And now for some real news

Jice Virago · Post by **Jice Virago** » September 1, 2004, 10:11 pm

Problem is Israel will never let another country in that region get nukes without pre-emtively stricking them first. This is where WW3 is going to begin folks, and our guys are caught between two fundementalist states who don't care about starting a nuclear exchange to prove a point, since they are sure god will reward their efforts next life anyhow. We should have reigned in Israel when we had the chance, or dumped them and embraced Egypt or another westernized middle east state as our main ally. Now were fucked, with our fucking dick hanging in the wind because we decided to go on a nation building rampage and occupy an entire fucking country in the middle of that shit. Good job fucking the country George, Mission Accomplished!

Oh and you guys are dead on about having nukes being the best deterrent from getting pig fucked by the Neocons. Another feather in GW's cap for setting back peace and foreign policy to the 1950s.

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » September 1, 2004, 11:01 pm

It is an interesting situation when you have two people who dislike each other with guns pointed at each other's heads.

They can do little but talk out their issues lest they both lose.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 2, 2004, 12:17 am

While I freely admit that Israel's pre-emptive strike on any muslim country would be a global catastrophe, I will say something that most likely will piss off the majority of this board. I will always be on the side of Israel. My religion dictates this. I am ready for all sorts of flames, from all angles and perspectives.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » September 2, 2004, 12:26 am

Just another proof to me while religion is bad

I prefere to judge people or countries on their actions, not by religion.

Dregor Thule · Post by **Dregor Thule** » September 2, 2004, 12:53 am

Krimson Klaw wrote:While I freely admit that Israel's pre-emptive strike on any muslim country would be a global catastrophe, I will say something that most likely will piss off the majority of this board. I will always be on the side of Israel. My religion dictates this. I am ready for all sorts of flames, from all angles and perspectives.

I'll admit, I thought you were a little better than that, but you're also one of the most reasonable and intelligent "conservatives" on here, so I'll let it slide. THIS TIME MISTER.

Siji · Post by **Siji** » September 2, 2004, 2:03 am

Krimson Klaw wrote:I will always be on the side of Israel. My religion dictates this.

This is the type of attitude that makes me further distance myself from religion. Blind faith in anything but your religions version of God is a bad thing. Blind faith in anything having to do with the human race is ignorant at best.

Winnow · Post by **Winnow** » September 2, 2004, 2:38 am

Krimson Klaw wrote:I will always be on the side of Israel. My religion dictates this.

Scary stuff right there. As bad as any extremist group.

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » September 2, 2004, 5:46 am

Does nobody here understand that the US is 20% of the real power of the UN? That the UN is not some adversarial foreign power? That the rules binding the UN were, in large part, drawn up by the US? And that the UN has acted in accord with US interests in over half the instances where action was required (and that in those instances where it didn't it wasn't because of being outvoted but because of soviet veto)? But now when JUST ONCE the UN (i.e. the security council) voted, not against the US but in favour of more patience (that was entirely justified in hindsight, well fuck me how surprised am I?), the GOP propoganda machine has turned it into the new USSR?
Fuck that bullshit. It's ingenuous to the point of being retarded and all the arrogant "prove you're worth our time" crap just illustrates what's wrong with the US in the eyes of the rest of the world today. Get the fuck over yourselves.

Metanis · Post by **Metanis** » September 2, 2004, 10:32 am

Thanks for the heads up on this issue. I'll be writing letters to my congresspeople and my president that keeping Iran nuke-free needs to be a top priority. I shudder to think what a band of crazed religious nutcases would do if they had the Bomb. Joint air-raids with Israel would offer the most crushing 1st strike scenario. Call it the Princess Kelshara option. Bomb their asses so far back in time that they think the stone age is a technological marvel.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » September 2, 2004, 10:40 am

Metanis wrote:Thanks for the heads up on this issue. I'll be writing letters to my congresspeople and my president that keeping Iran nuke-free needs to be a top priority. I shudder to think what a band of crazed religious nutcases would do if they had the Bomb. Joint air-raids with Israel would offer the most crushing 1st strike scenario. Call it the Princess Kelshara option. Bomb their asses so far back in time that they think the stone age is a technological marvel.

/snicker

archeiron · Post by **archeiron** » September 2, 2004, 10:56 am

vn_Tanc wrote:Does nobody here understand that the US is 20% of the real power of the UN? That the UN is not some adversarial foreign power? That the rules binding the UN were, in large part, drawn up by the US? And that the UN has acted in accord with US interests in over half the instances where action was required (and that in those instances where it didn't it wasn't because of being outvoted but because of soviet veto)? But now when JUST ONCE the UN (i.e. the security council) voted, not against the US but in favour of more patience (that was entirely justified in hindsight, well fuck me how surprised am I?), the GOP propoganda machine has turned it into the new USSR?
Fuck that bullshit. It's ingenuous to the point of being retarded and all the arrogant "prove you're worth our time" crap just illustrates what's wrong with the US in the eyes of the rest of the world today. Get the fuck over yourselves.

How does the US's burst DPS compare to Sam Deathwalker's?

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » September 2, 2004, 11:04 am

US Burst DPS is pretty high

Metanis · Post by **Metanis** » September 2, 2004, 11:42 am

The attached /rant is a sarcastic way pointing out that while we may disagree about approaches the stakes are very large and very real.

Iran may actually have totally peaceful intentions for creating their fissionable material. I don't think the world community should dick around however if there is even an appearance that weapons-grade material is being diverted from legitimate uses.

I have a solution to Iran and Iraq and even North Korea.

It's amazingly simple. We go back to a slightly modified version of Mutual Assured Destruction. That was the defense policies of the USA and USSR during much of the cold war. Sort of a cosmic game of "you show me yours and I'll show you mine".

Instead of pouring billions of dollars into the reconstruction of Iraq and more billions of dollars a year into foreign aid I propose the US invest that money into developing a whole new class of "super neutron bombs".

These are the nuclear bombs that use X-ray and Gamma Ray radiation bursts to kill people while not destroying much real property. These would be super clean bombs that leave almost no radioactive residue. I would build really really huge ones that can kill every person in a 50 mile radius of detonation.

Then the USA would pull home all our troops from all over the world.

We would also have created an updated Axis of Evil List. You know the one...

Iraq
Iran
North Korea
Canada
France
Germany
Norway
Sweden
Pakistan
India
China
(pick your own personal favorite)

(I would never publish the complete list, it would be better if some countries were left to wonder if they were on the list.)

Then we make a simple rule.

If the USA ever gets hit with any sort of WMD we will retaliate with massive counterstrikes against EVERY nation on the list using the new powerful neutron bombs. We won't care which sicko nation started the war we will just end it with extreme finality. When the raditation dissipates in 100 years or so we would have many new parks in places like Paris, Stockholm, Tehran, Toronto, Vancouver, etc.

It's a win-win solution! USA will no longer export our archaic notions of freedom to the the world. The world becomes responsible for it's own safety. Heck! We might even put the devil out of business trying to process the billions of new souls showing up on Hells doorstep.

Mutual Assured Destruction - Rev 1.

Sionistic · Post by **Sionistic** » September 2, 2004, 11:47 am

We won't care which sicko nation started the war we will just end it with extreme finality.

everytime I read that i just giggle

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » September 2, 2004, 12:19 pm

US response to the "Iran Problem" will be one of two things:
1) Let's Roll.
2) N.Korea mk.II

Both have their problems but I'm guessing #2 will be the way.

Krimson Klaw · Post by **Krimson Klaw** » September 2, 2004, 1:08 pm

My viewpoint of Israel is no different than her being a direct family member. I will still recognize her mistakes, I will say when she is in the wrong which I have obviously done in the past, and try to use common sense and good judgement in an attempt to solve things in the middle east. I will however never be for any action that would destroy her. I by no means meant to imply that Israel can do no wrong and is perfect. Just like a family member that may do wrong and punishment must be met out, you still love the family member, but at the same time your common sense may tell you that the punishment is just and must be carried out. You in most circumstances would never turn your back on a close family member, and that's how I feel about Israel. You can still hate me for my viewpoint, I am ready for it, I knew what I was getting into when I made my point.

landgrabbing I am against, pre-emptive strikes, I definitely don't want that to happen but I fear it most likely will, and it will start a chain reaction of hell and America is already right in the middle of it.

-edit- the timing will be tricky Vn_tanc. If Israel for some reason does not hit Iran with a strike, then Iran should have a pretty peaceful future because America won't touch them while they are armed. If I were one of Irans leaders right now, the key would be speed. The faster they can announce they have 2 or 3 nukes the better off they will be.

Hesten · Post by **Hesten** » September 2, 2004, 1:13 pm

Voronwë wrote:US Burst DPS is pretty high

Yeay. US military seems to be like wizards Manaburn. Highly effective in doing lots of damage fast, but when its been used, the wizard get creamed

Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » September 2, 2004, 1:17 pm

i have a feeling im going to be glowing a weird green color in the future

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » September 2, 2004, 1:33 pm

Krimson that isn't that bad of an attitude really. I read it as being pro-Israel no matter what, no punishment and that they could do nothing wrong. That would be a bad attitude imho.

vn_Tanc · Post by **vn_Tanc** » September 2, 2004, 1:41 pm

I don't think it's in the USs best interests to have Israel nuke Iran (with nukes created from US knowhow, no less) so I think the US would be able to restrain them from that course of action on pain of being cut loose. Conventional air-strikes on the iranian nuke plants a la the treatment the Iraqis got is more plausible though.
Such an act would swell the islamist terrorist ranks by a huge number though. A nuking would cause unimaginable chaos IMO.