Camry Hybrid
Camry Hybrid
After doing some extensive research, and switching jobs to one I have to drive to, we decided to get a second car. I was really enjoying only having one car and no payments, but it couldn't last forever. Remembering that the government (State and Federal) were giving a tax rebate, this was added incentive. We thought about getting a diesel to convert into a bio-diesel, but didn't think it was very cost effective and I wasn't about to pour bio-diesel into a new car. A few friends of ours have gone this route and the reliable diesel sedans are mostly foreign. We had a VW for several years and after paying over $500 for a tune-up (A FUCKING TUNE-UP where I bought the $250 spark plug wires), we decided on the Hybrid.
Our options initially were the Honda Insight and the ever popular Toyota Prius. I did some initial research where I was then introduced to the Toyota Camry (Hybrid). We went out mid-December to test drive, settling on our financial institute to do the haggling for us. Let me first say that the Prius is a good second car. It's built to save gas. The Camry, on the other hand, is a first car. With the added horsepower from the electric engine, it pushes about 185 HP, compared to about half that for the Prius. There was more passenger room with the Camry, and some other features we were sold on.
We've had the car two months now, so I feel I can comment on it since most of the newness has rubbed off. It's my wife's car for the most part, but she lets me drive it on the weekends. Performance wise, the thing handles like a dream. You'd swear it was an AWD. During the huge dumps of snow Denver got in late December, it was unstoppable. We've taken it for a few trips in the mountains skiing and it can push 80 up some steep inclines with ease. It's so incredibly quiet on the inside as well with very little road noise seeping into the cabin. The read-out has been re-tooled to include a MPG meter instead of a tach. If you want to maximize fuel, just adjust your driving to meet maximum MPG. Coming down from the mountains last weekend, I managed to get 85 MPG (~50 miles). No shit! Of course going uphill is a little less efficient. More on that later...
As for the interior, it's roomy and we decided on a touring package (sunroof, 6 CD changer with JBL speakers, heated mirrors). The Camry comes standard with power everything. One thing that's annoying is they put the MP3 player plug in way in the back of the mid-console compartment. Another complaint is the trunk space. The battery takes up some of the trunk and you're left with a small window when folding down the seats which (luckily) is big enough to fit a snowboard and two pair of skis through. We'll eventually get a Thule or other rack, so I'm not that concerned. Another cool feature is the "keyless" ignition. The keys never have to come out of your pocket, which is pretty neat, but has me wondering about how safe it is.
Getting back to gas mileage, we've been averaging about 31-35 mpg, which is far off the sticker mpg of 40 mpg. We can probably squeeze another 2-4 mpg out of it, so it's not that bad. We're planning on having this car a while, so we wanted something with staying power and the Camry recently won the Motor Trend car of the year. The safety features were awarded a 5-star rating as well. If the car is operating under 40 mph, you can keep it on electric if you're going downhill/level, which is pretty cool and dead quiet. The engine will typically shut off completely when stopped. Another interesting feature is the "Automatically controlled continuously variable transmission". It's somewhat jerky, and whines a lot, but being married I'm used to that. We've only had one problem, when the front tire blew out. Toyota wanted $200+ to install a new factory tire on the car, but we went to a tire dealer and got a better tire for under $100.
Overall, we're very pleased with our purchase. It makes the wife happy, so that's what matters most. I wanted to get personalized plates to read "NOTSMUG" to play on the South Park episode, but I chickened out.
Our options initially were the Honda Insight and the ever popular Toyota Prius. I did some initial research where I was then introduced to the Toyota Camry (Hybrid). We went out mid-December to test drive, settling on our financial institute to do the haggling for us. Let me first say that the Prius is a good second car. It's built to save gas. The Camry, on the other hand, is a first car. With the added horsepower from the electric engine, it pushes about 185 HP, compared to about half that for the Prius. There was more passenger room with the Camry, and some other features we were sold on.
We've had the car two months now, so I feel I can comment on it since most of the newness has rubbed off. It's my wife's car for the most part, but she lets me drive it on the weekends. Performance wise, the thing handles like a dream. You'd swear it was an AWD. During the huge dumps of snow Denver got in late December, it was unstoppable. We've taken it for a few trips in the mountains skiing and it can push 80 up some steep inclines with ease. It's so incredibly quiet on the inside as well with very little road noise seeping into the cabin. The read-out has been re-tooled to include a MPG meter instead of a tach. If you want to maximize fuel, just adjust your driving to meet maximum MPG. Coming down from the mountains last weekend, I managed to get 85 MPG (~50 miles). No shit! Of course going uphill is a little less efficient. More on that later...
As for the interior, it's roomy and we decided on a touring package (sunroof, 6 CD changer with JBL speakers, heated mirrors). The Camry comes standard with power everything. One thing that's annoying is they put the MP3 player plug in way in the back of the mid-console compartment. Another complaint is the trunk space. The battery takes up some of the trunk and you're left with a small window when folding down the seats which (luckily) is big enough to fit a snowboard and two pair of skis through. We'll eventually get a Thule or other rack, so I'm not that concerned. Another cool feature is the "keyless" ignition. The keys never have to come out of your pocket, which is pretty neat, but has me wondering about how safe it is.
Getting back to gas mileage, we've been averaging about 31-35 mpg, which is far off the sticker mpg of 40 mpg. We can probably squeeze another 2-4 mpg out of it, so it's not that bad. We're planning on having this car a while, so we wanted something with staying power and the Camry recently won the Motor Trend car of the year. The safety features were awarded a 5-star rating as well. If the car is operating under 40 mph, you can keep it on electric if you're going downhill/level, which is pretty cool and dead quiet. The engine will typically shut off completely when stopped. Another interesting feature is the "Automatically controlled continuously variable transmission". It's somewhat jerky, and whines a lot, but being married I'm used to that. We've only had one problem, when the front tire blew out. Toyota wanted $200+ to install a new factory tire on the car, but we went to a tire dealer and got a better tire for under $100.
Overall, we're very pleased with our purchase. It makes the wife happy, so that's what matters most. I wanted to get personalized plates to read "NOTSMUG" to play on the South Park episode, but I chickened out.
Congrats on the purchase. Glad your wife is enjoying it. I'm sure the mileage will improve as the car breaks in more. I think toyota has done a really good job on the styling of this camry(and the ES350 for that matter), as it looks much much better than the outgoing car. I've heard that the trunk space can be an issue, but at least the batteries give the car a better weight distribution.
- Pherr the Dorf
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Xyphir wrote:It's somewhat jerky, and whines a lot, but being married I'm used to that
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Re:
I recently got one too, and have been getting similar mileage. Really a nice car.Xyphir wrote:We've been getting 38+ MPG lately.Pherr the Dorf wrote:Don't expect over 34-35
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Awwwww, the Prius isn't that gutless.With the added horsepower from the electric engine, it pushes about 185 HP, compared to about half that for the Prius.
The Prius has a combined (gas/electric) 110 bhp.
It's also 800 lbs lighter than a Camry Hybrid.
Prius : 76 bhp/ton
Camry : 100 bhp/ton
The Prius is about 1.8 seconds slower to 60 than the Camry Hybrid.. which is about 1.6 seconds slower to 60 than the V6 Camry.
To put that into perspective, the V6 Camry is as quick to 60 as a '88 BMW M6 and only 1.1 seconds slower to 60 than a Lamborghini Countach.
The Pruis is about as quick 0-60 as a '75 Chevy Nova 350... or a '84 Scirocco.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Hybrids are all torquey, hence they have very nice get up and go.
I will spare you all the Hybrid rant and just say they are a decent bridge even if they are not at all part of the answer.
I will spare you all the Hybrid rant and just say they are a decent bridge even if they are not at all part of the answer.
The first duty of a patriot is to question the government
Jefferson
Jefferson
- noel
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Re: Camry Hybrid
They're the closest thing to 'an answer' that's readily available.
But seriously, I'd love to hear your 'rant'. Don't waste my time if the best you can do is point out that hybrids don't actually save consumers a lot of money.
But seriously, I'd love to hear your 'rant'. Don't waste my time if the best you can do is point out that hybrids don't actually save consumers a lot of money.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
I understand that the Prius has some get-up-and-go, but put them side by side going up a 4-6% incline for several miles with 4 people inside and see how they compare. I live in Denver and take trips into the mountains from time to time. It makes a difference to me if the max speed up an incline is 60 mph, which I have heard from Prius owners with only two passengers.
We're getting about 37-40 mpg so far, and that probably won't change. Unfortunately, Hybrids are probably the best alternative to gas-only cars at the moment, considering how far the average person lives from their work. Electric cars are coming, and I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if the price is right. A new car manufacturer, Tesla, is helping to lead the way.
We're getting about 37-40 mpg so far, and that probably won't change. Unfortunately, Hybrids are probably the best alternative to gas-only cars at the moment, considering how far the average person lives from their work. Electric cars are coming, and I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if the price is right. A new car manufacturer, Tesla, is helping to lead the way.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
In the idiotic US car market, yes.Hybrids are probably the best alternative to gas-only cars at the moment
What difference would it make in your trip time if you could only go 60 up inclines? What kind of impact on all your other driving does the extra power have?
My Rabbit's getting ~50 mpg
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- noel
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Re: Camry Hybrid
I assure you, the Prius can go faster than that up an incline. I've driven the Prius from SF to LA, and it's loud as hell and rather annoying, but you can go up whatever hill you need to at a reasonable 75-90mph speed.
What year Rabbit Aab?
What year Rabbit Aab?
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- miir
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Re: Camry Hybrid
That's absolute horseshit.It makes a difference to me if the max speed up an incline is 60 mph, which I have heard from Prius owners with only two passengers.
The Prius (and every other gas/electric hybrid) has fuckloads of torque.
I know americans are generally pretty fat, but a couple of passengers is not going to cap the car out at 60 miles per hour.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Freeze miir's post count prs.
Thx.
Thx.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
'82noel wrote:What year Rabbit Aab?
turbo-diesel
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Re: Camry Hybrid
LOL... that's what I was afraid of...Aabidano wrote:'82noel wrote:What year Rabbit Aab?
turbo-diesel
My Camry won't beat you on MPGs, neither will the latest TDI Golf. We will however beat you on comfort, navi, bluethooth, leather, moonroof, etc. Don't get me wrong, I *love* the old Rabbit, but you can't really make a fair comparison to today's cars which do a heck of a lot more than just get you from point A to point B.
Not a flame in any way.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
It don't even have power steering, I just brought it up to be butthead regardlessnoel wrote: We will however beat you on comfort, navi, bluethooth, leather, moonroof, etc.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Have you factored parking lots into your exercise schedule?Aabidano wrote:It don't even have power steering, I just brought it up to be butthead regardlessnoel wrote: We will however beat you on comfort, navi, bluethooth, leather, moonroof, etc.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Yes, it's improved my English as well as being a fitness device.Boogahz wrote:Have you factored parking lots into your exercise schedule?
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Re: Camry Hybrid
The only issue w/ the prius and hills i've heard is that you drain the batteries rapidly and really push the rather small main engine. Not really a problem with the camry though as the main engine is quite a bit more substantial.noel wrote:I assure you, the Prius can go faster than that up an incline. I've driven the Prius from SF to LA, and it's loud as hell and rather annoying, but you can go up whatever hill you need to at a reasonable 75-90mph speed.
I'd consider a prius as i like the form factor in addition to the excellent gas mileage. The only problem I have with it is that there's not enough interior width for what I would need. Stick a baby seat back there and good luck fitting two adults with it.
Is the trunk space really that compromised because of the battery pack in your camry? I've also gotten used to pass-through trunks which would be hard to give up
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Re: Camry Hybrid
Yeah, the trunk space is kind of disappointing. No more putting my bike in the trunk with rear seats folded down and only the front wheel removed. It's a compromise, but one I was willing to make.
We considered the Lexus RX Hybrid, which places all the battery stuff under the rear seats and out of your way, but I just couldn't bring myself to spend over 45 grand on a car. I can afford it, I just didn't want to. It helped that I didn't like the exterior styling; my wife liked it a lot.
Our other vehicle is an '07 Acura MDX w/tech package. If it got good gas mileage (we're getting like 19MPG), It would be my favorite vehicle ever. Sadly Acura doesn't make a hybrid SUV yet. The Camry was a good primary vehicle for the majority of what we like to do, but we still retain the MDX for trips where we take our two labs and need the extra space or for when we need to cart our family around.
Back on the Prius... I could see where you'd kill your battery if the hill lasted for a really long time, but my biggest complaints were the lack of interior space (5 adults is no fun), and the noise. It's really loud in a Prius when you're giving it gas. We did quite a few big foothills, but nothing like what a trip through the rockies might do to you.
We considered the Lexus RX Hybrid, which places all the battery stuff under the rear seats and out of your way, but I just couldn't bring myself to spend over 45 grand on a car. I can afford it, I just didn't want to. It helped that I didn't like the exterior styling; my wife liked it a lot.
Our other vehicle is an '07 Acura MDX w/tech package. If it got good gas mileage (we're getting like 19MPG), It would be my favorite vehicle ever. Sadly Acura doesn't make a hybrid SUV yet. The Camry was a good primary vehicle for the majority of what we like to do, but we still retain the MDX for trips where we take our two labs and need the extra space or for when we need to cart our family around.
Back on the Prius... I could see where you'd kill your battery if the hill lasted for a really long time, but my biggest complaints were the lack of interior space (5 adults is no fun), and the noise. It's really loud in a Prius when you're giving it gas. We did quite a few big foothills, but nothing like what a trip through the rockies might do to you.
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Re: Camry Hybrid
As far as an answer goes, the GX Civic is an answer that can be bought today, not the most convenient answer but an answer. Runs on Natural gas and not gasoline, for sure a huge step in the right direction. If you commute under 220 miles a day (260 if you have a natural gas line in your home) and are using the car as a commuter, this is by far the best answer available.
Noel, you live in southern California, starting next year the FCX will be released down there (nationwide in 2011). This will be the first Hydrogen Fuel Cell car on the road available to the public, the home refueling station also can heat, cool and power your home, completely off the grid.
New clean burning diesels (available from VW, BMW, Honda and Mercedes starting in 2009) if run off biodiesel are certainly a better answer as well, running on regular diesel they will get Hybrid mileage without the battery fiasco down the road. Honda, Toyota, GM and Ford all claim they will recycle the batteries when they die but most cars die in accidents or other failures long before the battery packs will. These stacks will rot and leak in a junk yard and into our environment and cause more damage than the 4-12% real time gas savings you will see from driving one.
The environmental footprint of producing a Hybrid is far greater.
The reason Acura (Honda)has yet to release a Hybrid SUV is because of the electronic steering involved. There is not a decent electronic steering box that is nimble and responsive (ie drives like a Honda) for a vehicle that size, until there is, there will be no Hybrid MDX/Pilot/whatever. All Hybrids should have the battery packs stacked upright behind the back seat (on the axle point) anyways for safety in a Tbone collision, the safest point is where the Civic and Camry have it placed.
The Prius has the worst visibility of any car on the road and looks like an abortion of an escape ship from the space station but I do like the new Camry design except that the hood screams Hyundai.
There, I avoided all talk of cost of ownership vs savings at the gas pump and the premium that comes on the car and the fact that pissing money down the drain that could go to a thousand better ways to save the environment is far from green as well.
Noel, you live in southern California, starting next year the FCX will be released down there (nationwide in 2011). This will be the first Hydrogen Fuel Cell car on the road available to the public, the home refueling station also can heat, cool and power your home, completely off the grid.
New clean burning diesels (available from VW, BMW, Honda and Mercedes starting in 2009) if run off biodiesel are certainly a better answer as well, running on regular diesel they will get Hybrid mileage without the battery fiasco down the road. Honda, Toyota, GM and Ford all claim they will recycle the batteries when they die but most cars die in accidents or other failures long before the battery packs will. These stacks will rot and leak in a junk yard and into our environment and cause more damage than the 4-12% real time gas savings you will see from driving one.
The environmental footprint of producing a Hybrid is far greater.
The reason Acura (Honda)has yet to release a Hybrid SUV is because of the electronic steering involved. There is not a decent electronic steering box that is nimble and responsive (ie drives like a Honda) for a vehicle that size, until there is, there will be no Hybrid MDX/Pilot/whatever. All Hybrids should have the battery packs stacked upright behind the back seat (on the axle point) anyways for safety in a Tbone collision, the safest point is where the Civic and Camry have it placed.
The Prius has the worst visibility of any car on the road and looks like an abortion of an escape ship from the space station but I do like the new Camry design except that the hood screams Hyundai.
There, I avoided all talk of cost of ownership vs savings at the gas pump and the premium that comes on the car and the fact that pissing money down the drain that could go to a thousand better ways to save the environment is far from green as well.
The first duty of a patriot is to question the government
Jefferson
Jefferson