A different perspective on the war.

Adex_Xeda · Post by **Adex_Xeda** » March 24, 2003, 3:55 am

The author of this article asks the question, Haven't we played right into Osama's hands?

It's worth some thought.

http://www.paknews.com/specialNews.php? ... 2003-03-20

kyoukan · Post by **kyoukan** » March 24, 2003, 6:28 am

Well bin Laden's goal is to get basically all of Islam involved in a holy war with the united states. So while the actions of your government are pretty much doing exactly what he wants, I don't think that bin Laden has been somehow manipulating world events into this course of action.

I don't think his terrorist attacks have been carried out in order to get the the US to strike back at muslims in general, but that seems to be the way it's working out. Basically bin Laden could not ask for a better president than Bush jr. because he is a violent thug that uses military to assert influence on other nations (as long as he doesn't have to do any of the fighting himself).

So in a way I think that the american government is reacting exactly the way that will further bin Laden's cause against the united states, but I honestly don't think he is in touch with reality enough to actually mastermind all this. And I don't think even Nostradamus would have predicted that 9/11 would have turned into an all out assault on Iraq with absolutely no evidence connecting the two together other than the dominant religion in the region.

Millie · Post by **Millie** » March 24, 2003, 11:29 am

Kyo summed it up pretty well. There IS no connection between Bin Laden and Hussein. The two men hate each other. One is a religious zealot, and the other (Hussein) has been a very secular man throughout his life. As far as I know, Saddam wasn't even a practicing Muslim until the U.S. invaded his country, and he needed a spiritual platform upon which to garner support.

Trying to link Hussein and Bin Laden is a pretty laughable notion. It's like saying that Furor and Xanupox are best friends, simply because they once played on the same EQ server at the same time. The logic just isn't there.

As far as Bin Laden achieving his goals: that's 90% Bush's fault. Bush played right into Bin Laden's hands, and I'm glad at least a few of us saw it coming. It's almost as if Bush is *trying* to instigate a holy war between Muslims and the U.S.

miir · Post by **miir** » March 24, 2003, 11:30 am

Recent events would have been fairly easy to predict judging from US foreign policy over the last 20 years and the attitude of George W Bush.

Of course other groups and countries are following Al Qaedas lead.
Bush has been consistent in his reaction to anything that he views as 'threat' to the USA....

Millie · Post by **Millie** » March 24, 2003, 11:34 am

One thing everyone seems to be forgetting in the wake of the Iraq invasion is the conflict Bush instigated in Afghanistan last year. Did that little war really accomplish anything, other than satisfying the revenge hard-ons of the hawks in our government?

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » March 24, 2003, 11:55 am

Sorry, not plausible.

Islam isn't the enemy, period. If you think it is, you obviously haven't seen a breakdown on the top religions in the US recently.

Osama keeled the stock market!

Osama eess leading the world by the nose!!

Please.

miir · Post by **miir** » March 24, 2003, 12:03 pm

Islam isn't the enemy, period. If you think it is, you obviously haven't seen a breakdown on the top religions in the US recently.

I think you are completely missing the point.
It has nothing to do with the opinions of americans.

If the USA continues to 'murder' muslims (justified or otherwise) they will foster greater comtempt in the nation of Islam for everything associated with the west.

It used to be only the radical muslims who were willing to martyr themselves against the 'american infidels'.

With Bush attacking Afghanistan and Iraq and inflicting thousands of innocent muslim casualties, he is directly creating anti-american sentiment in the middle east.
The murder of innocents is creating an entire generation of american hating muslims eager to achieve martyrdom.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » March 24, 2003, 12:04 pm

miir wrote:
Islam isn't the enemy, period. If you think it is, you obviously haven't seen a breakdown on the top religions in the US recently.
I think you are completely missing the point.
It has nothing to do with the opinions of americans.

If the USA continues to 'murder' muslims (justified or otherwise) they will foster greater comtempt in the nation of Islam for everything associated with the west.

It used to be only the radical muslims who were willing to martyr themselves against the 'american infidels'.

With Bush attacking Afghanistan and Iraq and inflicting thousands of innocent muslim casualties, he is directly creating anti-american sentiment in the middle east.
The murder of innocents is creating an entire generation of american hating muslims eager to achieve martyrdom.

Hmmm I wonder how they feel about the thousands of innocent american lives taken by muslims.

Trek · Post by **Trek** » March 24, 2003, 12:11 pm

Who cares, we are evil and must rule the world, not matter the situation, this is how it will be viewed by some

miir · Post by **miir** » March 24, 2003, 12:15 pm

Hmmm I wonder how they feel about the thousands of innocent american lives taken by muslims

In the eyes of radical muslims, infidels are not innocent.

I suspect that repairing relations with the less radical muslim factions would be more productive than going to war with them and creating a generation of full fledged american hating muslim-martyrs.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » March 24, 2003, 12:23 pm

miir wrote:
Hmmm I wonder how they feel about the thousands of innocent american lives taken by muslims
In the eyes of radical muslims, infidels are not innocent.

I suspect that repairing relations with the less radical muslim factions would be more productive than going to war with them and creating a generation of full fledged american hating muslim-martyrs.

The Radical Muslims would never let that happen you know it and so does the rest of the world, These people thrive on conflict that is how they gain and keep power.

Xyun · Post by **Xyun** » March 24, 2003, 12:30 pm

These people thrive on conflict that is how they gain and keep power.

All aboard the buffoon balloon.

Fallanthas · Post by **Fallanthas** » March 24, 2003, 12:30 pm

I think you are completely missing the point.
It has nothing to do with the opinions of americans.

If the USA continues to 'murder' muslims (justified or otherwise) they will foster greater comtempt in the nation of Islam for everything associated with the west.

The point I was making is that the fact that they are muslims means nothing. Nor would it matter if those providing the destabilizing influence were Catholics, Protestants or Jews.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » March 24, 2003, 12:31 pm

Xyun wrote:
These people thrive on conflict that is how they gain and keep power.
All aboard the buffoon balloon.

And your the Pilot CockGobbler

Lets search the web and find on act these so called radical muslims have done to better Humanity.

miir · Post by **miir** » March 24, 2003, 12:31 pm

Cartalas wrote: The Radical Muslims would never let that happen you know it and so does the rest of the world, These people thrive on conflict that is how they gain and keep power.

Iraq is not run by radical muslims. Even nations like Kuwait who have many hard line muslims in higher up positions have been able to maintian a working relationship with the US government.

Cart, cmon man... do a little bit of research into the middle east and Islam before you spew stuff like this... you're looking a bit silly.

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » March 24, 2003, 12:35 pm

miir wrote:
Cartalas wrote: The Radical Muslims would never let that happen you know it and so does the rest of the world, These people thrive on conflict that is how they gain and keep power.
Iraq is not run by radical muslims. Even nations like Kuwait who have many hard line muslims in higher up positions have been able to maintian a working relationship with the US government.

Cart, cmon man... do a little bit of research into the middle east and Islam before you spew stuff like this... you're looking a bit silly.

And in every Govt. that we have a working relation with there is some spin off faction bombing a Embassy,shooting a reporter, Kidnapping Westerners.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » March 24, 2003, 12:36 pm

And in every Govt. that we have a working relation with there is some spin off faction bombing a Embassy,shooting a reporter, Kidnapping Westerners.

Hum USA bombed the Chinese embassy, shot a reporter and quite a few of the prisoners held from Cuba are westerners...

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » March 24, 2003, 12:38 pm

Kelshara wrote:
And in every Govt. that we have a working relation with there is some spin off faction bombing a Embassy,shooting a reporter, Kidnapping Westerners.
Hum USA bombed the Chinese embassy, shot a reporter and quite a few of the prisoners held from Cuba are westerners...

I guess you need to explain yourself here!

As far as the Embassy it was a accident, when did the U.S shoot a reporter on purpose?

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » March 24, 2003, 1:18 pm

Yeah accident due to CIA having outdated maps. Journalist was shot in Iraq the other day.