Game Fixing?

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Game Fixing?

Post by Tyek »

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=a ... &type=lgns

See Winnow was sort of right. The Spurs victory was all due to the mob. This guy did not ref the game, but I am sure it goes deeper. Right Winnow??? I am with you, the conspiracy lives!!!!
The FBI is investigating allegations that veteran NBA referee Tim Donaghy bet on basketball games over the past two seasons, including ones in which he officiated.
Defense attorney John Lauro confirmed Donaghy is under investigation but refused to comment on the allegations or the case.
According to a law enforcement official, authorities are examining whether the referee made calls to affect the point spread in games on which he or associates had wagered.
The law enforcement official, who spoke to the AP on Friday on condition of anonymity, said the referee was aware of the investigation and had made arrangements to surrender as early as next week to face charges. The official, who did not identify the referee, is familiar with the investigation but was not authorized to speak publicly about the ongoing investigation.
The law enforcement official said the bets involved thousands of dollars and were made on games during the 2005-2006 and 2006-2007 seasons.
According to the Elias Sports Bureau, Donaghy officiated 68 games in the 2005-06 season and 63 games in 2006-07. He also worked 20 playoff games, including five last season.
The NBA issued a brief statement Friday: "We have been asked by the FBI, with whom we are working closely, not to comment on this matter at this time."
The FBI probe, which began recently, also involves allegations that the referee had connections to organized crime associates. Other arrests are expected, the official said.
The referee had a gambling problem, according to the official, and was approached by low-level mob associates through an acquaintance.
The investigation first was reported Friday by the New York Post.
"I'm shocked, terribly shocked," said Gary Benson, an NBA official for 17 years who retired two years ago because of knee problems. "Those are people that you work with and that you literally -- you spend more time with those people than you do with your family."
Benson said he didn't work with Donaghy much.
"You have a lot of acquaintances and very few friends. ... I probably worked a handful of games with him overall, just a handful."
Nevada gambling regulators were not involved in an investigation and had no information about the allegations, said Jerry Markling, enforcement chief for the state Gaming Commission and Gaming Control Board.
Markling, in Las Vegas, said he learned of the probe from news accounts.
"The allegations were new to us," said Mark Clayton, a control board member. "However, we will continue to monitor them to ascertain whether there is any connection to Nevada's licensed sports books."
Veteran oddsmaker John Avello, at the Wynn resort on the Las Vegas Strip, said that without specific information it would be difficult to identify wagering irregularities over the last two seasons.
"At this point, it's too early to know if any games were affected," Avello said, adding that no regulators or investigators had contacted him about the case.
Jay Kornegay, executive director of the sports book at the Las Vegas Hilton, said he had never seen any unusual activity in NBA betting, and was surprised not to have heard about an investigation until Friday.
"Whispers would have happened on the street, and we would have heard something," Kornegay said. "Any type of suspicious or unusual movements, you usually hear in the industry. We're so regulated and policed, any kind of suspicion would be discussed.
"We haven't seen anything like that in the NBA that I can remember," he said, "and we haven't been contacted by anybody."
Kornegay said legal sports betting in Nevada represents a fraction of sports betting worldwide, with 98.5 percent of all action taken outside the state. Clayton cited a 2005 estimate by the National Gambling Impact Study Commission that found $380 billion is wagered on illegal sports betting, compared with $2.25 billion in legal sports betting in Nevada.
Gambling long has been a problem in sports, and leagues have made a point of educating players of the potential pitfalls. The NBA, for example, discusses gambling at rookie orientation, even bringing in former mobster Michael Franceze to speak.
NBA commissioner David Stern had long objected to putting a team in Las Vegas because it permits betting on basketball, though earlier this year allowed Mayor Oscar Goodman to submit a proposal to owners on how the city would handle wagering on a team if it moved there.
Goodman argues that legalized gambling, monitored by the Nevada Gaming Commission, prevents these types of suspicious activities.
"We're the only regulatory agency in the world that really looks at unusual activity as far as the movement of the line and that type of conduct," he said. "I think it's a good thing that Las Vegas has the type of regulation that makes sure that bad things don't happen."
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

I heard about this on the way to work today.

That's really fucked up. Refs can call fouls in the paint at any time. It's too subjective. Easy to rig. The exact same play can be called either way, especially down in the paint.

I hope they release the evidence, mentioning which games, etc. It will piss off the players that were in those games the most.

Side note:

Stern needs to go. That dude blows. Whenever I hear him talk, I can tell that he's totally out of touch with things and doesn't give a shit what people thing.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Pherr the Dorf »

NBA Steroids policy... nuf said as to why Stern is not and should be shitcanned
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

Just keep that big fat * on the 2007 NBA Championship.

Game Three of the Suns/Spurs was the last game the crooked ref participated in:

Image

I remember Amare getting three super fast fouls in the first quarter of that game among other things. Tim Donaghy called the lame charge call when cheap shot Bob flopped....worst call ever.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Boogahz »

It will probably X, but I figured Winnow needed this:

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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by StupidMcDupid »

haha,damn im gonna need a poster of that bruce bowen picture,shit i'll even frame it, maybe i'll roll by the dominions and have him autograph it or something.

And "suns fan" is still crying :D
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

Fans of honesty and integrity are still bitching yes.

It takes a dirty playing team AND a cheating ref to take down the Suns. They should throw out the championship for 2007. It means nothing at this point.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Sylvus »

And, in a counterpoint...
Pounding the Rock wrote:One fellow who is predictably making a huuuuuuuge mountain about this (most likely because he's afraid to jinx his beloved Red Sox by writing a column about them) mole hill is Bill Simmons. He wrote a scathing article about the whole affair, focusing largely on Game 3, and basically took a huge steaming dump on our team and the legitimacy of our fourth title. If you're keeping track at home, the Spurs have only won two championships since neither the 1999 nor 2007 seasons in actuality ever "happened."

That's still two more than Dallas or Phoenix, of course, but I don't need to tell you that.

Personally, I think the NBA should conduct two separate banner/ring/trophy ceremonies every season. One, as per custom, will still be given to the team that wins the NBA Finals, and the other will be awarded to the squad Bill Simmons, President of the Sports Universe, deems worthy.

For this season the Bill Simmons Championship would obviously go to the Suns, last year's would have gone to the Mavs, and in 1999 we'd give one to, I dunno, the Celtics I guess. Because we all feel terrible about Len Bias and Reggie Lewis, really. Their premature deaths were the biggest tragedy in the history of the world you know. Well, outside of Boston not getting the 1st or 2nd pick in this lottery, that is.

Anyway, if Steve Nash and co. want to use the Donaghy thing as an excuse for losing, that's fine with me. Excuses are for losers. I watched every minute of that series and as I remember it, the Spurs prevailed mainly because Amare still sucks on defense, Shawn Marion always comes up small when it counts, Tony dominated Barbosa on both ends of the court, and Raja Bell couldn't guard Manu at all in Games 5 or 6. Oh, and Mike D'Antoni killed them the whole series. Anyone here remember it differently?

Simmons made excuse after excuse for the Suns, covering up for all their failures and conveniently ignoring all the tiny details that hurt his argument. Let's take them one by one.

He says the Suns would've won game 1 if Nash didn't get hurt. I hate to break it to you Bill, but not only were the Spurs winning the game at the time of Nash's injury, (self-inflicted by the way) but he was out for only 45 seconds total and those crooked NBA refs you're so low on made every allowance they could to get him back in the game, blatantly delaying action like umpires stopping to sweep home plate so a catcher can recover from a foul ball to the groin. No matter how much time they gave him, Nash and the trainer couldn't stop the bleeding.

Whose fault is that?

And you know what? As far as Game 1 goes, having Nash on the bench wasn't exactly a handicap for Phoenix. He sucked that game and finished with a -12 while his backup, Barbosa was +4.

Going into the series, most of the experts picked the Spurs to win because they were the tougher, more defensive minded, more experienced team (kinda like your old Celtics, eh Bill?). Game 1 was a chance for the Suns to make a statement on their home floor and they, and particularly their leader, came out flat and laid an egg. The Spurs stomped on them easily without Manu even playing all that well.

Game 2 was a legitamate beatdown for the Suns, and they did what they had to do, salvaging one home game. The Spurs never looked very crisp or into it and one got the impression that they were satisfied with themselves getting the one road win.

That brings us to Game 3, and Simmons' apopylectic shitfit. Yes, there were a few bad calls in the game, as there are in every game. But looking at the supposed Zapruder film on Youtube, nothing strikes me as that egregious besides the one Ginobili play. And even in that one, the issue wasn't that a foul was called, (Manu certainly thought there was, judging by his reaction) but the timing of it, with Donaghy blowing the whistle well after the shot attempt.

What's funny about the rest of the plays though is that A) they're mostly no-calls on 50/50 plays against the Spurs defense and B) Donaghy isn't the one making the calls, it's Eddie F. Rush. I guess he was in on it too.

People are making a big deal that Amare Stoudemire played only 21 minutes in this game because of foul trouble, but nobody brings up the fact that Amare was second in all of the NBA in fouls committed last season. Also, he's the bright individual that got himself suspended in Game 4.

Here's my crazy conspiracy theory, ready? Maybe, just maybe, Amare only played 21 minutes because Amare is really fucking stupid.

Whoa.

You know what's really hilarious? The worst non-call of the game wasn't even mentioned by Simmons or the Youtube clip. Raja Bell raked Manu across the face and practically gouged out his eye (remember the cut?) in the 3rd quarter. Nobody called a foul even though the evidence was pretty hard to refute afterward. Funny how nobody is bringing that play up, huh? In fact, what happened in the aftermath of that non-call is what won the game for the Spurs, not a crooked ref. Gino was so pissed off that he exploded for like 8 points in 40 seconds or something at the end of the 3rd quarter and the Spurs turned a tight game into a relatively routine playoff win.

Still, Simmons' rationalization for why "the bad refs" were sent to work Game 3 is ridiculous. Despite their Game 2 loss, the Spurs weren't the team that had anything to prove, Phoenix was. They were the wimps and chokers without the rings, not us. Show me one person, TSG included, who thought the Suns were still going to win that series after Game 1. The way Bill makes it sound, the league was afraid of Phoenix blowing past the Spurs 4-1 and sent the pro-home refs to give the feeble Spurs a chance to prolong the series before eventually succumbing to their mighty nectarine-and-plum clad conquerors in Game 6 or 7. Gimme a break. If the NBA was interested in a long series, they would have assigned road-friendly refs, if there even is such a thing, to Game 3. All the pressure to win in that situation is on the team that lost home court advantage. You give them Game 3 so they can relax and make the underdog play their tails off in Game 4 to send the series back 2-2.

Anyway, nward we go to Game 4. TSG makes it sound like that the Suns, finally given proper refs to work with, boatraced us in this game since they were the clearly superior team. Is he smoking crack? We were winning the whole game, and up by double digits for a huge chunk of it. We totally collapsed in the last eight minutes (you want to talk about some bad calls, go watch this one again, good lord) and the Suns outright stole the game.

Does anyone remember the actual game? No. All people talk about is the Nash/Robert Horry play, otherwise known as, "THE DIRTIEST, HARDEST, AND MOST FLAGRANT FOUL EVER COMMITTED."

What started as a simple hard foul became a month-long news story for three reasons, all having to do with the Suns. 1) Nash totally embellished the foul and pretended to be in a lot of pain, even though he got up pretty damn quickly when 2) Bell went after Horry after the play, turning it into an altercation leading to 3) Amare and Diaw stupidly leaving the bench and getting themselves suspended.

What's ironic to me about the suspensions is that with everyone questioning the integrity of the NBA in general and David Stern in particular, it took a lot of guts and ethics to do what he did. Think about it, why would this guy purposefully pull the strings for the Spurs? What's in it for him? Our team gets NO ratings. We play a slowdown style, our players don't say or do anything outrageous, and our coach shuns the media like a plague. ESPN can't stand us, and the public won't watch us. Our players are known as either shameless and balding floppers, dirty thugs, whiners, or emotionless automatons. Our point guard is only "NOW" because he's married to a woman everyone wants to sleep with.

Somebody give me one selfish or business-driven reason why Stern would want the Spurs in the NBA Finals. Go ahead, I've got all day.

He suspended Amare and Boris not because there's a conspiracy or because he wanted the Spurs to win. He suspended them because they broke a rule. David Stern isn't stupid. He knew that 90% of the people watching that series were rooting for the Suns. But rules are rules and the leaving the bench rule is a good one for the league; a concept that Bill Simmons and most of the gang at ESPN just can't seem to swallow because it - GASP! - happened in a playoff game and it was a spur of the moment thing.

Because you know, most brawls and fights like the Knicks/Nuggets thing or the Malice in the Palace are choreographed and planned well in advance.

I commend Stern for having the stones to suspend Amare, knowing the heat he would face for it and going through with it anyway. It's disingenuous of Simmons to bring up the suspension when it has nothing to do with the Donaghy controversy and laughable for him to group Diaw in with Stoudemire as "one of the Suns main guys." Mind you that this is the same Boris Diaw that Bill made fat jokes about the whole season and whom the Suns were desperately trying to unload during the offseason. For God sakes, I think Horry was more valuable to us than Diaw was to them, and the only reason he got a two game suspension (the Warriors alone committed a half dozen fouls in their five game series with the Jazz that were more egregious than Horry's by the way) was to make the thing look more palatable.

All you need to know about the Game 5 suspensions was that the NBA board of governors had a chance this past month to change or alter the rule and they decided not to. All of the whining and complaining was sound and fury, signifying nothing.

As for Game 5 itself, the culprits weren't Stern or the refs. The guy who blew that game was D'Antoni, plain and simple. He only played six guys (his main three of Nash, Marion and Bell all played 46+ mins) and his guys were completely tapped out in the second half. In the 2nd quarter with a 15 to 20 point lead, there was no reason for D'Antoni to not give Pat Burke and Jalen Rose a few spot minutes. No matter how poorly they did, it's not like they were in a position to kill the team right then. D'Antoni's lack of trust in his bench has crippled the Suns for three years running now and it boggles my mind that nobody took him to task for how he totally mismanaged such a critical, winnable game. A coach can't react to two rotation players being out by simply doling out their minutes to the other six. You have a 12 man roster for a reason and if you can't trust over a third of your guys for even a couple of minutes with a huge lead, then perhaps someone else should be brought in to do the GM job.

Oh right, that happened.

Simmons' assertion that the Suns would've cruised in Game 5 is asinine given how easily the Spurs won Games 1, 3, and 6 and how they were winning most of Game 4. The only contest, out of six, that the Suns won undisputed was Game 2. They got Amare back and all that changed was both teams scored a lot more points. You didn't need to have a ref on the inside to predict that one.

The better team won the series, and I wish ESPN and all the Suns bandwagoners could just accept it already. If y'all want rings, then perhaps you should tell your superduperstars to play a little defense and tell your coach to act like a leader of men instead of Yosemite Sam on speed.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

Dirty play is encouraged in the NBA. The NBA refs are fixing games and Stern is a moron.

2007 NBA Champions: Phoenix Suns

In 2008 they go for back to back titles. They should breeze through the playoffs if the game fixes are over.

If it's clear that dirty play is still encouraged, after the All Star game, the Suns players will start taking out kneecaps and probably have a perfect record thereafter. The NBA has until the All Star game to get its shit together.

I'll be done with NBA if it turns out to be as bad as it has been for the last year. It's hard to support a league that penalizes emotion, allows no individualism, has crooked refs, and rewards dirty play over skilled play. Grats on a boring product and the lowest finals ratings ever. Genius marketing.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Boogahz »

Maybe your team won't suck itself into a loser's position next season...or did you not read the counterpoint Sylvus posted? It actually had some good points regarding the Suns shooting themselves in the foot and the idiocy behind your claims of the calls being made by a crooked official among other things.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

What kind of moronic argument is that? When two of your key players are suspended, there are less players to play against a full strength quality team. The Suns would have won game five at full strength. They weren't going to win it by substituting Banks and Burke for Nash and K.Thomas. Take out Duncan and Ginobili and see how the Spurs would have fared against the Suns.

Cause and effect.

That the Suns came close to winning game five makes it game of the year considering Amare and Diaw were out. You've got to appreciate the Suns even more for putting out that kind of clean effort short handed against a dirty team and refs.

If the Suns were dirty, James Jones would have punched any Spur player he was close to the minute he saw Duncan walk off the bench onto the floor. Another fantastic "judgement" call by the NBA determined that it wasn't an issue. The league is blind or corrupt. Considering the latest developments, I'm leaning toward corrupt.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Kelshara »

Every time Winnow posts about the Suns I get this image of a little kid in my head screaming and crying heh.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Tyek »

and if Kobe and Shaq got along...blah blah blah

Woulda coulda shoulda winnow. you lost.

I once heard a Raider fan on the Jim Rome show explain how their 8-8 record could have easily turned into a Super Bowl title if....

he started using the term Raider myopia right after that call, not sure if he uses it now, but you sure remind me of that call in this thread.

******Hope that makes sense, it is 2 am in El Paso I am drunk and I have an early flight home, so I take little responsibility for grammar or spelling.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

Tyek wrote:and if Kobe and Shaq got along...blah blah blah
You can't compare an asshat personality like Kobe's to the CANADIAN SPORTSMAN OF THE YEAR 2X! The Suns are good people! They were'n robbed due to inner conflicts and big heads. The very foundations of the NBA were rocked. Refs cheating, dirty play being ignored.

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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Gzette »

he's saying it doesn't fucking matter. get over it and stop reaching
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

Gzette wrote:he's saying it doesn't fucking matter. get over it and stop reaching
It does matter. Not in the grand scheme of life but in the little world of the NBA it matters.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by StupidMcDupid »

Hey *if* suns still had barkeley they would have crushed the spurs right?

Just face it,even charles barkeley (ex phoenix sun) predicts the spurs to win the title every year.There isnt any conspiracy, the better team won.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Winnow »

Charles is funny but he's a moron when it comes to being an analyst. He also has it in for the Suns as he left on bad terms. Everyone knows this that has followed the situation.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Tyek »

Donaghy may name other officials. This could be really bad for the NBA. Every game will be questioned as to whether it was fixed. Every close call will be really scrutinized. Even if this is not true, he has hurt the league even more now.

ESPN report says he may identify as many as 20 NBA officials who gamble

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS



NEW YORK -- The referees union maintains that Tim Donaghy is known to be the only referee involved in gambling activities, despite a report that he was about to provide names of colleagues who may also have violated NBA rules.

The report on ESPN Radio in New York said that Donaghy will provide prosecutors as many as 20 names of other NBA officials and will detail their involvement in some form of gambling, believed to include betting in casinos.

The offenses may not include criminal activity, according to the report, but could violate NBA policy and lead to firings that would decimate the officiating staff. Twenty referees would make up about a third of the league's roster.

"This incident is an isolated incident and our folks are of the highest integrity and character and we're open to sitting down with the NBA to discuss measures that help make sure that the integrity of the game is maintained," said Lamell McMorris, head of the referees union.

"As far as I know, our folks are of the highest character. This situation has been isolated to one individual."

NBA spokesman Tim Frank said the league had no additional information and would not comment. Commissioner David Stern said last month that he believed that no other officials were being investigated for criminal activity, calling Donaghy a "rogue, isolated criminal."

Donaghy, who lives in Lakewood Ranch, pleaded guilty to two felony charges Wednesday and admitted betting on games he officiated. He also provided inside information to others and faces a maximum of 25 years in prison when he is sentenced Nov. 9 for conspiracy to engage in wire fraud and transmitting betting information through interstate commerce.

According to the antigambling rules given to referees, officials are not allowed to do any kind of betting, except for offseason trips to the race track. Officials are allowed to attend shows at a casino during the offseason, but may not be in the gaming area.

Referees who violate the policy could be fired.

Gambling experts: Donaghy likely needed the thrill

For NBA referees, the job isn't about winning or losing. And for Donaghy, experts say, neither was his gambling addiction.

The adrenalin rush that comes with placing a wager is what keeps bettors betting -- and problem gamblers losing. Donaghy, with his high-profile, $260,000-a-year job and beautiful Lakewood Ranch home, didn't need the money.

He needed the excitement.

"It's not about the money so much as the action," said Arnie Wexler, a recovering compulsive gambler who operates a hot line for people with the same addiction. "It makes you feel like a big shot by being in the action. ... The need for action drives you."

Donaghy acknowledged the "unique access" provided by his job -- including which crews would officiate certain games, the relationships between certain officials and players, and the physical condition of certain players.

While court papers say Donaghy himself bet on the NBA for four years, including games he officiated, compulsive gambling experts said taking payoffs for picks makes perfect sense. There is a thrill that comes with every bet, whether it involves a neighborhood bookie or a lucrative tip slipped to a high-roller, they said.

Court documents provided a glimpse of his scheme.

In one exchange with his coconspirators, court papers stated, Donaghy provided a tip about an NBA game on Dec. 13, 2006. He officiated a Boston Celtics-76ers game in Philadelphia that same day.

The next day, Donaghy met with the conspirators to receive a cash payment for passing along useful information about the 76ers-Celtics game, said a person close to the investigation, speaking on condition of anonymity because the case is ongoing.

The point spread moved two points before tip-off -- a sizable swing -- with Boston going from a 1.5-point favorite to a 3.5-point choice. Boston won by 20.

Speaking in code during telephone calls, Donaghy made gambling recommendations to the coconspirators. If he was correct, they paid him $5,000 in cash. If he was wrong, he received nothing.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Aslanna »

$260,000 for blowing a whistle 6-7 months a year. Seems high!
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Pherr the Dorf »

If I was a Kings fan... I'd be fucking pissed
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Trek »

Pherr the Dorf wrote:If I was a Kings fan... I'd be fucking pissed
Why? I am thinking that most of that sport seems to be pretty fucked. I cant say for sure that I believe teams that are even in the playoffs should be there, there must be some shit going on in the regular season to shouldnt there be? I make a LOT more money betting the season over what I make postseason.
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Pherr the Dorf
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Pherr the Dorf »

Umm because the refs were TOLD to make that series go to 7 games... I remember watching that game 6 and wondering wtf was going on with the calls... now we know.

The Black Sox got nothin on a league that tells it's refs to cheat.
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Re: Game Fixing?

Post by Trek »

I thought they mentioned bad calls in game 5 or something as well, I dont know if that becomes relevant since I dont follow bball
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