MGS4 Too Big for 50GB Blu Ray Disk

[Winnow]

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/03/02/kojim ... -ray-disc/

Even the largest format optical storage can't hold new games so it was smart for Microsoft to stick with DL DVDs. They'd still have to use multiple disks anyway!

It looks like they're robbing people of content in MGS4 to make it fit. Microsoft has no bullshit Sony pride. They'd simply add more disks if the game is too large. Eight DL-DVDs!

It's not much of a shocker to learn the latest (and final) installment in the Metal Gear Solid series is a sizable one -- MGS games have a history of being big (and beautiful). However, a recent interview with series creator Hideo Kojima revealed a startling fact about MGS4 -- Kojima complained that a few features had to be cut from the game so it would fit on a Blu-ray disc. As format fanatics already know, that means the game takes up nearly 50 gigabytes of space.

If true, this is bad news for anyone who hoped to see anthropomorphic cow-bots on the 360 (unless that data was divided between about five dual-layer DVDs), but it could also mean a painfully long installation time for PS3 owners as well. We can only imagine that 49 of those gigabytes are taken up by thousands of variations on just three lines of dialogue -- "Snake? SNAKE? SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!?"

[Animalor]

What I loved seeing was the commenters on some blogs that were bashing the Xbox for having multi-disk games were asking for Kojima to put out 2 BD's for MGS4.

Personally, I'm anxious to see how well Ninja Gaiden 2 on the 360 will do against MGS4 for the PS3 since they're coming out at roughly the same time.

[Waikiki]

The blog that I read stated the following:

In an exclusive interview with Hideo Kojima, creator of the Metal Gear series, he complained that the size of the 50GB Blu-Ray discs were not enough for Metal Gear Solid 4. The producers of the title considered the disc to small and they had to compress some parts of the game in order to keep it on one disc.

I wonder who translated correctly?

[miir]

The blog that I read stated the following:

In an exclusive interview with Hideo Kojima, creator of the Metal Gear series, he complained that the size of the 50GB Blu-Ray discs were not enough for Metal Gear Solid 4. The producers of the title considered the disc to small and they had to compress some parts of the game in order to keep it on one disc.

I wonder who translated correctly?

It's seems a hell of a lot more logical to compress some assets than to cut parts from the game to make it fit on one disc.

It looks like they're robbing people of content in MGS4 to make it fit. Microsoft has no bullshit Sony pride. They'd simply add more disks if the game is too large. Eight DL-DVDs!

I have no idea what this means... I checked around and unless Sony purchased Konami this morning, they are sure as fuck are not publishing/producing/distributing MGS4.... and unless Sony is (secretly) forcing developers to limit their games to one blu-ray disc, it would appear that you're talking out your ass once again.

[Winnow]

More disks = possibility for more disk cover art!

[Winnow]

Metal Gear Solid 4

Kojima Disappointed With Metal Gear Solid 4

Looks like Kojima Jr. isn't the only one disappointed with Metal Gear Solid. The latest issue of the UK's Edge magazine contains an interview with Metal Gear creator Hideo Kojima, who expresses disappointment with the latest game in the series, Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots. It isn't so much the gameplay itself as it is the graphics.

"Game-wise, it's pretty close to the original vision: you sneak into the battlefield and can choose whether to do a stealth game or interfere with the battle more directly. But the graphic, side things like motion-blending and the size of the map, totally was not accomplished to my original vision - to my satisfaction.

Now Kojima is a well-known perfectionist, but it is a bit disturbing to see him voice his dissatisfaction with what is supposed to be the masterpiece of the franchise. So where does he lay the blame for not fully realizing his vision?

Not good! This is supposed to be the big hit for the PS3. Even with all the delays (year +), they still can't program games for the PS3.

I hope Final Fantasy XIII turns out OK in 2010.

PS3
Operation: Clusterfuck

[Tyek]

LOL Winnow cracks me up

[Truant]

LOL Winnow cracks me up

way to feed.

[Jice Virago]

Any FPS that needs more than 50gb at this point is using way to much fucking FMV. Its tolerable in an RPG (I was fine with it in Lost Odysee) because those are more story driven, but for action/fps games, its just dumb. My spidey sense is telling me MSG4 is probably going to suck because in the past the more CGI FMVs they pump in to a game, the shittier the actual game winds up being (see Devil May Cry series) when its done. I am willing to bet the thing probably has a huge fucking hard drive install, as well. But the HD install I can accept, because it means better performance and less "Loading Content" bullshit that plagues every 360 game I play, lately.

[Niffoni]

I don't buy it. I think Kojima is just living out the Japanese dream of being able to say "It's so big it won't even fit" about something.

[Winnow]

Wow, MGS4 launch in japan was a dud:

http://kotaku.com/5015692/metal-gear-so ... ch-+-osaka

http://kotaku.com/5015686/metal-gear-so ... ch-+-tokyo


The launch in New York with Kojima in attendance at least looked like a fun time:

http://kotaku.com/5015693/hideo-kojima- ... ght-launch

[Animalor]

Wow, MGS4 launch in japan was a dud:

http://kotaku.com/5015692/metal-gear-so ... ch-+-osaka

http://kotaku.com/5015686/metal-gear-so ... ch-+-tokyo


The launch in New York with Kojima in attendance at least looked like a fun time:

http://kotaku.com/5015693/hideo-kojima- ... ght-launch

That's probably cause all the lauch events were cancelled in Akibara cause of the mass murder that happened last week.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i9oA ... AD916EHU80

[Winnow]

That's probably cause all the lauch events were cancelled in Akibara cause of the mass murder that happened last week.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i9oA ... AD916EHU80

It really wasn't that massive. The Japanese are overreacting. Most had mere flesh wounds.

We get one of those a day in the U.S.

edit: follow up to yesterdays report:

So! It finally happened. Metal Gear Solid 4 launched. I went out and checked the launch here in Osaka. Seems like the US launch was more successful with bigger crowds, bigger hype. For a AAA game (and hardware bundle), the Tokyo lines were surprisingly short. Like compared to how, say, Monster Hunter Portable 2nd G moved games and software in Japan with hundreds of people turning out at multiple locations across Tokyo in droves, the MGS4 launch here was way low-key. No doubt Sony is hoping MGS4 will do the same in Japan. Guess we'll find out when the official sales numbers come in.

As I mentioned in the comment section: Granted, it was raining in Tokyo (sunny in Osaka!) and there was that recent Akihabara tragedy, but from what I saw MGS4 doesn't look like it's doing gangbusters here. Maybe the actual sales figures will be different or maybe the game has legs or maybe everyone will be picking it up on the way home from work. Who knows?

[Funkmasterr]

That's probably cause all the lauch events were cancelled in Akibara cause of the mass murder that happened last week.
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i9oA ... AD916EHU80

It really wasn't that massive. The Japanese are overreacting. Most had mere flesh wounds.

We get one of those a day in the U.S.

edit: follow up to yesterdays report:

So! It finally happened. Metal Gear Solid 4 launched. I went out and checked the launch here in Osaka. Seems like the US launch was more successful with bigger crowds, bigger hype. For a AAA game (and hardware bundle), the Tokyo lines were surprisingly short. Like compared to how, say, Monster Hunter Portable 2nd G moved games and software in Japan with hundreds of people turning out at multiple locations across Tokyo in droves, the MGS4 launch here was way low-key. No doubt Sony is hoping MGS4 will do the same in Japan. Guess we'll find out when the official sales numbers come in.

As I mentioned in the comment section: Granted, it was raining in Tokyo (sunny in Osaka!) and there was that recent Akihabara tragedy, but from what I saw MGS4 doesn't look like it's doing gangbusters here. Maybe the actual sales figures will be different or maybe the game has legs or maybe everyone will be picking it up on the way home from work. Who knows?

I won't be too surprised if it doesn't do well.. the Japanese are confining themselves more and more to childish anime type games, and "stylistic" crap like that recent RPG on the DS.

[Animalor]

OMFG this is rich.

So apparently, MGS4 has installs. Yes I said installS. There's an install when you start the game and installs between each of the 5 acts in the game.

I first read this on Tycho's blog post from yesterday:

In the space of our play experience, we've already seen two separate installs. The game is still broken up into discrete areas, which I found odd, the assumption being that if we were taking time out to install shit it was because we were doing it to sustain a single world. You would have a hard time convincing me that multiple installs over the course of playing a videogame are worse than disc swapping. This has become some kind of theological question on forums, a kind of philosophical pinata, except no matter how many times you strike it no reward is forthcoming. Blu-Ray is only a convenience if it is actually convenient, if it doesn't require concessions either at the beginning of an experience or at several points throughout. It's amazing to me that this is considered progress.

What strikes me as interesting is this: How is a 3-4 minute install between acts better than the 30-45 seconds it takes to swap a DVD9 disk.

No wonder Konami ordered reviewers not to talk about install times in their reviews.

[miir]

Picked this up for cheap yesterday... what a truly bizarre game.
Lots of really nicely done cutscenes. Production values are top notch.
Gameplay is typical stealth/shooter.
I usually don't care much for 1st/3rd person games on consoles but this one is easy to control and not too twitchy.

[Animalor]

I'm holding out until the PS3 is under 200$ before taking the plunge.

The only real perk for me over the 360 is the Blu-Ray playback and Blu-Ray movies and players are still prohibitively expensive and the rental collection just isn't there yet.

[miir]

Blu-Ray was huge for me when I was deciding which to get...
For $399 CDN you get a blu-ray player, 80 gig HD, wireless network connection, a good selection of games and free full-featured online play.


For the same price you can get a standard 60 gig 360 with a USB wireless adapter and a great selection of games. You can't get a HD player for the 360 and they make you pay ($8/month, $50/year) for full-featured online play.

Not a very good value in my opinion.

[Animalor]

Value is ultimately in the eye of the beholder.

My 360 allows me to stream the content of my Vista Media Center to my TV. Allows me a full featured PVR based from my PC without having to pay Rogers or Bell 300$ upfront or 15-25$ a month of rental fees.

The online community I play games with now is on the 360. I don't play MMO's anymore so the actual cost of my online gaming has actually reduced by 120$ a year.

I don't own the wireless adapter because my TV is close enough to my broadband equipment that I can run cable.

Streaming DivX content from the dashboard is also a huge plus.

My wife and daughter love all the capabilities that I've provided them through the unit and that one, while subjective, is priceless for me.

If I do one day buy a 2nd PCD panel for somewhere else in the house, I'll most likely get another 360 arcade to act as a 2nd streaming device since Windows Media Center can feed up to 5 devices.

Sure the PS3 could give me Blu-Ray and content streaming(sans The Media Center Extender) but I've seen the XMB and it would not be anywhere near as easy to teach my wife and daughter how to access the content.

[miir]

My 360 allows me to stream the content of my Vista Media Center to my TV. Allows me a full featured PVR based from my PC without having to pay Rogers or Bell 300$ upfront or 15-25$ a month of rental fees.

The PS3 (and even the Wii) can do the exact same thing. Heck, even the original Xbox can do that.

The online community I play games with now is on the 360. I don't play MMO's anymore so the actual cost of my online gaming has actually reduced by 120$ a year.

It would be even cheaper with the PS3. In 2 and a half years, you could buy another PS3 with the money you saved!

I don't own the wireless adapter because my TV is close enough to my broadband equipment that I can run cable.

Some people don't have that luxury.
Microsoft charging $100 for a USB wireless G adapter is nothing short of highway fucking robbery.

Streaming DivX content from the dashboard is also a huge plus

Every current generation console can do this.

If I do one day buy a 2nd PCD panel for somewhere else in the house, I'll most likely get another 360 arcade to act as a 2nd streaming device since Windows Media Center can feed up to 5 devices.

Why would you dump $200 for a non-HDMI device that you would have to physically connect to your network?
Why not drop an extra $60 for a Wii that can do exactly the same thing and has a different/better selection of games that your wife and daughter will probably love more than the Xbox?

Sure the PS3 could give me Blu-Ray and content streaming(sans The Media Center Extender) but I've seen the XMB and it would not be anywhere near as easy to teach my wife and daughter how to access the content.

Have you even seen media streamed from a PS3?
TVersity is a vastly superior media server to Windows Media Center and it's not a resource pig.

Do your wife and daughter know how to use a remote control?
I didn't even have to show my wife how to access our music, photos and TV/Movies on my media server via the PS3. She figured it our for herself in about 30 seconds.

[Animalor]

*sigh* Why do I even fucking bother. We all know that you hate the 360 and any hack is inherantly better than anything that can be done natively..

The PS3 (and even the Wii) can do the exact same thing. Heck, even the original Xbox can do that.

The only way that the PS3 can do this is either through installing Linux on the PS3 or installing a web server on your PC and streaming it to a Flash-enabled browser on your Wii or PS3. Not exactly convenient either way to the 1-button push to dedicated software on the machine that I have now.

Yes the original Xbox has a hack that allows a great Media Center(XBMC), but Windows Media Center this is a simple, out of the box solution that works great and doesn't require a lot of tinkering.

It would be even cheaper with the PS3. In 2 and a half years, you could buy another PS3 with the money you saved!

While this is true, the people I play games with would still be absent. And clusterfucks of online registration like the Metal Gear Online's 3 seperate registrations would still be present.

I don't own the wireless adapter because my TV is close enough to my broadband equipment that I can run cable.

Some people don't have that luxury.
Microsoft charging $100 for a USB wireless G adapter is nothing short of highway fucking robbery.

No arguement there. It is robbery. The 120GB HDD prices isn't any better either.

Then again, Sony isn't exactly a consumer haven with a 60$ DS3 because they were too cheap to pay immersion in the first place or the 70$ HDMI Cable pack.

Streaming DivX content from the dashboard is also a huge plus

Every current generation console can do this.

PS3 can do this natively. The Wii had tu use more 3rd party software and it's web browser. See #1.

If I do one day buy a 2nd PCD panel for somewhere else in the house, I'll most likely get another 360 arcade to act as a 2nd streaming device since Windows Media Center can feed up to 5 devices.

Why would you dump $200 for a non-HDMI device that you would have to physically connect to your network?
Why not drop an extra $60 for a Wii that can do exactly the same thing and has a different/better selection of games that your wife and daughter will probably love more than the Xbox?

Err, all 360's have had HDMI for 2 years now. I have a DS in the house with a few general titles(Brain Age, Animal Crossing etc) and my wife and daughter don't touch that thing at all. Maybe in a few years when my daughter is 7-8 I'll get a Wii if it's still relevant.

Sure the PS3 could give me Blu-Ray and content streaming(sans The Media Center Extender) but I've seen the XMB and it would not be anywhere near as easy to teach my wife and daughter how to access the content.

Have you even seen media streamed from a PS3?
TVersity is a vastly superior media server to Windows Media Center and it's not a resource pig.

Have you even seen the ressource usage from Media Center???

My 360 streaming live TV right now is using ~100MB of RAM(% of the total on the PC) and about 1-2.5% of processing power available.. That's less than iTunes uses when it starts up. It's almost less than an average web browser process.

How much does TVersity use when it's doing transcoding on the fly from various formats and streaming?

I won't even bother responding to the comment about my wife and 4 year old.

[Boogahz]

I don't own the wireless adapter because my TV is close enough to my broadband equipment that I can run cable.

Some people don't have that luxury.
Microsoft charging $100 for a USB wireless G adapter is nothing short of highway fucking robbery.

I use a Linksys adapter that I got for $40. It works just fine.

[miir]

I wasn't aware that the 360 arcade now has HDMI. When I was looking at them, they did not.

It's also cool that you cna use 3rd party USB network adapters with the 360. When I was looking into purchasing a 360, it only supported the 'official' xbox wireless network adapter.


But I stand by my assessment that the PS3 is a better value.

For a comparable price, It does everything that the 360 can do PLUS you get a Blu-Ray player.
The only advantage to the 360 is the larger selection of games.

[Boogahz]

For a comparable price, It does everything that the 360 can do PLUS you get a Blu-Ray player.
The only advantage to the 360 is the larger selection of games.

I use my console for games rather than movies.

[Fairweather Pure]

IMO, the PS3 is only a value if you want blu ray. Most people do not.

One of the main reasosn I perfer Xbox is because my RL friends have Xbox. I know 1 person with a PS3, and he only watches movies on it. In the end, you have to choose a system that supoprts your wants and needs. A PS3 accomplishes none of those things for me.

Does Sony not even have the trophy system in place yet?

I bought my parents a 360 for Xmas. Now I can play online with my Dad and little brother, and they have access to my constantly growing game collection. The decision was pretty much a no brainer.

[miir]

Most people do not.

I know loads of people who bought a PS3 over the 360 because of the BluRay player.
I know people who are non-gamers who bought the PS3.
Just because YOU PERSONALLY have no interest in a BluRay player, don't try to project that on what the average consumer wants.

Does Sony not even have the trophy system in place yet?

Starting 2009 trophies are going to be mandatory for all PS3 game releases.
I'd estimate that 80-90% of the games released in the past 6 months have trophies.

[Animalor]

I wasn't aware that the 360 arcade now has HDMI. When I was looking at them, they did not.

Shortly after the elite shipped, the motherboards with HDMI got rolled out to all new SKU's coming out. I'm kinda irked that mine doesn't ahve HDMI but the VGA cable does an admirable job with the graphics.

It's also cool that you cna use 3rd party USB network adapters with the 360. When I was looking into purchasing a 360, it only supported the 'official' xbox wireless network adapter.

This isn't just a USB wireless adapter that you plug in sadly. It's one of those base stations that you configure at your PC, then hook up to your 360 with an ethernet cable and it requires it's own power. Yes it works, yes it's cheaper but it's far from simple or elegant.

[miir]

This isn't just a USB wireless adapter that you plug in sadly. It's one of those base stations that you configure at your PC, then hook up to your 360 with an ethernet cable and it requires it's own power. Yes it works, yes it's cheaper but it's far from simple or elegant.

If it saves $60

[Animalor]

The price of a new game =)

[Winnow]

The PS3 is complete crap if you like to play online games with your friends. There's no contest between Live and whatever PS3 offers. I could give a rat's ass if PS online is free if it sucks, which it does. At this point I'd sell my PS3, with upgraded 160GB HD and Little Big Planet for 250.00 If I needed money. Luckily I don't! Hate the controller for the PS3 as well which is something you have in your hands 100% of the time you use a console unless watching movies. You also have to sit through frequent, time consuming firmware updates for the PS3 for bullshit updates as opposed to meaningful, less frequent, short install updates for the 360.

[miir]

There have been exactly TWO firmware updates in the past 4 months.

Online gaming with the PS3 is good. Maybe not as good as on the xbox, but I play Warhawk, Resistance2, Burnout and Fifa09 all the time with friends from work. Fifa is fucking great online.



The main reason I think you dislike the PS3 (if you even actually have a PS3) is because you can't play pirated games on it.

[Winnow]

New, quieter Jasper 360's hitting stores:

http://kotaku.com/5099691/jasper-360-co ... the-market

And of course I have a PS3. It sucks. On top of it being a bad machine, it looks like the 60GB HD was faulty as well. At least spending even more money for a new HD on the already expensive PS3 fixed that problem.

I've bought two games for the PS3:

GTA-IV: had freezing issues, online multiplayer, lobby, matches blew.

Little Big Planet: Played for an hour so far right after purchasing...and only after downloading two consecutive patches, with the online levels not accessible due to server issues...surprise surprise. Downloaded a third patch the other day just to boot it up and show a friend.

The only game that's impressed me on the PS3 was Uncharted.

Other than that, 360 all the way including many more, higher quality, games than the PS3. Less FPS issues, less patching issues, less complaining from developers about what a bitch the PS3 is to program for.

[miir]

Yea winnow, we all know you hate the PS3...
This is a thread about a PS3 game that you don't own and that you have never played.
Go faggot up some other threads with your 360 fanboy shit.

I actually find it funny that some 360 owners feel so insecure about their choice of console that we (me boog and animalor) can't even have a decent conversation about consoles without the retards screaming about how much the PS3 sucks.

Give a fucking rest already.

[Winnow]

I'm sorry, but didn't you faggot up this thread long before my comments? I think you might want to re-read the thread post sequence on expanding the topic beyond MSG4.

Don't see how I can feel insecure about a 360 purchase when I own both consoles. I absolutely hate Apple yet at least I can see the quality in some of their portable players and phones. For hating Apple so much, I own:

Mac Plus (back in the day, and still own that overheating heap of shit), Nano, Nano Fatty, iTouch and an iPhone 3G

I even spent weeks with OSX trying to understand why anyone would like it over Windows. It's crap. It's perfect for idiots and old people on the verge of dementia.

As for Sony gaming, I owned a PS2 and liked it (not as much as Xbox but it was ok and had a huge selection of games) PS3 blows. Have owned it longer than you've owned yours. I've described in detail why it sucks, especially the controller. Sony made poor design choices and then rushed it at the end. You've got a complex CPU combined with a crappy thrown in graphics card. A handful of games worth playing on it and even less exclusives worth considering. Online gaming is ass. Long as firmware upgrades that do little to improve, just fixing bugs.

[miir]

Seriosuly dude, fuck off.









The only way to get winnow to shut the fuck up is by letting him get the last word..

[Winnow]

You fuck off. I started this thread!

[Fairweather Pure]

Most people do not.

I know loads of people who bought a PS3 over the 360 because of the BluRay player.
I know people who are non-gamers who bought the PS3.
Just because YOU PERSONALLY have no interest in a BluRay player, don't try to project that on what the average consumer wants.

Blu Ray movies have made up 4% of home video sales this year, leaving 96% of sales firmly in the hands of plain 'ol DVD sales. Most people are not buying Blu Ray movies, and therefore most do not care about the Blu Ray player in a PS3.

Sales figures from industry-tracking website VGChartz shows that more around 336,517 Nintendo Wii consoles have been bought in the last month, compared to about 190,440 Xbox 360 consoles and 88,561 PlayStation 3s.

Gamers also don't seem to care for the Blu Ray player in the PS3.

[miir]

I'll leave you 360 fanboys alone to your circle jerk.
Enjoy.

[Fash]

I'm not even going to bother posting links to discredit your bullshit numbers regarding BluRay market share and PS3 sales.
You obviously just pulled them out of your ass.

edit: to add miir's now deleted post

[Fash]

Fairweathers ass has a big industry website AND a magazine!!

Anyways, I was able to source his claims in just a few minutes and wasn't able to find any contrary information.

[miir]

.

[cadalano]

xbox is mo betta.

[Fairweather Pure]

I had linked it originally, but cut it to paste it in a different spot in my post and forgot to repaste the link. I was tired or something!

Let's be clear. I am not a 360 fanboi. I hated the first Xbox. It's one of the reasons it took me so long to jump on board this generation of gaming, since the 360 was first out of the gate I wanted no part of it! I owned a PS2 with around 40 games by the time I decided to go next gen. There is a reason that Xbox is outperforming the PS3 by so much (and reasons why the Wii is killing both). We have had this discussion various times over the years and the case just gets stronger for the same reasons.

I will buy a PS3 when I am ready for Blu Ray. I will not buy games for a PS3 if I have the choice between 360 and PS3 because of the inferior online capability and lack of my friends that own a PS3. I also like the 360 controller significantly more.

Blu Ray players are one of the big ticket toys that seem to be flying off the shelves this year. I think PS3 will have a large boost for that very reason. That, and the fact that people are now purchasing both systems. I would hope that Blu Ray market penetration will continue to improve through the years. It helped that we now have a single format. As it is now, they haven't even hit max Laser Disc sales percentages. I will likely convert when I start seeing Blu Ray movies in the 10$ or less range when they are on sale. I will repurchase only certian titles. Stuff like Lord of the Rings and Pixar films, but not movies like Office Space or Sling Blade.

The cons to me going Blu are pretty large right now, so I just cannot justify it.

[Kwonryu DragonFist]

Me and the missus bought a PS3!

We watched The Dark Knight in bluray!

[Animalor]

How the things they change in 18 months..

So I got MGS4 on Thursday(or friday?) used at EB.

It's a decent game. Love the narrative and the presentation. My first Metal Gear experience and it didn't disappoint.

I do stand by my point earlier in the thread that the multiple installs between chapters are aggravating but the game is worth playing imo.