hispanics and 25 cents for blacks.

Members of the conservative group said they meant no offense and were only trying to protest the use of race or gender as a factor in college admissions.

Similar sales have been held by College Republican chapters at colleges in at least five other states since February.

A black student filed a complaint with SMU, saying the sale was offensive. SMU officials said they halted the event after 45 minutes because it created a potentially unsafe situation.

"This was not an issue about free speech," Tim Moore, director of the SMU student center, said in a story for Thursday's edition of The Dallas Morning News. "It was really an issue where we had a hostile environment being created."

The sale drew a crowd outside the student center and several students engaged in a shouting match, Moore said.

David C. Rushing, 23, a law student and chairman of Young Conservatives of Texas at SMU and for the state, said the event didn't get out of hand. At most, a dozen students gathered around the table of cookies and Rice Krispies treats, he said.

"We copied what's been done at multiple campuses around the country to illustrate our opinion of affirmative action and how we think it's unfair," he said.

Matt Houston, a 19-year-old sophomore, called the group's price list offensive.

"My reaction was disgust because of the ignorance of some SMU students," said Houston, who is black. "They were arguing that affirmative action was solely based on race. It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."

The group sold three cookies during its protest, raising $1.50.

In June, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled universities could use race as a factor in admissions under limited conditions. In Texas, universities had been banned from using race as a factor under a 1996 decision by a lower court.

I think it's a very good way to illustrate affirmative action, and the one counter the black guy had did not make any sense 'They were arguing that affirmative action was solely based on race. It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization'. Umm, it IS based on race. I need to restate my opinion on affirmative action. I don't like it, never have, BUT, I do feel that it fills a gap, better to have something there than nothing at all right now. We need something in place of affirmative action, but I am not pretending to have all the answers and say what 'that' is. I understand it, trying to make up for generations of oppressive practices that are hard wires into society. It will take generations to get minorities back on track and on an even playing field as I think kyoukan mentioned in the past, I just don't agree with how AA is doing it.

-edit- and I don't think the bake sale was racist, it seems anyone that disagrees with AA is thus labelled. It just made an extreme 'and I use the term loosely' political viewpoint very clear.

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » September 25, 2003, 11:37 am

You're black? you get 20 points of consideration. You're Native American? You get 30 points of consideration. etc.

To a strong affirmative action supporter, they can't relate to this, they'll talk and talk about building diversity and how it's all a good thing totally disconnected from the way their goal is pursued.

So, hearing the comments you just described Krimson doesn't surprise me. That guy who didn't like it can't relate to reality.

Is it ok to pursue noble goals via hypocritical methods?

Is it ok to steal from the rich to give to the poor?

Classic ethical quandry.

Personally I enjoy an environment where my peers come from all over. I've learned a lot from it. My chance to learn from them was gained at the expense of some other individual who wasn't allowed to attend this university because he didn't have the right skin pigmentation.

My gain, some white guy's loss. Is it fair? Hard to say.

Burke · Post by **Burke** » September 25, 2003, 11:40 am

The group sold three cookies during its protest, raising $1.50.

How many different cookie combinations are possible? Class?

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » September 25, 2003, 11:42 am

"They were arguing that affirmative action was solely based on race. It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."

It always surprises me seeing otherwise sensible, educated people making statements like that. Though I guess it shouldn't anymore.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » September 25, 2003, 11:46 am

i think a better thing to protest is that in the same positions white men tend to be better componsated than females or minorities.

now why couldnt i be one of those overcompensated white males?

Truant · Post by **Truant** » September 25, 2003, 11:49 am

Interesting...

I personally think affirmative action is the biggest pile of horseshit ever.

Then again I'm a white male, so of course I would, right?

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » September 25, 2003, 11:56 am

People benefit from interacting with other cultures.

If we had that a little more, we might not have so many troubles with the Middle East.

How do you fairly pursue diversity? Figure that out and you'll be everyone's hero.

Post by **Sylvus** » September 25, 2003, 12:19 pm

Adex_Xeda wrote:If we had that a little more, we might not have so many troubles with the Middle East.

How do you mean? Do you honestly think that any of the problems we're having with the Middle East are caused by a lack of cultural diversity over here? If anything, I'd say it's just the opposite and dislike of our diversity permeating their somewhat homogeneous culture, along with our support for Israel, lust for oil and probably several other things are what are causing our problems in the Middle East. I certainly don't see Affirmative Action having anything at all to do with the situation over there.

Marbus · Post by **Marbus** » September 25, 2003, 12:38 pm

I see the benefits from it and being pretty liberal, becoming more so in college after I told the State College Republicans where they could stick their offer of Chairman. However I FIRST had on numerous occasians watched this fail miserably.

Trying to ensure a diverse population to let everyone get an education? Noble and Grand, don't have really a problem with it but...

Letting unqualified individuals into graduate programs where they can seriously screw someone's life up because of their race? that is bullshit!

The college I went to limits the student body to 1000 students at any given time to keep class size small. We had a pretty diverse population of "above average students." As a pre-med stundent we all hung out and studied together because we has so much work. By our sophomore year it was obvious that some people just weren't going to make it. They just didn't understand it and would probably be better off doing something else. The population of people in this category was pretty equil on race and gender. Of course all of those people continued on a applied for Medical School. Jr year we all take the MCAT some scores predict exactly what many of us had seen... some people just didn't get it.

But when the acceptances were announed for the next year many of us we in awe of what we read (admittedly I didn't get in the first time due to a misunderstanding with one of my references, one I didn't need actually as she was a Philosophy teacher... she wrote that I did need to go to Med school but because my true calling was to be a minister. Once I got that cleared up I had a place to start the next year - just didn't want people thinking I had ulteror motives for the post).

Anyway when the list came out there were some people that we knew would obviously get in and some we thought well maybe then those we thought...no chance in hell. What was amazing is that there were some white males with excellent grades, MCATs, references who had been working or volunteering at hostpitals who DIDN'T get it. These were people who LIVED biology and had a personality to boot. There was NO WAY they couldn't have been selected but they weren't... then we read on down and see that 4 Black Females from the "No way in Hell" category all got in. WTF was that? One of them earlier in the year had to drop out of most of her biology classes because she was failing... her statement was "dosen't matter, I'm a black female, I'll get in" AND SHE WAS RIGHT! Please being Black or being female is not the issue. 2 of the people in the group of people who were brilliant were black females. They studied and worked hard and had the intelligence, they desivered Med school not because of race or gender but because they had what it took. I would trust either of them with my life. However there were other people who worked just as hard, had the same intelligence etc.. but didn't get in BECAUSE they were white males. To this day it scares me to think that somewhere those other girls are Drs now, there is little doubt in my mind they have already killed off a few patients because of "accidents".

My point... give people a chance but don't judge on race. Just take it off form all together. Those that work hard and can make the cut will, it shouldn't matter their gender or race and we will all be better off in the long run... at least IMHO.

Marb

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » September 25, 2003, 12:43 pm

Here's an example Sylvus,

I know a guy from Lebanon who is a citizen in the US now.

He has told me stories about how the mass migration of displaced Palestinians affected his family.

He helps me understand the bitterness many Lebonese people feel towards Israel that I wouldn't otherwise know about.

He recounts how the US, Soviets, and Europe during the cold war would monkey with the politics in the region. He helped me understand why even a newly freed Iraqi people would be distrustful and chaffed by a US army in their country.

If more Americans were exposed to culture in the middle east, we as a whole would be making better foreign policy decisions.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 25, 2003, 12:54 pm

How do you fairly pursue diversity?

You use peer pressure to embarass the fuck out of people who make decisions of any sort based on race.

Post by **Sylvus** » September 25, 2003, 1:17 pm

Adex_Xeda wrote:If more Americans were exposed to culture in the middle east, we as a whole would be making better foreign policy decisions.

Hmm... half of my friends are of Middle Eastern descent and I live next to the largest concentration of Arabs (Dearborn, MI) this side of the Middle East, so I guess I sort of took for granted that people just knew that kind of stuff. It was my belief that our foreign policy snafus had less to do with a lack of understanding their culture and more to do with a bunch of shitheads making our foreign policy decisions.

I certainly won't disagree with wanting Americans to be exposed to people from the Middle East. Most that I have known have had a really strong relationship with their families and have been friendly, intelligent people. Plus their food is fantastic!

But I digress, this has very little to do wtih Affirmative Action.

Sionistic · Post by **Sionistic** » September 25, 2003, 1:21 pm

Burke wrote:
The group sold three cookies during its protest, raising $1.50.
How many different cookie combinations are possible? Class?

easy, a bus full of indians

masteen · Post by **masteen** » September 25, 2003, 1:22 pm

I liked the diverse environment at the University of Florida because I got to date some hot black and asian chicks.

Sionistic · Post by **Sionistic** » September 25, 2003, 1:24 pm

and as for the protest, i agree with the point they were trying to make, but it wasnt the best way to do it, it sounded like there would be some violence eventually

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » September 25, 2003, 1:55 pm

I guess even boring, uncreative white male college conservatives need an outlet to channel their indignation and rage about having to share their god given right to a college education with the goddam niggers and spics, not to mention the fucking queers, but couldn't they come up with something a tad more original than another fucking bake sale with cheaper prices for the inferior races and genders? HAY GUYZ LETS DO THIS BAKE SALE I READ ABOUT IT ON MIKE SAVAGE'S WEBSITE IT'LL BE TOTALLY RAD WE'LL REALLY STICK IT TO THOSE COLOREDS.

I always see a bunch of spoiled white men whining about affirmative action and how unfair it is to them, but nobody ever offers any logical alternatives to close the massive social and economic disparity between the races and genders in the US.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 25, 2003, 2:02 pm

That's because there are no alternatives.

-edit-I would almost fully support AA if for one thing, they started giving qualified minorities the oportunities, and not just minorities with a pulse. There, problem solved for me for the most part.

Post by **Sylvus** » September 25, 2003, 2:20 pm

Krimson Klaw wrote:I would almost fully support AA if for one thing, they started giving qualified minorities the oportunities, and not just minorities with a pulse. There, problem solved for me for the most part.

Amen to that. The problem there is finding the qualified minorities, which would probably be an administrative nightmare.

Mort · Post by **Mort** » September 25, 2003, 2:41 pm

kyoukan wrote:I guess even boring, uncreative white male college conservatives need an outlet to channel their indignation and rage about having to share their god given right to a college education with the goddam niggers and spics, not to mention the fucking queers, but couldn't they come up with something a tad more original than another fucking bake sale with cheaper prices for the inferior races and genders? HAY GUYZ LETS DO THIS BAKE SALE I READ ABOUT IT ON MIKE SAVAGE'S WEBSITE IT'LL BE TOTALLY RAD WE'LL REALLY STICK IT TO THOSE COLOREDS.

I always see a bunch of spoiled white men whining about affirmative action and how unfair it is to them, but nobody ever offers any logical alternatives to close the massive social and economic disparity between the races and genders in the US.

OMG, I didnt see this coming...... Not from Kyou. Have you ever actually listened to him Kyou? Do you know his stance on ANYTHING? Or is this just some more anti-American spew? I'm not defending him, I know he's pretty hardcore, but I do listen to his show a few times a week.... do you? (Savage I mean)

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » September 25, 2003, 2:44 pm

AA is ass. kyoukan is retarded as usual. The students weren't saying they didn't want minorities at the school, they were protesting the lameness that is AA.

The solution is to get a pair of pliers and a blow torch and go to work on racists one by one and then dye white people's skin black and do whatever Michael Jackson did to his skin to black people. The final solution would be a requirement to genetically alter DNA in all new fertilized eggs with two options...one, have a fro, white skin and a j-lo ass or two, have black skin but no ass.

I hate these discussions. They're usually all bitching with no solutions.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » September 25, 2003, 2:47 pm

""My reaction was disgust because of the ignorance of some SMU students," said Houston, who is black. "They were arguing that affirmative action was solely based on race. It's not based on race. It's based on bringing a diverse community to a certain organization."

The above is so bloody stupid that it does prove one frequent charge of black organizations correct, the newsmedia responding to any situation immediately finds the black guy or girl who is the biggest dumbass within 5 square miles.

Kyoukan is not a racist, she just hates people of certain skin tones.

Crav · Post by **Crav** » September 25, 2003, 3:00 pm

The problem really begins with education. Unfortunately minority and underprivileged students go to schools funded by the property taxes from poor neighborhoods, which means that they do not get an equal education as students from richer neighborhoods (usually white middle to upper middle class families).
Now what caused this situation? Was it that the poor people were just too lazy and stupid to lift themselves up and have the "American Dream"? Was it that most of these people never really had a choice or a chance for that matter? A lot of poor people began working in their early to mid teens because they had to help support their families, now some of their children have had to do the same and other have not. The world is a very unfair place, the thing is we usually only see how unfair it is when it affects us personally.
Affirmative action is a very unfair practice, but at the moment it's the only thing helping some of those people that for one reason or another did not receive the proper education needed in K-12 schooling. You want to get rid of AA, it's very simple, have your congressmen support a better funded public education system. I wonder how much 187 billion would help?

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 25, 2003, 3:03 pm

Excellent post.

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 25, 2003, 3:54 pm

187 billion is best served in the Iraq situation. Not our schools.

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » September 25, 2003, 3:57 pm

I don't think it's fair that I can be punished (in essence) for something my ancestors may or may not have done. Or that someone else can be rewarded for something that was done to their ancestors.

For the last 20 years, people that deserved admission to a college (or whatever), have been able to get it. It should be completely based on thier own merits, not on a an accident of birth. AA just enforces the belief that I deserve something just because I'm "special".

Anyone in the US can go anyplace they want in life provided they are willing to work for it.

*Edit -

Sylvus wrote:Amen to that. The problem there is finding the qualified minorities, which would probably be an administrative nightmare.

Not really, those folks that have the grades\drive to attend college are all in or went to high school somewhere.

Zaelath · Post by **Zaelath** » September 25, 2003, 4:15 pm

Not to put too fine a point on it, but where do the black people that "make it" go?

I don't see anyone worrying about AA and the "yellow" people because they look after their own...

Now, if you really want to be colour blind you can't make any differentiation, positive or negative. AA doesn't help "the cause" it simply makes arbitrary winners and arbitrary losers and reinforces the seperation.

Crav · Post by **Crav** » September 25, 2003, 4:19 pm

187 billion is best served in the Iraq situation. Not our schools.

Yes of course it is and 10 years from now when we have an undereducated working class filling up the unemployment line because all the blue collar jobs have been moved to China and South America and all the white collar jobs have moved to India and other parts of the world we can take pride in how we changed the world for the better.

I don't think it's fair that I can be punished (in essence) for something my ancestors may or may not have done. Or that someone else can be rewarded for something that was done to their ancestors.

Like I said neither system is fair, they just are. You want it to change then volunteer to help tutor under privileged kids so that they become qualified and there is no need for AA or write to your congressmen to help provide better public education to all children.

Anyone in the US can go anyplace they want in life provided they are willing to work for it.

I am sorry, but this just is not true. Have you ever met a family with both parents working minimum wage jobs and barely making it? Go and ask them if they can go anyplace they want to live? Do you think the migrant workers out in the fields can do whatever they want? Can you say that they don't work as hard as anyone else in this country?

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 25, 2003, 4:36 pm

It is true, Crav. Starting from some family background you have to sweat more, but noone is excluded by their social status at birth.

You want to solve the racial discrimination, you eliminate support for racially motivated decision. You don't flip the racism 180 degrees and call it justice.

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » September 25, 2003, 4:38 pm

Have you ever met a family with both parents working minimum wage jobs and barely making it?

Yes, and I've seen them take turns going to college on grants\loans, busting their ass to get somewhere in life.

They own a house, one owns a business and the other is a journeyman electrician now. The wife owns the own business, she was on welfare and in public housing when I first met her in 1990.

I know numerous others that have made the same trip. Quite a few from the literal gutter where they lived due to poor choices early in life.

I've worked full time since just before I turned 16. I've no tolerance for people who think they have it rough and expect someone else to get them out of it.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » September 25, 2003, 4:41 pm

sure people of any color or gender can do whatever they want to do regardless of society or their social/economic status. all they have to do is work hard.

also, world peace is easily attained if people would just start being nice to each other.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » September 25, 2003, 4:42 pm

Aabidano wrote:For the last 20 years, people that deserved admission to a college (or whatever), have been able to get it. It should be completely based on thier own merits, not on a an accident of birth. AA just enforces the belief that I deserve something just because I'm "special".

Anyone in the US can go anyplace they want in life provided they are willing to work for it.

Not really, those folks that have the grades\drive to attend college are all in or went to high school somewhere.

Grades and drive from where? For some strange reason, you think that someone can just move into a nice neighborhood with an elite school system. You also seem to feel that everyone is on equal ground with regards to each educational system. That is so wrong, it's painful to even think such ignorance exists.

I've seen it firsthand as a math tutor back in college. It was, essentially, a math class I and another student taught to get students up to snuff for college credit level courses. Some students were just taught like shit. Some just soaked the math up like a sponge. One girl who graduated 4th in her class from Trenton Central High (a very weak educational facility at least back in the late 80's) only had about 900 combined on her SAT's and couldn't pass the college level math test. Some of a gun if she didn't chew my course up and spit it out in six weeks. Two of those weeks was spent having her regain confidence in herself. She graduated cum laude four years later as we kept in touch.

She would have been passed up under your rules. She had the drive and the ability, it's just that her starting line was so far removed from the pack, it would have been filed in your "underachiever" pile. Fucking sad

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 25, 2003, 4:43 pm

Nice neighborhood? Elite school system?

How are those prerequisites for success?

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » September 25, 2003, 4:44 pm

Actually Kyoukan part of that is true, Colin Powell went from enlisted black dude to Secretary of State.

If you want to succeed you have the same shot in the US regardless of color. Really if you learn english, spoken and written you can overcome almost any challenge in the US. Lots of dumbfucks making a lot of money legally here.

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » September 25, 2003, 4:47 pm

Chidoro wrote:Some of a gun if she didn't chew my course up and spit it out in six weeks. Two of those weeks was spent having her regain confidence in herself. She graduated cum laude four years later as we kept in touch.

You proved my point actually...

She had the drive and the ability

And that's why she made it.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 25, 2003, 4:49 pm

My pops has a handicapped leg from birth, rode my bike to work every day to be a custodian while he went to night school. Meanwhile my mom drove our only beat up car to work at Burger King. When my pops graduated and got a job at the IRS, my mom then went to night classes for business. My pops is now a manager at the IRS and my mother works for Dell INC. Of course, I am not sure if AA was even a big issue back in the 70's, I think it was just getting off the ground during that time. When I see the crap my dad went through for my family, it makes me even more furious at people that think they are too good to work at XXXX place. If my pop can ride a freaking 16" bicycle to work everyday to be a janitor with only one leg, those bastards can get a freakin job. Sorry to get on a tangent, but if my parents can make it, anyone can. Just an example.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » September 25, 2003, 4:50 pm

Fallanthas wrote:Nice neighborhood? Elite school system?

How are those prerequisites for success?

You care to match up the statistics that show someone going through a strong educational system through high school is better off than someone who isn't taught shit because it can't be funded and the environment doesn't support it? Or should we just assume it's true and not waste my time having to google shit

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » September 25, 2003, 4:51 pm

Aabidano wrote:And that's why she made it.

No, she made it because she had the drive AND the opportunity. You wouldn't have given her one.

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » September 25, 2003, 5:01 pm

Mort wrote: OMG, I didnt see this coming...... Not from Kyou. Have you ever actually listened to him Kyou? Do you know his stance on ANYTHING? Or is this just some more anti-American spew? I'm not defending him, I know he's pretty hardcore, but I do listen to his show a few times a week.... do you? (Savage I mean)

lol

yeah he's a real paragon of virtue. I gave even you more credit than that but I see I was wrong again.

anti-minority
anti-woman
anti-gay
pro less taxes for the wealthy (him)
pro tort reform (no brainer unless you are a litigation attorney)

the stupid dumbass didnt even last 2 weeks on tv for calling a gay guy a "sodomist" and "I hope you get aids and die" while he was on the air. He also wrote a book called The Death of the White Male where he expounds about how minorities (my word not his) are ruining the anglo race in america. good for him.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 25, 2003, 5:04 pm

Try reading a bit more carefully, Chidoro. Particularly the last 13 posts.

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » September 25, 2003, 5:07 pm

Chidoro wrote:No, she made it because she had the drive AND the opportunity. You wouldn't have given her one.

My point is that the opportunity is there for anyone who's willing to take it. Did you track her down and say "Hey, you look smart, take my class."? I don't think so, she quite likely signed up for it herself.

It's a matter of personal initiative.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » September 25, 2003, 5:24 pm

Aabidano wrote:My point is that the opportunity is there for anyone who's willing to take it.

No it wouldn't have been. She wouldn't have been even accepted into the
damn college under your rules. She would have been left out.

Did you track her down and say "Hey, you look smart, take my class."? I don't think so, she quite likely signed up for it herself. It's a matter of personal initiative.

No, actually she was mandated to take it by the college in as a pre-requisite to taking mandatory college level math classes. All it took was someone to teach her properly, you know, the way it would have most likely been done had she gone to a high school that had a math teacher worth a damn.

Chidoro · Post by **Chidoro** » September 25, 2003, 5:34 pm

Fallanthas wrote:Try reading a bit more carefully, Chidoro. Particularly the last 13 posts.

I did, you should make a point. Particularly in response to my question towards you.

Just because something isn't a "pre-requisite" doesn't mean that everyone is dancing happily on equal ground.

Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » September 25, 2003, 5:37 pm

im sorry but affermitive action is a buncha shit ... its like giving the job that a person is a total incompident and passing over the person that could do the job and more ... im sorry but your grades should get you into college not your race thats a buncha crap having someone that could do something with their life betting rejected because a minority racial group needs more numbers in their school.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 25, 2003, 6:08 pm

You dumbass, noone said anything about 'equal ground'.

READ THE GODDAMNED POSTS BEFORE YOU RESPOND!

Mort · Post by **Mort** » September 25, 2003, 6:22 pm

kyoukan wrote:
Mort wrote: OMG, I didnt see this coming...... Not from Kyou. Have you ever actually listened to him Kyou? Do you know his stance on ANYTHING? Or is this just some more anti-American spew? I'm not defending him, I know he's pretty hardcore, but I do listen to his show a few times a week.... do you? (Savage I mean)
lol

yeah he's a real paragon of virtue. I gave even you more credit than that but I see I was wrong again.

anti-minority
anti-woman
anti-gay
pro less taxes for the wealthy (him)
pro tort reform (no brainer unless you are a litigation attorney)

the stupid dumbass didnt even last 2 weeks on tv for calling a gay guy a "sodomist" and "I hope you get aids and die" while he was on the air. He also wrote a book called The Death of the White Male where he expounds about how minorities (my word not his) are ruining the anglo race in america. good for him.

Like I said Kyou... I dont agree with everything he says, actually he's pretty fucking far right, but entertaining sometimes when I've had my fill of CNN type shit. And I am all for tort reform, atleast we can agree to disagree

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 25, 2003, 6:32 pm

I used to find him entertaining too until I read what kyou said about him making the white race being ruined statements. I did some more searches on things he has said in the past, and he can kiss my ass.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » September 25, 2003, 6:35 pm

LOL. When I've had my fill of actual news, I too like to flip over to the KKK channel for some good entertainment!

Marbus · Post by **Marbus** » September 25, 2003, 7:52 pm

Part of the problem is we don't help people who want to help themselves. Example...

When I was working with the gangs in Little Rock I had some mothers who were too proud to take a hand out so they worked 3 mw jobs (daddy wasn't around) to provide for their kids and give them a good home. What did she get for that? The gov took away any money they were giving her and because she worked all the time her kids ended up in gangs hanging around with the kid whos mom who was on crack and wouldn't get off her ass living on welfare.

IMHO the system should be you work? we help. Give people a grace period and stop this bull shit. Hell all the money we would save WOULD fund better schools. That mom worked very hard and eventually was able to get night classes and is a manager because she worked hard but her family suffered for a while because she wanted something better for herself and them... to me that just isn't right.

My mom, retired first grade teacher now works for a private school for special needs children. Her TA is a young black girl with excellent drive and intelligence who did very well in school... but got pregnant the summer after HS. To live on her own she got x dollars from the Gov and low income housing... until she got a job. About a month after getting there she got a letter telling her they were going to cut her WIC and increase her rent now that she was working... SHE WAS MAKING MW! Mom eventually talked her into applying to one of the state schools and going on to collge where she is doing great. Working hard, and the Gov. is helping again (since she quit of course). I have no problem with Grants, AA, or paying extra taxes to help people who want to help themselves. Truly we ARE all in this together eventually... but it's sooooo difficult to see people who just don't care getting special attention for ANY reason.

As far as getting INTO undergraduate I agree that we should give almost everyone who wants to go a chance because of the disparity in the schools... I agree with that. But once there, once on equil ground that is where it stops. From there it's based on merit. Now if we would better fund our HS then I would be for removing it from Undergraduate as well but I don't see that happening any time soon.

Marb

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » September 25, 2003, 8:18 pm

Krimson Klaw wrote:I used to find him entertaining too until I read what kyou said about him making the white race being ruined statements. I did some more searches on things he has said in the past, and he can kiss my ass.

you can always take solace in the fact that his real name is micheal weiner.

Crav · Post by **Crav** » September 25, 2003, 10:17 pm

You know as I was driving back from school something really funny hit me. I started thinking about the student body at SMU, so I decided to take a look at the demographics. According to the SMU webpage there are 10,955 students enrolled. Out of those 2,185 student were classified as miniority(Hispanics, African Americans, and Native Americans). That means that only 8 out of every 10 students there are white. You can compare that with the University of Texas at Austin where there are 52,002 students enrolled and there are 20,548 students classifed as minorities, which means that 6 out of every 10 students are white.

Anyways just a little food for thought on what our young Republicans are fighting for.