Obamacare!

[Leonaerd]

[Avestan]

Name a single US government service (health care or otherwise) that you think runs as well or better than their private counterpart.

The United States Postal Service. UPS and FedEx can't hold a candle to what the USPS does everyday, and without taxpayer dollars for the most part.

The USPS remains a pillar of government management:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/postal-re ... ector.html

[Asheran Mojomaster]

Name a single US government service (health care or otherwise) that you think runs as well or better than their private counterpart.

The United States Postal Service. UPS and FedEx can't hold a candle to what the USPS does everyday, and without taxpayer dollars for the most part.

The USPS remains a pillar of government management:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/postal-re ... ector.html

I refuse to use the USPS unless I have no choice. When I started my business, we did not yet have managers handling all of our payroll, and it was up to me to send out paychecks. Over the course of a year, I learned to stay away from there.

It takes longer to get anything done, and they lost at least 10 envelopes / packages I had to send. I eventually used Fedex only, and they have yet to lose a single thing, and it is much more convenient. Very rarely is there a line.

[kyoukan]

The USPS remains a pillar of government management:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/postal-re ... ector.html

Much of the Postal Service's loss in 2012 came from two defaults on a total of more than $11 billion in payments that Congress had directed USPS to pay into a fund for future retiree health benefits.
The agency was unable to make the payments, but still must account for them in financial statements.

This was explained to you on this very fucking thread . Yes, the same thread where I already called you a stupid twat for not even reading the articles that you rush to slap up in order to "prove" your uneducated and ignorant world view.

How many other privately owned and independently run corporations do you know of that are mandated by congress to put a fifth of their revenue into a giant bank account that no one can access ever?

[Avestan]

Are you seriously trying to argue that the USPS should not shrink or cut staff and that all their problems are due to government. . .wait for it. . .regulation?

The fact that they have not significantly modified their business despite this little thing called the "internet" makes their corporate structure, regulations or leaders completely idiotic. Pick your reason - the point is that government involvement does not breed the freedom needed to make smart business decisions. All the leaders seem to know what they want to do, but the government does not let them. Do you really count that as a point in favor of government run enterprise? At least they are getting the fucking US Senate to pass a bill that allows them to not ship on Saturdays - such amazing agility!

I know you like to flame, but I think you guys are the only ones in the entire country (or in the Northland) who thinks the USPS is a well functioning enterprise.

[Aslanna]

That's Obama for creating the USPS.

[Avestan]

Not sure what Obama has to do with this other than the fact that he seems to like large government run enterprises.

[Aslanna]

Not sure what Obama has to do with this

Exactly my point!

[Boogahz]

Not sure what Obama has to do with this

Exactly my point!

He's not gettin' it!

[kyoukan]

Are you seriously trying to argue that the USPS should not shrink or cut staff and that all their problems are due to government. . .wait for it. . .regulation?

The fact that they have not significantly modified their business despite this little thing called the "internet" makes their corporate structure, regulations or leaders completely idiotic. Pick your reason - the point is that government involvement does not breed the freedom needed to make smart business decisions. All the leaders seem to know what they want to do, but the government does not let them. Do you really count that as a point in favor of government run enterprise? At least they are getting the fucking US Senate to pass a bill that allows them to not ship on Saturdays - such amazing agility!

I know you like to flame, but I think you guys are the only ones in the entire country (or in the Northland) who thinks the USPS is a well functioning enterprise.

For the third time in the same thread, you are not even reading your own fucking article you posted. You wonder why I get so fucking upset.

Postal officials want Congress to pass legislation that would allow the agency to end Saturday mail delivery and run their own health plan rather than enrolling USPS employees in federal health programs, among other things.
Lawmakers have been working for more than a year on legislation to overhaul the Postal Service, but have been unable to agree on how to do it.

The USPS needs an ACT OF CONGRESS to change the way they do business.

This is an entity with 65 billion in revenue in 2011. Even with volumes of mail on the downswing they still manage to make ends meet if you don't factor in the on paper and totally false, FAKE debt that they have pay into due to a deliberate attempt to sabotage them by a GOP controlled house. Honest to christ, do you even read ANYTHING?

The post office provides invaluable services to the federal government for free. They are a repository of federal documents and applications and a place to file them, free of charge. Millions of Americans rely on the USPS stations to file their income tax. Just because your daddy's fucking accountant does yours for you still does not mean everyone's does. They are mainstays in small towns that rely on the post office to fulfill hundreds of needs for federal service. Do you think fucking UPS is going to do that when the USPS is gone? No, you are FUCKED. Fucked by your own stupidity and lame political ideology that you are fed because you can't think for your own. You'e such a goddam ignoramus that it hurts my soul. I almost hope you moron yourselves of one of the most historically successful public entities in the history of the planet just because that is exactly what clowns like you deserve.

The USA was built by the USPS. Expansion would have taken decades longer were it. Take a fucking second and learn something for once. You should be proud of the USPS because it is one of the most magnificent stories in your country's history. In grew in tandem with your country's birth in the world's largest and most efficient publicly run delivery systems in history that dozens of developing and expanding nations have modeled off of.

But go ahead and think what you want. People like you will anyway because it is more convenient for you than actually educating yourselves, even on the own articles that you post.

[Avestan]

Personal attacks are a wonderful way to distract folks from undefensible claims - but I can see you already know that.

Your point, if I understand it correctly, is that no one else can


1. Be a repository for federal documents and applications

and

2. Provide a way to file taxes


Seriously? What other thing (the internet) could do these things (the internet)? What other places exist in almost every city (grocery stores, city halls, Wal-Mart, libraries)? Who picks up and drops off shit at every doorstep in the country (UPS, Fed-Ex) and has the ability to process tax documents (the IRS)?

Interestingly, here are the tax filing instructions on usa.gov:

File Your Taxes

Over 100 million people filed their taxes electronically last year. Electronic filing (e-file) makes filing your taxes easier, reduces the risk of error, and you’ll receive your refund faster. The IRS can help you find an authorized e-file provider in your area.

You can also file your federal tax return by mail. You can print forms from the IRS website or find them at your local library. Before mailing them in, make sure to double check your math for errors. Visit the IRS for a list of the most common forms and instruction booklets for each form. The IRS has information about which form to use: the 1040-EZ, 1040A, or 1040.

I think you might be the only one who wants the USPS to play this role that you think it critical - including the IRS. Even the government pushes people away from mailing crap.

Now - notice that I never said I wanted the USPS to go out of business. My point has always been that if the USPS were a well run, non government organization, it would have downsized itself. It would have reacted to the internet. It would have cut staff. It would still be thriving instead of years too slow on something every reasonable person saw coming from a mile away. This tangent was only ever started as a discussion of government run enterprise and you guys saying that the USPS was an awesome success example!

So, I took the USPS 10k to my daddy's accountant to have a look and he suggested that I have you guys take a look:

http://about.usps.com/who-we-are/financ ... fy2012.pdf

Here's the thing. Those prepayments are a big deal - to the tune of 11 billion dollars. But even if they did not have to pay a cent towards ridiculously high future payouts (we can discuss the merits of that decision if you want), they still lost over 2.45 billion dollars. If you don't believe me, check out page 22 and read the "Results from Operations" bit. I highly recommend reading that entire section. The good news is that adjusted losses were over 2.6 billion last year. At least that is what the people I paid told me to tell you.

If you are too lazy to read financial documents and cannot afford your parent's accountants, here is one reasonable summary:

Without the impact of these charges, the net loss would have been $2,450 million in 2012, $2,685 million in 2011, and
$584 million in 2010.

Due to the combined effects of decreasing revenue and legislatively-mandated costs, we have suffered losses in every
quarter since Quarter I, 2008, except Quarter IV, 2011 and Quarter IV, 2009. These two quarters would have also shown
losses if P.L. 112-33 and P.L. 111-68 had not reduced those year’s retiree health benefits prefunding contributions from
$5.5 billion to zero in 2011 and from $5.4 billion to $1.4 billion in 2009.

It needs to shrink. Their management knows it. They have been trying to cut it for years. The government keeps stopping them. They keep losing lots of money. I am not sure why you guys keep trying to argue against any of this.

Also - I love the USPS and appreciate what it has done for this country even if I hope you excuse my stopping short of giving it credit for building it. I want to see it succeed. In order to succeed, I think it needs massive changes that our government is stopping. That is the point. It is hard enough to create a strong and functioning organization without our ridiculous government dictating what days you have to ship or telling you that you have to keep open offices that serve towns with populations of 8. Call me a cynic, but I think we are setting ourselves up for a repeat with health care. Hope I'm wrong. But I'm not. My daddy's accountant told me so.

[kyoukan]

Personal attacks are a wonderful way to distract folks from undefensible claims - but I can see you already know that.

Your point, if I understand it correctly, is that no one else can


1. Be a repository for federal documents and applications

and

2. Provide a way to file taxes

YES, YOU HAVE NARROWED DOWN THE ENTIRETY OF MY POST TO A LASER FOCUS. GREAT JOB!

ARE YOU 100% CERTAIN YOUR NAME ISN'T THE GREAT SUMMARIZO: THE WORLD'S MOST ADEPT HUMAN AT SUMMARIZING CONVERSATIONS?!

[Kilmoll the Sexy]

She/it simply cannot function without being a vile, pitiful piece of shit.

The hard part of even reading this thread is mostly the foreign idiots who claim the USPS is the gold standard of government involvement, when it is the government itself killing it. Yes, we all know that the USPS could function extremely well if Congress did not have to allow them to make any changes. The problem is that CONGRESS IS INVOLVED. How fucking blind do you have to be to understand that the very reason for the fail is that the same governing bodies that set the system up 100+ fucking years ago is now the reason for complete fail? It is pretty much the same for every government agency across the board. Things were set up to run well then, and now things are a complete shambles because of incompetence at every level.

How much money do you think Congress blows through the USPS at zero charge to themselves with political horseshit? Every fuckhead running for office should be footing that bill out of pocket. Why don't they? Because it is complete mismanagement in our government.

As for the lapdog who was barking about what this had to do with Obama: ummmmmm...maybe because they want to same government that is too incompetent to keep a system running that ran itself for 100+ years wants to take over running a trillion dollar health care setup?

You people literally make me sick to my stomach.

[masteen]

The USPS isn't failing because of incompetence, Congressional or otherwise. It's failing because of a deliberate and calculated move to make it insolvent. This is what you don't seem to understand.

[Avestan]

Personal attacks are a wonderful way to distract folks from undefensible claims - but I can see you already know that.

Your point, if I understand it correctly, is that no one else can


1. Be a repository for federal documents and applications

and

2. Provide a way to file taxes

YES, YOU HAVE NARROWED DOWN THE ENTIRETY OF MY POST TO A LASER FOCUS. GREAT JOB!

ARE YOU 100% CERTAIN YOUR NAME ISN'T THE GREAT SUMMARIZO: THE WORLD'S MOST ADEPT HUMAN AT SUMMARIZING CONVERSATIONS?!

QED

[Avestan]

The USPS isn't failing because of incompetence, Congressional or otherwise. It's failing because of a deliberate and calculated move to make it insolvent. This is what you don't seem to understand.

newsflash: no one wants the USPS to be insolvent. No one here or in politics has called for the USPS to go away. It just needs to adjust appropriately - which it cannot do - because it is a gigantic government clusterfuck of crony capitalism.

[masteen]

How is forcing a mandate upon them that NO OTHER GOVERNMENT ENTITY has to bear anything other than a blatant attack to force insolvency? Crony capitalism? Perhaps, if we allow that the Republican stalwarts who did this were in the pockets of UPS and FedEx.

[Winnow]

USPS is horrible.

They're trying to dream shit up to keep it going. The latest is encouraging junk mail....the "Current Resident" kind you can't get rid of. If you stacked all of your junk mail for an entire year, you'd have a better understanding of what a waste it is. I could not touch my mailbox for a year if it wasn't for that fucking junk mail that jams it up every week. They really need to create a "no not junkmail my ass" law that's similar to the Do not Call lists.

Every bill/statement that I have is electronically delivered that gives me the option to do so (about 95%). There is almost NOTHING that needs to be delivered regular mail. UPS and FedEX handle packages much better. If there was a way for me to completely refuse delivery service from the USPS, I would do so. I pay my bills on line. I pay my taxes online.

I respect what the USPS accomplished over the first 200 or so years. I also think the Pony Express was pretty cool as well back in its day.

The bottom line is that they're fucked. Traditional mail is a thing of the past. Paper Magazines, Newspapers, etc are all on their way out. There's nothing left to deliver except junk mail and grandma's Christmas card. I don't see any kind of business model that would keep the USPS in business. Their only plan is increasing junk mail which is a monster waste for all involved.

The average American receives 41 pounds of junk mail per year. Not only does junk mail clog up our mailboxes, it also wreaks havoc on the environment. Nearly half of the junk mail received annually (44 percent) ends up in a landfill. In addition, nearly $320 million in local tax money is used to dispose of junk mail, and more than 100 million trees are used to create pulpwood for paper products.

3/21/12 7:35 AM EDT

The financially struggling U.S. Postal Service has a new plan to boost revenue, but you might find your mailbox filling up as a result — with junk mail.

The agency is launching a marketing campaign to promote Every Door Direct Mail, an online tool that helps small businesses circulate direct mail, promoting their services to new or existing customers without their names or addresses.

Junk mail already accounts for 48 percent of total mail volume. It's closer to 80% for anyone smart enough to figure out how to select electronic billing. As soon as that happens and old people die, leaving new grandmothers that are comfortable with receiving and delivering eCards or videos via tablets, that number will increase to 90% junk mail.

USPS facilities should be converted into pot growing farms. It's the only way to save the service while also reducing crime/illegal activities resulting from the ridiculous laws making it illegal to sell a naturally growing plant.

[Kilmoll the Sexy]

How is forcing a mandate upon them that NO OTHER GOVERNMENT ENTITY has to bear anything other than a blatant attack to force insolvency? Crony capitalism? Perhaps, if we allow that the Republican stalwarts who did this were in the pockets of UPS and FedEx.

Stop sticking labels on it relating to parties. The GOP pushed it in and the Dems shit all over themselves with free reign for two years and did nothing but ram Obamacare through. They easily could have done something about that pre-funding.

Again, the government fucked up the process and thinking that they won't do the same with any federal healthcare program is a bigger fallacy than thinking Palestine and Israel are going to have lasting peace..

[Avestan]

How is forcing a mandate upon them that NO OTHER GOVERNMENT ENTITY has to bear anything other than a blatant attack to force insolvency? Crony capitalism? Perhaps, if we allow that the Republican stalwarts who did this were in the pockets of UPS and FedEx.

Stop sticking labels on it relating to parties. The GOP pushed it in and the Dems shit all over themselves with free reign for two years and did nothing but ram Obamacare through. They easily could have done something about that pre-funding.

Again, the government fucked up the process and thinking that they won't do the same with any federal healthcare program is a bigger fallacy than thinking Palestine and Israel are going to have lasting peace..

Again - the USPS lost 2.45 billion last year and 2.6 the year before if you pretend they did not need to pay that stuff. 15+ per year if you do. Neither scenario shows a healthy organization and there is no growth or pending change in strategy to suggest this will change without cuts.

Worth noting - those liabilities do not just disappear if they allowed them to not account for them that way. When exactly do you think they will be paid? After the miraculous phyiscal mail turnaround that we are all expecting? If you were a creditor to the USPS, wouldn't you want them to show now that they can pay those bills later? Would you lend them new money if they could not? I wouldn't.

As taxpayers, we are the creditors for the USPS. If I believed for a second that they could cut costs on their own, I would not levy this requirement, but I don't - they have never shown any ability to do so. The only leverage we have as investors in this historic organization is the lending cap. That is why they were forced to account for it. It was the only way to get them to do anything other than careering off an increasingly large cliff.

[miir]

the USPS lost 2.45 billion last year and 2.6 the year before

Why don't you do 5 seconds of research to find out WHY they lost that much money....
It might have everything to do with the 75 years worth of future retiree health benefits that senate requires them to pay off in 10 years.
Something no other government agency has been required to do.

You take away the prefunding expenditures and the USPS is making more than 2-3b profit per year.

[Kilmoll the Sexy]

the USPS lost 2.45 billion last year and 2.6 the year before

Why don't you do 5 seconds of research to find out WHY they lost that much money....
It might have everything to do with the 75 years worth of future retiree health benefits that senate requires them to pay off in 10 years.
Something no other government agency has been required to do.

You take away the prefunding expenditures and the USPS is making more than 2-3b profit per year.

Well that is not true either, but they would be on the plus side. I don't even have a huge issue with them making them pay more into the retirement funds and building that fund up with the future in sight. There is no doubt that at some point the USPS is going to be mostly obsolete. With all of their money coming from stamps and paid package deliveries, when they stop being viable they still will have benefits to pay out. If they do not have money waiting, it is going to be taxpayer bailouts.


edit: I forgot to add that the amount of the pre-funding and the time frame for doing so is absurd. Having some extra cash go straight to the retirement fund would be smart, but the amount should not be large enough to create a defecit either.

[kyoukan]

lol at the fucking mongoloid brigade jumping in to defend I fucking love the absolute certainty of being right when these mouth breathers start to fall all over themselves in this forum trying to argue something.

[Winnow]

I know you worship the U.S. kyoukan but you need to lay off the pipe when it comes to the USPS. This isn't something they can suck their way out of so you can't really offer much advice on this one.

[kyoukan]

wow I haven't been owned like that since the 10th grade

[miir]

edit: I forgot to add that the amount of the pre-funding and the time frame for doing so is absurd. Having some extra cash go straight to the retirement fund would be smart, but the amount should not be large enough to create a defecit either.

Yea, it's totally ridiculous.
They were required to 'pre-fund' over $10b over the past 2 years alone.

[Kilmoll the Sexy]

Well it is ridiculous. The entire argument we (you know the mouthbreathers who have no clue what we are talking about) have been making in this thread is that the same government that does stupid shit like that is going to run healthcare? The costs and amount of administration for healthcare would be light years past what the USPS has to deal with.

[Spang]

Well it is ridiculous. The entire argument we (you know the mouthbreathers who have no clue what we are talking about) have been making in this thread is that the same government that does stupid shit like that is going to run healthcare?

The Affordable Care Act is health insurance reform, and there's no public option.

[Funkmasterr]

The fact that most people who argue against the health care reform are comparing a little government regulation to stop its citizens from getting completely fucked by insurance companies to something that is run and regulated by the government is pretty indicative of a lack of intelligence and independent thought.

The government isn't taking full control of all the private run insurance companies. Quit fucking talking like it is.

[Avestan]

the USPS lost 2.45 billion last year and 2.6 the year before

Why don't you do 5 seconds of research to find out WHY they lost that much money....
It might have everything to do with the 75 years worth of future retiree health benefits that senate requires them to pay off in 10 years.
Something no other government agency has been required to do.

You take away the prefunding expenditures and the USPS is making more than 2-3b profit per year.

Dude, read the next sentence - the 2.45 and 2.6 pretend the prefunding did not exist. That was the entire point of what I wrote. The loss is $15 billion with the prefunding. There is no scenario with a profitable USPS. None. Clear?

[Winnow]

The U.S. Postal Service will end Saturday delivery of first-class mail starting in August.

Finally. Now lets get it down to once a week.

I'd also like to be able to opt-in to have all of my unstoppable junk mail to "current resident" sent electronically so I can filter it right to the deleted mail folder.

[masteen]

Dude, read the next sentence - the 2.45 and 2.6 pretend the prefunding did not exist. That was the entire point of what I wrote. The loss is $15 billion with the prefunding. There is no scenario with a profitable USPS. None. Clear?

Since when do we expect public services to be profitable?

[Funkmasterr]

The U.S. Postal Service will end Saturday delivery of first-class mail starting in August.

Finally. Now lets get it down to once a week.

I'd also like to be able to opt-in to have all of my unstoppable junk mail to "current resident" sent electronically so I can filter it right to the deleted mail folder.

By the way, this hasn't been voted on yet and likely won't happen.

[Fairweather Pure]

Dude, read the next sentence - the 2.45 and 2.6 pretend the prefunding did not exist. That was the entire point of what I wrote. The loss is $15 billion with the prefunding. There is no scenario with a profitable USPS. None. Clear?

Since when do we expect public services to be profitable?

Wait, the city trucks filling pot holes aren't turning a profit?!?

[kyoukan]

they are if you consider how much the city worker's union profits.

[Avestan]

Dude, read the next sentence - the 2.45 and 2.6 pretend the prefunding did not exist. That was the entire point of what I wrote. The loss is $15 billion with the prefunding. There is no scenario with a profitable USPS. None. Clear?

Since when do we expect public services to be profitable?

Generally, we don't, but we do expect the USPS to do this since. . .

On March 18, 1970, postal workers in New York City—upset over low wages and poor working conditions, and emboldened by the Civil Rights movement—organized a strike against the US Government. The strike initially only involved postal workers in New York City, but it eventually gained support of over 210,000 United States Post Office Department workers across the nation. While the strike ended without any concessions from the Federal government, it did ultimately allow for postal worker unions and the government to negotiate a contract which gave the unions most of what they wanted, as well as the signing of the Postal Reorganization Act by President Richard Nixon on August 12, 1970. The Act replaced the cabinet-level Post Office Department with the independent United States Postal Service, and took effect on July 1, 1971.

source:wikipedia

Part of that deal was that in exchange for union concessions, the USPS would remain revenue neutral. It was considered a union victory at the time.

[Winnow]

The United States Postal Service will be putting aside its plan to eliminate Saturday mail delivery, at least for now. According to a memo on its site, the USPS blames Congress for passing a continuing budget resolution that contains restrictive language that prohibits a new mail delivery schedule. There was already some question as to whether the plan would go forward or not — since the 1980s, Congress has written in funding for the Post Office as long as i maintains the same service level as 1983. There was some debate on whether or not some provisions had changed that would let the USPS get away with its new plan, but the Post Office is backing down for now.

Bummer.

[Winnow]

This president sucks. I can't imagine even the Obama lovers from years back like this guy anymore.

[Aabidano]

I can't imagine the alternatives presented being any better. Not saying anything positive about the DNC - The RNC would shaft everyone in the US but the top 0.2%. That was basically the platform they ran in 2012.

Obamacare is a huge PoS, just a pipeline for a mandatory shafting of the US by insurance companies. The prices quoted on healthcare.gov are 4x higher than what I pay via my employer, including my employers part of the bill. If the government is also paying into this, we as a nation are being even more massively shafted.

"Medicare for all" is the route we should have taken. Medicare HMOs are very profitable too, allowing the insurance industry leeches a bit of the pie also.

[kyoukan]

Universal health care available to all residents who need it is the only way to run a health care system.

If your insurance plan is 75% lower than a basic Obamacare plan then you are being defrauded and your carrier will drop your ass to fend for yourself the microsecond you get sicker than a cold.

[Morgrym]

The US Military has been functioning for years on TRICARE and prior to that CHAMPUS. If the Non Affordable Care Act mirrored what the Gov has already been doing for years, this would be a non issue. Unfortunatly some Demigogue *cough*Obama*cough* had to get involved and the entire ideal was corrupted. I saw this failing the moment it was announced due to the low payout that providers are going to get. No professional wants to work for next to nothing and no troll feeding off of welfare will ever get off of it. Hell, why would you want to? You can make in personal wages no more than $1000 a month and still be on welfare. In most states, it pays out more than $8.00 an hour which is higher than minimum wage. In a few states, it pays more than a lot of people make on a daily basis with a real job.

Top 10 Hourly Wage Equivalent Welfare States in U.S.
State Hourly Wage Equivalent
Hawaii $17.50
Alaska $15.48
Massachusetts $14.66
Connecticut $14.23
Washington, D.C. $13.99
New York $13.13
New Jersey $12.55
Rhode Island $12.55
California $11.59
Virginia $11.11

I am glad I will be retired from the Military and have TRICARE for myself and my family for the rest of their lives and don't have to worry about this hunk of shit. I am not thrilled that I will be paying even more out of my pocket for some waste of space and oxygen to get free health care. Such is life in a society that is on a downward spiral towards Socilism though.

[kyoukan]

haha. welfare queens, socialism! you're a fucking moron. enjoy your fucking free healthcare for life for being some half-witted pencil pusher in the army while you complain about the meager shit people have to pay for and still get financially wiped out if they or their families ever get really sick. maybe if they took your benefits away when you left your job like every other american you wouldn't be so fast to judge.

oh, and GOD BLESS YOU FOR YOUR IMPORTANT SERVICE, you entitled jackass.

[Funkmasterr]

haha. welfare queens, socialism! you're a fucking moron. enjoy your fucking free healthcare for life for being some half-witted pencil pusher in the army while you complain about the meager shit people have to pay for and still get financially wiped out if they or their families ever get really sick. maybe if they took your benefits away when you left your job like every other american you wouldn't be so fast to judge.

oh, and GOD BLESS YOU FOR YOUR IMPORTANT SERVICE, you entitled jackass.

I was going to say something similar, but decided it was more effort than it was worth.

[Aslanna]

Oh no the SOCIALISM card has been played! Game over man. Game over.

[Aabidano]

Mexico is expecting to have universal coverage by 2015, they also expect both the GDP to improve and govt expenditures to drop as a result.

I have tricare standard as well as my employer coverage, tricare has been run by Humana for ~10 years.

Obama took what he could get rather than standing up and blaming failure on the RNC as he should have. He was still in the mode of believing they were rational adults who meant well for the country at that point. They've proved that notion quite thoroughly wrong.

[Winnow]

Oh look! Cool people making fun of people that served their country that have the nerve to throw around the word, "entitled".

[Leonaerd]

Served the corporate country as a paid henchman, used to forcibly secure strategic assets. It's sad that people risk their lives to do as much, and even sadder that being the aggressor in an unnecessary conflict is believed by voters to be heroic.

Coast guard? Full respect.

[Winnow]

Served the corporate country as a paid henchman, used to forcibly secure strategic assets. It's sad that people risk their lives to do as much, and even sadder that being the aggressor in an unnecessary conflict is believed by voters to be heroic.

If you believe that's what the entire military is about, you're pretty messed up.

[Aabidano]

If you believe that's what the entire military is about, you're pretty messed up.

Most people in the US have no frame of reference at all to the mission of our military outside what sells toothpaste and tampon add time on the news.

I spent 6 of my military years supporting FBM submarines, that community and it's land based counterpart didn't have anything to do with the robber barons you speak of.

The US Navy and USMC have had a heavy presence in the middle east, Africa and SE Asia since the end of WWII; along with the Brits, Aussies and New Zealanders. A tiny subset of the reason behind that was oil\resources. That totally fucked up part of the world would be much worse otherwise, even with the idealistic wars.

[Bubba Grizz]

oh, and GOD BLESS YOU FOR YOUR IMPORTANT SERVICE, you entitled jackass.

All I can say is wow. You get a whole new perspective when people are trying to kill you. I forgive the ignorance of people who just can't know due to first hand experience. I hope they never do have that experience. Ever.