VeeshanVault

And here's what will turn the iPad into a fanboi device:
http://www.infoworld.com/d/mobilize/sev ... ablets-506
Prices will plummet quickly.

Why would the prices plummet? Pricing on several of those units were the same or much higher.

Not sure why you think simply having Window 7 in tablet form will kill the iPad.

As much as I hate Apple, iOS >>>>>>>> Windows 7 for maturity/usability in portable computing. Even in those screenshots, it looks messy. I wouldn't give OSX the time of day when it comes to desktops over Windows 7 but it's a whole other story when it comes to portable computing. I played round with touchscheen Windows 7 PCs. No thanks. At least not for the next few years until (if) Microsoft gets its head out of its as when it comes to mobile solutions.

Same reason MS based stuff out sells Apple everyplace else, Zune being an exception. I won't say it's better. I will say it's cheap and everyone uses it.

Apple has gone out of it's way to maintain itself as a boutique brand as they'd be gone otherwise.

I'd expect the basic Atom powered ones similar to #1 to drop down under $350 in less than a year. In theory it's cheaper to make than a netbook and they're turning a profit on those at sub $200 prices.

The models with more processor, etc.. will be a little more, but #2, the Asus for instance won't be $1k.

Where does the iPad proccesor fall for power in the great scheme of things?

*Edit - perfectly happy with Win7 Home Prem. on my netbook. Runs nice, plays movies and music fine 250Gb HD and has ~12 hours battery life. Not as good as a reader as I'd hoped, I'll buy a *Pad of some sort or a kindle-type device at some point.

Winnow wrote:As much as I hate Apple

You're the worst kind of fanboy.

If the build/screen quality is as good as the iPad/iPhone I may give it a peek. Win7 is a pretty good OS, at least for a regular PC/laptop.

I'd like to see a Windows Phone 7 tablet

miir wrote:I'd like to see a Windows Phone 7 tablet

That would be Windows 8 from what I've seen...

They should go a different direction...


Windows MeTablet!

Microsoft is making the same mistakes with Windows on Tablets that they were making with Windows Mobile 5, 6, 6.1 and 6.5.
Trying to make an old experience better or by adding layers on the old product in order to make it more touch friendly.

The old experiences peek through to the touch friendly stuff way too often and drag it down to the level of unpleasant.

Microsoft really needs to take the WP OS and make wifi-only devices a la iPod Touch and base their tablets on it. Focus on it will be encouraging to the devs and they may be more tempted to develop for it.

Aabidano wrote:And here's what will turn the iPad into a fanboi device:
http://www.infoworld.com/d/mobilize/sev ... ablets-506
Prices will plummet quickly.

That quote is from about a year ago...still nothing...and now this:

According to information gleaned from Apple's overseas supply chain, a prototype of the iPad 3 already exists. But Apple is anything but in a hurry to ready the third-generation tablet into production for a market release. In fact, it sounds like Apple is going to take its sweet old time getting the iPad 3 ready - a move that will give Apple fanatics plenty of time to savor the iPhone 5 and any additional goodies Cupertino has in store before the end of 2011.

In a research note shared with investors Friday, J.P. Morgan analyst Mark Moskowitz says the iPad 3 likely won't be introduced until well into 2012. "In our view, Apple should be in no rush," he said. "The other tablet entrants have stumbled so far, and that trend-line could persist deep into 2012."

According to Moskowitz, the primary reason why Apple will sit on the iPad 3 for the time being is because there is virtually no competing tablet in the current marketplace that makes Apple nervous. With their touchscreen tablet dominating nearly three-quarters of the global tablet market share, the iPad 3 will all but certainly remain in Apple's tech holster until the need to draw fire against a new competitor next year becomes apparent.

Moskowitz, however, doesn't see any credible threats for the immediate future. In fact, he suggests that the next major tablet push - probably from Sony - could prove an epic failure based on his own impression of Sony's demonstrated device. "To us, Sony's tablet lacks the refined, sleek feel of the iPad and its bezel-like back is not user-friendly," he wrote. "Lastly, the Sony tablet runs on the Android O/S, which has failed to garner as much interest in tablets as it has in smartphones."

I wish everyone but Apple didn't suck in the tablet market so it would force Apple to release new tech instead of sitting on it. The rest of the world's incompetence is hurting all of us. Android is useless. Windows 8 does look promising for tablets though. I'm guessing a second half decent Windows 8 tablet in 2012 will stop Apple from counting it's money long enough to drop the next iPad 3 which will make everything else look crusty again. Apple's got bazillions and time to make the best product even better while other companies scramble to figure out something that will at least give users an viable alternative. I'm hooked on tablets. Be it Apple's or another company, I'll keep using tablets from here on out. The problem is Apple could release kick ass tablets every 6 months but now it looks like it could go beyond a year before a new iPad is out due to the extremely weak offerings out there. Hell, I want a Windows 8 tablet if it's bigger than the iPad. I wouldn't mind using a 15" tablet if it was well put together.

Was expecting a much more active market, current non-Apple offerings still cost too much for something most folks don't know what they'd use for.

Fighting Apple on their ground isn't going to work as HP found out.

I use mine a lot more than I expected to, it's almost replaced my netbook for workday surfing & music. Better reader than my phone too

Wife wants one, not sure she'd use it for anything, will snag another touchpad if I can later.

The Indian prototype is impressive--especially at a $35 price point. The device runs on a variation of Linux. It has no internal storage, but it is capable of storing data on a memory card. It has a built in word processor, video conferencing capabilities, and--most importantly for a cloud-based workforce--a Web browser. Oh--it can also run on solar power

Sounds like it could almost replace my touchpad, wonder if the CPU is robust enough to show mp4s.

http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/a ... uting.html

Aabidano wrote:

The Indian prototype is impressive--especially at a $35 price point. The device runs on a variation of Linux. It has no internal storage, but it is capable of storing data on a memory card. It has a built in word processor, video conferencing capabilities, and--most importantly for a cloud-based workforce--a Web browser. Oh--it can also run on solar power

Sounds like it could almost replace my touchpad, wonder if the CPU is robust enough to show mp4s.

http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/a ... uting.html

Oh god, do you not recall the JooJoo Tablet piece of shit?

http://www.pcworld.com/article/193707/j ... oints.html

This is more like what I expected 6 months ago, and the niche the touchpad should have aimed at. The Indian one still seems like it should have a chance, all depending. Not aimed at the same usage at all.

The Amazon Fire is, in a sense, an iPod Touch. It is hitting the market right when such a stop-gap product is needed. The iPad is clearly a “better” device with better hardware and more functions, but the Fire is $300 less and still rather capable. Likewise, the Fire might not be the best Android tablet, but Amazon has clearly compensated for the lackluster hardware with a fresh interface. Consumers have shown a resistence to non-iPad tablets, but the $500 price point is out of reach for many consumers. A $200 tablet, loaded with Amazon’s media offerings, is the right product to kick start tablets from niche to mainstream

http://techcrunch.com/2011/09/28/i-want ... hCrunch%29

While the Fire is nice, holy fuck, the basic Kindle is down to $80 bucks.

A ten inch Kindle Fire might be interesting but 7" is too small for reading magazines. 10" iPad is just big enough to be able to read a page.



It also seems too skinny for a normal magazine page to display properly.

I freaking love my iPads. I use them both daily. You don't need a stand. Just prop them up against a pillow, lock the screen in portrait for movies/TV shows. and you have a great viewing experience as you lie sideways. You also don't need display protectors. iPhone and iPad screens don't scratch. I haven't used them in years and my screens are perfect. I think the Amazon offerings are using gorilla glass so they'll be scratch proof for the most part as well.

I think Amazon's Kindle Fire's will place a solid #2 behind Apple. I'm sure they'll sell plenty of them. Good price. I'll always go for the more powerful device though. I like speed combined with a long lasting battery. In this economy, many people will settle for the less expensive device. I can see the value in the kindle but if you have the money, don't see why you'd choose it over the iPad except for book reading/portability of the 7" size. Hoping Amazon is able to push Apple to speed up their iPad release timeline. I just can't see the 7" being useful for magazine, comic, etc reading. From what I read, it looks like they'll be releasing a 10" model fairly soon after the 7".

No matter what the future holds, I'm completely hooked on tablets. They are the favorite devices I own. I've never been much of a laptop user but I think tablets will squash most of the lightweight notebooks, etc out there, leaving just the desktop replacement type Laptops. PSVita could move in on some of this action as well with it's nice screen and power.

The integration with their store and prime streaming combined with the cheapness are gonna motivate me to shell out for one. I am gonna read so many books this winter.

Winnow wrote:I think Amazon's Kindle Fire's will place a solid #2 behind Apple.

Looking at them a bit more the screen is kind of small for non-reader use but for someone competing in this ring this is how you put your foot in the door.

Well, not to add momentum to something that's doesn't have an "i" in front of it, but rumors are that Amazon might buy Netflix at some point. Netflix separating their physical DVD/Blu Ray (Qwikflix) business would allow Amazon to buy Netflix streaming which is what they want as it would avoid the taxes that must be paid due to all the distribution centers Netflix (had) for their physical media. Amazon has the coin to buy Stars contracts, etc that Netflix doesn't. This would be great for everyone. Amazon would create serious competition for Apple and most likely would still sell their streaming service to iPad users in the form of an App. We'd all get a streaming service that might actually have some great content.

Interesting chart!

That's amazon physical book sales vs kindle paid book sales. Bye bye printed media.

I give it a few months before there's a Kindle Fire DX which will fulfill the larger form factor.

Winnow wrote:That's amazon physical book sales vs kindle paid book sales. Bye bye printed media.

I dispute that, sort of. I do see mass market print media going the way of the dodo, but I think there will always be a market for higher quality hardcover editions of classics.

I bet college publishers are going to resist this the longest. Can't fuck students with 10% for 10% buyback on ebooks.

masteen wrote: I bet college publishers are going to resist this the longest. Can't fuck students with 10% for 10% buyback on ebooks.

Some high schools are already going with iPads instead of text books, very few and from rich neighborhoods I'm sure, but the trend is happening. Online Universities issue everything out in pdf format. I covered the story about iPads in the cockpit, replacing 18 pounds of printed manuals.

I posted about the pdf magazines on the book forum. It's an outstanding way to browse though a magazine (still think 10" is smallest size for a full size page without need to scroll or squint) The smaller market of comic books also rocks on iPad type devices. I "listen" to most of my books these days. Mostly non fiction for me. I haven't checked the statistics but I'm betting the audiobook format is increasing it's percentage of readers as well.

I'm far from anti physical media. I sold my comics but still have boxes of novels somewhere. Print won't die completely but it will decline faster than most expect. My parents still get the newspaper delivered to them!

The future of textbooks:

http://vimeo.com/14448256

I see this happening sooner rather than later. My kids watch the Disney channel and on there they have show called A.N.T. Farm. The show is about young genius type kids in a high school setting. Each of those kids have some form of tablet to do their school work on. Now my kids are already asking to get one. Imagine all the households who have kids who watch this one show. Disney is helping set the stage for this to become common place.

My question is, for what my family would use a tablet for (internet and maybe movies) would it be worth getting a Kindle Fire or should I just wait for the Touchpad prices on Ebay to drop?

Depends on if your kids' schoolbooks are epubs or not.

Unless you can get a new in the box touchpad "soon" I'm not so sure I'd touch one. Clock is ticking on the battery as soon as it's assembled. Wouldn't buy used except from someone I knew.

Strictly for schoolwork something as limited as that $35 device might be better than something more full featured as it teaches the kids that it's a tool to achieve a goal as opposed to an entertainment device that can be used for work.

Look at all the stupid you see going on with school issued laptop, I'm sure it's just the tip of the iceberg.

I use mine all the time in place of a PC, and instead of my phone as a reader. In the middle of The Man Who Would be King now, free on Amazon.

one of my nephews was issued a netbook in kindergarten.... I remember our Big Chief Indian notebooks with the 1" lines at that age!

Winnow wrote:

Interesting chart!

That's amazon physical book sales vs kindle paid book sales. Bye bye printed media.

Yes, it's very interesting. While I hate graphs w/out a vertical axis because they can be exmerely misleading, I see increase sales of all books, printed and digital. Not so sure printed media will go away so soon. I can see digital books replacing paperbacks because they were always a cost effective solution in the past just as digital books are, but not hard cover books, not for awhile anyway.

Bubba Grizz wrote:I see this happening sooner rather than later. My kids watch the Disney channel and on there they have show called A.N.T. Farm. The show is about young genius type kids in a high school setting. Each of those kids have some form of tablet to do their school work on. Now my kids are already asking to get one. Imagine all the households who have kids who watch this one show. Disney is helping set the stage for this to become common place.

My question is, for what my family would use a tablet for (internet and maybe movies) would it be worth getting a Kindle Fire or should I just wait for the Touchpad prices on Ebay to drop?

Don't skimp on your tablet. Get an iPad, even the cheapest one will do the trick unless you store a ton of videos and music on it (you can just stream that stuff)

Apple has always been big in schools (old timers will remember Apple IIs in their schools). iPad is what will have all the educational apps and it's far and away the #1 tablet which will always get the attention of any app developer. Buying your kid something other than an iPad would be like sending them to school decked out in K-Mart clothes. (ok, bad example if you already do that!). It would be like sending them to school in a Bears jersey when everyone else is wearing Packers.

So you're basically gonna faggot up practically every thread in this forum with your Apple/Ipad/iphone fanboy splooge?

Ooookay, one less forum to bother with.




Mark topics read

That is a good point and generally will mean an iSomething unless the school district goes in an unexpected direction. Unless you're getting them for general purpose use it's probably best to hold off and find out what they'll mandate.

My boss has all his sons on netbooks running Ubuntu.

Local schools are 100% MS, Office 2007 was mandatory for the wifes last round of classes and similar in the HS. Wouldn't expect iAnything but you never know.

Still think going the practical & utilitarian route is more productive long term. Kids don't need yet another flashy distraction. Goes against the American more is better mentality though.

miir wrote:So you're basically gonna faggot up practically every thread in this forum with your Apple/Ipad/iphone fanboy splooge?

Ooookay, one less forum to bother with.




Mark topics read

Don't have any kids! They'll have crab hands from using bad controllers and be disadvantaged in school due to poor educational instrument choices!

Aabidano wrote: Still think going the practical & utilitarian route is more productive long term. Kids don't need yet another flashy distraction. Goes against the American more is better mentality though.

It's possible to do both. Back when schools were using Apple II's, I was hacking way on my C-64. I was writing programs, setup my own BBS, was phreaking with sprint, metro and mci codes, hex editing games to insert my BBS # in them all when I was 14 and before the internet. I still had to use Apple II's at school and back then we didn't take our PC/tablets to school like kids are starting to do.

That said, iPad is the way to go for a kid with education in mind. Buy them that 99 special HP thing on the side if you think they can hack it and make something of it. The 10" Kindle Fire that will most likely be released in the next few months would be something to consider as well since it's the first Android based tablet that looks to have some solid backing behind it.

Things can change but but so will the technology so there's no need to look to the future because you'll be buying something different and 4 times as powerful by then. If you want something that's best now, it's the iPad considering hardware, software, and market dominance.

Winnow wrote:Things can change but but so will the technology so there's no need to look to the future because you'll be buying something different and 4 times as powerful by then. If you want something that's best now, it's the iPad considering hardware, software, and market dominance.

The way I'm looking at it, it depends if you're wanting to create creators\engineers of technology or consumers of it.

There are obvious exceptions but if you want to make a shallow consumer with a gui go apple, want to make a person who has the creativity of thought to make the device give them a linux box with a compiler.

The difference between our new employees trained in former soviet states and those from the US is very noticeable. No slight against the US kids, had a couple really sharp interns this summer. Lack of foo foo technology is not always a detriment and frequently an advantage as they have to learn how to work around the limitation of their environment.

Aabidano wrote:

Winnow wrote:Things can change but but so will the technology so there's no need to look to the future because you'll be buying something different and 4 times as powerful by then. If you want something that's best now, it's the iPad considering hardware, software, and market dominance.

The way I'm looking at it, it depends if you're wanting to create creators\engineers of technology or consumers of it.

There are obvious exceptions but if you want to make a shallow consumer with a gui go apple, want to make a person who has the creativity of thought to make the device give them a linux box with a compiler.

The difference between our new employees trained in former soviet states and those from the US is very noticeable. No slight against the US kids, had a couple really sharp interns this summer. Lack of foo foo technology is not always a detriment and frequently an advantage as they have to learn how to work around the limitation of their environment.

I don't think Bubba's talking about programming here unless I'm wrong. It's a learning device to access educational media.

What you're getting at would PC application development. For iOS, that would be Xcode and would be done on a PC/Mac. That really has nothing to do with the actual tablets and accessing media with them.

Do you want them to spend their time trying to customize the device to get it to work as they want or you want a device that lets them focus on learning without hassle? A complex device doesn't make it a better learning tool if it's purpose is to deliver the applications. I'd rather give them maximum time to focus on their studies without the device itself causing hiccups unrelated to their projects.

For younger kids I suspect it's going to be used for spelling, math, homework and textbooks. Done properly nothing is gained by a $500 device over a $35 device. The solar powered part is nice, even in classrooms as you don't have to screw with kids who forgot to charge.

Aabidano wrote:For younger kids I suspect it's going to be used for spelling, math, homework and textbooks. Done properly nothing is gained by a $500 device over a $35 device. The solar powered part is nice, even in classrooms as you don't have to screw with kids who forgot to charge.

If it's simply pdf files you're probably right.

As for leaving home without the battery charged...that's just plain bad parenting!