CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Spang »

U.S. drones kill kids in the Middle East on a regular basis, with no 24/7 news coverage or presidential tears shed.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Leonaerd »

They don't count. Because turbans.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by kyoukan »

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:
Canelek wrote:Actually, he (Kilmoll) is correct there, terminology-wise.

To CCP programs...at least in Oregon, training is required prior to getting permit. A background check is, of course, taken as well.

As for firearm prohibition, it would certainly be a tall order in the states. I think we are still expecting another revolution or something--perhaps that is why we have our very own Tea Party now. It would be a hoot to go back to 50's-era switchblade-disco, however.


Why feed that sad little fuck? She is in denial about what I know/do so fuck her.

To the point about the carry programs....

My biggest problem with the carry programs (and many of the NRA people who think we should all have the right to carry without any licensing) is that the lack of training by people and their general skill levels are just HORRENDOUS.

In days of old, people HAD to use firearms for food and defense from wild animals, so those skills were actually being used and improved. Today, most people only know about firearms from what they see on TV or in movies (most of which is so horrendously unrealistic that it is almost astounding). I would actually like to see a federal standard that people need to acquire and a realistic standard set of laws for concealed carry. I know that is way outside the NRA viewpoint, but frankly people need to have the brains and ability to not be a liability.

I can say all that honestly, having seen the high and low ends of shooters just in the local area. I have shot some of the IDPA matches down here and I have also had literally hundreds of people come through me for CCW classes. As far as the IDPA macthes went, I was pretty much middle of the pack in all of the ones I did. Granted I was using my standard carry gear as opposed to having the specialized competition type gear those guys were using, but it was still clear that with equal gear that it might have been a bit closer even though I would still not be beating them. Some of those guys were GOOD.

Now take that and compare it to the standard person coming through the classes....where i would say 1 or 2 of the hundreds that I have seen could even approach my level. That 9" plate is not moving at all and people struggle to hit it at a 70% clip. Ohio only puts you on the range for 2 hours and that is honestly not enough time....especially when you have to spend 8 hours teachign people who to clean their gun and other ridiculous shit like what the different parts of ammunition is.

Training and practice are the 2 most important things anyone who owns a gun needs to do and we make it tough for people to do that. We make it easy to own, but hard to train. Watch more TV and you will know how not to do it.
I agree. They should know how to index under high stress situations.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Leonaerd »

[Show]
Image
Indexed in 2 minutes flat with my bear hands. WITH CLAWS. Take that mall shooters.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

kyoukan wrote:
I agree. They should know how to index under high stress situations.

You should do more google searches.

Indexing is not something you "know how to do". It is something you do automatically and without thought through training and practice. Feel free to continue trolling this thread to make yourself appear woefully inadequate.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Siji wrote:
Winnow wrote:
Zaelath wrote:
Siji wrote:As was said above, things in this country (and likely around the world) are only going to get worse over time.
Yeah, except realistically it's limited to the US.
Except for the killing spree that ended 77 lives in Europe that includes car bombs, shootings where 1 in 4 Norwegians knew someone that was killed that day. If were going by body count, that has to add up to a few mass killings in the states.
The US is better at sensationalizing our tragedies and ignoring those of other countries. If the US had to deal with what happens in any number of other countries, 20 children in kindergarten would be considered a good day.

Even though I am not going to say that this one was sensationalized being that it may have been the most tragic and evil thing that has happened since I have been alive, it appears you are right according to some actual data.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/150464/ameri ... ening.aspx
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Zaelath »

Winnow wrote:
Zaelath wrote:
Siji wrote:As was said above, things in this country (and likely around the world) are only going to get worse over time.
Yeah, except realistically it's limited to the US.

Except for the killing spree that ended 77 lives in Europe that includes car bombs, shootings where 1 in 4 Norwegians knew someone that was killed that day. If were going by body count, that has to add up to a few mass killings in the states.
That was addressed in the rest of the post you didn't quote, carry on.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by kyoukan »

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:
kyoukan wrote:
I agree. They should know how to index under high stress situations.

You should do more google searches.

Indexing is not something you "know how to do". It is something you do automatically and without thought through training and practice. Feel free to continue trolling this thread to make yourself appear woefully inadequate.
Thanks for teaching me all about indexing in high stress situations, Wyatt Earp! I bet the NRA calls you for hot tips about shooting things, because you're up on all the coolest jargon.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Anytime troll.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Winnow »

If you want kyoukan to understand, compare it to spearing a fish.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Siji »

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:
Siji wrote:
Winnow wrote:
Zaelath wrote:
Siji wrote:As was said above, things in this country (and likely around the world) are only going to get worse over time.
Yeah, except realistically it's limited to the US.
Except for the killing spree that ended 77 lives in Europe that includes car bombs, shootings where 1 in 4 Norwegians knew someone that was killed that day. If were going by body count, that has to add up to a few mass killings in the states.
The US is better at sensationalizing our tragedies and ignoring those of other countries. If the US had to deal with what happens in any number of other countries, 20 children in kindergarten would be considered a good day.

Even though I am not going to say that this one was sensationalized being that it may have been the most tragic and evil thing that has happened since I have been alive, it appears you are right according to some actual data.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/150464/ameri ... ening.aspx
I wouldn't disagree on the severity of this situation. But when you've got reporters fighting over who can get the interview with the 5 year olds minutes after then survived this incident, and when it's 24x7 non-stop coverage on every station, site, etc it's over the top. From several articles that have been put out the town has turned into the pit of hell with all of the media camped out there bothering everyone.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Aabidano »

"Life is what happens while you're making plans for later."
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Zaelath »

I often think about guns while I'm "cleaning my piece".
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Hesten »

Whee, the NRA finally reacted...and despite it being absolutely idiotic, I don't think their reaction came as a surprise:

http://news.yahoo.com/nra-calls-armed-p ... 51713.html
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Another tard claiming it is idiotic to put an officer in each school....yay.


So your solution is "assault weapon" ban will fix it all again! Except that it didn't fix anything the first time....



Let me ask you this: Why do we provide a fucking motorcade of officers for public officials, rock stars, athletes, etc and that is fine.....but we can't do that for our kids because that is idiotic and reckless?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

My high school always had a cop and several security guards. It sucked at the time, cause we got our asses kicked by them several times, but they stopped a lot of shit from happening. I have no problem with that
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Leonaerd »

cause we got our asses kicked by them several times
Really?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Fairweather Pure »

Better get armed guards in movie theaters too.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Aslanna »

Weren't Republicans crying about big government? Now they want to put police in every school? Who is going to pay for that?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

Leonaerd wrote:
cause we got our asses kicked by them several times
Really?
Yeah, they weren't any more gentle than they would be elsewhere. But with fights occurring multiple times a day and someone getting thrown down a flight of stairs not being uncommon, I don't blame them.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Aslanna wrote:Weren't Republicans crying about big government? Now they want to put police in every school? Who is going to pay for that?

You can't be that stupid....ok maybe you can be.

I may be alone amongst the gun people, but I would not oppose a small tax on guns and ammunition that would go towards protecting our schools from deranged idiots. If they proposed something like a 1% federal surcharge on firearms and ammo and every cent of that was going towards training, arming, and paying for a dedicated resource I would vote for the guy who put the law to paper.

That STILL leaves us in the position of individuals being responsible and reporting the headcases to authorities and either getting them help or removing them from the general population. No ban on the tools is ever going to do anything to eliminate the people who are intent on doing harm.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Winnow »

Standard school issue uniforms for kids should include Kevlar flac jackets, maybe helmets too although most of these killers are smart and would probably shoot them in the face. I'm thinking implant a small explosive in each kids' skull so when a shooter goes nuts, the first kid he kills would explode and take out the shooter*, with only a few extra casualties.




*still working on a solution sniper scenarios
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Spang »

Columbine had an armed guard. How'd that turn out?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Boogahz »

weren't the Columbine guards camping the smoking area?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Aslanna »

Do you honestly think a cop there will solve anything? The smart gun toting crazy person will just take him out first before the guy even knows what happened.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Winnow »

Why don't these shooters get silencers? I know next to nothing about guns. Is it hard to get a silencer? I'd imagine the body count would be much higher if you could be a little quieter about it.


I did a quick google and found this right away:

http://www.impactguns.com/silencers.aspx

I think we've actually been lucky. There have been very few truly prepared kooks. That guy in Norway was well prepared but most of the U.S. shooters haven't been. Columbine was thought out. I guess maybe The Batman/Joker guy sort of had things planned out but not really well.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Spang »

Approximately 50 children have been killed by guns in the United States since the Sandy Hook incident.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Winnow »

Did any of the guns have silencers that killed them?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Silencers do not silence. Everyone believes what they see coming from Hollywood. Silencers will drop the decibel level of a firearm to non-damaging levels, but they are still very loud. You would have zero issues hearing the report of a "silenced" firearm if you were standing in opposing end zones of a football field.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Hesten »

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:Another tard claiming it is idiotic to put an officer in each school....yay.

So your solution is "assault weapon" ban will fix it all again! Except that it didn't fix anything the first time....

Let me ask you this: Why do we provide a fucking motorcade of officers for public officials, rock stars, athletes, etc and that is fine.....but we can't do that for our kids because that is idiotic and reckless?
Seriously, it would help HOW? How big is the average school, how many guards would you need to effectively cover it, and have an eye on all students? You would more or less need a guard in every bloody room.
And THEN assume that a vigilant and prepared school shooters wont possibly react faster than a bored out of his skull school guard during a math class.

And it HAS been done, Columbine had a guard, and see how much that helped.

And let say that if by some miracle, all school shooters drop their plans due to a bored guard snoozing in a corner of the room (again assuming you manage to get your nearly bancrupt country to foot the ENORMOUS bill to put guards in every room of every school in the country), what about civil liberties?
I could have sworn that most of the gun nuts are of the "they can pry my guns from my cold dead fingers", "its in the constitution so we can defend ourselves against a CORRUPT government" type of people. Are you at the same time willing to let the government that are one of the reasons for you HAVING GUNS spend MASSIVE tax money you do NOT want to pay, to massively increase GOVERNMENT OVERSIGHT and LAW ENFORCEMENT OVERSIGHT, having every schoolkid in the country watched, by a government that almost half the country believe are close to being the Antichrist, due to the amazing hate between the parties (this goes no matter WHICH of the two parties are in charge)?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Winnow »

Spang wrote:Approximately 50 children have been killed by guns in the United States since the Sandy Hook incident.

I have no idea where Spang pulled this figure from and am not going to research it. If that stat is true, then Sandy Hook is just a little bump on the kill chart and is only noticeable because of the number killed on one location. That would mean about 2,600 kids a year in the US are killed by guns. 26 is just 1%. It's nothing. It's three times the number killed on a normal day. Big deal. Does anyone celebrate a day when no kids are killed by guns? No. They only make note of the bad days.

Pump a little more money into mental health research so third worlder's like kyoukan feel like we care about what they think so they don't try and shoot us while we plunder their country's resources, and move on.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Fairweather Pure »

All rights have costs. Society has to judge those costs worth the right. If somebody speaks freely, the worst thing that happens is somebody takes offense. And freedom of speech does not include speech that is intended and likely to incite imminent violence. So even speech is limited to prevent violence. Gun rights arguments are, in a word, extreme. They insist that society tolerate the deaths of its members as its cost. It's time for that to change, because the request is extreme and we should reject it.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Spang »

The United States has more guns (~300 million), the loosest gun laws, and the most gun-related deaths than any other developed country.

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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

I'm all for much stricter gun control, but not only is banning guns not a solution, it won't work. Give me one example of a successful prohibition/ban in this country.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Spang »

Instead of banning guns, we need to change hearts and minds. It won't happen overnight, but overtime more and more people will find guns to be unnecessary, like smoking cigarettes, eating animals and using plastic bags at the grocery store.

Also, the frontpage of today's New York Post (a conservative rag if there ever was one):
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Zaelath »

Kilmoll the Sexy wrote:Silencers do not silence. Everyone believes what they see coming from Hollywood. Silencers will drop the decibel level of a firearm to non-damaging levels, but they are still very loud. You would have zero issues hearing the report of a "silenced" firearm if you were standing in opposing end zones of a football field.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by kyoukan »

Funkmasterr wrote:I'm all for much stricter gun control, but not only is banning guns not a solution, it won't work. Give me one example of a successful prohibition/ban in this country.
it's not about getting rid of all guns so no gun crimes ever happen again. it's about reducing people's easy access to firearms. perhaps if the newtown shooter didn't have a house full of loaded weapons laying around he wouldn't have gathered them all up and shot up an elementary school when he went into his psychotic episode. maybe he would have just torn his clothes off and ran around until a couple of cops tased him.

most of the recent mass shootings have been done with legally obtained weapons capable of killing scores of people in a really short period of time.

sure, taking away easy access to high powered weapons may finally have to make kilmoll come to terms with the fact he has a small dick and a failed life, but better now than on the death bed. it's a small price to pay if those crazy yankees stop gunning down their kids.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

Like I said, I'm all for much stricter gun control. I'm not sure how much it would do to prevent shit like this but it needs to happen anyhow. Especially the gun show loopholes.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by kyoukan »

Unless you think Americans are culturally wired to kill large amounts of people on rampages, I can't see why it wouldn't help. Countries with stricter gun laws have exponentially lower instances of this kind of thing per capita, and dramatically less gun crime in general. Most gun crimes are caused by legally purchased weapons, and a large portion of the ones that are done with illegal weapons were weapons that were at one point legally purchased and then stolen.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

Well, while I have no facts to support my feeling with, I do believe Americans are fucked up mentally and socially more than most other countries do to the way things have been in this country over the last hundred years or so. Prescription drug problems, mental health, education, and all the various ways our government shits on the people are all things are all things that would need to be addressed in conjunction with the change in gun laws to really have a lasting impact. Gangs and shit get guns that were once purchased legally because it's so pathetically easy, but were that ease of access taken away, there are many illegal channels that could and would be used much more.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Zaelath »

Funkmasterr wrote:Well, while I have no facts to support my feeling with, I do believe Americans are fucked up mentally and socially more than most other countries do to the way things have been in this country over the last hundred years or so. Prescription drug problems, mental health, education, and all the various ways our government shits on the people are all things are all things that would need to be addressed in conjunction with the change in gun laws to really have a lasting impact. Gangs and shit get guns that were once purchased legally because it's so pathetically easy, but were that ease of access taken away, there are many illegal channels that could and would be used much more.
The drug/hooker logic that says you can't stop supply so why bother doesn't work as well with guns because they're not consumables. You not only have to hide the purchase, you have to hide possession forever.

I would have thought you've already proved a well armed society is not a polite society, so all that's left is elephant repellent arguments and stories about heroes that "scared people into suiciding by being seen cowering with a weapon".
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Fairweather Pure »

From today's news it sounds like firefighters should have guns too, or at the very least armed guards.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by kyoukan »

they were just exercising their second amendment rights by defending their homes from the government.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Fairweather Pure wrote:From today's news it sounds like firefighters should have guns too, or at the very least armed guards.

Or we could stop pretending that violent felons will obey laws.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Fairweather Pure »

Pretending seems to be the NRA's full time job. Same for gun nuts. The entire reasoning behind owning assualt rifles and concealed weapons is based around a 12yr old's shootout fantasies.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Stick your head back in the sand or actually do some research to find out how often armed people actually prevent themselves from being victims. Seriously, for people who think they are intelligent, you are the most uneducated group of people on subjects like this. Stop reading CNN and Huffington post and actually go look up non-slanted statistics. I am not talking NRA either...you can find a lot of info about these things if you really want, but you would rather spout the same tired lies that you are told by the most leftist organizations in the US.

Did you know that the statistics used for "children" in firearm deaths in the US actually include the ages of 19-24? Probably not since Huff Post doesn't put that in print.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

Assault rifles aren't personal defense weapons you delusional twat. If you're going to argue, take your own advice and pull your head out of the sand. And by sand, I mean your ass.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

Did you know that 18 out of 20 children will grow up to be more intelligent than a member of the NRA? Trufax.
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Kilmoll the Sexy »

Funkmasterr wrote:Assault rifles aren't personal defense weapons you delusional twat. If you're going to argue, take your own advice and pull your head out of the sand. And by sand, I mean your ass.

Where exactly do you get your information? Where is the definition of "personal defense weapon" at that I can look it up and see that they don't qualify?
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Re: CT Shooting: 26 dead - 20 kindergarten kids 6 adults

Post by Funkmasterr »

It's ridiculous you'd even argue the point. You can defend yourself with a pistol/shotgun. What defense situation that you're going to encounter at your residence will require an assault rifle? The entire Taliban regime coming for you? The zombie apocalypse?
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