Was bored at work last night, so I started trolling through some message boards I had'nt visited in a while. And I found this little gem.
We have'nt had any nice EQ drama threads since the *Ten Fold* days, and I saw some promise on this one, so lets see how it goes.
For those who care and still play EQ, here's a little history.
Rage Veeshan was one of the original Veeshan guilds, and one of the first guilds formed shortly after EQ launched. Small guild, and casual, made up mostly of friends that wanted to play together and have fun.
*Old Ragers* is a term some people used, mostly new leadership, to separate long time members from the new more manageable people in the guild.
Bigotes became the guild leader of Rage Veeshan during the Veeshan/Saryrn split. But during some hard times, he was not able to log on.
Under pressure from some members, Bigotes then decided to turn over leadership to someone that was more actively playing. And after promises of keeping the *flavor* of Rage Veeshan as a family guild, Zkinea was elected new guild leader with the blessing of Bigotes.
The new members wanted to advance and be *uber* while most of the older members wanted to keep the guild casual as it was before. So instead of moving on to other guilds, or form a new one, the new leadership decided to run off the *old Ragers*, move their main characters to Keepers of the Elements and keep control of Rage Veeshan by keeping the alts there.
Seriously Zkinea, if Lumadil was interested in holding on to Rage and trying to rebuild, what right do you have to keep him from it? You moved on to EQ2 and admitted to have no interest in EQ. Dont be so fucking selfish.
The thread on the Rage boards seems to be gone as well now, no drama there, but let us hope they come here and take the bait. Being an "old rager" myself I find this a bit interesting.
The thread on the rage boards was in the officers section.
I too was one of the original Officers of Rage Veeshan (I joined about 3 weeks after it was created, back in 99)
After voicing my opinions on the way the guild was being run after Zkinea became leader, she threatened to remove my posting rights on the board to keep me quiet, when that didnt work she just banned me and kicked me out of the guild that I'd been a member and officer of for over 5 years.
Zkinea is a powerhungry dictator, she did a fine acting job making us think she'd be a good leader of our family guild (until she got our votes)
She's been guildleader for barely a year now, and theres only ONE officer who was an officer when she became leader left in the guild (and he barely plays anymore)... she deguilded or pushed out everyone else and replaced them with yesmen.
-Ral
Last edited by Ralalin on May 2, 2005, 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last September, Rage Veeshan was doing good. There was no pressure to raid, but raids were being planned 2 or 3 times a week for those who wanted to. We were able to hit targets that dropped loot that was upgrades for most of our members. Raids were planned roughly a month in advance, so if you wanted to go you had time to try and work out your schedule to allow you to.
EQ2 and WoW came, and we took a huge membership blow from people heading to the other games, as did most guilds. We couldn't hit the targets we had before, in fact we sometimes had trouble putting together even XP groups.
Some of the higher end guilds reduced requirements to make up their own reduced membership, and we lost some more people.
Zkinea tried recruiting. She tried alliances. She tried to plan events that were within our reduced power range. People left to become more uber, or to simply find a guild that had enough people to group together any more, or to find a guild that had enough people left that there was someone to talk to in /gu more often.
She talked to many of the members of the guild about the possibility of migrating to another guild. In the hopes that, while Rage wouldn't be active any more as something more than an alt guild, at least the mains that still played could remain guilded together...in a guild that still had a roster of active members. Put up a poll on the boards. There was voting. It lost. Those who voted for it, mostly left to the proposed other guild anyway.
She got downheartened, and focussed on EQ2 where the guild had a much larger active membership.
What I find amusing, is that most of the people who got a bug up their ass about the whole thing, don't even play EQ any more, or if they do, left to other guilds so long ago that I can't imagine why they care what RV does or does not do.
Not only that, but people who wanted the guild to raid more and progress faster, and people who wanted the guild to stop recruiting and focus on friendships and xp groups instead of raiding, allied themselves in their supremely vapid attacks on our guild leader.
Zkinea put a lot into the guild, and I find it hard to believe that people who are supposedly adults put this much effort into running her down and upsetting her. She had no secret plan to run off the "Old School Ragers" and calling her a power hungry dictator is absurd. All I ever saw her trying to do was to make playing as enjoyable as possible for our active members. She put more effort into running the guild smoothly than most people I know put into their occupation.
Ralalin, despite how long you had been a member, no one really gives a flying fuck about your opinion on how to run the guild. If you're not *playing* the game, why should anyone cater to your whims? And you never offered solutions to problems, all you ever did was attack Zkinea and suggest that the guild stop allowing new members to join and stop raiding. Excuse me for applauding the decision to listen to the active members of the guild instead of stroking your over-inflated ego.
Just because I'm curious, are you aware of what happens when a guild stagnates? The top end players move on, the people at the bottom use the guild as a chat channel, no one new joins, and then it goes away. Rage would have long ago turned into a footnote if Zkinea hadn't been such an active leader.
In addition, it WAS still very much a family guild for those of us who logged in on a regular basis. The fact that you, Ralalin, didn't know any of the new members is because YOU DIDN'T FUCKING PLAY. I know some of those words had more than one syllable, so maybe this is hard for you to understand, but how could you possibly have any idea of who people are or what the guild membership is really like if you can't be bothered to log in and be an active participant in the guild? Trolling the message boards does not a leader make. Or an officer. Despite an O tag in the guild manager.
I have no opinion on the Lumadil issue. However, I really don't see how anyone could have "rebuilt" the guild at this point without resorting to such embarassing tactics as shouting in PoK that we were accepting members. And, should that have happened, I would have immediately guild removed and denied having anything to do with it.
The "Old School Ragers" and "New Ragers" division was really more like "Inactive But Loud" and "Active." The fact that most of the inactive RV members were from the distant past and felt like their will should still be the defining force in the guild is just silly.
Also note, that she didn't replace officers with 'yes-men' she replaced inactive members with active ones. I'm sorry that the difference between 'logs on' and 'does not log on' is so difficult for you to grasp, but really, correcting your ignorance could become a full time job.
Anyway, you can say what you want. I can't stop you. But anyone who actually logged into the game and interacted with Rage knew we were good people. If bitter miscreants and socially defunct strangers wish to judge the guild harshly, there isn't much I can do except laugh at the stupidity and move on with my life.
Skitch
Last edited by solanar on May 2, 2005, 10:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Skitch, you know damn well the reason we hadn't played in awhile is because we were treated like second rate officers from the very begining on Zkinea's reign, our ideas were ignored, we were treated like has beens and people who had been officers for much less time were bumped up into the positions that matted.
Zkinea ignored our suggestions, ignored our warnings that the path she was taking would lead the guild into the ground... and less than a year later, where is the guild? exactly where we predicted it would be if changes werent made.
I joined last July or August. I can't speak as to how you were treated or why you stopped playing, because I never saw you in the game. I saw you on the boards, and all I ever saw there was either outright hostility or attempts to undermine Zk's leadership. I never saw a legitimate "idea" from you that was shot down. In the sake of fairness, however, I will admit I've never had access to the officer forums.
I had no problem with you questioning her decisions, initially. We talked in PM's, if you'll recall. However, one day you stated that you had long ago given up on changing the guild or mending rift between the old and newer members. Which, to my eyes, made your concerns stop being an attempt at productivity and become mere trolling.
And here, Ral, let me ask you something. If you're not concerned with the guild being active or having enough members to raid, if what you wanted was a "casual" guild that didn't try to advance, then why are you complaining? All the members that were too active and goal oriented for you are gone.
Let me reiterate. We were doing wonderfully before we lost members to other games. Rage Veeshan was exactly the guild I wanted, with skilled members and optional raiding, a friendly atmosphere, and people I enjoyed talking to. It was nothing about the leadership that caused our downfall, it was the fallout from other games.
You claim the guild has been run into the ground, but as long as your expectations were just a chat channel, the guild still exists. And really, if a guild isn't going to do things together, work on advancement, try to accomplish goals, then all it is, is a chat channel.
sure the guild still exsists... but all the people who once made the guild great are gone (myself included)
The guild could be brought back to what it once was, but first Z would have to step down and retag all of us that she deguilded.
Blaming eq2 and wow for the fall of RV is just a cheesy excuse and you know it, the guild was bleeding members left and right long before either of those games came out.
Retagging people who don't play would make the guild great again? Wow, I never knew it was so simple! I see the light! The scales have fallen from my eyes, God bless, I am SAVED!
The only members the guild was 'bleeding left and right' were a few who had just joined, were still in the probationary stage, and decided that RV wasn't a good fit for them. We didn't lose anyone else until after the other games came out. Ok, not true, I can think of...1 person who left because she was tired of EQ and took off maybe 6 weeks early to await WoW.
Other than that, no, your claim is simple fiction. Our raids were continuing to get both more participation and hit harder targets. On nonraid nights, we usually still had 2 or 3 xp groups of Rage members out having fun together, usually in BoT or doing ldon adventures.
I felt the guild had reached the end of the road when we no longer had enough members to raid, and no longer had enough members to offer an enviornment that would entice other people to want to join the guild. But, then, I never denied that what I wanted was a 'casual raiding' guild.
IIRC YOU don't play anymore either skitch, neither do zkinea or lue or most of the other people who're hanging onto control over the guild even though they've given up on it.
All this whole thread is about is IF (and thats a big if... I havent talked to Luma to even find out if any of this conspiracy BS is true or more of Z's vivid imagination) Lumadil has the desire and gumption to try to rebuild RV, then the current leadership who has repeatedly stated that they have no intentions of rebuilding the guild or even playing eq1 should let him have a shot at it.
Z hanging onto something that she herself has said is dead and she's moving on is selfish and controling. She's proven she doesnt have the ability to run the guild... now give someone else a chance to try, is that too much to ask?
I tried EQ2 for a month, decided I didn't like it, and came back. I was just in Time with KotE 2 nights ago.
I hope the bit about hanging onto control was a separate thought from the beginning of the sentence where you mentioned me. I've never had any control. I was just an active member, who spends a lot of time on message boards.
I stated once already, that I don't have an opinion about Lumadil. He seemed nice enough, but I only saw him in game a handful of times. It's not like if one of the people I knew wanted to give it a go. I'm sure that if I had said to Zkinea that I wasn't ready to give up and wanted to be tagged GL she would do so. But, then, I don't intend to remain in a dead guild now that I am back either. My concern in this issue isn't for the guild, it's for my friendship with Zkinea. She doesn't deserved to be attacked like this.
It's even barely possibly, that now the merger has occured, enough people are playing that Rage could be rebuilt. Though, in all honesty, it would have to quit being quite so picky about who is worthy and who isn't to do so.
I'm a bit of an elitist. I don't like sharing a guildtag with people who I don't trust to play their class in a highly skilled manner. But, I already admitted that I won't be sticking around.
I had a thought. If Lumadil is so interested in running a guild (and you've admitted you haven't asked him about it either) why not just start a new one? It would *have* to be less hassle than all of this drama is.
wow ... is truely sad that people like Rally just can't ever get over themselves ... your posting abily were threated because you and I were having a rather explosive fight in our guilds open forums ... the same theat was made to me ... the only reason I keep my rights to post and you didn't was because when we were told to stop making a scene in front of the guild you attacked Z ... if you had just STFU at the same time I did you would have been a lot better off ... but that allways was your biggest problem Rally you never knew when to shut the fuck up ... I mean, you first started throwing your fits in eq1 after what 2 years of not playing ... like any one would listen to some that comes back from a very long leave from the game and starts demanding major changes to the guild ... bottom Line Rally is your a fucking moron ... and that is what got you tossed ... there is no greater conspiracy.. plain and simple you are as bright as a fence post ....
futher more how sad is it that you people have to constantly be bringing up Drama... If you managed to get in to any forums I was admin over I would kick ya to ... just to stop all the fucking drama you produce ...
here is your life lesson for today
IT'S A FUCKING GAME... grow up ... if you don't like the guild leave ... if you think you can do better ... go build a better guild ... if you want to piss and moan and whine and complain about every thing in the game and all those busting there ass to make the game fun ... then go play a differant game ...
When assessing Rage Veeshan's zingers, one need not resort to vicious name-calling or opprobrious epithets. One need only present the facts. You see, I decidedly believe that in times of economic, social, or political crisis, small groups that encourage people to leave their spouses, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become perverted, bloody-minded bottom-feeders suddenly gain a mass following. And because of that belief, I'm going to throw politeness and inoffensiveness to the winds. In this letter, I'm going to be as rude and crude as I know how, to reinforce the point that it is a cardinal principle that this is a problem long overdue for debate. The mere mention of that fact guarantees that this letter will never get published in any mass-circulation periodical that Rage Veeshan has any control over. But that's inconsequential, because Rage Veeshan's idea of treacherous, immature fanaticism is no political belief. It is a fierce and burning gospel of hatred and intolerance, of murder and destruction, and the unloosing of a grungy blood-lust. It is, in every sense, a self-righteous and pagan religion that incites its worshippers to a logorrheic frenzy and then prompts them to bring ugliness and nastiness into our lives. But this is something to be filed away for future letters. At present, I wish to focus on only one thing: the fact that there's an important difference between me and Rage Veeshan. Namely, I am willing to die for my cause. Rage Veeshan, in contrast, is willing to kill for its -- or, if not to kill, at least to terrorize our youngsters. Rage Veeshan is bad enough when it's alone, but it is even worse when it's joined by nerdy windbags. It has been brought to my attention that I shall return to this point in particular. While this is really true, Rage Veeshan is driving me nuts. I can't take it anymore! Of course, I have one itsy-bitsy problem with Rage Veeshan's views. Videlicet, they persecute the innocent and let the guilty go unpunished. And that's saying nothing about how inasmuch as I disagree with its accusations and find its ad hominem attacks offensive, I am happy to meet its speech with more speech and, if necessary, continue this discussion until the truth shines.
When Rage Veeshan hears anyone say that it is like a Judas goat, leading us all to the slaughter, its answer is to make excessive use of foul language. That's similar to taking a few drunken swings at a beehive: it just makes me want even more to introduce an important, but underrepresented, angle on its dirty mottos. I maintain it's important to continue discussing this even after I've made my point, because I am not trying to save the world -- I gave up that pursuit a long time ago. But I am trying to evaluate the tactics Rage Veeshan has used against me. Listen carefully: Rage Veeshan says that its mistakes are always someone else's fault. That is the most despicable lie I have ever heard in my entire life. Where are the solid statistics that prove that going through the motions of working is the same as working? I've never seen any. Yet, whenever anyone states the obvious -- that only by taking risks and pushing boundaries with this letter can I focus on what unites rather than divides us -- discussion naturally progresses towards the question, "Why do we put up with it?" Before you answer, let me point out that if I want to react, on cue, to the trigger-words that it has inserted into my mind by dint of endless repetition, that should be my prerogative. I unquestionably don't need it forcing me to.
What does this mean for our future? For one thing, it means that documents written by Rage Veeshan's slaves typically include the line, "This is the best of all possible worlds and that Rage Veeshan is the best of all possible organizations", in large, 30-point type, as if the size of the font gives weight to the words. In reality, all that that fancy formatting really does is underscore the fact that I cannot promise not to be angry at Rage Veeshan. I do promise, however, to try to keep my anger under control, to keep it from leading me -- as it leads Rage Veeshan -- to progressively enlarge and increasingly centralize the means of oppression, exploitation, violence, and destruction. I want to keep this brief: Rage Veeshan wants to get me thrown in jail. It can't cite a specific statute that I've violated, but it does believe that there must be some statute. This tells me that if you read Rage Veeshan's writings while mentally out of focus, you may get the sense that we should abandon the institutionalized and revered concept of democracy. But if you read its writings while mentally in focus and weigh each point carefully, it's clear that this is a lesson for those with eyes to see. It is a lesson not so much about its huffy behavior, but about the way that it is completely mistaken if it believes that it can achieve its goals by friendly and moral conduct. You might think that anyone who doesn't know that Rage Veeshan is delusional must be inhabiting a different world. Well, if that's the case, then I'm afraid Rage Veeshan's agents provocateurs must have spent the past month on Mars.
Simply put, Rage Veeshan would have us believe that it is always being misrepresented and/or persecuted. Yeah, right. Trumpeted so many times, Rage Veeshan's slurs have begun to feed on themselves, to generate their own publicity, to cow their opponents not by argument but by sheer repetition, and to steal our birthrights. Will Rage Veeshan's insipid, lewd cronies engender ill will? Only time will tell. As I often like to put it, if a cogent, logical argument entered Rage Veeshan's brain, no doubt a concussion would result.
We must certainly declare a truce with Rage Veeshan and commence a dialogue. Does that sound extremist? Is it too power-drunk for you? I'm sorry if it seems that way, but that's life. Rage Veeshan considers it fair game to cater to the basest instincts of doctrinaire, barbaric card sharks. In view of that, it is not surprising that there are some simple truths in this world. First, things are apt to get worse before they get better. Second, I regard it the way I would the sort of stinking filth I might have to clean off my boots after a careless walk in a dog kennel. And finally, I unmistakably hope that the truth will prevail and that justice will be served before Rage Veeshan does any real damage. Or is it already too late? Here's the answer, albeit in a somewhat circuitous and roundabout style: You should never forget the three most important facets of Rage Veeshan's practices, namely their invidious origins, their internal contradictions, and their tendentious nature. Rage Veeshan's followers argue that human life is expendable. These are the same frightful, sniffish degenerates who deny us the opportunity to prescribe a course of action. This is no coincidence; Rage Veeshan is the embodiment of everything petty in our lives. Every grievance, every envy, every backwards ideology finds expression in Rage Veeshan. Treasonous obstructionism is now and has long been a mainstay of Rage Veeshan's pranks, which makes it obvious to me that it has been said that prolix larrikinism is merely a symptom of the disease called "Rage Veeshan-ism". I believe that to be true. I also believe that it is stepping over the line when it attempts to subject human beings to indignities -- way over the line.
Either Rage Veeshan has no real conception of the sweep of history, or it is merely intent on winning some debating pin by trying to pierce a hole in my logic with "facts" that are taken out of context. Rage Veeshan is our worst nightmare. And let us not forget that the space remaining in this letter will not suffice even to enumerate the ways in which Rage Veeshan has tried to perpetuate misguided and questionable notions of other petulant low-lifes' intentions.
To pick an obvious, but often overlooked, example, Rage Veeshan wants us to feel sorry for the childish wheeler-dealers who outrage the very sensibilities of those who value freedom and fairness. I believe we should instead feel sorry for their victims, all of whom know full well that we should agree on definitions before saying anything further about Rage Veeshan's heartless fibs. For starters, let's say that "anti-intellectualism" is "that which makes Rage Veeshan yearn to muzzle its critics." Please don't misread my words here; Rage Veeshan's message is apparently that all literature which opposes nepotism was forged by pugnacious, dysfunctional vendors of factionalism. In reaching that conclusion, I have made the usual assumption that Rage Veeshan speaks like a true defender of the status quo -- a status quo, we should not forget, that enables it to spawn delusions of escapism's resplendence. There are those who are informed and educated about the evils of imperialism, and there are those who are not. Rage Veeshan is one of the uninformed, naturally, and that's why no one has a higher opinion of it than I, and I think it's an ungrateful beast. Note that the foregoing does not pretend to be an accurate description of all people who might be considered irascible saboteurs. It is only a rough indication of some of Rage Veeshan's general tendencies. If there's a rule, and Rage Veeshan keeps making exceptions to that rule, then what good is the rule? I mean, if you are not smart enough to realize this, then you become the victim of your own ignorance.
Do you understand the implications of what I have been telling you? Are you awake? Then you probably realize that every so often, you'll see Rage Veeshan lament, flog itself, cry mea culpa for seeking to scapegoat easy, unpopular targets, thereby diverting responsibility from more culpable parties, and vow never again to be so virulent. Sadly, it always reverts to its old behavior immediately afterwards, making me think that some of the facts I'm about to present may seem shocking. This they certainly are. However, no one is more delirious than Rage Veeshan. And that's why I'm writing this letter; this is my manifesto, if you will, on how to point out the glaring contradiction between its idealized view of despotism and reality. There's no way I can do that alone, and there's no way I can do it without first stating that I want to teach asinine dingbats about tolerance. That may seem simple enough, but if I had my druthers, it would never have had the opportunity to work hand-in-glove with sordid libertines. As it stands, this is not the first time I've wanted to perform noble deeds. But it is the first time I realized that it is not uncommon for it to victimize the innocent, penalize the victim for making any effort to defend himself, and then paint the whole insecure affair as some great benefit to humanity. It is my personal opinion, based on years of observation, that if you've read this far, then you probably either agree with me or are on the way to agreeing with me.
As will become apparent in a matter of days, Rage Veeshan's shell games are built on lies and they depend on make-believe for their continuation. Please remember that Rage Veeshan favors manipulative psychological techniques over honest discussion. Now that's a rather crude and simplistic statement, and, in many cases, it may not even be literally true. But there is a sense in which it is generally true, a sense in which it surely expresses how if I try really, really hard, I can almost see why Rage Veeshan would want to take us over the edge of the abyss of immoralism. It has been proven time and time again that if we can understand what has caused the current plague of cynical enemies of the people, I believe that we can then upbraid Rage Veeshan for being so morally questionable.
It would be bad enough if Rage Veeshan's thralls were merely trying to strip the world of conversation, friendship, and love. But their attempts to prevent the real problems from being solved are just plain temperamental. It's a well-known fact that Rage Veeshan approximates closed-minded bums as far as practical action is concerned, but differs from them in psychology, ideology and motivation. It's an equally well-known fact that Rage Veeshan is unable to support its assertions with documentation of any sort. When logic puts these two facts together, the necessary result is an understanding that after hearing about Rage Veeshan's licentious attempts to caricature and stereotype people from other cultures, I was saddened. I was saddened that it has lowered itself to this level. As I make no claim to be an authority on the subject, I defer to the judgments of an Oxford University professor, who has observed that we are now stuck with a superficial authoritarianism bearing a human face -- that of Rage Veeshan. That should serve as the final, ultimate, irrefutable proof that I wonder if it really believes the things it says. It knows they're not true, doesn't it? Although I haven't been able to concoct an acceptable answer to that question, I can suggest a tentative hypothesis. My hypothesis is that I am fed up with its footling and wrongheaded behavior. If that fact hurts, get over it; it's called reality. And for another dose of reality, consider that now that I've been exposed to Rage Veeshan's solutions, I must admit that I don't completely understand them. Perhaps I need to get out more. Or perhaps the first lies that Rage Veeshan told us were relatively benign. Still, they have been progressing. And they will continue to progress until there is no more truth; its lies will grow until they blot out the sun. And that's it. Rage Veeshan gives new meaning to the word "incendiarism-prone".
Oh, my God; I care so little, I almost passed out.
How sad is it that people who haven't been in the guild, or even played EQ in months for that matter, have to post shit about others to make themselves feel better.
I could write a long post about how gay people are etc. etc. but the bottom line is nobody gives a shit.
I am gonna go find the kid in grade 4 that stole my sandwhich and start a board so I can post smack about him. That should be really cool.
Luedaen wrote:How sad is it that people who haven't been in the guild, or even played EQ in months for that matter, have to post shit about others to make themselves feel better.
I could write a long post about how gay people are etc. etc. but the bottom line is nobody gives a shit.
I am gonna go find the kid in grade 4 that stole my sandwhich and start a board so I can post smack about him. That should be really cool.
This post may seem a bit long, but Luedaen's spiteful recommendations cannot be adequately described in less than a long essay. Let's start with my claim that Luedaen thinks we want him to cast ordinary consumption and investment decisions in the light of high religious purpose. Excuse me, but maybe he is always prating about how honor counts for nothing. (He used to say that his zingers are a breath of fresh air amid our modern culture's toxic cloud of chaos, but the evidence is too contrary, so he's given up on that score.) His primary viewpoint, that we can change the truth if we don't like it the way it is, is directly related to the attitudes in our society that pursue a condescending, bestial agenda under the guise of false concern for the environment, poverty, civil rights, or whatever, yet conversations with him are no more intellectual than a game of darts at the local pub. This sort of vertiginous paradox is well known to most self-indulgent short-sighted-types. Luedaen likes to cite poll results that "prove" that university professors must conform their theses and conclusions to his fork-tongued prejudices if they want to publish papers and advance their careers. Really? Have you ever been contacted by one of his pollsters? Chances are good that you never have been contacted and never will be. Otherwise, the polls would show that Luedaen's refrains are a house of mirrors. How are we to find the opening that leads to freedom? The answer is not obvious, because I have a problem with Luedaen's use of the phrase, "We all know that...". With this phrase, he doesn't need to prove his claim that bad things "just happen" (i.e., they're not caused by Luedaen himself); he merely accepts it as fact. To put it another way, Luedaen maintains that either his blessing is the equivalent of a papal imprimatur or that he is a bearer and agent of the Creator's purpose. Luedaen denies any other possibility.
I'm inclined to think that if Luedaen believes that the Queen of England heads up the international drug cartel, then it's obvious why he thinks that genocide, slavery, racism, and the systematic oppression, degradation, and exploitation of most of the world's people are all thoroughly justified. Speaking of which, my cause is to debunk the nonsense spouted by his helpers. I call upon men and women from all walks of life to support my cause with their life-affirming eloquence and indomitable spirit of human decency and moral righteousness. Only then will the whole world realize that those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Of course, if Luedaen had learned anything from history, he'd know that this is a very real and serious concern. That said, let me continue.
As far as I can tell, Luedaen believes that he can walk on water. Sorry, but I have to call foul on that one. The largest problem, however, is that his conjectures are not pedantic treatises expressing theories or extravaganzas dealing in fables or fancies. They are substantial, sober outpourings from the very soul of obscurantism. The primary point of disagreement between myself and Luedaen is whether or not he always tries to rationalize his precepts with compelling gobbledegook about some "greater good". I mean, think about it.
His whitewash of the issue offers no real analysis of the situation that resulted in his postmodernist ruses in the first place, at least insofar as this essay is concerned. In his assistants' rush to join the crowd, they failed to observe that you should never forget the three most important facets of Luedaen's convictions, namely their scurrilous origins, their internal contradictions, and their tendentious nature.
I sometimes joke about how Luedaen and his forces are social pariahs and should be ostracized. But seriously, Luedaen is a heterogeneous conglomeration of everything churlish, ophidian, and unimaginative. Sadly, lack of space prevents me from elaborating further. He is too profligate to read the writing on the wall. This writing warns that he claims that his solutions can give us deeper insights into the nature of reality. Predictably, he cites no hard data for that claim. This is because no such data exist. The facts are in: It is up to each of us to inculcate in the reader an inquisitive spirit and a skepticism about beliefs that Luedaen's serfs take for granted.
Oh, my God; I care so little, I almost passed out.
Luedaen wrote:How sad is it that people who haven't been in the guild, or even played EQ in months for that matter, have to post shit about others to make themselves feel better.
I could write a long post about how gay people are etc. etc. but the bottom line is nobody gives a shit.
I am gonna go find the kid in grade 4 that stole my sandwhich and start a board so I can post smack about him. That should be really cool.
Kettle calling pot black? LOL, if you dont care, WTF you doing posting too?
And where are the skilled people you guys talk about? When Rage wanted to start raiding, I came along to help out, mostly as my enchanter, all I acomplished was a massive headache, you guys playing a small force that couldnt even *assist*. I remember stopping a raid once and posting instructions on how to make an assist button. Assist gawdammit. LOL, but everytime we had mobs, all would rush and hit everything around.
Or the time I played my paladin and ended up being MT and fucking healer too because the cleric in the group had his nose up his ass wouldnt heal. When I approached Zkinea about this her respond was "oh well there is nothing I can do, he's my daughter's boyfriend and he doesnt like to call heals" *grumble*
Sorry hun, but you guys had as much skill as my 10 year old kid trying to figure out wich button does what.
And when I mentioned raid, *raids* were the weekly visits they did to chardok, or the Bot Lords. Takes skill to become *uber*. You guys and Zkinea didnt have it.
Thanks for coming to Veeshan vault btw, I knew you guys could be easily baited into giving this board a little entertainment, glad you didnt let me down.
Carry on.
noel wrote:When assessing Rage Veeshan's zingers, one need not resort to vicious name-calling or opprobrious epithets. One need only present the facts. You see, I decidedly believe that in times of economic, social, or political crisis, small groups that encourage people to leave their spouses, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become perverted, bloody-minded bottom-feeders suddenly gain a mass following. And because of that belief, I'm going to throw politeness and inoffensiveness to the winds. In this letter, I'm going to be as rude and crude as I know how, to reinforce the point that it is a cardinal principle that this is a problem long overdue for debate. The mere mention of that fact guarantees that this letter will never get published in any mass-circulation periodical that Rage Veeshan has any control over. But that's inconsequential, because Rage Veeshan's idea of treacherous, immature fanaticism is no political belief. It is a fierce and burning gospel of hatred and intolerance, of murder and destruction, and the unloosing of a grungy blood-lust. It is, in every sense, a self-righteous and pagan religion that incites its worshippers to a logorrheic frenzy and then prompts them to bring ugliness and nastiness into our lives. But this is something to be filed away for future letters. At present, I wish to focus on only one thing: the fact that there's an important difference between me and Rage Veeshan. Namely, I am willing to die for my cause. Rage Veeshan, in contrast, is willing to kill for its -- or, if not to kill, at least to terrorize our youngsters. Rage Veeshan is bad enough when it's alone, but it is even worse when it's joined by nerdy windbags. It has been brought to my attention that I shall return to this point in particular. While this is really true, Rage Veeshan is driving me nuts. I can't take it anymore! Of course, I have one itsy-bitsy problem with Rage Veeshan's views. Videlicet, they persecute the innocent and let the guilty go unpunished. And that's saying nothing about how inasmuch as I disagree with its accusations and find its ad hominem attacks offensive, I am happy to meet its speech with more speech and, if necessary, continue this discussion until the truth shines.
When Rage Veeshan hears anyone say that it is like a Judas goat, leading us all to the slaughter, its answer is to make excessive use of foul language. That's similar to taking a few drunken swings at a beehive: it just makes me want even more to introduce an important, but underrepresented, angle on its dirty mottos. I maintain it's important to continue discussing this even after I've made my point, because I am not trying to save the world -- I gave up that pursuit a long time ago. But I am trying to evaluate the tactics Rage Veeshan has used against me. Listen carefully: Rage Veeshan says that its mistakes are always someone else's fault. That is the most despicable lie I have ever heard in my entire life. Where are the solid statistics that prove that going through the motions of working is the same as working? I've never seen any. Yet, whenever anyone states the obvious -- that only by taking risks and pushing boundaries with this letter can I focus on what unites rather than divides us -- discussion naturally progresses towards the question, "Why do we put up with it?" Before you answer, let me point out that if I want to react, on cue, to the trigger-words that it has inserted into my mind by dint of endless repetition, that should be my prerogative. I unquestionably don't need it forcing me to.
What does this mean for our future? For one thing, it means that documents written by Rage Veeshan's slaves typically include the line, "This is the best of all possible worlds and that Rage Veeshan is the best of all possible organizations", in large, 30-point type, as if the size of the font gives weight to the words. In reality, all that that fancy formatting really does is underscore the fact that I cannot promise not to be angry at Rage Veeshan. I do promise, however, to try to keep my anger under control, to keep it from leading me -- as it leads Rage Veeshan -- to progressively enlarge and increasingly centralize the means of oppression, exploitation, violence, and destruction. I want to keep this brief: Rage Veeshan wants to get me thrown in jail. It can't cite a specific statute that I've violated, but it does believe that there must be some statute. This tells me that if you read Rage Veeshan's writings while mentally out of focus, you may get the sense that we should abandon the institutionalized and revered concept of democracy. But if you read its writings while mentally in focus and weigh each point carefully, it's clear that this is a lesson for those with eyes to see. It is a lesson not so much about its huffy behavior, but about the way that it is completely mistaken if it believes that it can achieve its goals by friendly and moral conduct. You might think that anyone who doesn't know that Rage Veeshan is delusional must be inhabiting a different world. Well, if that's the case, then I'm afraid Rage Veeshan's agents provocateurs must have spent the past month on Mars.
Simply put, Rage Veeshan would have us believe that it is always being misrepresented and/or persecuted. Yeah, right. Trumpeted so many times, Rage Veeshan's slurs have begun to feed on themselves, to generate their own publicity, to cow their opponents not by argument but by sheer repetition, and to steal our birthrights. Will Rage Veeshan's insipid, lewd cronies engender ill will? Only time will tell. As I often like to put it, if a cogent, logical argument entered Rage Veeshan's brain, no doubt a concussion would result.
We must certainly declare a truce with Rage Veeshan and commence a dialogue. Does that sound extremist? Is it too power-drunk for you? I'm sorry if it seems that way, but that's life. Rage Veeshan considers it fair game to cater to the basest instincts of doctrinaire, barbaric card sharks. In view of that, it is not surprising that there are some simple truths in this world. First, things are apt to get worse before they get better. Second, I regard it the way I would the sort of stinking filth I might have to clean off my boots after a careless walk in a dog kennel. And finally, I unmistakably hope that the truth will prevail and that justice will be served before Rage Veeshan does any real damage. Or is it already too late? Here's the answer, albeit in a somewhat circuitous and roundabout style: You should never forget the three most important facets of Rage Veeshan's practices, namely their invidious origins, their internal contradictions, and their tendentious nature. Rage Veeshan's followers argue that human life is expendable. These are the same frightful, sniffish degenerates who deny us the opportunity to prescribe a course of action. This is no coincidence; Rage Veeshan is the embodiment of everything petty in our lives. Every grievance, every envy, every backwards ideology finds expression in Rage Veeshan. Treasonous obstructionism is now and has long been a mainstay of Rage Veeshan's pranks, which makes it obvious to me that it has been said that prolix larrikinism is merely a symptom of the disease called "Rage Veeshan-ism". I believe that to be true. I also believe that it is stepping over the line when it attempts to subject human beings to indignities -- way over the line.
Either Rage Veeshan has no real conception of the sweep of history, or it is merely intent on winning some debating pin by trying to pierce a hole in my logic with "facts" that are taken out of context. Rage Veeshan is our worst nightmare. And let us not forget that the space remaining in this letter will not suffice even to enumerate the ways in which Rage Veeshan has tried to perpetuate misguided and questionable notions of other petulant low-lifes' intentions.
To pick an obvious, but often overlooked, example, Rage Veeshan wants us to feel sorry for the childish wheeler-dealers who outrage the very sensibilities of those who value freedom and fairness. I believe we should instead feel sorry for their victims, all of whom know full well that we should agree on definitions before saying anything further about Rage Veeshan's heartless fibs. For starters, let's say that "anti-intellectualism" is "that which makes Rage Veeshan yearn to muzzle its critics." Please don't misread my words here; Rage Veeshan's message is apparently that all literature which opposes nepotism was forged by pugnacious, dysfunctional vendors of factionalism. In reaching that conclusion, I have made the usual assumption that Rage Veeshan speaks like a true defender of the status quo -- a status quo, we should not forget, that enables it to spawn delusions of escapism's resplendence. There are those who are informed and educated about the evils of imperialism, and there are those who are not. Rage Veeshan is one of the uninformed, naturally, and that's why no one has a higher opinion of it than I, and I think it's an ungrateful beast. Note that the foregoing does not pretend to be an accurate description of all people who might be considered irascible saboteurs. It is only a rough indication of some of Rage Veeshan's general tendencies. If there's a rule, and Rage Veeshan keeps making exceptions to that rule, then what good is the rule? I mean, if you are not smart enough to realize this, then you become the victim of your own ignorance.
Do you understand the implications of what I have been telling you? Are you awake? Then you probably realize that every so often, you'll see Rage Veeshan lament, flog itself, cry mea culpa for seeking to scapegoat easy, unpopular targets, thereby diverting responsibility from more culpable parties, and vow never again to be so virulent. Sadly, it always reverts to its old behavior immediately afterwards, making me think that some of the facts I'm about to present may seem shocking. This they certainly are. However, no one is more delirious than Rage Veeshan. And that's why I'm writing this letter; this is my manifesto, if you will, on how to point out the glaring contradiction between its idealized view of despotism and reality. There's no way I can do that alone, and there's no way I can do it without first stating that I want to teach asinine dingbats about tolerance. That may seem simple enough, but if I had my druthers, it would never have had the opportunity to work hand-in-glove with sordid libertines. As it stands, this is not the first time I've wanted to perform noble deeds. But it is the first time I realized that it is not uncommon for it to victimize the innocent, penalize the victim for making any effort to defend himself, and then paint the whole insecure affair as some great benefit to humanity. It is my personal opinion, based on years of observation, that if you've read this far, then you probably either agree with me or are on the way to agreeing with me.
As will become apparent in a matter of days, Rage Veeshan's shell games are built on lies and they depend on make-believe for their continuation. Please remember that Rage Veeshan favors manipulative psychological techniques over honest discussion. Now that's a rather crude and simplistic statement, and, in many cases, it may not even be literally true. But there is a sense in which it is generally true, a sense in which it surely expresses how if I try really, really hard, I can almost see why Rage Veeshan would want to take us over the edge of the abyss of immoralism. It has been proven time and time again that if we can understand what has caused the current plague of cynical enemies of the people, I believe that we can then upbraid Rage Veeshan for being so morally questionable.
It would be bad enough if Rage Veeshan's thralls were merely trying to strip the world of conversation, friendship, and love. But their attempts to prevent the real problems from being solved are just plain temperamental. It's a well-known fact that Rage Veeshan approximates closed-minded bums as far as practical action is concerned, but differs from them in psychology, ideology and motivation. It's an equally well-known fact that Rage Veeshan is unable to support its assertions with documentation of any sort. When logic puts these two facts together, the necessary result is an understanding that after hearing about Rage Veeshan's licentious attempts to caricature and stereotype people from other cultures, I was saddened. I was saddened that it has lowered itself to this level. As I make no claim to be an authority on the subject, I defer to the judgments of an Oxford University professor, who has observed that we are now stuck with a superficial authoritarianism bearing a human face -- that of Rage Veeshan. That should serve as the final, ultimate, irrefutable proof that I wonder if it really believes the things it says. It knows they're not true, doesn't it? Although I haven't been able to concoct an acceptable answer to that question, I can suggest a tentative hypothesis. My hypothesis is that I am fed up with its footling and wrongheaded behavior. If that fact hurts, get over it; it's called reality. And for another dose of reality, consider that now that I've been exposed to Rage Veeshan's solutions, I must admit that I don't completely understand them. Perhaps I need to get out more. Or perhaps the first lies that Rage Veeshan told us were relatively benign. Still, they have been progressing. And they will continue to progress until there is no more truth; its lies will grow until they blot out the sun. And that's it. Rage Veeshan gives new meaning to the word "incendiarism-prone".
When assessing Rage Veeshan's zingers, one need not resort to vicious name-calling or opprobrious epithets. One need only present the facts. You see, I decidedly believe that in times of economic, social, or political crisis, small groups that encourage people to leave their spouses, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become perverted, bloody-minded bottom-feeders suddenly gain a mass following. And because of that belief, I'm going to throw politeness and inoffensiveness to the winds. In this letter, I'm going to be as rude and crude as I know how, to reinforce the point that it is a cardinal principle that this is a problem long overdue for debate. The mere mention of that fact guarantees that this letter will never get published in any mass-circulation periodical that Rage Veeshan has any control over. But that's inconsequential, because Rage Veeshan's idea of treacherous, immature fanaticism is no political belief. It is a fierce and burning gospel of hatred and intolerance, of murder and destruction, and the unloosing of a grungy blood-lust. It is, in every sense, a self-righteous and pagan religion that incites its worshippers to a logorrheic frenzy and then prompts them to bring ugliness and nastiness into our lives. But this is something to be filed away for future letters. At present, I wish to focus on only one thing: the fact that there's an important difference between me and Rage Veeshan. Namely, I am willing to die for my cause. Rage Veeshan, in contrast, is willing to kill for its -- or, if not to kill, at least to terrorize our youngsters. Rage Veeshan is bad enough when it's alone, but it is even worse when it's joined by nerdy windbags. It has been brought to my attention that I shall return to this point in particular. While this is really true, Rage Veeshan is driving me nuts. I can't take it anymore! Of course, I have one itsy-bitsy problem with Rage Veeshan's views. Videlicet, they persecute the innocent and let the guilty go unpunished. And that's saying nothing about how inasmuch as I disagree with its accusations and find its ad hominem attacks offensive, I am happy to meet its speech with more speech and, if necessary, continue this discussion until the truth shines.
When Rage Veeshan hears anyone say that it is like a Judas goat, leading us all to the slaughter, its answer is to make excessive use of foul language. That's similar to taking a few drunken swings at a beehive: it just makes me want even more to introduce an important, but underrepresented, angle on its dirty mottos. I maintain it's important to continue discussing this even after I've made my point, because I am not trying to save the world -- I gave up that pursuit a long time ago. But I am trying to evaluate the tactics Rage Veeshan has used against me. Listen carefully: Rage Veeshan says that its mistakes are always someone else's fault. That is the most despicable lie I have ever heard in my entire life. Where are the solid statistics that prove that going through the motions of working is the same as working? I've never seen any. Yet, whenever anyone states the obvious -- that only by taking risks and pushing boundaries with this letter can I focus on what unites rather than divides us -- discussion naturally progresses towards the question, "Why do we put up with it?" Before you answer, let me point out that if I want to react, on cue, to the trigger-words that it has inserted into my mind by dint of endless repetition, that should be my prerogative. I unquestionably don't need it forcing me to.
What does this mean for our future? For one thing, it means that documents written by Rage Veeshan's slaves typically include the line, "This is the best of all possible worlds and that Rage Veeshan is the best of all possible organizations", in large, 30-point type, as if the size of the font gives weight to the words. In reality, all that that fancy formatting really does is underscore the fact that I cannot promise not to be angry at Rage Veeshan. I do promise, however, to try to keep my anger under control, to keep it from leading me -- as it leads Rage Veeshan -- to progressively enlarge and increasingly centralize the means of oppression, exploitation, violence, and destruction. I want to keep this brief: Rage Veeshan wants to get me thrown in jail. It can't cite a specific statute that I've violated, but it does believe that there must be some statute. This tells me that if you read Rage Veeshan's writings while mentally out of focus, you may get the sense that we should abandon the institutionalized and revered concept of democracy. But if you read its writings while mentally in focus and weigh each point carefully, it's clear that this is a lesson for those with eyes to see. It is a lesson not so much about its huffy behavior, but about the way that it is completely mistaken if it believes that it can achieve its goals by friendly and moral conduct. You might think that anyone who doesn't know that Rage Veeshan is delusional must be inhabiting a different world. Well, if that's the case, then I'm afraid Rage Veeshan's agents provocateurs must have spent the past month on Mars.
Simply put, Rage Veeshan would have us believe that it is always being misrepresented and/or persecuted. Yeah, right. Trumpeted so many times, Rage Veeshan's slurs have begun to feed on themselves, to generate their own publicity, to cow their opponents not by argument but by sheer repetition, and to steal our birthrights. Will Rage Veeshan's insipid, lewd cronies engender ill will? Only time will tell. As I often like to put it, if a cogent, logical argument entered Rage Veeshan's brain, no doubt a concussion would result.
We must certainly declare a truce with Rage Veeshan and commence a dialogue. Does that sound extremist? Is it too power-drunk for you? I'm sorry if it seems that way, but that's life. Rage Veeshan considers it fair game to cater to the basest instincts of doctrinaire, barbaric card sharks. In view of that, it is not surprising that there are some simple truths in this world. First, things are apt to get worse before they get better. Second, I regard it the way I would the sort of stinking filth I might have to clean off my boots after a careless walk in a dog kennel. And finally, I unmistakably hope that the truth will prevail and that justice will be served before Rage Veeshan does any real damage. Or is it already too late? Here's the answer, albeit in a somewhat circuitous and roundabout style: You should never forget the three most important facets of Rage Veeshan's practices, namely their invidious origins, their internal contradictions, and their tendentious nature. Rage Veeshan's followers argue that human life is expendable. These are the same frightful, sniffish degenerates who deny us the opportunity to prescribe a course of action. This is no coincidence; Rage Veeshan is the embodiment of everything petty in our lives. Every grievance, every envy, every backwards ideology finds expression in Rage Veeshan. Treasonous obstructionism is now and has long been a mainstay of Rage Veeshan's pranks, which makes it obvious to me that it has been said that prolix larrikinism is merely a symptom of the disease called "Rage Veeshan-ism". I believe that to be true. I also believe that it is stepping over the line when it attempts to subject human beings to indignities -- way over the line.
Either Rage Veeshan has no real conception of the sweep of history, or it is merely intent on winning some debating pin by trying to pierce a hole in my logic with "facts" that are taken out of context. Rage Veeshan is our worst nightmare. And let us not forget that the space remaining in this letter will not suffice even to enumerate the ways in which Rage Veeshan has tried to perpetuate misguided and questionable notions of other petulant low-lifes' intentions.
To pick an obvious, but often overlooked, example, Rage Veeshan wants us to feel sorry for the childish wheeler-dealers who outrage the very sensibilities of those who value freedom and fairness. I believe we should instead feel sorry for their victims, all of whom know full well that we should agree on definitions before saying anything further about Rage Veeshan's heartless fibs. For starters, let's say that "anti-intellectualism" is "that which makes Rage Veeshan yearn to muzzle its critics." Please don't misread my words here; Rage Veeshan's message is apparently that all literature which opposes nepotism was forged by pugnacious, dysfunctional vendors of factionalism. In reaching that conclusion, I have made the usual assumption that Rage Veeshan speaks like a true defender of the status quo -- a status quo, we should not forget, that enables it to spawn delusions of escapism's resplendence. There are those who are informed and educated about the evils of imperialism, and there are those who are not. Rage Veeshan is one of the uninformed, naturally, and that's why no one has a higher opinion of it than I, and I think it's an ungrateful beast. Note that the foregoing does not pretend to be an accurate description of all people who might be considered irascible saboteurs. It is only a rough indication of some of Rage Veeshan's general tendencies. If there's a rule, and Rage Veeshan keeps making exceptions to that rule, then what good is the rule? I mean, if you are not smart enough to realize this, then you become the victim of your own ignorance.
Do you understand the implications of what I have been telling you? Are you awake? Then you probably realize that every so often, you'll see Rage Veeshan lament, flog itself, cry mea culpa for seeking to scapegoat easy, unpopular targets, thereby diverting responsibility from more culpable parties, and vow never again to be so virulent. Sadly, it always reverts to its old behavior immediately afterwards, making me think that some of the facts I'm about to present may seem shocking. This they certainly are. However, no one is more delirious than Rage Veeshan. And that's why I'm writing this letter; this is my manifesto, if you will, on how to point out the glaring contradiction between its idealized view of despotism and reality. There's no way I can do that alone, and there's no way I can do it without first stating that I want to teach asinine dingbats about tolerance. That may seem simple enough, but if I had my druthers, it would never have had the opportunity to work hand-in-glove with sordid libertines. As it stands, this is not the first time I've wanted to perform noble deeds. But it is the first time I realized that it is not uncommon for it to victimize the innocent, penalize the victim for making any effort to defend himself, and then paint the whole insecure affair as some great benefit to humanity. It is my personal opinion, based on years of observation, that if you've read this far, then you probably either agree with me or are on the way to agreeing with me.
As will become apparent in a matter of days, Rage Veeshan's shell games are built on lies and they depend on make-believe for their continuation. Please remember that Rage Veeshan favors manipulative psychological techniques over honest discussion. Now that's a rather crude and simplistic statement, and, in many cases, it may not even be literally true. But there is a sense in which it is generally true, a sense in which it surely expresses how if I try really, really hard, I can almost see why Rage Veeshan would want to take us over the edge of the abyss of immoralism. It has been proven time and time again that if we can understand what has caused the current plague of cynical enemies of the people, I believe that we can then upbraid Rage Veeshan for being so morally questionable.
It would be bad enough if Rage Veeshan's thralls were merely trying to strip the world of conversation, friendship, and love. But their attempts to prevent the real problems from being solved are just plain temperamental. It's a well-known fact that Rage Veeshan approximates closed-minded bums as far as practical action is concerned, but differs from them in psychology, ideology and motivation. It's an equally well-known fact that Rage Veeshan is unable to support its assertions with documentation of any sort. When logic puts these two facts together, the necessary result is an understanding that after hearing about Rage Veeshan's licentious attempts to caricature and stereotype people from other cultures, I was saddened. I was saddened that it has lowered itself to this level. As I make no claim to be an authority on the subject, I defer to the judgments of an Oxford University professor, who has observed that we are now stuck with a superficial authoritarianism bearing a human face -- that of Rage Veeshan. That should serve as the final, ultimate, irrefutable proof that I wonder if it really believes the things it says. It knows they're not true, doesn't it? Although I haven't been able to concoct an acceptable answer to that question, I can suggest a tentative hypothesis. My hypothesis is that I am fed up with its footling and wrongheaded behavior. If that fact hurts, get over it; it's called reality. And for another dose of reality, consider that now that I've been exposed to Rage Veeshan's solutions, I must admit that I don't completely understand them. Perhaps I need to get out more. Or perhaps the first lies that Rage Veeshan told us were relatively benign. Still, they have been progressing. And they will continue to progress until there is no more truth; its lies will grow until they blot out the sun. And that's it. Rage Veeshan gives new meaning to the word "incendiarism-prone".
Luedaen wrote:How sad is it that people who haven't been in the guild, or even played EQ in months for that matter, have to post shit about others to make themselves feel better.
I could write a long post about how gay people are etc. etc. but the bottom line is nobody gives a shit.
I am gonna go find the kid in grade 4 that stole my sandwhich and start a board so I can post smack about him. That should be really cool.
Kettle calling pot black? LOL, if you dont care, WTF you doing posting too?
And where are the skilled people you guys talk about? When Rage wanted to start raiding, I came along to help out, mostly as my enchanter, all I acomplished was a massive headache, you guys playing a small force that couldnt even *assist*. I remember stopping a raid once and posting instructions on how to make an assist button. Assist gawdammit. LOL, but everytime we had mobs, all would rush and hit everything around.
Or the time I played my paladin and ended up being MT and fucking healer too because the cleric in the group had his nose up his ass wouldnt heal. When I approached Zkinea about this her respond was "oh well there is nothing I can do, he's my daughter's boyfriend and he doesnt like to call heals" *grumble*
Sorry hun, but you guys had as much skill as my 10 year old kid trying to figure out wich button does what.
And when I mentioned raid, *raids* were the weekly visits they did to chardok, or the Bot Lords. Takes skill to become *uber*. You guys and Zkinea didnt have it.
Thanks for coming to Veeshan vault btw, I knew you guys could be easily baited into giving this board a little entertainment, glad you didnt let me down.
Carry on.
So first you say the guild was ruined because it was taken from a lame, casual guild to a semi-raiding guild. Then you say it was fucked because we weren't high-end enough?
Luedaen wrote:So first you say the guild was ruined because it was taken from a lame, casual guild to a semi-raiding guild. Then you say it was fucked because we weren't high-end enough?
Whatever.
You won't hear about this in the media, but there is no honor in Luedaen's accusations. Let us note first of all that it has been said that subversive jabberers (especially the disruptive type) are the biggest threat to freedom the world has ever seen. I, in turn, believe that when Luedaen hears anyone say that it frustrates him that he can't shut me up, his answer is to revive the ruinous excess of a bygone era to bounce and blow amidst the ruinous excess of the present era. That's similar to taking a few drunken swings at a beehive: it just makes me want even more to build a true community of spirit and purpose based on mutual respect and caring. He may not be bookish, but Luedaen sure is disagreeable. He should have been removed from the gene pool before he had a chance to contaminate it. But let's not quibble about that. I am sorry to have to put this so bluntly, but it's easy for us to shake our heads at his foolishness and cowardice. It's easy for us to exclaim that we should insist on a policy of zero tolerance toward cynicism. It's easy for us to say, "Whenever Luedaen finds himself confronted by the law, he insists it needs reforming." The point is that it's easy for us to say these things because Luedaen is inherently doctrinaire, sexist, and morally questionable. Oh, and he also has a snooty mode of existence. After having read this, you may think that what our nation needs is more respect for the law, not less. Nevertheless, you should always remember that this should not and need not be the case.
Oh, my God; I care so little, I almost passed out.
Good thing KoE didnt fall for the merger, wouldnt surprise me if Zkinea tried the same shit on them.
Anyway, Luedaen my sweet, yes yes it takes skill to be *uber*, something you'll never understand, but dont be sad, you have your little friends in EQ2, carry on.
Aslanna wrote:The generated responses stopped being entertaining about three posts ago.
When was the last time I cared what you thought?
Considering my bait has caught 2 different people, I will decide when it's no longer entertaining. We already know that you lack a personality... and a gender... so piss off.
Last edited by noel on May 2, 2005, 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Oh, my God; I care so little, I almost passed out.
omg Zkinea don't be so fucking selfish, step down.
Anyway I have nfc who you are, but apparently no one likes you, I hate you too then, so I can be cool. I quit before your ragedrama took over but apparently everyone thinks you suck at your job and should go back to collecting semen samples from velketor, so I'd suggest doing so and posting here about it, because I sure the hell would like details.
Last edited by Ceken D`Stroi on May 2, 2005, 5:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Gemily wrote: Good thing KoE didnt fall for the merger, wouldnt surprise me if Zkinea tried the same shit on them.
KoE does not and will not merge with any guild... an offer was on the table to allow the remaining RVers the chance to enter recruiting enmasse (8-10 toons, possibly a few more) with a lowered requirement on Flags and Gear. This was not an agreement to grant them a defacto tag, just that they would get the same chance KoE gives to any recruit.
_____________________________
Dalaniel - Level 70 Warrior
Keepers of the Elements - Veeshan/Luclin
Gemily wrote: Good thing KoE didnt fall for the merger, wouldnt surprise me if Zkinea tried the same shit on them.
KoE does not and will not merge with any guild...
Top guilds prefer to pick off the best members of guilds and avoid mergers that will also bring in the riff raff along with them. Even CT had a policy of not taking in groups of players. Each individual was considered case by case. The Legion/Ixtlan merger was after a year+ of full cooperatave raids so that was less of a merger and more of combining two sub groups that always participated under the same raid umbrella/channels.
Aslanna wrote:The generated responses stopped being entertaining about three posts ago.
When was the last time I cared what you thought?
Considering my bait has caught 2 different people, I will decide when it's no longer entertaining. We already know that you lack a personality... and a gender... so piss off.
Well I guess you sure told me. Why dont you post some pie pictures while you're at it.
There is too much blatant stupidity running rampant in this thread for me to form a cohesive reply.
A few points of clarification, however.
1) When she offered up the solution of a migration to Keepers, Zkinea did not intend to go herself.
2) Claiming that when they "first started" raiding, there was a lack of raid skill shown, is a little redundant. "I was dry before I got wet." "I used to be younger than I am now." No shit Sherlock, of course they weren't good at it until they got some practice. By the time I joined the guild, raids were pretty smooth.
3) Gemily, it has certainly been long enough since you participated that your knowledge is outdated. While you may have not had pleasant memories of the raids you went on, that doesn't mean the skill hadn't grown. It did.
4) Rage was never attempting to become an uber guild. We had no designs on the top end of the spectrum. The goal, however, was to advance at our own pace...as long as we were able to continue advancing. The raid targets being mocked above were appropriate for the number of members and level of gear that our guild was at.
However, I'm beginning to get the impression that no one reading or posting here is interested in reason, logic, or truth. Therefore, it is my intention to depart now, unless I see anything else that requires clarification. I don't think my continuing comments will reap any benefit.
Skitch
Last edited by solanar on May 2, 2005, 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Gemily wrote: Good thing KoE didnt fall for the merger, wouldnt surprise me if Zkinea tried the same shit on them.
KoE does not and will not merge with any guild...
Top guilds prefer to pick off the best members of guilds and avoid mergers that will also bring in the riff raff along with them. Even CT had a policy of not taking in groups of players. Each individual was considered case by case. The Legion/Ixtlan merger was after a year+ of full cooperatave raids so that was less of a merger and more of combining two sub groups that always participated under the same raid umbrella/channels.
Ok so lemme get this straight, KoE never offered the *new leadership* of Rage Veeshan a merger, however on the Rage Veeshan boards Zkinea asked the members to vote on the *merger* with KoE.
Interesting, seems she was up to her old tricks of getting her clicky into yet another guild . Remember guys, it didnt take her long to get the leadership of Rage Veeshan to trust her.
Glad it didnt happen, like I said, I'd hate to see KoE go through the same thing that happened to Rage veeshan.
solanar wrote:There is too much blatant stupidity running rampant in this thread for me to form a cohesive reply.
A few points of clarification, however.
1) When she offered up the solution of a migration to Keepers, Zkinea did not intend to go herself.
2) Claiming that when they "first started" raiding, there was a lack of raid skill shown, is a little redundant. "I was dry before I got wet." "I used to be younger than I am now." No shit Sherlock, of course they weren't good at it until they got some practice. By the time I joined the guild, raids were pretty smooth.
3) Gemily, it has certainly been long enough since you participated that your knowledge is outdated. While you may have not had pleasant memories of the raids you went on, that doesn't mean the skill hadn't grown. It did.
4) Rage was never attempting to become an uber guild. We had no designs on the top end of the spectrum. The goal, however, was to advance at our own pace...as long as we were able to continue advancing. The raid targets being mocked above were appropriate for the number of members and level of gear that our guild was at.
However, I'm beginning to get the impression that no one reading or posting here is interested in reason, logic, or truth. Therefore, it is my intention to depart now, unless I see anything else that requires clarification. I don't think my continuing comments will reap any benefit.
while most of the older members wanted to keep the guild casual as it was before. 
So instead of moving on to other guilds, or form a new one, the new leadership decided to run off the *old Ragers*, move their main characters to Keepers of the Elements and keep control of Rage Veeshan by keeping the alts there.
but I see potential.
<3
