Battlegrounds (yes plural) next patch...

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Animalor
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Battlegrounds (yes plural) next patch...

Post by Animalor »

Along with a ton of info from Blizzard's Lead Designer.

https://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thre ... ost2761331
As promised, we met with Lead Designer Kalgan and presented him with the following questions. Please sit back, relax and take a moment to review the information he has provided. As always, your constructive feedback is appreciated. Enjoy!

Epic Battles = Epic Lag?

Since the Honor System encourages players to take part in player vs. player combat, large scale battles are forming in areas such as Hillsbrad and the Barrens. This has been causing extreme latency, which is frustrating for both those participating and those that aren't. Do you see this as a problem, and are there plans in motion to address this issue?

The current lag being generated by the large PvP battles is unfortunate. Although optimizations are being made to improve the play experience in high-density battles, we suspect that much of the current behavior will be very short lived. The Honor system has sparked great interest, and seeing that areas such as Hillsbrad and the Barrens were already hotspots for player vs. player combat it isn't surprising that players rush to either locations in order to check out the new system.

We feel the largest contributing factor in the reduction to the latency in these hotspots is the fact that Battlegrounds will be ready for release next patch! Yes, that's right, I said next patch, and yes, I said Battlegrounds...plural! The implementation of Battlegrounds will draw players away from towns and into instanced environments designed for either small-scale or epic battles between evenly matched teams (we’ll be sure to get you more information soon about how the instancing works). With many players taking their PvP action into battlegrounds (due to both the fun-factor and the contribution points for completing objectives), we expect that combat in the outdoor world will be of a much more manageable size.

Battlegrounds plural?! What does Kalgan mean?!! Hmm...

Uh, Kalgan?

...

How Do I Quest at a Grave Yard?

The new Honor system seems engaging, but many times I would prefer to simply quest. How am I supposed to enjoy the other aspects of the game and avoid player vs. player combat when the majority of the population is hunting other players in an attempt to gain honor?

We're fairly certain that once Battlegrounds are released, players will notice that the player vs. player combat taking place in contested zones will be substantially reduced. As described earlier, players will generally find it advantageous to their honor score to fight in battlegrounds. I would also like to make mention that players on a PvP realm should always feel some sense of danger when questing in a contested zone, as such is part of what makes this realm type fun and exciting, assuming it is at a reasonable amount. Once players understand how the Honor System works and how they should best be utilizing their time in order to gain its rewards, we expect that you will not be in any more danger than you were before the addition of the Honor System (possibly less).

Orcs vs. Human?


Since the Horde vs. Alliance ratio on certain realms is not perfectly balanced, don't you think that the faction with larger numbers will be at a significant advantage?

Despite a very common misconception, Horde and Alliance numbers are pretty well balanced on PvP realms. Since most players will be building up their Honor ranking by fighting in a Battleground environment, where sides are evenly matched, realm imbalance shouldn't factor in to either faction's ability to progress in the Honor system.
That being said we are investigating other solutions in the short to mid term to help the Horde vs. Alliance imbalance. Yet nothing we can discuss at this time.

Why Won't You Punish Us?

You've stated on many occasions that you will analyze the Honor system and only add a system of dishonor if player actions necessitate such. While this is a noble cause, it seems as if having no system of checks and balances in place that punishes players for "unfair" tactics will only result in frequent and unwanted trips to the local graveyard. Now that you've seen the system working on the test realm, have your thoughts on this changed?

We're taking our first step towards a dishonor system upon the release of the next patch. Trivial civilian NPCs such as quest givers and vendors will now give dishonor points to players that prey upon them. We haven't decided upon a specific penalty but it will be enough that the majority of players will not wish to engage in combat with those NPCs. This combined with the fact that upon the release of Battlegrounds most players will not be targeting towns or unsuspecting adventurers nearly as often, should reduce the need to add too much more in the way of a penalty, or dishonor.

With that being said, I would like to reiterate that just as we added this small addition of dishonor as result of seeing the system in action, we will continue to analyze the Honor system and make improvements until we're satisfied with the way it’s working.

Equal Opportunity Classes?

Does each class have an equal opportunity to advance in the Honor system? It seems that the Mage has a greater advantage over the Warrior due to their area effect spells and their ability to dish out a ton of damage in a short space of time.

The initial data has not indicated that any one class has dramatic advantages over another. I believe this train of thought to be spawned from the confusion surrounding how players rise in rank. Keep in mind, an Honorable Kill does not determine the rate at which you progress under this system, only that the kill itself was considered to be fair, and that you received contribution points for that kill. A players total contribution points, which takes into account many factors to determine the value of a kill (as described in other previews and FAQs), is the more relevant factor in determining a character’s advancement in rank at the end of the week.

Warriors for example, are an extremely durable class that are capable of doing good damage and (depending on the scenario) often have a greater survivability rate than cloth classes. The data we’ve seen thus far indicates that the most important factor lies in how well a player uses the advantages of their class. As a side note, one of the things we're adding in the next patch along with Battlegrounds is a new combat log message which will appear after each kill informing you of your estimated contribution points for a kill when it happens. This number will be slightly crude, as it doesn't factor in players killed under the diminishing return rule but it will provide players with a better understanding of how the system works and how valuable a given kill is.

If you wish to read the Honor System Q&A with Kalgan which was posted on the 31rst of March, please follow the link below.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... ost2309447
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Post by Fairweather Pure »

Cry havoc and let loose the dogs of war!
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Post by Skogen »

I might have to drag my Hunter off the shelf to give this a whirl!

then again...going into pvp as Hunter might be asking for frusteration.
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Post by Fairweather Pure »

Hunters in a group PvP setting are awsome with thier ranged attacks. You can hang back and pick people off, lay traps for the charging enemy, and take it up close and personal when the time comes. If you team up all your hunters to work on one target, you can drop a player froma distance before they knew what hit em.

My GF just fills the enemy priests/mages/warlocks with mana draining arrows, selects and marks high prioriety targets with Hunter's Mark, and sends her pet on suicide runs to take out anyone who try to back off when low on health. She's always doing something and enjoys largescale PvP a lot more than one on one.
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Post by Diae Soulmender »

Skogen wrote: then again...going into pvp as Hunter might be asking for frusteration.
I do pretty well in PvP man. I am by far not a God in PvP, but I do ok.

Lord how I hate Rogues!!!

(Sinsiter Strike!)
(Stun!)
Blender Mode Enabled...
(Stun!)
Blender Mode Enabled...

Dead Hunter :(

--hehe

PS: I swear to God Rogues hang out on the fringes of battle looking for Hunters.... and I do mean 'specifically' Hunters....
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Post by Skogen »

I think I that PvP with a hunter wasn't my bag....and come to think of it, I was almost always fighting rogues! I only won ONE fight...and it was a warlock.
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Post by Diae Soulmender »

Skogen wrote:I think I that PvP with a hunter wasn't my bag....and come to think of it, I was almost always fighting rogues! I only won ONE fight...and it was a warlock.
Im not going to make any comments on Skill Skog cause I dont know ya or how long and far you played your Hunter.

Im not saying I cant kill a Rogue (I can) its just when they get the jump on me I can almost guarentee you Im dead (along with just about any other class who gets jumped by a Rogue).

PvP Servers have got it downright tough right now and I do feel sorry for all the 45-55 folks on them servers. They are simply walking targets waiting to pop at a graveyard near you.

Poor bastards.

== Back on Subject ===

On the other hand I really do have very little sympathy for those folks on PvP Servers as it is the lot they chose to pursue. Right now its bad because of Honor, but again, what did you expect? Its a PvP Server and you knew well beforehand that Gank-fests were gonna happen. It just happens to be even worse then you thought....
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Post by Fairweather Pure »

I fucking hate rogues. Luckily, druids have a couple tricks up our sleeves and are pretty good at recovering once we are pounced on. A lot of classes cannot say the same.

The best way to fuck up a rogue is always have a free action potion on you. Take away thier ability to stun lock you and they are truely fucked. I don't think I've ever lost a 1 vs 1 against a rogue when I've used a free action, but I've probably lost the majority when I have not.

As a druid, it's free action, farie fire, then bear from for the win. They just can't take the dmg without stun lock to save thier ass.
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Post by Skogen »

As far as my skill goes, you dont have to say it, I know it! I suck! however comma, I play on a PvE server, and only dabble in PvP at best.

I played a shaman on the beta PvP server, and there were some fun times there, barring Hillsbrad. I couldn't go 5 minutes without a high level alliance player ganking me when trying to do the "Battle of Hillsbrad" quest series, or the fucking "Hecular's Revenge" quests.
Things did get fun once I got into in some higher level areas. I got to experience shaman pwnage first hand! It was great stuff for a while, but in th end, I found PvP wasn't my bag.
So, that's were I am now..playing on Whisperwind as a Shaman. I'm still not huge on PvP, but would like to try out the battleground to see if I like it!

EDIT:
Its a PvP Server and you knew well beforehand that Gank-fests were gonna happen. It just happens to be even worse then you thought....
oh god, is it worse than it was in beta? I can't imagine that!
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Post by Diae Soulmender »

I dont play on PvP either, but everything Im reading gank-fests are rampent on PvP server. T4eams of people camping corpses, graveyards, flight masters and such.

Poor bastards.

I only have 88 kills under my belt so i guess I am a PvP Dabbler also. Im not playing WoW to kill others. Im more in to PvE then PvP.
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Post by Skogen »

Diae Soulmender wrote:I dont play on PvP either, but everything Im reading gank-fests are rampent on PvP server. T4eams of people camping corpses, graveyards, flight masters and such.

Poor bastards.

I only have 88 kills under my belt so i guess I am a PvP Dabbler also. Im not playing WoW to kill others. Im more in to PvE then PvP.
88 kills? You're a downright PvP master in my book!!

back in the early days of PvP beta, the flightmaster was an easy kill, and the town defense system of massive guard spawn wasn't implemented. So the alliance would enter Tarren Mill, kill everything and everyone with ease, and camp, camp camp! oh god was it an aweful experience to just try and escape that hell...espeically when you were stone bound to tarren mill.
Last edited by Skogen on April 25, 2005, 1:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by Fairweather Pure »

I think I have about 30 honor kills right now, but my GF has over 100. She spends her time killing and I spend my time healing everyone, which apparently is a foreign concept to 99% of Alliance players. :roll:
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Post by Diae Soulmender »

Skogen wrote: 88 kills? You're a downright PvP master in my book!!
HA HA! I wish!

Of the 88 kills I would guess that only 20 of them are actual 1 on 1 kills where I got all of the contribution. That vast majority are from Multi-Shot, Volley and that occasional crit on someone.

PS: Let me give some advise to those who DONT play a Hunter...

If you are on a Mount and a Hunter is chasing you and gets within 20 yards of you and pops you with Scatter Shot to stop you dead in your tracks... DISMOUNT! Dont be a retard and try to keep running from the Hunter. You will surely die.

Scenario:

me chasing someone (irrelevent of what class).

I get within 20 yards I drop mount and Scatter Shot you. This stops you dead in your tracks.

I am cheetah'd and run up to you easily and immediately hit you with Wing Clip (snare) and begin beating on you.

I continually Wing Clip you and keep you snared all the while beating your dumb ass.

DONT TRY TO KEEP RUNNING RETARD.

Dismount and face me or you *will* die. You will NOT get away from me mounted. Drop your mount and either die like a man or kill me, but dont die on your mount. It just makes you look like a n00b :)

PSS: I think 5 of my kills are from level 60 (Whatever class) who simply thought they could stay mounted and get away. Retards each one of them --hehe.
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Post by Boogahz »

There are really only certain zones where you run into regular ganking on PvP servers (Gorefiend at least). These are usually the zones that both sides get forced to by quests such as Hillsbrad (this particular zone situation makes me wanna pee on the devs) and Stranglethorn Vale. Other than these two zones, you will usually run into people that are solo, or at most a full group.

You can get ganked in almost any zone, but it will usually only be to one or two people passing through. Camping corpses is just silly in almost every zone. There is nearly always a way to respawn somewhere that the other person won't be able to see you, and if they still kill you, you will be able to "corpsejump" your way across the zone in the same amount of time that you piss your guildmates off by whining about corpse campers.
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Post by Letania »

I have a low 50s Rogue on Arthas with 300 or so HKs at the moment. They're all small group or solo pvp.

Being a rogue in this case it's obviously easier to avoid ganks but some zones have it bad. Arthas is among the first servers that was launched and it's fairly heavily populated on both ends. Most the alliance spend their time doing retarded things and I see a lot of horde, but the horde bitch on the boards about population imbalance. Anyways

Un'Goro can get bad, tonight it was for 2 hours, when there were 3 level 60s on epic mounts chasing people around, the worst being an MC equipped warrior/rogue duo. Felwood IS bad, if a group of 60s wants to own the zone they can and will, since the road is central to all areas, and epic mounts facilitate fast and effecient ganking. Since everyone there is 48+, the 60s love it. I'm not sure on the plaguelands yet, but I assume they're really bad though it might be for both sides and thusly balanced.

Re: Hunters in pvp. They suck when alone or in very small groups but destroy shit in larger groups. Level 60 hunters and warlocks are the only level 60 classes I feel 100% confident and annihilating should I get the jump. Once crippling is on the hunter, you follow up with evasion and it's down hill from there. No trap or Imp. Wing Clip is gg. My 52 warrior friend and I routinely embarass level 60 hunters, even if they're with some protection; we killed a 60 hunter while locking down Kargath TWELVE times, without corpse camping. I shit you not.

Warlocks, anti fear trinket and just beat the piss out of them for 30 seconds. Don't even kick, just full on DPS. I'm not a stunner, albeit kidney sees frequent use, I'll open with ambush and swap to SS (Need shanker) weapon and pummel them into CB/Evisc.
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