Mid-level car purchase question

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 22, 2003, 4:54 pm

I think you need a style opinion then, rather than an opinion on making a sound financial decision.

Since I have zero style, I won't comment again. maybe the 'hep' folk here can help you out.

Post by **Sylvus** » September 22, 2003, 4:55 pm

That wasn't a flame, it was a joke. Now it may not have been the funniest joke, but that's beside the point. Quit being such a baby!

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 22, 2003, 5:04 pm

Shanter wrote:I'm driving a 2003 Tiburon GT right now and it's not bad. Besides a minor window problem.

I appreciate your input. However it just frightens me further heh. In my mind a 2003 car shouldn't have ANY issues....

Can I ask what the window problem was?

I still have to talk to my friend that has like a 2000 or 2001 tiburon. I usually hang with him on Thursdays. Problem is he crashed his car atleast once, and many of his issues could be related to that.

The good news is that since my purchase is about a year off...I can ask you how the car is doing in a year before I make my purchase, then it will have seen some more age....

I might also start asking people quick questions if I see them getting in or out of a Tiburon. I hate talking to strangers, but I can do it when I feel the need.

All the sites like edmunds and epinions have NEW owners posting, very fewold owners return, and if they do...it will always be bad...it's not like I went to epinions to tell them how much I like my 1996 sunfire recently, even though it has been a great car.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 22, 2003, 5:14 pm

Sylvus...I thought it was kinda funny...but I interpreted it as a flame. However like I have stated before people can flame me all they want, I don't care.

Side note: My real name is Jeff Walker...your photo was of Paul Walker. That's the only reason I thought it was funny.

OMG did I let out my real name!?! You also have access to my picture and approx location. 1,000 VV's if I receive a letter in my mailbox with your VV handle. My name is almost as common as John Smith, Good luck.

Edit: Another hint, I drive a 1996 Pontiac Sunfire.

Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » September 22, 2003, 6:01 pm

anyone know whats one of the most gas efficient cars? besides those electic things thats not ugly?

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » September 22, 2003, 6:04 pm

Denver -- The Environmental Protection Agency today announced the 26th annual Miles Per Gallon rankings for passenger vehicles. The fuel economy estimates for the 2001 model year vehicles rank the Honda Insight as the most fuel efficient car at 61 miles per gallon (mpg) for city driving and 68 mpg on the highway.

Don't make the mistake of confusing fuel economy with vehicle economy.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 22, 2003, 6:34 pm

Honda Insight is a hybrid though...gas electric.

Give me a few minutes I have an article on a car custom built for this one guy that got INSANE gas mileage. He was like CEO of one of the european car companies or something.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 22, 2003, 6:52 pm

Grrr...I can't find the article. I thought it was in an issue of Popular science from over the summer...I thought it had a face of the guy who had it built.

Anyway....I want to eat a snack and hit the gym so I give up.

The only thing I remember about the article was the gas mileage was like 100 mpg or more maybe even near 200 mpg. And the dude was leaving the car manufacturer...and the manufacturer was based in I think Europe.

However the car is too expensive to build for the masses...if I remember right the frame was made out of maybe Berillium or something. I mean it was crazy....

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 22, 2003, 11:38 pm

I saw one of these today in the gym parking lot....nice. Toyota Celica GT

For 18k I can get a 140hp, 125 torque....GT version. For 22k I'd get GT-S 180hp 130 torque (torque is still kinda low..wtf?). I'd need quite a few options on the low end one...it doesn't have rims, it doesn't have power windows...nothing. Both would need the action package to look like that picture (although I don't think the small one has a hood scoop). And I have to have a sunroof.

I need a Toyota connection if I'm to afford this car in the budget I specified.

---------------------
I looked at a couple civis in the parking lot, they aren't as bad as I thought, but still bland. And like I passed 4 or 5 of them on the way to my car.
---------------------

Mitsubishi Eclipse - 2 of these were in the parking lot also.

I have to get the GS version instead of RS, because the RS can't get a stupid sunroof. But still the GS base is 19k, with sunroof and a radio upgrade it's 20k...plus I get the spoiler which I want anyway, and bigger tires. It's 147 hp 158 torque...I could live with that. My sunfire is 150/150 so it's about the same. It costs a lot more for the V6 in the GT and GTS.

My brother has the Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder with the 210 hp or so engine and sportstronic transmission, he has had it for 2 years, no problems.

-------------
I'd say the Celica looks cooler then the Eclipse (if I got the action package), but it's also a smaller engine, and costs more....toyota is a trusted company, but I trust Mitsubishi I think as well.

------------
I saw a Lancer they don't look to bad, but they are like 120 hp 130 torque. About 18k if I want a sunroof because I'd need to buy the LS.

If I want more power (and I do, badly, that's just not enough) I have to go all the way to a lancer evolution....which is like a totally different car...271 hp, 273 torque...29k base price...that's overkill.

So Lancer is no dice...

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 22, 2003, 11:40 pm

The Lancer will ass rape you on insurance. Trust me.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 22, 2003, 11:59 pm

Even the non-evoluton?

They are 120hp 130 torque...If you turn the air on, joggers would pass you...

I mean it doesn't matter to me really because they are too weak for my tastes, except for when it jumps to evolution, then it's too powerful lol. There is no middle ground, it goes from 130 to 270...lame.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » September 23, 2003, 12:09 am

Horsepower isn't really an entirely reliable indicator of how fast a car is. There's plenty of cars with sub-150 horsepowers that are relatively fast. While their straight-line might not be quite as fast as some monster with 300 horses, they can be far more agile and nimble, corner better, go in and out of traffic, and so on. The celica and eclipse are two of those, although I can't stand the eclipse because it's become the standard "i wish i was vin diesel" car.

Once a car meets your standards (hp, torque, sunroof, power locks and whatnot) is aesthetics your primary concern?

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 23, 2003, 12:27 am

Pilsburry wrote:Even the non-evoluton?

They are 120hp 130 torque...If you turn the air on, joggers would pass you...

I mean it doesn't matter to me really because they are too weak for my tastes, except for when it jumps to evolution, then it's too powerful lol. There is no middle ground, it goes from 130 to 270...lame.

Yes. The Lancer (formally the Mirage) gets an insurance rating of 20+ --22 I think--. The Corvette is a 23.

Marbus · Post by **Marbus** » September 23, 2003, 12:42 am

My best friend has a Celica GT with that body style, LOVES it but here those rank up with the Jettas, Miatas, & Sebering Conv. as "chick-only" cars. He doesn't care though, he still loves his car.

There are a lot of opinions flying around Pils, but none of us here with all of our opinions are you. As I said earlier, it's good to hear what others say but the most imporatant thing is how much YOU like it.

Take a Saturday and just go to dealers. When you walk up just tell them. I have x number of different makes and models I want to consider. I'm NOT buying today but would like to see what you have a drive x, y or z model. If I like it the best I'll be back. If they give you some lip, move on to the next dealer.

I say drive because while I knew I would love my 5 series it really wasn't too far and above my 1989 Honda Accord LXi. Sure the BMW had more horsepower but it also had a LOT more weight. The old Accords from that era just handled extremely well and it cruised a plesant 90 mph on the Interstate VERY often between Little Rock and Fort Smith. I put 167,000 miles on it in 3.5 years going all over the country... why? because I just loved the way it drove. I put over 200K on the BMW but if I could have either one (in the respective year models) right now I would rather have the old Accord, the memories are just too good.

I suggest you test drive until you find what feels good to you, and wish you good luck in it as well.

Cheers!
Marb

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » September 23, 2003, 12:50 am

depends on what you are actually rating since this whole thread started about insurance, lemme throw in my 2 cents as well (the other 48 were shot 9 times!).

Common misconceptions about vehicles and insurance in "most" states:

1)What one company does/does not do is what every company will/will not be able or willing to do.

2) Not all discounts are available/allowed in every state with every "type" of insurance.

3) The color of your car does not your premium affect.

4) Not all sportscars are rated higher than other cars by every company.

5) Manual vs Automatic....doesn't matter if the car is basically built the same.

6) Tickets are not automatically removed when you take Defensive Driving and not all insurance companies can/will give discounts for it.

Take ownership of your damn policy. Ask questions. If they are idiots and cannot or will not answer questions, even when you are just shopping around, move along. Most people think that all companies are the same. Some even think going directly with one company rather than through an agent is cheaper. While this "can" be true, it all depends on that agent's cost of doing business and how far they can "spread" the cost out so that they are not getting as much commision on your policies. Some agents may not even be ABLE to write you the best policy with the company they write with. Look around.

As for the ratings, Zamtuk, way off. You are looking at it from a sportscar standpoint. Take someone with a spotless driving record, decent credit (depending on the state), and responsible....that corvette could be cheaper to insure than many other vehicles out there. Some companies/states do not even HAVE a high performance surcharge on vehicles anymore. The driver is the risk...the car is just what you have to pay for when that dumbass risk runs into someone.

Shanter · Post by **Shanter** » September 23, 2003, 1:29 am

The battery for the windows was bad(driver side window wouldn't roll up or down, sucked cause I couldn't do drive-thru, had to fucking walk in to order), so they replaced it. First time they just switched out the breaker or something and they thought they fixed it, but it happened again, so they just put a new motor in for it.

Faerin · Post by **Faerin** » September 23, 2003, 10:05 am

Marbus wrote:My best friend has a Celica GT with that body style, LOVES it but here those rank up with the Jettas, Miatas, & Sebering Conv. as "chick-only" cars. He doesn't care though, he still loves his car.

wtf ...

<img src="http://www3.sympatico.ca/faerin/MyCar/DSC00070small.jpg">

NOT a chick car

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 23, 2003, 12:15 pm

Boogahz wrote:As for the ratings, Zamtuk, way off. You are looking at it from a sportscar standpoint. Take someone with a spotless driving record, decent credit (depending on the state), and responsible....that corvette could be cheaper to insure than many other vehicles out there. Some companies/states do not even HAVE a high performance surcharge on vehicles anymore. The driver is the risk...the car is just what you have to pay for when that dumbass risk runs into someone.

True, but in my case (5 years strong, never one report on my insurance) I am still paying out the ass. Hell, my agent even went outside and said WTF when he rated my car. It was actually rated in some magazine (Forbes I want to say) in the top 5 worst cars to get for insurance. This report, of course, came out way after I bought my car. For those that want the details, I pay $118 per month (though this is set to go down my next term) for full coverage in NC.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » September 23, 2003, 12:29 pm

Faerin wrote:wtf ...

<pic of a Sebring Convertible removed>

NOT a chick car

Chicks, fags, and tourists are the only people I've ever seen driving them. And really not too many fags...

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 23, 2003, 1:11 pm

Shanter wrote:The battery for the windows was bad(driver side window wouldn't roll up or down, sucked cause I couldn't do drive-thru, had to fucking walk in to order), so they replaced it. First time they just switched out the breaker or something and they thought they fixed it, but it happened again, so they just put a new motor in for it.

Yeah that's what I figured, it's a common problem with Tiburons from what I could tell.

The others are engine lights flashing on for a sec, then the engine almost stalling (sometimes actually stalling), corroded rims, flakey paint, and bad clocks heh.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 23, 2003, 1:18 pm

Sueven wrote:Horsepower isn't really an entirely reliable indicator of how fast a car is. There's plenty of cars with sub-150 horsepowers that are relatively fast. While their straight-line might not be quite as fast as some monster with 300 horses, they can be far more agile and nimble, corner better, go in and out of traffic, and so on.

Once a car meets your standards (hp, torque, sunroof, power locks and whatnot) is aesthetics your primary concern?

Yes, HP isn't everything, body weight and torque also attribute to speed. The Eclipse looks heavy but I'll research that more when I get to it, the Tiburon is heavy...so heavy that the 4 cylinder isn't even an option in my mind.

And yes Aesthetics is a primary concern. It has to look sporty, even if it isn't that fast.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 23, 2003, 1:27 pm

As for only chicks and fags driving the celica...I'm sure a lot of people say that about the sunfire also. I'm not too worried about it.

I'm only worried about me liking the car....not other people.

As for insurance, I'm going to stick with State Farm. I've been with them for the last 13 years, they give me several discounts that I'll lose if I transfer. I remember one time they jacked the price up and I tried to transfer, they were still the cheapest....the rate jack was caused by a state law. They actually sent me a gaurantee recently in the mail stating I reached a status where they will NEVER revoke my policy.

$118/mo is not that bad....what year is the Lancer? Are you over 25? Married?

Want to hear an insurance nightmare? Scrimps 2003 V8 Mustang. He pays around $300/mo. He has a few tickets, under 25, single....once his old car was hit in the driveway by a drunk driver who ran through his GF's yard in order to hit it, another time he ran off the road himself and totalled his last car. $300/mo...I pay $400 for 6/mo.

Marbus · Post by **Marbus** » September 23, 2003, 2:37 pm

Marb's definition...

A "chick car" is not necessarily a car that only Women like. I personally really like the Jettas and the Sebering Conv. However the fact is that around here, in Central Arkansas, you never see a guy behind the wheel of any of those... ever. Another friend of mine wanted to get a Jetta but wouldn't because everyone gave him a hard time that it was a "chick car" I told hime who gave a care what they thought if he like it... but he still wouldn't. So I set about to prove that it wasn't a "chick car." For over 3 months I made it a point to look at the driver on every Jetta I saw... even while I was in Chicago for a week (probably different up there right?). Nope, in over 3 months of trying I never once found a guy driving a Jetta... same seems to hold true for the Sebering as well but I haven't done as much personal research, just that I know 8 people with them and they are all women.

Marb

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » September 23, 2003, 3:40 pm

In the northeast, I hardly ever see females driving Celica's. It's a total white drug dealer car up here.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » September 23, 2003, 3:48 pm

Pils, look at my car, look at yours, look at your woman, look at mine. No need for details here. But you know the deal.

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 23, 2003, 3:52 pm

Well, I am single and under 25. But, my insurance agent was more than surprised at my rate. She gave me a rundown of other cars in that range, Corvette was right above mine and Ferrari, wasn't too far off. (considering a geo is an 8 rating, mine was like 22 on a scale of 30 (?)). But anything over 25 you will be paying your bill in children. I recently got my 5 year safe driving discount, but alas it doesn't show up until my renewal which is in January I think. So after that it should be down in the 80's I hope.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 23, 2003, 4:01 pm

Kylere, I don't think she likes you for the car. And if you think she does, best to bail now hehe.

I don't think I need some fancy car to meet women, I think as long as it's clean and not rusty...they won't lay any real judgement down. I won't impress them either....but any woman who places too much value on what you drive, isn't a woman I want.

You know what I got at stake Kylere....or I think you do, I forget.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » September 23, 2003, 5:09 pm

I do..

But seriously I am not sweating it, I am taking a paycut of 10 bucks an hour to move to Michigan

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 23, 2003, 6:02 pm

I would too Kylere, she seems like a great girl.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » September 23, 2003, 7:34 pm

The ratings are determined by a number of factors like I think I have stated before.

Looking at how we rate the Corvette, it's more complex than saying it's a 25 out of a max of 30. See my previous answer to Pils' original question. WE, as in the company I work for (not all), break the vehicle's ratings down by how they would affect EACH coverage. For instance, that same 25 you have overall would break down like this (considering an '03 vette 2door rather than the coupe) 5 - 16 - 21 - 03.

5...you will not DO much damage in a collision, so your liability insurance on that vehicle would be less compared to any of the vehicles I gave info to Pils on in a previous post.

16 - Comprehensive claims could be higher in frequency or cost of repairs on this type of vehicle.

21 - Collision coverage...you're vehicle would be more likely to take damage in a collision and "we" would be paying out the ass for it compared to other vehicles.

03 - The chance of you or those in your vehicle being injured are low.

Once again, this is on an '03 Vette, not yours necessarilly.

Also Full Coverage does not exist. Even agents call it that at times. There is ALWAYS something that wouldn't be covered. Full coverage is just liability, comprehensive, and collision. There are other coverages out there to protect you in your vehicle, others in the vehicle as well, lost wages, rental in the event of a collision (no it's not included with collision coverages in most states), roadside assistance, additional parts and equipment (the bling bling you want covered just in case since it's not factory), etc..

The only reason I go on about insurance is that the original question was about what hit Pils would take with the Tiburon or a similar vehicle btw. That and it's how I make my living.

Karae · Post by **Karae** » September 23, 2003, 9:50 pm

Sebring isn't a chick car.

It's a rental car.

Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » September 23, 2003, 10:05 pm

old people drive those where i live heh

Post by **Xouqoa** » September 23, 2003, 11:46 pm

Kaelina, Sunserae, Truant:

Would any of you like to play Warcraft 3 with me? I am bored and am interested in playing but I don't feel like playing by myself.

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 23, 2003, 11:56 pm

I play every night Xou, and would be savvy for a game!

On topic: I have EVERYTHING on my coverage save uhh, I think its the medical coverage for people who drive my car. Sucks to be my DD and wreck.

Other than that, I just said yes to anything my agent offers me.

The only thing I have used my insurance for is my towing reimburstment.

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » September 24, 2003, 12:08 am

hi xou!

i would love to play wc with you d00d. btw, do you remember that time when we saw that guy in the place with the crazy something or other? man, that was cool.

Post by **Xouqoa** » September 24, 2003, 12:44 am

yeah that guy was cool suns

remember when he slipped and fell down the escalator at the Valleyview Mall? hahahahahahaah man those were good times

Zamtuk · Post by **Zamtuk** » September 24, 2003, 1:24 am

xou is poo at wc3

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 25, 2003, 2:05 am

Well talked to my friend with the Tiburon, it's 2 years old (but it has 63k+ miles on it) he said aside from the accident he only really took it to the shop once for an engine light, but it was a problem due to the gas cap not being tightened down enough (sounds fishy to me but, eh).

He did say he wouldn't recommend it, but wouldn't comment why except that I can get a better car for the money....I know he has the smaller engine. The 134 hp 4-cyl, automatic...so I bet that's his biggest peeve is lack of power.

However today...I saw him because his live-in GF bought a new car today, and she wanted us to see it....A Hyundai Accent, so I take it he was truly satisfied with the companies reliability.

And although his is only 2 years old, an accident and 63k+ miles is a pretty good measuring stick still.

So Tiburon is back on the list, just not near the top like it was on the first day...because you really can't do a whole lot better features for the money, my issue was reliability and he put that to rest.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 25, 2003, 4:15 pm

Unexpected development.

2004 Hyundai Tiburon V6 GT next month.

Don't flame me for the pick....you don't know the deal I'm getting on it. I guarantee noone here would have passed it up.

Truant · Post by **Truant** » September 25, 2003, 9:11 pm

Well then you're wrong.

You could offer me one for free...and unless I was drunk, i'd turn it down.

Boogahz · Post by **Boogahz** » September 25, 2003, 10:24 pm

but you are Truant.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 26, 2003, 3:02 am

Well it's looking more like a Mitsubishi Eclipse now...by Oct 31st.

I have to check the Dodge SRT4 though...if they have some decent cash back they might be in the running, I know they are offering 2,000 back on the neon...so if they give $2,500 or more back...it will be close...because I can get those at about dealer invoice without haggling. I'm going to see them tomarrow or maybe saturday.

I checked my sources and one of them has access to a database and he said most Hyundai's hit the shop about 9 times thier first year? Holy Shit. That's like every 6 weeks on a new car?

I also told the Mitsubishi guy I was looking at other cars still and didn't need a big sales pitch, I said SRT4, Celica, WRX, Tiburon....and he said they are all good cars so long as you steer clear of any Hyundais or Kia's.

And then tonight at the bar I was talking to some girl, or more like she was trying to talk to me but I couldn't hear her.....she was talking for a few minutes and I just nodded my head like I knew what she said and just all of a sudden said "blah blah blah..My Hyundai" and I was like "What type?" she drives an Elantra, 1.5 yrs old. It's in the shop so often she can't even get a loaner anymore...she is trying to dump it.

So Tiburon is like out, permanently now....Eclipse GS is in the lead..Dodge SRT4 is in second. Deadline Oct. 31st 2003...about one month.

Truant · Post by **Truant** » September 26, 2003, 3:25 am

i'm going to be completely flat out with you. If you are driving short distances, you will do more harm to a turbo charger than it will be able to benefit you.

It really does need time to warm up and cool down...EVERYtime you drive.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 26, 2003, 3:45 am

Alright, then I'll get the Eclipse GS....

The one I saw today had alloy wheels, CD, Sunroof, some like leather steering wheel and shifter little odds and ends..$21,750 or something like that.

$3,000 cash back (if I don't use thier financing).

Can probably talk them down to $21,000 or less.

So were looking at $18,000.

I'm about to get on auto trader and see how much my current car is worth, then enter my own ad...I might be able to get as much as $4,000 for it.

It will cost me like $14k + tax after I sell my car.

Pilsburry · Post by **Pilsburry** » September 26, 2003, 4:17 am

Wow some people are trying to sell 1996 sunfires for $8,000+

I put mine at $4,900 it's about average cost...but lower miles then most (63k), more features too I think (bigger engine, upgraded stereo, sunroof).

My interior is near perfect, there is no mechanical problem I know of, I crashed it once, but the impact was 5mph or less....didn't do any body work.

So the biggest complaint will be a couple dings. But it's not like caved in from a serious impact or any rust.

If I get a bite I get a bite....if not I have a nice car to drive on days when it snows or salt is abundant this winter.

Lynxe · Post by **Lynxe** » September 26, 2003, 8:50 am

Pils: I have a good friend who bought a Tiburon a few years ago and is fanatical about it. If you want to fire me off a PM with some questions for him I'd gladly pass them along and I'm sure he'd be happy to answer them or chat with you. (He is actually Gung's new roommate).

Marbus said

if you have a truck you will look more like a real man

Does an SUV fall into the "truck" category or is it a different class? I picked up one of these in Feb (blood red, not silver) and I am definitely not "a real man"

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » September 26, 2003, 10:19 am

Just fucking test drive the god damn cars already and stop making up a whole book of changing minds and half truths.

Kylere · Post by **Kylere** » September 26, 2003, 10:30 am

Kelshara wrote:Just fucking test drive the god damn cars already and stop making up a whole book of changing minds and half truths.

Geez welcome once again to the new "Clueless as Cartalas Award" winner. Pils has yet to tell a single lie in this thread, but you are throwing baseless accusations without proof.

Kaelina · Post by **Kaelina** » September 26, 2003, 11:06 am

Service at the Mitsubishi dealerships has been complete ass. Three different dealerships here in NY could not manage to fix my car. The people were fucking rude, and they even charged me a few times when they did NOTHING to the car, while the problem merrily continued (the car would randomly shut off while driving down the road, even at 60+ MPH).

Saturn service is by far the best I've seen.

Rojer · Post by **Rojer** » September 26, 2003, 11:27 am

I am giving some hardcore consideration to buying this, any one have any thoughts on it?

http://www.edmunds.com/apps/uvl/idp.do? ... &zip=55082

Rojer