Dream Team loses to Puerto Rico

Kguku · Post by **Kguku** » August 15, 2004, 4:33 pm

92-73, too funny!

http://www.tsn.ca/olympics/news_story.asp?id=94987

I love the stunned looks on their faces in that picture.

It's so satisfying seeing a bunch of pompous prima donnas getting their asses handed to them.

Crav · Post by **Crav** » August 15, 2004, 4:58 pm

Well the game showed that he U.S. can't hit threes to beat the zone defense. It might be emblematic of the weakness of U.S. basketball development or just shows how many of the U.S. top shooters either turned down the invitation or who were simply not invited. Either way the U.S. coaches are going to have to figure out a way to beat the zone without great shooters, if any one can do it, Larry Brown, Roy Williams and Greg Popovich can do it. It's just a matter of whether the players will listen to them or not.

Oh and I found it rather humorous to see all the Canadians posting on the comment section, when Canada didn't even make it to the Olympics in basketball and in point of fact it was a lose to the very same Puerto Rico that kept them out.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » August 15, 2004, 5:05 pm

I could not agree more. I am always happy to see amateur American athletes succeed at the Olymics, but I just don't give a rat's ass about basketball in general, much less the jackass NBA players. Let the amateurs play in the Olympics (yes, I know other countries use pro players). Win or lose, at least you give some guys a chance to compete even though they don't own 4 yachts and complain about needing a bigger salary for a 5th.

I do not feel that way about pros playing on the Olympic US or Canada hockey teams though....because hockey is fucking cool!

Also, I think the hockey players in Noth America actually understand the honor that it is to represent their country.

These past few years, the NBA has fallen from my interest to the level of Tennis and Figure Skating. Welcome to your new status bitches!

Kguku · Post by **Kguku** » August 15, 2004, 5:06 pm

Canada has never been strong in basketball, and does not submit a team full of NBA pro's. As for Canadians commenting on that article, it could be because TSN.CA is a CANADIAN broadcaster.

Now if you want to get in to mockery of who did not make what where, I could point out the fact that the USA did not qualify for Baseball, which was, when I last looked, your national past time. I think that would be akin to Canada not qualifying for hockey.

The amusement is the fact that the USA is the only team to submit an entire roster of professional players, where as other teams, such as Canada, rely heavily on amateur talent.

The expectation of a team with a high caliber of talent is to do better than what they put forth on the court there.

miir · Post by **miir** » August 15, 2004, 5:26 pm

Oh and I found it rather humorous to see all the Canadians posting on the comment section, when Canada didn't even make it to the Olympics in basketball and in point of fact it was a lose to the very same Puerto Rico that kept them out.

How many NBA allstars are on the Canadian basketball team?

Keverian FireCry · Post by **Keverian FireCry** » August 15, 2004, 5:46 pm

Now if you want to get in to mockery of who did not make what where, I could point out the fact that the USA did not qualify for Baseball, which was, when I last looked, your national past time. I think that would be akin to Canada not qualifying for hockey.

Ehhh, well think about who makes up a huge part of the MLB; Puerto Ricans, Dominicans, Cubans, Haitians, Japanese, Koreans, etc. So really, our "national" past time has been dominated by foreign players, and I'm willing to bet that the % of foreign players in the MLB will continue to rise.

p.s. I'm not familiar with our olympic baseball team though...did it even have our pros?

Crav · Post by **Crav** » August 15, 2004, 5:52 pm

I think you mean that other countries aren't fielding teams full of NBA talent, which is much different from saying that they are not fielding a team full of professional players. Most of the countries have their own professional leagues that are closer in rules to the international game then the NBA. Now I'm not saying that we didn't suck because we sure as hell did. I gave my opinion on why we sucked in the post.

My statement of finding Canadians posting humorous wasn't because they where posting, which would be silly since as the title on the left shows that the site is "Canada's Sports Leader". What I found humorous was trash talking when your team isn't even participating. Again that is my own subjective view of funny.

Edit: Never mind on the ignore issue, just copy pasted the link for putting someone on ignore and added a remove command on to the string.

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » August 15, 2004, 5:57 pm

Keverian FireCry wrote:
Now if you want to get in to mockery of who did not make what where, I could point out the fact that the USA did not qualify for Baseball, which was, when I last looked, your national past time. I think that would be akin to Canada not qualifying for hockey.
Ehhh, well think about who makes up a huge part of the MLB. Puerto Ricans, Dominicans, Haitians, Japanese. So really, our "national past time" is dominated by people from other countries.

I'm not familiar with our olympic baseball team though...did it even have our pros?

Nope.

But many current pros had played on past Olympic teams as amateurs.

I am quite surprised that we did not qualify--I had not been paying much attention. As far as baseball in the US, we do indeed have folks from all over that come here to live and play baseball! I love that about the game.

Stalker Vacio · Post by **Stalker Vacio** » August 15, 2004, 7:55 pm

too fuckin funny. I hope they get there shit together...

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » August 15, 2004, 8:06 pm

I hope the basketball team fails. Having NBA players in the Olympics is a mockery to every amateur athlete that works all year, every year to have the chance to compete. Those idiots on the Olympic committee, or whoever else creates policy made a huge mistake letting NBA players in. Didn't they realize what miscreants the NBA players are compared even with other professional athletes? I mean really DUH!

I hope they lose and some sanity is restored by banning pro athletes from the Summer Olympics...not going to happen, but it is a nice thought.

Truant · Post by **Truant** » August 15, 2004, 9:32 pm

Kguku wrote:Canada has never been strong in basketball, and does not submit a team full of NBA pro's. As for Canadians commenting on that article, it could be because TSN.CA is a CANADIAN broadcaster.

Now if you want to get in to mockery of who did not make what where, I could point out the fact that the USA did not qualify for Baseball, which was, when I last looked, your national past time. I think that would be akin to Canada not qualifying for hockey.

The amusement is the fact that the USA is the only team to submit an entire roster of professional players, where as other teams, such as Canada, rely heavily on amateur talent.

The expectation of a team with a high caliber of talent is to do better than what they put forth on the court there.

Now, I don't want to talk about basketball. In fact, I'm glad the US lost. And they lost exactly how I expected they would. Because they didn't even play.

But you brought up baseball. And the gloves are now off.

The US has never, to the best of my knowledge, sent pro's to the olympic baseball team. The Olympic summer games takes place in the middle of baseball season, fairly soon before playoff time, and the MLB does not pause for the olympics. The US sends it's college baseball players every year to the olympics, many of which never go on to play pro.

There is a big article on this exact subject over on ESPN, in which the clusterfuck that is the Olympics is sorted out so the public can understand why shit stinks.

There are 8 teams for the Olympic baseball tournament. In all of North and South America, there are only 2 teams allowed. Almost every single baseball playing country in the world is in North and South America, excepting the Asiatic nations of course. That means, out of Canada, US, Dominican Republic, Cuba, Columbia, etc, etc etc. Only 2 teams will compete. Wtf is that?

Pretty much everyone out there has Cuba picked to win the whole thing, so you can guarantee they have a spot to compete every 4 years, so that leaves one spot for everyone else.

Now that I'm done explaining that. No, America not qualifying for baseball is not akin to Canada not qualifying for hockey. Because America has never used pro's for baseball, while pro's compete every olympics in hockey, even for Canada.

On a side, the MLB is trying to organize a World Cup for baseball, in which all baseball playing nations can send their all-star pro teams to compete against the world's best. I'm very excited about that possibility. I would love to see our pro's against the world's best, I think it would be an exciting series of games.

Stalker Vacio · Post by **Stalker Vacio** » August 15, 2004, 9:40 pm

too fuckin funny. I hope they get there shit together...

Kguku · Post by **Kguku** » August 15, 2004, 9:54 pm

Truant wrote:Now that I'm done explaining that. No, America not qualifying for baseball is not akin to Canada not qualifying for hockey. Because America has never used pro's for baseball, while pro's compete every olympics in hockey, even for Canada.

Again, it is very much akin to that. NHL players did not join the ranks of playing in the Winter Olympics until Nagano in 98 (I personally am not a fan of the NHL Pros playing in the games). That being said, the qualification tournaments (if you need to go because of a poor showing during the last Olympics) is held DURING the NHL season, and professionals are not excused to go to this. This is played by the National Teams, and those that they might be able to pull from the farm teams. As for what the European teams put forth in their rosters, I am not 100% sure, though I am guessing they would do like our National Teams do, and pull from the farm teams for their Pro Leagues.

Menelaos · Post by **Menelaos** » August 16, 2004, 1:00 am

Pro or not, the best athletes in a given category should be allowed to compete in the Olympics. The only thing stopping that from the past was politics, plan and simple. You think NBA players are miscreants? Look at swimmers (dope scandal, anyone?), boxers, and sprinters. The latter two can certainly be categorized in the "gangsta miscreant" category, yet I don't see your seriously skewed viewpoints focussing on THAT. Your same argument could be said about other countries, who field NBA stars in their teams year in and year out. Sarunas Marcialones(sp?), Peja Stojakovic, among many others, play for their respective Olympic teams too...I don't see anybody calling foul there... Give me a break, you self-righteous idiots. Start focussing on real issues, seriously. I mean, by your same argument, professional gymnasts and swimmers should also not be allowed to compete in the Olympics. Give. Me. A. Break. Self. Righteous. Idiots.

That aside, I'm glad the "Dream Team" lost. This current group is made up of some real selfish players, aside from Tim Duncan. In my opinion, the only real "Dream Team" that ever existed was the first one, made up solely of Hall of Famers and possibly the best players at their positions ever (Michael Jordan, certainly the best SG ever, if not player, period; Magic Johnson; Larry Legend, among others). It's nice to see the rest of the world become more and more competitive.

Menelaos · Post by **Menelaos** » August 16, 2004, 1:05 am

BTW Kguku, you're so poorly misinformed about the NHL and Olympics qualifying. If what you were saying were true, NHL stars would NOT be playing for any of their respective countries in the Olympics. According to you, only their farm players would be participating.

Karae · Post by **Karae** » August 16, 2004, 2:21 am

Tim Duncan, Allen Iverson, and a bunch of rookies who have never won anything is hardly a Dream Team...but losing to Puerto Rico is still pathetic. Another in the long list of examples of superb teamwork beating dissonant talent.

Oh yea...right on Canelek...cos the amateurs are working so hard to be in the Olympics

. Please, they all want to be in the NBA and we shouldn't fuck THEIR hard work over by letting the fact that they were good enough to make it where others failed prevent them from participating in the olympics.

Same goes for every sport.

Kguku · Post by **Kguku** » August 16, 2004, 2:39 am

Menelaos wrote:BTW Kguku, you're so poorly misinformed about the NHL and Olympics qualifying. If what you were saying were true, NHL stars would NOT be playing for any of their respective countries in the Olympics. According to you, only their farm players would be participating.

I'm sorry, how am I misinformed regarding when olympic qualification rounds happen? Qualification for the 2002 Olympics was in February 2001. Now I may be wrong here, but I don't recall the NHL stopping the league so certain NHL teams that have players from other countries currently playing to be freed up to try and qualify with their country's team.

Again, depending on how well you do during the previous Olympics determines if you will need to re-qualify, or if you get automatic entry.

You can qualify with one team, and swap in players as you see fit. This qualification takes place roughly a year before the olympics are to start, and there is no expectation that you are to field the same team you qualified with.

To show your lack of misinformation, and that the Olympics has no problems with substitutes, we could take for an example the America Mens 4x100 Freestyle Relay team. Not all of those that were in the qualifying round took place in the final. Phelps was substituted in, and left out of the qualifying round to give him a break. Now according to your logic, I would guess that could be deemed impossible to do. Remember that the person Phelps was replacing was not injured, and this is a common practice that is done by these teams if they know that qualifying will be relatively easy for them.

As for scandals, you'll find it in every sport, and the IOC and sporting bodies in general do need to clamp down on the abuse, but that's an entirely different issue.

Amateur athletes deserve a place to shine, and the whole concept of the Olympics was to limit to to Amateur athletes only. Yes some get paid in the way of prize money at certain Track and Field events, and they have sponsorship from companies. Those that excel in the sport can make out quite well (and those that do, do not qualify for the prize monies that are offered, as there is income limits). These people work tirelessly year in and year out to prove themselves. To compete for their country in events, and to see what limits they can push themselves to. There is no guarantee of massive amounts of cash, like in Professional Sports, so those that stay in it as a purist deserve to be reconigzed and not overshadowed by those that play to entertain us for insane gobs of cash.

As for "Self.Righteous.Idiots", you have proven that you are definately one of those time and again. Just because people wish to see the Olympics brought back to what it was originally intended for, AMATEUR ATHLETES, doesn't mean they're self righteous, it means they want to see the people who are glossed over and not recognized on a regular basis get the recognition they deserve.

Menelaos · Post by **Menelaos** » August 16, 2004, 10:57 am

The best athletes in a given category deserve to be in the Olympics representing their countries. Period! Who the hell cares where they are from or from what background. Professional soccer players, gymnasts, and swimmers, among many, MANY others, have been participating for decades; why would you single out basketball players just because they are a bunch of thugs who make millions? I don't understand this double standard at all. Am I being self righteous in trying to point that out? YOu say one thing, yet don't seem to see the facts in front of you in other categories. I can understand your disdain of NBA players, I share that with you in most cases. They ARE a bunch of thugs, and they DO make more money than they should, and they DO whine about getting more of it; but they are the best athletes in the basketball world and they should be able to represent their respective countries if they so chose to.

If you exclude professional sports players from the Olympics, say goodbye to all the current gymnasts who participate in the Professional World Championships every year, all the swimmers who do the same, and a good number of soccer players; hell, the list goes on and on. I don't see you whining about them, do I?

Get with the times...

Cartalas · Post by **Cartalas** » August 16, 2004, 12:06 pm

Please Stop calling this The Dream Team this team is far from the best the NBA has to offer.

Niffoni · Post by **Niffoni** » August 16, 2004, 1:24 pm

The article is worth clicking just for the looks on their faces.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » August 16, 2004, 3:06 pm

This past years NBA playoffs previewed this.

Only 1 guard in the NBA at the all star break had a FG% greater than 50%. That used to be the standard. Sam Cassell was that guard.

Anyway, in the playoffs, the Spurs would have owned the Lakers if they could have made the occassional three pointer.

This is funny except for the part about it being embarrassing.

Basically it shows you the lack of work ethic in these players. Shooting percentage is a direct reflection of the time you spend developing the skill. Smoking weed all day unfortunately does not develope this skill.

i'm amazed they could find 12 NBA players who could piss in a cup and qualify for the olympics

Menelaos · Post by **Menelaos** » August 16, 2004, 3:41 pm

Voronwe, so well said. Lack of work ethic killed the NBA. ALl you see these days are people who played street ball who, with gifted athleticism and good college scouting, have made it to the NBA from the streets of some urban ghetto. They're all gangster-wannabe thugs, and have turned the NBA into a fuckin' joke of a league, in my opinion. While there are still good personalities in the game, like Stojakovic, Duncan, and a few others, the entire league is made up of thugs

The players these days lack any class, and like you said, have lost the ability to make long jump shots.

In a lot of ways, they make up for it in pure athleticism, but what was painfully obvious in the loss to Puerto Rico was the american's inability to make open threes, which in the Olympics is about 2.5 feet shorter than in the NBA. It doesn't help them that this current American team has no accomplished jump shooter among them at ALL. It's all made up of athletic players without consistent jump shots.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 16, 2004, 3:57 pm

The league lost a major good-guy personality when David Robinson retired. I lived in San Antonio for 3 years and what he did for the community is incredible. He is one hell of a guy. And Duncan isn't far behind either. Neither were/are flashy players but damn.. work ethic and focusing on getting the job done are just two of the major compliments that can be made about them.

Crav · Post by **Crav** » August 16, 2004, 4:08 pm

Agree with Kelshara, David Robinson helped shape the San Antonio Spurs and his attitude and work ethic are still with the Spurs even after his retirement. It's one of the reasons why the Spurs are able to be such a successful small market club. I remember everyone calling him soft because he wasn't all thuggish and didn't freak out every time a call went against him. I was really happy he was able to retire with two championship rings. He is one of the few athletes that I would call a role model.

Tenuvil · Post by **Tenuvil** » August 16, 2004, 4:31 pm

Puerto Rico is a protectorate of the USA, and not a sovereign country, I didnn't know they could/would have an Olympic team? Wouldn't that be like Guam having an Olympic team? (hell maybe they do)

flankmen · Post by **flankmen** » August 16, 2004, 4:42 pm

Voronwë wrote:Only 1 guard in the NBA at the all star break had a FG% greater than 50%. That used to be the standard.

Who's standard is this?? For a guard, 44% to 47% is considered quality, anything higher is exceptional. Jordan, arguably the best pure shooter in the game, had a career avg of .497.

Menelaos wrote:They're all gangster-wannabe thugs, and have turned the NBA into a fuckin' joke of a league, in my opinion.

This is obviously a ridiculous generalization, but unfortunately the olympic team is helping to perpetuate this sort of view of the NBA. This team was put together based solely on statistics and marketing value, with little or no thought going into character, work ethic, or team play.

xZiBiT · Post by **xZiBiT** » August 16, 2004, 5:22 pm

They should have just sent the Pistons to play in the olympics. The NBA champ for the year in that given year should be sent to represent the U.S. in international competitions.

Regardless its all about selling jerseys and creating revenue for USA basketball than it is about representing your country and winning a gold medal.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 16, 2004, 5:31 pm

Wont work. Most top contenders in the NBA have foreign players as integral parts of their teams. And Piston members were invited and said no.

xZiBiT · Post by **xZiBiT** » August 16, 2004, 10:03 pm

Can you blame them? I can't. Ben Wallace was a member of the 2002 Team that finished sixth in Indy. I think that is the reason that Ban and Rip declined, they both knew it was a no win situation with the way they picked this team. Why go from the high of winning a championship as a team to being embarassed in the olympics by the Puerto Ricans and every other second/third world country in the world because you have to play with some ballhogs who don't know the meaning of the word defense? This is just further proof that team basketball beat superstar basketball.

I'm not saying you can't substitute anyone onto the championship team but you could keep the majority of the starting lineup of any championship caliber team together and send them.

I would pay the price of a Laker ticket to see Tim Duncan(for Mehmet) inserted into the Piston's lineup to take on the world. It certainly would be this bullshit basketball that currently represents the U.S. Besides, I'm almost certain Larry Brown would have chosen to take his Detroit team over this one and would have gladly replaced Stephon with Chauncey, Marion with Tayshaun, Boozer with Ben, D.Wade with Rip, and Amare with R.Wallace. Then add in Michael Redd for Lebron or carmelo to light up the three point line. Who knows maybe then the Detroit players might have accepted, maybe they wouldn't have, but it would have been worth a shot.

However, Detroit doesn't sell jerseys. Its a shame that U.S. olympic basketball is more about profit than winning.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » August 16, 2004, 10:07 pm

flankmen wrote:
Voronwë wrote:Only 1 guard in the NBA at the all star break had a FG% greater than 50%. That used to be the standard.
Who's standard is this?? For a guard, 44% to 47% is considered quality, anything higher is exceptional. Jordan, arguably the best pure shooter in the game, had a career avg of .497.

Jordan wasn't even the best pure shooter on his team (Steve Kerr), let alone the league at that time (Larry Bird anyone??!?!?!!?!)

Jordan shooting the same kind of shots Iverson does (fallaway crazy layups, etc) shoots .497. Iverson is probably career .325

the difference is Jordan busted his ass to get better. Iverson's most famous quote "we are talking about practice man". (shocked that he got disciplined for skipping practice.

regardless even if you are right that 45% is the standard for "quality" and i'll totally grant you that, i'm not an NBA fan. this olympic team would win 200-50 if they shot 45%

Markulas · Post by **Markulas** » August 17, 2004, 1:14 am

I watched the game in shock and I guess I didn't how to feel. The US looked like they didn't know how to play the game. No one on the US team has been to the Olympics and they all seemed to be too arrogant to even practice together. But seriously I felt an embarrassment for US for the loss even though anyone could have seen it coming.

Fucking a

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » August 17, 2004, 1:34 am

I was reading in The Oregonian that Iverson said that they had much less practice together than any of the other countries teams.

Is this not the same guy that a couple weeks ago was all upset about his punishment for being late for a team meeting? Iverson said something along the lines as: Just Practice! Practice? ...Something like that... but it made for some funny sports radio....

Way to trip over yourself smart guy.... As far as amateur basketball players vs pro players, Karae, I do believe they work much harder since they so indeed want to get to the NBA level, etc... Can they compete on the Olympic platform? Nah... my point was and still is that the majority of NBA players do NOT deserve to represent this country. I have seen NOTHING from the current US team to counter that sentiment.

I would much rather see non-NBA players at least try and come together to try and qualify than this whiney bunch of spoiled brats. I do see what you are getting at though... it would be nice if non-pro basketball players could qualify, but it is not realistic, hence the spawning of the "dream team".

I have a sneaking feeling that after this "effort" that most Americans would not even notice if there were no US basketball team...

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » August 17, 2004, 11:32 am

hopefully that was a wakeup call

flankmen · Post by **flankmen** » August 17, 2004, 12:06 pm

If anyone can turn things around, it's Larry Brown. This team is still the most talented group of players in Athens. Jefferson, who is typically a very good shooter, won't have another 3-for-16 performance. Everyone else (besides Iverson), had a pretty good game offensively. If Brown can keep Iverson under control (big IF), and get them playing some defense, they're going to be just fine.

On a side note, this sub-par American team has brought some parity to Olympic basketball, and as a fan of the sport, I enjoy the fact that it could be a wide-open race.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 17, 2004, 12:24 pm

heh Iverson is playing with a broken thumb.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » August 17, 2004, 12:59 pm

good, now maybe he will stick to passing which is amazing at instead of shooting which he sucks at.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » August 17, 2004, 1:39 pm

Iverson could have been the best point guard the NBA had ever seen. Instead, he's just another "Me first," player in a league full of them. Keep shooting those bricks, kid.

I love how he uses his occasional hot streaks as a reason to keep shooting. Hey .417 would be a sweet average if he was a baseball player

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 17, 2004, 2:12 pm

To defend AI a bit.. he has never really had much support and have had to carry the team on his shooting a lot. Hard to break out of that habbit once you actually have some good players around you.

Menelaos · Post by **Menelaos** » August 18, 2004, 2:09 am

Iverson is probably the most talented basketball player in the game. Nobody plays among giants like him and excels. Who, at his size, can compete the way he does, drive down the lane, bump a 7 footer and still make a wild layup? If he was as mentally capable as he is physically, he would be so damn good.

He shoots a low percentage, but he was always trained to take that many shots by the coaching staff. Look at who surrounds him; in their best year of play, when they went to the finals, his team consisted of the likes of Aaron Mckie and Eric Snow. The fact that he alone carried them to the Finals is a testament to his ability. I don't know of any player in the history of the league who could take that many jump shots and shoot a high percentage.

He is sort of the poster child of today's NBA. So much damn potential, but in the end, has zero class. I miss the days where NBA athletes were humble, and had a work ethic.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » August 18, 2004, 12:00 pm

Hey they actually won a game! They still are one of the worst shooting groups to ever step on the court though. I can damn well guarantee you that I could outshoot their 4 of 21 from the 3 point line though. Atrocious.

Tim Duncan was getting absolutely screwed against the home team. The refs called a foul on him on a very clean block...and a terrible call on a loose ball. Can't blame the refs for trying to get the US team out of contention....most of the US wants to see them fail too.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 18, 2004, 12:06 pm

Well to be honest.. the US team played a lot harder against the Greece than I've seen this group play before. And they played some defense! LeBron, AI, Duncan and others all played a good game. Not AS good as they can, but a hell of a lot better than against Porto Rico

masteen · Post by **masteen** » August 18, 2004, 1:35 pm

Menelaos wrote:I don't know of any player in the history of the league who could take that many jump shots and shoot a high percentage.

Michael Jordan. Unfortunately, Iverson is no MJ. I don't remember His Airness skipping many team meeting, showing up late to practice, or giving his coach ulcers. Jordan used to play when he was so fucking sick they needed to give him IV's.

Menelaos wrote:He is sort of the poster child of today's NBA. So much damn potential, but in the end, has zero class. I miss the days where NBA athletes were humble, and had a work ethic.

Don't forget to add: knew how to fucking shoot and play defense.

Kilmoll the Sexy · Post by **Kilmoll the Sexy** » August 18, 2004, 1:51 pm

There were a TON of players who were better jump shooters in the NBA...including the time during Jordan's reign. Chris Mullin, Magic, Stockton, and Mo Cheeks just to name a few that were much better shooters. Jordan was a good shooter...not great. People only remember him for the greatest games he had and the amount of points he put up. What they forget is that he often shot 35-40 times to score 40 a game.

masteen · Post by **masteen** » August 18, 2004, 3:13 pm

I just brought up Jordan because he not only shot a very decent % while taking a lot of shots, but he also lead his team to SIX championships.

The problem today is that the kids who grew up wanting to be like Mike have no idea the work MJ put into improving his already stellar skills when he moved from UNC to the pros.

Also, Mike MADE HIS FUCKING FREE THROWS. Nothing pisses me off more than watching the big fucking productions these dipshits make at the charity stripe only to shoot 6/10. I can fucking shoot 60%, and I suck at basketball.

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 18, 2004, 3:41 pm

You know one of the reasons I don't like Jordan? There is no doubt about him as an athlete, but as a person.. well let's just say he could have done a LOT with his fame, but all he has basically done is to promote himself.

Menelaos · Post by **Menelaos** » August 18, 2004, 3:51 pm

Jordan shot near 50% career, yes. It's unfair to compare anybody to the best player in league history; anybody will pale in comparison...

AI can't play defense? Then why has he been top 3 in steals for the past five years running, and often the league leader? He's a great team defender, but his small frame prohibits him from being a good one-on-one defender.

AI can't shoot? If he wasn't the only player on that team that had a game, and wasn't constantly fighting through double and triple teams, I'd be willing to bet his percentage would go way up. The man has a great jump shot, when he uses it properly.

You guys swear you could make free throws in an NBA game as well as you could in a practice gym. People like Antonio Davis, Dale Davis, who can't make a FT if their lives depended on it in a game, consistently shoot 90%+ in practice. It's a whole different story when you are in a real game...

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 18, 2004, 4:24 pm

AI can defend when he wants to. He did quite well against Greece.

Sueven · Post by **Sueven** » August 20, 2004, 8:18 pm

Iverson is one of the best defenders in the league. Being 5 foot 11 and 170 pounds is a bit of a limitation.

Pherr the Dorf · Post by **Pherr the Dorf** » August 21, 2004, 4:27 pm

And they lose AGAIN

Kelshara · Post by **Kelshara** » August 21, 2004, 4:38 pm

Yah but can't compare Lithuania and PR (who btw have won 2 more games so they are the surprise team so far). Lithuania is one of the favourites with some very good players and can shoot the 3 like crazy.

USA didn't play as good as they can, but they played a hell of a lot better.