Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith -=[ SPOILERS ]=-

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Canelek
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Post by Canelek »

Dregor Thule wrote:
Canelek wrote:Upon a second viewing, I am much more happy with how this was done. I think an important part is to disregard the 'acting' of Portman and that guy that played Anakin and see this movie as well as the original trilogy(and the last 5 minutes of EP2) as one.

Damn cool, effects aside. As far as acting...well... Smitts and McGregor did very well, IMO.
I thought Smitts was pretty wooden and uninspired. Not that he had a lot to work with, the character wasn't developed at all really.
Hey, I am working with a non-developed character though. He had a nifty speeder escape(not that they gave him resistance), said his lines smoothly, and was sincere when offering to take the child into his care. His lines were spoken swiftly, but were not wooden, IMO.

Then again, his character looked pretty good after the Calculon scene(RE: Futurama). :)
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Post by Kithyen »

Better than the first two, but admitedly the first two set the bar pretty low :P
Instead of all the interaction between Padme and Anakin being cringe inducing only about half the dialogue between the two are so. Lucas'esque dialogue is still prevalentt thru most of the movie but the actors seem to deliver their lines with a bit more conviction in this one making it a bit more bearable. And yes the fight between Obiwan and Anakin will rock your socks off.

Other than that it's a pretty mediocre movie that will probably satisfy most fans due to Lucas tying things together nicely, even though most of it seems forced as if he was trying desperately to tie everything up before the movie ended. It was worth the $7.50 at least for some of the visuals and the sound editing.

In other words I didn't feel like I was going to vomit in this movie. Points to Lucas on that one.
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Post by Animalor »

Just saw it too. It was be far the best of the recent trilogy. I enjoyed it quite a bit.

Quick thing though...

[hide]
So it took about 15-20 years to complete the Death Star the first time around from the structure they had in EP3 and a few years between the Ep4 and ep6 one?
[/hide]
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Post by Dregor Thule »

Oh, had to mention one more bad part..

[hide]Darth Vader says, 'NOOOOOOOOOOOO!'[/hide]
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Post by Dregor Thule »

noel wrote:Apparently on the DVDs that were released in Ep5, IG-88 (the bounty hunter/assasin droid) has been edited out and replaced with one of General Greivous' bodyguards. Can anyone confirm/deny that? Does anyone know when Lucas is going to stop changing the original series?
Nope, just watched Empire again, and IG-88 is very much there. This was in the dvd boxed set that was just released last October(?). I breathed a sigh of relief!
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Post by Canelek »

Replacing IG-88 would be a fucking travesty....don't scare me like that!! Read the Tales of the Bounty Hunters, or somesuch for the best damn spinoff ever. :D also, Zukuss ftw. :)
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Post by Kithyen »

Animalor wrote:
[hide]
So it took about 15-20 years to complete the Death Star the first time around from the structure they had in EP3 and a few years between the Ep4 and ep6 one?
[/hide]
Well it wasn't completely done. It was only like half of one or something. Still yea, it was only like a year or so that passed between episode IV and VI.

It reminds of the Clerks scene where they're discussing that a lot of the people on the second death star that died in it's destruction were engineers/plumbers/outside contractors etc, which the empire needed in order to get it built that quickly :) But yea it seems ridiculus that no matter how much extra help they had that they would've had it that far along. Then again I guess that's why I'm not ruler of the galaxy or something.
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Post by Dregor Thule »

Well, they'd already made all the crucial decisions the first time through, such as which toilet paper holders to use, what wallpaper the emperor wanted in his personal quarters, etc, etc... it was just redoing it all!

And man, I'm actually surprised. Just watched V and VI and I actually felt Vader was a lot deeper after seeing I III and III... I'm amazed!
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Post by Sirensa »

Watched Episode III again, and I, II, IV, V, VI as well. Having done that, my enjoyment of III increased. It's up there with Empire IMO.

Although, I think Natalie Portman sucks beyond all comprehension. In my view, it's her fault that Hayden Christianson appears to have sucked in parts of III as well. I've rejected their romance since I and II simply because of the somewhat motherly role she initiated with him, and then in II because of her initial revulsion to his looks "stop looking at me like that it makes me uncomfortable" etc.
- For the audience to believe they secretly fell in love, they would have had to have been shooting each other hot looks and playful sexual banter a la Han and Leia. At least in private, instead of deep pseudo-discussions of whether or not to fall in love, and how wrong it would be, etc. And that stupid crap on Naboo could have been worked much better if we were to believe their relationship changed.

(P.S. - that damn bitch needs to eat, even Lucas, with his horde of children, ought to know that pregnant women - especially those pregnant with twins - should not appear to be anorexic)
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Post by Kithyen »

Sirensa wrote:
(P.S. - that damn bitch needs to eat, even Lucas, with his horde of children, ought to know that pregnant women - especially those pregnant with twins - should not appear to be anorexic)
I don't remember her being as skinny in the first two as she is in the third installment. I'm beginning to wonder if she had just lost weight in preperation for her role in the upcoming holocaust movie she's supposed to be in. She showed up at the premiere with a buzzed head.

Then again Lucas only spends like three days filming actors (and he probably got that out of the way early) and three years splooging over his special effects so that's probably not it.
Oh, and your poet Eliot had it all wrong:
THIS is the way the world ends.

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Post by noel »

Dregor Thule wrote:
noel wrote:Apparently on the DVDs that were released in Ep5, IG-88 (the bounty hunter/assasin droid) has been edited out and replaced with one of General Greivous' bodyguards. Can anyone confirm/deny that? Does anyone know when Lucas is going to stop changing the original series?
Nope, just watched Empire again, and IG-88 is very much there. This was in the dvd boxed set that was just released last October(?). I breathed a sigh of relief!
Thanks! I didn't buy the DVD so I couldn't confirm. One of the geeks who were in line (my real friends were amazed I could speak their language) told me that was the case. I'm glad they left IG-88 alone.
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Post by Dregor Thule »

I'm such a nerd. I've entered some Star Wars frenzy out of nowhere really. I hadn't even watched the movies in awhile, but now? I've watched them all. In the span of 2 days. Know what else? I actually looked up the new toy lines. I'm fucking sad.

That being said, they have a totally wicked line of Star Wars Unleashed figures. They're like 8" "statues" almost, about 30 of them, and they look sweet! Also, in my perusals, I learned that Trandoshans (Bossk's race) apparently regenerate lost limbs, which I found highly ironic since when I was a wee boy my dog then chewed off my Bossk figure's left leg and right arm.

They never regenerated :(
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Post by Fairweather Pure »

The IG-88's had a pretty cool role in the animated shorts that were on Cartoon Network. There were mounted on speeders with lances or something like that.
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Post by noel »

Dregor Thule wrote:I'm such a nerd. I've entered some Star Wars frenzy out of nowhere really. I hadn't even watched the movies in awhile, but now? I've watched them all. In the span of 2 days. Know what else? I actually looked up the new toy lines. I'm fucking sad.

That being said, they have a totally wicked line of Star Wars Unleashed figures. They're like 8" "statues" almost, about 30 of them, and they look sweet! Also, in my perusals, I learned that Trandoshans (Bossk's race) apparently regenerate lost limbs, which I found highly ironic since when I was a wee boy my dog then chewed off my Bossk figure's left leg and right arm.

They never regenerated :(
I bought a lego arc fighter, and a Clone Commander action figure. :(
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Post by Canelek »

Haha, I spent 3 years from 95-98 collecting shit. I have boxes full of POTF2 figures, etc. I even have a '95 boba Fett (half-circle hand) signed by Jeremy Bullock, a '95 Darth Vader (long sabre) signed by David Prowse, and a Greedo (red card) signed by the chick that played Greedo.

yup, SW geek here.... my friend and I used to be regulars at toy stores throughout the san Fernando valley. holy shit, I need to off this stuff.
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Post by Dregor Thule »

Ok, Canelek wins.
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Post by Winnow »

I've got Star Wars trading cards that came in Wonder Bread back during the original movie.

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I have an excuse though. I was just a little kid and received nutrition from the enriched wonder bread along with the cards! My hard earned toy money went toward Micronauts.

Wait...you guys are talking about present day purchases? OMG you nerds! :twisted:
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Post by Hesten »

Kithyen wrote:
Sirensa wrote:
(P.S. - that damn bitch needs to eat, even Lucas, with his horde of children, ought to know that pregnant women - especially those pregnant with twins - should not appear to be anorexic)
I don't remember her being as skinny in the first two as she is in the third installment. I'm beginning to wonder if she had just lost weight in preperation for her role in the upcoming holocaust movie she's supposed to be in. She showed up at the premiere with a buzzed head.
Its not a holocaust movie, its a sci-fi (i think thats what they label it) movie called V for Vendetta.
Its a movie based one one of Alan Moores best comics (and yes, if i get some space to put it here, i can upload it in the comic section, its VERY much worth a read).
Nathalie Portman wont be shaved all the time in it, but yes, she need to be skinny and head shaved on a point in the movie.
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Post by Homercles »

I just saw it on Sunday. Like others said, I came away wanting to watch the original three again. And like Winnow said, the best part of the movie was when the helmet came down.

Hell, I couldve done without the first hour of the movie. The movie didnt get good until Annikan made that lightspeed jump from horrible actor trying to portray conflict to decent actor of a strictly evil dude.

The Jedi slaughter is when it turned into a good movie. I actually got a little choked up as Yoda cringed in pain and sorrow from the hits thru the Force.


I guess Im alone on the "visually stunning" aspect of the movie. I felt the CGI was WAY overdone and actually poor in some cases. That stupid ass lizard that Obi rode was horrible. And the creature sound effects were terrible.

Am I the only one that prefers a Ton Ton and The Rankorr to any of the CGI creatures in episodes 1-3? And none of the thousands of CGI spacecraft can compare to the Falcon or an X-Wing Fighter. In 4-6 the spaceships were like characters. You loved seeing the Falcon on screen.
In 1-3 the spaceships just turned into a bunch of clutter. No personality. No memorable scenes.

After watching Sithe, I have developed a nostalgia for model making, puppetry, and make-up. They seem to add more intamacy to a film. God knows the Special Effects people take more care in developing a 2/3 sized model of the Millenium Falcon then they do for any of the various CGI spacecraft.

Maybe Im just dissappointed because 1-3 didnt make me relive the magic of my childhood that was Star Wars
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Post by Winnow »

Homercles wrote:
Am I the only one that prefers a Ton Ton and The Rankorr to any of the CGI creatures in episodes 1-3? And none of the thousands of CGI spacecraft can compare to the Falcon or an X-Wing Fighter. In 4-6 the spaceships were like characters. You loved seeing the Falcon on screen.
In 1-3 the spaceships just turned into a bunch of clutter. No personality. No memorable scenes.
I totally agree on the Ton Ton preference. There seems to be a laundry list of things that the original three did better than episodes 1-3 but remember how much impact the elements had in Empire Strikes Back? Luke dying from the cold on Hoth, cutting open the Ton Ton for warmth, the drama of Han Solo being frozen for transportation...episodes 1-3 lost all of those things that made you feel like you were deep into the story and not just watching historical documents.
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Post by Voronwë »

its a challenge to make a movie of a story that everybody already knows what happens.

Empire had a massive advantage in that regard, as much was unknown, and there was a lot of the story yet to unfold.

i thought some of the effects in "Empire" totally sucked, and i dont think at all that the stop action models of animals is a better looking effect than a digitized one. LIke when the big Wampa arm (on a stick) whacks Luke.

Some of the dialogue in "Empire" is HORRIBLE. Han and Leia going back and forth while Luke was in the sick bay, and Luke trying to look cool while he put his arms behind his head after she kisses him. That was corny as hell.

so what. its fun, and its my favorite movie ever.

the movies aren't perfect. i think people are constantly holding the newer movies to a different standard than the ones they loved as a child.

that's not to say that I and II were strong movies. They weren't. I'm just saying all the movies have had weaknesses that one could nit-pick.
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Post by Sirensa »

Voronwë wrote:i think people are constantly holding the newer movies to a different standard than the ones they loved as a child.
Totally.

Luke was pretty whiney too!
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Post by Marbus »

I agree Voronwe.

However I want to add that I personally loved the first 30 minutes. Seeing it for a second time on Saturday I didn't focus always on the Jedi fighters but the other ships, the CGI there is truly amazing.

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Post by Winnow »

Sirensa wrote:
Voronwë wrote:i think people are constantly holding the newer movies to a different standard than the ones they loved as a child.
Totally.

Luke was pretty whiney too!
That's part of what made the original series great : ) Love them or hate them, you at least had some feeling for the characters.

AND WHERE WAS THE COMEDY RELIEF!!!? CP30 had no one liners in episode 3. R2D2's squeeks and pops aren't as funny as C3PO.

Obi Wan caused this whole mess by treating Anakin like a child. It was already known that he was The Chosen One. Make him a master jedi and put him on the council before all the problems with Chancellor Palpatine occur. You don't screw around with the Chosen One. He was owning Obi Wan in ability on their missions. Give him some respect.
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Post by Marbus »

Come on Winnow, his "ability was never in question" just his maturity.
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Post by noel »

Owning Obi-Wan on missions... maybe. When the lightsaber battle finally came... SCOREBOARD Obi-Wan! :P
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Post by Dregor Thule »

The new effects vs. the old... I agree and disagree. The old stop motion and total reliance on models had more texture to them, they felt a little more grounded in space than a lot of the newer CGI, but they also had some faults (the stop motion at least). I dunno if it's because I've gone to school for this type of thing, but watching the Ton Ton's again was a little painful with their jerky animation. But then I saw the CGI band in Jaba's palace in ROTJ and the 2 CGI singers were pretty bad too.

All that said... CGI Yoda was simply awesome. Watch number 1 then number 2.. in 1 they used a puppet almost all the time, if not all, and 2 they went the CGI look. Jesus, so much better. They need to go back and cut out all the puppet yoda's and add in CGI ones from episode 1. Don't touch the originals tho ><
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Post by Homercles »

I agree that the CGI Yoda is better than the puppet yoda. But that may be the only case of CGI that trumps the original films. Even though the Ton Ton is choppy in its movements (when its running) it still has more "life" and more personality than any of the CGI creatures in 1-3. Lucas is so apeshit over CGI it seems he goes out of his way to find more and more and more reasons to use it. Again I'll harp on that god aweful lizard creature Obi-Wan rode. Was that creature needed at all? It served absolutely no purpose in the story. It aided Obi in no way. Lucas just thought "hey, lets have obi riding a gigantic lizard that has a sonicyelp."

CGI is most effective when its focused within the film. Not when the entire film is based on it. Lord of the Rings is the perfect use of CGI. Golem, the Demon, the trolls. They worked and looked perfect!

Compare that to 1-3. Every creature. Every starship, every droid (aside from r2 and 3-PO, and damn near every landscape. The entire movie was basically created on a computer.
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Post by noel »

In the opening space battle of this movie, I thought it looked horrible. It barely looked like things were flying around. I'm not sure if it was because everything looked so perfect, but it was almost as though everything was still. I didn't get any impression of movement/speed/anything. Granted, in a weightless environment, that might be more realistic, but it just didn't convey 'space battle' to me. That's actually another problem with using CGI, everything looks too perfect. Not enough defect, or variation from one unit to another.

I think a good example of horrible CGI was the fight in Ep1 between the Gungans and the Battle Droids. At no point in time did it look real in the slightest. Another example of bad CGI is the scene in Ep2 in the Arena. Watch it again, and watch as the actors attempt to pretend they're looking at something, and miss. Frankly, that's more of an editing issue to me but it's a direct result of using CGI badly.

I think the Battle of Geonosis was done EXTREMELY well. Apparently, several of the scenes where they landed the dropships and let off the clones were created by taking a film of a marine helicopter landing, and pasting clones and dropships over what was in that scene. That was a great job, and looked real.

I agree, the taun taun looks very jerky, and just bad in the zoomed out shots. That said, I really didn't like the lizard Obi-Wan was riding in Ep3 or any of the 'beasts' in the arena in Ep2. I think there's a fine line, but for certain, the technology has come a long way.

As good as Lucasfilm is, I think the large-scale battles in LotR TT and RotK looked better.
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Post by vn_Tanc »

I thought it fucken ruled. Relentless action, eyegasm CG porn, sucky-love-story bits kept to 15-sec slices, lots of nice touches and some actual emotional resonance (who didn't feel somthing when the jedi were being slaughtered?). I think it's about as good as any Star Wars movie not featuring Han Solo could be. I had no problem with the speed of Anakin's fall as I always felt it would be a snap rather than a slide.
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I'd go and see it again. To miss this in the cinema in favour of the shite rip that's out on Torrent is a crime.

Note: It's also well worth seeing BOTH series of the animated clone wars before seeing it. You get more mileage from Grievous for one thing. And you also see more of the pressure on Anakin that nudges him towards snapping.
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Post by noel »

vn_Tanc wrote:Note: It's also well worth seeing BOTH series of the animated clone wars before seeing it. You get more mileage from Grievous for one thing. And you also see more of the pressure on Anakin that nudges him towards snapping.
Totally agree.
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Post by Dregor Thule »

vn_Tanc wrote:Duel=Cuel
You lose some serious points just for that!
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Post by Canelek »

Sirensa wrote:
Voronwë wrote:i think people are constantly holding the newer movies to a different standard than the ones they loved as a child.
Totally.

Luke was pretty whiney too!
But I was going to go to the Tashi Station to pick up some power converters!!
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Post by Voronwë »

You can waste time with your friends when your chores are done.
Now come on, get to it!


there you go now, you made me fire up "Throne Room and End Title" from Star Wars. Incidentally my buddy and i used to close our radio show with this in college. So if you were listening to WVUM 90.1 at 9:55am on Mon or Fri, you got your geek fix for the day ;-) oh yeah, in 1994 or 1995 :p
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Post by Hoarmurath »

With regards to the whole "chosen one" and bringing balance to the force.... I think Anakin *does* do that. WIth his help, nearly all of the light-side jedi are wiped out, and at the same time, he impregnates Padme with the children that will end up destroying both him and the emperor. So that by the time Ep. 6 ends, you have the Sith destroyed and only one jedi remains(plus another untrained potential jedi in Leia, I suppose). That's pretty close to balance, I think. You essentially end up with no Jedi council, and no Sith lords. Like Yoda says, I think the prophecy was misread...or maybe taken too lliterally.

*Disclaimer: I've only seen the 6 movies, I've read none of the books or seen any of the animated series.
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Post by Xzion »

***not a spoiler

I noticed that the storm troopers in this movie (clones of boba fetts dad) were around 30-35 years old...25 years or so later when ep4 takes place wouldnt the storm troopers(around 60 years old) not be able to fight as well or at all?
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Post by Sionistic »

Even in sci-fi, I doubt they only made one batch of clones.
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Post by Marbus »

Stormtroopers are just that... Stormtroopers they are not Clone Troopers.

Once the war was over they stopped purchasing Clones and started recruiting. While they were wearing similiar suits you will notice that the ST in the origial series all sounded different because they are different people. Only Boba Fett (in the DVDs) sounds like Jango.

Also note that the CT wouldn't be 60 they would be a LOT older due to the growth acceleration. They aged to about 25 in a little under 10 years so in 20 more years they would be 75 or 80.

If you ever played Tie Fighter, part of the background story was signing up to serve the Empire. You could be a ST, Fighter Pilot, Speeder Biker etc...

No need to pay for clones when you can establish a good recruiting system.

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Post by Sirensa »

Hoarmurath wrote:With regards to the whole "chosen one" and bringing balance to the force.... I think Anakin *does* do that.
Yeah exactly, Anakin is the chosen one.
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Post by Voronwë »

not entirely.

ANnakin polarizes the force opposite to the way that it was. Only through the actions of his son, does he play a part in the balancing, when his son convinces him to kill the EMperor.
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Post by Winnow »

Balance would only be achieved if one of the twins eventually joins the Dark Side.

Looks for that in episodes 7-9!
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Post by Xzion »

Marbus wrote:Stormtroopers are just that... Stormtroopers they are not Clone Troopers.

Once the war was over they stopped purchasing Clones and started recruiting. While they were wearing similiar suits you will notice that the ST in the origial series all sounded different because they are different people. Only Boba Fett (in the DVDs) sounds like Jango.

Also note that the CT wouldn't be 60 they would be a LOT older due to the growth acceleration. They aged to about 25 in a little under 10 years so in 20 more years they would be 75 or 80.

If you ever played Tie Fighter, part of the background story was signing up to serve the Empire. You could be a ST, Fighter Pilot, Speeder Biker etc...

No need to pay for clones when you can establish a good recruiting system.

Marb
clones are much better soldiers though, specially with the genes of a badass bounty hunter, i would think they would pay the higher price for the quality, but yeah...that does make sense
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Post by Kwonryu DragonFist »

Winnow wrote:Balance would only be achieved if one of the twins eventually joins the Dark Side.

Looks for that in episodes 7-9!
So its Luke VS Leia in Ep 7-9? They must be oldies :D
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Post by Marbus »

Nah Anakin and Janice Solo would be my guess...
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Post by Ebumar »

I'm sure you mean jaina and jacen solo, and anakin solo is like 10 in those movies. Or, supposed to be.
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Post by vn_Tanc »

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Post by Winnow »

rofl, if you left that alone and someone saw it that hadn't seen Star Wars, they'd throw it out as a broken toy.
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Post by Syndaen Crystalthorn »

Top Ten Things Samuel L. Jackson Should Have Said in the Star Wars Prequel

10. You don't need to see my goddamn identification, 'cause these ain't the motherfuckin' droids you're looking for.

9. Womp rat may taste like pumpkin pie, but I'll never know, 'cause I'd never touch the filthy motherfucker.

8. This is your father's lightsaber. When you absolutely, positively, have to kill every motherfuckin' stormtrooper in the room ... accept no substitutes.

7. If Obi-Wan ain't home then I don't know what the fuck we're gonna do. I ain't got no other connections on Tatooine.

6. Feel the Force, Motherfucker.

5. 'What' ain't no planet I've ever heard of! Do they speak Bocce on 'What'?

4. You sendin' the Fett? Shiat, Hutt, that's all you had to say!

3. Yeah, Chewie's got a hair problem. What the brother gonna do? He's a Wookie.

2. Does Jabba the Hutt look like a biatch? Then why are you tryin' to fuck him like one?

1. Hand me my lightsaber... it's the one that says, 'Bad Ass Mother Fucker.'
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Post by Ransure »

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Post by noel »

[hide=Proper Fucked!]Image[/hide]
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