VeeshanVault

I hated the fact that he was such a great and classy guy, much like I hate Jeter.... the AL east just got easier

They lowered his pay so they wouldn't have to be the bad guys and fire him.

Spang wrote:They lowered his pay so they wouldn't have to be the bad guys and fire him.

Dude's got plenty of cash. He could coach for free if he really wanted to.

Actually, as a Yankees fan, I see it the opposite Spang. They forced his hand and I don't blame him at all for leaving. How about taking the effort they spend on harrassing Torre and finding more hitters, and use that to develop more pitching. Joba is nice, it shows the Yankees they don't have to always trade away youth for hits. I hope they follow that pattern.

Tyek wrote:Actually, as a Yankees fan, I see it the opposite Spang. They forced his hand and I don't blame him at all for leaving. How about taking the effort they spend on harrassing Torre and finding more hitters, and use that to develop more pitching. Joba is nice, it shows the Yankees they don't have to always trade away youth for hits. I hope they follow that pattern.

Isn't that basically what Spang was saying? Was there another post which you disagreed with that I am not seeing? The cut in pay/incentive deal I can understand. Telling him that he would basically be on a year-to-year contract was insulting.

I love Torre, but I'm looking forward to a new era.

12 years as a coach, 12 years in the post season... yah he probably is to blame about problems, he takes the pieces and gets them to the post season 100% of the time. Cashman should have been launched, instead you are stuck with an unknown instead of a track record... smart move!

His salary this year was non incentive based, he made 7.5 Mill, he had a chance if they won the series to make 8 mill.

Rumor has it, Larussa will take over.

To qualify, I say this as a BoSox fan:

Torre is one of the greatest managers ever. I also think he's a stand-up, classy guy. He has stood by his players (the good and the bad) through their mishaps and triumphs. He commands a lot of respect from me (along with Jeter), which is something i cannot say about most of the Yankees organization.

What they did to him to call him out like that was pure shit. I guess it's too much to expect them to show a little respect and decency to someone who is directly responsible for their success. The offer they made him was also a slap in the face imo. I applaud him on his actions from the call out through the offer, and I think his waiting to hear them out, and walking, was more powerful than just washing his hands of it after the series was over.

I wish him the best of luck with his next team.

Isn't that basically what Spang was saying? Was there another post which you disagreed with that I am not seeing? The cut in pay/incentive deal I can understand. Telling him that he would basically be on a year-to-year contract was insulting.

Maybe I misunderstood. I am back on pain meds, so I am a little slower then normal and that is slow enough. I thought he was saying that Yankee fans would think Torre bailed on the team, rather then seeing it for what it was, them screwing Torre. I know we are not always the smartest fans, but I think most see their strategy.

Truant wrote:To qualify, I say this as a BoSox fan:

Torre is one of the greatest managers ever.

Huh? This is typical thinking about an absolute average manager at best that is handed the best players in baseball every year and people slob his knob saying he is one of the greatest ever? I don't buy it at all. Yea, Torre won 4 rings with the highest payrolls in baseball every year and being able to buy any player they want every year.

However, Torre has been a coach of more than just the Yankees as well. His oevrall record over 15 years outside of the Yankees is an impressive 894-1003. Yup.....he was 109 games UNDER .500. He also had some talent on those clubs....so why in 15 years did he have exactly ONE division winner and ZERO playoff wins? Is it mere coincidence that his winnign came when he went to the Yankees and the bottomless pit of spending? Is it because he went to the AL where you never have to bother actually managing a game and there is no pinch hitting for pitchers or other little factors that actually make coaching a game challenging?

Yea...I am going to go ahead and call bullshit and say that just about anyone competent that was given those Yankees teams would have come away with multiple WS wins.

The Torre team that beat the Braves early in his time with the Yankees was far from the most talented. Torre was able to keep a team full of top notch players on the same page. People seem to think coaching the most talent is always the easiest thing, but that is just not true. The Lakers struggled before Phil came in, managed ego's and did his thing. It eventually imploded, but he got them to 3 rings.

The Yankees have the most talent, but sometimes it is harder getting those players to work together. I am sure it is easier to win with the Yankees payroll don't get me wrong, but maybe Torre's managing talents came from keeping those teams in check. He may not have been the best strategist, but to deny he was a good manager at NY is short-sighted.

Spang wrote:Rumor has it, Larussa will take over.

There's no way he'd go into that situation.

He'll be back at the helm of the Cardinals next year.

http://www.stltoday.com/blogs/sports-be ... -about-it/

Great article detailing why he won't be a Yankee.

I'll be the first to admit I was wrong if he does, but there are so many negative points that I just don't see it happening. He confirmed yesterday he should be managing the Cardinals next year.

Torre is well respected here in STL. He's a great manager, but I agree with him as the "pay cut" was definitely a slap in the face and it was meant to turn the Yankees away from being the bad guy.

Tyek wrote:The Torre team that beat the Braves early in his time with the Yankees was far from the most talented. Torre was able to keep a team full of top notch players on the same page. People seem to think coaching the most talent is always the easiest thing, but that is just not true. The Lakers struggled before Phil came in, managed ego's and did his thing. It eventually imploded, but he got them to 3 rings.

The Yankees have the most talent, but sometimes it is harder getting those players to work together. I am sure it is easier to win with the Yankees payroll don't get me wrong, but maybe Torre's managing talents came from keeping those teams in check. He may not have been the best strategist, but to deny he was a good manager at NY is short-sighted.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

It wasn't the salary cut that ticked him off, it was the incentive based rewards that did. He stated to mike & mad dog that it was the real thing that did it for him because it symbolized that the org didn't believe he knew how important the post season was.

Looks like he will be in LA, with A-rod to follow. Anything will be better then Little.

We don't want either of them.

noel wrote:We don't want either of them.

Why on earth would you not want Torre?

Either way you got him but jeez, I am glad the AL east got better, I hate that the NL west just got harder.

How bad are the Cubs? They got swept by the D'Backs, who got swept by the Rockies, who got swept by the Boston.

Pherr the Dorf wrote:

noel wrote:We don't want either of them.

Why on earth would you not want Torre?

Either way you got him but jeez, I am glad the AL east got better, I hate that the NL west just got harder.

It's pretty simple really. The Dodgers aren't going to spend what the Yankees were willing to spend and in my mind Torre is more suited as a veteran coach/manager of egos (ala Phil Jackson) than a coach for a bunch of young players. Given that the Dodgers last year imploded when the veterans and the young players started fighting, I don't think Torre is suited for the job. Also, see Kilmoll's post.

As far as A-Rod goes, it'll be a sad/horrible day if he's in an Angels or Dodgers uniform. You shouldn't have to mortgage your goddamn franchise for one player, ever. The closest he's gotten to the World Series was when he pre-empted it with his opting out the other night. Fuck him and fuck Boras.

As far as a-rod goes, he's more likely to end up with the giants, angels, or cubs before the dodgers. I do agree though, his money is ridiculous. However, in certain markets, he does make the club a ton of money in return. I get the feeling he'll be a Giant next year, but maybe another team will surprise me.

With regards Torre, you know your club much better than I but I think he could handle that situation. You may even end up w/ Mattingly as a bench coach to boot which isn't a bad thing.

I think you get where I'm coming from now, but it has little to do with Torre, and a LOT to do with the way the Dodgers operate. I just don't think they'll give him what he needs to be successful.

I doubt arod ends up as a gnat, I really do see them signing Hunter tho. I think he would be a good addition in SF and not cost a ton.

Far as arod goes, I think he will end up in Dodger blue, not a totally horrible thing IMO. In reality LA is the best place for arod to end up if you hate him because its pretty much the end of his career like all our big $$$$ FA's. Expect him to be on the DL within the first season.
Torre is a far better coach to have around then Little.....even tho he isnt much of a tactitian either.