Ok, so I've lost about 8 inches off my waist since May (I had / have a big waist though), Cholesterol is 100 (total, 61 HDL, 39 LDL, 133 Triclycerides), Blood sugar is normal now etc... After loosing the first bit I decided carbs was something I should have been watching all along and figured since I had momentum going now was the time, after an 11 year haiatus, to get back to serious lifting which I did back in July.
After 3 months or so things are coming along well. Yea I'm still a wuss right now but I'm finally back up to benching 225 and working out with 185 both flat and incline (not doing decline), back (using about 250 on Row, 200 lat pulldown) and legs (650 leg press) have always been very strong but I never worried about my shoulders that much. Thus I've added a lot of different shoulder exercies, the best one which I had totally forgotten about, is the Arnold Press, damn, can feel that one.
Anyway, all the guys I work out with know I'm trying to get a lot of mass back so I can cut hard and loose a bunch of weight in the spring. Everyone has recommened that I start taking Creatine. So I got a preworkout powder / boost that is suppose to be the latest and greatest. However when I was speaking with my Dr. he said the Creatine was good but watch out for it, don't use too much. As I'm only taking it on the days I lift (3 days a week, cardio 2 days) he thought that should be just fine.
So my question, any of you guys using Creatine? If so how much and how often? What have been your results? I feel a little more pumped when taking it but haven't noticed much. When I was serious before, there wasn't Creatine so I just don't know a lot about it.
Secondly, anyone got any shoulder tips for big shoulders? Not really traps because mine are already big, just doing upright rows have started them growing again and I don't want to be a no neck lookin' guy unless I can get big enough with little body fat. Anyway, here is what I'm currently doing, would love to hear some other ideas.
1. Lateral Extension Front - 2 sets
2. Lateral Extension Side - 3 sets
3. Arnold Press - 3 sets
4. Upright Row - 4 sets (Done on Bicep / Back day - all others on Chest / Tri Day)
5. Mil Press Standing - 4 sets
6. Mil Press Sitting / Smith - 2 sets
7. Lateral Cable Extensions Side - 2 sets
Thanks!
Marb
PS - One more thing, any tips for forearms? I do a couple sets of curls overhand, and have a weight tied to a pole I roll up and down, then do some wrist curls... anything else, do those little squeeze things you see people using back in the 50s really do anything?
Creatine Question and also Shoulders
Moderator: The Kwon
First, I just want to say good for you. 
It sounds like you've already done a hell of a lot as far as getting yourself back into healthy shape, and I just wanted to give you a little pat on the back for positive reinforcement!
Second, I know shit about creatine, but we've had several threads (quite a while back in various forums, I did a search and grabbed some links for you.
http://www.veeshanvault.org/forums/view ... t=creatine
this was the first I can recall, it dealt specifically with lifting.
http://www.veeshanvault.org/forums/view ... t=creatine
this one was sort of a followup to the first one. Noel did a bit more research and provided it as a seperate thread.
That's about it. I know Kwon endorses it, and Noel doesn't. So you may want to talk to each of them specifically.
Keep it up sir!
It sounds like you've already done a hell of a lot as far as getting yourself back into healthy shape, and I just wanted to give you a little pat on the back for positive reinforcement!Second, I know shit about creatine, but we've had several threads (quite a while back in various forums, I did a search and grabbed some links for you.
http://www.veeshanvault.org/forums/view ... t=creatine
this was the first I can recall, it dealt specifically with lifting.
http://www.veeshanvault.org/forums/view ... t=creatine
this one was sort of a followup to the first one. Noel did a bit more research and provided it as a seperate thread.
That's about it. I know Kwon endorses it, and Noel doesn't. So you may want to talk to each of them specifically.
Keep it up sir!
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Kwonryu DragonFist
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The waist was never a problem for Tony P.
3 cans of tuna and water per day for a few weeks before a show.
For shoulders, i do
Standing Militarypresses
Sitting Militarypresses
Behind the neck presses
Front raises
Lateral raise
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Creatine Marbus!
Creatine works well for me, it does not work as well for every person, but i use it for 2-3 weeks every now and then.
My body responds well to creatine, Noel does not like it though, but we have different goals with our physiques.
Noel is staying ripped 24/7 365 days a year while i try to build more mass during the autumn/winter and then start with definition during spring.
3 cans of tuna and water per day for a few weeks before a show.
For shoulders, i do
Standing Militarypresses
Sitting Militarypresses
Behind the neck presses
Front raises
Lateral raise
-
Creatine Marbus!
Creatine works well for me, it does not work as well for every person, but i use it for 2-3 weeks every now and then.
My body responds well to creatine, Noel does not like it though, but we have different goals with our physiques.
Noel is staying ripped 24/7 365 days a year while i try to build more mass during the autumn/winter and then start with definition during spring.
Last edited by Kwonryu DragonFist on October 13, 2006, 6:42 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Kwonryu DragonFist
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Kwonryu DragonFist
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Re: Creatine Question and also Shoulders
Marbus forearmsMarbus wrote: PS - One more thing, any tips for forearms? I do a couple sets of curls overhand, and have a weight tied to a pole I roll up and down, then do some wrist curls... anything else, do those little squeeze things you see people using back in the 50s really do anything?
Clickage
Basically, depends on the person, some people dont have to train forearms at all, they [the forearms]get a good stress with the other exercises.
Doing heavy lifts generally will stress your forearms as well, and depending on your body, you may/may not need to have forearm-training in your regimen.
You actually just need three exercises total for a full-body workout.
If you lift heavy and max out at 8 reps or even such a high weight that you can not do more than 6, your musclegroups will be affected.
Heavy Squats
Heavy incline Bench
Heavy Deadlift
These 3 simple exercises are enough to get a balanced physique actually.
So, by doing heavy exercises in general, you may not need to dedicate workouts for your forearms.
Thanks guys!
I'm not really worried about my legs, after being very active at over 430 lbs for the last 8 years they are considerably strong (didn't realize I was that big...guess I didn't want to know). Once I get down some more, currently about 369) I may add some squats but as the weight comes off I'm not wanting to look like Tom Plats, if I'm going to bust my arse doing this again I want to concentrait on symetry, which is why I'm trying to build my shoulders up. When I use to do and teach aerobics I did it with 10lbs weights in my hands so my shoulders were/are strong, just not big.
In regards to the forearms I do those 2 exercises, and also the twising up a weight on a rope but not every time (do those on back / bi day). My main reason for concern is my lats. My grip gives out way before my back and biceps do. To compensate I use to use straps but that's probably why it's out of balance now. Anyway I'll also read though those old posts. The stuff I'm taking though is the Creatine Ethyl Ester, not the old monohydrate stuff.
Heh, even though I'm still a big guy, and part of my chest size now is definitely fat, it's encourging to see that my chest is about even wtih my belly and flater when I wake up... sure the wife is happy about that as well, heh. It's nice to not have that huge belly in my way. When we got married I had just gone through a mass cycle and was about 270, I know from what I've lifting I've lost some of that but it seems to be coming back fast, perhaps because I had it before, much faster for sure, even with dieting and no supplements until recently, than the guys I know who have never lifted. Thanks for the encouragement too, I have a long way to go but I didn't gain it all back over night nor did I loose it all the first time overnight, took about a year and a half to 2 year... sure it will be the same. With 2 boys (2 and 4) and another on the way I want to start coaching little league football etc... trying to get in shape again so that when the other kids say, YOUR DAD IS HUGE!, it's a good thing, not a bad one
Once down to about 250 I plan on starting a martial arts class but I'm not sure which one to pursue as a newbie... any thoughts on that? Pretty open except for Taekwondo and would eventually like to take Jujitsu but I think I have to take another first don't I?
Marb
I'm not really worried about my legs, after being very active at over 430 lbs for the last 8 years they are considerably strong (didn't realize I was that big...guess I didn't want to know). Once I get down some more, currently about 369) I may add some squats but as the weight comes off I'm not wanting to look like Tom Plats, if I'm going to bust my arse doing this again I want to concentrait on symetry, which is why I'm trying to build my shoulders up. When I use to do and teach aerobics I did it with 10lbs weights in my hands so my shoulders were/are strong, just not big.
In regards to the forearms I do those 2 exercises, and also the twising up a weight on a rope but not every time (do those on back / bi day). My main reason for concern is my lats. My grip gives out way before my back and biceps do. To compensate I use to use straps but that's probably why it's out of balance now. Anyway I'll also read though those old posts. The stuff I'm taking though is the Creatine Ethyl Ester, not the old monohydrate stuff.
Heh, even though I'm still a big guy, and part of my chest size now is definitely fat, it's encourging to see that my chest is about even wtih my belly and flater when I wake up... sure the wife is happy about that as well, heh. It's nice to not have that huge belly in my way. When we got married I had just gone through a mass cycle and was about 270, I know from what I've lifting I've lost some of that but it seems to be coming back fast, perhaps because I had it before, much faster for sure, even with dieting and no supplements until recently, than the guys I know who have never lifted. Thanks for the encouragement too, I have a long way to go but I didn't gain it all back over night nor did I loose it all the first time overnight, took about a year and a half to 2 year... sure it will be the same. With 2 boys (2 and 4) and another on the way I want to start coaching little league football etc... trying to get in shape again so that when the other kids say, YOUR DAD IS HUGE!, it's a good thing, not a bad one
Once down to about 250 I plan on starting a martial arts class but I'm not sure which one to pursue as a newbie... any thoughts on that? Pretty open except for Taekwondo and would eventually like to take Jujitsu but I think I have to take another first don't I?
Marb
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Kwonryu DragonFist
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Everyone should strive for Tom Platz legs!Marbus wrote: I'm not really worried about my legs, after being very active at over 430 lbs for the last 8 years they are considerably strong (didn't realize I was that big...guess I didn't want to know). Once I get down some more, currently about 369) I may add some squats but as the weight comes off I'm not wanting to look like Tom Plats, if I'm going to bust my arse doing this again I want to concentrait on symetry, which is why I'm trying to build my shoulders up.
Well, if you work your shoulders and lats a lot it will make your waistline look even slimmer (illusion), so do lots of chins, T-bar and rowing as well as the shoulder-execises.
Even if you have a big waist now, adding great lats and huge delts will create the illusion that your waist is a lot smaller, so no worry about that!
Symmetry should be top priority!
As for Martial Arts later on, i'd go with Muay Thai and why not BJJ with that. They are both fun arts and compliment eachother well (striking and grappling).
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Kwonryu DragonFist
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Nick wrote:Those pictures scare me
78 - 80 cm waistline should be the goal for a good V-shape.
But crazy as it sounds, Flex Wheeler had a 72 cm waist in his prime, that's near impossible for most of us to achieve heh.
If you have some troubles with slimming down the waist and burning the lovehandles, do the opposite, instead of slimming the waist,work the lats like crazy and punish the delts which will make the waist look helluva smaller and you will get a good V-shape!
Symmetry is Alpha and the Omega imho!
Still, some people prefer a straight line from top(shoulders) to bottom(waist), and some prefer the pearshape
Several of the powerlifters got the pearshape due to huge bellies!
Then again Nick! Are we powerlifting or bodybuilding?
That's right, we're shaping the bod, nothing else!
Well last time I lost a bunch I had a bunch of skin around the waist for years, it was finally going back into place when I started gaining again 
So this time I may have to have a tummy tuck or something like that, however once I get to that point, it will be a good problem to have But since I'll probably never be competing I may never do it if it goes down enough to look good when I'm wearing shorts with a shirt tucked it... however if I get my body where I want it again I may have to say screw it and go all the way, heh.
I actually recently switched to a wide grip on my rows to help spread my lats and fill them out (the illusion) taking it slow on the heavy weights doing that for now until my body gets use to doing it differently, seen some guys really hurt themselves switching from narrow to wide grips on bench before (I've always taken a pretty wide grip on bench).
Waist right now is about a 50, was a 60 back in May but I'm still wearing my 52 pants cause I don't want to buy more until I get to 48 or less, I have old ones in the closet, now if I could just find some Gerbou (sp) like I use to wear back in the 80s I would be set, I like the lower waistline but can't seem to find them in the US anymore. However I've got 10 to 12 more inches to go before that's really an issue. The first 60 or so lbs wasn't very difficult but the next probably will which is why I'm going for mass for a few months then will cut in January. Still trying to loose a little but not worrying about it as much right now, letting my body adjust and trying to eat often and the right thing which is often difficult, luckly there is a Japanese place right down the street and I can get sushi and veggies for lunch pretty cheap, and it's amazingly good sushi for middle of nowhere Arkansas
Marb
Marb
PS - Those pictures rock! I always thought Zane was great but he got so overshadowed by Arnold by the 80s a lot of non body builders and even new ones didn't know who he was. Symetry wise there use to be a guy named Bob Paris that competed in the late 80s early 90s, always though his symetry was pretty much perfect.
So this time I may have to have a tummy tuck or something like that, however once I get to that point, it will be a good problem to have But since I'll probably never be competing I may never do it if it goes down enough to look good when I'm wearing shorts with a shirt tucked it... however if I get my body where I want it again I may have to say screw it and go all the way, heh.I actually recently switched to a wide grip on my rows to help spread my lats and fill them out (the illusion
) taking it slow on the heavy weights doing that for now until my body gets use to doing it differently, seen some guys really hurt themselves switching from narrow to wide grips on bench before (I've always taken a pretty wide grip on bench).Waist right now is about a 50, was a 60 back in May but I'm still wearing my 52 pants cause I don't want to buy more until I get to 48 or less, I have old ones in the closet, now if I could just find some Gerbou (sp) like I use to wear back in the 80s I would be set, I like the lower waistline but can't seem to find them in the US anymore. However I've got 10 to 12 more inches to go before that's really an issue. The first 60 or so lbs wasn't very difficult but the next probably will which is why I'm going for mass for a few months then will cut in January. Still trying to loose a little but not worrying about it as much right now, letting my body adjust and trying to eat often and the right thing which is often difficult, luckly there is a Japanese place right down the street and I can get sushi and veggies for lunch pretty cheap, and it's amazingly good sushi for middle of nowhere Arkansas
Marb
Marb
PS - Those pictures rock! I always thought Zane was great but he got so overshadowed by Arnold by the 80s a lot of non body builders and even new ones didn't know who he was. Symetry wise there use to be a guy named Bob Paris that competed in the late 80s early 90s, always though his symetry was pretty much perfect.
Girbeau...you can still find them in the ethnic clothing stores in this area. Probably true for your area as well. (But there are tons of jeans out there, all with different designs...I bet you could find something similar, that doesn't cost quite as much)Marbus wrote:now if I could just find some Gerbou (sp)